Coast Guard commandant signals he will resist Trump's military transgender ban

[240B]

Military service is not conscripted or mandatory. Anyone can resign or simply get out at their next EAOS.


It is crazy for someone to join the Military as it is, and then try to change the military to suit themselves. If you don't like the military, then simply don't join up, or get out. What is the problem?


I couldn't sign up to work for Intel or Motorola, and then decide I don't like the social policies of the CEO and therefore I refuse to follow them. (Your're fired!)


In what world do these people live? In what world does this kind of thing actually work? Reality doesn't work like that.

[Wingnut]

I never said I won't. At that, I never even responded to you. I just hadn't gotten around to it yet.

I always take no response as a big F U. 

[Emjay]

I always take no response as a big F U.

I don't because I am also of the tribe with problems getting around to things.

[Emjay]

Military service is not conscripted or mandatory. Anyone can resign or simply get out at their next EAOS.


It is crazy for someone to join the Military as it is, and then try to change the military to suit themselves. If you don't like the military, then simply don't join up, or get out. What is the problem?


I couldn't sign up to work for Intel or Motorola, and then decide I don't like the social policies of the CEO and therefore I refuse to follow them. (Your're fired!)


In what world do these people live? In what world does this kind of thing actually work? Reality doesn't work like that.

True but you forget what the climate was when they joined.  We had history's worst president trying to force all sorts of horrible things on us.

[Wingnut]

I don't because I am also of the tribe with problems getting around to things.

I'm of the Fugawe Tribe.  Even when I don't know where I am... I have time to send smoke signals.

[Sighlass]

Get the liberal out of our military. The goal of the military is not to perform social experiments, nor is it a 4 year program to get your free sex change.

[Free Vulcan]

Trump needs to make a call to the Admiral and inform him that he expects to see his letter of resignation on his desk within 24 hours or he will personally go to this Coastie's office and fire him in person.

No kidding. I was always under the impression that you could not publicly go against the CinC. This guy needs frog marched out of his office.

[240B]

No kidding. I was always under the impression that you could not publicly go against the CinC. This guy needs frog marched out of his office.

That could be what he wants. What he did is obviously against the UCMJ. The only way what he did makes any sense at all is if he is setting up a political career after his military service. Having a record of bucking Trump, and bucking military protocol would be a badge of honor if he intends to run as a Liberal Democrat.

[truth_seeker]

I have no doubt he will.  Better than serving a Commander in Chief who thinks so little of the military that he'd blindside its leadership by tweeting a change in policy without advance warning, hanging them out to dry to deal with the fallout affecting hundreds if not thousands of their personnel.

How many of the military members are affected?

You seem to NT know, since you speculate it may be hundreds, or thousands. What if it is fewer than 100?

What do you believe abut the cost to taxpayers, for lost productivity during "transforming?"

What do you even know about "morale?" Maybe other servicemen dare not complain, lest Obama-era officers punish them?

[Free Vulcan]

That could be what he wants. What he did is obviously against the UMCJ. The only way what he did makes any sense at all is if he is setting up a political career after his military service. Having a record of bucking Trump, and bucking military protocol would be a badge of honor if he intends to run as a Liberal Democrat.

You might be on to something there.

[Emjay]

How many of the military members are affected?

You seem to NT know, since you speculate it may be hundreds, or thousands. What if it is fewer than 100?

What do you believe abut the cost to taxpayers, for lost productivity during "transforming?"

What do you even know about "morale?" Maybe other servicemen dare not complain, lest Obama-era officers punish them?

I read somewhere that it involves 800 service persons.  Not sure if that's right.

[Emjay]

I read somewhere that it involves 800 service persons.  Not sure if that's right.

 

I looked up the original source and it looks like the CG General actually made the statement in public.

I thought there were psychological tests given before people were accepted into the military.  It might be a good idea to check those out now and see if any of the Trans people gave false answers which would be cause for immediate dismissal.

[ABX]

I read somewhere that it involves 800 service persons.  Not sure if that's right.

I bet they have no clue. It could be just 5 people. Some of the numbers I've seen are crazy though. Some are reporting 8,000, others reporting 15,000. (yea right).

http://www.thedailybeast.com/pentagon-has-no-idea-how-many-transgender-troops-it-kicked-out

Of course, ask someone in the Army and they'll say everyone in the AF is transgendered. :)

[txradioguy]

Military service is not conscripted or mandatory. Anyone can resign or simply get out at their next EAOS.


It is crazy for someone to join the Military as it is, and then try to change the military to suit themselves. If you don't like the military, then simply don't join up, or get out. What is the problem?


I couldn't sign up to work for Intel or Motorola, and then decide I don't like the social policies of the CEO and therefore I refuse to follow them. (Your're fired!)


In what world do these people live? In what world does this kind of thing actually work? Reality doesn't work like that.

QFT

[skeeter]

Military service is not conscripted or mandatory. Anyone can resign or simply get out at their next EAOS.


It is crazy for someone to join the Military as it is, and then try to change the military to suit themselves. If you don't like the military, then simply don't join up, or get out. What is the problem?


I couldn't sign up to work for Intel or Motorola, and then decide I don't like the social policies of the CEO and therefore I refuse to follow them. (Your're fired!)


