Trump's Idea to Cut National Debt - Get Creditors to Accept Less

[ABX]

Yeah right. Fails economics 101. We are heading to a crash. Both Trump and Cruz agree. That's at minimum a default.

You are confusing a lot of separate things. A 'crash' as in a market crash is not a national bankruptcy. That can be caused by a lot of factors, not the least of which is the inflationary cycle I mentioned above. A market crash also is not a default any more than during the great depression did we default on our country's debt obligations. On the contrary, the government greatly expanded debt obligations through printing and currency devaluation. That is an entirely different set of problems.

Before you say 'fails economics 101', you may want to look up specific terms like bankruptcy. These terms have specific meanings that are important.

[Mechanicos]

You are confusing a lot of separate things. A 'crash' as in a market crash is not a national bankruptcy. That can be caused by a lot of factors, not the least of which is the inflationary cycle I mentioned above. A market crash also is not a default any more than during the great depression did we default on our country's debt obligations. On the contrary, the government greatly expanded debt obligations through printing and currency devaluation. That is an entirely different set of problems.

Before you say 'fails economics 101', you may want to look up specific terms like bankruptcy. These terms have specific meanings that are important.

I do know what bankruptcy means and all its Chapters. His wanting to renegotiate with soft creditors is not bankruptcy. The fact is Bankruptcy/default is the BATNA of a negotiated agreement in this case. BATNA means Best Alternative To A Negotiated Agreement. They are not the same thing and its not honest to keep using the term bankruptcy on the context of this issue.

[Free Vulcan]

I do know what bankruptcy means and all its Chapters. His wanting to renegotiate with soft creditors is not bankruptcy. The fact is Bankruptcy/default is the BATNA of a negotiated agreement in this case. BATNA means Best Alternative To A Negotiated Agreement. They are not the same thing and its not honest to keep using the term bankruptcy on the context of this issue.

This is not Chapter bankruptcy. This is int'l global finance. Merely bringing up the subject of negotiating with creditors will completely rock the system.

And exactly what would we pay them with?

[Mechanicos]

This is not Chapter bankruptcy. This is int'l global finance. Merely bringing up the subject of negotiating with creditors will completely rock the system.

And exactly what would we pay them with?

And what exactly is the option? To continue on the same path?

[driftdiver]

And what exactly is the option? To continue on the same path?

How about cut spending?   WOW shocking

Entitlements, welfare, food stamps, global warming studies,

[Mechanicos]

How about cut spending?   WOW shocking

Entitlements, welfare, food stamps, global warming studies,

Trump hates the EPA and many of the govt agencies that handicap business. As far as food stamps welfare, getting rid of 20 million illegals would be a good start on that. SS people paid for.

[Mechanicos]

Debt Default In America

http://www.truthbasedlogic.com/default.htm

[Bigun]

How about cut spending?   WOW shocking

Entitlements, welfare, food stamps, global warming studies,

We could start by eliminating about 2/3 of what the federal government is currently doing without the slightest constitutional authority to do it!

[Wingnut]

Trump hates the EPA and many of the govt agencies that handicap business. As far as food stamps welfare, getting rid of 20 million illegals would be a good start on that. SS people paid for.

Little known fact:
Trump loves the EPA.  And the EPA loves Trump.  So much love in fact, the EPA turned the Animas River orange in Trumps honor.

[driftdiver]

Little known fact:
Trump loves the EPA.  And the EPA loves Trump.  So much love in fact, the EPA turned the Animas River orange in Trumps honor.

 

[kjam22]

Trump heard about these guys on the radio...   https://www.nationaldebtrelief.com/apply/

They will solve your debt crisis for you.....

[RedHead]

He told truth and was pragmatic. I suspect tho this segways into his wanting to charge for arrears the countries we financially and militarily support who do not pay their fair compensation for the services we have provided. So, this can reduce the Debt owed to them by the amounts they owe us. Good Idea  when you think about it.

So how does defaulting on our debt teach those countries we militarily support?

[geronl]

We could start by eliminating about 2/3 of what the federal government is currently doing without the slightest constitutional authority to do it!

