Live Thread: War With Iran Continues #5

[Bigun]

The understanding is that Iran will open up the Strait of Hormuz and negotiate an end to its nuclear ambitions in exchange for the USA lifting the blockade and trade restrictions. The rest is pretty much pie in the sky.

I opposed the war to begin with, so I would just say that this deal reinforces my reasons for believing the military action was a fool's folly. In some ways, Iran emerges better off now than it was before the war. The mullahs have diplomatic legitimacy and access to world trade. They have suffered some military and economic losses, but over the long run the ability to trade and diplomatic legitimacy will outweigh the costs.

The USA emerges from this having spent a few hundred billion to (hopefully) eliminate the nuclear threat; but nothing gained insofar as Iran's other mischief. It is a net loss for us, and a net win for China.

Repeating myself; "Anything that leaves the Mullah regime in control of Iran's government is a total failure!"

[Wingnut]

Repeating myself; "Anything that leaves the Mullah regime in control of Iran's government is a total failure!"

It looks like what Judge Smails said Spaulding is apropos here,  "You'll get nothing and like it!"

[Timber Rattler]

Trump says he talked to Syrian leader about taking on Hezbollah

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/trump-says-he-talked-syrian-leader-about-taking-hezbollah-2026-06-17/

U.S. President Donald Trump said on Wednesday he had spoken to Syria's leader about combatting Iran-backed Hezbollah in Lebanon, a day after criticizing Israel for killing too many civilians ​and not getting the job done.

Asked at a Group of Seven summit in Evian-les-Bains, France, ‌if he had talked to Syrian President Ahmed al-Sharaa about Hezbollah, Trump nodded and said "yes." Asked if Sharaa was willing to take on the Shi'ite armed group, Trump said he would talk about that later.

(snip)

"I consider that (Lebanon) the minor war, Iran’s a big one, but we have that little pinprick out ​there that constantly rears its head, and that's Hezbollah," Trump told reporters on Tuesday on the sidelines of ​the summit.

Trump has strongly backed Sharaa, a former al Qaeda commander who toppled long-ruling autocrat Bashar al-Assad and has sought to portray himself as a moderate leader trying to unify his war-ravaged nation and end its isolation.

"He's done an amazing job ​of pulling it together. He's not a Boy Scout, but he's done an amazing job of pulling ​it together, and he is very good with Hezbollah. Does not like them," Trump said on Tuesday.

EXCERPT

So now Trump wants Syria to invade Lebanon to fight Hezbollah while demanding that Israel sit back and take it from the Iranians.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

There are a couple of posters on this thread that at one time gave insightful dialogue.

Now the TDS vitriol clouds their comments so much that nothing they say is positive.  Almost appear to be cheering for the enemy.

They treat the present as the end when the end result remains unknown.

An awful way to view our country.

[DefiantMassRINO]

Netanyahu snookered Trump into starting another 'quick' war of foreign misadventure in the Middle East.

Hezbollah, Hamas, Islamic Jihad, the Houthis, the Mullahs, and the IRGC need to go if there is going to be a peaceful, non-nuclear, non-aggressive Iran.  That takes years of spy-craft to bring to fruition.  It can happen, but dropping bombs from afar is not enough to get the job done.  That has to be followed-up by action on the ground by Western supported insurrectionists - an ol' fashioned Cold War dirty war.

[libertybele]

@Bigun  @libertybele

I truly don't think Trump is throwing Israel "under the bus".  He wants to return to the plan for the Middle East in play before the Iran war.    There *are* changes coming to the Middle East --- and while Israel's not going under any bus, the changes will make Israel pretty damn uncomfortable --- until Israel begins to notice the air is fresher, the sun is brighter, the drones have gone silent and they are wealthier and more secure  --- and not just Israel, but the Gulf States, too.

POTUS wants to return to the Gaza peace and reconstruction initiatives, do the same in the West Bank and now in Lebanon.

Trump wants to go full speed ahead with the Abraham Accords --- with Israel a newly valued member of the neighborhood. 

