Conservatives voice frustration after Trump signals 'gutless' retreat on border wall

[edpc]

I know I've read a lot about how "tricky" Trump is.  I haven't seen it, but perhaps I've just missed it.  I am genuinely curious, what has Trump accomplished while in office by being "tricky" ?

Any tricks rolled out regarding immigration will be from Stephen Miller. This mofo isn’t fooling anyone with his newfound hairline courtesy of Toppik.

[Right_in_Virginia]

Donald J. Trump
Verified accountï‚™ @realDonaldTrump 

The Democrats, who know Steel Slats (Wall) are necessary for Border Security, are putting politics over Country. What they are just beginning to realize is that I will not sign any of their legislation, including infrastructure, unless it has perfect Border Security. U.S.A. WINS!

4:28 AM - 20 Dec 2018

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1075729672628068353

It's not clear what legislation the President's referring to ..... but we sure do live in interesting times. 

[Axeslinger]

It's not clear what legislation the President's referring to ..... but we sure do live in interesting times.

And you believe that tweet after just last week saying “I’ll be proud to shut down the government” for the wall...and this week folding like a cheap suit on that very topic?

Your rah rah sis boom bah never ceases to amaze (and horrify) me, @Right_in_Virginia

[Right_in_Virginia]

And you believe that tweet after just last week saying “I’ll be proud to shut down the government” for the wall...and this week folding like a cheap suit on that very topic?

Your rah rah sis boom bah never ceases to amaze (and horrify) me, @Right_in_Virginia

Are you voicing your hatred for me or for the country when you celebrate what could be a setback in keeping the US safe @Axeslinger

Or is it both?

[RoosGirl]

I think it's bleep awesome that we have gone from calling members Hillary supporters to saying they hate America.  The AT gang here has really outdone itself with their coordination on this one.

[edpc]

It's not clear what legislation the President's referring to ..... but we sure do live in interesting times.

Of course it is clear. He’s referring to legislation being passed in the next congress. He even specifically mentions an infrastructure bill. Supposedly, he won’t sign it, unless it contain spending for wall. He only has three options:

Veto a bill and be directly responsible for a shutdown.

Veto a bill and be embarrassed by congressional override.

Pocket veto and the bill becomes law in 10 days.

None of these options are particularly good for him, since they all carry political risk. After the oval office meeting with Pelosi and Schumer, he’s pretty much limited himself to the first one. Despite what his base will think, shut downs or not popular with the majority. That’s the dual edge of populism.

[sneakypete]

I disagree w your notion that trump has something up his sleeve...

. 

@Axeslinger

I woudldn't call it a notion. Or even a suspicion.  If I have to pick a word,I am going to go with "hope".

Truth to tell,I have no idea what is going on beyond the headline. Last I heard,things were just peachy-keen,and suddenly I see headlines claiming he is backing away from building the wall.  This makes no sense to me. He is not stupid,and he knows the vast majority of his support is due to his claiming he wanted to put up a wall.

I think this is just another indication of his utter lack of guiding principles other than “what’s good for me”

How could he possible think backing away from the rock his presidency stands on would be good for him in any respect?

[sneakypete]

Donald J. Trump
Verified account @realDonaldTrump

The Democrats, who know Steel Slats (Wall) are necessary for Border Security, are putting politics over Country. What they are just beginning to realize is that I will not sign any of their legislation, including infrastructure, unless it has perfect Border Security. U.S.A. WINS!

4:28 AM - 20 Dec 2018

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1075729672628068353

@Right_in_Virginia @ALL

That doesn't look like a backing off on the wall statement to me.

[Axeslinger]

Are you voicing your hatred for me or for the country when you celebrate what could be a setback in keeping the US safe @Axeslinger

Or is it both?

Silly girl, @Right_in_Virginia I don’t hate you. I find your lack of intellectual honesty utterly and completely repugnant,but I don’t hate you. 

And for the record, you can KMA  for even having the temerity to suggest I hate my country...but that does typify exactly why I find you loathsome.

[Axeslinger]

. 

@Axeslinger

I woudldn't call it a notion. Or even a suspicion.  If I have to pick a word,I am going to go with "hope".

