Jeff Sessions: Chronic pain sufferers should ‘take an aspirin and tough it out’

[GrouchoTex]

@GrouchoTex
Except that as AG he does have the power to impact millions of people.  Hospitals, doctors, nurses and of course the patient.  The vast majority of people who just want the pain to go away.  Most don't want to take the pills and would stop in a second if they could.

Yet, what can he legally do?
He can merely crack down on the illegal use and abuse of the drugs, which is what the current law requires him to do, anyway
There is not much he can do beyond that.

One a brighter note:
A company in Carolina, ( I do not remember if it North or South), is now experimenting with a more potent non-addictive pain killer than what is available now.
It won't be out for a while, but it is a step in the right direction.

[Emjay]

Sessions never said "chronic pain suffers" and he wasn't referring to them.  He was talking about people who have transient pain and the doctors who prescribe opioids as the first pain reliever. 

Sessions's only point was these drugs are too addictive to be a first choice pain reliever.  He used Gen. Kelly as an example--he had minor hand surgery and his doctor wanted to prescribe an opioid for the pain.  Kelly refused.




! No longer available


@libertybele

Excellent point from a fairer perspective.  It's kinda sad that we here, who consider ourselves media savvy, are so quick to jump on media talking points.

Of course, his 'take an aspirin' thing was taken out of context and not his main point at all.

But he still should leave comments on this pain killer problem to more knowledgeable people.

[roamer_1]

Sessions made a huge mistake with this press conference.  I believe he is actually ignorant about the real world in which people suffer.

He is right about attempting to combat the opiod addiction, but saying just take an aspirin is an insult and makes him sound really stupid.

He is not open to new ideas.  He is violently against medical Marijuana which I am in favor of because he doesn't know that much about it.

@Emjay
You might read on... you may have jumped to a conclusion or two (as I had).

Did you happen to get to @Suppressed 's post recording his actual statement?
http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,304047.msg1604951.html#msg1604951

As to medical dope, I too am against it, and I know about all there is to know about it.
Not so much for those who have actual need, though I would hope that need to be fleeting ... But because, like opiods  (and alcohol for that matter), systemic abuse is rife, and nearly unavoidable.
 

[driftdiver]

Yet, what can he legally do?
He can merely crack down on the illegal use and abuse of the drugs, which is what the current law requires him to do, anyway
There is not much he can do beyond that.

One a brighter note:
A company in Carolina, ( I do not remember if it North or South), is now experimenting with a more potent non-addictive pain killer than what is available now.
It won't be out for a while, but it is a step in the right direction.

@GrouchoTex
Legally?  Quite a bit.  He can change how these drugs are handled.  They can change the prescription length, something which has been talked about.  Changing the maximum prescription length to 7 days.   Requiring patients to get a new prescription every 7 days.   They can increase the reporting requirements for the healthcare providers, increasing their workload and opportunity for error.   An error which would result in jail time and loss of their ability to work.   The list of things he can do is extensive.

[Right_in_Virginia]

People have different pain levels.  Some people here have described ordeals I don't even want to think about.

Within the last year, I fell and broke my arm.  It was a pretty bad break and required a pin to be inserted.  They kept asking me about my pain level on a scale of one to ten.  I always said zero because I never felt any pain at all.

I apologize in advance @Emjay for my frustration because I do not know how else to say this:  The sole purpose of my post was simple:  Jeff Sessions DID NOT say people with chronic pain should take an aspirin.  His point, clearly made in his speech, was that opioids are not the best treatment for  transient pain because they are so addictive.  Yes, he did say "buck up" and take something else for your minor surgery and sprains (and know your pain will pass with healing).

Individuals with low pain thresholds or long-term opioid use need to discuss alternatives with their doctors.  And together they should determine if the patient's hesitancy to try a different treatment plan is due to an addiction rather than pain level.  If so ... it may be an option to get help for that and start over with something less addictive.  If it's not an addiction, the doctor should keep prescribing the damn drug.

Again, please don't take this the wrong way, but I don't care what the patient and doctor decide.  But a periodic conversation about long-term pain management should be held with or without Jeff Session's suggestions.

[INVAR]

@INVAR
You are the case that proves the point.  You'll attack anyone who isn't perfect in your eyes, denounce and insult them.    Meanwhile the left moves on its merry way.

