NEW: Donald Trump Walks Back Tax Plan, Saying 'It's Going to Be Negotiated' (Tax Increases on Job Creators)

[Mechanicos]

Nice forum slide attempt. The issue was the fact that any tax changes will have to be negotiated since we are not an autocracy. So the claim he was walking back his stated goals of taxes was nothing more than dishonest #nevertrump agitprop.

[DCPatriot]

Nice forum slide attempt. The issue was the fact that any tax changes will have to be negotiated since we are not an autocracy. So the claim he was walking back his stated goals of taxes was nothing more than dishonest #nevertrump agitprop.

Really appreciate all your efforts here, @Mechanicos  !!

[Bigun]

I haven't seen this one trashed yet.  But he's going to have to explain how it will cut $10 trillion in revenues over ten years, but balance the budget and cut the debt.  With all of his other issues, his tax plan hasn't really come under much scrutiny yet.  One by one though, all of his promises and plans will start to be dissected, as will Hillary's.  Anti-Trump posters claim there's no difference between the two.  Well the tax plans certainly wouldn't bear that out.

He's already explained it!

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/07/us/politics/donald-trumps-idea-to-cut-national-debt-get-creditors-to-accept-less.html?smid=fb-share&_r=0

He is certifiably CRAZY!

[sinkspur]

Nice forum slide attempt. The issue was the fact that any tax changes will have to be negotiated since we are not an autocracy. So the claim he was walking back his stated goals of taxes was nothing more than dishonest #nevertrump agitprop.

Why is Trump already throwing out one of his chits?  He says taxes on the wealthy will have to go up.  I'm sure Chuck Schumer appreciates him giving that up before negotiations even begin.

[MACVSOG68]

He's already explained it!

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/07/us/politics/donald-trumps-idea-to-cut-national-debt-get-creditors-to-accept-less.html?smid=fb-share&_r=0

He is certifiably CRAZY!

He's obviously going to have to do better than that.  Some think strategic use of inflation might work, but either one of those would send our credit ratings and confidence in the dollar into the ditch.

[sinkspur]

I haven't seen this one trashed yet.  But he's going to have to explain how it will cut $10 trillion in revenues over ten years, but balance the budget and cut the debt.  With all of his other issues, his tax plan hasn't really come under much scrutiny yet.  One by one though, all of his promises and plans will start to be dissected, as will Hillary's.  Anti-Trump posters claim there's no difference between the two.  Well the tax plans certainly wouldn't bear that out.

Well, we know they'll both raise taxes on job creators, so there's that.

[montanajoe]

Really appreciate all your efforts here, @Mechanicos  !!

I really appreciate the ignore feature of this forum.....

[Mechanicos]

Why is Trump already throwing out one of his chits?  He says taxes on the wealthy will have to go up.  I'm sure Chuck Schumer appreciates him giving that up before negotiations even begin.

More #neverTrump Agitprop. Trump has always said he was going to make people like himself pay more. Specifically he mentioned hedge fund managers more than once.

Now some facts for the lo infos. The reason tax increase NEVER reach the super wealthy such as the ones funding and running #neverTrump is because all the tax increases are "income"  tax based. Yet, in the real world the same billionaires who run #neverTrump have very little "income" as their lobbyists have ensured the tax code defines it. The closest thing they have to "income" like you and me as far as the tax code goes is their petty cash funds.

Trump is after the Globalists, the ones who are outside of the tax increases they have been slamming us with. I have no problem with liberal billionaires like the ones funding #neverTrump and their agitprop articles/fake polls having to pay the same rates as I do no matter how they structure their wealth increases. 

[Leto]

Ok tired of this, Have none of you ever done a negotiation? Its not walking back anything. You get nothing with hard line refusal to negotiate unless you are Obama and dealing with Republicans. The question is what is it he wants and what can be given away. You assume its the core principles he has stated without any evidence.

As usual this talking point is a #neverTrump nothing burger.

Negotiation 101 is not negotiating against yourself publicly against yourself. Why negotate against yourself if you have a pub majority in the House and Senate and dem can't filibuster spending bills?

Stupid IMHO.

[Mechanicos]

Negotiation 101 is not negotiating against yourself publicly against yourself. Why negotate against yourself if you have a pub majority in the House and Senate and dem can't filibuster spending bills?

Stupid IMHO.

He did not negotiate against himself. Only the uninformed did not know he has been saying the same thing for months at his rallies. It falls under fairness. The Super Rich such as those funding the #neverTrump agenda do not pay taxes like us peosn since their lobbyists ensure the definition of "income" favors the wealth making vehicles they use. He mentioned hedge fund mangers before who escape being taxed like we do because of the tax code loopholes they had inserted in it.

[BuckeyeTexan]

"On my plan, they're going down. But by the time it's negotiated, they'll go up," Trump said.

I fear that will be the case with all of Trump's plans. We'll get the exact opposite of what he proposed.

[Mechanicos]

Fair enough.  Then why did he put forth a tax plan on his website that would lower the top rate from 38% to 25% if he didn't think it was fair, and didn't intend on doing it??

Top tax rate refers to "income" tax. The issue is whose wealth creation falls under that tax. So he can drop the rate yet still bring in more tax revenue from the super rich by expanding what falls under the term of art "income." Right now people like William Bennett were paying "income" tax rates lower then some of their employees even with much greater wealth creation going on.

