Author Topic: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China  (Read 72701 times)

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Oceander

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #325 on: March 13, 2014, 03:57:41 am »
we should know soon enough; Malaysia has said it's sent aircraft to the area spotted by the Chinese

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #326 on: March 13, 2014, 04:03:36 am »
David Gallo who was part of the Air France search, said a couple of interesting things:

1) how did they miss something this large with the initial aerial search

2) if this is it it makes sense because it is so near the last known position  - for instance Air France was found near the last known position

3) he said the size is awfully large, Air France's largest wreckage was the size of a desk.

Actually they found the entire vertical fin of AF447.  On the A330, it is made of composites where as on the 777 is it mostly aluminum.  Composites float.
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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #327 on: March 13, 2014, 04:08:42 am »
Actually they found the entire vertical fin of AF447.  On the A330, it is made of composites where as on the 777 is it mostly aluminum.  Composites float.

 :shrug: :shrug: just reporting what the co-leader of the AF search team just said on CNN..   maybe he was speaking of a very large desk... :shrug:  remember it took them two years to find the wreckage of AF.

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David Gallo, an oceanographer with the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution in the US, was part of the team that found Air France flight 447.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2014, 04:09:46 am by Rapunzel »
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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #328 on: March 13, 2014, 04:10:16 am »
The area where this plane is presumed down is shallower than the plane is long.... per David Gallo
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Oceander

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #329 on: March 13, 2014, 04:14:47 am »
The area where this plane is presumed down is shallower than the plane is long.... per David Gallo

The plane is 64 meters long; that's about 210 feet.  Even 150 feet of water is pretty deep.

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #330 on: March 13, 2014, 04:16:16 am »
The plane is 64 meters long; that's about 210 feet.  Even 150 feet of water is pretty deep.

Someone said on Fox it is around 170 feet.  Pretty shallow compared to Air France - I thought is was 10,000 feet, but some of it was actually at 13,000 feet.  For someone like Woods Hole 170 feet would be a piece of cake.
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Oceander

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #331 on: March 13, 2014, 04:20:50 am »
Someone said on Fox it is around 170 feet.  Pretty shallow compared to Air France - I thought is was 10,000 feet, but some of it was actually at 13,000 feet.  For someone like Woods Hole 170 feet would be a piece of cake.

The problem is finding it first; if it's in the western part of the south china sea - where they've been searching and where that debris the Chinese spotted is - then it should be comparatively easy to bring up the wreckage since that part of the SCS is very shallow (avg depth is about 60m).

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #332 on: March 13, 2014, 04:36:32 am »
:shrug: :shrug: just reporting what the co-leader of the AF search team just said on CNN..   maybe he was speaking of a very large desk... :shrug:  remember it took them two years to find the wreckage of AF.

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David Gallo, an oceanographer with the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution in the US, was part of the team that found Air France flight 447.

They found the floating debris very quickly including the aforementioned fin.



It was all the sunken debris, including both data recorders, which took up to 2 years to recover because it wasn't where they thought it would be.
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Oceander

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #333 on: March 13, 2014, 04:38:22 am »
any further word on the malaysian aircraft that were supposed to be checking out what the chinese say they've spotted?

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #334 on: March 13, 2014, 04:44:51 am »
any further word on the malaysian aircraft that were supposed to be checking out what the chinese say they've spotted?

Nothing yet and I've been watching most of the aviation sites for updates.  There is a ~12 hour time difference so it is daylight there right now.  Even if the aircraft are on site, finding something, which compared to the ocean is very small, is difficult at best.  And even if it is spotted from the air, unless it says "Malaysia Airlines" on the side or is clearly painted in their color scheme, it will probably need a ship going out there so the item(s) can be retrieved for proper identification.
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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #335 on: March 13, 2014, 06:16:46 am »
Quote
VIDEO: Chinese ridicule Malaysia's recruitment of 'witch doctor' to track missing plane | South China Morning Post
http://www.scmp.com/news/china/article/1447159/video-chinese-ridicule-malaysias-recruitment-witch-doctor-track-missing

