Author Topic: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas  (Read 36459 times)

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Offline Hoodat

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #650 on: November 09, 2017, 02:23:51 pm »
And how come we continue to insure inanimate objects (cars) which can do absolutely nothing without human intervention?  Shouldn't we be insuring drivers instead of cars?  Except for the insurance lobby we would be!

The idiocy premise here is that because of insurance laws, there are zero uninsured cars today.
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Offline Victoria33

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #651 on: November 09, 2017, 02:24:54 pm »
Both are the problem.   You cannot deny that a gun - like an automobile - is an inherently dangerous implement.   Registration and insurance can be an effective means of helping to deter guns from falling into the hands of bad people.
@Jazzhead

Registration would surely get rid of weapons - yours included since the govn. would know every weapon you have and come and take it/them.  Weapons were registered in Australia and when they passed a law to get rid of weapons, they knew where each one was - now, no one there has a weapon.  I suggest you go live there where there are no weapons.

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #652 on: November 09, 2017, 02:26:49 pm »
Both are the problem.   You cannot deny that a gun - like an automobile - is an inherently dangerous implement.   Registration and insurance can be an effective means of helping to deter guns from falling into the hands of bad people.
That is such a stupid argument to take.  A knife is dangerous - so register it.  Fire is dangerous - so register matches.  The list goes on, the same as your blather.
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #653 on: November 09, 2017, 02:28:49 pm »
Weapons were registered in Australia and when they passed a law to get rid of weapons, they knew where each one was - now, no one there has a weapon.

Criminals do.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

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Offline Bigun

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #654 on: November 09, 2017, 02:30:29 pm »
That is such a stupid argument to take.  A knife is dangerous - so register it.  Fire is dangerous - so register matches.  The list goes on, the same as your blather.

Knives, forks, and spoons are undoubtable the biggest health risks most people face!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #655 on: November 09, 2017, 02:31:52 pm »
I am sorry, @Hoodat, I completely misrepresented what you really said.  Forgive me, I knew better....
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #656 on: November 09, 2017, 02:33:08 pm »
Knives, forks, and spoons are undoubtable the biggest health risks most people face!

Damned straight!  Look what they've done to Rosie O'Donnell  and Michael Moore.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
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Offline Bigun

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #657 on: November 09, 2017, 02:34:21 pm »
The idiocy premise here is that because of insurance laws, there are zero uninsured cars today.

LOL!  Yeah!  Except those driven by every illegal you might encounter!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #658 on: November 09, 2017, 02:37:29 pm »
LOL!  Yeah!  Except those driven by every illegal you might encounter!

They don't pay, but everybody else does with the fee for "Uninsured Motorists."
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #659 on: November 09, 2017, 02:39:20 pm »
I am sorry, @Hoodat, I completely misrepresented what you really said.  Forgive me, I knew better....

It wasn't you.  It was Jazzhead.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline Bigun

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #660 on: November 09, 2017, 02:42:08 pm »
They don't pay, but everybody else does with the fee for "Uninsured Motorists."

QFT!  The insurance lobby is VERY powerful indeed!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline thackney

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #661 on: November 09, 2017, 02:46:38 pm »
Yes, insurance carries a cost.  I know that twice a year when I cut a check.  But my car is both useful to me and potentially dangerous to others.   So I must both register and insure it.

Only if you drive it on public roads.  You are not required to do so if you keep it only your property.  That may sound silly to you, but where I live, plenty have farm trucks that never touch pavement.  Just owning the vehicle does not require you to register and insure.  Same with collectibles not driven.
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #662 on: November 09, 2017, 02:53:22 pm »
In Alabama, auto insurance is not mandatory.  In Virginia, one can pay a fee to the Commonwealth to be exempt from the insurance requirement.

Each State has different laws.  But the one certainty here is that laws do not control criminals.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #663 on: November 09, 2017, 02:56:14 pm »
That is such a stupid argument to take.  A knife is dangerous - so register it.  Fire is dangerous - so register matches.  The list goes on, the same as your blather.

Cars and guns are uniquely useful, and uniquely dangerous.  Interestingly, according to the CDC, in 2014 the age-adjusted death rate for both firearms (including homicides, suicides and accidental deaths) and motor vehicle events (car crashes, collisions between cars and pedestrians, etc.) was almost exactly the same - 10.3 deaths per 100,000 people.

