Author Topic: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'  (Read 8766 times)

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Offline Fantom

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #25 on: June 01, 2018, 11:28:16 pm »
You gonna now announce how it is up 220 today or do you just play the one-way street?


 :thumbsup:
Those who profess to favor freedom, and yet deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning, they want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters.

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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #26 on: June 01, 2018, 11:42:43 pm »
When did you get your PHD in economics.  I doubt if you know any more than I do.

@Emjay

Since you asked, I did earn a minor in economics while in engineering school.  But it doesn't even take that to learn from history.  All it takes is the ability to learn.

Let's review, shall we?  In 2009, President Baraq Obama imposed a 35% tariff on Chinese tires.  All non-Chinese tire manufacturers quickly followed suit by raising the price of their own tires, taking advantage of the artificially high price of competitor tires set by the government.  This resulted in Americans paying $1.1 billion more for tires than they would have before the tariffs were imposed.

For me personally, I saw the price of my American-made tires go up.  It was a nice windfall for the manufacturer, but it sucked for consumers.  The tariffs allegedly saved 1,200 United Steelworker jobs.  But it cost 3,700 import/export jobs.  Net job loss - 2,500 because of the tariffs.

And how did China respond?  By placing tariffs on US chicken imports.  That tariff cost US chicken growers $1 billion in lost sales.

Notice that no economics degree is required here.   We have history to teach us.  Tire tariff resulted in:
  • $1.1 billion loss of purchasing power by US consumers
  • 2,500 lost tire jobs
  • $1 billion in lost farm sales


Anyone with a functioning brain can figure out that overall, this hurt Americans.  Yet some choose to ignore history.  Is that you?
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Fantom

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #27 on: June 01, 2018, 11:47:29 pm »


Well, in essence a tariff is a tax. Paid for by the consumers in the country imposing. Note I said "consumers", not Citizens. Thus it makes illegals pay too.

Which gets to my point. It broadens the tax base, which needs to happen. Using the tax code via the illegal 16th(never properly passed) to transfer wealth from a ever narrowing "elite" taxpayer to an ever demanding tax consumer is marxist/socialism. 

Such is not a good thing, and has never.. in the history of the world, ended well.

Having said that, lets look inside the costs. Steel is at about $800.00 a metric tonne ... a car uses about 1.5 tonne. A 25% tariff adds $300.00 to the price of a 20,000-50,000 dollar car.

 Most costs are labor ..or Value Added Cost... costs of production.  That is why a VAT tax is the worst.. although it is broad based.

Those who profess to favor freedom, and yet deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning, they want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters.

Frederick Douglass

Offline darroll

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #28 on: June 01, 2018, 11:48:01 pm »
This surely saved ALCOA Aluminum. They have been teetering on the brink for many years.

Offline edpc

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #29 on: June 01, 2018, 11:51:48 pm »
Back before the federal income tax tariffs & duties were the primary means the government used to fund itself, BTW.


Yes and without a large regular standing army and no social programs, their operating costs were minimal.  Individuals do not have to pay taxes on a regular basis. It is withheld from their pay, so it does not have the same impact as a payout.  Eliminate the income tax and go across the board with tariffs now and see what happens when people are paying higher prices for everything. There will be pitchforks and torches on the DC mall.
I disagree.  Circle gets the square.

Offline Fantom

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #30 on: June 01, 2018, 11:53:08 pm »
@Emjay




Anyone with a functioning brain can figure out that overall, this hurt Americans. 

Did it? Ever take a chem class...... you have not balanced you equation.  Maybe two lost $7.00Hr jobs moving chinese imports vrs one $35.00 job actually making produckts...then taxes paid and less welfare out.

You need to do some basic thinkin' seems to me.
Those who profess to favor freedom, and yet deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning, they want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters.

Frederick Douglass

Online libertybele

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #31 on: June 02, 2018, 12:31:32 am »
So in essence the supposed Trump tax cuts that so many raved about are basically not going to mean squat because consumers will be paying more for goods because of the steel and aluminum tariffs and less people will be able to afford these goods.  The less people buy goods, the less labor is needed and eventually jobs will be lost. 

