Author Topic: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion  (Read 5625 times)

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Offline thackney

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Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« on: March 10, 2017, 03:25:07 pm »
Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
http://fuelfix.com/blog/2017/03/10/dow-chemical-nears-completion-of-freeport-expansion/
Posted by Jordan Blum, Date: March 10, 2017

Dow Chemical’s multibillion-dollar expansion in Freeport is nearing completion with the crown jewel ethylene plant coming online mid-year — getting a head start on competing projects from Exxon Mobil and Chevron Phillips Chemical in Baytown.

“We’ll be one of the first out of the gate, so we feel pretty good about that,” said Doug May, Dow’s business president over chemicals and aromatics.

Dow’s nearly-completed, massive ethane cracker project will manufacture 1.5 million tons per year of ethylene, which is the primary building of most plastics. Dow also will bring new plastics production plants online in Freeport too. The 1.5 million tons is nearly triple the capacity of Occidental Petroleum’s ethane cracker that just started production in Ingleside.

The Exxon Mobil and Chevron Phillips ethane crackers will produce the same amount of capacity as the Dow project, but they’ve faced some delays and won’t commence production until late 2017, or even early next year as May suspects. A lot of the projects were authorized at similar times to take advantage of the cheap and ample shale gas unlocked by horizontal drilling and hydraulic fracturing in Texas and other regions.

“Originally there was a fear we were going to have all that capacity at once,” May said. “The reality though is the world needs that capacity. But it’s going to be more spaced out than expected.”

The ethane cracker is the largest piece of Down’s more than $6 billion expansion along the Gulf Coast, mostly in Freeport and Lake Jackson, to add more ethylene, polyethylene, propylene and other plastics manufacturing. Most of the production will go toward delivering plastics to the developing world.

If anything, May said he’s also pleasantly surprised that global plastics demand remains strong in China with more potential growth in India and other developing parts of the world.

The Freeport complex south of Houston is Dow’s largest in the world; the Michigan company designed and built Lake Jackson 73 years ago to house workers when it chose rural Freeport as an operations site. Dow employs more than 6,000 people in the Greater Houston area, mostly in Freeport and Lake Jackson.

The massive ethylene cracker is expected to come online about the same time Dow completes its massive, $130 billion merger of equals with DuPont. But May emphasized Dow’s Texas operations will see little impact.

The primary goal of the merger is to create a stronger agri-chemical business to pit against Monsanto and other. When DowDuPont is formed at the end of June, the merged company will begin its process of splintering into three separate companies, including one still named Dow that would continue to own and run the Freeport complex.

The materials science business would operate under the Dow name, the agribusiness under DuPont and specialty products under a yet-to-be determined brand. The splintered Dow will eventually add nearly 1,500 DuPont workers in Texas along with DuPont’s chemicals and plastics complex in Orange near the Louisiana border.

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Offline thackney

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2017, 03:26:32 pm »
This is a significant area of growth in US manufacturing.

Using the Natural Gas Liquids, mostly from our growing shale gas production, as feedstocks to make a higher value product.
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Offline GrouchoTex

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2017, 06:21:50 pm »
One of the times I had most feared for my life, was when I was in the Dow Chemical Plant in Freeport, during a Tornado warning, surrounded by a lot of chemicals that ended in"-ene".

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2017, 06:26:33 pm »
This is a significant area of growth in US manufacturing.

Using the Natural Gas Liquids, mostly from our growing shale gas production, as feedstocks to make a higher value product.

LNG cracker?  Seems C2= and C3= yields would be low, and too much heavies instead. And if I remember, Dow really isn't into the Aromatics business.   Interesting.
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #4 on: March 11, 2017, 01:45:45 pm »
Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
http://fuelfix.com/blog/2017/03/10/dow-chemical-nears-completion-of-freeport-expansion/
Posted by Jordan Blum, Date: March 10, 2017

Dow Chemical’s multibillion-dollar expansion in Freeport is nearing completion with the crown jewel ethylene plant coming online mid-year — getting a head start on competing projects from Exxon Mobil and Chevron Phillips Chemical in Baytown.
this new one, a bit smaller, is already operating at a cost of $1.5bn.

