Do Conservatives And Liberals Have Enough in Common to Keep A Country Together Anymore?

[rangerrebew]

Do Conservatives And Liberals Have Enough in Common to Keep A Country Together Anymore?
John Hawkins

Posted: Nov 18, 2017 12:01 AM


“When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.” – The Declaration of Independence

Remember the woman who was fired for flipping off Trump’s motorcade? Well, she has been deluged with job offers from liberals and a Gofundme set up in her name has raised 117k dollars and counting. This seems like a small thing, but it’s indicative of where we are as a society.

https://townhall.com/columnists/johnhawkins/2017/11/18/do-conservatives-and-liberals-have-enough-in-common-to-keep-a-country-together-anymore-n2411206?utm_source=thdailypm&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=nl_pm&newsletterad=

[Fishrrman]

Actually, no -- I don't think so.

There was a time when "commonality" might have been possible, but... no more.

Perhaps at the core of the matter is that when one defines the characteristics of "liberal" vs. "conservative", ethnicity increasingly becomes a determinant.

It's not conservatives who are pushing this distinction so much -- it's the leftists/communists.

Only minutes ago, I read a thread elsewhere in this forum that asked the question to wit: are the "outdoors" a form of "white supremacy"?

The more ridiculous (and divisive) such claims from the left become, the greater the wedge driven between them (and those they represent, i.e., nonwhites) and traditional-minded Euro-Americans.

I sense that increasing numbers of Euro-Americans -- perhaps soon a majority of them -- are getting fed up with such nonsense. As such, they feel no compunction to acquiesce to the demands of the left and a diminishing sense of "shared bonds" with nonwhite Americans and illegals. And at the same time, whites are coalescing into their own "identity group", and shedding their dying and dead skins of white guilt.

Whether this new group identity will come at the expense of national identity, remains to be seen...

[Sanguine]

I'm not sure we do.

[Axeslinger]

Here’s a simple way to arrive at the answer to the question:

Do you want to live in the country that they would make?

And the converse holds true as well.

I, for one, know that I do not.

Currently we are in a no mans land where we hold to the belief that maybe, just maybe we can roll back the gains made by the left over the last 100 years. But here’s the thing:  if we do, THEY won’t abide that because they don’t want to allow that to happen.  And if we don’t, we really have no other recourse but to separate.  Either way, it’s only a matter of time.

[skeeter]

Actually, no -- I don't think so.

There was a time when "commonality" might have been possible, but... no more.

Perhaps at the core of the matter is that when one defines the characteristics of "liberal" vs. "conservative", ethnicity increasingly becomes a determinant.

It's not conservatives who are pushing this distinction so much -- it's the leftists/communists.

Only minutes ago, I read a thread elsewhere in this forum that asked the question to wit: are the "outdoors" a form of "white supremacy"?

The more ridiculous (and divisive) such claims from the left become, the greater the wedge driven between them (and those they represent, i.e., nonwhites) and traditional-minded Euro-Americans.

I sense that increasing numbers of Euro-Americans -- perhaps soon a majority of them -- are getting fed up with such nonsense. As such, they feel no compunction to acquiesce to the demands of the left and a diminishing sense of "shared bonds" with nonwhite Americans and illegals. And at the same time, whites are coalescing into their own "identity group", and shedding their dying and dead skins of white guilt.

Whether this new group identity will come at the expense of national identity, remains to be seen...

How can the country stay together? It seems as though progressives and their hangers-on seem to hate me and almost everything I value. They grow increasingly belligerent and disinclined to accept the results of elections and judicial decisions - the means by which we've historically sorted out our differences - they don't like.

At some point at the threat of violence they will demand we submit entirely.

[Free Vulcan]

Nope. I'm pretty much to the point where anything left needs to be mocked, attacked, and destroyed. I mostly treat liberals like second class citizens, and simply go in to hack them to pieces any time I debate them, rudely.

They crossed the line with their #resistance and antifa reindeer games. There's not going back over the Rubicon now.

[Bigun]

Nope. I'm pretty much to the point where anything left needs to be mocked, attacked, and destroyed. I mostly treat liberals like second class citizens, and simply go in to hack them to pieces any time I debate them, rudely.

They crossed the line with their #resistance and antifa reindeer games. There's not going back over the Rubicon now.

I see a way forward that is reflected in this map.

https://blueshift.io/election-2016-county-map.html

See if you can spot it!

[Sanguine]

I see a way forward that is reflected in this map.

https://blueshift.io/election-2016-county-map.html

See if you can spot it!

That's shockingly clear, @Bigun.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

If we get rid of some of the things dividing us, like diversity crap, portrayal of class envy instead of an environment to aspire to greatness and success, and illegals flooding this country which cannot speak our language or understand out laws, perhaps.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

I see a way forward that is reflected in this map.

https://blueshift.io/election-2016-county-map.html

See if you can spot it!

That's a great map. It even rotates.

[skeeter]

I see a way forward that is reflected in this map.

https://blueshift.io/election-2016-county-map.html

See if you can spot it!

