USA & No Korea Summit LIVE THREAD

[driftdiver]

Trump could cure cancer, end world hunger, make ice cream healthy and some people still wouldn't give him any credit.  Because you know, he's Trump.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Agreed.   The first step is just that - a first step.   But the genie's out of the bottle.    Every North Korean citizen will see the photo of Kim and Trump, and read the Joint Statement.

Exactly -- how is that bad??

The thing is that the most dangerous time for a dictatorship is when the people start having hope.  People with no hope have nothing to fight for, and so they don't.  But if you give them a glimpse of a potentially much better future, and they are then denied that...they can get quite angry.

Some people are saying this is a propaganda victory for Kim.  I think that they are ignoring that NK national policy has been to absolutely demonize the U.S. for decades.  A picture of a U.S. President meeting with their leaders, and saying he wants peace...that is big.

[Frank Cannon]

That's one.  Do you really think any other Republican President couldn't have gotten tax cuts from a Republican House and a Republican Senate?  Of course, there's been plenty of other deals to be had:  "repeal and replace", Mexico paying for the wall, DACA, "irreversible" and "verifiable" denuclearization by North Korea.  Unfortunately, it sure appears to me that in this summit, Kim got more than he gave up.

You are just going to be intentionally obtuse because A) You hate Trump and nothing he does interests your Rockefeller Republican sensibilities and B) You hate Trump and nothing he does interests your Rockefeller Republican sensibilities.

[Frank Cannon]

BTW.......

Just more tangible evidence......Trump is GOD!!!!!

[dfwgator]

BTW.......

Just more tangible evidence......Trump is GOD!!!!!

He's a God...not THE God.

[corbe]

   More proof it doesn't take much for Frank to get his panties wet.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Of course, there's been plenty of other deals to be had:  "repeal and replace", Mexico paying for the wall, DACA, "irreversible" and "verifiable" denuclearization by North Korea.

The last is premature, but as to the others, how do you know that there actually existed majorities willing to vote for repeal and replace, or that Mexico was actually willing to pay for the wall?  Some deals can't be made because there is no compromise that is acceptable to both sides.  That's the reality of negotiating.

Unfortunately, it sure appears to me that in this summit, Kim got more than he gave up.

What did he get that has any tangible value?

[TomSea]

Opinion piece, CBC (Canada) calls it, of course, they aren't in the best of moods now after G-7:

Trump the 'great dealmaker' lets Kim Jong-un walk away with the spoils in Singapore
cbc.ca Keith Boag

Editor’s note: The opinions in this article are the author’s, as published by our content partner, and do not necessarily represent the views of MSN or Microsoft.

The leader of the world's most repressive regime — who reportedly delights in ordering his political enemies in North Korea blown to smithereens with anti-aircraft guns or ripped apart by starving dogs — stepped out of his limousine on Singapore's Sentosa Island Tuesday morning to receive the priceless gift of a face-to-face meeting with the putative leader of the free world.

At that moment, Kim Jong-un notched the diplomatic coup that had eluded him, his father and his grandfather for decades: In front of the world, the despot was treated as an equal by the president of the United States.

Read more at: https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/trump-the-great-dealmaker-lets-kim-jong-un-walk-away-with-the-spoils-in-singapore/ar-AAyxVXt

[aligncare]

Opinion piece, CBC (Canada) calls it, of course, they aren't in the best of moods now after G-7:

The left has been screaming “Trump will get us into a war!,” then they scream “Trump isn’t provoking Kim enough!” 

[Concerned]

The last is premature, but as to the others, how do you know that there actually existed majorities willing to vote for repeal and replace, or that Mexico was actually willing to pay for the wall?  Some deals can't be made because there is no compromise that is acceptable to both sides.  That's the reality of negotiating.


What did he get that has any tangible value?

I think truly great deal-makers can find a way to get what they want.

As for Kim, whether it's tangible or not, he definitively got more than he gave IMO.  Look, we may eventually get to an "irreversible" and "verifiable" denuked North Korea.  If we get there, I'll certainly celebrate it, but it sure seems to me like round one went to Kim IMO. 

[driftdiver]

I think truly great deal-makers can find a way to get what they want.

As for Kim, whether it's tangible or not, he definitively got more than he gave IMO.  Look, we may eventually get to an "irreversible" and "verifiable" denuked North Korea.  If we get there, I'll certainly celebrate it, but it sure seems to me like round one went to Kim IMO.

From what I can tell the only thing Kim got was a delay in the war games.  That can change quickly so it's really not a win.

[Concerned]

From what I can tell the only thing Kim got was a delay in the war games.  That can change quickly so it's really not a win.

I think North Korea dictators have been seeking legitimacy for decades.  Meeting with the US President certainly provides them that and a huge propaganda win at home......at least IMO.  As noted in the OpEd posted by TomSea above:

Before handing out Nobel prizes, though, it's important to see what happened in the way that Kim likely sees it. He's just enjoyed the most unimaginable success on the international stage in the history of his country. It was made possible by the fact of his nuclear weapons, so their value to him has proved itself. Does that really sound like the precondition that would persuade him to give up those weapons in the foreseeable future?