OxyChem and Mexichem Announce Startup of their Joint Venture Ethylene Cracker in Ingleside, Texas

INGLESIDE, Texas — February 27, 2017 — Ingleside Ethylene, LLC, the 50/50 joint venture between Occidental Chemical Corporation (OxyChem), a subsidiary of Occidental Petroleum Corporation (NYSE:OXY), and Mexichem, S.A.B. de C.V. (BMV:MEXCHEM), today announced that its ethylene cracker at OxyChem’s Ingleside, Texas, complex has begun operations on schedule and on budget. The ethylene cracker is currently in a production stabilization phase.

The cracker, which will be operated by OxyChem, has the capacity to produce 1.2 billion pounds (550,000 cubic meters) of ethylene per year and provide OxyChem with an ongoing source of ethylene for manufacturing vinyl chloride monomer (VCM), which Mexichem will use to produce polyvinyl chloride (PVC resin) and PVC piping systems. The companies have a 20-year supply agreement.

“We are pleased to announce the safe startup of the ethylene cracker at our plant in Ingleside. This is a significant milestone for both OxyChem and Mexichem, enabling us to capitalize on the advantages that shale gas development presents for the chemical industry. It also helps our companies better compete globally in our respective markets, and gives us an inherent advantage to manage the cost of ethylene,” said Robert Peterson, President, OxyChem.

http://newsroom.oxy.com/press-release/oxychem-and-mexichem-announce-startup-their-joint-venture-ethylene-cracker-ingleside-t
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 01:46:01 pm by IsailedawayfromFR »
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Offline Victoria33

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2017, 02:56:27 pm »
One of the times I had most feared for my life, was when I was in the Dow Chemical Plant in Freeport, during a Tornado warning, surrounded by a lot of chemicals that ended in"-ene".
@GrouchoTex
@thackney
 
Liberals don't want this country to run on oil.  I have often wondered what they would do if everything made of plastic was removed from their lives as plastic comes from oil.

Groucho, I understand your fear of being where there was "ene" chemicals during a tornado.

I lived in the NASA area for 20 years.  Going south from there down Highway 45 toward the coast, one comes to Texas City, which is the oil process capital of the world on the Gulf Coast, along with Freeport, Baytown, Lake Jackson, Beaumont.

I worked for a time as the director of services for handicapped students at a college in Texas city.  One day we heard a loud sound.  That warning sound meant something had blown up or was on fire in one of those many companies' oil refining plants.  That sound meant get out of there now!  Everyone in that college headed for their cars, including me.  I headed back to the NASA area, thankful it was far enough north to be out of the danger area if something had exploded or was on fire.  That one didn't kill any people.  I would never live in Texas City or any of those other towns where chemicals are king.

Many years ago, a plant did explode in Texas City and many people were killed - those at the plants, as the one that exploded caused other plants to explode, and it also killed people living in the town - the "ene" chemicals killed those in town.  After that tragedy, the warning sound system was put in.


Offline thackney

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2017, 03:24:24 pm »
LNG cracker?  Seems C2= and C3= yields would be low, and too much heavies instead. And if I remember, Dow really isn't into the Aromatics business.   Interesting.

Natural Gas Liquids is not LNG.

The first is ethane, propane, butane, etc.

LNG is methane stored at -260°F
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Offline thackney

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #7 on: March 11, 2017, 03:26:13 pm »
LNG cracker?  Seems C2= and C3= yields would be low, and too much heavies instead. And if I remember, Dow really isn't into the Aromatics business.   Interesting.

An ethane cracker produces ethylene.  Feedstock for plastics and other chemicals.
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Offline thackney

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2017, 03:28:16 pm »
@GrouchoTex
@thackney
 
Liberals don't want this country to run on oil.  I have often wondered what they would do if everything made of plastic was removed from their lives as plastic comes from oil.