Excuse you - but your party is marching Left merrily.    The leader of your party in the Senate did more than just verbally attack Conservatives - he vowed and acted upon 'crushing' grassroots Conservatives that dared to challenge the Establishment Oligarchy that funded Obamas agenda.  Then there's the rules changes made in the last two conventions designed to prevent and sideline grassroots Conservatives.  As to denouncements and insults, they have been flung at Conservatives for the last two years who have anything critical or negative to opine about Trump. So you are projecting at best.

Your party has control of both houses and the presidency.  They refused to get rid of ObamaCare, are pushing Amnesty by another name and just decided to outspend Obama to the tune of TRILLIONS. 

But okay and good... you go on ahead and keep doing the same stupid shit you and your party have been doing for the last 20-plus years and see where it gets you.

The AG is an embarrassment and a bane to liberty, period.

[driftdiver]

I apologize in advance @Emjay for my frustration because I do not know how else to say this:  The sole purpose of my post was simple:  Jeff Sessions DID NOT say people with chronic pain should take an aspirin.  His point, clearly made in his speech, was that opioids are not the best treatment for  transient pain because they are so addictive.  Yes, he did say "buck up" and take something else for your minor surgery and sprains (and know your pain will pass with healing).

Individuals with low pain thresholds or long-term opioid use need to discuss alternatives with their doctors.  And together they should determine if the patient's hesitancy to try a different treatment plan is due to an addiction rather than pain level.  If so ... it may be an option to get help for that and start over with something less addictive.  If it's not an addiction, the doctor should keep prescribing the damn drug.

Again, please don't take this the wrong way, but I don't care what the patient and doctor decide.  But a periodic conversation about long-term pain management should be held with or without Jeff Session's suggestions.

@Right_in_Virginia
You're reading a lot into what he said and didn't say.

His message was clear, take an aspirin and buck up.   His message was very condescending towards people who don't just tough it out.

[Emjay]

All Western medicine does is treat the symptoms and not the ailment.   My wife had had a chronic pain issue for about 10 years.  The doctors are pretty much useless and restricting her pain medicine doesn't solve the problem. 

She has only found relief through non-traditional treatments.  Ironically the initial problem started shortly after she had a pneumonia vaccine.

I was agreeing with much of what you posted until you posted this.

I just cannot stand people who AMA haters and go for junk medicine.  I especially hate it because my niece is way into that mindset.  I can just hear her say 'AMA' and 'Big Pharma' with total contempt.

What she doesn't treat with contempt is some alternate medicine quack that she spend thousands of dollars on which, of course, her insurance did not cover.

Doctors aren't God, even though some of think they are but they are up to date on the latest VALID treatments.

I also cannot stand vaccine haters.  Vaccines have saved so many lives yet a certain mindset of people blame them for everything and refuse to take them.

[GrouchoTex]

@GrouchoTex
Legally?  Quite a bit.  He can change how these drugs are handled.  They can change the prescription length, something which has been talked about.  Changing the maximum prescription length to 7 days.   Requiring patients to get a new prescription every 7 days.   They can increase the reporting requirements for the healthcare providers, increasing their workload and opportunity for error.   An error which would result in jail time and loss of their ability to work.   The list of things he can do is extensive.

Wouldn't any of these actions require a change in Federal law?
Wouldn't Congress have to vote on these things?
Does the AG have the authority to do any of these things without changes to the existing laws?

[driftdiver]

Remember this is the guy who also wants to expand the property seizure without due process.

[Sanguine]

Remember this is the guy who also wants to expand the property seizure without due process.

And, I think most of us agree that this is not a conservative ideal.

[RoosGirl]

Sessions's only point was these drugs are too addictive to be a first choice pain reliever.  He used Gen. Kelly as an example--he had minor hand surgery and his doctor wanted to prescribe an opioid for the pain.  Kelly refused.

@libertybele

Well hell, my grandpa had bad reactions to novocain, so any time he needed dental work done he decided to just do without.  I guess since he did that we should all just "man up" and say no to it any time we need dental work.

[Emjay]

I apologize in advance @Emjay for my frustration because I do not know how else to say this:  The sole purpose of my post was simple:  Jeff Sessions DID NOT say people with chronic pain should take an aspirin.  His point, clearly made in his speech, was that opioids are not the best treatment for  transient pain because they are so addictive.  Yes, he did say "buck up" and take something else for your minor surgery and sprains (and know your pain will pass with healing).

