Is Trump a liar?

[roamer_1]

The time for you to oppose DJT was before and during the primaries like I did. Now is the time to stand against Harris even if you don't like Trump.

Exactly false. Rah-rah team bullshit.
Standing for one socialist against another is without purpose.

[roamer_1]

In fact, voting FOR big government from the RIGHT is against purpose.

[MeganC]

Exactly false. Rah-rah team bullshit.
Standing for one socialist against another is without purpose.

Look at the US Supreme Court's decisions of late and then imagine what Harris' justices will do.

[roamer_1]

Look at the US Supreme Court's decisions of late and then imagine what Harris' justices will do.

Doesn't matter. You are not making government smaller. And in that, liberty must suffer.

Your argument is satisfaction with the candy thrown by the clown at the front of the parade.
Your appetite will go wanting soon enough.
This populist bullshit does nothing except grow government even more.

And I will not vote for that, no matter the flavor of the candy.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

 

Sooner or later, everyone lies. We're human. Maybe it was to blame the cat for the lamp we tipped over, or merely saying "I don't know" with a chocolate covered face to try to not get in trouble for the frosting disappearing while mom was in the bathroom. Or to avoid some other more profound consequence later in life, but basically, none is without sin. Repent! 
(Seriously, do.)

Lest we forget, Trump made his money in real estate promotion. Promoting a (premium) brand involves superlatives, sometimes to excess, but generally, those involve at least some aspect of truth. The person on the other end of that expects some hyperbole; such is modern sales, whether I agree with that or not. The onus of doing due diligence, as always, resides with the buyer.

Caveat emptor has been the case at least since the Romans dominated the Mediterranean.

With that in mind, if we are to excuse hypebrole and even some minor subsequent underperformance, can we hold the Democrats to task for their promises, or, for that matter, anyone in politics? Is that really deceptive (or to turn that question around, are we so naive to expect that promises made from the stump are going to be worth the paper they weren't even written on?) Ideally, we would re-elect the ones who fulfill their promises, and primary out the ones who do not, but such would involve an attentive and engaged electorate, without compromising conflicts of interest. We don't have that.

Where it becomes less murky, however, is when one bears False Witness against others.
Enshrined in the list of 'Thou Shalt Nots' as one of the big ten offenses against God, Himself, carved in stone, even, that is not so excusable as a little hype. (At least in the judeo-Christian ethos, Islamists have been excused from such encumbrances when promoting their faith.)

The question should be "Which candidate(s) lie about their own accomplishments (they did or they didn't) and lie about the stated goals of other, opposing candidates?".

I must note that not much Trump says about his Democratic opponents is demonstrably false, whereas their comments and attributions of his alleged policies and behaviours leave much to be desired in terms of veracity.

I'm no fan of situation ethics or relative goodness, because I believe in absolutes of right and wrong. With that consideration, I prefer to make verifiable statements when stating fact (this is opinion), and commonly cite sources for information.

With that in mind, though, consider which of the two leading candidates for POTUS has spent the most time, energy, and money saying things which just aren't so about the other, and the fog clears. The tendency for incontinent prevarication is commonly on one side, and they even buy ad space to mislead their supporters or turn others against their opponent.

But then, projection is one of their defining behaviours.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

The time for you to oppose DJT was before and during the primaries like I did. Now is the time to stand against Harris even if you don't like Trump.

No chance a NT will do that.  Only supports those who do not lie much, maybe like Bernie Sanders.

[roamer_1]

No chance a NT will do that.  Only supports those who do not lie much, maybe like Bernie Sanders.

Nah... No Bernie for me. Never had it, never will.

Maybe a Ron Paul.
Certainly a DeSantis.

Not so much Never-Tumpy as I am Never-Liberal... But then, I repeat myself.

[LMAO]

Lies that significantly damage other people's good character is a bridge too far for me.

Trump has done that with both Cruz and DeSantis.

It is "winning" at any cost.

 



And now that his campaign is faltering , expect further attacks against those of us who refuse to reward that and bail his supporters out of their poor primary choice

[Smokin Joe]

 



And now that his campaign is faltering , expect further attacks against those of us who refuse to reward that and bail his supporters out of their poor primary choice

Interesting that you can see his lies so clearly, and yet sanction the LIES that the Democrats are spewing about everything and everyone.

[roamer_1]

Interesting that you can see his lies so clearly, and yet sanction the LIES that the Democrats are spewing about everything and everyone.

Who here is sanctioning lies of any kind?
One group is sanctioning lies from the right... I heard that.

[massadvj]

Another counter-argument is that to be a lie, the person speaking must know it is false (and intend to deceive).  Trump is not a liar, but (like most politicians) a bulls**tter, in the sense that bulls**t is defined by Harry G. Frankfurt in his charming little volume On Bulls**t.  Bulls**t is saying whatever is expedient without regard to whether it is true or false. Unfortunately for one's view of politicians, Trump included, Frankfurt concludes that bulls**tting is a worse enemy of truth than lying.  The liar at least has enough regard for the truth to know it, but say something contrary to it.  The bulls**tter has no regard for the truth at all.

Good point.

[massadvj]

All politicians lie. It is not possible to succeed as a politician without lying. I have always been more concerned about what politicians do than what they say. Trump has always been a bombastic promoter. I thought he was a boor when he was a real estate developer/celebrity, and I like him even less as a politician. I will never understand his appeal. But I will vote for him based on my expectations that he will DO three things: enforce the border, deregulate business (especially energy), and appoint good judges. I think these are reasonable expectations given his record.

I also pretty much know what Kamala Harris is likely to do based on her record, and none of it is good. Everything else is just noise, including the lies that are coming from all the politicians' mouths.

