BASEBALL 2017---Bring it On!!!

[Bigun]

Something else that could help the game---stop looking exclusively at pitchers who can throw lamb chops
past wolves and start looking for the pitchers who pitch with their brains no matter how fast their fastballs
are. Show me the pitcher with a mixture of off-speed and breaking stuff and brains in hand with a decent
fastball, and I'll show you a few Hall of Famers. (Greg Maddux, Tom Glavine, Warren Spahn, Juan Marichal
---and he sure didn't hurt himself with those fourteen or so different windups he had, either---to name a
few.) Give me the brain pitcher and a) he'll win me a lot of ballgames and b) have a pretty long career
for me.

The pitcher who can live on fastballs in the big leagues hasn't come along yet. The closest we ever came was J.R. Richard (no not Nolan Ryan who lived on intimidating hitters) and even he couldn't do it.  If you are going to make it in the bigs you are going to have to have two are three pitches that you can throw for strikes every time you go out there! That and a catcher that knows YOU and calls the game accordingly goes a long way these days. 

[catfish1957]

The pitcher who can live on fastballs in the big leagues hasn't come along yet. The closest we ever came was J.R. Richard (no not Nolan Ryan who lived on intimidating hitters) and even he couldn't do it.  If you are going to make it in the bigs you are going to have to have two are three pitches that you can throw for strikes every time you go out there! That and a catcher that knows YOU and calls the game accordingly goes a long way these days.

Man we had an awesome staff '79-'80.  Fireballers Richard and Ryan, with Joe Niekro knuckling in between.  Add Sambito, and Smith in the pen.......    Too bad we couldn't hit a lick.

[EasyAce]

The pitcher who can live on fastballs in the big leagues hasn't come along yet. The closest we ever came was J.R. Richard (no not Nolan Ryan who lived on intimidating hitters) and even he couldn't do it.  If you are going to make it in the bigs you are going to have to have two are three pitches that you can throw for strikes every time you go out there! That and a catcher that knows YOU and calls the game accordingly goes a long way these days.

We've had more major league pitchers living on their fastballs than you think, and to the extent they have other
pitches they're more or less show-me pitches to set up more fastballs. Pitchers who can live on brains and off-
speed stuff are a little more rare now than in even Nolan Ryan's day.

J.R. Richard didn't go down because of his fastball, he went down because the Astros mistook his shoulder
fatigue for laziness and didn't heed a warning sign---and boom! Stroke, career over. If they'd paid attention
sooner a good doctor would have seen what was coming and stopped it.

[EasyAce]

. . . a catcher that knows YOU and calls the game accordingly goes a long way these days.

How about a catcher who knows the hitters in the league? He could know you and your tendencies but if he doesn't
know the hitters a little better, you're a dead duck before you throw the first pitch. If I'm a manager and I've got
a hot new young catcher, the first thing I tell him is get every scouting report you can get on every hitter in the
league, watch what these hitters do when you see them, then worry about what your pitchers are going to
throw. The number one way to get your pitcher on the page is to know as much as you can about the hitters you're
going to face before you get out there. Otherwise, you're going to call for that delicious slider your man throws
thinking no way they're gonna hit this but you're going to got some splainin' to do when that delicious
slider got hit for delicious distance.

I once asked Catfish [Hunter] why he never shook me off. He said, "It's your job to know the hitters. You just tell
me what to throw and I'll throw it.---Ray Fosse.

I looked confident out there but I really wasn't. It was Yogi [Berra] who gave me that confidence with what he knew about
me and what he knew about the other guys. If anyone else was my catcher, I couldn't have pitched the way I did.
---Whitey Ford.

(A favourite Berra story: He happened upon a meeting of pitchers before an All-Star Game and the subject was pitching
to Stan Musial. "Forget it," Berra said, deadpan. "You guys are trying to figure out in fifteen minutes what nobody's
figured out in fifteen years.")

[Bigun]

We've had more major league pitchers living on their fastballs than you think, and to the extent they have other
pitches they're more or less show-me pitches to set up more fastballs. Pitchers who can live on brains and off-
speed stuff are a little more rare now than in even Nolan Ryan's day.

