2 B A Growing, Evolving Critique & Commentary of Tom DeLonge's "Sekret* Machines: Gods: Man & War wi

[Quix]

Turned up missing after the computer glitch that was somewhat forum wide.

[Quix]

 Avoiding Truth
.
There is a principle
__Which is a bar against all information,
____Which is proof against all argument,
______And which cannot fail to keep man in everlasting ignorance.
________That principle is condemnation before investigation
--Edmund Spencer
 
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[bigheadfred]

Something about the degree of virulence indicates a shaking or breaking of a worldview and also of a personal belief system. People don't want the truth. Can't handle the truth.

. . . that by merging fictional and nonfictional approaches, including mass media and social media in a variety of strategies, something analogous to the “truth” may be discovered about the foremost challenge to global culture in the twenty-first century**

I try to take in a lot of information, but not to the extent of myopic concentration.

I notice the mass brainwashing.

I'll try for a more studied review of your statements tonight. Gotta go to work.

FWIW, I noticed a slight change in the (my) timeline Monday morning. The oligarchs have had a pretty free run over the last 24 years--starting with HWBush.  Trump is upsetting their apple cart. Not tipping it over, but there are apples rolling loose.

[bigheadfred]

Corinthians 4:4

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

[Quix]

Corinthians 4:4

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

ABSOLUTELY INDEED.

THANKS.

Great comments. And Scripture.

[Quix]

Additional excerpts from Sekret Machines Vol 2:
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To use the term "alien" is to telegraph a certain mindset where it doesn't exist and to devalue the dialogue in the process.

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So . . . now we are supposed to be Politically Correct about !!!aliens!!!???? Horrendous.
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However, he wasn't able to come up with a better word. LOL.
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--and there is evidence to suggest that these secret machines have been developed for decades, if not longer, but that they may not be what we think they are--we believe it is more important to consider that it may not be alien technology that is being re-engineered.

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He doesn't elaborate, yet, on that interesting assertion.
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Since the very earliest times of mankind, there has existed a particular mental attitude on the part of man as regards the existence of a thought supposed to be superior to his own: this is the religious attitude.
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Until now, human thinking has never been applied to a category of thought supposed to be super-human other than in a religious context . . . The particular difficulty of Ufological research is, consequently, the difficulty of applying oneself to a super-human phenomenology merely with the methods of science and excluding all mysticism.
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--Aime Michel

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He seems to {actually, he makes it clear that he does} lean a lot on Gnosticism . . . Gnostic beliefs etc. as having usefulness in analyzing the phenomenon.
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He seems to subscribe to some of Sitchin's junk but rightly notes that a fair amount of Sitchin's stuff was quite wrong, inaccurate, unscholarly.
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As Samuel Noah Kramer wrote,
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"history begins at Sumer" {9} and with the beginning of recorded history we have the begining of a paranoia and the suspicion that all is not what it seems. While the truth may not be as Sitchin conceived it, there is still a strange and persistent element of terror in the cuneiform texts out of Sumer that may reflect concerns among these ancient peoples that are eerily similar to our own." {empheses Qx's in all these quotes}

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It is an interesting book that "advances" the discussion considerably. imho, certainly it will have an impact.

[Quix]

Am now at having  read  10% of the book.

These last bunch of pages are intellectual nonsense but follow faithfully the deceptions from hell plentiful in the new age etc. realm.

They treat the Biblical record as merely another collection of ancient mythology--some parts 'possibly' true like some other mythological records from the Sumerians etc.

He talks about preserving the species vs individuals--i.e. that the collective is far more important than the individual.

That is the antithesis of the Biblical narrative.

Christ died for us as individuals.

He really gets into the serpent gods stuff--describing as Gnostics  and some secret societies that the serpent in The Garden was the "true god" etc. etc. etc. wanting to lift man up via knowledge etc. etc. etc.

Blasphemous carp.

He's seemingly spent a lot of pages moving toward the theme, setting up the theme that the coming "ET's" will follow in the line of the 'gods' lifting man up via knowledge.

I'm not surprised. There are a lot of bright oligarchy stooges and puppets of the fallen angels that have bought that line of thinking hook, line and sinker.

Truly Christ was right when He said that the GREAT DECEPTION in the end times would be so great that were it possible, even the elect would be deceived.

[bigheadfred]

--and there is evidence to suggest that these secret machines have been developed for decades, if not longer, but that they may not be what we think they are--we believe it is more important to consider that it may not be alien technology that is being re-engineered.

If you think about the stories of the Vimanas, the lightning weapons, etc., then look at the megalithic evidence of machine marks, and then think about the "secret" knowledge supposedly held by secret societies, or the power of the priest/king class to perform magic/miracles it makes some sense.