Individuals with low pain thresholds or long-term opioid use need to discuss alternatives with their doctors.  And together they should determine if the patient's hesitancy to try a different treatment plan is due to an addiction rather than pain level.  If so ... it may be an option to get help for that and start over with something less addictive.  If it's not an addiction, the doctor should keep prescribing the damn drug.

Again, please don't take this the wrong way, but I don't care what the patient and doctor decide.  But a periodic conversation about long-term pain management should be held with or without Jeff Session's suggestions.

Hey, don't apologize to me.  I agree with you.

Jeff's comments were pounced upon and exaggerated.  He did not say just take an aspirin, it was in the context of don't reach for a pill unless you really need it.

I was saying I don't feel much pain and I'm either lucky or healthy.  I didn't feel pain when I broke my arm although people seemed to think I should.

[Emjay]

@Emjay
You might read on... you may have jumped to a conclusion or two (as I had).

Did you happen to get to @Suppressed 's post recording his actual statement?
http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,304047.msg1604951.html#msg1604951

As to medical dope, I too am against it, and I know about all there is to know about it.
Not so much for those who have actual need, though I would hope that need to be fleeting ... But because, like opiods  (and alcohol for that matter), systemic abuse is rife, and nearly unavoidable.

Oh, yeah.  I agree.  Sessions needs to understand the danger of the media trap.  He fell into one and has been unduly abused.

I still don't like his stand on Pot which I think is a knee jerk reaction by people of a certain age about Pot.

[roamer_1]

Yet, what can he legally do?
He can merely crack down on the illegal use and abuse of the drugs, which is what the current law requires him to do, anyway
There is not much he can do beyond that.

One a brighter note:
A company in Carolina, ( I do not remember if it North or South), is now experimenting with a more potent non-addictive pain killer than what is available now.
It won't be out for a while, but it is a step in the right direction.

In my experience with chronic pain and opiods, the whip-saw effect of regulation was disconcerting.
In the end, prior to my weaning off, I had to jump through many hoops to get my fix.  I was on a 30 day prescription, but I had to show up in person at my docs office and obtain an hand-written prescription every_single_time to renew. Then that prescription had to be presented to the pharmacist within 24 hrs, by me personally, in order to secure the pills.

To a guy with awful pain, and circadian trouble because of it, especially because I was out of narcs and coming off them besides, by the time I could obtain a new script... jumping through those hoops was excruciating. In their efforts to regulate, they are paying hell to those who actually need it.

But to be fair, dragging me around by the nose is responsible in large part for formulating an alternate means of pain relief. I knew addiction was not good for me, and was looking already... but  the dog-and-pony show accelerated my efforts like a turbocharger.

 

[driftdiver]

And, I think most of us agree that this is not a conservative ideal.

.

@Sanguine
I dont see that on Bills list?

Bill likes the Federal govt, he's not big on states rights.

[Right_in_Virginia]

@Right_in_Virginia
You're reading a lot into what he said and didn't say.

His message was clear, take an aspirin and buck up.   His message was very condescending towards people who don't just tough it out.

No .. I listened to him.  Sessions's whole point was that addictive opioids should not be the first treatment in transient pain management.  Granted, I've said this more clearly than he, but Sessions was not being "condescending", he was being rational.

Your argument reminds me of the discussions about stopping the overuse of antibiotics. Everyone thought this was great advice---for other people. Now we have superbugs.  Everyone thinks stopping the opioid addiction crisis is necessary ---but apparently with other people.  Now we have more addicts.

How does one determine if opioid use for "pain management"  has not morphed into flat out addiction?  How does one reasonably measure the actual pain being experienced if the patient is too high to tell?  And if the drug is removed, are the subsequent symptoms from actual pain or withdrawal?

Is it not best for a patient, in consultation with his or her health care provider, to follow a non-addictive pain management plan, buck up and not risk addiction for transient pain??

I just don't understand the problem you've got with this.

@driftdiver

[driftdiver]

Wouldn't any of these actions require a change in Federal law?
Wouldn't Congress have to vote on these things?
Does the AG have the authority to do any of these things without changes to the existing laws?

