Author Topic: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith  (Read 1531 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online mystery-ak

  • Owner
  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Posts: 384,318
  • Let's Go Brandon!
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/19/us/politics/evangelicals-see-donald-trump-as-man-of-conviction-if-not-faith.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=second-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=1

Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith

By MAGGIE HABERMAN and THOMAS KAPLANJAN. 18, 2016


Buford Arning, a retired building-supply executive in Statesville, N.C., went to church each week until a pinched nerve made it hard for him to leave his house. He believes in living a faith-filled life. But he does not demand piety of his preferred presidential candidate, Donald J. Trump.

“Am I a Bible toter that gets out and preaches on the side of the street and tries to convert everybody? No,” said Mr. Arning, 62, who calls himself an evangelical voter. He said he believed that Mr. Trump was “a Christian man,” and that was good enough.

Mr. Trump may not be as spiritually minded as former Gov. Mike Huckabee of Arkansas, who was a Baptist minister, “but I think his values are very much the same,” Mr. Arning said.

“His personal life is saintlike compared to Bill Clinton’s,” he added.

continued
Proud Supporter of Tunnel to Towers
Support the USO
Democrat Party...the Party of Infanticide

“Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.”
-Matthew 6:34

Offline musiclady

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 22,682
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2016, 12:41:28 am »
Yep.  Our standard of behavior is to be better than Bill Clinton.

Yep.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline libertybele

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 57,778
  • Gender: Female
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2016, 12:49:50 am »
Yep.  Our standard of behavior is to be better than Bill Clinton.

Yep.

 :beer:  IMHO it seems that the moral decay of our society started on a downward trend with Bill's indiscretions and our Congress giving him a free pass with no consequences for his actions. 
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Offline musiclady

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 22,682
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2016, 12:53:39 am »
:beer:  IMHO it seems that the moral decay of our society started on a downward trend with Bill's indiscretions and our Congress giving him a free pass with no consequences for his actions.

It absolutely did.  Even though some argue that Bill Clinton's behavior reflected our cultural decline rather than led the decline, what happened with his acquittal was that illicit affairs and betrayal of one's spouse became a sanctioned behavior, and those opposing it subjected to ridicule.

That's why there is blind support of Trump in spite of his marital infidelity.  The bar has been lowered so far that it's no big deal any more.

Even to those who call themselves 'evangelical' Christians.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline alicewonders

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13,021
  • Gender: Female
  • Live life-it's too short to butt heads w buttheads
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #4 on: January 19, 2016, 12:55:46 am »
That's interesting and unexpected - and from the NYT no less. 

Don't tread on me.   8888madkitty

We told you Trump would win - bigly!

Offline Sanguine

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 35,986
  • Gender: Female
  • Ex-member
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2016, 02:00:05 am »
That's interesting and unexpected - and from the NYT no less.

And, what does that tell us?   

 :pondering:

Online mountaineer

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 79,252
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #6 on: January 19, 2016, 02:06:21 am »
Of course the couple of Christians to whom the NYT spoke certainly must represent the views of all of us (we're so monolithic,  you know).
Support Israel's emergency medical service. afmda.org

Offline truth_seeker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 28,386
  • Gender: Male
  • Common Sense Results Oriented Conservative Veteran
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2016, 02:19:03 am »
:beer:  IMHO it seems that the moral decay of our society started on a downward trend with Bill's indiscretions and our Congress giving him a free pass with no consequences for his actions.
Baloney. It started with bare ankles, dancing, moving pictures, end of Prohibition.
"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

Offline ABX

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 900
  • Words full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2016, 02:22:23 am »
Of course we do. Our DonaldTM was sent by God himself to raise us out of a thousand years of darkness and usher in a new revival. It will be a great revival, it will be huge. God deemed The Art of the Deal the second most important book after the Bible for a reason. I mean, the Bible is great, but The Art of the Deal is so much more relevant today. Like it says in Two Genesis 89:700, 'a golden-haired calf will lead them out of darkness and they will never want again, for they will be full of Trump Water and Trump Steaks....' - Amen


Offline truth_seeker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 28,386
  • Gender: Male
  • Common Sense Results Oriented Conservative Veteran
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2016, 02:32:43 am »
Ted Cruz's Father Suggested His Son Is 'Anointed' to Bring About 'End Time Transfer of Wealth'

http://www.alternet.org/speakeasy/brucewilson/ted-cruzs-father-suggested-his-son-anointed-bring-about-end-time-transfer

