Author Topic: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College  (Read 1295 times)

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Online mystery-ak

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Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
By Michael Burke - 03/03/19 06:00 PM EST

A plan to circumvent the Electoral College is gaining momentum among blue states after Democrats suffered two crushing defeats in presidential elections over the past two decades.

The plan has been given new impetus after Colorado Gov. Jared Polis (D) said this week that he will sign a bill to have his state become the 12th state along with the District of Columbia to join the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact.

The states making up the compact, which already includes New York, Illinois and all the New England states except for New Hampshire, would commit to awarding their electoral votes to whoever wins the popular vote nationally, regardless of the results in the Electoral College.

So far, these states, with Colorado, add up to 181 electoral votes, well short of the 270 needed to ascend to the White House.

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https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/432061-dem-states-move-to-bypass-electoral-college
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Online Fishrrman

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #1 on: March 03, 2019, 11:23:43 pm »
Want to get on the fast track to Civil War II?
Just keep pushing this idea in the blue states until it succeeds.

Online Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2019, 11:29:57 pm »
Want to get on the fast track to Civil War II?
Just keep pushing this idea in the blue states until it succeeds.

This was my first thought, too @Fishrrman   ....  And I don't subscribe to war being around every corner.  But this could be the trigger. The outrage would known no bounds and there would be precious little of the nation to save.


« Last Edit: March 03, 2019, 11:31:00 pm by Right_in_Virginia »

Online andy58-in-nh

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2019, 11:41:54 pm »
Want to get on the fast track to Civil War II?
Just keep pushing this idea in the blue states until it succeeds.

Which is why it will almost certainly not succeed, as was our Founders' intent.  A Constitutional amendment would be required, which even under present circumstances would have virtually no possibility of passage, given that 34 state legislatures would have to agree to something that would benefit only the coastal elites of a far smaller number of states, but also their political dependents.  So it is not impossible.

We are yet a Republic... if we can keep it.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2019, 11:45:39 pm by andy58-in-nh »
"The most terrifying force of death, comes from the hands of Men who wanted to be left Alone. They try, so very hard, to mind their own business and provide for themselves and those they love. They resist every impulse to fight back, knowing the forced and permanent change of life that will come from it. They know, that the moment they fight back, their lives as they have lived them, are over. -Alexander Solzhenitsyn

Online Fishrrman

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2019, 12:03:15 am »
andy wrote:
"Which is why it will almost certainly not succeed, as was our Founders' intent.  A Constitutional amendment would be required, which even under present circumstances would have virtually no possibility of passage, given that 34 state legislatures would have to agree to something that would benefit only the coastal elites of a far smaller number of states, but also their political dependents.  So it is not impossible."

No, Andy, you misunderstand.

The entire purpose behind "National Popular Vote" is to do an end-run around the Constitutional establishment of the Electoral College.

The leftist/democrat-communists are getting within' spittin' distance of having enough state legislatures sign onto this, that we had better not discount it on its face.

Of course, NPV will end up before the U.S. Supreme Court at some point.

This case will become as important to the future of the United States in the Twenty-first Century, as was the Dredd Scott decision of 1857. Which became perhaps "the fuse" that eventually led to the explosion in April of 1861...

Offline skeeter

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2019, 12:06:38 am »
So red states can band together & tell blue states to p*ss up a rope.

Offline roamer_1

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2019, 12:24:27 am »
So red states can band together & tell blue states to p*ss up a rope.

That's right... It means nothing unless red states start doing it. The dems were already going to win all the states that have signed on thus far.

The only thing it does is supply a wee bit o satisfaction watching all those blue states turn red in the condition where a Republican happens to win the popular vote.

Online andy58-in-nh

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #7 on: March 04, 2019, 12:36:40 am »
andy wrote:
"Which is why it will almost certainly not succeed, as was our Founders' intent.  A Constitutional amendment would be required, which even under present circumstances would have virtually no possibility of passage, given that 34 state legislatures would have to agree to something that would benefit only the coastal elites of a far smaller number of states, but also their political dependents.  So it is not impossible."

No, Andy, you misunderstand.

The entire purpose behind "National Popular Vote" is to do an end-run around the Constitutional establishment of the Electoral College.

The leftist/democrat-communists are getting within' spittin' distance of having enough state legislatures sign onto this, that we had better not discount it on its face.

Of course, NPV will end up before the U.S. Supreme Court at some point.

This case will become as important to the future of the United States in the Twenty-first Century, as was the Dredd Scott decision of 1857. Which became perhaps "the fuse" that eventually led to the explosion in April of 1861...

There is no such thing as an "end-run" around the Constitution, at least not in this case:

USC Article 2 Section 1:

"Each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors, equal to the whole Number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: but no Senator or Representative, or Person holding an Office of Trust or Profit under the United States, shall be appointed an Elector."

Part of the subsequent original language has already been amended by the 12th Amendment, which clarified the mechanism by which both Presidents and Vice Presidents would be elected. But the fundamental language establishing an Electoral College remains to this day unchallenged, and it cannot be undone by a vote of state legislatures external to the creation of a constitutional amendment abolishing the College itself, and instituting a popular vote in its stead.