J.R. Richard didn't go down because of his fastball, he went down because the Astros mistook his shoulder
fatigue for laziness and didn't heed a warning sign---and boom! Stroke, career over. If they'd paid attention
sooner a good doctor would have seen what was coming and stopped it.

Never said Richard went down because of the fastball.  I said he couldn't make it throwing them exclusively and he got bombed several times before he figured that out.

Show me a pitcher that throws fastballs 80% or more and I'll show you a pitcher who's career will be short!

[Cyber Liberty]

Randy Johnson?  Any pigeon will tell you his fastball was murder.

[EasyAce]

Never said Richard went down because of the fastball.  I said he couldn't make it throwing them exclusively and he got bombed several times before he figured that out.

He lived on his fastball, which wouldn't have been a horror except that it took him several seasons to develop
control of the pitch. When he wasn't getting bombed, he was handing out walks like they were holiday candy until
he finally learned control.

Did you know: The night Richard broke the National League's record for seasonal strikeouts by a righthander (he passed
Tom Seaver's 290), he pitched against . . . Jim Bouton, making an odd comeback with the Braves. Bouton was
pitching with little but a knuckleball, yet he and Richard went mano-a-mano, though Bouton scattered five hits,
and each came out with the game tied at two. (Joaquin Andujar lost in relief for the Astros.)

[EasyAce]

Show me a pitcher that throws fastballs 80% or more and I'll show you a pitcher who's career will be short!

If he throws them to the same spots, sure his career will be short. You can live on a single pitch
if you know how to change speeds with it and work the entire zone, not just throw them through
the same slot.

One fastballer I remember: Dick Radatz, for a few years the Red Sox relief ace. He was, until
Ted Williams convinced him to try throwing a sinkerball Williams thought Radatz could handle.
(Radatz threw about 85-90 percent fastballs, was expert at the "climbing the ladder" kind of
fastball pitching, and usually threw a couple of changeups in for good measure.)

Living on the fastball didn't kill him. Fixing what wasn't broken did. (Especially after he'd pitched
an average 130+ innings a year out of the pen from 1962-65.) Radatz began losing what
made him so fearsome after three seasons. He lost his control and his arm gave him fits, and
he disappeared almost as fast as he'd arrived in the first place.

[Bigun]

How about them Astros?  GREAT comeback! 

Go Stros!

[EasyAce]

How about them Astros?  GREAT comeback! 

Go Stros!

Those guys look more tenacious every game.

[catfish1957]

How about them Astros?  GREAT comeback! 

Go Stros!

Still can't believe it.  I bet someone has to help Santana pick up his jaw off the floor.  Leaving at the end of 7 with a 6 run lead, and have your bullpen give up 11?

[Bigun]

Those guys look more tenacious every game.

They are the real deal!  Hope they can stay healthy!

[DCPatriot]

Bryce Harper, Hunter Strickland start bench-clearing brawl between Nats, Giants

Washington Nationals star Bryce Harper charged San Francisco Giants reliever Hunter Strickland in the eighth inning of the teams' game on Monday.

Strickland plunked Harper in the hip with a 98 mph pitch. Harper then gestured at Strickland with his bat, strode to the mound, threw his helmet at the Giants pitcher and the two exchanged blows as benches cleared.

The 6-foot-4, 220-pound right-hander had to be carried off the field by several of his Giants teammates to keep him away from the melee.

It was the first time the two had met since Harper hit two home runs off Strickland during the 2014 NLDS between the Nats and Giants.

video at link

http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/19492344/bryce-harper-washington-nationals-hunter-strickland-san-francisco-giants-start-bench-clearing-brawl

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

[EasyAce]

Bryce Harper, Hunter Strickland start bench-clearing brawl between Nats, Giants

Washington Nationals star Bryce Harper charged San Francisco Giants reliever Hunter Strickland in the eighth inning of the teams' game on Monday.

Strickland plunked Harper in the hip with a 98 mph pitch. Harper then gestured at Strickland with his bat, strode to the mound, threw his helmet at the Giants pitcher and the two exchanged blows as benches cleared.

