Ted Cruz introduces legislation to keep immigrant families together after they cross the border

[SirLinksALot]

The typical illegal has the attitude of "F You and your Immigration Laws, You Stole this land from us and we have the Right to be here."

I have never understood this argument.

Stealing a piece of land presumes that you owned the land.

Who actually owned what in North America before the white men arrived?

What "proof" do we have that this tribe or that laid claim to ownership of say, Property X with this size?

Does this mean anyone who arrives first in a vast continent gets to say that he owns all of it?

If Robinson Crusoe lands in an Island, does he now claims that he owns the island when a ship eventually arrives?

[Jazzhead]

Murdering and conquering aren't typical "Christian values" that I recognize.

Neither is treating asylum seekers as criminals and separating parents and children.

Can't anyone here see why this looks so bad?   If an illegal commits a crime and is incarcerated, she is treated no different than a citizen who commits the same crime - she goes to jail and is separated from her kids.   But that's not the situation here - these are asylum seekers,  parents and kids escaping oppression.  They may or may not merit asylum.  But while their case is pending, they are being treated as equivalent to criminals,  with parents and kids separated.  You may think these are the worst people on earth for daring to knock on our door.   But the optics are terrible, and the policy is not sustainable. 

[dfwgator]

Neither is treating asylum seekers as criminals and separating parents and children.

Can't anyone here see why this looks so bad?   If an illegal commits a crime and is incarcerated, she is treated no different than a citizen who commits the same crime - she goes to jail and is separated from her kids.   But that's not the situation here - these are asylum seekers,  parents and kids escaping oppression.  They may or may not merit asylum.  But while their case is pending, they are being treated as equivalent to criminals,  with parents and kids separated.  You may think these are the worst people on earth for daring to knock on our door.   But the optics are terrible, and the policy is not sustainable.

It "looks bad" because the media wants to make it look bad.  Goebbels had nothing on our media.

[dfwgator]

I have never understood this argument.

Stealing a piece of land presumes that you owned the land.

Who actually owned what in North America before the white men arrived?

What "proof" do we have that this tribe or that laid claim to ownership of say, Property X with this size?

Does this mean anyone who arrives first in a vast continent gets to say that he owns all of it?

If Robinson Crusoe lands in an Island, does he now claims that he owns the island when a ship eventually arrives?

But the Commies have so indoctrinated people over the years, that they buy this crap.

[SirLinksALot]

Neither is treating asylum seekers as criminals and separating parents and children.

Let's say you are President Jazzhead and you swore to uphold the law of the land ( which you have to ).

The law of the land says that ADULTS who cross the border illegally must be incarcerated until they can process their claim. The law also says that children cannot be incarcerated with the adult for their safety ( BTW, I will ignore for the meantime, the fact that almost 80% of these kids are NOT with their parents but with some sort of adult "guardian" ( Note the quotes ) ).

What is President Jazzhead supposed to do? IGNORE THE LAW?

BTW, Obama himself was doing the same thing that Trump did. There was not an outcry as big as this one when that happened then. Suddenly, we are supposed to believe that Only Trump is doing this.

[GrouchoTex]

Neither is treating asylum seekers as criminals and separating parents and children.

Can't anyone here see why this looks so bad?   If an illegal commits a crime and is incarcerated, she is treated no different than a citizen who commits the same crime - she goes to jail and is separated from her kids.   But that's not the situation here - these are asylum seekers,  parents and kids escaping oppression.  They may or may not merit asylum.  But while their case is pending, they are being treated as equivalent to criminals,  with parents and kids separated.  You may think these are the worst people on earth for daring to knock on our door.   But the optics are terrible, and the policy is not sustainable.

@Jazzhead
I can explain to you what the "Asylum" seeker of today is doing, this isn't you Father's "Asylum" seeker, but I don't think you want to know.
It has been explained in several threads like this.
You may now continue to bury your head in the sand.

[Cyber Liberty]

Neither is treating asylum seekers as criminals and separating parents and children.

Can't anyone here see why this looks so bad?   If an illegal commits a crime and is incarcerated, she is treated no different than a citizen who commits the same crime - she goes to jail and is separated from her kids.   But that's not the situation here - these are asylum seekers,  parents and kids escaping oppression.  They may or may not merit asylum.  But while their case is pending, they are being treated as equivalent to criminals,  with parents and kids separated.  You may think these are the worst people on earth for daring to knock on our door.   But the optics are terrible, and the policy is not sustainable.

I think murdering Americans is worse than treating "Asylum Seekers" who jumped even that line by not crossing at a Port of Entry.

I don't give a bleep if you think it looks bad.  You walk a mile in my shoes and tell me about it looking bad.