Truth to tell,I have no idea what is going on beyond the headline. Last I heard,things were just peachy-keen,and suddenly I see headlines claiming he is backing away from building the wall.  This makes no sense to me. He is not stupid,and he knows the vast majority of his support is due to his claiming he wanted to put up a wall.


How could he possible think backing away from the rock his presidency stands on would be good for him in any respect?

@sneakypete
Don’t disagree with a thing you wrote except the stupid part.  And this does not come from any Animosity or even dislike I have of the man, just truly being analytical... I’m not sure how bright he really is.   I also don’t believe he has the political instincts necessary to realize how many around him may not be giving him the best advice...but like you said, who knows what’s happening behind the scenes

[aligncare]

Trump is tricky and the fat lady ain't sung yet,but if he backs off on building the wall he will NOT get re-elected.  It's one thing for the Dims to use congressional tricks to keep him from getting the funding,and another thing to just quit.

Given that no one in DC, republican or democrat, wants the wall, we’re gonna have to accept that Trump’s prospects of getting a wall done is not a sprint, it’s a marathon. We need to wait and see what Trump does next about achieving his signature issue, before people get all worked up.

[Axeslinger]

Given that no one in DC, republican or democrat, wants the wall, we’re gonna have to accept that Trump’s prospects of getting a wall done is not a sprint, it’s a marathon. We need to wait and see what Trump does next about achieving his signature issue, before people get all worked up.

@aligncare put down the rose glasses (not a shot at you), you couldn’t be more wrong.  He has virtually no chance of getting re-elected it he folds on this one issue.  AND there will not be a better strategic time for it because of the incoming House.  This IS the hill he should choose to live or die on...and unfortunately he’s choosing to die without even trying to fight.  He laid down the gauntlet last week looking strong and defiant to the Dems attempted tyrrany and now he looks weak, ill prepared AND like a liar to his base.

[edpc]

Given that no one in DC, republican or democrat, wants the wall, we’re gonna have to accept that Trump’s prospects of getting a wall done is not a sprint, it’s a marathon. We need to wait and see what Trump does next about achieving his signature issue, before people get all worked up.

Despite all of the theories people have come up with about repurposing money from other departments and military spending, he’s extremely limited with what he can do. Kellyanne Conway just recently said, “He has a responsibility to keep the government moving forward and he has a responsibility to get border security. If he could do that by himself he would have done it already."

[Free Vulcan]

Given that no one in DC, republican or democrat, wants the wall, we’re gonna have to accept that Trump’s prospects of getting a wall done is not a sprint, it’s a marathon. We need to wait and see what Trump does next about achieving his signature issue, before people get all worked up.

Notice again, that these so called conservatives aren't the least bit tizzied at the failure of Republicans in Congress to pass any meaningful immigration legislation the last two years, in a body that they themselves are a part of.

I'm not sure it was the best tactical move to make the big play for the border wall, but even if he didn't 'cave' the result would be the same.

[RoosGirl]

Notice again, that these so called conservatives aren't the least bit tizzied at the failure of Republicans in Congress to pass any meaningful immigration legislation the last two years, in a body that they themselves are a part of.

I'm not sure it was the best tactical move to make the big play for the border wall, but even if he didn't 'cave' the result would be the same.

Except that the "street fighter" could at least pound Twitter with how the Democrats don't want border security and fought him every step of the way and at least tried to use it for some political gain in 2020.

[aligncare]

Except that the "street fighter" could at least pound Twitter with how the Democrats don't want border security and fought him every step of the way and at least tried to use it for some political gain in 2020.

Fair point. The man’s not perfect. But, then again, this has not played out yet.

Hey, ‘tis the season to spread glad tidings, what can I say?

Cheers,
From an ardent AT   

[Free Vulcan]

Except that the "street fighter" could at least pound Twitter with how the Democrats don't want border security and fought him every step of the way and at least tried to use it for some political gain in 2020.

Fair point, but bottom line is we've had a 2-year capitulation by Congress, which the conservatives are part of, but they want to ignore that to pile on a reversal of statement.