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Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #336 on: March 13, 2014, 12:29:37 pm »
http://m.us.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702304914904579434653903086282?mobile=y


March 13, 2014 4:17 AM
U.S. Investigators Suspect Missing Airplane Flew On for Hours
Engine Data Suggest Malaysia Flight Was Airborne Long After Radar Disappearance



     By
    Andy Pasztor

U.S. investigators suspect that Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 stayed in the air for about four hours past the time it reached its last confirmed location, according to two people familiar with the details, raising the possibility that the plane could have flown on for hundreds of additional miles under conditions that remain murky.

Aviation investigators and national security officials believe the plane flew for a total of five hours, based on data automatically downloaded and sent to the ground from the Boeing Co. 777's engines as part of a routine maintenance and monitoring program.

That raises a host of new questions and possibilities about what happened aboard the widebody jet carrying 239 people, which vanished from civilian air-traffic control radar over the weekend, about one hour into a flight to Beijing from Kuala Lumpur.

Six days after the mysterious disappearance prompted a massive international air and water search that so far hasn't produced any results, the investigation appears to be broadening in scope.

U.S. counterterrorism officials are pursuing the possibility that a pilot or someone else on board the plane may have diverted it toward an undisclosed location after intentionally turning off the jetliner's transponders to avoid radar detection, according to one person tracking the probe.

The investigation remains fluid, and it isn't clear whether investigators have evidence indicating possible terrorism or sabotage. So far, U.S. national security officials have said that nothing specifically points toward terrorism, though they haven't ruled it out.

But the huge uncertainty about where the plane was headed, and why it apparently continued flying so long without working transponders, has raised theories among investigators that the aircraft may have been commandeered for a reason that appears unclear to U.S. authorities. Some of those theories have been laid out to national security officials and senior personnel from various U.S. agencies, according to one person familiar with the matter.

At one briefing, according to this person, officials were told investigators are actively pursuing the notion that the plane was diverted "with the intention of using it later for another purpose."

As of Wednesday it remained unclear whether the plane reached an alternate destination or if it ultimately crashed, potentially hundreds of miles from where an international search effort has been focused.

In those scenarios, neither mechanical problems, pilot mistakes nor some other type of catastrophic incident caused the 250-ton plane to mysteriously vanish from radar.

The latest revelations come as local media reported that Malaysian police visited the home of at least one of the two pilots.

A Malaysia Airlines official declined to comment. A Boeing executive who declined to be named would not comment except to say, "We've got to stand back from the front line of the information."

The engines' onboard monitoring system is provided by their manufacturer, Rolls-Royce PLC, and it periodically sends bursts of data about engine health, operations and aircraft movements to facilities on the ground.

"We continue to monitor the situation and to offer Malaysia Airlines our support," a Rolls-Royce representative said Wednesday, declining further comment.

"The disappearance is officially now an accident and all information about this is strictly handled by investigators," said a Rolls-Royce executive who declined to be named, citing rules of the International Civil Aviation Organization, a United Nations agency.

As part of its maintenance agreements, Malaysia Airlines transmits its engine data live to Rolls-Royce for analysis. The system compiles data from inside the 777's two Trent 800 engines and transmits snapshots of performance, as well as the altitude and speed of the jet.

Those snippets are compiled and transmitted in 30-minute increments, said one person familiar with the system. According to Rolls-Royce's website, the data is processed automatically "so that subtle changes in condition from one flight to another can be detected."

The engine data is being analyzed to help determine the flight path of the plane after the transponders stopped working. The jet was originally headed for China, and its last verified position was half way across the Gulf of Thailand.

A total flight time of five hours after departing Kuala Lumpur means the Boeing 777 could have continued for an additional distance of about 2,200 nautical miles, reaching points as far as the Indian Ocean, the border of Pakistan or even the Arabian Sea, based on the jet's cruising speed.

Earlier Wednesday, frustrations over the protracted search for the missing plane mounted as both China and Vietnam vented their anger over what they viewed as poor coordination of the effort.

