You would think people at this level would be smart enough to KNOW that to begin with!
I think that Debbie and Hillary were "willfully ignorant," and expected to get away with it.
To date, it appears they were correct.
It can't realistically be expected to change, until people lose jobs, power, money, status and freedom when they screw up.
They are natural born liars, cheater, thieves. Their air of superiority, entitlement is amazing.