The man behind the Trump rally disturbance in Reno,

[Smokin Joe]

Ahh, so violence is excusable if the victim "asked for it"?

At least he wasn't in a short skirt with a low neckline...it could have been worse!!

[Smokin Joe]

That yelling "Gun" crap sounds like a particularly dangerous form of "swatting" that could have ended with people dead and or wounded.

Yep.

[Chosen Daughter]

Many of us are in the same position as this man on Sunday when we make our way to church.  We certainly cannot go to the front with our questions about whether Trump is fit to lead the United States of America.

[Wingnut]

That yelling "Gun" crap sounds like a particularly dangerous form of "swatting" that could have ended with people dead and or wounded.

Good point.   I bet this is in the Trumpanzee handbook:
How to Handle a Dissenter/ Dem Plant at a Trump Rally
1.  Take subject to the ground by means of force.
2.  Cover him from view.
3.  Yell: "Gun"
3a. Pop a few ballons for effect.

[Cripplecreek]

Good point.   I bet this is in the Trumpanzee handbook:
How to Handle a Dissenter/ Dem Plant at a Trump Rally
1.  Take subject to the ground by means of force.
2.  Cover him from view.
3.  Yell: "Gun"
3a. Pop a few ballons for effect.

And the secret service would get the blame.

Like Kent State, history unequivocally blames the national guard but there are plenty of legitimate questions about who gave the order to fire and who actually fired the first shot.

[sneakypete]

Good point.   I bet this is in the Trumpanzee handbook:
How to Handle a Dissenter/ Dem Plant at a Trump Rally
1.  Take subject to the ground by means of force.
2.  Cover him from view.
3.  Yell: "Gun"
3a. Pop a few ballons for effect.

@Wingnut

Uhhh,you seem to be a couple of quarts overfilled with paranoia.

You DO understand that once someone starts shooting in a crowd that ANYONE can get hit,right? Even/maybe even especially,the one doing the shouting.

[sneakypete]

And the secret service would get the blame.

Like Kent State, history unequivocally blames the national guard but there are plenty of legitimate questions about who gave the order to fire and who actually fired the first shot.

@Cripplecreek

Not much chance of THAT happening. The SS guys are VERY well trained and NOT prone to panic shooting. They will NOT shoot unless they see a shooter with a gun and have a clear shot at him or her.

More likely would be a retard in the crowd pulling a gun from from under  his shirt and waving it around wildly looking for a shooter,and maybe spotting another retard doing the same thing and shoot them,"just in case". Which would most likely result in someone else pulling a gun to shoot the guy that shot the first guy with a gun,etc,etc,etc.

There are VERY good reasons the SS don't want armed people showing up at political rallies,and this pretty much has to be the number 1 reason.

[Victoria33]

@beandog

Seriously?  Those Trump yahoos were justified in beating him?  According to his rights, he was free to bring his sign into the rally without fear of being assaulted.

@CatherineofAragon

"...he was free to bring his sign into the rally..."

Actually, he was not.  I read this morning that when people are checked before going in a rally now, besides checking for weapons, no outside signs are allowed in.  This makes sense.  The campaign gives out their signs after the people go into the rally.  This is to keep weird signs and anti-Trump signs from getting on TV.  This guy could have held up his sign outside the rally, but not inside.

I have read numerous accounts of what the man did, and he had his sign hidden when he went into the rally.  So, he was pulling his anti-Trump sign out from his shirt to hold it up.  It was his action pulling out the sign that set people off and someone yelling, "Gun!"  That set off the Secret Service to almost literally drag Trump out of there fast.

The look on the face of one SS man was like steel - his face said he was ready to take a bullet or kill anyone who was a threat to the life of Trump.

Bob spoke to me about the Secret Service this morning after this incident. You know Bob worked at the Pentagon in classified information coming into the CIA.  He would go to the White House to deliver top secret info. for the President.  He interacted with the Secret Service agents.  He said their training is tough and they have to be willing to take a bullet to "save" the president, die if necessary, or they cannot be agents.