Two-thirds, at least

[Mechanicos]

We could start by eliminating about 2/3 of what the federal government is currently doing without the slightest constitutional authority to do it!

Congratulations, we are in agreement.

[RedHead]

And what exactly is the option? To continue on the same path?

Trump has shown no interest in getting off that path so his plan is to default and then have to borrow more at higher rates.  Good plan.  /sarcasm

[Free Vulcan]

And what exactly is the option? To continue on the same path?

No. We need to stop issuing new debt. We need to start paying down old debt. I don't even know how we're going to deal with unfunded liabilities.

You need to understand - our debt isn't just debt. It's also used as an asset. That debt is in retirement funds, held as bank reserves, it's used as collateral, and as interest bearing reserve currency by foreign nations. These things are stacked on top of one another in our interlinked global system of banking and finance.

Do you realize what it will do to the global banking system if we try to discount it? It will crash everything that's built on it, trillions in money supply just gone. It will grind everything to a halt, like right now.

And if you try and buy that debt by creating money, you just exchange one set of problems with another. Global banking and finance are like temporal mechanics in the sci-fi shows - there are very twisty and often perverse consequences to actions taken.

Running surpluses is our only hope of getting our debt situation. We need to cut unneeded spending and make our business environment more competitive to increase revenue. That's the only legit way you can do it.

[Bigun]

And what exactly is the option? To continue on the same path?

1. implement the penny plan.  http://www.onecentsolution.org/the-one-cent-solution/

2. Pass the fairtax into law!      http://fairtax.org

Passing the fairtax into law would result in the greatest and most sustained economic expansion that anyone alive today in this country has ever seen and with the penny plan in place our economic woes would be history in very short order!

And the kicker is we get our FREEDOM back in the bargain!

[geronl]

We need to cut unneeded spending and make our business environment more competitive to increase revenue. That's the only legit way you can do it.

 

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

This kinda thing is common with collection agencies. They purchase debt for pennies on the dollar so even if you only pay a fraction of what you owe, they will still make money.

Of course your credit goes to shit, but that doesn't matter right? We're the United States!

[Mechanicos]

No. We need to stop issuing new debt. We need to start paying down old debt. I don't even know how we're going to deal with unfunded liabilities.

You need to understand - our debt isn't just debt. It's also used as an asset. That debt is in retirement funds, held as bank reserves, it's used as collateral, and as interest bearing reserve currency by foreign nations. These things are stacked on top of one another in our interlinked global system of banking and finance.

Do you realize what it will do to the global banking system if we try to discount it? It will crash everything that's built on it, trillions in money supply just gone. It will grind everything to a halt, like right now.

And if you try and buy that debt by creating money, you just exchange one set of problems with another. Global banking and finance are like temporal mechanics in the sci-fi shows - there are very twisty and often perverse consequences to actions taken.

Running surpluses is our only hope of getting our debt situation. We need to cut unneeded spending and make our business environment more competitive to increase revenue. That's the only legit way you can do it.

Some of the many critics of Trump crunched the Numbers of what you proposed awhile back. Even if all of it was done as it should be, it would not even come close to fixing the house of cards problem that the Establishment created. I have no doubt most of what you suggested is already planned to happen. Talking about negotiating debt is only ONE part of a much bigger strategy to fix the economic disaster. Nonetheless, what many seem not to understand is the likely path that we are on now would have us in war rather than the implementation of common sense economic solutions. 

I do not know if you had any political science classes, but normally when a country is approaching the kind of economic positions US and several others are, wars start for several reasons. Such as to stimulate the economy, focus the anger, increase production etc. Normally, the goal of the ruling class when that happens is to keep such wars small with few reported casualties for the "good" guys. Our rulers have used this strategy a lot since WWII. The Problem now is the politically correct "enemy" does not play by the rules and can strike back. Thus the small managed wars with good optics  can and will escalate.

We have a Cancer, no matter what there will be pain. Would rather it be managed, short lived and get healthy after or catastrophic and possibly fatal to our economic house of cards? We are on the path to the latter, or worse -even with what you suggested. Which by the way are good ideas, just insufficient.   

[Bigun]

Donald J. Trump is clinically insane!

Should never bee allowed within a mile of ANY elected office much less the presidency!