Author Topic: Camille Paglia: This is why Trump’s winning, and why I won’t vote for Hillary (Read 2702 times)

mystery-ak · « **on:** March 24, 2016, 01:00:24 pm »

http://www.salon.com/2016/03/24/camille_paglia_this_is_why_trumps_winning_and_why_i_wont_vote_for_hillary/

Thursday, Mar 24, 2016 05:00 AM CST

Camille Paglia: This is why Trump’s winning, and why I won’t vote for Hillary
GOP needs to wake up and realize Trump is its fault. But the Trump/Clinton death match is a national nightmare
Camille Paglia

This week’s horrific terrorist attacks on the Brussels airport and metro raised the pressure in the already tight U.S. presidential campaign. Candidates of both parties were instantly measured against voter expectations of how a president could and should behave in a similar crisis. Meanwhile, it was jarring to see a beaming President Obama relaxing at a Cuban baseball game, while grisly photos of the wrecked terminal and dazed, bloodied victims in Belgium were on steady media feed all over the world.

Given that most people, sequestered at their workplace, were unable to monitor the full range of responses throughout the day, the candidate who emerged on top was almost certainly Donald Trump. Despite his alarming enthusiasm for waterboarding and torture, Trump’s central campaign theme of securing the borders and more stringently vetting immigrants was strengthened by the events in Brussels, a historic city whose changing demographics he had already controversially warned about. Trump’s credibility would be enhanced if he treated the vital immigration issue in general policy terms rather than divisively singling out specific groups (Mexican, Muslim), the majority of whom are manifestly law-abiding.

Hillary Clinton’s Brussels response was basically boilerplate, calling for solidarity with Europe and playing chess with Trump to paint him as a greenhorn and hothead. Bernie Sanders (whom I support and contribute to) had little to say, beyond conveying condolences to the Belgian people, because foreign affairs have unfortunately remained a sideline for him. Neither Sanders nor Martin O’Malley ever went after Hillary’s disastrous record as Secretary of State with the tenacity that they should have—a failure of strategy that has proved costly in the long run.

continued

Relic · « **Reply #1 on:** March 24, 2016, 01:12:25 pm »

I am not a Trump fan. I think he is unpredictable, and I doubt his sincerity when he says he cares about America. However, I would crawl over broken glass to vote AGAINST Hillary. It takes a special kind of stupid for someone to vote for Hillary, and the sure damage she will do, because Trump may do damage.

I found this on facebook. I agree, why is it the GOP can put together a 100 day plan to get rid of Trump, but has no similar plan for Hillary? And never had one for Obama?

http://conservativetribune.com/rush-trumps-defense-1-gop/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=RightWingNews&utm_content=2016-03-22&utm_campaign=manualpost

Bill Cipher · « **Reply #2 on:** March 24, 2016, 01:21:29 pm »

Except that Trump consistently loses to Clinton in polls and he continues to build his negatives with the general electorate.

Relic · « **Reply #3 on:** March 24, 2016, 01:23:41 pm »

Quote from: Bill Cipher on March 24, 2016, 01:21:29 pm

Except that Trump consistently loses to Clinton in polls and he continues to build his negatives with the general electorate.

Yeah, we get it. You hate Trump. Here's a newsflash, you are going to hate Hillary more.

Enjoy
https://www.yahoo.com/politics/why-nevertrump-will-never-work-1392133276262454.html

Bill Cipher · « **Reply #4 on:** March 24, 2016, 01:26:26 pm »

Quote from: Relic on March 24, 2016, 01:23:41 pm

Yeah, we get it. You hate Trump. Here's a newsflash, you are going to hate Hillary more.

No, you don't get it. And before you start pissing all over me like a 2 y.o. I will remind you that I have already said multiple times I will vote against Hillary even if it means voting for the orange baboon.

Get it? Is that clear enough for you?