Your map tells me that if we elected by the popular vote last November our president would've been selected by illegal aliens.

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

Do conservatives even agree with each other any more?

[Millee]

If we get rid of some of the things dividing us, like diversity crap, portrayal of class envy instead of an environment to aspire to greatness and success, and illegals flooding this country which cannot speak our language or understand out laws, perhaps.

And start by eliminating the worthless Gender/Womyns/Black studies classes. 

[Jazzhead]

I read this morning that, according to a study,  Rs and Ds are not measurably more supportive of the party to which they belong as compared to a decade ago,  but despise the "other side" considerably more.   I've seen similar studies that suggest that partisans are much less likely than before to have friends or otherwise socialize with folks on the other side. 

It seems we tend to view millions of our fellow citizens as the implacable enemy.     

[Jazzhead]

If we get rid of some of the things dividing us, like diversity crap, portrayal of class envy instead of an environment to aspire to greatness and success, and illegals flooding this country which cannot speak our language or understand out laws, perhaps.

It's called identity politics.  It used to be embraced only by the left;  but nowadays a lot of conservatives want in on this odious gig.   

[dfwgator]

No.

[dfwgator]

Do conservatives even agree with each other any more?

Conservatives at least still have the same goals.  Our disagreements are about the means of achieving them.   That is not the case with Liberals, our goals are diametrically opposed to theirs'.

[Bigun]

That's shockingly clear, @Bigun.

“The mobs of the great cities add just so much to the support of pure government as sores do to the strength of the human body. It is the manners and spirit of a people which preserve a republic in vigor. A degeneracy in these is a canker which soon eats to the heart of its laws and constitution.”

Thomas Jefferson: Notes on Virginia Q.XIX, 1782. ME 2:230

"I think our governments will remain virtuous for many centuries as long as they are chiefly agricultural; and this will be as long as there shall be vacant lands in any part of America. When they get piled upon one another in large cities as in Europe, they will become corrupt as in Europe.”

Thomas Jefferson to James Madison, 1787. Papers 12:442

I think Mr. Jefferson was entirely correct!

[jmyrlefuller]

It's called identity politics.  It used to be embraced only by the left;  but nowadays a lot of conservatives want in on this odious gig.

It is only so, because it works. We would not have ended up with Donald Trump had Barack Obama not wormed his way into power and stayed there. As regrettable as it seems, fighting fire with fire is sometimes a necessary evil.

[goatprairie]

Not all people who are committed Dems are hardcore liberals. My step-daughter and her husband are loyal Dems, but about as socially conservative as you can get.  My lib son-in-law is very religious (I am not, even though I consider myself a Christian) and gets upset when I make up  (what I consider) funny lyrics to Christmas songs. He is also a Boy Scout leader, gun owner, and hunter.
My step-daughter, another committed Dem, is also very socially conservative.  She's against pot legalization. She didn't like Bernie Sanders for president after finding out his tax plan would cost them many thousands of dollars. Btw, they're both doing very well financially.
They live conservatively and expect people to live traditional, moral  lives. I'm sure there are millions of committed Dems who live similar lives.
So you're asking: why do they support and vote for Democrats?
That's a good question. I believe the s-in-law might eventually turn, but they both believe the Dem Party is on the side of justice, niceness, and goodness.
 Republicans, however, are icky, greedy people who just don't care about anybody but themselves. Even though they know both  the wife and I are Republicans. Actually I'm a conservative first, and Republican second.
But the wife and I overlook the snotty comments directed at Republicans by my step-daughter and s-in-law. They might turn eventually. Time will tell.

[musiclady]

No.

Beat me to it.

Simple, one word answer.


No.

[INVAR]

No.

Half of the population cannot agree upon core principles or values in terms of culture, life, religion, business and government.

Half wants government to be God and provide everything without any responsibility - the other, wants government to get the hell out of their lives.

One will seek to impose their values upon the other by force and the other will use force to prevent it.

A society cannot exist in that state.

Normalcy Bias prevents us from seeing the reality of where we have arrived.

[Axeslinger]

@goatprairie

Sorry...sounds like wishful thinking.  They may be all that you say they are, but in the present and recent environment they choose to support ALL that is antithetical to conservatism and by proxy actively seek your destruction.

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

All traceable to Academia.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankfurt_School

They infect the students with collectivist rot, and then it takes the students 20 or 30 years to de-program themselves.

Those who go into Govt work see no need to give themselves that brain enema.

Because the supply of Other Peoples Money is endless in Govt.

1: Abolish Tenure Now!

2: Since the Academics generating today's ideological sewer Can't be Fired, perhaps Bob Heinlen's premise that Voting be predicated on a different type of Educational System isn't so far fetched after all.

You want to vote? You want to be be a Citizen?

Have Skin in the Game.

Free Download.

Infuriate a Liberal.

Read It.

Starship Troopers.

https://wrathoftheawakenedsaxon.wordpress.com/2016/09/26/starship-troopers-robert-heinlein-free-pdf-download/

[EdJames]