Groucho, I understand your fear of being where there was "ene" chemicals during a tornado.

I lived in the NASA area for 20 years.  Going south from there down Highway 45 toward the coast, one comes to Texas City, which is the oil process capital of the world on the Gulf Coast, along with Freeport, Baytown, Lake Jackson, Beaumont.

I worked for a time as the director of services for handicapped students at a college in Texas city.  One day we heard a loud sound.  That warning sound meant something had blown up or was on fire in one of those many companies' oil refining plants.  That sound meant get out of there now!  Everyone in that college headed for their cars, including me.  I headed back to the NASA area, thankful it was far enough north to be out of the danger area if something had exploded or was on fire.  That one didn't kill any people.  I would never live in Texas City or any of those other towns where chemicals are king.

Many years ago, a plant did explode in Texas City and many people were killed - those at the plants, as the one that exploded caused other plants to explode, and it also killed people living in the town - the "ene" chemicals killed those in town.  After that tragedy, the warning sound system was put in.

Plastics are mostly made from natural gas liquids these days.  Ethane to ethylene to polyethylene.
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Offline Victoria33

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2017, 03:45:25 pm »
Plastics are mostly made from natural gas liquids these days.  Ethane to ethylene to polyethylene.
@thackney

Liberals don't want natural gas, either.  If you can't make it from wind or solar, they don't want it - save the planet, go green.  The liberal engineer I know, worked for a huge oil company, sat on wells being drilled, in case something electronic screwed up and he would fix it.  He hated companies that made a profit and hated the oil coming out of the ground.  Can you say hypocrisy? He said the only problem the world had, was climate change and said climate change would eventually affect the area where he lived and food wouldn't grow there any more, and he would move to California when that happened.

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2017, 04:07:09 pm »
LNG cracker?  Seems C2= and C3= yields would be low, and too much heavies instead. And if I remember, Dow really isn't into the Aromatics business.   Interesting.

Not cracking. Coupling.

Oxidative coupling of methane
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxidative_coupling_of_methane

The oxidative coupling of methane (OCM) is a type of chemical reaction discovered in the 1980s for the direct conversion of natural gas, primarily consisting of methane, into value-added chemicals. Direct conversion of methane into other useful products is one of the most challenging subjects to be studied in heterogeneous catalysis.[1] Methane activation is difficult because of its thermodynamic stability with a noble gas like electronic configuration. The tetrahedral arrangement of strong C–H bonds (435 kJ/mol) offer no functional group, magnetic moments or polar distributions to undergo chemical attack. This makes methane less reactive than nearly all of its conversion products, limiting efficient utilization of natural gas, the world’s most abundant petrochemical resource.
Ethylene production

The principal product of OCM is ethylene, the world’s largest commodity chemical and the chemical industry's fundamental building block. While converting methane to ethylene would offer enormous economic benefits, it is a major scientific challenge. Thirty years of research failed to produce a commercial OCM catalyst, preventing this process from commercial applications.[2]

Ethylene production is an estimated $160 billion/year.[citation needed] Ethylene derivatives are found in food packaging, eyeglasses, cars, medical devices, lubricants, engine coolants and liquid crystal displays.[citation needed] Ethylene production by steam cracking consumes large amounts of energy, uses valuable oil fractions, such as naphtha and is the largest contributor to Greenhouse gas emissions in the chemical industry.[citation needed]

The oxidative coupling of methane to ethylene is written below:[3][4]

    2CH
    4 + O
    2 → C
    2H
    4 + 2H
    2O

The reaction is exothermic (∆H = -280 kJ/mol) and occurs at high temperatures (750–950 ˚C).[5] In the reaction, methane (CH
4) is activated heterogeneously on the catalyst surface, forming methyl free radicals, which then couple in the gas phase to form ethane (C
2H
6). The ethane subsequently undergoes dehydrogenation to form ethylene (C
2H
4). The yield of the desired C
2 products is reduced by non-selective reactions of methyl radicals with the surface and oxygen in the gas phase, which produce (undesirable) carbon monoxide and carbon dioxide.