Relic · « **Reply #5 on:** March 24, 2016, 01:29:37 pm »

Quote from: Bill Cipher on March 24, 2016, 01:26:26 pm

No, you don't get it. And before you start pissing all over me like a 2 y.o. I will remind you that I have already said multiple times I will vote against Hillary even if it means voting for the orange baboon.

Get it? Is that clear enough for you?

I'll apologize, (and ignore your mini rant), because I know we're all a bit sick of the pro and anti Trump pissing matches here. I'm not pleased that Trump is the likely nominee. I can't believe that's the best we can do, but, almost anyone is better than Hillary.

Bill Cipher · « **Reply #6 on:** March 24, 2016, 01:32:30 pm »

Quote from: Relic on March 24, 2016, 01:29:37 pm

I'll apologize, (and ignore your mini rant), because I know we're all a bit sick of the pro and anti Trump pissing matches here. I'm not pleased that Trump is the likely nominee. I can't believe that's the best we can do, but, almost anyone is better than Hillary.

My rant? Check the mirror first.

But yes, I agree, there are few worse than Clinton, particularly with the Supreme Court at stake.

GourmetDan · « **Reply #7 on:** March 24, 2016, 01:49:15 pm »

Quote from: Relic on March 24, 2016, 01:12:25 pm

I found this on facebook. I agree, why is it the GOP can put together a 100 day plan to get rid of Trump, but has no similar plan for Hillary? And never had one for Obama?

Because...

"The sole purpose of the Republican Party is to serve as an ineffective alternative to the Democrat Party."

aligncare · « **Reply #8 on:** March 24, 2016, 02:15:24 pm »

Quote from: Relic on March 24, 2016, 01:12:25 pm

I am not a Trump fan. I think he is unpredictable, and I doubt his sincerity when he says he cares about America. However, I would crawl over broken glass to vote AGAINST Hillary. It takes a special kind of stupid for someone to vote for Hillary, and the sure damage she will do, because Trump may do damage.

I found this on facebook. I agree, why is it the GOP can put together a 100 day plan to get rid of Trump, but has no similar plan for Hillary? And never had one for Obama?

http://conservativetribune.com/rush-trumps-defense-1-gop/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=RightWingNews&utm_content=2016-03-22&utm_campaign=manualpost

Donald Trump is extremely predictable. He's no mystery. He said exactly why he's running for president.

Donald Trump is all about winning the best deal he can possibly make for those he represents – in this case, as president, representing America.

He's repeated the same basic message about politicians and the media since at least 1988, and earlier. It's in the public record. You can find it on YouTube or do a Google search.

Donald Trump has consistently opposed stupid American politicians losing American treasure and blood overseas to less capable nations than ourselves. That, he is absolutely consistent on. Of course, the sanctimony from the pious crowd want to make sure that their candidate checks off all of the "conservative" checkboxes.

Sorry but this is the wrong year for that kind of ideological purity test. Besides, Ted Cruz is as establishment as you can get. Starting working for the establishment in the Bush administration, where he met his wife Heidi, who also worked for the Bush administration. Now, he's accepted establishment donor money and the Bush's financial team, headed by Neil Bush. You can't get any more establishment than Bush et al.

alicewonders · « **Reply #9 on:** March 24, 2016, 02:42:38 pm »

Quote from: aligncare on March 24, 2016, 02:15:24 pm

Donald Trump is extremely predictable. He's no mystery. He said exactly why he's running for president.

Donald Trump is all about winning the best deal he can possibly make for those he represents – in this case, as president, representing America.

He's repeated the same basic message about politicians and the media since at least 1988, and earlier. It's in the public record. You can find it on YouTube or do a Google search.

Donald Trump has consistently opposed stupid American politicians losing American treasure and blood overseas to less capable nations than ourselves. That, he is absolutely consistent on. Of course, the sanctimony from the pious crowd want to make sure that their candidate checks off all of the "conservative" checkboxes.

Sorry but this is the wrong year for that kind of ideological purity test. Besides, Ted Cruz is as establishment as you can get. Starting working for the establishment in the Bush administration, where he met his wife Heidi, who also worked for the Bush administration. Now, he's accepted establishment donor money and the Bush's financial team, headed by Neil Bush. You can't get any more establishment than Bush et al.

