Conservatives near revolt on Senate health care negotiations

[corbe]

   If I see 'Moral Narcissists' one more time I am gonna break my Pearls @Mesaclone

[Mesaclone]

   If I see 'Moral Narcissists' one more time I am gonna break my Pearls @Mesaclone

Moral NARCISSISTS!

[corbe]

   My pearls were hocked a long time ago.

[Bigun]

Dems are idiots, but they are not the devil....

Really?  You must have missed their national conventions the last few election cycles!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PlSUubjPzLw

[Smokin Joe]

Simple. Because its not the guys that the Tea Party helped elect who are the problem. Its the large group of moderate Republicans who, in many cases, nearly lost their seats to Tea Party primary opponents. We may not care much for these folks, but their votes still count in the House and Senate. "Letting it crash" as you proclaim, is simply surrender. If that's your choice, than so be it...surrender away. Many of us, however, have not yet begun to fight.

Surrender? No. Sometimes the only way to save the village is to burn it. If you are overrun, call in fire on your own position. The GOP is overrun with lesser liberals who couldn't beat the Democrat on the Democrat ticket.

These people who narrowly missed defeat last time will know it in the future, because they will have no Conservative votes.

They are the ones who will own this mess, and that's out there for all to see.

Or, they could always vote to do away with Obamacare. 

[Mesaclone]

Surrender? No. Sometimes the only way to save the village is to burn it. If you are overrun, call in fire on your own position. The GOP is overrun with lesser liberals who couldn't beat the Democrat on the Democrat ticket.

These people who narrowly missed defeat last time will know it in the future, because they will have no Conservative votes.

They are the ones who will own this mess, and that's out there for all to see.

Or, they could always vote to do away with Obamacare.

So you think the Dems that take their place, putting Pelosi and Schumer in the Speaker/Majority Leader positions, will vote for conservative ideas? Do you actually want MORE liberal Supreme Court Justices?

The Republicans you refer to are generally in moderate to liberal districts....so they have little choice but to bear SOME resemblance to their constituencies...you teaching them a lesson won't give us more "truly" conservative reps from those districts in the future. All that will do is give us more Liberal governance, for longer periods of time, with even more radically liberal justices and legislation ensuing. And you think that is a good idea?

[Oceander]

So you think the Dems that take their place, putting Pelosi and Schumer in the Speaker/Majority Leader positions, will vote for conservative ideas? Do you actually want MORE liberal Supreme Court Justices?

The Republicans you refer to are generally in moderate to liberal districts....so they have little choice but to bear SOME resemblance to their constituencies...you teaching them a lesson won't give us more "truly" conservative reps from those districts in the future. All that will do is give us more Liberal governance, for longer periods of time, with even more radically liberal justices and legislation ensuing. And you think that is a good idea?

[Idiot]

Why not? Weren't people promised that all those Senate candidates would repeal the ACA? Or are they unmitigated liars? Not behind the Party? Or has the Party been jerking the peoples' collective chain telling them one thing when they can't get it through, and now that they can, they won't?
I'm thinking the latter.

Which is why I am no longer GOP. They are only marginally better than the Dems and then only part time.

[roamer_1]

All that will do is give us more Liberal governance, for longer periods of time, with even more radically liberal justices and legislation ensuing. And you think that is a good idea?

Liberalism through Democrats seems little different to liberalism through Republicans.

Here;s an idea! Why not stand for something other than liberalism? I wonder if that will work!

[Mesaclone]

Liberalism through Democrats seems little different to liberalism through Republicans.

Here;s an idea! Why not stand for something other than liberalism? I wonder if that will work!

Here's some politics 101.

The range from liberal to conservative is a spectrum...its not an on/off switch. The Dems you speak of are still left of the moderate to mildly conservative Republicans at issue. Further, the Republicans also vote along with the GOP conservatives FAR more than would even moderate Dems. So pretending like they are the same is just a cop out...they clearly are not.

[Hoodat]

Perhaps some need to quit living in fantasy land.

You can only pass legislation for which you have 50 votes in the Senate. The "perfect" conservative bill....or a full repeal with no strings...cannot get 50 votes

Yet the GOP controlled Senate will have no problem at all getting 50 votes to fund Obamacare for another year.  Go figure.