New plant directly converts natural gas to ethylene http://www.processingmagazine.com/new-plant-directly-converts-natural-gas-to-ethylene/

A new gas-to-ethylene plant has been commissioned by Siluria Technologies, a San Francisco company that specializes in technology for converting natural gas into fuels and chemicals.

According to Siluria, its new facility will enable natural gas to supplement crude oil as the basis for transportation fuels, commodity chemicals and plastics. This adds value to natural gas resources while also reducing the cost of producing chemicals, plastics and fuels because natural gas is cheaper and more plentiful than crude oil. In turn, that could result in lower prices paid by consumers.

The demonstration plant in La Porte, Texas, is the first to produce ethylene directly from natural gas using Siluria's Oxidative Coupling of Methane (OCM) technology, an efficient catalytic process which the company says is more scalable, more environmentally friendly and more cost-effective in many settings than current methods of production.

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2017, 04:16:36 pm »
An ethane cracker produces ethylene.  Feedstock for plastics and other chemicals.

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Offline Victoria33

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #12 on: March 11, 2017, 04:44:19 pm »
@Elderberry

La Port is another town on the Gulf Coast near the Houston Ship Channel.  It may be the most northern one on the Coast, as it in Harris County where Houston is, then the plants are one after another on the coast, in towns, going down to Texas City and on down the coast, to terminate in Corpus Christi on the coast.

All this production of products from oil/natural gas, including most of the gasoline used in the country, is one reason why Texas can stay afloat if the country's economy goes bust.  I used to have stock in a company that has pipe lines going to the north where heating oil is sent to northeastern states.  Without that pipeline, the northeastern states would freeze in the winter. Gasoline from those plants also goes north through pipes. 

Jokes are made in Texas about those "damned northern Yankees" - that we could freeze them out and stop their cars anytime we wanted.

Offline Victoria33

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #13 on: March 11, 2017, 05:13:19 pm »
@thackney
@Elderberry
@Quix

One dam breaking could destroy every oil/gas processing plant on the gulf coast all the way through Texas City.  On 9/11, when the towers fell, after a short period of time later that day, there began to be military helicopters going over my house.  I won't tell you where I lived at the time (it was not the NASA area then).  I found out later, that a certain dam not far from my house (won't name the river dam) had military helicopters staying over it for a number of days.  I also found out later, if that dam was destroyed, it would flood/destroy all these oil/gas processing plants along the coast.  Those plants also use this non salt water in those plants.  Due to this fast military protection of this dam, it has to be near the top of vital resources to protect from possible attack.

There is so much we don't know about how our government/military protects this country.  We yell and scream, write complaints about our government, yet there are protections trying to keep us safe.  I know from family who served at the pentagon and family who works with the NSA, that we yell and scream about these agencies and yet they keep protecting us.  We are an ungrateful bunch at times, always complaining and not considering the devoted government people in those groups to keep us safe and in our military as they do the same.  We pray for our people in government who do their jobs to protect us and we never hear about them.

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #14 on: March 11, 2017, 06:17:22 pm »
@GrouchoTex
@thackney
 
Liberals don't want this country to run on oil.  I have often wondered what they would do if everything made of plastic was removed from their lives as plastic comes from oil.

Groucho, I understand your fear of being where there was "ene" chemicals during a tornado.

I lived in the NASA area for 20 years.  Going south from there down Highway 45 toward the coast, one comes to Texas City, which is the oil process capital of the world on the Gulf Coast, along with Freeport, Baytown, Lake Jackson, Beaumont.

I worked for a time as the director of services for handicapped students at a college in Texas city.  One day we heard a loud sound.  That warning sound meant something had blown up or was on fire in one of those many companies' oil refining plants.  That sound meant get out of there now!  Everyone in that college headed for their cars, including me.  I headed back to the NASA area, thankful it was far enough north to be out of the danger area if something had exploded or was on fire.  That one didn't kill any people.  I would never live in Texas City or any of those other towns where chemicals are king.