It'll get bumpy, but, let's get this done! ---

One of our greatest allies is going to be made pretty uncomfortable?  That's not acceptable.  Tying Bibi's hands in anyway is wrong.  They have a right to defend their country.  What are they supposed to do when  Hezzbolah attacks them; sit around and twiddle their thumbs because Trump and Co. made some kind of 'deal' for them???? No!

Trump does NOT have the right to dictate to other nations.  Agreements are one thing, but overreaching the power that he thinks he has is not right.  Israel is also a sovereign nation and a regional powers and needs to remain so.

[libertybele]

Trump says he talked to Syrian leader about taking on Hezbollah

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/trump-says-he-talked-syrian-leader-about-taking-hezbollah-2026-06-17/

EXCERPT

So now Trump wants Syria to invade Lebanon to fight Hezbollah while demanding that Israel sit back and take it from the Iranians.

I caught that.  Seems like just a dandy idea. 

[mystery-ak]

https://twitter.com/EricLDaugh/status/2067277364975792296

[mystery-ak]

https://twitter.com/FoxNews/status/2067279642172535238

[libertybele]

Just by the two pictures up above; Rubio seems uncomfortable; -- one he was looking to the side the other picture he is looking at the ground.  Perhaps I'm reading more into the scenario than I should.   

[Idiot]

They are reading the agreement on the old Rush show now.

[Idiot]

The agreement just read is not nearly as bad as some here have alluded to.

[DCPatriot]

Iran war live: Trump says ‘back to dropping bombs’ if Iran ‘misbehaves’

U.S. President Donald Trump attends a bilateral meeting with Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi during the G7 Summit in Evian-les-Bains, France, June 17, 2026. REUTERS/Evelyn Hockstein
02:42
US-Israel relations: New fractures in congressional support for Israel
By Jillian Kestler-D'Amours, Fiona Kelliher and Mariamne Everett

United States President Donald Trump says the memorandum of understanding with Iran that is to be signed on Friday is not final and warns of a return to “dropping bombs” if he “doesn’t like it”.

Iran has accused Israel of violating the truce in Lebanon 84 times since it reached the agreement with the US and warns of a “harsh response” if attacks continue.



https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2026/6/17/iran-war-live-israel-kills-four-in-lebanon-as-trump-criticises-netanyahu?update=4670883

[mystery-ak]

Just by the two pictures up above; Rubio seems uncomfortable; -- one he was looking to the side the other picture he is looking at the ground.  Perhaps I'm reading more into the scenario than I should.   

No...Trump is droning on and on...just now took a question....I feel sorry for people standing..I would have collapsed by now..

[DCPatriot]

The agreement just read is not nearly as bad as some here have alluded to.

Never...Never end a sentence with a preposition!   

 
Idiot      DCP


 

[mystery-ak]

https://twitter.com/nicksortor/status/2067287897196187751

[Idiot]

Never...Never end a sentence with a preposition!   

 
Idiot      DCP


 

Constructing a document is much different than typing on an internet forum.  It’s what it is. 😁

[libertybele]

https://x.com/ClayTravis/status/2067258357937844613?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

[libertybele]

Yes, this is ABC .... but ..... this is shameful if it is true....they are comparing it to Obama agreement .....   It is being relayed that Iran basically got what they wanted and the U.S. got nothing!!

Iran live updates: US releases terms of memorandum of understanding

1. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran and their allies in the current war, by signing this mou declare the immediate and permanent termination of military operations on all fronts, including in Lebanon, and undertake from now on not to initiate any war or any military operation against each other, and to refrain from the threat or use of force against each other, and ensuring the territorial integrity and sovereignty of Lebanon. The final deal will confirm the permanent termination of the war on all fronts, including in Lebanon and other provisions of this paragraph.

2. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran undertake to respect each other's sovereignty and territorial integrity and to refrain from interfering in each other's internal affairs.

3. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran commit to negotiating and achieving the final deal in maximum 60 days extendable with mutual consent.