In years past,  cars killed far more than guns did, but in recent years that trend has reversed,  as car deaths per capita have fallen considerably. Gun homicide rates have actually fallen in recent years as well,  but those gains have been offset by rising gun suicide rates.   (Suicides account for approximately 2 out of 3 gun deaths, according to the CDC.)
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Offline thackney

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #664 on: November 09, 2017, 03:04:38 pm »
Cars and guns are uniquely useful, and uniquely dangerous.  Interestingly, according to the CDC, in 2014 the age-adjusted death rate for both firearms (including homicides, suicides and accidental deaths) and motor vehicle events (car crashes, collisions between cars and pedestrians, etc.) was almost exactly the same - 10.3 deaths per 100,000 people.

In years past,  cars killed far more than guns did, but in recent years that trend has reversed,  as car deaths per capita have fallen considerably. Gun homicide rates have actually fallen in recent years as well,  but those gains have been offset by rising gun suicide rates.   (Suicides account for approximately 2 out of 3 gun deaths, according to the CDC.)

And very strict gun control does not impact suicide rates. 

Ezra Klein Is Wrong: Gun Control Doesn’t Reduce Suicide Rates
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/423192/ezra-klein-wrong-gun-control-doesnt-reduce-suicide-rates-mark-antonio-wright

...most guns are illegal in Japan and gun-ownership rates are extremely low, the country has the lowest gun-homicide rate in the world at one in 10 million. According to Vox’s theory, Japan should have a similarly low suicide rate — but that’s not what you see at all. Japan has one of the highest suicide rates in the world, nearly twice the U.S. rate....
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Offline Bigun

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #665 on: November 09, 2017, 03:15:59 pm »
In years past,  cars killed far more than guns did, but in recent years that trend has reversed,  as car deaths per capita have fallen considerably. Gun homicide rates have actually fallen in recent years as well,  but those gains have been offset by rising gun suicide rates.   (Suicides account for approximately 2 out of 3 gun deaths, according to the CDC.)

DAMN!  Cars kill people all by themselves! Who knew! /s
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #666 on: November 09, 2017, 03:18:37 pm »
In years past,  cars killed far more than guns did, but in recent years that trend has reversed,  as car deaths per capita have fallen considerably. Gun homicide rates have actually fallen in recent years as well,  but those gains have been offset by rising gun suicide rates.   (Suicides account for approximately 2 out of 3 gun deaths, according to the CDC.)

So, you still haven't gotten off the "Inanimate objects can kill" kick.  I've been waiting for years for my car and weapons to go on a killing spree, and they still haven't.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
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Offline Bigun

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #667 on: November 09, 2017, 03:30:52 pm »
So, you still haven't gotten off the "Inanimate objects can kill" kick.  I've been waiting for years for my car and weapons to go on a killing spree, and they still haven't.

I would suggest that your wait will exceed your lifespan!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #668 on: November 09, 2017, 04:13:32 pm »
In the context of this particular crime,  I agree that there was already a law in place and the lack of enforcement of that law (i.e., the Air Force's failure to provide the information to fill the data base) is the issue.   

But the larger issue,  as you and roamer have cited,  is ease at which bad guys can illegally obtain guns.  I've heard the response that no new laws are needed because criminals can "always" get the guns they need.   In a nation where the number of guns far outstrips the number of people, illegal transfers of firearms are simply a fact of life, and the carnage caused by illegal guns is the price we pay for living in this country. 
Nope, you still missed the point. No new laws will do one damned thing to stop those criminals from obtaining guns.
If they can't steal or buy them, they will build them. If they can import cocaine, run sex slaves internationally, penetrate international borders, obtain or manufacture explosives and weapons of war, what makes you think the dribbling of ink on a piece of paper is going to stop them?

As if a paper that said says "You can't invade" stopped Attila the Hun or the sack of Rome.

The law will not stop people who are determined to to not follow the law.

Another law, by weight of the law books, by preponderance of regulation, will not make one whit of difference.  Especially when all the existing laws against a felon (or military equivalent), domestic abuser, and mental patient with a history of violence having a firearm didn't work: he was not stopped by the law.
Quote
I can't agree with that.  That is why I continue to advocate a similar regime as we require for motor vehicle ownership - registration and insurance.    Own as many guns as you want, so long as they are registered and insured.   

