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Author Topic: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)  (Read 1549 times)

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Online corbe

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Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« on: August 06, 2019, 03:03:28 pm »
Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings
 
Do you feel comfortable giving up a cornerstone of our republic for a safety dependent upon enforcement by a government that has failed at this before?

By Dana Loesch
August 6, 2019

The people who report your Twitter account and your Facebook pages because they dislike your opinion want you to trust a government-run system where people can, without serious penalty of law, report you and have your property confiscated before you’re allowed to defend yourself in court weeks, even months, later.

Politicians refer to law-abiding, gun-owning Americans as “domestic security threats,” yet want you to trust them with implementing such a system. I’m talking about red flag laws and the risk they pose to due process—you know, those other rights after the Second Amendment in the Constitution.

Red flag laws, also known as Extreme Risk Protection Orders (ERPOs), have passed through a number of state legislatures across the country; Sen. Marco Rubio has a somewhat new legislative proposal titled the Extreme Risk Protection Order and Violence Prevention Act. Sen. Lindsay Graham joined Sen. Richard Blumenthal to co-sponsor red flag legislation; even Rep. Dan Crenshaw has mentioned ERPOs for potential consideration.

There is nuance to be had here, for sure, but realize that it is an abrogation of due process to invert the order of “innocent until proven guilty” to “somewhat guilty until proven innocent.” The question isn’t whether these laws do this, the question is whether you feel comfortable giving up a cornerstone of our republic for a safety dependent upon enforcement by a government that has failed at this before.

The murderers in Parkland, Florida and Dayton, Ohio, are two recent examples. These two monsters were walking red flags with access to firearms and yet, with all of the laws available to adjudicate them ineligible to carry or purchase guns, they continued unabated until the unthinkable. They weren’t stopped.

<..snip..>

https://thefederalist.com/2019/08/06/red-flag-laws-not-good-solution-mass-shootings/
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Offline mountaineer

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2019, 12:55:05 pm »
 :beer:
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2019, 01:56:28 pm »
Quote from: corbe on August 06, 2019, 03:03:28 pm
Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings
 
Do you feel comfortable giving up a cornerstone of our republic for a safety dependent upon enforcement by a government that has failed at this before?

By Dana Loesch
August 6, 2019

 
There is nuance to be had here, for sure, but realize that it is an abrogation of due process to invert the order of “innocent until proven guilty” to “somewhat guilty until proven innocent.” The question isn’t whether these laws do this, the question is whether you feel comfortable giving up a cornerstone of our republic for a safety dependent upon enforcement by a government that has failed at this before.

 @corbe

And there it is.
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Online Smokin Joe

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2019, 10:22:27 am »
Well, there half of it is.

Then there is this sort of incident:Maryland’s ‘Red Flag’ Law Turns Deadly: Officer Kills Man Who Refused To Turn In Gun

At the time of the story it was not clear who called police to alert them. It was 5AM and he answered the door with a handgun...

Can you imagine what people like the anti-gun radicals in Virginia who got a list of CCW holders could do with a law like this?? Wage war, that's what. https://www.cnn.com/2012/12/25/us/new-york-gun-permit-map/index.html

Is doxx and SWAT the new antigun tactic?
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Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

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Offline Polly Ticks

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #4 on: August 08, 2019, 12:52:53 pm »
This guy has a good point, too.


« Last Edit: August 08, 2019, 12:56:31 pm by Polly Ticks »
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #5 on: August 08, 2019, 01:20:38 pm »
Quote from: Polly Ticks on August 08, 2019, 12:52:53 pm
This guy has a good point, too.



Thank heavens guns are never weaponized. 
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Offline Polly Ticks

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #6 on: August 08, 2019, 01:22:18 pm »
Quote from: Right_in_Virginia on August 08, 2019, 01:20:38 pm
Thank heavens guns are never weaponized.

Same goes for free speech, but that doesn't negate it as a right.
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2019, 01:28:52 pm »
Quote from: Polly Ticks on August 08, 2019, 01:22:18 pm
Same goes for free speech, but that doesn't negate it as a right.

Sure it's a right .... but no one's suggesting we allow folks to yell "fire" in a crowded movie theater or eliminate libel and slander laws, are we.   We accept these parameters on free speech as Constitutional and righteous.
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Offline Polly Ticks

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #8 on: August 08, 2019, 01:32:23 pm »
Quote from: Right_in_Virginia on August 08, 2019, 01:28:52 pm
Sure it's a right .... but no one's suggesting we allow folks to yell "fire" in a crowded movie theater or eliminate libel and slander laws, are we.   We accept these parameters on free speech as Constitutional and righteous.

Get back to me when someone suggests that if your ex-boyfriend claims that you might yell fire in a crowded theater then your right to free speech can be removed.
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #9 on: August 08, 2019, 02:45:50 pm »
Quote from: Polly Ticks on August 08, 2019, 01:32:23 pm
Get back to me when someone suggests that if your ex-boyfriend claims that you might yell fire in a crowded theater then your right to free speech can be removed.

You went so fast for the snark that you missed my whole point @Polly Ticks   
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Offline Polly Ticks

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #10 on: August 08, 2019, 03:00:09 pm »
Quote from: Right_in_Virginia on August 08, 2019, 02:45:50 pm
You went so fast for the snark that you missed my whole point @Polly Ticks

Uh huh.
Quote from: Right_in_Virginia on August 08, 2019, 01:20:38 pm
Thank heavens guns are never weaponized.

And I'm the one who started with the snark. 




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Online Smokin Joe

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #11 on: August 08, 2019, 04:20:32 pm »
Quote from: Right_in_Virginia on August 08, 2019, 01:20:38 pm
Thank heavens guns are never weaponized.
Yes, this just allows the police to come in at 5AM and use theirs.
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How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Bigun

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2019, 04:29:26 pm »
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Offline xyno

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #13 on: August 08, 2019, 04:56:33 pm »
Bkmk
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings (Dana Loesch)
« Reply #14 on: August 08, 2019, 05:03:16 pm »
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