Author Topic: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns  (Read 2264 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline ABX

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 900
  • Words full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« on: August 18, 2018, 05:07:20 pm »
Quote

While the Department of Justice is working to convince a judge to lift an injunction barring the publishing of blueprints for 3D printed guns, Attorney General Jeff Sessions says his division will take action against people who make the plastic “undetectable” firearms....


http://amp.timeinc.net/fortune/2018/08/17/sessions-3d-printed-guns


Offline Right_in_Virginia

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 80,122
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2018, 05:25:40 pm »
Let's hope this includes ISIS and MS 13 "refugees" already living among us.

Offline Meldrew

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 225
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2018, 05:36:00 pm »
Quote
Sessions’ statement followed a brief by the DOJ Wednesday that urged a federal judge to rescind a block on publishing the blueprints. That injunction came after 19 states and the District of Columbia argued that the guns were untraceable and could be a boon to criminals and terrorists.

So basically he's affirming to the 19 states that he will enforce existing law.  Good.  Now the 19 states have to prove them untraceable (undetectable?).  Should be interesting. 

Online Bigun

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 51,697
  • Gender: Male
  • Resistance to Tyrants is Obedience to God
    • The FairTax Plan
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2018, 05:36:15 pm »
But there is no time for Hillary Clinton, James Comey, Huma Abadeen, etc. etc.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline ABX

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 900
  • Words full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2018, 05:38:18 pm »
Let's hope this includes ISIS and MS 13 "refugees" already living among us.

They aren't the ones 3d printing guns. They can get real ones on the streets.

Offline Meldrew

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 225
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2018, 05:50:37 pm »
Not to mention that it would be a dumb gun to use for general defense.  They're single shot and have a habit of blowing up after a few rounds. 

Offline ABX

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 900
  • Words full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2018, 05:58:39 pm »
Not to mention that it would be a dumb gun to use for general defense.  They're single shot and have a habit of blowing up after a few rounds.

The people who are making these aren't doing it to make a weapon to use but are making a point about the government infringing on rights and that technology can't be stopped.

Online Elderberry

  • TBR Contributor
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,567
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2018, 06:00:07 pm »
Not to mention that it would be a dumb gun to use for general defense.  They're single shot and have a habit of blowing up after a few rounds.

3D printed guns have come a long way from the "Blow UP Single Shots"

“Download this gun”: 3D-printed semi-automatic fires over 600 rounds

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/03/download-this-gun-3d-printed-semi-automatic-fires-over-600-rounds/

! No longer available

Offline Right_in_Virginia

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 80,122
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2018, 06:07:41 pm »
The people who are making these aren't doing it to make a weapon to use but are making a point about the government infringing on rights and that technology can't be stopped.

Would you bet your life on this?

Offline Right_in_Virginia

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 80,122
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2018, 06:08:57 pm »
Not to mention that it would be a dumb gun to use for general defense.  They're single shot and have a habit of blowing up after a few rounds.

Right now.  But we all know this can and will be corrected.  Then what?


Offline roamer_1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 44,014
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2018, 06:10:12 pm »
Would you bet your life on this?

Doesn't matter.

Offline roamer_1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 44,014
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2018, 06:11:02 pm »
Right now.  But we all know this can and will be corrected.  Then what?

Doesn't matter.
The point in FACT is that it cannot be stopped.

Offline Meldrew

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 225
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #12 on: August 18, 2018, 06:14:31 pm »
3D printed guns have come a long way from the "Blow UP Single Shots"

“Download this gun”: 3D-printed semi-automatic fires over 600 rounds

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/03/download-this-gun-3d-printed-semi-automatic-fires-over-600-rounds/

! No longer available

That's an AR lower, not a whole gun. Note that everything else on the rifle is metal (at least on the upper).  Not appreciably different than what's available in the market today. 

Offline Right_in_Virginia

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 80,122
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2018, 06:21:28 pm »
Doesn't matter.
The point in FACT is that it cannot be stopped.

Okay.   :shrug:

Online Elderberry

  • TBR Contributor
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,567
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2018, 06:27:04 pm »
That's an AR lower, not a whole gun. Note that everything else on the rifle is metal (at least on the upper).  Not appreciably different than what's available in the market today.

By the ATF, the lower IS the gun, whether its fitted out with parts or not.

Offline Meldrew

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 225
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #15 on: August 18, 2018, 06:32:44 pm »
Right now.  But we all know this can and will be corrected.  Then what?