The insurance I'd propose is similar to PIP insurance that most states require of car owners.   Simple no-fault insurance that will pay the medical bills and restore lost income to the victims of injury caused by an insured gun.   The way I'd work it is to require insurance up until the time when a gun is legally sold, transferred or reported lost to the police.   That will provide a monetary incentive to report sales, transfers and losses, and to keep guns safely stored so as to prevent losses.   It would help address the abuse where sellers don't have your sense of moral obligation not to conduct a private sale when the buyer is "sketchy".   Conduct a private sale or swap,  but only upon such conditions that permit your obligation to continue to insure that gun to be lifted.   

We live with such requirements routinely with our cars - useful but potentially deadly implements just as guns are.   The burden of insurance causes us to make sure unauthorized use is monitored, and that transactions take place with proper transfer of title and registration.   
Oh no. No effing way. I currently carry insurance on six vehicles, and whether I am driving them all at the same time or not, I am still required to carry that insurance. My state is NOT a no-fault state, and for that reason I can afford that, because my premiums are based on my conduct as a driver, and my record of doing so safely, not on the behaviour of every idiot who just moved here from out of state who thinks they  know how to drive on snow and ice.
Because my premiums don't include paying for the actions of others (a socialist concept) and instead hinge on MY actions, I can afford those vehicles as an operational expense. That insurance costs me less for the fleet than one bad driver pays for one vehicle, and I should not have to pick up the tab for that bad driver.

But carrying insurance on a firearm which might sit in the cabinet and not see the light of day for months, sometimes a year or more, is ridiculous and could only be an onerous regulation designed to make it entirely too expensive to keep a large number of firearms.

Equally ridiculous is the concept that having a large number (whatever you consider a "large" number to be) of firearms is more dangerous than only having one or two. In fact, that one man with 100 firearms is just going to have to make quite a few trips to carry them all. As a practical matter (and despite all that two-fisted special effects trick shooting on tee vee) you only shoot one at a time--it is that one which makes a difference, not the dozen(s) in the gun safe.   
Those I have known with only that one rifle are VERY good with it, they know every quirk about it, the ballistics, the holdover at distance, (bullet drop) whether it shoots a little to the right or left of the factory sights, and can generally pick a gnat off a fly's ass at 100 yards without ruffling the wings of the fly using that one rifle. The guy who owns a hundred rifles can't just pull one out at random generally, and be nearly so accurate (he might hit the fly, too).
So, without affecting the ability of a person to be accurate, put rounds down range, to hit a target, the law you propose would just assail a collector with another layer of ongoing expense. Just NO.
And then there is the very real risk of those lists of firearms being hacked to provide targets for criminals to come and steal the firearms.

De-milling (rendering them a pretty piece of non-functional junk) is not an option, either, because that is just the destruction of guns, not allowing some collector to collect guns without the burden of registration and your insurance scheme. Within a couple years of the 1968 GCA, a fellow named Kenyon Ballew was gunned down during a BATF raid based on a hot tip that he had grenades sitting on his mantel. They were not live grenades, but inert practice grenades. That didn't stop the depredations he and his wife were subjected to, nor keep him from being shot in the head by the agents there to seize explosive devices that did not exist. For that reason I will never have anything in my home which only 'looks like' something. It will be legal and functional or it won't be there. 

In fact, that insurance/gun registration law would only guarantee another crop of criminals produced not on the 'mean streets', but in the legislature as some bunch of nitwits pass yet another law that makes the thing you were doing (or not doing) legally yesterday illegal tomorrow.

You see, to use your example, we have laws requiring people to carry liability insurance on motor vehicles.

They get ignored, in spite of there being a law, and so often do they get ignored, that part of my auto insurance coverage is for "uninsured motorists" who might run into me.

With millions of firearms out there, a significant number of which have never been recorded on a Form 4473 (that started in 1968), what makes you think that people would run in to register their guns by insuring them individually?

All that law would do is make those firearms without paperwork on them that much more valuable in the real market of cash or trade.

And, back to the original problem, it would do nothing to keep violent people with mental health problems from hurting others. It will, at most force a slight change in tactics. Maybe he would have used a couple of machetes instead?
« Last Edit: November 09, 2017, 04:17:57 pm by Smokin Joe »
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Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #669 on: November 09, 2017, 04:27:39 pm »
Cars and guns are uniquely useful, and uniquely dangerous.  Interestingly, according to the CDC, in 2014 the age-adjusted death rate for both firearms (including homicides, suicides and accidental deaths) and motor vehicle events (car crashes, collisions between cars and pedestrians, etc.) was almost exactly the same - 10.3 deaths per 100,000 people.