October 17, 2013

In a sermon last year at an Irving, Texas, megachurch that helped elect Ted Cruz to the United States Senate, Cruz' father Rafael Cruz indicated that his son was among the evangelical Christians who are anointed as "kings" to take control of all sectors of society, an agenda commonly referred to as the "Seven Mountains" mandate, and "bring the spoils of war to the priests", thus helping to bring about a prophesied "great transfer of wealth", from the "wicked" to righteous gentile believers. link to video of Rafael Cruz describing the "great transfer of wealth" and the role of anointed "kings" in various sectors of society, including government, who are to "bring the spoils of war to the priests".

Rafael Cruz' dominionist sermon given August 26, 2012, at the New Beginnings Church of pastor Larry Huch, in Irving, Texas has already received considerable scrutiny due to an excellent Huffington Post commentary by Methodist Associate Pastor Morgan Guyton, who noted the explicitly dominionist nature of pastor Cruz' sermon, which concerned the divine mandate for believers, with anointing of "kings" in their respective spheres, to take control over all sectors of society.

Cruz spoke of "Kings who are anointed to go to war, win the war, and bring the spoils of war to the priests."

Discussion of the now-notorious speech by Rafael Cruz has missed the fact that Ted Cruz was subsequently blessed and anointed by prominent dominionist pastors, in effect as a "king" in the political/governmental sphere, at a special blessing ceremony at the Marriott Hotel in Des Moines, Iowa, at a July 19th-20th 2013 rally designed to draw pastors into politics.

But in a very real, mundane sense Ted Cruz has already helped deliver hundreds of millions of dollars, or more, to the evangelical right. Cruz' past service - as a "king" who brought "spoils to the priests" - is a matter of established record; as I revealed in a prior story, no less than a top adviser to President George W. Bush has stated that in 1999 Ted Cruz played a major role in helping the Bush for President campaign lock down the conservative evangelical vote in the 2000 election.

One can interpret the "great transfer of wealth" -- predicted by Ted Cruz' father Rafael Cruz, and by Pastor Larry Huch, who threw his Texas megachurch's considerable heft behind the 2012 Cruz for Senate campaign -- in magical terms, sure.

But Ted Cruz' apparently notable role in getting George W. Bush into the presidency led in turn to Bush's "Faith Based Initiative" - that continues to this day under two successive Obama administrations and which, during the Bush years, funneled billions of dollars to churches and institutions associated with the religious right.

In other words, the "great transfer of wealth" is about more than wishful thinking. It's about an ongoing effort, by leaders and institutions of the evangelical right, to gradually gobble up the secular sphere of government.

Thus, for example, fast growing Christian schools such as the late Moral Majority co-founder Jerry Falwell's Liberty University, which now vacuums up hundreds of millions of dollars in federal student aid money each year. Or the hundreds of millions of diverted tax dollars now flowing, in a least 12 U.S. states, under so-called "neo-voucher" schemes, to private schools - many of which, as explored in a new Rolling Stone story, have virulently anti-LGBT policies. Under Bush, too, several billion dollars per year in USAID funding were shifted from secular aid nonprofits to religious ones, some them holding anti-gay and reactionary, even theocratic, underlying ideology.

I could go on at length about this dreary subject, which involves major shifts in government social service funding streams. But instead, let's turn now to the "kings for dominion":

In his August 26th, 2012 guest sermon at Larry Huch's Irving, TX megachurch, U.S. Senator Ted Cruz' father Rafael Cruz, in what was not the first of his guest appearances at the church, explained,

"The pastor [Huch] referred to Proverbs 13:22, a little while ago, which says that the wealth of the wicked is stored for the righteous. And it is through the kings, anointed to take dominion, that that transfer of wealth is going to occur. God, even though he's sovereign, even though he's omnipotent, he doesn't let it rain out of the sky - he's going to use people to do it."

