Trump: I may ask Congress to formally declare war to fight terror

[Mechanicos]

So show me prior conduct of Trump abiding by the Constitutional limits on the powers of the president.

Show me where he is Government?

[ABX]

He is right on the surface about getting this, but let's see how long before he walks this back.

[Oceander]

Get real, folks.  No Congress, Democrat or Republican, would give the person Donald J. Trump a declaration of war.

The implications of that are simply too frightening for sane Americans to contemplate.

Congress did give us the PATRIOT Act. 

[Oceander]

Show me where he is Government?

That's right, he's never served in government, much less been president, so all we have for consideration are his words, which are meaningless things he twists as he wishes - truthful hyperbole - in order to sell suckers on the deal he's offering them. 

He said "I may" which necessarily implies that he "may not" and that he believes he has discretion in whether to do so or not.

There are lies, there are damned lies, there are statistics, and then there are Trump's truthful hyperboles. 

[kjam22]

From your own post earlier:

And what specifically are those powers that a declaration confers?  And what could be the effect?  You read the summary on a 70+ page document.  Certainly didn't study the statutes.  Now your 5 minutes ahead of king Trumpy in knowledge

[Mechanicos]

H
You do realize the appropriation happens annually?   Further, are you really suggesting we disban the entire military when things seem peaceful?   

There is a legal slight of hand going on with the army authorizations exceeding 2 years. The Korean war is not a declared war but a war by Treaty - and it is still ongoing.

[Mechanicos]

That's right, he's never served in government, much less been president, so all we have for consideration are his words, which are meaningless things he twists as he wishes - truthful hyperbole - in order to sell suckers on the deal he's offering them. 

He said "I may" which necessarily implies that he "may not" and that he believes he has discretion in whether to do so or not.

There are lies, there are damned lies, there are statistics, and then there are Trump's truthful hyperboles.

Of course hes going to hedge his bets at THIS time because he does not have all the information (intelligence briefings) of a president yet. Dumb talking point. Would you commit to an irreversible path to war before you had enough information on it? Get real.

[kjam22]

There is a legal slight of hand going on with the army authorizations exceeding 2 years. The Korean war is not a declared war but a war by Treaty - and it is still ongoing.

I'm just asking..... Are you saying we either declare war or completely disban our military?   Is that your position?

[Mechanicos]

And what specifically are those powers that a declaration confers?  And what could be the effect?  You read the summary on a 70+ page document.  Certainly didn't study the statutes.  Now your 5 minutes ahead of king Trumpy in knowledge

Statutes are inferior law and only have power when they do not conflict with the Constitution. Statutes get struck down all the time as unconstitutional. IF we get a Constitutional USSC who knows how many Statutes will be struck....

[Mechanicos]

This is kinda funny. #neverTrump Constitutionalists arguing against the constitution's own language... 

[Oceander]

Of course hes going to hedge his bets at THIS time because he does not have all the information (intelligence briefings) of a president yet. Dumb talking point. Would you commit to an irreversible path to war before you had enough information on it? Get real.

You really, really love red herrings, don't you.  How is refusing to say he's bound by the Constitution, saying he "may" as Congress for authorization or a declaration hedging anything other than preserving his options to violate the Constitution?  It doesn't require knowledge of any particular situation to say whether or not the president is bound by the Constitution - other than a knowledge of the Constitution, which Trump very clearly lacks. 

Tell me again how "may" is the same as "must".

[kjam22]

Statutes are inferior law and only have power when they do not conflict with the Constitution. Statutes get struck down all the time as unconstitutional. IF we get a Constitutional USSC who knows how many Statutes will be struck....

A declaration of war should be given when that is what is necessary to win the conflict.   When what it does and the powers it grants the prez are necessary.   Hence the question..... What exactly would it do to better help us defeat ISIS? 

[Mechanicos]

You really, really love red herrings, don't you.  How is refusing to say he's bound by the Constitution, saying he "may" as Congress for authorization or a declaration hedging anything other than preserving his options to violate the Constitution?  It doesn't require knowledge of any particular situation to say whether or not the president is bound by the Constitution - other than a knowledge of the Constitution, which Trump very clearly lacks. 

Tell me again how "may" is the same as "must".

Tell me again why a smart person would commit to war at this time without sufficient information to make that decision. Its an option to be decided later like what happens in real world land not #neverTrump land.

