Author Topic: Ukraine 4  (Read 519617 times)

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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3150 on: June 14, 2024, 10:49:54 am »
Putin demands more Ukrainian land to end war; Kyiv rejects 'ultimatum'

Vladimir Soldatkin  |  June 14, 2024  |  10:35 AM EDT


MOSCOW, June 14 (Reuters) - President Vladimir Putin said on Friday Russia would end the war in Ukraine only if Kyiv agreed to drop its NATO ambitions and hand over the entirety of four provinces claimed by Moscow, demands Kyiv swiftly rejected as tantamount to surrender.

On the eve of a conference in Switzerland to which Russia has not been invited, Putin set out maximalist conditions wholly at odds with the terms demanded by Ukraine, apparently reflecting Moscow's growing confidence that its forces have the upper hand in the war.

He restated his demand for Ukraine's demilitarisation, unchanged from the day he sent in his troops on Feb. 24, 2022, and said an end to Western sanctions must also be part of a peace deal.

He also repeated his call for Ukraine's "denazification", based on what Kyiv calls an unfounded slur against its leadership.
Ukraine said the conditions were "absurd".

"He is offering for Ukraine to admit defeat. He is offering for Ukraine to legally give up its territories to Russia. He is offering for Ukraine to sign away its geopolitical sovereignty," Ukrainian presidential adviser Mykhailo Podolyak told Reuters.  .  .

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/putin-says-west-needs-find-way-work-with-russia-2024-06-14/
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3151 on: June 14, 2024, 11:01:29 am »
Nothing in Eastern Europe is easy or black and white @Cyber Liberty

Crimea was part of Russia from 1783 until Khrushchev unilaterally gave it to Ukraine in 1954.  The people of Crimea have voted for independence from Ukraine and the majority consider themselves Russian.   Rather than occupiers, the majority considered Russia a protector and ally in their efforts to break free of Kiev.

Face value judgements rarely hold up in Eastern Europe. :shrug:


@Right_in_Virginia


Alaska was once part of Russia! Do we give Alaska back to them if they demand it?



Join The Reagan Caucus: https://reagancaucus.org/ and the Eisenhower Caucus: https://EisenhowerCaucus.org

Ronald Reagan: “Rather than...talking about putting up a fence, why don’t we work out some recognition of our mutual problems and make it possible for them to come here legally with a work permit…earning here they pay taxes here.”

Offline mountaineer

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3152 on: June 14, 2024, 11:03:41 am »
Ian Miles Cheong
@stillgray
BREAKING: Russia Proposes Ceasefire to Ukraine
“Ukrainian troops should be completely withdrawn from Donetsk and Lugansk People's Republics, Kherson and Zaporozhye regions."
Should Ukraine promise to give up plans to join NATO, Putin says that the ceasefire order will be declared immediately and begin negotiations.
9:39 AM · Jun 14, 2024

Ian Miles Cheong
@stillgray
By doing this, Russia puts the onus on Zelensky to accept the terms of the ceasefire and gives the United States and NATO an off-ramp to stay out of it despite whatever preexisting agreements they may have. Nothing is stopping Ukraine and the US from working together as long as they don't join NATO.
9:48 AM · Jun 14, 2024

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Offline Bigun

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3153 on: June 14, 2024, 11:19:15 am »

@Right_in_Virginia


Alaska was once part of Russia! Do we give Alaska back to them if they demand it?

I guess so if you cannot distinguish between legitimate purchase and outright theft!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3154 on: June 14, 2024, 11:23:19 am »
Should Ukraine promise to give up plans to join NATO, Putin says that the ceasefire order will be declared immediately and begin negotiations.