[edpc]

It "looks bad" because the media wants to make it look bad.  Goebbels had nothing on our media.

Perhaps the admin shouldn’t try to rival them in Goebbels-esque behavior by proudly and publicly rolling this practice out with the AG announcing a ‘Zero Tolerance Policy,’ then bring out the DHS Secretary to later say ‘there is no policy.’

[Suppressed]

BTW, Obama himself was doing the same thing that Trump did. There was not an outcry as big as this one when that happened then. Suddenly, we are supposed to believe that Only Trump is doing this.

Actually, after a while, Obama began to ignore the law.

[jpsb]

Neither is treating asylum seekers as criminals and separating parents and children.

What you don't get, and I know I am wasting my time trying to explain it to you, is that they ARE
NOT asylum seekers. If they were asylum seekers they would enter LEGALLY at a port of entry and
ask for asylum. Then their children would remain with them until a determination was made.

These people are illegally sneaking into USA and if they get caught they have been told to ask for
asylum to delay being deported. If they are not caught illegally sneaking into the country they
don't claim asylum they simply disappear.

So the entire premise of you argument is INCORRECT.

[Sanguine]

Another reason Congress doesn't want to deal with it is because they've been lying to us for many years and they don't want us to see the truth (shocker, I know).  Many, even many on our side, are still bandying the number 11 million about.  Where did that number come from and does it have any relationship to truth?  It might have had some truth to it - many years ago.  Since then, the number of "immigrants" has increased dramatically and I don't think anyone inside the Beltway wants us to understand the real numbers and full extent of the problem.

[dfwgator]

@Jazzhead

Asylum Seekers?  Are these Communist countries they're fleeing from?

And look what we did to Elian who actually did flee from a Communist country.

[Sanguine]

What you don't get, and I know I am wasting my time trying to explain it to you, is that they ARE NOT asylum seekers. If they were asylum seekers they would enter LEGALLY at a port of entry and ask for asylum. Then their children would remain with them until a determination was made.

These people are illegally sneaking into USA and if they get caught they have been told to ask for
asylum to delay being deported. If they are not caught illegally sneaking into the country they
don't claim asylum they simply disappear.

So the entire premise of you argument is INCORRECT.

That needs to be emphasized.

[Cyber Liberty]

That needs to be emphasized.

Now, don't interrupt liberals when they're trying to stampede people using false analogies.

[txradioguy]

That needs to be emphasized.

And that port of entry would be the first non conflict country they enter...not the third or fourth.

[Right_in_Virginia]

Neither is treating asylum seekers as criminals and separating parents and children.

Can't anyone here see why this looks so bad?   If an illegal commits a crime  ...

This is the problem ... right here:  "If an illegal commits a crime"  The act of crossing our borders without permission is illegal.  For cripes sake, "illegal" is in their very name.  What part of this don't you understand?

If people are truly "asylum seekers" then they enter this nation through a US Port of Entry.  If they do this, there's no illegal activity and the children stay with the adults.

But the folks running across the border intentionally bypassing a US Port of Entry are doing so because they have no case for asylum.  They are invaders and should be treated as such.  Send them back...children and adults.  No waiting.  No judges.  As the President said yesterday:  We don't need more judges, we need border security.

Don't make this more complicated than it is.  US Port of Entry:  Good.  Running across our border:  Bad.

And build the damn wall.

@Jazzhead

[GrouchoTex]

What you don't get, and I know I am wasting my time trying to explain it to you, is that they ARE
NOT asylum seekers. If they were asylum seekers they would enter LEGALLY at a port of entry and
ask for asylum. Then their children would remain with them until a determination was made.

These people are illegally sneaking into USA and if they get caught they have been told to ask for
asylum to delay being deported. If they are not caught illegally sneaking into the country they
don't claim asylum they simply disappear.

So the entire premise of you argument is INCORRECT.

Absolutely spot on @jpsb

[GrouchoTex]

This is the problem ... right here:  "If an illegal commits a crime"  The act of crossing our borders without permission is illegal.  For cripes sake, "illegal" is in their very name.  What part of this don't you understand?

If people are truly "asylum seekers" then they enter this nation through a US Port of Entry.  If they do this, there's no illegal activity and the children stay with the adults.

But the folks running across the border intentionally bypassing a US Port of Entry are doing so because they have no case for asylum.  They are invaders and should be treated as such.  Send them back...children and adults.  No waiting.  No judges.  As the President said yesterday:  We don't need more judges, we need border security.

Don't make this more complicated than it is.  US Port of Entry:  Good.  Running across our border:  Bad.

