Author Topic: Donald Trump Unveils Child Care Subsidy Aimed at Women, Suburban Swing Voters (Mandatory Paid Maternity Leave)  (Read 24397 times)

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Online corbe

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Complicit, regardless - I wonder how many know they are selling us into servitude with all the 'free' stuff they support?


 @roamer_1   Eventually, Sooner whether than Later, whether the Donald is elected or not, they will all know it, but as we've seen throughout History only a mightier force that destroys the notion they are in the right can bring about any true self awareness.
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline ABX

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The New TrumpTM with his kinder, gentler nature and progressive agenda is trying out a new slogan.


Online roamer_1

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 @roamer_1   Eventually, Sooner whether than Later, whether the Donald is elected or not, they will all know it, but as we've seen throughout History only a mightier force that destroys the notion they are in the right can bring about any true self awareness.

Pain.
Or the Great Teacher, humble in spirit, whose yoke is light.

The time for choosing draws nigh.

Offline Neverdul

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Employers aren't required to pay direct unemployment costs, its an insurance program. There's also no requirement to hire a temp either.

Except employers are required to buy unemployment insurance in most States (in NY for example, just having one employee you are required to buy it). Adding a middle man to the process doesn't alleviate the issue.

But even then, one big question looms.

Why is this the government's business?

I would like to correct both of you.

@Longmire

You are correct that employers do not directly pay the unemployment benefits paid to former employees who have successfully filed unemployment claims, but the employer’s experience rating, i.e. the rate (%) they are charged for the unemployment tax is directly related to the number of claims and benefits paid out and how much the employer has in reserve (i.e. the amount of $’s the employer has paid in to the system vs. the $ amount of claims paid out.) The fewer the claims and the higher their reserves, the lower their rate and visa versa.

I know of no state where unemployment tax is not mandatory or where there is an option to purchase a privately administered unemployment “insurance” policy.  There is no such animal.

Unemployment, while it called “insurance” is actually a payroll tax assessed and collected by the state government and the federal government.

1st there is the state unemployment tax - (SUI or sometimes referred to as SUTA).  Each employer is assigned an employment tax rate through their state government’s unemployment office. The rate is determined primarily by the employer’s experience rating, i.e. the number of approved unemployment claims (the more people they let go or layoff who end up receiving benefits, the higher the rate) and to an extent it is also based on their industry and is subject to change, up or down on an annual or even quarterly basis. New employers pay an introductory rate.

Each state determines the annual wage cap.  For instance, here in PA the unemployment tax is calculated on the first $9,500 of gross wages paid to each employee each year (and going up to $10,000 in 2017).   And here in PA the employee also pays 0.07 percent of their gross wages via a payroll deduction, just like any other tax, but there is no wage cap on the employee portion. The only states that currently also tax the employee are Alaska, New Jersey, and Pennsylvania. The wage cap applies to each employer paying wages to each employee. If I change my employer mid-year, the wage cap starts all over with the new employer, i.e. the new employer doesn’t get a credit for my wages paid nor for the unemployment taxes paid by my former employer even if I previously met the wage cap.

It also needs to be noted that several states are still assessing an unemployment tax surcharge.  This is to pay back the federal government loans when it mandated extended unemployment benefits some years back that the state unemployment funds did not have to pay out.

Then there is Federal Unemployment Tax (FUTA)

FUTA is tax of 6.0% minus a credit if the employer has paid into a state unemployment fund. If an employer is allowed the maximum credit of 5.4%, then the federal unemployment tax rate will be 0.6%. This rate is then applied to each employee's first $7,000 of annual gross wages.

Each quarter the employer files a state unemployment return, and annually a federal unemployment return (form 940) but the taxes are remitted quarterly in most cases (a few states now require monthly filings and remittances).

See here for how it is calculated (note they are incorrect in saying “There is no withholding from an employee's salary or wages for the state unemployment tax.” as I noted above.)

http://www.accountingcoach.com/payroll-accounting/explanation/4

@AbaraXas

What you may be thinking of in NY is the state mandated disability insurance (SDI). That is separate and different and above NY unemployment tax.  It is similar to a private short term disability insurance (STD) plan. California, Hawaii, New Jersey, New York and Rhode Island. Puerto Rico have mandatory disability insurance requirements.

NY SDI can be paid to the state of NY or through an approved private insurer and may in some companies run concurrent with their group STD and LTD insurance plans if they offer them.

Note that many companies offer STD, and most of those plans cover maternity leave (yes, having and recovering from having a baby is considered a “disability” for STD insurance purposes) and STD pays, depending on the plan and the employee’s salary or position, a % of salary (50%. 60% 70%, etc. some even up to 100%) and typically for up to 6 to 8 weeks. Some of these plans have a waiting period, typically a week or two and requires the employee to exhaust PTO or sick time prior to receiving benefits and once benefits kick in, they may allow the employee to use accrued PTO to cover the % of pay not paid by the STD plan so as true up to 100% of their salary. And if the woman stays out of work after exhausting her STD benefits and then using FMLA for up to another 6 to 4 weeks, she may be required her to exhaust accrued PTO or sick leave before taking the FMLA as unpaid.