Introducing pastor Cruz, in the context that it would soon be Rosh Hashanah, which would ring in the Jewish New Year of 2012, Larry Huch had stated, invoking dominionist numerology,

"The number 12 means 'divine government', that God begins to rule and reign. Not Wall Street, not Washington - God's people and his kingdom will begin to rule and reign"
"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

Offline Sanguine

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 35,986
  • Gender: Female
  • Ex-member
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #10 on: January 19, 2016, 02:42:04 am »
Ted Cruz's Father Suggested His Son Is 'Anointed' to Bring About 'End Time Transfer of Wealth'

http://www.alternet.org/speakeasy/brucewilson/ted-cruzs-father-suggested-his-son-anointed-bring-about-end-time-transfer

October 17, 2013

In a sermon last year at an Irving, Texas, megachurch that helped elect Ted Cruz to the United States Senate, Cruz' father Rafael Cruz indicated that his son was among the evangelical Christians who are anointed as "kings" to take control of all sectors of society, an agenda commonly referred to as the "Seven Mountains" mandate, and "bring the spoils of war to the priests", thus helping to bring about a prophesied "great transfer of wealth", from the "wicked" to righteous gentile believers. link to video of Rafael Cruz describing the "great transfer of wealth" and the role of anointed "kings" in various sectors of society, including government, who are to "bring the spoils of war to the priests".

Rafael Cruz' dominionist sermon given August 26, 2012, at the New Beginnings Church of pastor Larry Huch, in Irving, Texas has already received considerable scrutiny due to an excellent Huffington Post commentary by Methodist Associate Pastor Morgan Guyton, who noted the explicitly dominionist nature of pastor Cruz' sermon, which concerned the divine mandate for believers, with anointing of "kings" in their respective spheres, to take control over all sectors of society.

Cruz spoke of "Kings who are anointed to go to war, win the war, and bring the spoils of war to the priests."

Discussion of the now-notorious speech by Rafael Cruz has missed the fact that Ted Cruz was subsequently blessed and anointed by prominent dominionist pastors, in effect as a "king" in the political/governmental sphere, at a special blessing ceremony at the Marriott Hotel in Des Moines, Iowa, at a July 19th-20th 2013 rally designed to draw pastors into politics.

But in a very real, mundane sense Ted Cruz has already helped deliver hundreds of millions of dollars, or more, to the evangelical right. Cruz' past service - as a "king" who brought "spoils to the priests" - is a matter of established record; as I revealed in a prior story, no less than a top adviser to President George W. Bush has stated that in 1999 Ted Cruz played a major role in helping the Bush for President campaign lock down the conservative evangelical vote in the 2000 election.

One can interpret the "great transfer of wealth" -- predicted by Ted Cruz' father Rafael Cruz, and by Pastor Larry Huch, who threw his Texas megachurch's considerable heft behind the 2012 Cruz for Senate campaign -- in magical terms, sure.

But Ted Cruz' apparently notable role in getting George W. Bush into the presidency led in turn to Bush's "Faith Based Initiative" - that continues to this day under two successive Obama administrations and which, during the Bush years, funneled billions of dollars to churches and institutions associated with the religious right.

In other words, the "great transfer of wealth" is about more than wishful thinking. It's about an ongoing effort, by leaders and institutions of the evangelical right, to gradually gobble up the secular sphere of government.

Thus, for example, fast growing Christian schools such as the late Moral Majority co-founder Jerry Falwell's Liberty University, which now vacuums up hundreds of millions of dollars in federal student aid money each year. Or the hundreds of millions of diverted tax dollars now flowing, in a least 12 U.S. states, under so-called "neo-voucher" schemes, to private schools - many of which, as explored in a new Rolling Stone story, have virulently anti-LGBT policies. Under Bush, too, several billion dollars per year in USAID funding were shifted from secular aid nonprofits to religious ones, some them holding anti-gay and reactionary, even theocratic, underlying ideology.

I could go on at length about this dreary subject, which involves major shifts in government social service funding streams. But instead, let's turn now to the "kings for dominion":

In his August 26th, 2012 guest sermon at Larry Huch's Irving, TX megachurch, U.S. Senator Ted Cruz' father Rafael Cruz, in what was not the first of his guest appearances at the church, explained,

"The pastor [Huch] referred to Proverbs 13:22, a little while ago, which says that the wealth of the wicked is stored for the righteous. And it is through the kings, anointed to take dominion, that that transfer of wealth is going to occur. God, even though he's sovereign, even though he's omnipotent, he doesn't let it rain out of the sky - he's going to use people to do it."