Meanwhile the deficit continues to rise.

So ... explain to me how this is a good thing??
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Offline edpc

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #32 on: June 02, 2018, 12:34:00 am »
So in essence the supposed Trump tax cuts that so many raved about are basically not going to mean squat because consumers will be paying more for goods because of the steel and aluminum tariffs and less people will be able to afford these goods.  The less people buy goods, the less labor is needed and eventually jobs will be lost.


Well, it’s not crushing immediately. They would have to be in effect for a while.
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #33 on: June 02, 2018, 12:34:06 am »
Did it? Ever take a chem class...... you have not balanced you equation.  Maybe two lost $7.00Hr jobs moving chinese imports vrs one $35.00 job actually making produckts...then taxes paid and less welfare out.

You need to do some basic thinkin' seems to me.

@Fantom

Balancing the equation?  Did you forget about the $1.1 billion in higher costs?

Let's ignore for a moment the loss in import jobs.  Looking only at the 1,200 union jobs, each job cost American consumers over $900,000.  How does that balance out for you?

And when the tariffs went away, those same union jobs disappeared.

Then of course we also have the chicken farmers who lost $1 billion in sales because our tariffs against China as a payoff to the United Steelworkers Union caused China to retaliate with their own tariffs.  Human nature at work in our economy once again.  Go figure.

But I must admit, it is quite invigorating to see someone on this board actively defend Baraq Obama's trade policy.  Will wonders ever cease?
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Fantom

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #34 on: June 02, 2018, 12:37:26 am »
So in essence the supposed Trump tax cuts that so many raved about are basically not going to mean squat because consumers will be paying more for goods because of the steel and aluminum tariffs and less people will be able to afford these goods.  The less people buy goods, the less labor is needed and eventually jobs will be lost. 

Meanwhile the deficit continues to rise.

So ... explain to me how this is a good thing??

Once again ..basic chem.

So a car cost $300.00 more... a beer can...$0.0002. A American will make a living wage....instead of shuffling 'Round chinese goods for minimum/+welfare.

Balance your equation.
Those who profess to favor freedom, and yet deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning, they want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters.

Frederick Douglass

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #35 on: June 02, 2018, 12:43:50 am »
Once again ..basic chem.

So a car cost $300.00 more... a beer can...$0.0002. A American will make a living wage....instead of shuffling 'Round chinese goods for minimum/+welfare.

Balance your equation.

So you are perfectly OK with American consumers forking out nearly one million dollars to save an overpriced union job that wouldn't exist in a competitive market?
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Online libertybele

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #36 on: June 02, 2018, 12:43:51 am »
Once again ..basic chem.

So a car cost $300.00 more... a beer can...$0.0002. A American will make a living wage....instead of shuffling 'Round chinese goods for minimum/+welfare.

Balance your equation.

??? Who's to guarantee that ALL Americans will be making a living wage or a wage affording them goods at the higher price??  These tariffs are going to have an affect on the entire economy. If raising wages cuts into the new profits or greed (imagine that) takes over, you won't see rising wages, you will only see rising costs of goods.

Quite simple; people have less money to purchase goods, less goods will be produced which boils down to loss jobs.

Oh ... and did I mention ... that I am sure that Trump himself and family won't be nearly affected if at all in comparison to what this is going to do to the average Joe or those on fixed incomes.  Yeppers ... great for the economy.  NOT!!
« Last Edit: June 02, 2018, 12:46:42 am by libertybele »
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Online corbe

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #37 on: June 02, 2018, 12:55:26 am »
   At $3/gl, Gas has already eaten up most of that December Tax Cut (the only thing those varmits did) for many Americans, Venezuela/Iran continuing their downward spiral and now Tariffs, more pressure on the economy (unless you own Oil Stock)*, 5 months before the Midterms, just doesn't make sense to me.

