Author Topic: Marine Corps: Men and women must meet same standards for combat jobs  (Read 570 times)

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rangerrebew

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Marine Corps: Men and women must meet same standards for combat jobs
Jeff Schogol, Marine Corps Times 5:54 p.m. EDT April 12, 2016
Marine recruits learn marksmanship fundamentals on Parris Island


http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/story/military/careers/marine-corps/2016/04/12/marine-corps-men-and-women-must-meet-same-standards-combat-jobs/82934800/
 

The Marine Corps will not lower physical standards to allow women to join combat jobs, such as infantry, Navy Secretary Ray Mabus vowed Tuesday.

"I will never lower standards," Mabus told Marines and sailors at Marine Corps Base Camp Pendleton, California. "Let me repeat that: Standards will not be lowered for any group! Standards may be changed as circumstances in the world change, but they'll be changed for everybody."

After speaking about the Marine Corps' plan to integrate women into military occupational specialties that had been restricted to men, one Marine asked if female Marines would need to pass the same advanced courses as men to join the infantry.

"Same standards; doesn't matter," Mabus replied. "I mean, they're Marines."

MARINE CORPS TIMES

Female Marine officers, staff NCOs to join grunt units

The Marine Corps recently announced that male and female Marines must meet the same physical standards to be assigned to load-bearing units, such as infantry battalions, combat engineer companies and Raider companies, said Yvonne Carlock, a spokeswoman for Manpower and Reserve Affairs.

Previously, the Marine Corps had separate assignment policies for men and women, Carlock told Marine Corps Times on Tuesday. The administrative message does not apply to lateral moves into ground combat MOSs.
A primary marksmanship instructor works with recruits

A primary marksmanship instructor works with recruits March 1 at Parris Island. Navy Secretary Ray Mabus said Tuesday that standards for men and women in combat jobs will be the same. (Photo: Pfc. Carlin Warren/Marine Corps)

"The Secretary of Defense announced the opening of all occupations and units to all service members and published his guidance in a Dec. 3, 2015, memo to the secretaries of the military departments," Carlock said in an email. "MARADMIN 193/16 directs the application of gender neutral unit assignment criteria to all non-ground combat arms MOS Marines being screened for assignment to load bearing units."

Separately, MARDMIN 197/16 announced that a mobile training team will visit Marine Corps bases to explain the service's gender integration plan.

"This is not sensitivity training," said Marine Corps spokesman Capt. Philip Kulczewski. "The focus will be on the details of the implementation plan and how it affects all Marines' best practices."

MARINE CORPS TIMES

Senators scold Mabus for causing drama with Marine Corps

Mabus has been determined to make sure that women can serve in combat jobs, going as far as to criticize the Marine Corps’ own gender-integration study, which found that teams of male and female Marines did not perform as well as male-only teams and that women in load-bearing units are more likely to get injured than men.

He told National Public Radio in September that the female Marines who took part in the Marine Corps’ gender-integration experiment were not strong enough to carry heavy loads and that “there should have been a higher bar to cross to get into the experiment.”

Senators later lambasted Mabus for implying that the women who participated in the Marine Corps study were not up to the task.

“Secretary Mabus, this would have been a lot easier if you had not called in the press immediately and debunked what many of us view was a legitimate study without even reading it,” Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., said at the Feb. 2 hearing.
A primary marksmanship instructor with adjusts a recruit's

A primary marksmanship instructor with adjusts a recruit's position. (Photo: Pfc. Carlin Warren/Marine Corps)

MARINE CORPS TIMES

Marine Corps boot camp, job titles to be gender neutral by April

Over the next few weeks, Mabus will review a plan that he ordered the Marine Corps to submit that would make some job and MOS titles gender neutral, said Mabus' spokesman, Capt. Patrick McNally.

A Navy official told Marine Corps Times in January that the Marine Corps could keep iconic titles like "infantryman," "rifleman" or "midshipman."

"The idea is not to go in there and change the name when 'man' is incorporated as part of the term," the official said at the time. "... But when the word 'man' appears as a separate word ... they want that name to be changed."
« Last Edit: June 17, 2016, 11:05:54 am by rangerrebew »

rangerrebew

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Re: Marine Corps: Men and women must meet same standards for combat jobs
« Reply #1 on: June 17, 2016, 11:08:44 am »
In Marines' new fitness plan, pullups for women won't be mandatory
Lance M. Bacon, Marine Corps Times 12:18 p.m. EDT April 18, 2016
Max Pull Ups MWM 20140321

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/story/military/2016/04/18/marines-new-fitness-plan-pullups-women-wont-mandatory/82793128/

Marine leaders have proposed a new physical fitness test that would still allow women to do the flexed-arm hang — but they're not likely to earn a first-class score without pullups.