There may/probably was a society/civilization that had high technology. Call it Atlantis for fun. As some have been proposing some cataclysmic event, or series of events, destroyed that civilization. Some of the survivors and their technology remained. But over the centuries that knowledge was lost or hidden away because there was no way to reproduce it or repair it. But what has remained of it is still in the hands of those secret societies, including the Nazi's, and we have progressed far enough now tech wise that it can be reverse engineered and/or put to use.

I think there is a huge amount of historical and archaeology evidence that is hidden away. The truth IS stranger than fiction.

[Quix]

--and there is evidence to suggest that these secret machines have been developed for decades, if not longer, but that they may not be what we think they are--we believe it is more important to consider that it may not be alien technology that is being re-engineered.

If you think about the stories of the Vimanas, the lightning weapons, etc., then look at the megalithic evidence of machine marks, and then think about the "secret" knowledge supposedly held by secret societies, or the power of the priest/king class to perform magic/miracles it makes some sense.

There may/probably was a society/civilization that had high technology. Call it Atlantis for fun. As some have been proposing some cataclysmic event, or series of events, destroyed that civilization. Some of the survivors and their technology remained. But over the centuries that knowledge was lost or hidden away because there was no way to reproduce it or repair it. But what has remained of it is still in the hands of those secret societies, including the Nazi's, and we have progressed far enough now tech wise that it can be reverse engineered and/or put to use.

I think there is a huge amount of historical and archaeology evidence that is hidden away. The truth IS stranger than fiction.

THANKS. imho, that's more than a little plausible.

Time will tell.

Thanks for your kind reply.

[Quix]

Tom DeLonge and co-author go on at some length about shamanism etc.

They clearly are weaving a foundation for synthesizing a LOT of mysticism, occultic sources, ceremonies, values, constructions on reality.

It's disappointing to see someone as bright as he taken in by so much spiritual ugliness and hogwash.

At this point, at least, he seems to have no filter or alert whatsoever that detects or notices or categorizes evil spirits as evil at all.

He uses "liminal" in such discussions.

According to Merium-Webster.com:

    Definition of liminal               

• 1 :  of, relating to, or situated at a sensory threshold :  barely perceptible or capable of eliciting a response liminal visual stimuli
• 2 :  of, relating to, or being an intermediate state, phase, or condition :  in-between,  transitional in the liminal state between life and death  — Deborah Jowitt

 

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From Sekret Machines Vol 2:
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If we apply the Cargo Cult metaphor to this ritual{,} a few things become apparent rather quickly. The concentric circles with the hieroglyphs and strange lettering between them can easily stand in for the aerial vehicle, a "flying saucer" if you will, especially when we factor in the lights and the smoke from the incense, the odd sounds, and the oddly clad passenger within.

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imho, that's a great grope . . . at least a great leap of conjecture.
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But it fits the foundation he's building and the evidently intellectual/religious destination he seems to be heading toward.

[bigheadfred]

If we apply the Cargo Cult metaphor to this ritual{,} a few things become apparent rather quickly. The concentric circles with the hieroglyphs and strange lettering between them can easily stand in for the aerial vehicle, a "flying saucer" if you will, especially when we factor in the lights and the smoke from the incense, the odd sounds, and the oddly clad passenger within.

It could also be a depiction of an eclipse with  "father" time running the show.

[Quix]

It could also be a depiction of an eclipse with  "father" time running the show.

He goes on at such length . . . somewhat in the same vein as Dr Jacques Vallee . . . that an eclipse is highly unlikely to match the specifics he's talking about.

He goes into some detail about occult seances and the entities appearing; the incantations, sounds, rules involved . . . to some degree . . .

Vallee's point in his books is that occult goings on through the centuries have a LOT more in common with the ET visitations of our era than most folks would likely ever imagine.

I think Tom DeLonge would agree but I think he's going to end up taking it a bit of another direction.

[Quix]

Continued reading of Vol 2 . . .
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What we wish to point out here is the relative consistency of this experience from ancient, biblical times to the present. The fact that Ezekiel eventually will be abducted by the being in the chariot is further evidence that we are dealing with a single unitary complex of ideas and images that is repeated endlessly from era to era, from culture to culture.