So the way I read this, unless I am wrong, giving women maternity related unemployment benefits would not apply to those covered by a STD plan or other employer provided paid maternity leave plans if separate from or running concurrent with an STD plan. So if I am covered by a STD plan paying 50% of salary, will Trump’s plan allow me to file for maternity unemployment for the difference?

My other question is who pays the maternity related unemployment benefits – the state or the federal government unemployment programs or both? (And really there is only state unemployment benefits – the Federal unemployment taxes (FUTA) assessed and collected are apportioned back to the state programs). And how would maternity related unemployment claims effect the employer’s experience rating. i.e. their unemployment tax rate? In either case I cannot believe that the employer rate will not be effected.

Next, I would think that just as with an STD plan and when claiming FMLA, there would have to be some sort of verification process. I know that with STD and FMLA, that involves the woman completing forms and giving the name of their doctor who then in turn has to provide information to the insurer and or FMLA administrator often along with the company’s benefit or HR department. And with STD and FMLA, the employer has to verify the first day off from work and report the first day returned to work, often follow up when information is not returned in a timely manner or hand hold the employee through the application process, etc. so I know firsthand that there is an administrative burden on the employer and would not imagine this would be any different.

As to reducing “fraud”, that certainly exists but states have become increasing aggressive in tracking that down. I know at my last employer, where I was among many other things, I was in charge of completing requests not only on initial unemployment claims but to verify for on-going claims. It was not unusual after a terminated employee had been out on unemployment for several weeks for me to get (yet another) form to complete (in PA for each initial unemployment claim I had to complete 2 if not 3 forms, often asking the very same questions) and send back to the PA unemployment division. This time they wanted to know within a specific date range, for each week in that range, what we paid in wages, commissions, in PTO payouts, in severance, whether or not we were aware that our former employee had taken a job somewhere else, to confirm their last known address and phone number.  That is not to say that fraud was suspected but seemed to be a random check to see if the claimant had been honest about reporting any post termination pay.

Aside from that, I don’t know how else to crack down on fraud.  FWIW, all states I have worked with have a “new hire registry”. One of the purposes is to alert state agencies of when an employee owing child support or having a state tax lien becomes employed again (and yes, this is shared on a national level) but the other reason is to notify the state’s unemployment department so that unemployment benefits stop in case the claimant doesn’t report it and tries to continue receiving benefits. But that is as I understand not always fool proof.

But cracking down and prosecuting fraud and recovering fraudulent payments isn’t in itself without costs, the costs of investigators, prosecutors, administering re-payment plans. For every dollar fraudulently paid out and recovered, there is a cost involved in getting it back.

I will post some more thoughts on Trump’s plan when I get a chance.
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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As usual, he is very generous with other people's money. 

@Rivergirl   Please explain how an individual directing a portion of his or her income and/or his or her own savings account into a dependent care account has anything to do with YOUR money.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Limbaugh has thrown in the towel on conservatism:



What would a conservative child care proposal look like @sinkspur?

Enlighten us, please.

Offline Frank Cannon

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@Rivergirl   Please explain how an individual directing a portion of his or her income and/or his or her own savings account into a dependent care account has anything to do with YOUR money.

I guess since you are now an exposed Socialist being a Trump booster, you just gloss over the parts of plans where tax money will be doled out to some and not others.....

Quote
Donald Trump is proposing new federal subsidies for child care, including tax deductions for families’ expenses, rebates for lower income households that do not itemize their taxes, and new tax-preferred savings accounts.

So how is a rebate saving ones own money?

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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I guess since you are now an exposed Socialist being a Trump booster, you just gloss over the parts of plans where tax money will be doled out to some and not others.....

 :wtf!: are you talking about.  Have you read the proposal?  Or are you just guessing?  You're certainly not quoting ME here.

Quote
So how is a rebate saving ones own money?

Income is OUR money, Frankie .... or did you forget that.  Not paying taxes means I keep more of what is mine; as it's supposed to work....for the fiscally conservative.  Anything that I don't send to the Treasury is mine to use as I see fit, including saving it.



« Last Edit: September 15, 2016, 01:04:28 am by Right_in_Virginia »

Offline sinkspur

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What would a conservative child care proposal look like @sinkspur?

Enlighten us, please.

It looks exactly like what we have now.  No government interference in child care.  None.  Nada.
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline sinkspur

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:wtf!: are you talking about.  Have you read the proposal?  Or are you just guessing?  You're certainly not quoting ME here.