The 6-foot-4, 220-pound right-hander had to be carried off the field by several of his Giants teammates to keep him away from the melee.

It was the first time the two had met since Harper hit two home runs off Strickland during the 2014 NLDS between the Nats and Giants.

video at link

http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/19492344/bryce-harper-washington-nationals-hunter-strickland-san-francisco-giants-start-bench-clearing-brawl

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Apparently, Strickland held a grudge over those two division series bombs from three years earlier. ;)

[EasyAce]

There went his hopes for a third MVP and maybe the Angels' hopes of staying in the races . . .

Angels' Mike Trout to disabled list with torn thumb ligament

[DCPatriot]

Harper did NOT throw his helmet at Strickland.

At the last moment he slammed it into the 2nd base infield grass.

Harper should get ZERO games suspension for defending himself.

Strickland should get a whole month off.        freaking weasel.

[Bigun]

Harper did NOT throw his helmet at Strickland.

At the last moment he slammed it into the 2nd base infield grass.

Harper should get ZERO games suspension for defending himself.

Strickland should get a whole month off.        freaking weasel.

Sorry!  Watched the video and don't see it that way at all!

[EasyAce]

Harper did NOT throw his helmet at Strickland.

At the last moment he slammed it into the 2nd base infield grass.

Harper should get ZERO games suspension for defending himself.

Strickland should get a whole month off.        freaking weasel.

@DCPatriot
I saw the same video. Looked to me like Harper did want to throw his helmet to one side and not
at Strickland. And Strickland clearly was aiming his pitch at Harper's anatomy.

[Cripplecreek]

This Tigers Royals game is going to give me a stroke.

8-7 Tigers bases loaded with Tigers and 1 out.

[EasyAce]

This Tigers Royals game is going to give me a stroke.

8-7 Tigers bases loaded with Tigers and 1 out.

Looks like Miguel Cabrera killed your stroke in the crib---bases loaded, two-run single. 10-7 Tigers your final.

[Polly Ticks]

There went his hopes for a third MVP and maybe the Angels' hopes of staying in the races . . .

Angels' Mike Trout to disabled list with torn thumb ligament

Hated to see that.  I was looking forward to watching him yesterday, today, and tomorrow.

[Bigun]

Astros currently at 36/16 52 games in 110 left to play.  If they simply play .500 from here on out they finish 91/71.

Just sayin!

[DCPatriot]

Astros currently at 36/16 52 games in 110 left to play.  If they simply play .500 from here on out they finish 91/71.

Just sayin!

Yep.....now I can agree they're for real.

...while my Orioles have fallen like a rock.

The Yankees are due for a slump.     I'm waiting........     

[skeeter]

Harper did NOT throw his helmet at Strickland.

At the last moment he slammed it into the 2nd base infield grass.

Harper should get ZERO games suspension for defending himself.

Strickland should get a whole month off.        freaking weasel.

Funny way to defend ones self. But Stricklan pretty clearly threw at him.

If Harper wasn't such a punk he'd a just taken first base. Whats that - his 9th ejection?

He'll get the max suspension for that helmut deal.

[DCPatriot]

Funny way to defend ones self. But Stricklan pretty clearly threw at him.

If Harper wasn't such a punk he'd a just taken first base. Whats that - his 9th ejection?

He'll get the max suspension for that helmut deal.

Luckily, the helmet slipped and went into the grass on the 2nd base side of the mound.

Getting a 5 game (one start) suspension for waiting THREE F**KING YEARS to get back at one of the best players in the GAME with a lethal weapon 98 mph fastball is insane and criminal.

He should get a minimum of a 30 game suspension.   

GD Giants are a dozen games under .500 and about to have a fire sale.

Buster Posey knows that Scherzer is going to nail him tonight....or Strasburg tomorrow.

Talk about Posey.......the "Posey Rule" and the "Chase Utley Rule" immediately came about with SAFETY of the player (asset) in mind.

We need a "Harper Rule" now.

Harper gets 5 games.   Strickland gets 30 games.

And Harper presses formal charges for assault with a deadly weapon.   