Ukraine already gave up plans to join NATO in 2021 BEFORE Russia tried to capture Kyiv.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3155 on: June 14, 2024, 12:06:37 pm »
Ian Miles Cheong
@stillgray
BREAKING: Russia Proposes Ceasefire to Ukraine
“Ukrainian troops should be completely withdrawn from Donetsk and Lugansk People's Republics, Kherson and Zaporozhye regions."
Should Ukraine promise to give up plans to join NATO, Putin says that the ceasefire order will be declared immediately and begin negotiations.
9:39 AM · Jun 14, 2024

Ian Miles Cheong
@stillgray
By doing this, Russia puts the onus on Zelensky to accept the terms of the ceasefire and gives the United States and NATO an off-ramp to stay out of it despite whatever preexisting agreements they may have. Nothing is stopping Ukraine and the US from working together as long as they don't join NATO.
9:48 AM · Jun 14, 2024


@mountaineer


Full of crap
Join The Reagan Caucus: https://reagancaucus.org/ and the Eisenhower Caucus: https://EisenhowerCaucus.org

Ronald Reagan: “Rather than...talking about putting up a fence, why don’t we work out some recognition of our mutual problems and make it possible for them to come here legally with a work permit…earning here they pay taxes here.”

Offline mountaineer

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3156 on: June 14, 2024, 12:10:47 pm »
Full of crap
My posting it was not an endorsement - just putting it out there for discussion.
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3157 on: June 14, 2024, 12:13:29 pm »

@mountaineer


Full of crap

I already knew that about Ian Miles Cheong.
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3158 on: June 14, 2024, 12:17:51 pm »
BREAKING: Russia Proposes Ceasefire to Ukraine
“Ukrainian troops should be completely withdrawn from Donetsk and Lugansk People's Republics, Kherson and Zaporozhye regions."
Should Ukraine promise to give up plans to join NATO, Putin says that the ceasefire order will be declared immediately and begin negotiations.
9:39 AM · Jun 14, 2024


BREAKING: Hamas Proposes Ceasefire to Israel
“Israeli troops should be completely withdrawn from Israel."
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline MeganC

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3159 on: June 14, 2024, 12:58:17 pm »

@Right_in_Virginia


Alaska was once part of Russia! Do we give Alaska back to them if they demand it?

They are indeed demanding it.

RUSSIA MUST BE DESTROYED!!!

Offline PeteS in CA

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3160 on: June 14, 2024, 01:21:31 pm »
Quote
Nothing in Eastern Europe is easy or black and white @Cyber Liberty

Crimea was part of Russia from 1783 until Khrushchev unilaterally gave it to Ukraine in 1954.  ...

Fixing it for you: ... until Khrushchev unilaterally gave it back to Ukraine in 1954.

Sadly, Khrushchev, who was Ukrainian, could not resurrect the Ukrainian Tatars slaughtered by the Romanovs and Stalin, nor return the Ukrainian Tatars Stalin forced into exile.

Stalin's exiling of non-Russian non-Georgian ethnic groups is touched on by Solzhenitsyn in Gulag Archipelago. As is Stalin's terror famine against Ukraine. Robert Conquest also wrote about the Holodomor. RiV might learn from these books why Ukrainians would NEVER view Russians as "liberators" or "protectors". But probably would decline.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2024, 03:18:24 pm by PeteS in CA »
I am not and never have been a leftist.

If, as anti-Covid-vaxxers claim, https://www.poynter.org/fact-checking/2021/robert-f-kennedy-jr-said-the-covid-19-vaccine-is-the-deadliest-vaccine-ever-made-thats-not-true/ , https://gospelnewsnetwork.org/2021/11/23/covid-shots-are-the-deadliest-vaccines-in-medical-history/ , The Vaccine is deadly, where in the US have Pfizer and Moderna hidden the millions of bodies of those who died of "vaccine injury"?

Millions now living should have died. Anti-Covid-Vaxxer ghouls hardest hit.

Offline GtHawk

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3161 on: June 14, 2024, 05:07:56 pm »
I guess so if you cannot distinguish between legitimate purchase and outright theft!
I’m pretty sure they taught American history way back when she was in elementary school, they did way back when I was :shrug:

Offline GtHawk

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3162 on: June 14, 2024, 05:13:01 pm »
They are indeed demanding it.
sellers remorse, tough Shiite and the same goes for Mejico who decided on reconquista  to take the land back.