I don't know how they live like that, as their adrenaline has to be pouring into their body all the time, on guard for that bullet that may be coming from anyone in the surrounding area where the president is.  We saw that yesterday, the agents were going to protect the life of the candidate if they had to die to do it.

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[Smokin Joe]

@Cripplecreek

Not much chance of THAT happening. The SS guys are VERY well trained and NOT prone to panic shooting. They will NOT shoot unless they see a shooter with a gun and have a clear shot at him or her.

More likely would be a retard in the crowd pulling a gun from from under  his shirt and waving it around wildly looking for a shooter,and maybe spotting another retard doing the same thing and shoot them,"just in case". Which would most likely result in someone else pulling a gun to shoot the guy that shot the first guy with a gun,etc,etc,etc.

There are VERY good reasons the SS don't want armed people showing up at political rallies,and this pretty much has to be the number 1 reason.

I know the law varies from state to state, but most states don't legally allow even CCW permit holders to do so at a political rally unless they are wearing the badge.

That said, "SWATting" people, calling in a 'situation' man with a gun, shots fired, suicide threat, even spoofing caller ID to make it look like the address, has been done.
Which puts a tactical team on some SOB who might look like he has a weapon when he comes to the doorway with the remote in his hand. It is dangerous as all get-out for the victim.

Some instances:
https://www.fbi.gov/contact-us/field-offices/newhaven/news/press-releases/wethersfield-man-admits-participating-in-multiple-swatting-incidents

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/suburban-denver-swatting-incident-caught-gamer-camera-article-1.1919640

http://www.nj.com/mercer/index.ssf/2015/05/several_swatting_incidents_across_nj_shut_down_sch.html

https://krebsonsecurity.com/2013/04/swatting-incidents-tied-to-id-theft-sites/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2627338/Canadian-teenager-arrested-30-swatting-incidents-U-S-including-string-threats-against-Florida-high-school.html

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/fbi-swatting-cases-country-copycats/story?id=14257526

[Oceander]

@CatherineofAragon

"...he was free to bring his sign into the rally..."

Actually, he was not.  I read this morning that when people are checked before going in a rally now, besides checking for weapons, no outside signs are allowed in.  This makes sense.  The campaign gives out their signs after the people go into the rally.  This is to keep weird signs and anti-Trump signs from getting on TV.  This guy could have held up his sign outside the rally, but not inside.

I have read numerous accounts of what the man did, and he had his sign hidden when he went into the rally.  So, he was pulling his anti-Trump sign out from his shirt to hold it up.  It was his action pulling out the sign that set people off and someone yelling, "Gun!"  That set off the Secret Service to almost literally drag Trump out of there fast.

The look on the face of one SS man was like steel - his face said he was ready to take a bullet or kill anyone who was a threat to the life of Trump.

Bob spoke to me about the Secret Service this morning after this incident. You know Bob worked at the Pentagon in classified information coming into the CIA.  He would go to the White House to deliver top secret info. for the President.  He interacted with the Secret Service agents.  He said their training is tough and they have to be willing to take a bullet to "save" the president, die if necessary, or they cannot be agents.

I don't know how they live like that, as their adrenaline has to be pouring into their body all the time, on guard for that bullet that may be coming from anyone in the surrounding area where the president is.  We saw that yesterday, the agents were going to protect the life of the candidate if they had to die to do it.

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Yes, but he was already holding it up before he got jumped, so it cannot be the case that someone really thought he was pulling a gun out when that person yelled.  They yelled after the fact.

[LilLamb]

Yes, but he was already holding it up before he got jumped, so it cannot be the case that someone really thought he was pulling a gun out when that person yelled.  They yelled after the fact.

Exactly! People were looking at the sign and booing! Lots of revision going on trying to explain away the out of control reaction of Trump supporters.  Trump started this by encouraging supporters to act on their own to suppress protestors. Now they scan the people around them looking for someone to jump on so they can get an atta boy from Trump for taking out a protestor.

[Frank Cannon]

Excuse me but he had every right to be there with a protest sign.

True, but the outcome is not guaranteed. It appears this guy is a Leftist agitator. A guy has a right to wear a Klansman outfit to a black church, but the outcome is not guaranteed.

[Emjay]

He didn't rush the stage.  He was rushed.

Some Trumproid shouted "gun" which was why the SS sprang into action.

I saw no evidence that he rushed the stage.  If he had actually gotten anywhere near Trump, Trump would have cried like a little baby.

[sneakypete]

@CatherineofAragon


I don't know how they live like that, as their adrenaline has to be pouring into their body all the time, on guard for that bullet that may be coming from anyone in the surrounding area where the president is.  We saw that yesterday, the agents were going to protect the life of the candidate if they had to die to do it.

@Victoria33

Not really. In that respect they are no different than career combat arms soldiers. Actually,they are safer than combat arms soldiers because the chances of any of them facing off against a tank or an attack helicopter or jet fighter is VERY slim.

They just have Type A personalities,and by nature generally pay more attention to what is going on around them than most people. Because this is a part of their nature,it is natural for them to react more quickly to an act of possible aggression than  most people. They even get a rush out of it and the adrenaline dump they get from springing into action is a reward in itself. There is a good reason there is a term called "adrenaline junkie",but the term itself proves it's not a constant state.

Truth to tell,when a crisis hits adrenaline junkies actually get calmer than normal and have the ability to focus intently on possible targets/threats. Time seems to slow down,allowing you plenty of time to chose options.

It's after everything settles down that the real adrenaline dump hits and you get what may seem like a massive "sugar rush" to some.

[Smokin Joe]

You're right.  It was also pointed out to me that he didn't have permission to have the protest sign inside the event and that that is a fair regulation for a campaigns to require, just like any organized event people put on.  The protestors must keep the protesting outside the event.

Granted, all of that. It doesn't justify yelling "Gun!". That's a whole DEFCON level different. Though the agents are doubtless the best of the available best at what they do, the principal could get hurt in transit from the perceived threat, too. (Or the tactic could be used to herd the principal along a known escape route into a more dangerous threat.

[sneakypete]

True, but the outcome is not guaranteed. It appears this guy is a Leftist agitator. A guy has a right to wear a Klansman outfit to a black church, but the outcome is not guaranteed.

@Frank Cannon

C'mon,Frank. We both know the outcome is guaranteed in that case.

[Smokin Joe]

I agree with all of that.  He was guilty of sneaking in a disallowed sign and not sticking to outside protesting.  That's it.  The crowd overreacted (like the thugs they've become) and set the rest into motion.  The SS did what they are trained to do -- react fast just in case.  As for Trump, an urgent reaction is normal.  My gut says that he is a total yellow-belly because he is driven by self-centeredness and that's how it plays out. If he were on the Titanic, for example, you can bet he would have managed to get his tubby behind on that boat with the ladies and children.  He would have negotiated away his own wife's seat to nab it, IMO.  That's just how I see Trump.  He will sellout the rest of us in order to achieve any kind of gain for himself.  He's an abuse of power waiting to happen.

The wealthy families of the day secured their progeny in the lifeboats (children), and their family reputations on deck. That is the way it was done in the days before "Don't you know who I am?"

Their family businesses/empires would have suffered if so much as a single woman from the lower decks had been left out of the lifeboat because they had taken a seat.

[NavyCanDo]

I was a Protest Warrior counter protestor back in the day

I do miss the Protest Warriors. Not every one got what they were doing, but I did, and enjoyed following them.

[sneakypete]

Exactly.  I do not think Trump is cut from that kind of cloth.

@RAT Patrol

And Bubbette! is,and that's why you will refuse to vote for the only candidate she will be facing?