@GrouchoTex
Most of it is through Federal Regulations.   The most he would have to do is work with another Dept to get them to make the change.

The laws are written to give the agencies a lot of leeway.   Congress just made a law to make it easier for him to control these drugs.

[GrouchoTex]

And, I think most of us agree that this is not a conservative ideal.

Agreed

[driftdiver]

No .. I listened to him.  Sessions's whole point was that addictive opioids should not be the first treatment in transient pain management.  Granted, I've said this more clearly than he, but Sessions was not being "condescending", he was being rational.

Your argument reminds me of the discussions about stopping the overuse of antibiotics. Everyone thought this was great advice---for other people. Now we have superbugs.  Everyone thinks stopping the opioid addiction crisis is necessary ---but apparently with other people.  Now we have more addicts.

How does one determine if opioid use for "pain management"  has not morphed into flat out addiction?  How does one reasonably measure the actual pain being experienced if the patient is too high to tell?  And if the drug is removed, are the subsequent symptoms from actual pain or withdrawal?

Is it not best for a patient, in consultation with his or her health care provider, to follow a non-addictive pain management plan, buck up and not risk addiction for transient pain??

I just don't understand the problem you've got with this.

@driftdiver

@Right_in_Virginia

If thats what he meant then he should have said it.  but he didnt

he said people should tough it out

[GrouchoTex]

@GrouchoTex
Most of it is through Federal Regulations.   The most he would have to do is work with another Dept to get them to make the change.

The laws are written to give the agencies a lot of leeway.   Congress just made a law to make it easier for him to control these drugs.

Sorry to note that Congress has decided they do not want to be in the lawmaking business.
Never a good idea to take the laws out of the lawmakers hands, even if they can be idiots, at times.

[INVAR]

No .. I listened to him.  Sessions's whole point was that addictive opioids should not be the first treatment in transient pain management.  Granted, I've said this more clearly than he, but Sessions was not being "condescending", he was being rational.

Not his place to make public or policy statements unless he intends on criminalizing and using law enforcement and the courts to wage war upon what it is he is targeting.

He needs to leave discussion of medical and drug treatment to the Surgeon General.

[roamer_1]

I just cannot stand people who AMA haters and go for junk medicine.  I especially hate it because my niece is way into that mindset.  I can just hear her say 'AMA' and 'Big Pharma' with total contempt.

What she doesn't treat with contempt is some alternate medicine quack that she spend thousands of dollars on which, of course, her insurance did not cover.

Doctors aren't God, even though some of think they are but they are up to date on the latest VALID treatments.

I also cannot stand vaccine haters.  Vaccines have saved so many lives yet a certain mindset of people blame them for everything and refuse to take them.

@Emjay

I am, part and parcel, what you hate then.
But I see that the other way around.

When I was using western med for treatment, I was spending 200-1500 bucks a visit to various doctors, and had a 300-500 dollar a month habit toward pharmaceuticals... All of which were designed to maintain... to keep me exactly in that state.

OTOH, the most I ever paid to a 'quack' was a pound of tobacco , and most of my medicine is foraged for free, or readily available as food.

And take a guess which one is actually working better.

[Right_in_Virginia]

@Right_in_Virginia

If thats what he meant then he should have said it.  but he didnt

he said people should tough it out

For minor surgeries .... i.e. transient, not chronic, pain

[corbe]

@corbe.  I wish you would tell us more about that.  Why did you have to have back surgery and did it help at all?  I've heard that back surgery seldom helps the original problem.

    A blue hair pulled in front of me in Houston in 3/82 I laid my new Yamaha 920 down to keep from going into her back windshield, head first.  Crushed two vertebrae in my lower back and 2 in my neck.  After 5 back surgeries and 2 neck surgeries/multiple rods and screws over a span of 20 years I can walk, jog and sit at my computer for hours discussing the latest Trump follies, so yea, it helped me.  I couldn't walk for 6 months.

What opioids did you take and how dependent were you?  Could you get through a day without them.

   All of them whether they were legally prescribed or not.  On the second part, NO, I was convinced I couldn't live without them, classic definition of serious addiction.

And most of all, how did you break the habit?

   Simply picked the better of two options, a pill free life. I have been clean for so long I've forgotten what those years were like.