Will Anthony Kennedy’s replacement really end Roe v. Wade?

[XenaLee]

Oh I get it perfectly.  If you don’t subjectively like the result, it’s “judicial tyranny” and if you do subjectively like the result, it’s “fidelity to the Constitution”.  That’s also known as hypocrisy.

Um.... that sounds a bit like a liberal/leftie interpretation of what I posted.   Odd, that. 

[roamer_1]

I’m sorry you feel you got a raw deal out of the child support order; perhaps if you’d had a better lawyer .....

I don't have a child support order. But I have withheld those funds from my employees for years - Employees, many of whom are living in their car or in a refrigerator box because of that withholding... To the point of turning an old shed at my business into a bunkhouse.

That payment destroys a man, and is often the difference in supporting a home of his own - and definitely impacts any thought of a retirement.

[roamer_1]

Actually you made that argument for me without meaning to.

The argument can also be made the man should be able to force the woman to have an abortion, if we want to maintain equivalence with her ability to force the man into financial servitude.

That's right. And in fact that still isn't fair. What of the man that would keep the baby? It is of his blood as much as hers, by the very definition.

[Cyber Liberty]

I don't have a child support order. But I have withheld those funds from my employees for years - Employees, many of whom are living in their car or in a refrigerator box because of that withholding... To the point of turning an old shed at my business into a bunkhouse.

That payment destroys a man, and is often the difference in supporting a home of his own - and definitely impacts any thought of a retirement.

He informed me that I also payed Child Support on another thread.  Just like you.   

[roamer_1]

Does that mean that we should simply kill off all children who don’t have two parents?

And while they certainly applies in the abstract, there are plenty of families where it is not true.  And for those families, your vision of marriage would simply be a condemnation.

It is a matter of fact that you get more of what you support.
Government currently supports abortion, divorce, bastard children, and single family homes. And the government penalizes marriage and it's sanctity.

You do the math.

[roamer_1]

I don't have a child support order. But I have withheld those funds from my employees for years - Employees, many of whom are living in their car or in a refrigerator box because of that withholding... To the point of turning an old shed at my business into a bunkhouse.

That payment destroys a man, and is often the difference in supporting a home of his own - and definitely impacts any thought of a retirement.

ADDENDUM:
I later had to remove the bunks because, through the investigation of a child support order, it was ruled that my provision was a form of compensation and subject to calculation against the man. And thus the bunkhouse went away. Necessarily stuffed full of parts and supplies, subject to several inspections to make sure I wasn't doing it anymore.

BULLSHIT.

[Oceander]

Bovine fecal matter!

Right back atcha, sport. 

[Oceander]

Um.... that sounds a bit like a liberal/leftie interpretation of what I posted.   Odd, that. 

So now you’re admitting to being a liberal/leftie?  Because that is the essence of your position.

[Cyber Liberty]

So now you’re admitting to being a liberal/leftie?  Because that is the essence of your position.

Sounded to me like she, too, objects to you twisting her words.

[Oceander]

I don't have a child support order. But I have withheld those funds from my employees for years - Employees, many of whom are living in their car or in a refrigerator box because of that withholding... To the point of turning an old shed at my business into a bunkhouse.

That payment destroys a man, and is often the difference in supporting a home of his own - and definitely impacts any thought of a retirement.

Like I said, maybe they should have had better lawyers. 

And just whom do you expect to pay for the care and feeding of these “men’s” offspring?  Letting them go without paying doesn’t make the child go away and simply shifts those costs to someone else, like the rest of us, who clearly played no role in the creation of their children.

[Oceander]

Sounded to me like she, too, objects to you twisting her words.

She objects to having the ugly truth pointed out.  So do most people. 

[Oceander]

It is a matter of fact that you get more of what you support.
Government currently supports abortion, divorce, bastard children, and single family homes. And the government penalizes marriage and it's sanctity.

You do the math.

Again, you’re resorting to irrelevancies.  There is no logical connection between the freedom for a woman to choose an abortion and government support of abortion.  The one does not entail the other.  I quite agree that the government should not be in the business of providing or paying for abortions, just as I believe it should not be in the business of outlawing them. 

[Cyber Liberty]

She objects to having the ugly truth pointed out.  So do most people.