[skeeter]

Luckily, the helmet slipped and went into the grass on the 2nd base side of the mound.

Getting a 5 game (one start) suspension for waiting THREE F**KING YEARS to get back at one of the best players in the GAME with a lethal weapon 98 mph fastball is insane and criminal.

He should get a minimum of a 30 game suspension.   

GD Giants are a dozen games under .500 and about to have a fire sale.

Buster Posey knows that Scherzer is going to nail him tonight....or Strasburg tomorrow.

Talk about Posey.......the "Posey Rule" and the "Chase Utley Rule" immediately came about with SAFETY of the player (asset) in mind.

We need a "Harper Rule" now.

Harper gets 5 games.   Strickland gets 30 games.

And Harper presses formal charges for assault with a deadly weapon.   

Stricklan hits Harper in the butt with a pitch, Harper tries to brain Stricklan with a batting helmut from fifteen feet. And Harper presses charges?

Hilarious.

Luckily Panic fielded the helmut and threw Harper out at first.

The officials will issue a warning today. So if Posey gets beaned there'll be hell to pay.

[Idiot]

The pitcher who can live on fastballs in the big leagues hasn't come along yet. The closest we ever came was J.R. Richard (no not Nolan Ryan who lived on intimidating hitters) and even he couldn't do it.  If you are going to make it in the bigs you are going to have to have two are three pitches that you can throw for strikes every time you go out there! That and a catcher that knows YOU and calls the game accordingly goes a long way these days.

Here is the complete opposite of someone living on fastballs.

Charlie Hough  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Hough
Our Co. had season tickets to the Rangers.  I'd try to time it so I'd get to see Nolan Ryan pitch, then something would throw off the rotation and my luck would have it....I'd get stuck watching Charlie Hough.  If his knuckleball was on, it was a great night.  If it was off...it would be homer after homer and it would be an early trip to the car for the trip back home.

[GrouchoTex]

Yep.....now I can agree they're for real.

...while my Orioles have fallen like a rock.

The Yankees are due for a slump.     I'm waiting........     

Sat at the local icehouse watching the Astros game yesterday.
I thought I was going to run out of beer money, and I didn't get there until the 3rd inning!

[EasyAce]

Here is the complete opposite of someone living on fastballs.

Charlie Hough  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Hough
Our Co. had season tickets to the Rangers.  I'd try to time it so I'd get to see Nolan Ryan pitch, then something would throw off the rotation and my luck would have it....I'd get stuck watching Charlie Hough.  If his knuckleball was on, it was a great night.  If it was off...it would be homer after homer and it would be an early trip to the car for the trip back home.

The fans enjoy home runs, and we have assembled a pitching staff that is sure to please them.---Clark Griffith, Washington Senators
owner, speaking a little jocularly in the 1940s. (From when the watchword was, Washington---first in war, first in peace, and last in the
American League.)

[EasyAce]

Stricklan hits Harper in the butt with a pitch, Harper tries to brain Stricklan with a batting helmut from fifteen feet. And Harper presses charges?

Show me anyone who can throw a batting helmet anywhere near the velocity of a 90mph+ fastball. Superman doesn't count.

[skeeter]

Show me anyone who can throw a batting helmet anywhere near the velocity of a 90mph+ fastball. Superman doesn't count.

IMO it'd be pretty easy to injure someone by spiking a batting helmut at him from point blank range. But lets see what the league has to say.

BTW Stricklan can take a hike. The Giants have always played clean and we don't need a reliever with a 98mph fastball and nothing else but an ego.

[EasyAce]

IMO it'd be pretty easy to injure someone by spiking a batting helmut at him from point blank range. But lets see what the league has to say.

I was hoping the Giants themselves would say something first.

As the Orioles did, once upon a time, when Armando Benitez drilled Tino Martinez right after Edgar Martinez hit a grand slam and
triggered a bench-clearing brawl: they sent Benitez to the minors for three weeks.

As the Blue Jays did earlier this month, when Kevin Pillar responded to a quick-pitch strikeout by calling Jason Motte a nasty
euphemism for gay: the Jays suspended Pillar themselves, compelling Pillar to hold himself accountable publicly.