Income is OUR money, Frankie .... or did you forget that.  Not paying taxes means I keep more of what is mine; as it's supposed to work....for the fiscally conservative.  Anything that I don't send to the Treasury is mine to use as I see fit, including saving it.

A savings account for child care is fine.  Expecting a $17 billion shortfall to be made up by "economic growth" is silly.  Just exactly how is that supposed to work? 
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Online DB

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I would like to correct both of you.

@Longmire

You are correct that employers do not directly pay the unemployment benefits paid to former employees who have successfully filed unemployment claims, but the employer’s experience rating, i.e. the rate (%) they are charged for the unemployment tax is directly related to the number of claims and benefits paid out and how much the employer has in reserve (i.e. the amount of $’s the employer has paid in to the system vs. the $ amount of claims paid out.) The fewer the claims and the higher their reserves, the lower their rate and visa versa.

Just to add to that. The rate employers pay varies widely depending on the type of work the employee does along with the required state disability insurance.

Every mandate imposed on business cost money whether supposedly offset or not. Through both time and money to adhere, prove compliance and document it. The smaller your business the more pain it becomes. Many big businesses lobby for these mandates because it they already have manpower to manage them while their smaller competitors don't and find it harder to compete.

All you have to do is look at the rate of small businesses starting up year over year and it has been collapsing. Collapsing from ever increasing burdens that small startups don't have the resources to survive. It's death by a thousand cuts.

Offline guitar4jesus

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Offline musiclady

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Rush has truly sold his soul, hasn't he?

I'm still amazed and shocked and saddened that he truly didn't mean a thing he said about Conservatism's being the best solution all those years.

What a disappointment....    **nononono*
Character still matters.  It always matters.

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Offline sinkspur

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Ivanka gets prickly in an interview

Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Online corbe

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Ivanka gets prickly in an interview




    Clinton's daughter Chelsea, Trumps daughter Ivanka, I always heard the good Lord takes care of Alcoholics and Fools and those two are a cut from both cloths.

   2 Idiot NY liberals
« Last Edit: September 15, 2016, 01:58:45 am by corbe »
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Offline driftdiver

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Of course there is no "requirement" to hire a temp worker, or for a colleague to work OT (paid or unpaid.)  However, the work MUST be done.  Do you suggest that the work simply stagnates for 3 months at a time?  If so, then we don't need the employee to begin with.

@CSM

It depends on the work being done doesn't it?

If it's project related sometimes it can stagnate or be split out among other members of the team. Or someone new wears that hat which may be an opportunity for them to step up and shine.

If we're talking about shift work then yes, more hours for the remaining workforce or other improvements in efficiency. The expectation is that the employer will know how best to make the adjustments in the employee's absence.

But I really couldn't care less about an employer who would otherwise fire a pregnant employee for taking time off to have a child, and I'm guessing Trump doesn't either.

Another strawman.  What's wrong with her taking unpaid time off?
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Offline GrouchoTex

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Reading the same story in my Seattle Times, Trump is quoted as saying

"It's pro-family, it's pro-child, it's pro-worker. These are the people we have to take care of"

Sound like a Liberal Democrat statement  to you?    Sure does.   the old if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck.....

Yep, I'd rather not have the Federal Government "take care" of me, except for what they are constitutionally mandated to do.

Offline Neverdul

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Just to add to that. The rate employers pay varies widely depending on the type of work the employee does along with the required state disability insurance.

The unemployment tax rate the employer pays is the same for all employees but yes, in addition to the employer’s experience rating, the rate can be higher for some industries where there is a high turnover or a lot of seasonally dependent work, construction and farming for instance.

Both state mandated disability insurance and private STD insurance rates are determined by industry risks and overall payroll and for STD, the type plan. At my last employer employees in a professional and salaried classification were entitled to a higher weekly benefit – 80% of their salary vs. 66% for hourly workers and manufacturing production workers, so the rate was different based on their classification but not dependent on individual job titles/job descriptions. 

Every mandate imposed on business cost money whether supposedly offset or not. Through both time and money to adhere, prove compliance and document it. The smaller your business the more pain it becomes. Many big businesses lobby for these mandates because it they already have manpower to manage them while their smaller competitors don't and find it harder to compete.

All you have to do is look at the rate of small businesses starting up year over year and it has been collapsing. Collapsing from ever increasing burdens that small startups don't have the resources to survive. It's death by a thousand cuts.

Agreed.