Government conflicts and national arguments over crises are hardly unique to the Flight 370 situation, but some air-safety experts said they couldn't recall another recent instance of governments' publicly feuding over search procedures during the early phase of an international investigation.

Authorities on Wednesday radically expanded the size of the search zone, which already was proving a challenge to cover effectively, but the mission hadn't turned up much by the end of the fifth day.

Also on Wednesday, a Chinese government website posted images from Chinese satellites showing what it said were three large objects floating in an 8-square-mile area off the southern tip of Vietnam. The objects were discovered on Sunday , according to the website, which didn't say whether the objects had been recovered or examined.

Ten countries were helping to scour the seas around Malaysia, including China, the U.S. and Vietnam. Taiwanese vessels are expected to be on the scene by Friday, with India and Japan having also agreed to join the search soon.

In all, 56 surface ships were taking part in the search, according to statements issued by the contributing governments, with Malaysia providing 27 of them. In addition, 30 fixed-wing aircraft were also searching, with at least 10 shipboard helicopters available, mostly in the waters between Malaysia and Vietnam.

China's government was especially aggrieved. More than 150 of the 239 people on board are Chinese, and family members in Beijing have at times loudly expressed their frustration over the absence of leads.

More than a dozen Chinese diplomats met with Malaysian authorities in Kuala Lumpur on Wednesday as tension grew over the search.

"At present there's a lot of different information out there. It's very chaotic and very hard to verify," foreign ministry spokesman Qin Gang said in a regular press briefing. "We've said as long as there is a shred of hope, you can't give up."

The day before, Beijing pointedly pressed Malaysia to accelerate its investigation, which has been hampered by false leads on suspected debris and conflicting reports on radar tracking.

Vietnam on Wednesday suspended its search flights after conflicting reports from Malaysia that authorities had tracked the plane to the Strait of Malacca before it disappeared.

Gen. Rodzali Daud, Malaysia's air force chief, denied saying he had told local media that military radar facilities had tracked the plane there, saying they were still examining all possibilities. Vietnam later resumed normal search sweeps.

Malaysian authorities divided the search area into several sectors on either side of the country, as well as areas on land.

The challenge, said Lt. David Levy, a spokesman for the U.S. Navy's Seventh Fleet, isn't so much coordination as the sheer size of the area involved. The search grids are up to 20 miles by 120 miles, and ships and aircraft employ an exhaustive methodical pattern "like mowing your lawn" in their search for the plane, he said.

U.S. defense officials sought to play down any suggestion that the Malaysian government was doing a poor job with the search.

"It is not unusual for searches to take a long time, especially when you are working with limited data," one official said.

Aviation experts say the absence of an electronic signal from the plane before it disappeared from radar screens makes it difficult to pin down possible locations. Some radar data suggested the Boeing 777 might have tried to turn back to Kuala Lumpur before contact was lost, a detail that prompted a search for the plane on both sides of the Malaysian peninsula.

A U.S. Navy P-3C Orion maritime patrol aircraft has been searching the northern Strait of Malacca, west of Malaysia, while destroyers USS Kidd and USS Pinckney have been deploying helicopters in the Gulf of Thailand to the east.

So far the U.S., like other nations taking part in the search, has had no success. Many aviation experts are concluding that searchers may not have been looking in the right places. Even if the plane broke up in midair, it would have left telltale traces of debris in the ocean. The cracks now emerging between some of the participants in the search could make it even more difficult.

Diplomatic feuds over air disasters have generally erupted over the conclusions of the investigations, long after the initial search is over.

The results of the 1999 crash of an Egyptair Boeing 767 en route to Egypt from New York, which killed 217 people, spawned a dispute between Washington and Cairo that strained ties for years. The National Transportation Safety Board concluded the plane's co-pilot purposely put the twin-engine jet into a steep dive and then resisted efforts by the captain to recover control before the airliner slammed into the Atlantic Ocean off the coast of Nantucket. Egyptian authorities insisted the evidence indicated mechanical failure.