  * Chevron and Shell Stock Holder.
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline Fantom

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #38 on: June 02, 2018, 12:56:01 am »
@Fantom

Balancing the equation?  Did you forget about the $1.1 billion in higher costs?

Let's ignore for a moment the loss in import jobs.  Looking only at the 1,200 union jobs, each job cost American consumers over $900,000.  How does that balance out for you?

And when the tariffs went away, those same union jobs disappeared.

Then of course we also have the chicken farmers who lost $1 billion in sales because our tariffs against China as a payoff to the United Steelworkers Union caused China to retaliate with their own tariffs.  Human nature at work in our economy once again.  Go figure.

But I must admit, it is quite invigorating to see someone on this board actively defend Baraq Obama's trade policy.  Will wonders ever cease?

Last first as is my wont..... You do know Ronald Reagan imposed tariffs. Don't you? Nice try at that logical fallacy. In fact, our founders put them in the Constitution... as the main means of funding the federal government. I am saddened to see someone on this board so actively debase our Founders and Constitution. Yet not surprised.

Next easy pitch.....Fantom.......pulls his cap down,looks at the setting sun and Points to right field...he spits.... the pitch, swing ...CRACK.....it is going going gone..... we can make steel..
..... chinese still have to eat.

To balance your equation, the chinese lose billions at the cost of their consumers. Our chickens will still be sold. Human nature at work is game theory. Hungry will pay anything to eat.

***cool cat***

Need I really go on?

Postscript: In the distance , a car alarm chirps
« Last Edit: June 02, 2018, 01:03:26 am by Fantom »
Those who profess to favor freedom, and yet deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning, they want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters.

Frederick Douglass

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #39 on: June 02, 2018, 01:31:59 am »
Last first as is my wont..... You do know Ronald Reagan imposed tariffs. Don't you?

Yes.  I also know he was dead wrong to do so.  Tariffs and quotas effectively destroyed the US auto manufacturing industry.  They made Japan a much tougher competitor.  These policies pushed Japan into the luxury car market, creating competition for American manufacturers where none existed before.  And these policies also allowed American companies to cut production and raise prices.  By 1985, Americans were paying $11 billion more per year for cars than they would have without the tariffs.

You want to talk steel tariffs?  Reagan's steel tariffs cost Steel manufacturers 52,000 due to loss of competition, price increases, and production cutbacks.

Or how about computer chips?  Huge increases in computer chip prices because of the tariffs made American computer manufacturers less competitive against other nations.  Hence loss of market share and loss of jobs.

History is a great teacher.


Nice try at that logical fallacy. In fact, our founders put them in the Constitution... as the main means of funding the federal government.

Except that is not how our government is currently being funded.  And it has nothing at all to do with this discussion either.  If you wish to discuss eliminating all taxes but tariffs, then by all means start another thread.  But this one is about the affect tariffs have on the economy - not how our government was funded by them two centuries ago.


I am saddened to see someone on this board so actively debase our Founders and Constitution. Yet not surprised.

lol.  You're funny.  Pathetic, but funny.


Next easy pitch.....Fantom.......pulls his cap down,looks at the setting sun and Points to right field...he spits.... the pitch, swing ...CRACK.....it is going going gone..... we can make steel..
..... chinese still have to eat.

To balance your equation, the chinese lose billions at the cost of their consumers.

Less than 1% of steel imports come from China.  Less than 1%.  If anything, we should be buying more of it since they are willing to pay part of the cost themselves.  The more we buy, the more bankrupt they become.

But heck no, you would rather have every other manufacturer jack its prices up by 25% and pay them instead, and allow American manufacturers to become even less competitive so that Chinese steel manufacturers for the first time will finally be able to beat them on a level playing field.


Our chickens will still be sold.

What part of "$1 billion in lost sales" do you not get?  No, our chickens will not be sold if no one buys them.  (See:  Chrysler, AMC, GMC, GE, etc.)


Human nature at work is game theory.

Human nature is the one thing you continue to ignore.


Hungry will pay anything to eat.