In years past,  cars killed far more than guns did, but in recent years that trend has reversed,  as car deaths per capita have fallen considerably. Gun homicide rates have actually fallen in recent years as well,  but those gains have been offset by rising gun suicide rates.   (Suicides account for approximately 2 out of 3 gun deaths, according to the CDC.)
Well, DUH! It is a lot harder to drive over yourself with a car. (not saying it hasn't been done, just that it is a lot harder.)

So, take away guns and then what? Knives, pain killers, jumping off tall buildings/bridges? Beat themselves to death with a stick? I'm not making light of the emotional distress and despair that might lead someone to commit suicide--in fact, there is a level of determination there that has already overcome the very real will to survive, one of the most basic instincts.

What makes you think that level of determination will be thwarted by requiring a different method?

Again, it is the person involved who needs help, there, who was either not endowed with coping skills by their environment, upbringing, or suffering from illness or the events of life, or who found some other compelling reason, (however arcane their logic may have been)  to decide dead was better. Changing the method does not address the question or problems of why they are in the state they are in, why they believe strongly enough to overcome that very basic instinct to survive. You want to stop suicides? Address those issues, not the tool used to complete the act. You might as well have rope control, dull knives in the kitchen, and ban large nails and other pointy things.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #670 on: November 09, 2017, 04:57:32 pm »
Both are the problem.   You cannot deny that a gun - like an automobile - is an inherently dangerous implement.   Registration and insurance can be an effective means of helping to deter guns from falling into the hands of bad people.


I can't recall a Single Instance of a gun leaping up off a table by itself and shooting someone.

Registration and Insurance?

Two incredibly stupid ideas.

What they'd do is create a paper trail right back to the owner making it a million times easier for the likes of Schumer, Feinstein, and Holder to come pick them AND YOU up anytime they take a fancy to.

The NRA isn't the rock solid be all end all at protecting gun rights, but they've gone to Court many times already to get DOJ to destroy illegal databases they've compiled of gun owners culled from the 4473 background check form buyers have to fill out. They're supposed to be destroyed after the sale, not used to track who owns guns, and for damn good reason.
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #671 on: November 09, 2017, 05:03:09 pm »

I can't recall a Single Instance of a gun leaping up off a table by itself and shooting someone.

Registration and Insurance?

Two incredibly stupid ideas.

What they'd do is create a paper trail right back to the owner making it a million times easier for the likes of Schumer, Feinstein, and Holder to come pick them AND YOU up anytime they take a fancy to.

The NRA isn't the rock solid be all end all at protecting gun rights, but they've gone to Court many times already to get DOJ to destroy illegal databases they've compiled of gun owners culled from the 4473 background check form buyers have to fill out. They're supposed to be destroyed after the sale, not used to track who owns guns, and for damn good reason.
Actually, the Form 4473s are supposed to be kept on file by the dealer who sold the firearm. They get turned in if the dealer goes out of business or does not renew their FFL, for whatever reason. It is the NICS data which is supposed to be destroyed according to law, and yes, the BATF (and DOJ) has been taken to task over that data being compiled and stored.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #672 on: November 09, 2017, 05:13:40 pm »

And, back to the original problem, it would do nothing to keep violent people with mental health EVIL, (since the majority of folks wearing mental health labels are 5 times less likely to become violent than the ones without those labels) problems from hurting others. It will, at most force a slight change in tactics. Maybe he would have used a couple of machetes instead?

We've BTDT. Can't own a gun in China.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/14/world/asia/china-knife-attack/index.html

"China was hit by a spate of knife and cleaver attacks that targeted school children in 2010.

A number of measures were introduced at the time, including increased security at schools across the country and a regulation requiring people to register with their national ID cards when buying large knives."


Do we want to have to present a photo ID card and Govt license at Home Depot or Target to be ALLOWED to buy a knife?
« Last Edit: November 09, 2017, 05:14:17 pm by To-Whose-Benefit? »
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Offline austingirl

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #673 on: November 09, 2017, 05:18:26 pm »
Nope, you still missed the point. No new laws will do one damned thing to stop those criminals from obtaining guns.
If they can't steal or buy them, they will build them. If they can import cocaine, run sex slaves internationally, penetrate international borders, obtain or manufacture explosives and weapons of war, what makes you think the dribbling of ink on a piece of paper is going to stop them?