BTW Strickland can take a hike. The Giants have always played clean and we don't need a reliever with a 98mph fastball and nothing else but an ego.

I wrote about the Strickland-Harper scrum here.

[skeeter]

I was hoping the Giants themselves would say something first.

As the Orioles did, once upon a time, when Armando Benitez drilled Tino Martinez right after Edgar Martinez hit a grand slam and
triggered a bench-clearing brawl: they sent Benitez to the minors for three weeks.

As the Blue Jays did earlier this month, when Kevin Pillar responded to a quick-pitch strikeout by calling Jason Motte a nasty
euphemism for gay: the Jays suspended Pillar themselves, compelling Pillar to hold himself accountable publicly.
I wrote about the Strickland-Harper scrum here.

Maybe they aren't 100% certain the pitch was intentional. After all, the last encounter between the two was three years ago.

[Bigun]

I was hoping the Giants themselves would say something first.

As the Orioles did, once upon a time, when Armando Benitez drilled Tino Martinez right after Edgar Martinez hit a grand slam and
triggered a bench-clearing brawl: they sent Benitez to the minors for three weeks.

As the Blue Jays did earlier this month, when Kevin Pillar responded to a quick-pitch strikeout by calling Jason Motte a nasty
euphemism for gay: the Jays suspended Pillar themselves, compelling Pillar to hold himself accountable publicly.
I wrote about the Strickland-Harper scrum here.

Whew!  Tell us what you think next time!   

[EasyAce]

Maybe they aren't 100% certain the pitch was intentional.

Two out, nobody on, the Giants down 2-0, the first pitch to Harper going right at his body.

Suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuure it wasn't intentional.

[DCPatriot]

IMO it'd be pretty easy to injure someone by spiking a batting helmut at him from point blank range. But lets see what the league has to say.

BTW Stricklan can take a hike. The Giants have always played clean and we don't need a reliever with a 98mph fastball and nothing else but an ego.

He should have split his nose with the beak of the helmet.     Luckily, he'll probably only sit a week.

But Strickland....who LITERALLY had to carried off the field in a breakdown rage...should miss 30 days MINIMUM. 

[skeeter]

Two out, nobody on, the Giants down 2-0, the first pitch to Harper going right at his body.

Suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuure it wasn't intentional.

Harper obviously has Strickland's number. Strickland's first pitch attempts to back him off the plate but is poorly thrown.

The simple truth is neither you nor I know for sure.

[EasyAce]

Harper obviously has Strickland's number. Strickland's first pitch attempts to back him off the plate but is poorly thrown.

The simple truth is neither you nor I know for sure.

Horsesh@t. Strickland aimed it right at Harper. Or didn't anyone else notice Posey put a sign for a curve ball
down and Strickland threw a fastball anyway, never mind that he aimed right at Harper.

[EasyAce]

Just now breaking---Harper gets a four game suspension, Strickland a six. Someone's brains
in baseball government must have gone to bed. Or was it presumptuous of me to assume
they have brains?

[skeeter]

Horsesh@t. Strickland aimed it right at Harper. Or didn't anyone else notice Posey put a sign for a curve ball
down and Strickland threw a fastball anyway, never mind that he aimed right at Harper.

Posey said the pitch, assuming he means the one he called for, was fastball in.

http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/05/29/all-out-brawl-nationals-bryce-harper-giants-hunter-strickland-land-punches/

[EasyAce]

Posey said the call was fastball in.

And Momma said the neighbour's china closet Junior just put his foot through shouldn't have been there in the first
place.

[skeeter]

And Momma said the neighbour's china closet Junior just put his foot through shouldn't have been there in the first
place.

Whatever dude.

[DCPatriot]

Bryce Harper Should Have ‘Brought the Bat’ to the Mound, the Junkies say
By Chris Lingebach

WASHINGTON — Monday was the first time Bryce Harper had faced Hunter Strickland since they met in the 2014 NLDS, during which Harper took Strickland deep twice — in Games 1 and 4 — in two plate appearances.