4. Immediately upon the signing of this MOU, the United States of America will begin the removal of its naval blockade and any disturbances or impediments against the Islamic Republic of Iran, and will fully end the naval blockade within 30 days. During this period, the traffic of vessels will be in proportion to the numbers of pre-war traffic being restored by the Islamic Republic of Iran. The United States of America further undertakes to remove its forces from the proximity of the Islamic Republic of Iran within 30 days after the final deal,

5. Upon the signing of this MOU, the Islamic Republic of Iran will make arrangements using its best efforts for the safe passage of commercial vessels with no charge for 60 days only from the Persian Gulf to the Sea of Oman and vice versa. The traffic of commercial vessels will immediately start, and considering the need for removing the technical and military obstacles and demining by the Islamic Republic of Iran will be instated within 30 days. The Islamic Republic of Iran will conduct dialog with the Sultanate of Oman to define the future administration and maritime services in the Strait of Hormuz in discussion with other Persian Gulf with Oil states in line with the applicable international law and the sovereign rights of coastal states of the Strait of Hormuz

6. The United States of America undertakes with regional partners to develop a definitive, mutually agreed plan with at least USD 300 billion for the reconstruction and economic development of the Islamic Republic of Iran. The mechanism for the implementation of this plan will be finalized as part of a final deal within 60 days. All required licenses, waivers, and permissions needed for the relevant financial transactions will be granted by the United States of America.

7. The United States of America undertakes to terminate all types of sanctions against the Islamic Republic of Iran, including the United Nations Security Council resolutions, i.e.

IAEA Board of Governors resolutions, and all unilateral US sanctions, primary and secondary, in an agreed upon schedule as part of the final deal. The Islamic Republic of Iran and the United States of America acknowledge the critical importance of the sanctions termination issue above mentioned, and expressed their intentions to immediately address these issues in the negotiations in order to achieve mutual agreement on them.

8. The Islamic Republic of Iran reaffirms that it shall not procure or develop nuclear weapons. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran have agreed to resolve the disposition of stockpile enriched material pursuant to a mechanism that will be mutually agreed upon in accordance with the schedule mentioned in paragraph seven with the minimum methodology to be down blending on site under the supervision of the IAEA. The two parties also agreed to discuss the issue of enrichment and other mutually agreed matters related to the Islamic Republic of Iran's nuclear needs, based on a satisfactory framework being agreed upon in the final deal. The final deal will confirm the provisions of this paragraph. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran acknowledge the critical importance of the nuclear issues above mentioned, and express their intention to immediately address these issues in the negotiations in order to achieve mutual agreement on them.

9. Pending the final deal, the United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran agree to maintain the status quo. The Islamic Republic of Iran will maintain the current status quo of its nuclear program, and the United States of America will not impose any new sanctions, and will not deploy additional forces in the region.

10. The United States of America undertakes that immediately upon the signing of this MOU, and until the termination of sanctions, the US Department of Treasury will issue waivers for the export of Iranian crude oil, petroleum products, and derivatives, and all associated services, including banking transactions, insurances, transportation, etc.

11. The United States of America undertakes to make fully available for use the frozen or restricted funds and assets of the Islamic Republic of Iran upon the implementation of this MOU. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran will mutually agree on the procedures related to the release of these funds during the negotiations. Such funds, whether retained in the original account or transferred, shall be made fully usable for payment to any ultimate beneficiary designated by the Central Bank of the Islamic Republic of Iran. The United States of America undertakes to issue all necessary licenses and authorizations accordingly.

12. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran agree that an executive mechanism will be established to monitor the successful implementation of this MOU and the future compliance of the final deal.

13. After signing this MOU and subject to the beginning of the implementation of paragraphs 1,4,5,10, and 11 of this MOU and the continuing implementation of these measures, the United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran will start negotiations regarding the final deal exclusively on the other paragraphs.