A theme I see throughout Trump's positions is straight out of "the Wealth of Nations" - increase the pie's size. 

[sinkspur]

Top tax rate refers to "income" tax. The issue is whose wealth creation falls under that tax. So he can drop the rate yet still bring in more tax revenue from the super rich by expanding what falls under the term of art "income." Right now people like William Bennett were paying "income" tax rates lower then some of their employees even with much greater wealth creation going on.

A theme I see throughout Trump's positions is straight out of "the Wealth of Nations" - increase the pie's size.

By raising taxes on small businessmen and entreprenuers, Trump is killing their ability to create jobs.   How does that increase the pie's size?

[Bigun]

The vast majority of the wealthy pay taxes at a higher effective rate than the not wealthy.  The contrary belief is just populist spin.  And in the interview, Trump was talking about the actual nominal rates, and he said they'd go up.

He's directly contradicting his own written tax plan.

Unless you are wealthy enough to be able to arrange your affairs in such a way that you have very little or no "Income"!

[MACVSOG68]

Well, we know they'll both raise taxes on job creators, so there's that.

Not according to one of the two plans, but that could change.  What I want to see is the realistic details of a balanced budget as a start.  If we are going to spend $4 trillion a year, we should collect $4 trillion in taxes to pay for it.  And if we cut a trillion a year in taxes, then I want to see the actual plan of cutting spending by that much.  None of the candidates have done that to date...on either side of the aisle.  The devil is always in the details.

[Mechanicos]

By raising taxes on small businessmen and entreprenuers, Trump is killing their ability to create jobs.   How does that increase the pie's size?

Going from raising taxes on people like himself to claiming its going after the middle class is #neverTrump disingenuous agitprop. When you have to ADD to it spin it and massage it its not going to fly.

[BigHomer]

Unless you are wealthy enough to be able to arrange your affairs in such a way that you have very little or no "Income"!

If you think things were bad under Obama, wait until, God forbid, Trump becomes president. He'll rack up debt at a pace that will make Obama look comparatively conservative.

[andy58-in-nh]

Going from raising taxes on people like himself to claiming its going after the middle class is #neverTrump disingenuous agitprop. When you have to ADD to it spin it and massage it its not going to fly.

Except that it is nothing of the kind. 90% of new jobs are created by small businesses, composed of middle class people whose incomes are artificially inflated by the fact that they file their taxes as individuals under IRC subchapter "S". Many of the top 1% of taxpayers are not truly rich, if one excludes their business income. The truly wealthy most frequently do not report much earned income, but instead receive their wealth through passive sources such as insurance, charitable and investment trusts.

In any event, punishing the wealthy does nothing to create opportunities for those who are not. Only Progressive Liberals think that way.

The Donald could raise the top income tax rate to 90% and it wouldn't hurt him a bit.  Only striving entrepreneurs would get stung, and why not? He hates competition.

[geronl]

The Donald could raise the top income tax rate to 90% and it wouldn't hurt him a bit.  Only striving entrepreneurs would get stung, and why not? He hates competition.

exactly

[DCPatriot]

I really appreciate the ignore feature of this forum.....

Ah...but other respected members engage him, so you'll see his posts in any event.

Furthermore, it's not like his forte is posting juvenile sophomoric animated memes, so why ignore him?   

Don't want to see an opposing POV?

[sinkspur]

Ah...but other respected members engage him, so you'll see his posts in any event.

Furthermore, it's not like his forte is posting juvenile sophomoric animated memes, so why ignore him?   

Don't want to see an opposing POV?

An opposing POV argued rationally is one thing.  An opposing POV that one has to have translated........

[kevindavis007]

Going from raising taxes on people like himself to claiming its going after the middle class is #neverTrump disingenuous agitprop. When you have to ADD to it spin it and massage it its not going to fly.

You have to realize raising taxes on the wealthy is a liberal position not a conservative position.

[Bigun]

Except that it is nothing of the kind. 90% of new jobs are created by small businesses, composed of middle class people whose incomes are artificially inflated by the fact that they file their taxes as individuals under IRC subchapter "S". Many of the top 1% of taxpayers are not truly rich, if one excludes their business income. The truly wealthy most frequently do not report much earned income, but instead receive their wealth through passive sources such as insurance, charitable and investment trusts.

In any event, punishing the wealthy does nothing to create opportunities for those who are not. Only Progressive Liberals think that way.

The Donald could raise the top income tax rate to 90% and it wouldn't hurt him a bit.  Only striving entrepreneurs would get stung, and why not? He hates competition.

Thank God there are others here who understand this!  RIGHT ON!!!

[kik5150]

Trump has no core principles, hence everything is negotiable.

[GrouchoTex]

Going from raising taxes on people like himself to claiming its going after the middle class is #neverTrump disingenuous agitprop. When you have to ADD to it spin it and massage it its not going to fly.

Everyone knows that business  do not "pay" taxes, they "collect" taxes.
The higher the tax, the higher the cost of the products they sell, and the less likely it is they expand and hire more people, buy new equipment, etc.
Taxing the big corporation at a high rate will never work out.
It never has and it never will.
while not directly raising taxes on the middle class, it has the same effect, because they have to pay more for the goods and services they buy from the "rich".
Guys, this is basic conservative/ Milton Freidman economics.