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This is a good example of Tom DeLonge's degree of either ignorance or complicity in the Great Deception.
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He spends a lot of pages trying to convince the reader that all paranormal phenomena in history are a single unitary complex.
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He illustrates, demonstrates in such a narrative that regardless of how much he thinks he intellectually GROK's the Biblical record, he's woefully ignorant of the major aspects of the Biblical record of God's Word to man.
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1. He has bought into the deception that the Bible is a very flawed collection of earlier cultural documents e.g. from the Sumerians.
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2. He seems utterly blind to the fact that the Bible  is unparalleled and very unique in the whole entire history of literature and historic documents.
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3. He seems to be particularly blind to the fact that Almighty God Yehovah meant what He said and said what He meant in the Bible.
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4. He squeezes the Biblical supernatural/paranormal events into the format, script, meaning he and his supporters have chosen to believe is 'the truth.' It seems to totally escape his awareness that such mangling of the Biblical events is totally off the wall wrong.
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5. He seems to think that there is 0.0% difference between fallen angels vs God's loyal angels.
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6. He seems to think that the goals of one group (fallen angels) are identical to the goals of God's loyal angels.
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7. He equates God's fiercely forbidden occult activities (e.g. seances, for talking with the dead; getting prophetic input etc), with God ordained methods of dialogue with God.
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8. Essentially, he ends up claiming that utter darkness and deception is the same as total light and truth. It appears he has no clue that he's doing that.
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9. Nevertheless, he's slick enough in his presentation of the elements of the Great Deception that I expect that the hedonistic, secular, hostile-to-God masses will swallow it all hook, line and sinker. They have been well prepared & conditioned to buy the whole charade.
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10. Truly the Biblical warning about how the Great Deception of the END TIMES will be soooo great that were it possible, even the  "very elect" themselves would be deceived.
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 Avoiding Truth
.
There is a principle
__Which is a bar against all information,
____Which is proof against all argument,
______And which cannot fail to keep man in everlasting ignorance.
________That principle is condemnation before investigation
--Edmund Spencer
 
GOP BRIEFING ROOM ‘ALTERNATE REALITIES’ PING LIST
@bigheadfred
@Cyber Liberty
@DCPatriot
@Freya
@Ghost Bear
@GrannyMinimum
@Idaho_Cowboy
@jedidah
@Liberty Tree Dr
@Mom MD
@mrpotatohead
@Smokin Joe
@Texas Yellow Rose
@the_doc
@Victoria33
@WorkingClassFilth
 

[bigheadfred]

I don't think I am understanding something. Does he think ALL this information came from the Sumerians via the Annunaki? If that is the case are Sitchin's books The New Holy Bible?

[bigheadfred]

Also, a "single unitary complex" phrase seems at odds with itself.

[Quix]

Also, a "single unitary complex" phrase seems at odds with itself.

Depending.

One can have a complex explanation for a complex reality . . . and if say 3-8 groups have the same complex explanation for roughly the same complex reality

then it is accurate to call that interpretation a SINGLE interpretation, explanation regardless of the complexity.

Thanks for your kind reply.

[Quix]

Here's another long review of the book:
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http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/review-of-sekret-machines-gods-by-tom-delonge-with-peter-levenda-part-1
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{added paragraphing and emphases}