Introducing pastor Cruz, in the context that it would soon be Rosh Hashanah, which would ring in the Jewish New Year of 2012, Larry Huch had stated, invoking dominionist numerology,

"The number 12 means 'divine government', that God begins to rule and reign. Not Wall Street, not Washington - God's people and his kingdom will begin to rule and reign"

Ummm, yes, Cruz Sr. is a preacher.  He actually believes in all that "God stuff".  What's your point?

Offline truth_seeker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 28,386
  • Gender: Male
  • Common Sense Results Oriented Conservative Veteran
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2016, 02:48:39 am »
Ummm, yes, Cruz Sr. is a preacher.  He actually believes in all that "God stuff".  What's your point?

I merely posted an article, which is informative as to the religious beliefs of the Cruz family.

Anointed as "Kings"

End of Times Transfer of Wealth

Do you have any substantive remarks about the article, or just about me for posting it?
"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

Online mountaineer

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 79,252
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2016, 03:21:34 am »
Good points, RP, and welcome to GBR!  :patriot:
Support Israel's emergency medical service. afmda.org

Offline musiclady

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 22,682
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #13 on: January 19, 2016, 03:23:39 am »
Your informative article is a clear effort to smear the Cruz family.  Frankly, the religious beliefs of Cruz's father are irrelevant.  Trump's lack of being a born again Christian is also irrelevant.  How about we focus on the Constitutional beliefs of the candidates?

Ted Cruz understands the overreach of the federal courts.  He has spoken against it and offered solutions.  He has argued cases in front of the Supreme Court.  He has a far better understanding of the Constitution than does Trump.  Trump thinks we the people must submit to the judicial tyranny.  Cruz wants to fight it.

As for issues that affect Christians:  Cruz supported Kim Davis.  Trump did not.  Cruz speaks constantly about religious freedom, condemning the oppressive actions of the left in every case -- the bakers in Oregon, the wedding chapel people in New York, Kim Davis, etc..  Trump promises to promote the words "Merry Christmas."  He says "bad things are happening," but he offers no details.  Trump offers emotion.  Cruz offers solutions.  There is no comparison in the two when it comes to understanding the original intent of the Constitution and how to restore it from the liberal overreach of the past decades.

Trump can say he will do all sorts of things.  If the liberal judges decide to overrule him, then what?  He needs to stick to what he knows:  Casinos, Hotels, beauty pageants.

Some evangelicals may be so troubled by the loss of the term "Merry Christmas" that they can see nothing else.  I suspect most are a little bit smarter than that.

 goopo

No............. on second thought, GREAT posting!

And WELCOME!   :patriot:
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline alicewonders

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13,021
  • Gender: Female
  • Live life-it's too short to butt heads w buttheads
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #14 on: January 19, 2016, 03:26:36 am »
Yes, welcome to The Briefing Room, RAT Patrol.  I look forward to reading your postings - you're off to a great start!

 0005a

Don't tread on me.   8888madkitty

We told you Trump would win - bigly!

Offline truth_seeker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 28,386
  • Gender: Male
  • Common Sense Results Oriented Conservative Veteran
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #15 on: January 19, 2016, 06:16:34 am »
Your informative article is a clear effort to smear the Cruz family.  Frankly, the religious beliefs of Cruz's father are irrelevant. 

To the extend the father's religious beliefs are shared with the candidate himself, they are relevant to me.

Dominion Theology

Dominion Theology is a theocratic ideology that seeks to implement a nation governed by conservative Christians ruling over the rest of society based on their understanding of biblical law. Dominion Theology is related to theonomy, though it does not necessarily advocate Mosaic law as the basis of government.

Prominent adherents of Dominion Theology are otherwise theologically diverse, including the Calvinist Christian Reconstructionism and the charismatic/Pentecostal Kingdom Now theology and New Apostolic Reformation.

The term Dominion Theology is applied primarily among non-mainstream Protestants in the United States. Some elements within the mainstream Christian right have been influenced by Dominion Theology authors. Indeed, some writers have applied the term "Dominionism" more broadly to the mainstream Christian right, implicitly arguing that that movement is founded upon aMainstream conservatives do not call themselves "Dominionists," and the usage has sparked considerable controversy. theology that requires Christians to govern over non-Christians.

snip

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominion_Theology

"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

HAPPY2BME

  • Guest
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #16 on: January 19, 2016, 07:03:10 am »
Here we go again ..