As if a paper that said says "You can't invade" stopped Attila the Hun or the sack of Rome.

The law will not stop people who are determined to to not follow the law.

Another law, by weight of the law books, by preponderance of regulation, will not make one whit of difference.  Especially when all the existing laws against a felon (or military equivalent), domestic abuser, and mental patient with a history of violence having a firearm didn't work: he was not stopped by the law. Oh no. No effing way. I currently carry insurance on six vehicles, and whether I am driving them all at the same time or not, I am still required to carry that insurance. My state is NOT a no-fault state, and for that reason I can afford that, because my premiums are based on my conduct as a driver, and my record of doing so safely, not on the behaviour of every idiot who just moved here from out of state who thinks they  know how to drive on snow and ice.
Because my premiums don't include paying for the actions of others (a socialist concept) and instead hinge on MY actions, I can afford those vehicles as an operational expense. That insurance costs me less for the fleet than one bad driver pays for one vehicle, and I should not have to pick up the tab for that bad driver.

But carrying insurance on a firearm which might sit in the cabinet and not see the light of day for months, sometimes a year or more, is ridiculous and could only be an onerous regulation designed to make it entirely too expensive to keep a large number of firearms.

Equally ridiculous is the concept that having a large number (whatever you consider a "large" number to be) of firearms is more dangerous than only having one or two. In fact, that one man with 100 firearms is just going to have to make quite a few trips to carry them all. As a practical matter (and despite all that two-fisted special effects trick shooting on tee vee) you only shoot one at a time--it is that one which makes a difference, not the dozen(s) in the gun safe.   
Those I have known with only that one rifle are VERY good with it, they know every quirk about it, the ballistics, the holdover at distance, (bullet drop) whether it shoots a little to the right or left of the factory sights, and can generally pick a gnat off a fly's ass at 100 yards without ruffling the wings of the fly using that one rifle. The guy who owns a hundred rifles can't just pull one out at random generally, and be nearly so accurate (he might hit the fly, too).
So, without affecting the ability of a person to be accurate, put rounds down range, to hit a target, the law you propose would just assail a collector with another layer of ongoing expense. Just NO.
And then there is the very real risk of those lists of firearms being hacked to provide targets for criminals to come and steal the firearms.

De-milling (rendering them a pretty piece of non-functional junk) is not an option, either, because that is just the destruction of guns, not allowing some collector to collect guns without the burden of registration and your insurance scheme. Within a couple years of the 1968 GCA, a fellow named Kenyon Ballew was gunned down during a BATF raid based on a hot tip that he had grenades sitting on his mantel. They were not live grenades, but inert practice grenades. That didn't stop the depredations he and his wife were subjected to, nor keep him from being shot in the head by the agents there to seize explosive devices that did not exist. For that reason I will never have anything in my home which only 'looks like' something. It will be legal and functional or it won't be there. 

In fact, that insurance/gun registration law would only guarantee another crop of criminals produced not on the 'mean streets', but in the legislature as some bunch of nitwits pass yet another law that makes the thing you were doing (or not doing) legally yesterday illegal tomorrow.

You see, to use your example, we have laws requiring people to carry liability insurance on motor vehicles.

They get ignored, in spite of there being a law, and so often do they get ignored, that part of my auto insurance coverage is for "uninsured motorists" who might run into me.

With millions of firearms out there, a significant number of which have never been recorded on a Form 4473 (that started in 1968), what makes you think that people would run in to register their guns by insuring them individually?

All that law would do is make those firearms without paperwork on them that much more valuable in the real market of cash or trade.

And, back to the original problem, it would do nothing to keep violent people with mental health problems from hurting others. It will, at most force a slight change in tactics. Maybe he would have used a couple of machetes instead?

@Smokin Joe

Your well-reasoned arguments fall on the deaf years of the illogical who are incapable of critical thinking. But I enjoy your posts.
Principles matter. Words matter.

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: 'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas
« Reply #674 on: November 09, 2017, 05:23:14 pm »
@Smokin Joe

Your well-reasoned arguments fall on the deaf years of the illogical who are incapable of critical thinking. But I enjoy your posts.
Why, thank you! And yes, I know I won't convince the poster, but feel duty bound to shred their arguments anyway.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis