Author Topic: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century  (Read 1316 times)

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Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« on: August 15, 2016, 08:18:08 pm »
 Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
This is the one year I'm considering voting for the Libertarians. Too bad Gary Johnson and Bill Weld are blowing it.
By Robert Tracinski
Aug. 15, 2016
The Federalist
Quote
This is the one year I am vaguely considering voting for the Libertarian Party candidate, Gary Johnson. I’m sure I’m not the only regular Republican voter to do so. Too bad Gary Johnson and his running mate Bill Weld are kind of blowing it.

I normally wouldn’t vote Libertarian because they’re a small splinter party with no hope of winning and have no real impact on the election, and because, as a result of being a small splinter party, they tend to attract a lot of crackpots and repel the best political talent. (Libertarians with real political prospects, like Rand Paul or my own congressman, Dave Brat, bolt for the Republican Party when they can.) Then there’s the Libertarians’ dogmatically anti-interventionist foreign policy, complete with Ron-Paul-style rhetoric about how we were asking for 9/11. That is not exactly what you want to hear from the commander-in-chief.

But the offerings this year from the two big parties are so dreadfully bad, so clearly below the minimum level of acceptability, that I am willing to cast about for alternatives. It’s highly unlikely the Libertarian candidate could win outright, particularly in a year when the political Right is badly divided. There’s a slightly less slim hope that he could get enough electoral votes to throw the election to the House of Representatives and prevail there with the support of disgruntled anti-Trump Republicans. But at the very least, a Libertarian candidate who gets 20 percent or 25 percent of the vote, or more, would serve as an effective way to register a protest vote against both of the major parties, rob the actual winner of any kind of mandate, and give those of us who just can’t bring ourselves to pull the lever for Donald Trump or Hillary Clinton a way to vote our conscience.

It Wasn’t Hard to Seize the Moment, Guys

All the Libertarian Party had to do was to put forward a candidate who could take relatively sane and defensible positions, particularly on the kinds of issues—like civil liberties and free markets—where you can usually expect a prominent Libertarian to think clearly and take a position in line with a commitment to liberty. Because that’s kind of what the Libertarian Party exists for, right?

Yes, well, those of us who have followed the Libertarian Party over the years know they never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity. So it’s no surprise that Johnson and Weld are doing their best to drive us away—and they’re doing it by not even being good at being Libertarians.

Johnson badly flubbed a question about religious liberty, for the second time, coming out in favor the state’s right to coerce you into compliance with its notion of what your religious values ought to be. He wrapped up by declaring, “I just see religious freedom, as a category, as just being a black hole.” This sort of thing is Libertarianism 101, and Johnson just flunked it.

Then in the past few days, we got Weld sounding like a Massachusetts liberal on gun control (which he basically is), making hysterical claims about imaginary gun parts like “clips” and “pins” and calling the AR-15 a “weapon of mass destruction.”  ...
Read the rest at The Federalist
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Offline ABX

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Re: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2016, 08:21:26 pm »
I couldn't agree with this more. They had a real opportunity to work with natural allies on the Right and focus on limited government / maximum individual liberty and win a lot of voters there. Instead, they are pivoting to the left, focusing on Bernie voters. 

On a lot of Libertarian forums and pages I'm on, members are not happy with Gary Johnson. There actually is a Libertarian version of RINO and they are calling it. Many wanted him to pick Austin Petersen who by most accounts, a very Conservative Libertarian, but instead, Johnson chose to the left.

There are several main reasons why I probably will still vote for that ticket that I am working on writing up, but I won't spend time defending them or playing apologist on things I disagree over.

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Re: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« Reply #2 on: August 15, 2016, 08:37:31 pm »
If I shouldn't vote for Clinton or Trump because they're both too liberal, I sure as heck am not going to vote for the (arguably) equally liberal Johnson/Weld ticket, which isn't anywhere near being libertarian, in my book.
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Offline r9etb

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Re: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« Reply #3 on: August 15, 2016, 08:58:55 pm »
If I shouldn't vote for Clinton or Trump because they're both too liberal, I sure as heck am not going to vote for the (arguably) equally liberal Johnson/Weld ticket, which isn't anywhere near being libertarian, in my book.

While I agree with you on their politics, I've nevertheless been considering whether or not they'd be the best spot to lodge a protest vote... jury is still out, but they're at least an established party.

And, compared to Trump or Clinton.... they're preferable.

Offline ABX

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Re: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2016, 08:59:24 pm »
If I shouldn't vote for Clinton or Trump because they're both too liberal, I sure as heck am not going to vote for the (arguably) equally liberal Johnson/Weld ticket, which isn't anywhere near being libertarian, in my book.

I'm trying to find a good way to write this up, but the gist of my personal justification is on one hand, you have a set of authoritarian, big-government candidates in Hillary and Trump. On the other hand, you have the Libertarian ticket who, although wrong on many issues, stands for greatly reducing the size and scope of the government and putting control as local as possible, to the states or to the people. While I may not agree with every Libertarian issue, the general ideology moves us in a direction that strengthens those who believe in limited government. Compare that to Hillary and Trump who both, in their own ways, are just promising bigger and bigger government, more and more government, and less and less liberty.

Everyone has to make that decision on their own based on their own values, that's just my thought.

Offline ABX

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Re: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2016, 09:04:18 pm »
While I agree with you on their politics, I've nevertheless been considering whether or not they'd be the best spot to lodge a protest vote... jury is still out, but they're at least an established party.

And, compared to Trump or Clinton.... they're preferable.

The other way I look at it is to look at political parties like a business. The business of the RNC and DNC is to sell the product of votes for candidates. Like any business, there are naturally some customers who go back and forth, but if a business suddenly sees 15% or more of their business leave when they are used to 1%, they are going to see why those customers are leaving and adjust their business accordingly to stop losing customers. If third parties (be it Libertarian or Constitution) take a good bite out of the Republican voting block and fundraising (and this also applies to the Greens and DNC this year so it isn't a one sided bleed), it will make the party shift its focus back to the right (hopefully).

One other thing is if the third parties (all of them) can pull enough votes to prevent either major party candidate from getting 270 electoral votes (which is not out of the realm of possibility at all and has happened twice before), you get basically a big red reset button and the decision goes to the House (for the President) and the Senate (for the VP).. .then yo really get complicated but it does allow for a stop and breathe moment to reevaluate the situation based on changing factors (candidate's health, mental state, hacking revelations, foreign involvement revelations, etc)

Offline jmyrlefuller

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Re: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2016, 09:10:16 pm »
If I shouldn't vote for Clinton or Trump because they're both too liberal, I sure as heck am not going to vote for the (arguably) equally liberal Johnson/Weld ticket, which isn't anywhere near being libertarian, in my book.
The way I see it, Johnson and Weld are liberal, but comparatively benign. Trump and Clinton are liberal AND dangerous.
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Offline ABX

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Re: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2016, 09:13:54 pm »
The way I see it, Johnson and Weld are liberal, but comparatively benign. Trump and Clinton are liberal AND dangerous.

Trump and Clinton are big government activists.
Johnson is a liberal small government activist (ie, they won't use the federal government to force liberal causes but at the same time, they won't use the federal government to force Conservative causes)...

Which one would give you something closer to a Federalist Constitutional government? Which one would advance the causes of Conservatism in its truest sense, better in the long run?

Offline r9etb

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Re: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2016, 09:21:08 pm »
The other way I look at it is to look at political parties like a business. The business of the RNC and DNC is to sell the product of votes for candidates. Like any business, there are naturally some customers who go back and forth, but if a business suddenly sees 15% or more of their business leave when they are used to 1%, they are going to see why those customers are leaving and adjust their business accordingly to stop losing customers. If third parties (be it Libertarian or Constitution) take a good bite out of the Republican voting block and fundraising (and this also applies to the Greens and DNC this year so it isn't a one sided bleed), it will make the party shift its focus back to the right (hopefully).

One other thing is if the third parties (all of them) can pull enough votes to prevent either major party candidate from getting 270 electoral votes (which is not out of the realm of possibility at all and has happened twice before), you get basically a big red reset button and the decision goes to the House (for the President) and the Senate (for the VP).. .then yo really get complicated but it does allow for a stop and breathe moment to reevaluate the situation based on changing factors (candidate's health, mental state, hacking revelations, foreign involvement revelations, etc)

Maybe there's another way to look at it, too.  It's been quite a while since there's been a major party realignment -- maybe as far back as the replacement of the Whig Party by the Republicans.  There's obviously been some movement within and between the R's and D's since then, but it's been pretty static in terms of it being a two-party system.  The modern political system is essentially built on the existence of those two major parties. 

People in general identify as members of one or the other party, and that self-identification is very compelling for reasons that are often more emotional than rational.  To convince a person to move between parties is a big deal, but not terribly frightening. 

But to move from that stable two-party foundation to a different party -- that's very disconcerting, and even scary.  One must deal with a lot of uncertainty, and grapple with ideas that were not even in play with the two major parties, whose basic tenets have been long-established, if often honored in the breach.  It's damned frightening.  It took me a long time to work up to saying in public that I would not support the GOP candidate.

Now consider what happens in a year when there are two train-wreck candidates whose very nominations prove that the current parties are irretrievably broken.  This makes it easier for people to consider alternative political parties, and perhaps it begins the realignment process into a different set of viable political parties.  I've long wondered why a more centrist party hasn't emerged from the rubble that used to be inhabited by rational Democrats and moderate Republicans.  Maybe this is the year that realignment begins.

Offline JustPassinThru

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Re: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2016, 10:48:49 pm »
This was their Big Chance.

They did blow it.  Deliberately.

Because they don't want to win.  They're about Making A Statement; about showing how much smarter and above-it-all they are in voting for Principle.  Principles like open borders and legalization of all recreational drugs.

Obviously these are not serious people.  They don't want to win and in that regard, I'm in agreement.  I don't want such people to win, either.  Trump would have fit right in with them.

But they're not interested in doing anything but making noise and being a spectacle.

Offline dfwgator

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Re: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2016, 10:55:05 pm »
They should be called "The Contrarian Party."

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Re: Libertarians Are Blowing The Opportunity Of The Century
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2016, 12:25:26 am »
The way I see it, Johnson and Weld are liberal, but comparatively benign. Trump and Clinton are liberal AND dangerous.
Good comment - certainly food for thought.
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