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. . .
I won’t quote the pages of material Levenda writes to justify his description of the UFO “phenomenon” as a unified field of study but I will point out that he took the exact same material I worked with in my 2013 essay on the so-called “phenomenon” and derived the exact opposite conclusion. Where I looked at the many facets of the so-called phenomenon—from lights in the sky to midnight sexual encounters to prehistoric mysteries—and saw them as unrelated material brought together by a myth, Levenda sees them as different sides of a polyhedron that cannot be separated.
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Good luck proving that. It is, as he notes, an assumption, but one he makes for a political purpose, not a scientific one: He aims to bring about what he calls a “cultural revolution” that will overthrow mainstream society and the institutions supporting it in favor of one better aligned to New Age values. This book is not, therefore, the work of an investigator but a polemicist.
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And yet… There is a bitterness underneath the polemicist’s utopian tone. He speaks of “impotent” government and academic elites who attempt to humiliate believers in UFOs to cover up their own powerlessness, and his language makes veiled reference to fantasies of revenge. He speaks with contempt, too, of “ancient alien theorists,” whom he sees as ignorant pretenders. Levenda calls the moment of first contact the ur-punkt moment, German for “origin point,” but also a pun, reading phonetically in English “you’re punked,” which is to say, in vernacular, you have been played the fool. I can’t help but think that is no coincidence.
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. . .
His chapter is a grab bag of familiar claims. He compares superheroes to ancient gods, and he compares the Reptilians to the wisdom-serpents of ancient myth. He notes the relationship between Genesis and Babylonian mythology, and he goes off on a tangent about how evolutionary theory negates the very purpose of religion. While more subtle thinkers might attribute religion to an evolutionary imperative, Levenda instead wants to separate out consciousness from the cold, amoral demands of our genes. He claims that Near Death Experiences, alien abductions, and theophany are all the same phenomenon.
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He might be correct about the similarity, but he offers no proof that it is because of any superhuman power. Nevertheless, he assumes that there is some otherworldly reality, and he states that shamanism, Freemasonry, and sundry other spiritual systems are designed to help us travel back and forth between this dimension and that. He might pretend he doesn’t watch Ancient Aliens, but if you do, then you’ve heard all of this many times before, notably from William Henry, whose combination of conspiracy theory and spirituality Levenda comes closest to aping.
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The “aliens” on the show haven’t been from this dimension for five or six seasons. Levenda adds to the familiar discussion the claim, taken more or less wholesale from Jacques Vallée, that modern “magick” is a continuation of this shamanic activity and therefore provides real access to the spirit realm. He acts like early modern ritual “magick” was somehow divorced from the (misunderstood) ancient materials it drew upon when he speaks in awe of how similar the outward forms are to earlier ancient rituals. Levenda’s choice to treat each new subject as divorced from the context of the culture that spawned it allows him to pull the wool over the readers’ eyes and present as dramatic similarity what is actually a degree of cultural continuity.
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. . .
Levenda tries to use the myth as an entry point into a discussion of “sovereignty,” here eliding the legal title to rule a country with the idea of human primacy on Earth. In so doing, he brings in postmodern philosophy in a pretentious way to argue that human institutions have no way to deal with superhuman phenomena and therefore refuse to acknowledge the existence of UFOs because to do so would vaunt space aliens (or gods, or whatever) above humanity, an ideological impossibility. This leads to a rant about skeptics and materialists treasuring science as a “dogma,” as though space aliens would not be a subject of scientific interest.
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You can see from this were Levenda’s sympathies lie; he imagines the “aliens” as gods and the UFO “phenomenon” as an incursion of pre-Abrahamic myth into our reality. This is not, to put it kindly, much of an argument about UFOs, but it is a political one. Levenda emphasizes that his analysis would lead to the overthrow of all current governments because they undermine the absolute obedience each level of the social hierarchy owes its superiors. He then rants some more about science and how scientists refuse to study UFOs because they can’t be “tested.” This is demonstrably false, but at this point, there is no stopping the angry rants against various elites.
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. . .
To this discussion, Levenda adds the claim that an unidentified U.S. government official told him and DeLonge to look into “Greek mythology” to find answers to the UFO mystery. He takes Greek myths at face value, imagining them direct copies of Babylonian originals, though we all know that they are a complex stew of pre-Greek, Hittite, Near Eastern, Indo-European, and other influences. For example, the Greek myth of the Titans and the succession of the gods likely owes more to the Hittites than the Babylonians, though you wouldn’t know it from Levenda.
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Levenda concludes the chapter by adopting the mantra of the ancient astronaut theorists he despises: All gods, angels, devils, and demons are actually the powers that inhabit UFOs. “What we are proposing here and in the chapters and the books that follow is a scientific resolution to the old problem of gods, demons, good and evil, religion, magic, and all the impedimenta of the pre-scientific age.”
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That’s awfully grand, but it’s no different than when Erich von Däniken declared all of the gods to be space aliens (and George Van Tassel added Yahweh and the angels), or when Ignatius Donnelly declared them all to be kings of Atlantis, or even when St. Augustine told us that all of the gods were actually demons (City of God 7.33). Levenda is not offering anything “scientific” in the commonly accepted definition of the term; he is merely dressing up the old Christian urge to unify the supernatural in science-like clothes, as though appeals to quantum physics and Air Force reports could disguise the effort to reenchant the world and make the gods real again.
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. . . 

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[Quix]

I don't think I am understanding something. Does he think ALL this information came from the Sumerians via the Annunaki? If that is the case are Sitchin's books The New Holy Bible?

No. . . . well . . . mostly no, as I understand him.
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He asserts that the Sumerians were the earliest with the info found all around the world in a diversity of cultures.
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He notes that Sitchin was wrong about a lot of things. He still seems to side with Sitchin about some things. He does not believe Sitchin's writings are infallible by any stretch of the imagination. However, he still comes across sounding a lot in the same vein as Sitchin et al.
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He doesn't get extensively into the Annunaki stuff, so far.

Thanks for your kind reply.

[bigheadfred]

So are they lumping "everything" into a result of alien contact and interaction with people?

[Quix]

So are they lumping "everything" into a result of alien contact and interaction with people?

Yes and no.

The main disturbing 'lumping together,' to me, is equating Ezekiel's chariot and other Biblical mentions of such 'craft' etc. as

100% equal to occult, fallen angel etc. stuff throughout history from the Sumerians to the present.

He makes no distinction between angelic forces serving satan vs those serving Almighty God Yehovah.

And, he has swallowed the 'scholarly,' {choke choke} noise, farce that the Bible is a collection of myths, stories etc. that originated in pagan cultures earlier in time.

I don't think he'd say that ALL that's resulted in the current status quo is a function of alien contact with people. He might well say that most of the key features of religion, technology etc. have been seriously influenced by such contact.

Thanks for your kind reply.