Many years ago, a plant did explode in Texas City and many people were killed - those at the plants, as the one that exploded caused other plants to explode, and it also killed people living in the town - the "ene" chemicals killed those in town.  After that tragedy, the warning sound system was put in.
I lived in La Marque many years ago growing up and recall when we moved to Austin that I no longer could smell the Union Carbide plant.

Are you referring to the 1969 blast at the Texas City plant that killed 8 people?  It was in a brand new 1.2 billion pound per year ethylene cracker.

Of course the infamous blast in Texas City sent shockwaves around the world when it occurred in 1947 at the pier on a vessel containing fertilizer.  That one killed 581 people and changed forever how fertilizer is handled.  An interesting writeup on that and its causes is here.  http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/fertilizer-explosion-kills-581-in-texas
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Offline Quix

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #15 on: March 11, 2017, 06:25:46 pm »
@thackney
@Elderberry
@Quix

One dam breaking could destroy every oil/gas processing plant on the gulf coast all the way through Texas City.  On 9/11, when the towers fell, after a short period of time later that day, there began to be military helicopters going over my house.  I won't tell you where I lived at the time (it was not the NASA area then).  I found out later, that a certain dam not far from my house (won't name the river dam) had military helicopters staying over it for a number of days.  I also found out later, if that dam was destroyed, it would flood/destroy all these oil/gas processing plants along the coast.  Those plants also use this non salt water in those plants.  Due to this fast military protection of this dam, it has to be near the top of vital resources to protect from possible attack.

There is so much we don't know about how our government/military protects this country.  We yell and scream, write complaints about our government, yet there are protections trying to keep us safe.  I know from family who served at the pentagon and family who works with the NSA, that we yell and scream about these agencies and yet they keep protecting us.  We are an ungrateful bunch at times, always complaining and not considering the devoted government people in those groups to keep us safe and in our military as they do the same.  We pray for our people in government who do their jobs to protect us and we never hear about them.

Quite so.

However,

"The Government" has grown into a monster in a long list of ways.

Certainly there are many thousands of people working in government with good hearts, patriotic values and wills in behalf of the Republic and the citizens. PTL for that and Thank God they are there.

How long and how much they can hold back the building tsunami toward destruction remains to be seen.

Thousands of people in government are super treasonous and also sold out to the dark lord, his senior henchmen and puppet masters and his schemes for these END TIMES. imho, they deserve no quarter, grace, ignoring, kindness, freedom etc. Many of them, e.g. Shrillery and OThuga, are evil to the core. Many of them are extremely, off the wall abusive of small children in the worst ways and deserve stern punishment accordingly. 

I realize it's a major chore to pick the fly specs out of the pepper as to who is patriotic, "God fearing" (for an "archaic phrase"), redemptive, wholesome etc. in practical, honorable, persistent ways. But we are wise to do so when it comes to supporting this or that government person and their influences on society and our Republic and lives.

I don't think it's greatly helpful to blackwash government and its major institutions--except maybe the CIA that has long earned it--though sections of it still are probably mostly patriotic. Neither is it helpful to whitewash such.

Yes, prayer for our government officials and workers is in order and worthwhile. Earnest prayer of right-living people is probably greatly more powerful than voting.


= = = = =

Certainly defense of our land and way of life is a super high priority. And, government has a huge role to play in that.

However, it is wise to be aware that many of the defense elements are being polluted 24/7 with increasing factors, forces, designs, strategies, orders, plans to utterly shred the Republic and our citizens in a list of ways.

The folks determined to trash the old order and raise on its ashes a "New Order" as old as Babylon are very serious and quite far along in their plans.

Many of the protective forces, units, organizations in our government have been tainted to wholesale turned against the people and are being turned more so by the day. I don't have a clever solution to that one other than to be prepped up, alert, prayerful, wise. And to avoid as much as possible getting caught up in the increasing limitations and restrictive to punishing 'nets' of officialdom.