At what cost?  Americans have shown that they will pay $5 for a gallon of gas.  But there is an opportunity cost to doing so.  If I have to pay 25% more for AMERICAN steel, then I have less money to purchase something else.  And somebody's income will suffer because of it.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline edpc

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #40 on: June 02, 2018, 01:36:29 am »
Last first as is my wont.....



! No longer available


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Offline skeeter

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #41 on: June 02, 2018, 01:38:22 am »

Yes and without a large regular standing army and no social programs, their operating costs were minimal.  Individuals do not have to pay taxes on a regular basis. It is withheld from their pay, so it does not have the same impact as a payout.  Eliminate the income tax and go across the board with tariffs now and see what happens when people are paying higher prices for everything. There will be pitchforks and torches on the DC mall.

I wasn't suggesting we go back to funding the government with tariffs. I was suggesting they are not the anathema the purists seem to think.

And my secondary point was, according to economics 101, there will be no long term net effect of raising them.

My main point being what Trump is doing is a necessary step in renegotiating trade deals that, while very profitable for a very few at the top, have been hurting average Americans for decades.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2018, 01:41:35 am by skeeter »

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #42 on: June 02, 2018, 01:40:02 am »
You should try the soup.

If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #43 on: June 02, 2018, 01:41:30 am »
! No longer availablehttps://www.reaganlibrary.gov/sites/default/files/archives/speeches/1988/112688a.htm
Radio Address to the Nation on the Canadian Elections and Free Trade
November 26, 1988

My fellow Americans:

This week, as we prepared for Thanksgiving, Canada held an important election, and I'm pleased to again send my congratulations to Prime Minister Mulroney. One of the important issues in the Canadian election was trade. And like our own citizens earlier this month, our neighbors have sent a strong message, rejecting protectionism and reaffirming that more trade, not less, is the wave of the future.

Here in America, as we reflect on the many things we have to be grateful for, we should take a moment to recognize that one of the key factors behind our nation's great prosperity is the open trade policy that allows the American people to freely exchange goods and services with free people around the world. The freedom to trade is not a new issue for America. In 1776 our Founding Fathers signed the Declaration of Independence, charging the British with a number of offenses, among them, and I quote, ``cutting off our trade with all parts of the world,'' end quote.

And that same year, a Scottish economist named Adam Smith launched another revolution with a book entitled ``The Wealth of Nations,'' which exposed for all time the folly of protectionism. Over the past 200 years, not only has the argument against tariffs and trade barriers won nearly universal agreement among economists but it has also proven itself in the real world, where we have seen free-trading nations prosper while protectionist countries fall behind.

America's most recent experiment with protectionism was a disaster for the working men and women of this country. When Congress passed the Smoot-Hawley tariff in 1930, we were told that it would protect America from foreign competition and save jobs in this country -- the same line we hear today. The actual result was the Great Depression, the worst economic catastrophe in our history; one out of four Americans were thrown out of work. Two years later, when I cast my first ballot for President, I voted for Franklin Delano Roosevelt, who opposed protectionism and called for the repeal of that disastrous tariff.

Ever since that time, the American people have stayed true to our heritage by rejecting the siren song of protectionism. In recent years, the trade deficit led some misguided politicians to call for protectionism, warning that otherwise we would lose jobs. But they were wrong again. In fact, the United States not only didn't lose jobs, we created more jobs than all the countries of Western Europe, Canada, and Japan combined. The record is clear that when America's total trade has increased, American jobs have also increased. And when our total trade has declined, so have the number of jobs.

Part of the difficulty in accepting the good news about trade is in our words. We too often talk about trade while using the vocabulary of war. In war, for one side to win, the other must lose. But commerce is not warfare. Trade is an economic alliance that benefits both countries. There are no losers, only winners. And trade helps strengthen the free world.

Yet today protectionism is being used by some American politicians as a cheap form of nationalism, a fig leaf for those unwilling to maintain America's military strength and who lack the resolve to stand up to real enemies -- countries that would use violence against us or our allies. Our peaceful trading partners are not our enemies; they are our allies. We should beware of the demagogs who are ready to declare a trade war against our friends -- weakening our economy, our national security, and the entire free world -- all while cynically waving the American flag. The expansion of the international economy is not a foreign invasion; it is an American triumph, one we worked hard to achieve, and something central to our vision of a peaceful and prosperous world of freedom.