Online mountaineer

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 79,252
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #17 on: January 19, 2016, 12:08:32 pm »
To the extend the father's religious beliefs are shared with the candidate himself, they are relevant to me.
Please provide evidence that the younger Cruz does share his father's beliefs, and to what extent he does so.
Support Israel's emergency medical service. afmda.org

Offline ABX

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 900
  • Words full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #18 on: January 19, 2016, 03:10:00 pm »
Quote
Your informative article is a clear effort to smear the Cruz family.....

Hi RP and welcome to the site.  Just to note, these articles are not 'our' articles. Articles for and against many candidates are posted for the sake of discussion. We don't hide articles if they don't paint the picture we want, at that, articles that oppose what we believe or we see as attacks are often more discussed. This site is like a launching pad to discuss the articles and issues, learn more, and then take it to the outside world in your personal activism.

Offline libertybele

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 57,778
  • Gender: Female
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #19 on: January 19, 2016, 03:57:27 pm »
Cruz's record speaks for itself period.  Cruz introduced and was able to get amendments passed to the National Defense Authorization act in 2013 and in 2014; increasing the protection of religious liberty in the military and to protect chaplains.  He stood before a crowd and proclaimed "Those who hate Israel hate America.  And those who hate Jews hate Christians"...He was booed and further proclaimed "If you hate the Jewish people," your are not reflecting the teachings of Christ....the disdain from the audience was so bad that Cruz simply said... If you will not stand with Israel, that I will not stand with you.  God Bless you and good night" and he walked off the stage.

If that doesn't demonstrate Cruz's belief in religious freedom and his core religious beliefs and an unwillingness to back down from them, I don't know what does. 

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/09/10/ted-cruz-booed-off-stage-at-event-for-middle-eastern-christians-if-you-will-not-stand-with-israel-and-the-jews-i-will-not-stand-with-you/
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Offline EC

  • Shanghaied Editor
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23,804
  • Gender: Male
  • Cats rule. Dogs drool.
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #20 on: January 19, 2016, 04:17:54 pm »
It's cool - and agreed, welcome in!

As far as the recent kerfuffle with articles about Donnie and his faith - who cares?

Not me. Every candidate's relationship with God is, well, between them and God, so I leave that stuff to Him. I am looking for a President and CinC, not a Pope. In fact, attacks on Trump's faith (or lack of it) make me slightly more sympathetic to him. I think, Jeez, is THAT all they got?
The universe doesn't hate you. Unless your name is Tsutomu Yamaguchi

Avatar courtesy of Oceander

I've got a website now: Smoke and Ink

HAPPY2BME

  • Guest
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #21 on: January 19, 2016, 04:36:12 pm »
It's cool - and agreed, welcome in!

As far as the recent kerfuffle with articles about Donnie and his faith - who cares?

Not me. Every candidate's relationship with God is, well, between them and God, so I leave that stuff to Him. I am looking for a President and CinC, not a Pope. In fact, attacks on Trump's faith (or lack of it) make me slightly more sympathetic to him. I think, Jeez, is THAT all they got?

====================================================

Mixing religion with politics is like mixing gasoline with nitro glycerine - they both go BOOM in a big, big way.

Look at the Democrats.  They are quite a bit smarter than the Republicans.  They don't lose votes by pissing off people over religion.

Don't get me wrong, the Dems are a vile, baseless, reprobate to the core bunch of perverts (especially the ones we see on TV and who run for office).

The Republicans as late as ten years ago held the high moral ground over the Dems, but today one has to look really, really hard to tell the difference.

Squeezing out a few million more votes by invoking the Name of Jesus Christ has worked quite well for the Republicans over the past 150 years, but that pitch has ended - that dog won't bark anymore.

'Christians' have been burned so badly by the Republican party they now have to wear fire-retardant clothing at GOP gatherings, and especially when somebody gets up and invokes 'The Name of The Lord' for the Republican Party Battle Cry.  Those days are gone - vanished - kaput - fini - over - toast - HISTORY.  'Christians' just aren't going to drink that same kool aid anymore.