Earlier, Washington and Paris butted heads over the investigation into the 1994 crash of a French-built American Eagle commuter turboprop near Roselawn, Ind. The French objected to the NTSB's conclusions that French regulators failed to take actions that could have prevented the accident.

Earlier this week, Malaysian investigators said they were expanding their investigation to encompass the possibility of hijack or sabotage, and possible personal or psychological problems of the crew and passengers. But Malaysian officials haven't discussed transmissions regarding engine operations or offered any explanation for the primary and backup transponders' not working.
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Offline mountaineer

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #337 on: March 13, 2014, 12:50:00 pm »
No debris at spot seen on satellite: Malaysia
By Associated Press
March 13, 2014 | 1:23am

KUALA LUMPUR, Malaysia — No signs of the missing Malaysian jetliner have been found at a spot where Chinese satellite images showed what might be plane debris, Malaysia’s civil aviation chief said Thursday, deflating the latest lead in the five-day hunt.

“There is nothing. We went there, there is nothing,” Azharuddin Abdul Rahman told reporters in Kuala Lumpur.

Vietnamese officials previously said the area had been “searched thoroughly” in recent days ... .

AP via NY Post
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Oceander

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #338 on: March 13, 2014, 01:08:25 pm »
It would have been nice if Boeing and Rolls Royce had piped up earlier with this new information about the engine monitoring systems.  At the very least it would probably have saved millions of dollars and days' worth of time searching in areas where the plane is almost certainly not located if its engines continued to run for hours after its last contact - I'm guessing that engines generally don't keep running, or broadcasting their performance data, once the airplane they're attached to breaks up and/or hits the water.

Given this new info, the Chinese satellite images are very, very unlikely to be the missing plane.

Back to square one, or square zero even.

I'm also going to guess that the fact the plane continued to transmit engine data for hours after it stopped communicating means that the antennas were still functional, which heavily discounts the theory that the plane suffered a catastrophic failure due to the issues identified in the most recent FAA airworthiness release.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2014, 01:11:33 pm by Oceander »

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #339 on: March 13, 2014, 01:19:45 pm »
And the Malaysians are saying the report on the engine data is untrue.

Square zero indeed....


Oceander

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #340 on: March 13, 2014, 01:23:09 pm »
And the Malaysians are saying the report on the engine data is untrue.

Square zero indeed....



I think I'd be inclined to trust Boeing and Rolls Royce just a smidge more than the Malaysian gov't.

Offline olde north church

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #341 on: March 13, 2014, 01:23:20 pm »
1.  Tracking gear disabled.

2.  Area to store plane.

3.  Some level of government involvement:  misdirection, delay, limited or disinformation.
Why?  Well, because I'm a bastard, that's why.

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #342 on: March 13, 2014, 01:51:19 pm »
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2579524/Hijacked-hidden-US-counter-terror-officials-fear-plane-captured-debris-spotted-Chinese-ruled-new-data-reveals-airborne-FOUR-hours-vanishing.html

Was missing jet HIJACKED? US officials fear MH370 was captured and flown to mystery location after debris seen at sea is ruled out and new data reveals it was airborne FOUR HOURS after vanishing

    US investigators examining whether flight was taken to another location
    Officials suspect data from engines suggests plane flew total of five hours
    Counter-terrorism officials concerned pilot or someone else turned off  transponders
    Four more hours of flight time would allow the plane to fly 2,200 nautical miles
    That would put Pakistan and the Arabian Sea within reach
    Malaysia Airlines previously said the Rolls-Royce Trent engines stopped transmitting monitoring signals when contact with the plane was lost
    On Wednesday the Chinese government satellite imagery was released which showed the 'suspected crash site' of Malaysian Airlines Flight 370
    Blurry images appeared to show three large pieces of debris - the largest of which is 78-feet by 72-feet
    Vietnamese and Malaysian aviation chiefs ruled this out and said no plane debris was found at spot shown by China's satellite images

By James Nye and Richard Shears In Kuala Lumpur

PUBLISHED: 16:19 EST, 12 March 2014 | UPDATED: 06:59 EST, 13 March 2014

continued
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Offline Chieftain

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #343 on: March 13, 2014, 02:22:47 pm »
I think I'd be inclined to trust Boeing and Rolls Royce just a smidge more than the Malaysian gov't.