“Unimaginable success” sure sounds like a win to me. 

[TomSea]

The left has been screaming “Trump will get us into a war!,” then they scream “Trump isn’t provoking Kim enough!” 

As history is, we will not be able to come to a judgement of events, in 5, 10 or 15 years. Maybe we will know soon. What we do know, is the US made a sincere attempt for peace in that region.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

At that moment, Kim Jong-un notched the diplomatic coup that had eluded him, his father and his grandfather for decades: In front of the world, the despot was treated as an equal by the president of the United States.

And that gets him...what, exactly?

On the flip side, Trump earned the right to claim that he went further than any other U.S. president in trying to work with the NK's.  If Kim doesn't follow through, then Trump's got more political capital to push for much more "robust" U.S. actions against North Korea.  The entire country -- the entire world -- will know that we exhausted every single other possible avenue to resolve the threat the NK's pose.

So ultimately, if we're talking about the propaganda value of this meeting, Trump actually came out ahead because the propaganda on his end may actually be useful.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

I think truly great deal-makers can find a way to get what they want.

Could a truly great dealmaker get you to kill an innocent child, if that's what he wanted?

What could he offer that would make you do that?

[Concerned]

Could a truly great dealmaker get you to kill an innocent child, if that's what he wanted?

What could he offer that would make you do that?

I don't have any children, but I think even suggesting killing children is reprehensible.  Have a good day.   

[INVAR]

Trust But Verify



"While people are saying, "Peace and safety," destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape." - I Thessalonians 5:3

“For from the least of them to the greatest, all are greedy for gain. From prophet to priest, all practice deceit. They have treated My people's brokenness superficially, saying, ‘Peace, peace,’ when there is no peace at all.  Were they ashamed of the abominations they committed? No, they were not at all ashamed. They did not even know how to blush. So they will fall among the fallen; when I punish them, they will collapse,” says the LORD - Jeremiah 6:13-15

[truth_seeker]

NK threads providing chance for NTs to demonstrate "shrinking" in plain sight dance", to the chorus of their Fakestream Media's choreography

[aligncare]

The left has been screaming “Trump will get us into a war!,” then they scream “Trump isn’t provoking Kim enough!” 

What a hoot! Rush is just now making this very point.

I guess this puts me on the cutting edge of societal evolution.

[Sanguine]

NK threads providing chance for NTs to demonstrate "shrinking" in plain sight dance", to the chorus of their Fakestream Media's choreography

How is that relevant to the topic of this thread, other than to start the NT/ET fight up again?

[Jazzhead]

And that gets him...what, exactly?

On the flip side, Trump earned the right to claim that he went further than any other U.S. president in trying to work with the NK's.  If Kim doesn't follow through, then Trump's got more political capital to push for much more "robust" U.S. actions against North Korea.  The entire country -- the entire world -- will know that we exhausted every single other possible avenue to resolve the threat the NK's pose.

So ultimately, if we're talking about the propaganda value of this meeting, Trump actually came out ahead because the propaganda on his end may actually be useful.

Agreed.   Trump has shown his willingness to dispense with convention and conventional thinking,  and drill down to the heart of a problem.   We have North Korea at the bargaining table having signed a statement agreeing in principle to de-nuclearisation.  We have the most powerful man in Saudi Arabia suggesting Israel has the right to exist.    We have the makings of a true alliance against Iran.   We have the NATO countries spending more on defense than before.   We have provided arms to Ukraine, and kept our word in Syria regarding red lines.   We even have Russia saying it welcomes a reset in relations, noting that Trump can be expected to "keep his campaign promises".

No one was more critical than I was about Trump, prior to the election.   But especially when it comes to foreign policy, the man's a breath of fresh air.   

[Oceander]

How is that relevant to the topic of this thread, other than to start the NT/ET fight up again?

Because Trumpalos cannot assuage that bitter taint of insecurity they have unless all around them are worshipping Trump as fervently as they.

[corbe]

   @TomSea and @Maj. Bill Martin bring up a very salient point, we just can't possibly know what just transpired in Singapore, other than optics for awhile. 
   Sure didn't take this guy long to be shown the complete idiot that he was.

[Sanguine]

Because Trumpalos cannot assuage that bitter taint of insecurity they have unless all around them are worshipping Trump as fervently as they.

Gee, thanks, 0....

[Oceander]

And that gets him...what, exactly?

On the flip side, Trump earned the right to claim that he went further than any other U.S. president in trying to work with the NK's.  If Kim doesn't follow through, then Trump's got more political capital to push for much more "robust" U.S. actions against North Korea.  The entire country -- the entire world -- will know that we exhausted every single other possible avenue to resolve the threat the NK's pose.

So ultimately, if we're talking about the propaganda value of this meeting, Trump actually came out ahead because the propaganda on his end may actually be useful.

It may very well get him an undefeatable internal political position which, depending on where he is on the anti-American spectrum, could make him more intransigent rather than less when it comes to future negotiations with the US.  Or it could go the other way.  We'll have to wait and see who in the upper power structure gets arrested and executed in the coming weeks and months.