The landscape has always been messy because messy humans are involved. But the deliberate conspiracy against the welfare of the Republic and her people is unprecedented in all recorded history as far as I can recall. I can't think of a single government/culture in all recorded history where the leaders concerned spent many many decades setting up the wholesale trashing of the whole thing, particularly the people, values and way of life . . . toward utter destruction.

Nevertheless, the Bible predicted it and it is on the not distant horizon.

There's also that verse about when evil reigns in the affairs of men, good people hide themselves.

We certainly do live in interesting times.




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Offline Quix

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #16 on: March 11, 2017, 07:02:50 pm »

@Victoria33,


imho,

in a list of ways . . .

way back when such things were being built . . .

It was a strategic blunder to stupidly irrational to allow so many key industries to be built so close to each other in that region. I hope it wasn't deliberate for ugly reasons.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 07:03:16 pm by Quix »
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Offline Victoria33

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #17 on: March 11, 2017, 07:23:17 pm »
@Victoria33,
imho,  in a list of ways . . . way back when such things were being built . . . It was a strategic blunder to stupidly irrational to allow so many key industries to be built so close to each other in that region. I hope it wasn't deliberate for ugly reasons.
@Quix

Those plants are built on the Texas coast for a reason - the ship channel on the coast.  Ships from all over the world, loaded with oil/other products the plants need, and finished products from the ships to American companies, come into the ship channel and unload/load products. 

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #18 on: March 11, 2017, 09:26:11 pm »
@Victoria33,


imho,

in a list of ways . . .

way back when such things were being built . . .

It was a strategic blunder to stupidly irrational to allow so many key industries to be built so close to each other in that region. I hope it wasn't deliberate for ugly reasons.
This was indeed deliberate, but not irrational at all.

The Texas Gulf Coast birthed a lot of the modern oil industry by its prolific salt dome discoveries over 100 years ago.  Its proximity to the coast allowed a simple and effective way to translate that crude into products that could be shipped via tanker elsewhere, or by rail.

Later on, the giant East Texas field came about nearby and then the largest Oil basin in the US, the Permian.

The vast oil fields in Louisiana were later developed, as well as the shallow water GOM fields.

The Oil Companies' building plants and refineries, coupled with Texas's willingness to allow them, was of immense strategic value and one the most important industry developments this country has ever seen.
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #19 on: March 11, 2017, 09:32:32 pm »
Yeah, my point too, which was why I was wondering why you were calling it a cracker feedstock, unless it was flashed off for fuel for the furnaces.
As I understand it, we are confusing LNG(liquefied Natural Gas) with LPGs(Liquefied Petroleum Gases) or NGLs(Natural Gas Liquids).

The LNG is not in the equation for these plants.  Instead, NGLs, which are produced as a by-product of the shale fields, are indeed the feedstock.   LPGs are specific types of NGLs which are butane and propane.

I do not wish to be demeaning to you, but for others reading this, I found this nomenclature might be useful.  http://www.elgas.com.au/blog/1789-natural-gas-liquids-ngls-vs-lpg-vs-lng-differences-uses.

Perhaps the LNG mention was the new process of making ethylene directly from methane?  That would seem to maybe where that conversation originated.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 09:36:48 pm by IsailedawayfromFR »
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Offline Quix

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #20 on: March 11, 2017, 10:46:19 pm »
@Quix

Those plants are built on the Texas coast for a reason - the ship channel on the coast.  Ships from all over the world, loaded with oil/other products the plants need, and finished products from the ships to American companies, come into the ship channel and unload/load products. 

I understood that.

I've understood that for decades.

Sometimes convenience and even cost are unwisely placed as the chief considerations in locating such things.

They COULD have dug feeder canals to a fairly broadly spaced and scattered number of sites for national security reasons. They did not.

The result is . . . well placed jihadi attacks;
devastating horrendous weather events;
a devastating tsunami;
etc.

could trash a huge percentage of such  desperately needed infrastructure overnight.