Well said ac - and quite true. Trump is by no means the perfect candidate, but he is the GOP frontrunner, in spite of having to run against many "professional and experienced" politicians. It's clear that a great many Republicans have a bad taste in their mouths when it comes to having to support the same old tired GOPe supporting candidates. I think most people are willing to gamble on something different than what we've had to choose from in the past.

And yes - I do believe that Trump loves America. If he gets elected, everything he does will be to advance America's best interests. Will I agree with everything he does? Probably not - but I do know that Obama has, and Hillary will, do everything they can to destroy what made America great.

Does anyone have any doubt about that?

If you decide, out of moral and ethical purity, to not vote for the most conservative candidate that can win this November - and that is NOT a third party candidate - and NOT voting for a presidential candidate is the same as NOT voting against the Dem candidate.....if you decide to sit that decision out - then you have done just the same as vote for Hillary!

If Trump becomes the nominee, his numbers will go up if the party will get behind him - if they won't have destroyed everything trying to get rid of him first.

Relic · « **Reply #10 on:** March 24, 2016, 02:49:47 pm »

Quote from: alicewonders on March 24, 2016, 02:42:38 pm

...

And yes - I do believe that Trump loves America. If he gets elected, everything he does will be to advance America's best interests. Will I agree with everything he does? Probably not - but I do know that Obama has, and Hillary will, do everything they can to destroy what made America great.

Does anyone have any doubt about that?

...

And that is the point. Trump is bombastic, and at times quite crude. I was never a Trump fan, even before his political life, he was just too boorish for my taste.

But here it is. We are going to be given the choice of someone who has some success in life, and may actually have America's best interests in his priority list. Or, someone who is a liar, a cheat, and an America hater. A woman who personifies evil.

How anyone can say Hillary would be better than Trump is beyond me.

aligncare · « **Reply #11 on:** March 24, 2016, 02:56:53 pm »

"If Donald Trump is the nominee I will vote for Hillary Clinton" –TBR poster (name withheld out of respect for mystery-AK)

sinkspur · « **Reply #12 on:** March 24, 2016, 03:04:39 pm »

Quote

If you decide, out of moral and ethical purity, to not vote for the most conservative candidate that can win this November - and that is NOT a third party candidate - and NOT voting for a presidential candidate is the same as NOT voting against the Dem candidate.....if you decide to sit that decision out - then you have done just the same as vote for Hillary!

Baloney. Is the half of the eligible Americans who won't vote in November voting for Hillary? Of course not. That's why this is a silly argument.

Not voting for Trump is not voting for Trump, period. Unless I actually vote for Hillary (which I won't), she gets nothing from me.

Trump is not a conservative. He's also uncouth and crude and stupid when it comes to policy. And he's petty.

I don't want a president who's going to start twitter wars out of revenge when somebody takes a shot at him in the media.

alicewonders · « **Reply #13 on:** March 24, 2016, 03:17:35 pm »

Quote from: sinkspur on March 24, 2016, 03:04:39 pm

Baloney. Is the half of the eligible Americans who won't vote in November voting for Hillary? Of course not. That's why this is a silly argument.

Not voting for Trump is not voting for Trump, period. Unless I actually vote for Hillary (which I won't), she gets nothing from me.

Trump is not a conservative. He's also uncouth and crude and stupid when it comes to policy. And he's petty.

I don't want a president who's going to start twitter wars out of revenge when somebody takes a shot at him in the media.

Quote

Baloney. Is the half of the eligible Americans who won't vote in November voting for Hillary? Of course not. That's why this is a silly argument.

I could not disagree with you more Sink. The "half of the eligible Americans who won't vote in November" are, by not voting, NOT voting against Hillary - and that is the same as voting for her. It is enabling a win for her.

We know how you feel about Trump - you tell us over and over again. But yet, you offer no solutions.