[edpc]

Trump spent nearly a year in office, seeing very little done, to advance his agenda. With the exception of a supreme court appointment, nothing was done until December 2017, with tax reform. At that point, he knew full well the wall was not a priority with the congressional majority. Despite that, he went into the Camp David meeting, this past January, and agreed to support incumbents for the midterms. The biggest rallying points, during his campaign, were ‘lock her up’ and ‘build the wall.’ He freely admitted, post election, that ‘lock her up’ was just good campaign talk. You have to really wonder if he was ever truly serious about the wall.

[Free Vulcan]

Trump spent nearly a year in office, seeing very little done, to advance his agenda. With the exception of a supreme court appointment, nothing was done until December 2017, with tax reform. At that point, he knew full well the wall was not a priority with the congressional majority. Despite that, he went into the Camp David meeting, this past January, and agreed to support incumbents for the midterms. The biggest rallying points, during his campaign, were ‘lock her up’ and ‘build the wall.’ He freely admitted, post election, that ‘lock her up’ was just good campaign talk. You have to really wonder if he was ever truly serious about the wall.

He has the bully pulpit and that's about it, which he's used. Please tell us the Point A to Point B roadmap as to how he's going to get this done with a Congress not willing to do much of anything on anything.

[edpc]

He has the bully pulpit and that's about it, which he's used. Please tell us the Point A to Point B roadmap as to how he's going to get this done with a Congress not willing to do much of anything on anything.

That is entirely my point. He was fully aware they weren’t going to support the effort during 2017, yet he agreed to back them this year. Review the meeting attendees, examine their stance on immigration/the wall, and tell me if he could not see where this was heading.

He walked into the presidency, with a list of SCOTUS nominees, with outside help. He already had allies in the freedom caucus. He could’ve use their resources to find midterm candidates that would support his efforts. That is your A to B and what a real fighter would have done. I’m not saying this in hindsight, because I said the same thing in January.

He was never truly serious about doing the real work to get things done. He wanted to have rallies and adoration, but the ability to blame others, when it did not work out. We have seen that time and time again.

[Axeslinger]

He has the bully pulpit and that's about it, which he's used. Please tell us the Point A to Point B roadmap as to how he's going to get this done with a Congress not willing to do much of anything on anything.

Well...at a minimum when you cowboy up and say, “fine shut her down, I’M PROUD TO SHUT THE GIVERNMENT DOWN”, you don’t then a week later tuck your tail an totally capitulate...ON AN ISSUE THE AMERICAN PEOPLE AGREE WITH YOU ON!!!!

You shut the damn thing down and wait for congress to either give you a bill you support and will sign or one that you will veto and they have the votes to override.   You don’t just puss out.  You do what you say you’re going to and force congress to act.

It ain’t rocket surgery

[jpsb]

@aligncare This IS the hill he should choose to live or die on...and unfortunately he’s choosing to die without even trying to fight.  He laid down the gauntlet last week looking strong and defiant to the Dems attempted tyrrany and now he looks weak, ill prepared AND like a liar to his base.

That is what I find most disappointing, he is not even putting up a fight. How many times has he
told us next time I'll fight? More then a few times, so it's getting harder and harder to believe him.

[catfish1957]

That is what I find most disappointing, he is not even putting up a fight. How many times has he
told us next time I'll fight? More then a few times, so it's getting harder and harder to believe him.

DOW now under 23K.  Man..... Trump sure has had a rough few weeks.

[RoosGirl]

DOW now under 23K.  Man..... Trump sure has had a rough few weeks.

Hey, how's the 401k doing?  Ready to buy that first yacht yet?  I think someone asked that here a couple weeks ago.

[bilo]

That is what I find most disappointing, he is not even putting up a fight. How many times has he
told us next time I'll fight? More then a few times, so it's getting harder and harder to believe him.

This is it in a nutshell! Trump would have kept his supporters even if he lost in a veto override. It would be congressional Pubs who would have lost support for not standing with him.

Now it sounds like Trump will veto the spending bill and shut down part of the govt. If he hangs in there he will probably win, but will he ever truly regain his tough guy persona with his supporters now that he's signaled he will surrender.