Well, "then what" is the big question now isn't it.  The article falls short in that it seems to conflate "undetectable" with "untraceable".  If undetectable is what we're worried about then the problem will pretty much solve itself since any firearm would have to use metal or possibly carbon fiber to be reliable and safe for more than a few rounds.  Both those materials are detectable (quick aside - the TSA found about a half-dozen or so of these 3d printed guns in the past year).  If the issue is untraceable then it would seem what they want is a serial number attached to the "gun" part so they can trace it with the defacto registry they're not supposed to have. I suspect this is the more likely case given anti-gun activists these days. 

@AbaraXas and @roamer_1 are both right about the first amendment part of the issue and you'd like to think that would be a settled issue but I'm guesing the left will continue to push for penalties despite clear first amendment implications. 

This is just like the plastic gun scare in the 80's when Glocks first hit the market - and just as dumb, but of course, that never stops the left from persuing their authoritarian agenda. 

Offline Meldrew

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 225
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #16 on: August 18, 2018, 06:35:37 pm »
By the ATF, the lower IS the gun, whether its fitted out with parts or not.

Right, but that just means it's the serialized part.  The parts that make it go bang and keep the metal out of your face are metal regardless of where the serial number is. 

Online Elderberry

  • TBR Contributor
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,567
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #17 on: August 18, 2018, 07:08:09 pm »
Right, but that just means it's the serialized part.  The parts that make it go bang and keep the metal out of your face are metal regardless of where the serial number is.

All 3D printed guns have metal firing pins. One metal part or many, what's the diff?

Online Elderberry

  • TBR Contributor
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,567
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #18 on: August 18, 2018, 07:52:07 pm »
This case is not about the regulation of U.S. persons who wish to utilize a 3D printer to manufacture their own small-caliber firearms.  Rather, this case concerns the Department of State’s delegated authority to control the export of defense articles and services, or technical data related thereto, that raise military or intelligence concerns.  The Department is tasked with determining what technology and weaponry provides a critical military or intelligence advantage such that it should not be shipped without restriction from the United States to other countries (or otherwise provided to foreigners), where, beyond the reach of U.S. law, it could be used to threaten U.S. national security, foreign policy, or international peace and stability. 

https://www.justice.gov/opa/case-document/file/1087571/download?utm_medium=email&utm_source=govdelivery

Offline DB

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13,484
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #19 on: August 18, 2018, 08:00:26 pm »
Tilting at windmills...

Just more feel good laws that only affect the lawful. The lawful that don't murder people in the first place.


Offline roamer_1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 44,014
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #20 on: August 18, 2018, 08:04:53 pm »
This case is not about the regulation of U.S. persons who wish to utilize a 3D printer to manufacture their own small-caliber firearms.  Rather, this case concerns the Department of State’s delegated authority to control the export of defense articles and services, or technical data related thereto, that raise military or intelligence concerns.  The Department is tasked with determining what technology and weaponry provides a critical military or intelligence advantage such that it should not be shipped without restriction from the United States to other countries (or otherwise provided to foreigners), where, beyond the reach of U.S. law, it could be used to threaten U.S. national security, foreign policy, or international peace and stability. 

https://www.justice.gov/opa/case-document/file/1087571/download?utm_medium=email&utm_source=govdelivery

That particular horse has already left the barn. Closing the door won't help a dang thing.

Online Elderberry

  • TBR Contributor
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,567
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #21 on: August 18, 2018, 08:44:34 pm »
I was just identifying their underlying weasel words.

Offline DB

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13,484
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #22 on: August 18, 2018, 08:47:10 pm »
All 3D printed guns have metal firing pins. One metal part or many, what's the diff?

I would think ceramic firing pins would be practical (I'm no gun expert).

Offline ABX

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 900
  • Words full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #23 on: August 18, 2018, 08:53:40 pm »
Tilting at windmills...

Just more feel good laws that only affect the lawful. The lawful that don't murder people in the first place.

This

Online Elderberry

  • TBR Contributor
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,567
Re: Justice Department Will Prosecute Makers of 3D Printed Guns
« Reply #24 on: August 18, 2018, 08:54:44 pm »
I would think ceramic firing pins would be practical (I'm no gun expert).

I saw in Wiki that glass ceramic firing pins were used in some land mines.

Good luck in finding one suitable for a 3D pistol.