And build the damn wall.


@Jazzhead

100% Correct @Right_in_Virginia

[Jazzhead]

The law of the land says that ADULTS who cross the border illegally must be incarcerated until they can process their claim.

Show me where in the law that incarceration is required.  Crossing the border illegally is a misdemeanor.   I agree that the law requires that IF an individual is incarcerated,  her kids must be separated.   But it is Trump administration policy to incarcerate asylum seekers.  It is not the  law.

In previous administrations, asylum seekers were released into the U.S. pending their hearing.   I agree that's a problem, since an asylum seeker may disappear and not show up at the hearing,  and the bail system won't work because they don't come here with assets.   

If I were President Jazzhead,  I would release asylum seekers (with no other evidence of criminal activity, such as human trafficking) into the U.S. pending their asylum hearing provided they agree to confine themselves to a designated city or town and wear an ankle monitoring bracelet so their locations can be tracked if necessary. 

[sneakypete]

The typical illegal has the attitude of "F You and your Immigration Laws, You Stole this land from us and we have the Right to be here."

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I have never understood this mentality.

Exactly who owned what in this sparse continent before the White men came in the 15th century?

@dfwgator

I do. It is the mindset placed into their heads when they get here by activist Priests and other leftists seeking revolution and power. They were doing this with the US Indian tribes in the 50's and 60's,and now they are doing it with the Indians from south of our border. Do NOT call them "Indians" though,or their heads will explode and they will get violent. They are all the descendants of Spanish Dons,and you WILL call them "Spanish".

Anyhow,the idea by the left is to ferment revolution so that others die and they can then step in to reap the rewards.

[GrouchoTex]

Key words:

Port of Entry.

[sneakypete]

Murdering and conquering my be "biblical" (Old Testament) but it isn't "Christian" (New Testament).  Seriously.

@Cyber Liberty

So,the ORIGINAL "Word of God" has been replaced with the "New and Improved Word of God"?

[sneakypete]

What you don't get, and I know I am wasting my time trying to explain it to you, is that they ARE
NOT asylum seekers. If they were asylum seekers they would enter LEGALLY at a port of entry and
ask for asylum. Then their children would remain with them until a determination was made.

These people are illegally sneaking into USA and if they get caught they have been told to ask for
asylum to delay being deported. If they are not caught illegally sneaking into the country they
don't claim asylum they simply disappear.

So the entire premise of you argument is INCORRECT.

@jpsb  @Jazzhead

 

[SirLinksALot]

Show me where in the law that incarceration is required.  Crossing the border illegally is a misdemeanor.   I agree that the law requires that IF an individual is incarcerated,  her kids must be separated.   But it is Trump administration policy to incarcerate asylum seekers.  It is not the  law.

Please re-read what was posted above. They ARE NOT asylum seekers. If they were asylum seekers they would enter LEGALLY at a port of entry and ask for asylum. Then their children would remain with them until a determination was made. THAT IS THE LAW.

You don't cross the border illegally without going through a LEGAL and DESIGNATED port of entry and then call yourself an asylum seeker.

If that were the intent of the law, then anybody ( terrorists included ) can call themselves "asylum seekers" ( note the quotes ).

And I am still waiting for you to answer my question -- Exactly how many percent of a country's population who call themselves "asylum seekers" are you willing for this country to take in?

[INVAR]

Neither is treating asylum seekers as criminals and separating parents and children.

If they came into the country without the proper paperwork and through the proper door, then THEY ARE CRIMINALS - having violated our laws to get in here.  Separating children from the adults who are posing as their parents is definitively the correct thing to do.  It also acts as a deterrent to those who are being told to come here with their kids and get a free life paid for by SUCKERS in America.

Can't anyone here see why this looks so bad?

We no longer care 'how it looks'.   This is an invasion of foreign squatters you are advocating that we pay for and suffer.

But that's not the situation here - these are asylum seekers,  parents and kids escaping oppression.

If they snuck into this country without ringing the doorbell and getting the correct visas and paperwork filed, they are CRIMINALS and are lawbreakers and should be treated as invaders and sent back after being DNA marked so that they can never apply to come into this country ever again.

They may or may not merit asylum.  But while their case is pending, they are being treated as equivalent to criminals,  with parents and kids separated. 

Good.  It's past time to de-incentivize the open border welfare state that the hordes of squatters and OTMs are told that can just come in here, get treated better than citizens and live off my dime.

Unless you personally are going to house and pay for all these "asylum seekers" while their "cases are being adjudicated" you can just go pound sand.

We're broke and in debt and we cannot afford to deal with all the millions of SOTB squatters and Reconquinistas here now.