There ain't going to be any innocent bystanders on Wednesday morning. Everyone who voted will either vote for her or Trump,and the fools who take false pride in not having voted for either of them will be as responsible for her being in office as her most rabid supporter.

It's the equivalent of seeing an orphanage on fire,and then ignoring it. Yeah,it burns down and all the babies die,but it's not YOUR fault because YOU didn't set the fire,right?

There really are times in history when inaction equates to action,and this is one of them.

[Emjay]

His rights have everything to deal with it.  Respecting other people's rights, especially the rights of those we disagree with, is largely what separates us from the communists and the fascists, and the downright plain evil. 

I don't want to side with the Brownshirts, do you?

Poor analogy.  People who hunt bears should realize the danger.  People who make peaceful protests in political rallies might expect to be booed or even escorted out (which would be wrong) but not attacked .

[Emjay]

@RAT Patrol

And Bubbette! is,and that's why you will refuse to vote for the only candidate she will be facing?

There ain't going to be any innocent bystanders on Wednesday morning. Everyone who voted will either vote for her or Trump,and the fools who take false pride in not having voted for either of them will be as responsible for her being in office as her most rabid supporter.

It's the equivalent of seeing an orphanage on fire,and then ignoring it. Yeah,it burns down and all the babies die,but it's not YOUR fault because YOU didn't set the fire,right?

There really are times in history when inaction equates to action,and this is one of them.

This is not one of those times.  Trump should not get anywhere near the presidency.  I think not voting is a valid option this year.  I would vote the down ticket only but out here I don't know enough.  By next election I hope I will.

[sneakypete]

Poor analogy.  People who hunt bears should realize the danger.  People who make peaceful protests in political rallies might expect to be booed or even escorted out (which would be wrong) but not attacked .

@Emjay

Let's say you go to a LaRaza rally and have a sign showing you are opposed to illegal aliens living in America? Do you SERIOUSLY believe you won't be physically attacked?

[Emjay]

@Wingnut

Uhhh,you seem to be a couple of quarts overfilled with paranoia.

You DO understand that once someone starts shooting in a crowd that ANYONE can get hit,right? Even/maybe even especially,the one doing the shouting.

Nothing paranoid about thinking that many trump supporters are both violent and paranoid. 

[Emjay]

@Emjay

Let's say you go to a LaRaza rally and have a sign showing you are opposed to illegal aliens living in America? Do you SERIOUSLY believe you won't be physically attacked?

Do you seriously equate a Trump rally with a LaRaza rally?

You might be right.

[Victoria33]

@Victoria33

It's after everything settles down that the real adrenaline dump hits and you get what may seem like a massive "sugar rush" to some.

@sneakypete

I don't agree with you.  Adrenaline pours in at the moment of danger for quick action required.  When that ends, the body has a let down as the adrenaline stops flowing.  Example:

I can compare it to working as an EMT, which I was.  I responded to medical emergencies on an ambulance until I received my certification, and then in my gated community, responding emergencies before an ambulance got there.  Adrenalin poured into me and my body was stronger than normal, I could lift and move physical items or bodies that were heavier than I could normally lift/move.

My mind worked at max speed, evaluating the situation/bodies quickly and knowing what to do almost instantly.  Most of the time, in my community emergency response, I had an MCA (Medical Care Assistant) with me to help, to follow my directions.  Looking at me work, one would think I was calm as I wasn't jerky or frantic, but I was centered on the problems mentally and automatically doing what was required to save lives.  There is a mental list of priorities for an EMT to follow and those are drilled into us and are automatically checked off as we work.

Once that was over, I and the MCA were pretty much whipped, out of adrenaline rush, and the MCA and I would go somewhere to recover and calmly go over what happened and discuss if we could have done something differently than we did.  Every emergency was a learning lesson as no two emergencies are exactly alike.

Your saying adrenalin hits after the emergency, is just wrong.

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