I concur, but if we sliced Malaysia's denial into planks, we could re-roof a barn....

 :smokin:

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #344 on: March 13, 2014, 03:34:56 pm »
http://abcnews.go.com/International/us-officials-malaysia-airline-crashed-indian-ocean/story?id=22894802

US Officials Believe Malaysia Airline Crashed into Indian Ocean
March 13, 2014
By MARTHA RADDATZ

U.S. officials believe that the missing Malaysia Airlines jetliner may have crashed in the Indian Ocean and is moving the USS Kidd to the area to begin searching.

It will take another 24 hours to move the ship into position, a senior Pentagon official told ABC News.

"We have an indication the plane went down in the Indian Ocean," the senior official said.

The official said there were indications that the plane flew four or five hours after disappearing from radar and that they believe it went into the water.

The U.S. action came hours after Malaysian officials said they had extended their search into the Andaman Sea and had requested help from India in the search for the missing plane and its 239 passengers.

Investigators also said today that U.S. officials gave them reasons to keep searching the waters west of Malaysia, far from the flight path of the Malaysia Airlines plane.
Malaysian Defense Minister Hishammuddin Hussein said that the search’s “main focus has always been in the South China Sea,” which is east of Malaysia and along the plane’s route from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing.

But the search was extended earlier this week to include water far to the west on the other side of Malaysia.

“We are working very closely with the FAA and the NTSB on the issue of a possible air turn back,” Hishammuddin said, referring to the U.S. Federal Aviation Administration and National Transportation Safety Board.

“They have indicated to us that based on the information given by the Malaysian authorities, they — being the FAA and NTSB — the U.S. team was of the view that there was reasonable ground for the Malaysian authorities to deploy resources to conduct search on the western side of the peninsula of Malaysia. Under the circumstances, it is appropriate to conduct the search even if the evidence suggests there is a possibility of finding a minor evidence to suggest that ... the aircraft would have been there.”

Hishammuddin said it was possible the plane kept flying after dropping off of radar. "Of course, this is why we have extended the search," he said.

The Malaysians spent much of today's news conference dismissing earlier leads.

"I’ve heard of many incidents from many sources. Like we have said from the start, we have looked at every lead and in most cases — in fact in all cases — that we have pursued, we have not found anything positive," Hishamuddin said.

He said that pictures of three large objects floating in the South China Sea posted Wednesday on a Chinese government website were not debris from the missing plane.

"A Malaysian maritime enforcement agency surveillance plane was dispatched this morning to investigate potential debris shown on Chinese satellite images. We deployed assets, but found nothing. We have contacted the Chinese Embassy who notified us this afternoon the images were released by mistake and did not show any debris from MH370," he said.

Hishamuddin also dismissed a report by the Wall Street Journal that signals sent by the plane's Rolls Royce engine indicated the plane kept flying for up to five hours. He didn't dispute the plane could have kept flying, but said Rolls Royce did not receive any signals from the engine after it vanished from radar.

Earlier in the search, two oil slicks were determined to not be from the plane and an orange object thought to be part of the plane's door was investigated and found to be unrelated.


Map shows search areas for missing Malaysia Airlines jet which has been expanded, March 13, 2014.
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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #345 on: March 13, 2014, 03:49:46 pm »
http://abcnews.go.com/International/us-officials-malaysia-airline-crashed-indian-ocean/story?id=22894802

US Officials Believe Malaysia Airline Crashed into Indian Ocean
March 13, 2014
By MARTHA RADDATZ

U.S. officials believe that the missing Malaysia Airlines jetliner may have crashed in the Indian Ocean and is moving the USS Kidd to the area to begin searching.