[mountaineer]

FoiaFan🇮🇱
@15poundstogo
Trump is a deeply flawed human being. So am I. So are you. So are all despicable, weak Republican politicians.
But for those of us who don’t want an oppressive and racist one-party state, allied with and inviting millions of foreign invaders, that aggressively censors dissent, that is deeply invested in grooming children for irreversible quackish gender experiments, and that supports Hamas in every way other than openly and directly, Trump and the Republicans are all we have on the ballot.
Choose wisely.
7:41 AM · Aug 30, 2024

[Bigun]

All politicians lie. It is not possible to succeed as a politician without lying. I have always been more concerned about what politicians do than what they say. Trump has always been a bombastic promoter. I thought he was a boor when he was a real estate developer/celebrity, and I like him even less as a politician. I will never understand his appeal. But I will vote for him based on my expectations that he will DO three things: enforce the border, deregulate business (especially energy), and appoint good judges. I think these are reasonable expectations given his record.

I also pretty much know what Kamala Harris is likely to do based on her record, and none of it is good. Everything else is just noise, including the lies that are coming from all the politicians' mouths.

Right there with you Victor! @massadvj I'm not looking for a new drinking buddy.

[Hoodat]

If you get away from the maga/conservative forums and read other sources you will find many conservatives are starting to leave Trump in droves. Even Maga conservatives.

Seriously?  All the Conservatives at DU and DailyKos are leaving Trump in droves?  Go figure.

[deb]

Seriously?  All the Conservatives at DU and DailyKos are leaving Trump in droves?  Go figure.

MAGA conservatives will NEVER leave Trump. He’s their deity.

[MeganC]

Nah... No Bernie for me. Never had it, never will.

Maybe a Ron Paul.
Certainly a DeSantis.

Not so much Never-Tumpy as I am Never-Liberal... But then, I repeat myself.

DeSantis isn't in this election. Harris and Trump are. You may as well scream at the sky until blood blasts out of your throat you will not change this fact.

That said your choices are:

*Vote for Harris
*Vote for Trump
*Don't vote and you'll most likely improve the value of a Democrat vote in your state.

Your choices also include:

*Continue shitting on Trump in this topic and in this forum when he's the GOP nominee and in doing so you are absolutely campaigning for Harris against Trump. You are and I refuse to accuse you of being so damned stupid that you believe otherwise.

*Be hateful enough against Trump that you decide to reregister D and then openly campaign for Harris because the Orange Man is eeeeebil. 

[banddag]

Seriously?  All the Conservatives at DU and DailyKos are leaving Trump in droves?  Go figure.

Keep your head in the sand. People are wary of "you  must have 100% loyalty to Trump". stance and nothing else. People are worried about this blind allegiance to one man (and family) and where it will be leading us. From an article on The Hill today:  To have one family in complete control of a major national political party is an aberration in our country. Daughter-in-law Lara Trump, installed as co-chair of the Republican National Committee in March, naively spoke the truth in February when she said of its fundraising, “Every single penny will go to the number one and the only job of the RNC — that is electing Donald J. Trump as president of the United States…”
This is just one movement. There are many more on Facebook and the 'net.
I have also noticed a growing criticism of Trump at FR and Jimbo is no longer zotting them as he would have done in the past

https://leavingmaga.org/

@Hoodat

[catfish1957]

Keep your head in the sand. People are wary of "you  must have 100% loyalty to Trump". stance and nothing else. People are worried about this blind allegiance to one man (and family) and where it will be leading us. 
This is just one movement. There are many more on Facebook and the 'net

https://leavingmaga.org/

Hey. I remember you!!!!!!!

Remember catching you in 11 lies in just one post.   Congrats....  that's a tough accomplishment.

[banddag]

Hey. I remember you!!!!!!!

Remember catching you in 11 lies in just one post.   Congrats....  that's a tough accomplishment.

Post those 11 lies, each one.  BTW what did I say above that is untrue. People are leaving maga in droves. Get off the right wing  sites and learn another view for a change.

@catfish1957

[DefiantMassRINO]

One person's liar is another person's malignantly narcissistic pyschopathic fabulist ... with a bad spray tan.

[mountaineer]

Post those 11 lies, each one.  BTW what did I say above that is untrue. People are leaving maga in droves. Get off the right wing  mutual masturbation circle jerk sites and learn something for a change

Keep it classy.

[catfish1957]

Post those 11 lies, each one.  BTW what did I say above that is untrue. People are leaving maga in droves. Get off the right wing  mutual masturbation circle jerk sites and learn something for a change

@catfish1957

GTH...  From oil, to EV's, to climate change, to QE in the late '00's.  You have been a living breathing lying machine.  All anyone has to do, is peruse the shit you posted April and May of this year to get an idea. Proof enough bud, without wasting my time.

lol....  Trollz gotta be trollz.   Do you have your ready supply of links from MSN. The Hill, and the Guardian  to spread your bullshit?

Biggest lie of all?  Claiming to be a former conservative.

[banddag]

https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/259001/live-action-president-lila-rose-trump-is-losing-pro-life-votes

Even the pro life folks are becoming disfranchised with Trump. 

https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/259001/live-action-president-lila-rose-trump-is-losing-pro-life-votes

If elected, wait until he signs in an anti semi assault rifle ban. Trump has also been anti gun. He is a NY social liberal. He will be lame duck not worrying about reelection and having survived a assassination attempt I bet he is  now anti assault weapon but can't say it.

[mountaineer]

Biggest lie of all?  Claiming to be a former conservative.

Translation: never a conservative, not even close.