14. The final deal will be endorsed by a binding UNSC resolution, and then there's the signature page,


https://abcnews.com/International/live-updates/iran-live-updates-israel-withdraw-lebanon-katz-after/?id=133879236

[Right_in_Virginia]

One of our greatest allies is going to be made pretty uncomfortable?  That's not acceptable.  Tying Bibi's hands in anyway is wrong.  They have a right to defend their country.  What are they supposed to do when  Hezzbolah attacks them; sit around and twiddle their thumbs because Trump and Co. made some kind of 'deal' for them???? No!

@libertybele

Netanyahu's comfort zone is the barrel of a gun --- war is the only thing that makes him comfortable.  Whenever he's uncomfortable, it's always a good thing.  Israel deserves better than this pathological liar --- who is lacking even a shred of morality or vision.

Israel and the Gulf States have a chance to breathe life into Trump's future for the Middle East.   

Trump does NOT have the right to dictate to other nations.  Agreements are one thing, but overreaching the power that he thinks he has is not right.  Israel is also a sovereign nation and a regional powers and needs to remain so.

You do not understand these events.  Respectfully, take some time off and educate yourself.

[libertybele]

@libertybele

Netanyahu's comfort zone is the barrel of a gun --- war is the only thing that makes him comfortable.  Whenever he's uncomfortable, it's always a good thing.  Israel deserves better than this pathological liar --- who is lacking even a shred of morality or vision.

Israel and the Gulf States have a chance to breathe life into Trump's future for the Middle East.   

You do not understand these events.  Respectfully, take some time off and educate yourself.

I fully understand the events @Right_in_Virginia   and is your repeated anti-Israel wishes that continue to shine through.

[Idiot]

Yes, this is ABC .... but ..... this is shameful if it is true....they are comparing it to Obama agreement .....   It is being relayed that Iran basically got what they wanted and the U.S. got nothing!!

Iran live updates: US releases terms of memorandum of understanding

1. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran and their allies in the current war, by signing this mou declare the immediate and permanent termination of military operations on all fronts, including in Lebanon, and undertake from now on not to initiate any war or any military operation against each other, and to refrain from the threat or use of force against each other, and ensuring the territorial integrity and sovereignty of Lebanon. The final deal will confirm the permanent termination of the war on all fronts, including in Lebanon and other provisions of this paragraph.

2. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran undertake to respect each other's sovereignty and territorial integrity and to refrain from interfering in each other's internal affairs.

3. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran commit to negotiating and achieving the final deal in maximum 60 days extendable with mutual consent.

4. Immediately upon the signing of this MOU, the United States of America will begin the removal of its naval blockade and any disturbances or impediments against the Islamic Republic of Iran, and will fully end the naval blockade within 30 days. During this period, the traffic of vessels will be in proportion to the numbers of pre-war traffic being restored by the Islamic Republic of Iran. The United States of America further undertakes to remove its forces from the proximity of the Islamic Republic of Iran within 30 days after the final deal,

5. Upon the signing of this MOU, the Islamic Republic of Iran will make arrangements using its best efforts for the safe passage of commercial vessels with no charge for 60 days only from the Persian Gulf to the Sea of Oman and vice versa. The traffic of commercial vessels will immediately start, and considering the need for removing the technical and military obstacles and demining by the Islamic Republic of Iran will be instated within 30 days. The Islamic Republic of Iran will conduct dialog with the Sultanate of Oman to define the future administration and maritime services in the Strait of Hormuz in discussion with other Persian Gulf with Oil states in line with the applicable international law and the sovereign rights of coastal states of the Strait of Hormuz

6. The United States of America undertakes with regional partners to develop a definitive, mutually agreed plan with at least USD 300 billion for the reconstruction and economic development of the Islamic Republic of Iran. The mechanism for the implementation of this plan will be finalized as part of a final deal within 60 days. All required licenses, waivers, and permissions needed for the relevant financial transactions will be granted by the United States of America.

7. The United States of America undertakes to terminate all types of sanctions against the Islamic Republic of Iran, including the United Nations Security Council resolutions, i.e.