I don't consider that wise, patriotic, healthy, even common-sensical.

Sure, the economic reasons/rationalizations are easily touted. That doesn't  make them wisdom or "right."
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Offline Quix

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #21 on: March 11, 2017, 10:48:47 pm »
This was indeed deliberate, but not irrational at all.

The Texas Gulf Coast birthed a lot of the modern oil industry by its prolific salt dome discoveries over 100 years ago.  Its proximity to the coast allowed a simple and effective way to translate that crude into products that could be shipped via tanker elsewhere, or by rail.

Later on, the giant East Texas field came about nearby and then the largest Oil basin in the US, the Permian.

The vast oil fields in Louisiana were later developed, as well as the shallow water GOM fields.

The Oil Companies' building plants and refineries, coupled with Texas's willingness to allow them, was of immense strategic value and one the most important industry developments this country has ever seen.

I understand those valid reasons . . . and their validity--to a point.

I still strongly believe that allowing economic reasons . . . and convenience . . . to decide the issue of clustering so many critical industrial establishments sooooooo close together

was and remains

nonsensical, stupid, low in horse sense etc.

One doesn't have to be an engineer to see how that's, strategically speaking . . . NOT a good idea.


Please see my post just before this one.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 10:54:07 pm by Quix »
Forgive all; In all things Thank God; Love all. Love 1st, most & always... BE CALM & DO THE NEXT LOVING THING.
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Offline Victoria33

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #22 on: March 12, 2017, 01:53:10 pm »
@IsailedawayfromFR

I just read your comments today, Sunday, about the Texas gulf coast.  You understand the area and I enjoyed reading your posts about it.

I was born and grew up in the east Texas oil field.  My father worked for Sun Oil Company all his adult life.  I went to school, easily within a bike ride, in White Oak.  Because we were in the oil field, it was the richest school per capita in Texas.  I began elementary school in 1939.  Due to the wealth of the school, our school buses were like Continental Trailway buses and they picked you up at home.  We had a large library and we had a full time school nurse.  The school paid teachers more than any other place in Texas with free room and board, so we could choose the best teachers and they all wanted to be there.  Because of all this, I had an excellent education due to oil.  My father bought Sun Oil stock every month and it was that stock that sent me to college.

Before we met, my husband (now deceased) lived in La Marque.  He was Asst. Vice President of American National Insurance company in Galveston.  When we married, we lived in the NASA area and he drove back and forth to Galveston.

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #23 on: March 12, 2017, 02:22:59 pm »
I worked as a petroleum engineer for 41 years with several oil companies including Texaco, Exxon and Oxy all along the Gulf Coast, the East Coast, West Coast and Europe.  My business caused me to travel extensively in the Middle East, Far East, Australia and Africa.  We are glad to be finally able to retire here in Texas where we grew up.

My dad was a meteorologist when we lived in La Marque and working at the Galveston airport when Carla hit in '61. 
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Dow Chemical nears completion of Freeport expansion
« Reply #24 on: March 12, 2017, 02:30:29 pm »
I understand those valid reasons . . . and their validity--to a point.

I still strongly believe that allowing economic reasons . . . and convenience . . . to decide the issue of clustering so many critical industrial establishments sooooooo close together

was and remains

nonsensical, stupid, low in horse sense etc.

One doesn't have to be an engineer to see how that's, strategically speaking . . . NOT a good idea.


Please see my post just before this one.
guess you must also have thought it stupid at one time to build most of of the cars in the US around the Detroit area, have most financial institutions in the NY area, to have our govt run out of DC, etc. etc.

The point is there are reasons this is done, financial, effective, and a huge amount of synergy.

All of these were incrementally added over time and it made a lot of sense to build them where they are.  If some chief planner could go back to square one and decide how to build them fresh, likely he would have some comments like yours; however, this is the real world we live in.
No punishment, in my opinion, is too great, for the man who can build his greatness upon his country's ruin~  George Washington