When it comes down to it - we must stand behind the opposition to Hillary, as she will most assuredly be as bad, if not WORSE than the devastatingly awful president Barack Obama has proven to be. She is, in my mind, the single worst human being that could ever inhabit the White House.

So, wage your war in the primaries - that's what they're for. But, come November - you are going to have to choose a side.....

.....WITH Hillary - or - AGAINST Hillary?

Bill Cipher · « **Reply #14 on:** March 24, 2016, 03:30:10 pm »

Quote from: aligncare on March 24, 2016, 02:56:53 pm

"If Donald Trump is the nominee I will vote for Hillary Clinton" –TBR poster (name withheld out of respect for mystery-AK)

Fail. mystery-ak is unfailingly in favor of open discourse, so that's just a dodge to pretend you can prove what you cannot. And even so, you can only find one when you alleged there were many here. Like with Trump and his false accusations against Cruz for the wife-ad, checking facts before posting would be a good idea.

Bill Cipher · « **Reply #15 on:** March 24, 2016, 03:31:22 pm »

Camille Paglia speaks for most American women the way that Thomas Sowell speaks for most American blacks, which is to say not at all.

alicewonders · « **Reply #16 on:** March 24, 2016, 03:47:34 pm »

Quote from: Bill Cipher on March 24, 2016, 03:31:22 pm

Camille Paglia speaks for most American women the way that Thomas Sowell speaks for most American blacks, which is to say not at all.

I like her because she is not afraid to speak against her party. I may not agree with her party politics, but I respect her in that she is not afraid to call them out from time to time.

Bill Cipher · « **Reply #17 on:** March 24, 2016, 03:49:05 pm »

Quote from: alicewonders on March 24, 2016, 03:47:34 pm

I like her because she is not afraid to speak against her party. I may not agree with her party politics, but I respect her in that she is not afraid to call them out from time to time.

I don't necessarily disagree. I'm just saying that drawing conclusions about how women will vote in the general based on her statements is a fools errand.

Fishrrman · « **Reply #18 on:** March 25, 2016, 02:11:53 am »

Relic wrote above:
"And that is the point. Trump is bombastic, and at times quite crude. I was never a Trump fan, even before his political life, he was just too boorish for my taste."

Gee, it's almost as if General George Patton had come back to life and was running for president, eh?
But all the anti-Trumps would reject him, in favor of a more "Eisenhower-like" persona.

All well and good (I remember Ike, a little, I was still young then).
But you don't go to war with the general you wish you had.
You do so with the one you've got.

Trump is the fighter we've got, like him or not...

Bill Cipher · « **Reply #19 on:** March 25, 2016, 02:13:12 am »

Quote from: Fishrrman on March 25, 2016, 02:11:53 am

Relic wrote above:
"And that is the point. Trump is bombastic, and at times quite crude. I was never a Trump fan, even before his political life, he was just too boorish for my taste."

Gee, it's almost as if General George Patton had come back to life and was running for president, eh?
But all the anti-Trumps would reject him, in favor of a more "Eisenhower-like" persona.

All well and good (I remember Ike, a little, I was still young then).
But you don't go to war with the general you wish you had.
You do so with the one you've got.

Trump is the fighter we've got, like him or not...

General Patton?

EasyAce · « **Reply #20 on:** March 25, 2016, 02:56:37 am »

Quote

. . . a Trump-Hillary death match will be a national nightmare, a race to the bottom for both parties, as Democratic and Republican operatives compete to dig up the most lurid and salacious dirt on both flawed candidates. We’ll be sadistically trapped in an endless film noir, with Trump as Citizen Kane, Don Corleone and Scarface and Hillary as Norma Desmond, Mommie Dearest and the Wicked Witch of the West.

She was wrong about one thing: I'd have had Donaldus Minimus as Benny Binion, Bugsy Siegel (who, like Donaldus Minimus, wasn't even a tenth as smart as Don Corleone), and Bernie Madoff; and, Hilarious Rodent Clinton as Cruella deVille, Queen Athaliah, and Mommie Dearest.