IAEA Board of Governors resolutions, and all unilateral US sanctions, primary and secondary, in an agreed upon schedule as part of the final deal. The Islamic Republic of Iran and the United States of America acknowledge the critical importance of the sanctions termination issue above mentioned, and expressed their intentions to immediately address these issues in the negotiations in order to achieve mutual agreement on them.

8. The Islamic Republic of Iran reaffirms that it shall not procure or develop nuclear weapons. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran have agreed to resolve the disposition of stockpile enriched material pursuant to a mechanism that will be mutually agreed upon in accordance with the schedule mentioned in paragraph seven with the minimum methodology to be down blending on site under the supervision of the IAEA. The two parties also agreed to discuss the issue of enrichment and other mutually agreed matters related to the Islamic Republic of Iran's nuclear needs, based on a satisfactory framework being agreed upon in the final deal. The final deal will confirm the provisions of this paragraph. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran acknowledge the critical importance of the nuclear issues above mentioned, and express their intention to immediately address these issues in the negotiations in order to achieve mutual agreement on them.

9. Pending the final deal, the United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran agree to maintain the status quo. The Islamic Republic of Iran will maintain the current status quo of its nuclear program, and the United States of America will not impose any new sanctions, and will not deploy additional forces in the region.

10. The United States of America undertakes that immediately upon the signing of this MOU, and until the termination of sanctions, the US Department of Treasury will issue waivers for the export of Iranian crude oil, petroleum products, and derivatives, and all associated services, including banking transactions, insurances, transportation, etc.

11. The United States of America undertakes to make fully available for use the frozen or restricted funds and assets of the Islamic Republic of Iran upon the implementation of this MOU. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran will mutually agree on the procedures related to the release of these funds during the negotiations. Such funds, whether retained in the original account or transferred, shall be made fully usable for payment to any ultimate beneficiary designated by the Central Bank of the Islamic Republic of Iran. The United States of America undertakes to issue all necessary licenses and authorizations accordingly.

12. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran agree that an executive mechanism will be established to monitor the successful implementation of this MOU and the future compliance of the final deal.

13. After signing this MOU and subject to the beginning of the implementation of paragraphs 1,4,5,10, and 11 of this MOU and the continuing implementation of these measures, the United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran will start negotiations regarding the final deal exclusively on the other paragraphs.

14. The final deal will be endorsed by a binding UNSC resolution, and then there's the signature page,


https://abcnews.com/International/live-updates/iran-live-updates-israel-withdraw-lebanon-katz-after/?id=133879236

Before you hyperventilate again.  Please show me where it says the 300 billion is from the US?

[libertybele]

Before you hyperventilate again.  Please show me where it says the 300 billion is from the US?

Oh, good grief!  I'm not hyperventilating.  Yes, technically the 300B isn't coming from the U.S.,  but the $$$ is being 'unfrozen' for Iran to put to good use.     You know -- rebuilding the country for fellow Iranians ... no way are they going to use it to develop their nuclear program; after all  they promised.   

Give me a flippin' break!

[catfish1957]

Oh, good grief!  I'm not hyperventilating.  Yes, technically the 300B isn't coming from the U.S.,  but the $$$ is being 'unfrozen' for Iran to put to good use.     You know -- rebuilding the country for fellow Iranians ... no way are they going to use it to develop their nuclear program; after all  they promised.   

Give me a flippin' break!

I have gotten pretty used to our Lincoln Project Invasion here.  Good folks there I tell ya.  /s

[Idiot]

I have gotten pretty used to our Lincoln Project Invasion here.  Good folks there I tell ya.  /s

Are you referring to me?

[Cyber Liberty]

Are you referring to me?

I don't think there are any fans of The Lincoln Project here....

[libertybele]

So ...  I was mistaken ...

In negotiations aimed at a final agreement, the memorandum also calls for the U.S. and regional partners to develop a plan worth at least $300 billion for the reconstruction and economic development of Iran. Officials stressed the provision does not commit the U.S. to providing the funds, arguing instead that it would permit outside investment if a final deal is reached and Iran complies with its obligations.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-administration-unveils-sweeping-terms-proposed-iran-agreement

[catfish1957]

I don't think there are any fans of The Lincoln Project here....