Offline PeteS in CA

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3163 on: June 14, 2024, 06:52:07 pm »
sellers remorse, ...

Back in the 19th Century, Russia sold its colony at Fort Ross in California to John (Johann) Sutter (before the Gold Rush) because it was economically unsustainable, and in the 1870s(?) sold their Alaska colony for the same reason. The Yukon gold rush was 20 or 25 years later, and the discovery of oil in Alaska about a century later.

Alt-history is always fraught with uncertainty. I'm not sure what would have happened had Mexico not tried to violate the Treaties of Velasco and bite off a chunk of what had become the State of Texas. Mexico claimed the Nueces River was the "Rio Grande" of the treaties, while Texas and the US claimed the "Rio Grande" of the treaties was the Rio Grande; meaning no insult to those living along the Nueces, it's not very grande. The outcome of the Mexican-American War is known (though I wonder how many know the US paid for the Southwest, in gold and/or silver, per a treaty negotiated without any of the negotiators knowing that gold had been discovered in California). What would have happened had there been no war I couldn't guess. I do know that there was a revolt brewing in (Alta) California, due to Mexican misrule at about the same time the Mex-Am War broke out, but I'm not sure that would have succeeded.
I am not and never have been a leftist.

If, as anti-Covid-vaxxers claim, https://www.poynter.org/fact-checking/2021/robert-f-kennedy-jr-said-the-covid-19-vaccine-is-the-deadliest-vaccine-ever-made-thats-not-true/ , https://gospelnewsnetwork.org/2021/11/23/covid-shots-are-the-deadliest-vaccines-in-medical-history/ , The Vaccine is deadly, where in the US have Pfizer and Moderna hidden the millions of bodies of those who died of "vaccine injury"?

Millions now living should have died. Anti-Covid-Vaxxer ghouls hardest hit.

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3164 on: June 15, 2024, 12:08:29 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3165 on: June 15, 2024, 12:08:56 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3166 on: June 15, 2024, 12:10:01 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3167 on: June 15, 2024, 12:10:35 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3168 on: June 15, 2024, 12:15:26 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3170 on: June 15, 2024, 12:18:05 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3171 on: June 15, 2024, 12:20:45 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3172 on: June 15, 2024, 12:21:27 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3174 on: June 15, 2024, 12:31:17 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3177 on: June 15, 2024, 12:40:01 am »
Stoltenberg on Putin's statement: "It is not Ukraine that should withdraw troops, but Russia"

14 June 2024, 19:07


NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg reacted to Russian President Vladimir Putin's statement on the terms of the ceasefire, noting that "this is not a peace proposal, but a proposal for greater aggression."

"It is not Ukraine that should withdraw troops from Ukrainian territory. It is Russia that must withdraw its troops from the occupied Ukrainian land. And this proposal actually means that Russia should have the right to occupy even more Ukrainian land or four regions that they claim are not Ukrainian," he said at a briefing following a meeting of NATO defense ministers.

Stoltenberg stated that Putin's statement is not a proposal made with good intentions.

"This is a proposal that actually means that Russia must achieve its goals in war games, expecting Ukraine to give up significantly more territory than Russia has been able to occupy up to this time. Therefore, this is not a peace proposal. This is a proposal for more aggression, more occupation. And it demonstrates that Russia's goal is to control Ukraine, this has been Russia's goal from the very beginning of this war," the NATO Secretary General added.  .  .  .

https://ru.krymr.com/a/news-stoltenberg-o-zayavlenii-putina/32993379.html
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3178 on: June 15, 2024, 12:51:00 am »
Mobilized Soldiers' Relatives Call for Russian Officials' Sons to Replace Their Loved Ones

Updated: 12 hours ago




Relatives of mobilized Russian soldiers campaigning for their loved ones' return from Ukraine have called on the authorities to replace these men with the sons of Russian officials and media personalities.