It will take another 24 hours to move the ship into position, a senior Pentagon official told ABC News.

"We have an indication the plane went down in the Indian Ocean," the senior official said.

The official said there were indications that the plane flew four or five hours after disappearing from radar and that they believe it went into the water.

The U.S. action came hours after Malaysian officials said they had extended their search into the Andaman Sea and had requested help from India in the search for the missing plane and its 239 passengers.

Investigators also said today that U.S. officials gave them reasons to keep searching the waters west of Malaysia, far from the flight path of the Malaysia Airlines plane.
Malaysian Defense Minister Hishammuddin Hussein said that the search’s “main focus has always been in the South China Sea,” which is east of Malaysia and along the plane’s route from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing.

But the search was extended earlier this week to include water far to the west on the other side of Malaysia.

“We are working very closely with the FAA and the NTSB on the issue of a possible air turn back,” Hishammuddin said, referring to the U.S. Federal Aviation Administration and National Transportation Safety Board.

“They have indicated to us that based on the information given by the Malaysian authorities, they — being the FAA and NTSB — the U.S. team was of the view that there was reasonable ground for the Malaysian authorities to deploy resources to conduct search on the western side of the peninsula of Malaysia. Under the circumstances, it is appropriate to conduct the search even if the evidence suggests there is a possibility of finding a minor evidence to suggest that ... the aircraft would have been there.”

Hishammuddin said it was possible the plane kept flying after dropping off of radar. "Of course, this is why we have extended the search," he said.

The Malaysians spent much of today's news conference dismissing earlier leads.

"I’ve heard of many incidents from many sources. Like we have said from the start, we have looked at every lead and in most cases — in fact in all cases — that we have pursued, we have not found anything positive," Hishamuddin said.

He said that pictures of three large objects floating in the South China Sea posted Wednesday on a Chinese government website were not debris from the missing plane.

"A Malaysian maritime enforcement agency surveillance plane was dispatched this morning to investigate potential debris shown on Chinese satellite images. We deployed assets, but found nothing. We have contacted the Chinese Embassy who notified us this afternoon the images were released by mistake and did not show any debris from MH370," he said.

Hishamuddin also dismissed a report by the Wall Street Journal that signals sent by the plane's Rolls Royce engine indicated the plane kept flying for up to five hours. He didn't dispute the plane could have kept flying, but said Rolls Royce did not receive any signals from the engine after it vanished from radar.

Earlier in the search, two oil slicks were determined to not be from the plane and an orange object thought to be part of the plane's door was investigated and found to be unrelated.


Map shows search areas for missing Malaysia Airlines jet which has been expanded, March 13, 2014.

Please see Reply #296 on: March 12, 2014, 08:42:57 PM
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Oceander

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #346 on: March 13, 2014, 03:55:09 pm »
Please see Reply #296 on: March 12, 2014, 08:42:57 PM

please check your ego at the door

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #347 on: March 13, 2014, 04:07:40 pm »
please check your ego at the door

Being that you made a ridiculous remark about body of waters,strait, sea and so on-not being an OCEAN. I don't think it is egotistical Bigun predicted the IO.  :silly:
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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #348 on: March 13, 2014, 04:23:04 pm »
Being that you made a ridiculous remark about body of waters,strait, sea and so on-not being an OCEAN. I don't think it is egotistical Bigun predicted the IO.  :silly:

Everyone's welcome to their opinions.  And that's all they are.  Since the aircraft hasn't been found yet and there is no concensus that it went in the direction he said it did, his prediction is still just that, speculation.

Offline DCPatriot

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Re: Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China
« Reply #349 on: March 13, 2014, 06:10:31 pm »
Everyone's welcome to their opinions.  And that's all they are.  Since the aircraft hasn't been found yet and there is no concensus that it went in the direction he said it did, his prediction is still just that, speculation.

Yeah, buddy.....but you went way overboard with your criticism of a poster that used the word "ocean" when anybody that can fog a mirror knew he/she meant 'body of water'.

Lighten up, Francis.   :beer:
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