In what world do these people live? In what world does this kind of thing actually work? Reality doesn't work like that.

Why would a gay try to become a scoutmaster or a lesbian an ordained minister?

To trasnform those institutions. These people are intentionally pernicious.

[Oceander]

Trump needs to make a call to the Admiral and inform him that he expects to see his letter of resignation on his desk within 24 hours or he will personally go to this Coastie's office and fire him in person.

Exactly

[txradioguy]

I have no doubt he will.  Better than serving a Commander in Chief who thinks so little of the military that he'd blindside its leadership by tweeting a change in policy without advance warning, hanging them out to dry to deal with the fallout affecting hundreds if not thousands of their personnel.

Spoken like someone who is not only clueless about the military in general...but is also clueless about what we had to endure for 8 years with someone as our CINC who would rather spit on us than look at is.

There weren't mass resignations or GO's openly saying they wouldn't obey upcoming policy changes.

We saluted...executed and suffered in silence. 

Where was your outrage then?

Oh...yeah...thats right..

[Suppressed]

...but is also clueless about what we had to endure for 8 years with someone as our CINC who would rather spit on us than look at is.

There weren't mass resignations or GO's openly saying they wouldn't obey upcoming policy changes.

Evidently you forget the Clinton years, marked by very good officers, both commissioned and non-commissioned, choosing to leave the service rather than operate under the conditions you described.

[sneakypete]

The commandant of the Coast Guard said Tuesday he will not "break faith" with transgender members following President Trump's tweets about a total ban on their service in the military.

Adm. Paul Zukunft said his first call after hearing of the ban last week was to one of 13 Coast Guardsmen who have come out as transgender under the Pentagon's year-old policy of open service.

"We have made an investment in you and you have made an investment in the Coast Guard and I will not break faith," Zukunft said, recounting the conversation during a talk at the Center for Strategic and International Studies. "And so, that is the commitment to our people right now."

In the wake of Trump's announcement, the admiral said his second call about the transgender ban was to retired Gen. John Kelly, then the director of Homeland Security, and then Kelly contacted Defense Secretary Jim Mattis.

The Coast Guard then set up a "tiger team" of legal expert officers from the Judge Advocate General's Corps to deal with the situation.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/08/01/coast-guard-commandant-signals-will-resist-trumps-military-transgender-ban.html

I guess the Coasties think they could use a few pretty boys on ice breaker duty.

I'm betting the Navy is fond  of this idea,too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmGuy0jievs

[Jazzhead]

How many of the military members are affected?

You seem to NT know, since you speculate it may be hundreds, or thousands. What if it is fewer than 100?

The numbers I've seen reported are the low thousands, but I suspect it's in the hundreds.   Emjay's number of 800 sounds reasonable to me.   There can't be many.   I've known many gay folks over the years, but I can't say I've ever knowingly met a transgender. 

I don't trust Trump's motivation - I suspect this is a sop to religious conservatives, not a response to morale or cohesion issues in the military.   But blindsiding military leadership is, fundamentally, disrespectful to our armed forces.   I know how it goes -  if you aren't willing to follow orders, the choice you have is to leave.   That's the nature of the military, and I don't disagree that the Coast Guard Commandant's days are likely numbered.  But I applaud him for standing up for those under his command.   

[sneakypete]

Trump needs to make a call to the Admiral and inform him that he expects to see his letter of resignation on his desk within 24 hours or he will personally go to this Coastie's office and fire him in person.

@txradioguy

Yup,their job is to follow orders,not contest them. SOB should be out on the street tomorrow morning,without his retirement package,and wondering what happened to him.

Some E-2 might be able to get away with claiming he didn't understand the regulations,but no way in hell can an Admiral make that claim.

[sneakypete]

A Commander in Chief cannot have Generals who openly refuse to follow his orders. Forget about the "transgender" issue. The issue is not in any way the point. The point is disobeying a lawful order. There is no excuse for that ever.


The Admiral has ended his career with this statement.

@240B

And there you have it.

[Jazzhead]

Evidently you forget the Clinton years, marked by very good officers, both commissioned and non-commissioned, choosing to leave the service rather than operate under the conditions you described.

Good example.  A soldier is obliged to follow orders,  but when an order is trumped by conscience,  it is honorable to leave the service.   

[txradioguy]

@txradioguy

Yup,their job is to follow orders,not contest them. SOB should be out on the street tomorrow morning,without his retirement package,and wondering what happened to him.

Some E-2 might be able to get away with claiming he didn't understand the regulations,but no way in hell can an Admiral make that claim.

Exactly!  I'm in 100% agreement with you on this.

[txradioguy]

Evidently you forget the Clinton years, marked by very good officers, both commissioned and non-commissioned, choosing to leave the service rather than operate under the conditions you described.

No I came in during that time.  I watched as all the good ones were leaving and had to endure the bottom feeders in the enlisted ranks that were left...the thypes that would throw anyone under the buss and step over anyone they had to in order to save their career.

I don't recall...and I could be wrong because it was 25 years ago...buy there weren't any flag officers coming out and saying flatly I'm not going to do what you order us to do.  Their protest...like it was under Obama...was to just quietly retire and what ever level they were at and find a job in the civilian sector or just enjoy being retired. 

They showed their displeasure with their feet rather than with their mouth...and I can respect that completely.