“We demand to replace our men with other quite specific men: the children and husbands of those who tell our citizens from the screens that war is good,” the Put Domoi (“Way Home”) movement, which has organized women-led protests across the country calling for a full demobilization, wrote on its Telegram channel Friday.

“We can make a list long enough to replace every mobilized person,” the statement said.

The list includes the sons of Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov, Kremlin-loyal TV host Vladimir Solovyev and former President Dmitry Medvedev.

“Something tells us that such a rotation will quickly put an end to all hostilities,” Put Domoi said.

Earlier this month, a group of women staged a protest outside the Defense Ministry building in Moscow, demanding the return of those mobilized and a meeting with new Defense Minister Andrei Belousov.

Russia mobilized 300,000 reservists for the war in Ukraine in September and October 2022 and many have not returned home since.  .  .

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2024/06/14/mobilized-soldiers-relatives-call-for-russian-officials-sonsto-replace-their-loved-ones-a85416
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline PeteS in CA

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3179 on: June 15, 2024, 11:26:28 am »
The closest US analog to the Su-34 might be the F/A-18F, which is also a multi-role two-seater and of more similar speed than the much faster F-15E. The before and after pictures of the Morozovsk air base suggest that 2 and possibly more Su-34s will not be launching missiles and glide bombs at Ukraine any time soon, if ever.
I am not and never have been a leftist.

If, as anti-Covid-vaxxers claim, https://www.poynter.org/fact-checking/2021/robert-f-kennedy-jr-said-the-covid-19-vaccine-is-the-deadliest-vaccine-ever-made-thats-not-true/ , https://gospelnewsnetwork.org/2021/11/23/covid-shots-are-the-deadliest-vaccines-in-medical-history/ , The Vaccine is deadly, where in the US have Pfizer and Moderna hidden the millions of bodies of those who died of "vaccine injury"?

Millions now living should have died. Anti-Covid-Vaxxer ghouls hardest hit.

Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3180 on: June 15, 2024, 02:41:23 pm »
Mobilized Soldiers' Relatives Call for Russian Officials' Sons to Replace Their Loved Ones

Updated: 12 hours ago




Relatives of mobilized Russian soldiers campaigning for their loved ones' return from Ukraine have called on the authorities to replace these men with the sons of Russian officials and media personalities.

“We demand to replace our men with other quite specific men: the children and husbands of those who tell our citizens from the screens that war is good,” the Put Domoi (“Way Home”) movement, which has organized women-led protests across the country calling for a full demobilization, wrote on its Telegram channel Friday.

“We can make a list long enough to replace every mobilized person,” the statement said.

The list includes the sons of Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov, Kremlin-loyal TV host Vladimir Solovyev and former President Dmitry Medvedev.

“Something tells us that such a rotation will quickly put an end to all hostilities,” Put Domoi said.

Earlier this month, a group of women staged a protest outside the Defense Ministry building in Moscow, demanding the return of those mobilized and a meeting with new Defense Minister Andrei Belousov.

Russia mobilized 300,000 reservists for the war in Ukraine in September and October 2022 and many have not returned home since.  .  .

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2024/06/14/mobilized-soldiers-relatives-call-for-russian-officials-sonsto-replace-their-loved-ones-a85416


This should be posted on the TOS and I have a feeling there are more protests that are similar in Russia.
Join The Reagan Caucus: https://reagancaucus.org/ and the Eisenhower Caucus: https://EisenhowerCaucus.org

Ronald Reagan: “Rather than...talking about putting up a fence, why don’t we work out some recognition of our mutual problems and make it possible for them to come here legally with a work permit…earning here they pay taxes here.”

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3181 on: June 15, 2024, 04:14:25 pm »
Russian soldiers desert en masse to avoid frontlines in Ukraine

Sławomir Zagórski  •  6h


The Kremlin is mass-producing "cannon fodder." On social media, Russians complain and share tips on how to avoid military service. The organization Iditie Liesom has already helped 30,000 conscripts and soldiers escape – the equivalent of two divisions.