[Hoodat]

The thing is, you gotta go to war with the army you have

The army we have promised to repeal Obamacare.

[rodamala]

No, they're simply really bad politicians - the radical conservatives, that is, who shut it down.  They did nothing but sell a bill of goods to the electorate.  They're fools whose idiocy is exceeded only by the fools who elected them.

I vote only for congresscritters that INTEND to "shut down the goverment".

[Oceander]

The army we have promised to repeal Obamacare.

And then they realized that they'd have to replace it, and that's where all the trouble is.

[RoosGirl]

I will take it from the resounding silence to my twice asked request for a real life example where republicans settled for less and then came back later to win more with respect to any conservative position on any bill that it has never happened.  Proof is in the pudding, ladies and gents. Show me the pudding and until then you can take your BS 3D chess and  go pound sand.

[Oceander]

I will take it from the resounding silence to my twice asked request for a real life example where republicans settled for less and then came back later to win more with respect to any conservative position on any bill that it has never happened.  Proof is in the pudding, ladies and gents. Show me the pudding and until then you can take your BS 3D chess and  go pound sand.

Then why are you here?  You're wasting your time and everyone else's time, by your own admission.  Your position will never win, and therefore you are at the sufferance of those you disdain.  Run along.

[RoosGirl]

Then why are you here?  You're wasting your time and everyone else's time, by your own admission.  Your position will never win, and therefore you are at the sufferance of those you disdain.  Run along.

Perhaps just to prove you wrong.

[Oceander]

Perhaps just to prove you wrong.

Reality has already proven you wrong.

[RoosGirl]

Reality has already proven you wrong.

Then give me the info I have requested.  Put up or shut up.

[Oceander]

Then give me the info I have requested.  Put up or shut up.

Why bother?  You're not worth the time because you'd rather be a sterile martyr to ideological purity.

[XenaLee]

Then why are you here?  You're wasting your time and everyone else's time, by your own admission.  Your position will never win, and therefore you are at the sufferance of those you disdain.  Run along.

Actually.... she is making logical sense.  You... not so much.

And just who the hell are you to say who here is "wasting time"???

She posed a valid question which you haven't answered because you know she's right..... but refuse to admit it.

I've got a better idea.  Why the hell don't you "run along"?

[RoosGirl]

Why bother?  You're not worth the time because you'd rather be a sterile martyr to ideological purity.

If you can't do it, just say so.  No need to get nasty.  You don't know a thing about me.  In fact, I would love for you to be correct and prove me wrong.  I'm not too stubborn to admit that I am wrong in the face of proof that I am.

[Oceander]

Actually.... she is making logical sense.  You... not so much.

And just who the hell are you to say who here is "wasting time"???

She posed a valid question which you haven't answered because you know she's right..... but refuse to admit it.

I've got a better idea.  Why the hell don't you "run along"?

Really.  Remember the various Reagan-inspired tax reforms in 1986?  The first parts came in 1983, culminating in the 1986 comprehensive tax reform.  The republicans got started early, and brought it to a crescendo in 1986.  All I needed was one example.  Game.  Set.  Match.

Now, you show me where an overweaning emphasis on ideological purity has gotten anyone anything, other than dead.  Put up or shut up, sport.

[Oceander]

If you can't do it, just say so.  No need to get nasty.  You don't know a thing about me.  In fact, I would love for you to be correct and prove me wrong.  I'm not too stubborn to admit that I am wrong in the face of proof that I am.

I just did.  The tax reforms in the 1980s.

Now perhaps you can show us where being an ideologically pure martyr got anyone anything other than dead.

[roamer_1]

Here's some politics 101.

The range from liberal to conservative is a spectrum...its not an on/off switch.

I will disagree, entirely. The two are diametrically opposed as a matter of philosophy. That which lies between are pretenders, nearly by definition...

The Dems you speak of are still left of the moderate to mildly conservative Republicans at issue.

Ahh, the lesser evil argument. That is what has brought us here.

Further, the Republicans also vote along with the GOP conservatives FAR more than would even moderate Dems.

How would you know? It as been nearly half a century since Conservatism had the levers of power. The amount of forward motion on any Conservative issue is negligible in all that time.

So pretending like they are the same is just a cop out...they clearly are not.

Clear as mud, that.