People tend to detest word-twisters, yeah.  It's an ugly argumentation technique.

[roamer_1]

Like I said, maybe they should have had better lawyers. 

And just whom do you expect to pay for the care and feeding of these “men’s” offspring?  Letting them go without paying doesn’t make the child go away and simply shifts those costs to someone else, like the rest of us, who clearly played no role in the creation of their children.

Exactly right - which is why marriage is the obvious answer, and the answer that has been the answer for generation upon generation, for all time.

Never mind. Time will tell the paucity of your position. Soon enough, the welfare state will outstrip the ability of the government to pay for it... And if we two live through the collapse, we will see how things revert to the truth. Without uncle nanny providing the tools of decadence, decadence will necessarily flee. And in that, justice will bloom again.

It's how it works. Deny history all you like. Claim the sophistry that we are so much better than our fathers... It will necessarily come to naught.

[Oceander]

People tend to detest word-twisters, yeah.  It's an ugly argumentation technique.

I’m sorry you think telling the truth bluntly is twisting words. 

[Oceander]

Exactly right - which is why marriage is the obvious answer, and the answer that has been the answer for generation upon generation, for all time.

Never mind. Time will tell the paucity of your position. Soon enough, the welfare state will outstrip the ability of the government to pay for it... And if we two live through the collapse, we will see how things revert to the truth. Without uncle nanny providing the tools of decadence, decadence will necessarily flee. And in that, justice will bloom again.

It's how it works. Deny history all you like. Claim the sophistry that we are so much better than our fathers... It will necessarily come to naught.

Marriage is not “the answer”.  Oftentimes it is, and people should not be dissuaded from marrying and from working on solving the problems that arise in a marriage, but marriage will not fix what is already broken, and it will not magically solve all the ills of the world.  And that goes double for forced marriages, and marriages from which there is no divorce. 

[XenaLee]

Sounded to me like she, too, objects to you twisting her words.

He just can't help himself.  It's how they roll.....what they do.   He keeps making our case for us with every word he posts....lol.

[XenaLee]

She objects to having the ugly truth pointed out.  So do most people.

Only..... you (obviously) wouldn't know the truth if it jumped up, sat on your face and held a week-long sleepover!   

[Oceander]

Only..... you (obviously) wouldn't know the truth if it jumped up, sat on your face and held a week-long sleepover!   

If you say so.

[TomSea]

It's all part of the long struggle, this is one step closer as Romney/Ryan were one step closer, things rarely happen over night.  Even a lot of scholars, even people like Charles Krauthammer, no noted pro-lifer said the Roe V. Wade decision was a travesty.  States should not have this imposed on them just like for the most part, States have regulated marriage.

[roamer_1]

Marriage is not “the answer”.  Oftentimes it is, and people should not be dissuaded from marrying and from working on solving the problems that arise in a marriage, but marriage will not fix what is already broken, and it will not magically solve all the ills of the world.  And that goes double for forced marriages, and marriages from which there is no divorce.

Yes, in fact it is the only answer. And the evidence lies a mere fifty years in our past. Divorce was possible - only fault had to be proven. The state of divorce was minimal, abortion was largely illegal, bastard children were relatively few, crime was extremely low, and (state and church run) social services cost very little by comparison.

This brave new world of yours is a wrecking ball.

[TomSea]

Congrats to those who didn't abandon ship; it's a slow process but it's coming along.

[Oceander]

Yes, in fact it is the only answer. And the evidence lies a mere fifty years in our past. Divorce was possible - only fault had to be proven. The state of divorce was minimal, abortion was largely illegal, bastard children were relatively few, crime was extremely low, and (state and church run) social services cost very little by comparison.

This brave new world of yours is a wrecking ball.

No, in fact, it isn’t the answer in a substantial number of cases.  And neither are rigid or parsimonious divorce rules.  Those who think otherwise are the ones denying history. 

[XenaLee]

Yes, in fact it is the only answer. And the evidence lies a mere fifty years in our past. Divorce was possible - only fault had to be proven. The state of divorce was minimal, abortion was largely illegal, bastard children were relatively few, crime was extremely low, and (state and church run) social services cost very little by comparison.

This brave new world of yours is a wrecking ball.

As intended to be.

[roamer_1]

As intended to be.

Precisely so.