Since the beginning of the aggression in Ukraine, the Russian army has irretrievably lost 505,000 troops—killed, wounded, captured, or missing. The Kremlin must replenish these giant losses with new conscripts. Currently, the draft does not exceed 15,000 per month, but only 6,000 to 12,000 new soldiers reach the front. The rest remain in the rear.

According to Russian media reports, the number of volunteers among convicts and men from the poorest regions has dropped significantly. In the cities, roundups have begun, and escapes from the army— or attempts to evade it—have increased.
You can read many stories of Russian deserters on the Iditie Liesom organization channel.

"Last year, I turned 23. I had been successfully avoiding the army for five years, but I was caught on the street in December last year. They put me in a van  .  .  .

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russian-soldiers-desert-en-masse-to-avoid-frontlines-in-ukraine/ar-BB1ohtdn
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3182 on: June 15, 2024, 11:52:52 pm »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3184 on: June 15, 2024, 11:55:11 pm »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3185 on: June 15, 2024, 11:55:40 pm »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3187 on: June 16, 2024, 12:09:57 am »
In Russia approaching the Kerch bridge:


https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1801981923629150621
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3188 on: June 16, 2024, 12:12:15 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3189 on: June 16, 2024, 12:13:13 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3190 on: June 16, 2024, 12:18:08 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3191 on: June 16, 2024, 12:24:52 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline MeganC

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3195 on: June 17, 2024, 12:34:40 pm »
In Russia approaching the Kerch bridge:


https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1801981923629150621

"A new batch of Russian T-62's on their way to the front."

LOL. The first time in seventy years that anyone has called a T-62 'new'  :silly:
RUSSIA MUST BE DESTROYED!!!

Offline MeganC

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3196 on: June 17, 2024, 12:42:52 pm »
(Russian) State TV pundits are distraught over new sanctions


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vnPEpMdRrg

Poor Russians are butt hurt that Western sanctions are hurting them. These idiots are endlessly amazing. They threaten us with nuclear war every single day and then they're upset that we don't want to do business with them.  22222frying pan
RUSSIA MUST BE DESTROYED!!!

Offline PeteS in CA

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3197 on: June 17, 2024, 12:48:18 pm »
"A new batch of Russian T-62's on their way to the front."

LOL. The first time in seventy years that anyone has called a T-62 'new'  :silly:

Well, ya goes with what ya got. Russia's T-90s, T-80s, and T-72s are getting depleted, so some/many Russian tankers will be driving what their granddads drove when they served. Kind of like with B-52, except B-52s have ben updated throughout the time in service, while T-62s having been gathering dust in reserve warehouses for several decades. All that said, when used against infantry a T-62 can do a lot of damage ... unless the infantry has TOW or Javelin missiles.
I am not and never have been a leftist.

If, as anti-Covid-vaxxers claim, https://www.poynter.org/fact-checking/2021/robert-f-kennedy-jr-said-the-covid-19-vaccine-is-the-deadliest-vaccine-ever-made-thats-not-true/ , https://gospelnewsnetwork.org/2021/11/23/covid-shots-are-the-deadliest-vaccines-in-medical-history/ , The Vaccine is deadly, where in the US have Pfizer and Moderna hidden the millions of bodies of those who died of "vaccine injury"?

Millions now living should have died. Anti-Covid-Vaxxer ghouls hardest hit.

Offline MeganC

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3198 on: June 17, 2024, 01:05:57 pm »
Russia has about 30 functioning T-34 tanks that they bought from Laos. I keep wondering when they'll get deployed to the front. You know it's coming.
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Ukraine 4
« Reply #3199 on: June 17, 2024, 01:47:16 pm »
Russia has about 30 functioning T-34 tanks that they bought from Laos. I keep wondering when they'll get deployed to the front. You know it's coming.

They bought them from Laos? 
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
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