Their latest encounter came with the Nationals leading the Giants 2-0 in the eighth inning, and there would be only one pitch thrown — a 98-MPH fastball Strickland flung directly into the batter’s box, striking Harper square in the hip.

Harper squared up to shout at Strickland, then launched his helmet as he charged the mound seeking a fistful of revenge

“So Bryce Harper did charge the mound yesterday,” John-Paul Flaim of The Sports Junkies said Tuesday morning. “I just think baseball brawls, and the old baseball rules, are just stupid. I mean this guy, Hunter Strickland, is holding a grudge for three years!”

“I mean, let’s be honest. Yes, there have been brawls forever and they’re never gonna stop,” Jason Bishop said. “But when it’s a guy who is pissed off about a couple of bombs from three years ago? He’s got some issues. …It’s a bigger story when it’s a star in the game, and Bryce obviously is a star.”

“But it’s more than the bombs,” Erick Bickel said. “It was just that Bryce got a little overexcited for his liking, right? I mean, it’s not just the bombs.”

“But that’s what I think is stupid,” Flaim said. “Shouldn’t you be excited when you hit a home run in the playoffs? In the playoffs!”

“I agree. But I’m just saying, if you were to be technical about it, I don’t think he was necessarily upset that he hit two bombs off him,” Bickel said. “I think he was upset about just how excited he got.”

“Well the first one that he hit in Game 1, I didn’t think there was a problem with it at all,” Bishop recalled. “He hit the ball — he crushed it — he ran around the bases and ran to the dugout. Now, maybe the second one in Game 4…”

“A lot of hooting and hollering in there,” Bickel said.

“Yeah, but remember: after the first one, Strickland was staring at Bryce,” Bishop said. “That was all on Strickland.”

“Why you staring? Why you being a jerk? You gave up a big meatball down the middle,” John Auville said. “It’s not Bryce’s fault he hit it 500 feet!”

more at:  http://washington.cbslocal.com/2017/05/30/bryce-harper-should-have-brought-the-bat-to-the-mound-the-junkies-say/

[catfish1957]

Bryce Harper Should Have ‘Brought the Bat’ to the Mound, the Junkies say
By Chris Lingebach

Not going to take a position either way, but Harper might wish he had these four games played come MVP voting time.

[DCPatriot]

Not going to take a position either way, but Harper might wish he had these four games played come MVP voting time.

Nope....and Harper is NOT the team MVP.  That would be Ryan Zimmerman, if voting were today.

Luckily the rest of the NL East are under .500.

[catfish1957]

Nope....and Harper is NOT the team MVP.  That would be Ryan Zimmerman, if voting were today.

Luckily the rest of the NL East are under .500.

You know the team better than I do.  Still, though I don't care for the guy, he's maybe the best raw hitting talent behind Trout, and maybe Goldschmidt.

Still ..........2/3 of the season left?   I wouldn't write off his season yet.

[EasyAce]

This just in: Bryce Harper's suspension was cut to three games. No word yet on whether Hunter Strickland got
his suspension reduced on appeal.

Ponder this: Assuming Strickland's original suspension term holds up, it means Harper suspended for a minimum
of 27 innings and Strickland, being a relief pitcher, suspended for . . . six innings, perhaps seven. When
Strickland instigated things by exercising a grudge almost three years old.

You see why some people are sour on baseball government? Every time you hope for Solomon, you wind up getting
Maxine Waters.

[al_c]

I know how you feel.
We went through that with the Astros last year.
If they had held on to 1/2 of their late inning leads, they'd won the division outright, instead of missing the wildcard like they did.

Last year’s Astros switched places with my Rangers this season. I was quite surprised at their comeback last night … thanks to Elvis!

[GrouchoTex]

Last year’s Astros switched places with my Rangers this season. I was quite surprised at their comeback last night … thanks to Elvis!

That Astros Memorial day game was nuts.

Down 8-2 going into the 8th, at Minnesota.

Score 11 in the eighth and 3 in the ninth to win 16-8.
 

[Cyber Liberty]

D'backs in the process of blowing a late close game, too.  Bottom of the 9th, and the go-ahead just walked on.