[Oceander]

This is kinda funny. #neverTrump Constitutionalists arguing against the constitution's own language... 

How is Trump's saying he "may" follow the Consitution the same as saying he "will" follow the Constitution?

I am not arguing against the Consitution, I am arguing precisely for the Constituion and for the president's obligation to follow it.  All I'm asking for is proof that Trump acknowledges the Consitution and the limits it puts on the president.  That is what you cannot provide, and so you dance around the question and try to distract me with red herrings. 

Prove that Trump knows the president must ask for a declaration and proof that he will abide by that requirement, and that he will not - as Obama has done - evade that requirement if Congress does not comply by using executive orders to get what Congress will not give him.  That you cannot do. 

[Mechanicos]

A declaration of war should be given when that is what is necessary to win the conflict.   When what it does and the powers it grants the prez are necessary.   Hence the question..... What exactly would it do to better help us defeat ISIS?

Well for one, it would allow the US to take the oil...

[Mechanicos]

How is Trump's saying he "may" follow the Consitution the same as saying he "will" follow the Constitution?

The issue was he may ask for a declaration of war. You are the one focused on words more then conduct.

[kjam22]

Well for one, it would allow the US to take the oil...

We're going to take the oil?   How does that work exactly?  We take control of the pipelines going out of Syria and Iraq and get some marketers over there to sell it for us?  We tell Russia and China and whoever else that you have to pay us now instead of paying ISIS?   Or we also confiscate the shipping facilities and sail it to our country?   

Another meaningless Trumpyism.   The better solution is to destroy all of their production facilities, including well sites

[Oceander]

The issue was he may ask for a declaration of war. You are the one focused on words more then conduct.

Because there is no conduct on Trump's part by which to measure his words; except, of course, his notorious habit of lying - telling truthful hyperboles - in negotiating business deals, but that hardly reflects well on whether he would in fact follow the Constitution.

[Mechanicos]

Because there is no conduct on Trump's part by which to measure his words; except, of course, his notorious habit of lying - telling truthful hyperboles - in negotiating business deals, but that hardly reflects well on whether he would in fact follow the Constitution.

Whats funny is the "Trump is a liar" narrative created by the #neverTrump propaganda masters is only campaign rhetoric created by people who did not believe it themselves.
http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,208404.0.html

If it was True, there would be hundreds if not thousands of people with personal knowledge of the man on the news all day confirming this narrative.

[DCPatriot]

Whats funny is the "Trump is a liar" narrative created by the #neverTrump propaganda masters is only campaign rhetoric created by people who did not believe it themselves.
http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,208404.0.html

If it was True, there would be hundreds if not thousands of people with personal knowledge of the man on the news all day confirming this narrative.

What I like about getting a formal Congressional declaration of war....it essentially makes our military ONE BIG SWAT TEAM...which, at a moment's notice is able to go into any country deemed to be sheltering 'Terrorists'.

A couple of Reagan-like strikes putting a missile down a chimney in thought-to-be Safe Houses will change the battlefield considerably.

[kjam22]

Well for one, it would allow the US to take the oil...

We're gonna take the oil,  and people actually think that makes sense.   It may take 100 years to pump it all out of the ground,  so we'll just keep troops there insuring the safety of all of our oil workers for the next 100 years.    How childish does someone have to be to agree with king Trumpy about taking the oil?

[RedHead]

WoW a president who wants to follow the Constitution. Amazing.

That's OK, I'm sure it's just a passing fancy and he'll be back to his usual self real soon,

But it does beg the question of who, exactly, is he going to declare war on?

[RedHead]

Well for one, it would allow the US to take the oil...

OK, so Trump is talking invading and occupying for as long as the oil lasts?

[kjam22]

OK, so Trump is talking invading and occupying for as long as the oil lasts?

It drives me crazy.  King Trumpy says these stupid things that sound good, and 40% of republicans say in a hick accent..."hell ya"

[Mechanicos]

OK, so Trump is talking invading and occupying for as long as the oil lasts?

Maybe, maybe we will get a new Territory, or Solar will take off or cold fusion will come about. Nonetheless logically the goal would be to deny that revenue and resource stream to the Muslim Terrorists. There are several ways this can come about once we have control of the fields. Only ONE is using the military to run it...