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Author Topic: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown  (Read 4717 times)

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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #25 on: December 20, 2018, 11:17:52 pm »
Quote from: edpc on December 20, 2018, 07:04:10 pm
He won’t sign it or will he veto it? There’s a difference.

Not really, if Congress is adjourned. If it's not in session it's a pocket Veto.  If they are in session it becomes a law without the signature. Night and day difference.
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Offline Sanguine

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #26 on: December 20, 2018, 11:18:51 pm »
Quote from: jmyrlefuller on December 20, 2018, 11:16:00 pm
And whatever they do—no money paid for work not done. This is a shutdown, not a paid vacation!

Sure would put some pressure on our congresspeople by federal employees.
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #27 on: December 20, 2018, 11:20:39 pm »
Quote from: jmyrlefuller on December 20, 2018, 11:16:00 pm
And whatever they do—no money paid for work not done. This is a shutdown, not a paid vacation!

It should be that way, but it isn't.   They all get back pay after the "shutdown. "
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Offline edpc

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #28 on: December 20, 2018, 11:31:47 pm »
Quote from: Cyber Liberty on December 20, 2018, 11:17:52 pm
Not really, if Congress is adjourned. If it's not in session it's a pocket Veto.  If they are in session it becomes a law without the signature. Night and day difference.


If they designate an agent to receive messages during adjournment, it would require a formal veto.
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Offline corbe

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #29 on: December 20, 2018, 11:36:07 pm »
A pocket veto occurs when a bill fails to become law because the president does not sign the bill and cannot return the bill to Congress within a 10-day period because Congress is not in session. Article 1, Section 7 of the U.S. Constitution states:


If any Bill shall not be returned by the President within ten days (Sundays excepted) after it shall have been presented to him, the same shall be a Law, in like manner as if he had signed it, unless the Congress by their Adjournment prevent its return, in which case it shall not be a Law.
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Offline corbe

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #30 on: December 20, 2018, 11:44:55 pm »
   Sure, I advocated for The Cruz 'Green Eggs and Ham' filibuster/shutdown in 2013 He standing up to the unconstitutionality of obummercare and for 13 days the Gov was shut down and that cost us taxpayers $B in lost productivity and backpay to Federal Employees. Fast Forward to 2018, they've had 2 years to resolve this Wall thing and failed, now we come to the point where the taxpayers take upon the burden far in excess in what Trump is asking for~INSANE!!
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Offline Frank Cannon

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #31 on: December 20, 2018, 11:48:29 pm »
Gosh. Yesterday I was told Trump folded and was going to sign it. Be fun if we got news like the old days instead of unsourced speculation.
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Oceander

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #32 on: December 20, 2018, 11:54:34 pm »
Quote from: Amb. Frank Cannon on December 20, 2018, 11:48:29 pm
Gosh. Yesterday I was told Trump folded and was going to sign it. Be fun if we got news like the old days instead of unsourced speculation.

Your boy flip-flopped.  He doesn’t have a very strong backbone, after all. 
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Offline corbe

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #33 on: December 20, 2018, 11:55:53 pm »
Quote from: Amb. Frank Cannon on December 20, 2018, 11:48:29 pm
Gosh. Yesterday I was told Trump folded and was going to sign it. Be fun if we got news like the old days instead of unsourced speculation.


   Yesterday Sarah Huckabee Sanders stated that he would sign it because he had other means to finance the $5B request, WTF are we suppose to believe? 
   This morning's Fox & Freaks changed the whole narrative, admit it Mr. Ambassador.
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2018, 12:22:53 am »
Quote from: Oceander on December 20, 2018, 11:54:34 pm
Your boy flip-flopped.  He doesn’t have a very strong backbone, after all.

Don't point a finger at the President because so many folks here prefer to argue over rumors for days rather than wait and know what's actually happening.  Some just never learn.    :shrug:






« Last Edit: December 21, 2018, 12:23:44 am by Right_in_Virginia »
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Offline Wingnut

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #35 on: December 21, 2018, 12:27:41 am »
Quote from: Oceander on December 20, 2018, 11:54:34 pm
Your boy flip-flopped.  He doesn’t have a very strong backbone, after all.

He really pissed me off on this one.  He did his best John Kerry imitation on this on.  There is no denying it.  No defending it. 
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #36 on: December 21, 2018, 12:28:51 am »
Quote from: edpc on December 20, 2018, 11:31:47 pm

If they designate an agent to receive messages during adjournment, it would require a formal veto.

I guess.  Is that provision in the Constitution?  I'll have to go look.
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Offline edpc

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #37 on: December 21, 2018, 12:29:56 am »
Quote from: Amb. Frank Cannon on December 20, 2018, 11:48:29 pm
Gosh. Yesterday I was told Trump folded and was going to sign it. Be fun if we got news like the old days instead of unsourced speculation.