A new plan for the PFT would require most women to do between eight and 10 pullups to net a max score on that portion of the test.

                                                                                                             
The potential change is in response to a fitness review ordered by Commandant Gen. Robert Neller. Marine leaders found that “some current [fitness] standards are either not relevant, not challenging or not attainable,” according to a briefing obtained by Marine Corps Times. The plan was presented to Marine leaders last week.

                                                                                                                                  MORE

This doesn't seem to jibe with the original article.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2016, 11:12:51 am by rangerrebew »

Offline don-o

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Re: Marine Corps: Men and women must meet same standards for combat jobs
« Reply #2 on: June 17, 2016, 11:19:09 am »
How a controversial SECNAV has transformed the Navy

http://www.navytimes.com/story/military/2016/01/15/long-serving-navy-secretary-has-transformed-navy-usmc-despite-objections/78415698/

We may be hearing a LOT more about this guy in the coming days.

Offline don-o

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Re: Marine Corps: Men and women must meet same standards for combat jobs
« Reply #3 on: June 17, 2016, 11:25:05 am »
In Marines' new fitness plan, pullups for women won't be mandatory
Lance M. Bacon, Marine Corps Times 12:18 p.m. EDT April 18, 2016
Max Pull Ups MWM 20140321

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/story/military/2016/04/18/marines-new-fitness-plan-pullups-women-wont-mandatory/82793128/

Marine leaders have proposed a new physical fitness test that would still allow women to do the flexed-arm hang — but they're not likely to earn a first-class score without pullups.

A new plan for the PFT would require most women to do between eight and 10 pullups to net a max score on that portion of the test.

                                                                                                             
The potential change is in response to a fitness review ordered by Commandant Gen. Robert Neller. Marine leaders found that “some current [fitness] standards are either not relevant, not challenging or not attainable,” according to a briefing obtained by Marine Corps Times. The plan was presented to Marine leaders last week.

                                                                                                                                  MORE

This doesn't seem to jibe with the original article.

I believe there are two separate fitness tests. PFT has pullups, crunches and running. Combat fitness includes carrying 40 pound ammo can rove distance

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/story/military/2015/09/22/marines-may-see-tougher-cft-more-cyber-training-16/72323028/

Online Maj. Bill Martin

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Re: Marine Corps: Men and women must meet same standards for combat jobs
« Reply #4 on: June 17, 2016, 04:29:26 pm »
"I will never lower standards," Mabus told Marines and sailors at Marine Corps Base Camp Pendleton, California. "Let me repeat that: Standards will not be lowered for any group! Standards may be changed as circumstances in the world change, but they'll be changed for everybody."

Well, that's the whole game right there.

                                                                                                             
The potential change is in response to a fitness review ordered by Commandant Gen. Robert Neller. Marine leaders found that “some current [fitness] standards are either not relevant, not challenging or not attainable,” according to a briefing obtained by Marine Corps Times.

"Not attainable?"  How could they be "not attainable" if they've been the standards for years?
« Last Edit: June 17, 2016, 04:31:32 pm by Maj. Bill Martin »

geronl

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Re: Marine Corps: Men and women must meet same standards for combat jobs
« Reply #5 on: June 17, 2016, 05:50:30 pm »
They can say it, but we all know it won't be true.

Online Maj. Bill Martin

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Re: Marine Corps: Men and women must meet same standards for combat jobs
« Reply #6 on: June 17, 2016, 05:55:07 pm »
They can say it, but we all know it won't be true.

It may very well be true -- they'll just "change" (i.e. lower) the standards for both men and women.

geronl

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Re: Marine Corps: Men and women must meet same standards for combat jobs
« Reply #7 on: June 18, 2016, 12:19:31 am »
It may very well be true -- they'll just "change" (i.e. lower) the standards for both men and women.

They said the same thing about the Army Rangers, but women who failed part of the course were apparently allowed to do it over and over without starting all over as males have to do.