I know of one based on his Twitter history.  And I'd bet there are 2 or 3 stealth ones too if you dig hard enough

[Cyber Liberty]

So ...  I was mistaken ...

In negotiations aimed at a final agreement, the memorandum also calls for the U.S. and regional partners to develop a plan worth at least $300 billion for the reconstruction and economic development of Iran. Officials stressed the provision does not commit the U.S. to providing the funds, arguing instead that it would permit outside investment if a final deal is reached and Iran complies with its obligations.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-administration-unveils-sweeping-terms-proposed-iran-agreement

The key is Iran has to comply, and I don't think they are capable of doing that consistently after 47 years of "Death to America" and "Death to Israel."  They are sure to slip up and start shooting missiles at somebody.  Contrary to assertions I've heard here, I cannot believe the IRGC is no more.  Some of those hotheads are sure to (conveniently) defy their own government and pop off some rockets.

[Cyber Liberty]

I know of one based on his Twitter history.  And I'd bet there are 2 or 3 stealth ones too if you dig hard enough

Well, I can't keep track of X users and Briefers, at the same time.   

[libertybele]

The key is Iran has to comply, and I don't think they are capable of doing that consistently after 47 years of "Death to America" and "Death to Israel."  They are sure to slip up and start shooting missiles at somebody.  Contrary to assertions I've heard here, I cannot believe the IRGC is no more.  Some of those hotheads are sure to (conveniently) defy their own government and pop off some rockets.

I agree that Iran won't comply.  A memo seems far different than a binding treaty as well. 

As for outside investors -- I can't help but think Kushner already sees dollars signs.  (As a note; Kushner bought land in Albania and wants to put up some sort of luxury resort.  The natives aren't happy).

[Bigun]

The United States of America undertakes to make fully available for use the frozen or restricted funds and assets of the Islamic Republic of Iran upon the implementation of this MOU. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran will mutually agree on the procedures related to the release of these funds during the negotiations. Such funds, whether retained in the original account or transferred, shall be made fully usable for payment to any ultimate beneficiary designated by the Central Bank of the Islamic Republic of Iran. The United States of America undertakes to issue all necessary licenses and authorizations accordingly.

[Right_in_Virginia]

I fully understand the events @Right_in_Virginia   and is your repeated anti-Israel wishes that continue to shine through.

@libertybele

Wanting to see Israel fully integrated with her neighbors --- in economics, regional security and peace --- makes me "anti-Israel"?  I honestly don't know how else to ask this, so apologies if the question insults you ... but, what the hell is wrong with you? 

[Timber Rattler]

It's a total capitulation by the U.S. to Iran. 

Meanwhile...

Trump says he likes idea of blaming Vance if Iran deal doesn’t work out

https://www.cnbc.com/2026/06/17/trump-vance-iran-deal-nuclear-g7.html

President Donald Trump on Wednesday said he liked the idea of blaming Vice President JD Vance if a deal to end the war with Iran does not work out.

“If it works out, I’m going to take the credit. If it doesn’t work out, I’m blaming JD,” Trump quipped, after a reporter suggested Trump was setting Vance up to take the fall by sending the vice president in his stead to sign an agreement with Iran in the coming days.

EXCERPT

[Cyber Liberty]

It's a total capitulation by the U.S. to Iran. 

Meanwhile...

Trump says he likes idea of blaming Vance if Iran deal doesn’t work out

https://www.cnbc.com/2026/06/17/trump-vance-iran-deal-nuclear-g7.html

EXCERPT

That's probably a joke, but a really poor one.   

[Right_in_Virginia]

I can't help but think Kushner already sees dollars signs. 

[Timber Rattler]

Just by the two pictures up above; Rubio seems uncomfortable; -- one he was looking to the side the other picture he is looking at the ground.  Perhaps I'm reading more into the scenario than I should.   

Yeah, judging from his body language, Rubio is not on board and would much rather be somewhere else.