The ‘unsourced speculation’ came directly from John Cornyn, the Senate majority whip, after he had lunch with the Vice President. The whole idea behind getting a whip count is based on knowing whether the effort will be worthwhile. They obviously had assurances, beforehand.  However, Trump was embarrassed by Coulter last night and shamed by Fox & Friends this morning.

https://thepoliticalinsider.com/john-cornyn-trump-supports-spending-deal/

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/fox-friends-turns-trump-kellyanne-160318641.html
« Last Edit: December 21, 2018, 12:32:02 am by edpc »
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Oceander

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #38 on: December 21, 2018, 12:30:15 am »
Quote from: Right_in_Virginia on December 21, 2018, 12:22:53 am
Don't point a finger at the President because so many folks here prefer to argue over rumors for days rather than wait and know what's actually happening.  Some just never learn.    :shrug:








Is that a threat?
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Offline edpc

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #39 on: December 21, 2018, 12:33:10 am »
Quote from: Cyber Liberty on December 21, 2018, 12:28:51 am
I guess.  Is that provision in the Constitution?  I'll have to go look.


Congress can adjourn and designate an agent to receive veto messages and other communications so that a pocket veto cannot happen, an action Congresses have routinely taken for decades.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pocket_veto

Court ruling on the practice....


https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/olc/opinions/1983/12/31/op-olc-v007-p0187_0.pdf
« Last Edit: December 21, 2018, 12:36:09 am by edpc »
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #40 on: December 21, 2018, 12:57:41 am »
Quote from: Oceander on December 21, 2018, 12:30:15 am
Is that a threat?

I look forward to it...it's what makes TBR go 'round!
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For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #41 on: December 21, 2018, 12:59:37 am »
Quote from: edpc on December 21, 2018, 12:33:10 am

Congress can adjourn and designate an agent to receive veto messages and other communications so that a pocket veto cannot happen, an action Congresses have routinely taken for decades.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pocket_veto

Court ruling on the practice....


https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/olc/opinions/1983/12/31/op-olc-v007-p0187_0.pdf

Thanks!  It's good know our legal Betters have come up with a way to stymie a President by bending the Constitution.  Again.  I'm looking forward to the statute that strips the President of the authority to recess appoint.  Should be any day now.
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For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
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Offline edpc

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #42 on: December 21, 2018, 01:01:39 am »
Quote from: Cyber Liberty on December 21, 2018, 12:59:37 am
Thanks!  It's good know our legal Betters have come up with a way to stymie a President by bending the Constitution.  Again.  I'm looking forward to the statute that strips the President of the authority to recess appoint.  Should be any day now.


Well, at this point, it would be up to Ryan or McConnell, as to whether they would keep someone behind. If the Democrats were in control, they definitely would.
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Offline Frank Cannon

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #43 on: December 21, 2018, 01:04:23 am »
Quote from: edpc on December 21, 2018, 12:29:56 am

The ‘unsourced speculation’ came directly from John Cornyn, the Senate majority whip, after he had lunch with the Vice President. The whole idea behind getting a whip count is based on knowing whether the effort will be worthwhile. They obviously had assurances, beforehand.  However, Trump was embarrassed by Coulter last night and shamed by Fox & Friends this morning.

https://thepoliticalinsider.com/john-cornyn-trump-supports-spending-deal/

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/fox-friends-turns-trump-kellyanne-160318641.html

Funny. I didn't read President Trumps quote in any of that. Can't find where anyone was shamed either. Just some soothsaying and low grade bullshit.
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #44 on: December 21, 2018, 01:15:19 am »
Quote from: edpc on December 21, 2018, 01:01:39 am

Well, at this point, it would be up to Ryan or McConnell, as to whether they would keep someone behind. If the Democrats were in control, they definitely would.

Dems would hold the Session open until 1/3/2019 with Pro Forma calls.  They did that with Bush constantly since 2006.  The 2007-2009 congress never recessed, in order to prevent any recess appointments.
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Offline corbe

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #45 on: December 21, 2018, 01:17:34 am »
   Just passed the House on to McConnell.
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Offline edpc

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #46 on: December 21, 2018, 01:26:34 am »
Quote from: Amb. Frank Cannon on December 21, 2018, 01:04:23 am
Funny. I didn't read President Trumps quote in any of that. Can't find where anyone was shamed either. Just some soothsaying and low grade bullshit.


Right - Cornyn and Pence had lunch and just talked about golf and grandkids, like the Clinton tarmac meeting. Of course the majority whip had assurances the bill would go through and be fine. As far as being shamed goes, all anyone has to do is watch the Kellyanne Conway interview this morning on Fox. You don’t need to be Kreskin to know what happened next. On top of that, Trump unfollowed Coulter, hours after she blasted him. The tough ‘street fighter’ is actually a middle school bitch.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2018, 01:40:14 am by edpc »
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Offline Wingnut

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #47 on: December 21, 2018, 01:29:46 am »
Quote from: corbe on December 21, 2018, 01:17:34 am
   Just passed the House on to McConnell.

The most likely possibility Friday is that the Senate strips the border wall out of the bill but keeps the disaster funds and sends it back to the House. House lawmakers said they were being told to stay in town for more possible votes.
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #48 on: December 21, 2018, 01:42:41 am »
Quote from: corbe on December 21, 2018, 01:17:34 am
   Just passed the House on to McConnell.

WOO HOO !!!
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Offline edpc

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Re: Trump tells GOP he won't sign stopgap, threatening shutdown
« Reply #49 on: December 21, 2018, 01:49:50 am »
Quote from: corbe on December 21, 2018, 01:17:34 am
Just passed the House on to McConnell.



He won’t nuke option it.
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