An Answer to Roamer's earlier post.
Ahh... Thanks right off the bat,
@Mesaclone , for showing yourself to be so petty as to pointedly refuse to ping me to to the argument, either by actual ping or by the built in quotation system. . As with other things said herein, you prove yourself more than willing to discard standards and mores.
So thanks again for the sophomoric slight. It stands perfectly as a shining standard of the Tump campaign.
What you see as truth, is very different from what others see as truth...the reality is, there are roughly 340 million versions of what is "truth" within the nation. Who's truth prevails? We can't even agree amongst conservatives and amongst Christians on a single definition of truth...so rest assured, YOUR truth is of no more value than anyone elses.
Typically liberal thought... The fetid voice of indefinition. The destruction of standards. As with liberal Christianity, which has bent the words of Yeshua
and what they mean to the point that they can mean anything at all, this thought pretty well leaves Conservatism to be anything anyone wants it to be. I reject that outright.
No dear Mesaclone, there is only ONE truth. and with Conservatism, like Christianity, those approaching orthodoxy are closest to understanding... Because to them the origin of the thing is precious. They do not dare to bend the meaning.
The answer, of course, is that we must use reason and empathy and a democratic process to reach a functional compromise. On this site, we are conservatives...despite your personal claim that only you and those in complete agreement with you fit that description. But the mark of civilization...and an absolute requirement for a functional Republc is the ability to compromise, and since at least half the country has a different version of the "truth" than we do, compromise is also "what works"...in fact, it is the ONLY thing that works short of assuming dictatorial powers.[/b]
And therein lies confusion. You describe a political vehicle, not immovable truth. You describe the Republican party, truly replacing principle things, Conservatism, with political expedience. Certainly you can compromise within a political vehicle. That is what it is for... But in the meaning of things, in the definition of truth, compromise is called corruption. Truly.
In fact, that which works is timeless. A principle thing is always true. In that there is no substitution, and there can be no compromise. There is only law. Those essentials just ARE. You may as well claim the ability to mess with gravity or thermodynamics.
And the problem for you in this context is that those principles are the thing that bind us to form unity and drive that political vehicle you hold so dear... Without those things, the unorthodox creep in, and soon enough the principle things apparently dissolve in the caricature that becomes the 'reality' instead. That is the 'reality' to which you refer... A caricature that vaguely resembles the real thing, in just the same way a liberal church resembles Christianity.
Despite your protestations, the Republican party IS the only politically functional repository of conservatism in the United States.
No in fact, it is not, and that is precisely the point.
Your being part of one rather small sliver of that conservative coalition within the party does not change this fact. If conservatives cannot disagree amongst themselves whilst coming together to win national elections, than the cause of conservatism is doomed...by those who claim their pure version alone is acceptable. Narrow minded stupidity that ensures defeat...that's the hallmark of the NeverTrumpists.
Having sullied the definition of Conservatism to mean just about anything at all, It becomes nothing but a patch without rockers. But it is the rockers that define the patch - That provide authenticity. The patch has no value without the rockers, and is in fact, counterfeit. Again, a caricature. An empty vessel.
That is in fact the doom of the Conservative cause in the way you would go. Hollowed out and meaningless. In every way that same liberal church, devoid of value. Corruption and caricature. To the point that most people on this site could not define Conservatism by the numbers... Could not cite the principles they claim.
You misstate the argument...deliberately I think. The argument is that we follow the Reagan doctrine of attaining the most conservative legislation possible within a democratic process...if we can get an 80% conservative bill we take it...while fools who demand purity will damn such a bill because its 20% moderate or progressive. You forget, that we do not get to dictate policy...nor does the President...here in the real world we must operate within the realm of what is actually possible. Purity tests equal political surrender and defeat...which is why so few of us agree with your approach to politics, leadership and the Presidency.
You misstate Reagan, leaving out the resolve to never again let liberalism infect the party. And with your malformed definition of what Conservatism even IS, who the hell can say what is conservative versus moderate or progressive? It's whatever you like it to be, as malleable as the Republican party desires. You preach an empty doctrine. A blank sheet. And it is why the liberals are winning.
The one thing that you should stand up against, that we should all stand up against...you determine its best to simply accept surrender. Let me help you out...home schooling will never be enough to counter the Progressive monopoly on education. That must be faced and fought....and yes its a fight that will last generations...and can never be "ceded" to the Left. Changing your "own" is just another type of surrender, because if we can't persuade our fellow citizens of the rightness of our cause...our cause is lost. So what you are advocating is...again...defeat and surrender.
You have no cause.
In the first place, by the Conservative way of thinking, Federal meddling in education is unconstitutional. Y'all ain't fighting for that, and never will. Just like every other Conservative principle that has seen no gain and only erosion across the length of my life. Not a single win. None. Bupkis. Take the niggling little bits thrown by the clown at the front of the parade. In thirty more years you'll still be preaching the same damn thing and still nothing to show for it.
And to the contrary, if every conservative had the wherewithal of purpose, and pulled their children out of the school system, the system would necessarily collapse. And it is not surrender to do what I can. In fact that means far more - the battle at the local level - than at the federal level. And that describes the failure of your party and your cause more than anything else... Describing independence and individualism as surrender.
Sounds very pure and simple. In fact, all of us are standing for what we perceive as right and true...no less than yourself. We are as "true" of conservatives as are you, and unless all of us within that broader understanding of conservatism...not your narrow self approving version...can work in concert to fight progressivism...well...we will lose this country. Those too pure to work in this way will be at fault...that's not an accusation as much as it is a simple statement of what is.
You are progressivism. You just don't know it.
It is pure and simple. Conservatism in all its reach is well defined. And as it touches politics, it is also well defined. It stands upon pillars of truth. Principle things. Named things that contain meaning.
Those well defined things are what provide the impetus for your political vehicle. It's unity and structure are found therein. There is plenty of room for compromise beyond those pillars. But pillars have a purpose. You should think of what they do before you so blithely knock them down.
Liberalism is winning. Not by it's merit. It holds no merit. It is winning because it has no opposition. That opposition is found in those very pillars you seek to destroy.
And it isn't merely a narrow definition. It is the very marrow of the thing, and the basis of coalition.
That coalition no longer exists in the Republican party, because the Republican party does not provide service, and really never has... And it shows. With more than 60% of the country espousing conservatism, you can't hardly win an election... barely ekeing out a paltry win... In the meantime, the non-voting have become the biggest bloc of all. The disaffected. And the Republicans have been hemorrhaging members for decades. Where do you think they are going? PSST! They're going where I am.
You have it all wrong. The customer is always right, and your Republican big tent barely can pay to keep the lights on. You demand I buy your product - A product that I do not like, and in fact, cannot stand. It is vomit to me. Flatulence. Yet somehow you think I owe it to you. That you have a right to shove it down my throat and make me buy it... And then have the unmitigated gall to blame ME when I walk away and you can't keep the lights on.
The failure is not coming, it is here... That is not my fault. I am right here where I have always been. Fighting for exactly the same things I have always fought for. To lean on Reagan: I didn't leave the Republican party. The Republican party left me.
And it is pointless to support you. You suggest there is unity, for instance, in throwing fiscal conservatism under the bus... That I BETRAY my oath to my fellows made all those years ago.
LISTEN to that. Unity in betrayal.
And the price of that betrayal? Trillions upon trillions... I frankly don't give a single damn what else you do or have done... All that matters is the fiscal doom you have brought so near. A literal fiscal tsunami with a wave a thousand feet tall.
That is what betrayal brings. And then you have the sheer hubris to demand that I let you do it some more, and call it surrender when I won't.
Screw that.