 

Offline alicewonders

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13,021
  • Gender: Female
  • Live life-it's too short to butt heads w buttheads
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #22 on: January 19, 2016, 04:56:05 pm »
I'll say first that I am a Christian. 

Frankly, if someone wears their religion on their sleeve (not pointing to anyone specificially here) or uses their religion to gain people's trust or money - then they have blown it with me.  I agree that Rafael Cruz's religious views have nothing to do with Ted just like my father's views don't have anything to do with me.

However, I did find it an interesting read and I appreciate it being posted.  I have never heard of Seven Mountains and Dominion Theology before. 

Something else I'd like to add here, came to me the other day when I read a comment somewhere on the internet - when Trump was saying that not very many evangelicals come from Cuba.  Of course, everyone jumped on that as he was criticizing Cruz's father.  I don't think it was criticism at all now that I think about it.

Do think about it.  It is very true that not many evangelicals come out of Cuba - any that are there are probably rotting in prison or long dead.  Kind of like Iran.  So, I think Trump was, as is his public speaking style, verbalizing his stream of thought. 

   
Don't tread on me.   8888madkitty

We told you Trump would win - bigly!

Offline truth_seeker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 28,386
  • Gender: Male
  • Common Sense Results Oriented Conservative Veteran
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #23 on: January 19, 2016, 05:06:19 pm »
I am not smearing anybody. I am posting material which the electorate will have access to, for their own use to evaluate Cruz and other candidates.

He is doing great in Iowa, but Iowa voted for Obama twice, so gaining favor with deeply religious Republicans in Iowa seems to get a candidate nothing in the end.

Rev. Huckabee and Father Santorum can attest to that.

My opinion is that Cruz is TOO RELIGIOUS to win the general election. His father and his fringe denomination will enter the discussion.

Ted Cruz uses faith freely on campaign trail

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2015/12/10/ted-cruz-religion-2016-evangelicals/76945128/

"Cruz’s biggest financial backer — the Wilks family of Texas — is also deeply religious. Farris and Dan Wilks became billionaires during Texas' fracking boom and have donated millions of dollars over the years to religious and conservative non-profit groups. Farris Wilks is also a pastor who leads the Assembly of Yahweh 7th Day Church in Cisco, Texas, which preaches a mix of Christianity and Judaism, believes in a strict adherence to the Bible and considers homosexuality to be a serious crime."

"Religion is playing a bigger role than ever in this year's presidential campaigns and Cruz, from the day he announced his candidacy at the Jerry Falwell-founded Liberty University, is leading the pack, said Barry Lynn, executive director of Americans United for Separation of Church and State, which is critical of candidates mixing politics and faith.

A tipping point, Lynn said, came at last month’s National Religious Liberties Conference in Iowa, where Cruz said, “any president who doesn’t begin every day on his knees isn’t fit to be a commander-in-chief of this country.” Cruz was also introduced onstage by Pastor Kevin Swanson, who, earlier in the conference, quoted a passage of the Bible that he claimed justified the execution of homosexuals.

“This is over-the-top rhetoric, even for a conservative presidential candidate,” Lynn said. “There is a lot of religious fervor going on in [Cruz's] campaign.”

Tyler, the Cruz spokesman, called Swanson’s comments “reprehensible” and said Cruz has spoken out repeatedly against anyone who calls for hatred or violence against homosexuals.

“Senator Cruz is passionate about religious liberties” Tyler said in an email. “Many respected organizations were sponsoring [the conference], but, given these offensive comments, it was a mistake for Senator Cruz to appear at the event.”"
"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

HAPPY2BME

  • Guest
Re: Evangelicals See Donald Trump as Man of Conviction, if Not Faith
« Reply #24 on: January 19, 2016, 05:15:06 pm »
I am not smearing anybody. I am posting material which the electorate will have access to, for their own use to evaluate Cruz and other candidates.

He is doing great in Iowa, but Iowa voted for Obama twice, so gaining favor with deeply religious Republicans in Iowa seems to get a candidate nothing in the end.

Rev. Huckabee and Father Santorum can attest to that.

My opinion is that Cruz is TOO RELIGIOUS to win the general election. His father and his fringe denomination will enter the discussion.

===============================================

This country is more secular than any other time in it's history, and playing the 'faith card' in these immoral waters is like asking for a ski boat to run right over you while you are drowning.

The GOP can drown in three inches of water, easily.