So yes, any effort to avoid the necessity of amending the Constitution in order to abolish the Electoral College would inevitably lead to a Supreme Court challenge, the necessary result of which would be to enforce the nation's highest law. Or else, face an equally necessary revolt by the states and by the people, whose consequences one shudders to imagine.       
"The most terrifying force of death, comes from the hands of Men who wanted to be left Alone. They try, so very hard, to mind their own business and provide for themselves and those they love. They resist every impulse to fight back, knowing the forced and permanent change of life that will come from it. They know, that the moment they fight back, their lives as they have lived them, are over. -Alexander Solzhenitsyn

Offline libertybele

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #8 on: March 04, 2019, 12:37:19 am »
andy wrote:
"Which is why it will almost certainly not succeed, as was our Founders' intent.  A Constitutional amendment would be required, which even under present circumstances would have virtually no possibility of passage, given that 34 state legislatures would have to agree to something that would benefit only the coastal elites of a far smaller number of states, but also their political dependents.  So it is not impossible."

No, Andy, you misunderstand.

The entire purpose behind "National Popular Vote" is to do an end-run around the Constitutional establishment of the Electoral College.

The leftist/democrat-communists are getting within' spittin' distance of having enough state legislatures sign onto this, that we had better not discount it on its face.

Of course, NPV will end up before the U.S. Supreme Court at some point.

This case will become as important to the future of the United States in the Twenty-first Century, as was the Dredd Scott decision of 1857. Which became perhaps "the fuse" that eventually led to the explosion in April of 1861...

Exactly right.  Considering that Trump signed a bill to allow states to opt out of a barrier, means that we still have illegals crawling over the border and we still have caravans of illegals seeking asylum.  Those seeking asylum, if granted can apply for citizenship within 5 years.  So ... what do you think the state legislature is going to look like throughout the country once these people start voting??

There won't be a red state left.  The close race in TX should have been a wake up call to everyone.  Trump waiting till the last minute to push for his glorious wall should have opened a few eyes.  The DEMS having a complete majority is just around the corner. Blanket amnesty making it mathematically impossible for the GOP to win seats has  has been the goal and dream of the DEMS and we missed our chance to remedy that situation when we passed over a true conservative.  Very very sad. 

I hold no hope that we will remain a Republic.  5 years tops. 
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2019, 01:57:30 am »
Exactly right.  Considering that Trump signed a bill to allow states to opt out of a barrier, means that we still have illegals crawling over the border and we still have caravans of illegals seeking asylum.  Those seeking asylum, if granted can apply for citizenship within 5 years.  So ... what do you think the state legislature is going to look like throughout the country once these people start voting??

There won't be a red state left.  The close race in TX should have been a wake up call to everyone.  Trump waiting till the last minute to push for his glorious wall should have opened a few eyes.  The DEMS having a complete majority is just around the corner. Blanket amnesty making it mathematically impossible for the GOP to win seats has  has been the goal and dream of the DEMS and we missed our chance to remedy that situation when we passed over a true conservative.  Very very sad. 

I hold no hope that we will remain a Republic.  5 years tops.

You think we still are a functioning republic? 

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2019, 02:00:54 am »
There is no such thing as an "end-run" around the Constitution, at least not in this case:

USC Article 2 Section 1:

"Each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors, equal to the whole Number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: but no Senator or Representative, or Person holding an Office of Trust or Profit under the United States, shall be appointed an Elector."

Part of the subsequent original language has already been amended by the 12th Amendment, which clarified the mechanism by which both Presidents and Vice Presidents would be elected. But the fundamental language establishing an Electoral College remains to this day unchallenged, and it cannot be undone by a vote of state legislatures external to the creation of a constitutional amendment abolishing the College itself, and instituting a popular vote in its stead.

So yes, any effort to avoid the necessity of amending the Constitution in order to abolish the Electoral College would inevitably lead to a Supreme Court challenge, the necessary result of which would be to enforce the nation's highest law. Or else, face an equally necessary revolt by the states and by the people, whose consequences one shudders to imagine.       

Uhmm, doesn’t that say that states are free to choose the mechanism they will use to select their electors?  Why doesn’t that mean that a state can choose to appoint its electors based on the national popular vote?

Offline libertybele

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #11 on: March 04, 2019, 02:14:48 am »
You think we still are a functioning republic?

In most respects.  If the electoral process is successfully bypassed, I don't see that we will be a Republic, but rather a democracy.
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #12 on: March 04, 2019, 02:22:32 am »
In most respects.  If the electoral process is successfully bypassed, I don't see that we will be a Republic, but rather a democracy.

You're more optimistic than I am.  I think we've gone over the edge already.

Offline libertybele

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #13 on: March 04, 2019, 03:04:07 am »
You're more optimistic than I am.  I think we've gone over the edge already.

I don't think we're quite there yet, but I don't see that there is any saving "her".
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Offline InHeavenThereIsNoBeer

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2019, 03:32:34 am »
You're more optimistic than I am.  I think we've gone over the edge already.

Yeah, but at least we haven't looked down yet.
My avatar shows the national debt in stacks of $100 bills.  If you look very closely under the crane you can see the Statue of Liberty.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Blue states band together looking to bypass Electoral College
« Reply #15 on: March 04, 2019, 03:37:33 am »
Yeah, but at least we haven't looked down yet.

LOL, yeah, that helps.