After the Second World War, America led the way to dismantle trade barriers and create a world trading system that set the stage for decades of unparalleled economic growth. And in one week, when important multilateral trade talks are held in Montreal, we will be in the forefront of efforts to improve this system. We want to open more markets for our products, to see to it that all nations play by the rules, and to seek improvement in such areas as dispute resolution and agriculture. We also want to bring the benefits of free trade to new areas, including services, investment, and the protection of intellectual property. Our negotiators will be working hard for all of us.

Yes, back in 1776, our Founding Fathers believed that free trade was worth fighting for. And we can celebrate their victory because today trade is at the core of the alliance that secure the peace and guarantee our freedom; it is the source of our prosperity and the path to an even brighter future for America.

Until next week, thanks for listening, and God bless you.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2018, 01:42:07 am by Once-Ler »

Offline Fantom

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #44 on: June 02, 2018, 01:43:48 am »
Yes.  I also know he was dead wrong to do so.  Tariffs and quotas effectively destroyed the US auto manufacturing industry.  They made Japan a much tougher competitor. 

I do not do the post dissemble. It is too messy. Thus I reply with one post to your post.

Our Auto industry was destroyed before Reagan. Unions/poor quality/EPA. Had nothing to do with Reagan's tariffs.
Those who profess to favor freedom, and yet deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning, they want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters.

Frederick Douglass

Offline edpc

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #45 on: June 02, 2018, 01:45:12 am »
My main point being what Trump is doing is a necessary step in renegotiating trade deals that, while very profitable for a very few at the top, have been hurting average Americans for decades.


If they are in place temporarily and lead to trade negotiations, which I believe is his plan, it may work.  However, as a long-term policy, recent history shows they’re counter-productive.
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Offline skeeter

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #46 on: June 02, 2018, 01:46:57 am »

If they are in place temporarily and lead to trade negotiations, which I believe is his plan, it may work.  However, as a long-term policy, recent history shows they’re counter-productive.

You and I agree.

Offline Fantom

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #47 on: June 02, 2018, 01:47:58 am »
[/b] No longer available[/url]https://www.reaganlibrary.gov/sites/default/files/archives/speeches/1988/112688a.htm
Radio Address to the Nation on the Canadian Elections and Free Trade
November 26, 1988

My fellow Americans:

After the Second World War, America led the way to dismantle trade barriers and create a world trading system that set the stage for decades of unparalleled economic growth. And in one week, when important multilateral trade talks are held in Montreal, we will be in the forefront of efforts to improve this system. We want to open more markets for our products, to see to it that all nations play by the rules, and to seek improvement in such areas as dispute resolution and agriculture. We also want to bring the benefits of free trade to new areas, including services, investment, and the protection of intellectual property. President Trump will be working hard for all of us.

Yes, back in 1776, our Founding Fathers believed that free trade was worth fighting for. And we can celebrate their victory because today trade is at the core of the alliance that secure the peace and guarantee our freedom; it is the source of our prosperity and the path to an even brighter future for America.

Until next week, thanks for listening, and God bless you.

Free trade... do you think Ronald meant they put a tariff of 25% on our goods and we leave our markets open.

No that is not what Reagan championed.

FTFY
« Last Edit: June 02, 2018, 01:51:30 am by Fantom »
Those who profess to favor freedom, and yet deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning, they want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters.

Frederick Douglass

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #48 on: June 02, 2018, 01:53:50 am »
How successful was Reagan in forcing Japan to adopt a trade policy that suited our needs instead of theirs?
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Hatch: Trump steel and aluminum tariffs are a 'tax hike on Americans'
« Reply #49 on: June 02, 2018, 01:56:45 am »
FTFY
@Fantom

You are responding to what President Reagan said and believed...so FTFR I guess.