While Trump’s proposal of giving women “unemployment” benefits and offsetting the additional costs by reducing fraud and waste sounds like a good idea, I know in practice, with 20+ years working in PR and HR, that it will increase both administrative burdens and costs and most especially for small business.  Most larger employers already offer STD that includes maternity benefits or offer either a buy up option or have a separate maternity paid benefits plan and FMLA only applies to employers with 50 or more employees, so it will be the smaller businesses who will bear the brunt of the increased costs and administrative burdens.
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Offline sinkspur

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Can't get the six weeks if you're not married:
 
Garance Franke-Ruta
‏@thegarance
Ivanka tells Cosmo new benefit for marrieds only: "to benefit the mother who has given birth to the child if they have legal married status"
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline sinkspur

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THE HAND THAT ROCKS THE CRADLE: TRUMP'S CHILD CARE PROPOSAL EMPOWERS BIG DADDY GOVERNMENT

By: Logan Albright | September 14, 2016

Donald Trump has unveiled a set of new policies designed to reduce the cost of child care, presumably in an attempt to reach out to female voters — a demographic with which he has long had a fraught relationship. Among his proposals are a new tax deduction for child care expenses, a “rebate” for low-income households, six weeks of mandatory paid maternity leave for working mothers, and a pre-tax account that can be used for child care expenses.

Sounds great, right? Lower taxes, and a way to make raising children less costly for families. What’s not to love?

Well, hold your horses there, and beware of Greeks bearing gifts. A Trojan horse is one we should definitely look in the mouth. (We would like to apologize to our readers for this trainwreck of horse-related clichés. The author has been disciplined, and it will not happen again. – Ed.).

While it’s always nice to have lower taxes, it’s important to remember that the government doesn’t give anything away for free. There is always a cost to accepting government benefits, even when those benefits allow you to keep more of your own money for specific, government-designated purposes.

For evidence of this, we need look no further than federal education policy. Through Race to the Top Grants and No Child Left Behind waivers, the Department of Education induced states to accept the wildly unpopular Common Core standards. Since states accepted federal money, they had to abide by certain conditions — to the detriment of children everywhere.

Check out why Common Core equals common misery

A similar thing is likely to happen with child care. Credits, subsidies, and private accounts for child care all require the government to define what constitutes child care. This means that some products and services will be deemed “appropriate” and given special tax treatment, while others will be deemed “inappropriate” and taxed normally. It’s easy to imagine a scenario in which the government is deciding what sort of food you should feed your kids, what sort of books you should read them, and to what sort of day care you should send them. Adopt the government’s preferred choice, and be rewarded with a tasty tax treat. Make a different choice, and pay through the nose.

This is all part of the continuing usurpation of parental rights and responsibilities of parents by government agents. It is bad enough that the state has assumed more or less complete control of the education system; it now proposes to insert itself into the very business of child rearing.

The great philosopher Herbert Spencer spotted this tendency more than a hundred years ago and warned against it:

We have fallen upon evil times, in which it has come to be an accepted doctrine that part of the responsibilities [of child care] are to be discharged not by parents but by the public — a part which is gradually becoming a larger part and threatens to become the whole. Agitators and legislators have united in spreading a theory which, logically followed out, ends in the monstrous conclusion that it is for parents to beget children and for society to take care of them. (Principles of Ethics, Vol. I, p 545)

Today, the ties have become no less evil, and those words are truer than ever. On one side, we have Hillary Clinton insisting that it takes a village to raise a child, and on the other, we have Donald Trump proposing further distortions to an already Byzantine tax code to drive parents towards government-approved child rearing strategies.

By all means, parents should be taxed less — we all should be taxed less. But redistributive subsidies and selective tax breaks that allow government to define what does and does not constitute proper child care will not make us freer. It will only ensure that our children never escape the cruel embrace of paternalism and indoctrination.

- See more at: https://www.conservativereview.com/commentary/2016/09/hand-that-rocks-the-cradle?utm_content=buffer9399d&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer#sthash.aWsnSZWU.dpuf
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Online libertybele

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With any government entitlement program one always has to meet certain criteria.  I don't see this as any different.  The daycare centers I will assume will have to be government entities or licensed under further government regulations.  Then there may be a matter of qualifying financially; just like for food stamps and medicaid.  Someone making $25,000 a year as opposed to someone making $250,000 a year is going to need the benefit of reduced or free daycare more.  Then there is the issue of what is going to be 'taught' at these daycare centers ... our schools are liberal enough!

Then of course ... how is this going to be paid for??  Obvious answer - through taxes!  We'll be paying for someone else's daycare.  In part I see this as enabling mothers to work rather than staying home with the kids.
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Offline sinkspur

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Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline RoosGirl

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That supposed conservatives are even entertaining yet another government mandate like this is crazy to me, and all because "It's not Hillary."  I really think Trump could say the same exact things as Hillary, propose the same policies, promise the same Court nominees and some people would vote for him because he's "not Hillary" and maybe we could put some pressure on him not to actually do those things. 

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Who cares about liberty?

WALL!
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Online roamer_1

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That supposed conservatives are even entertaining yet another government mandate like this is crazy to me

There really is nothing to 'suppose', and you know it - these cannot be Conservatives.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2016, 03:01:28 pm by roamer_1 »