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Offline ABX

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The GOPe Turn on National Review
« on: January 22, 2016, 01:25:26 pm »
I guess they are settling for the candidate they can buy.

Quote
Houston, We Have a Problem

....Tonight, a top official with the RNC called me to say that National Review was being disinvited. The reason: Our “Against Trump“ editorial and symposium. We expected this was coming. Small price to pay for speaking the truth about The Donald.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/430166/houston-we-have-problem





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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2016, 02:07:32 pm »
http://www.nationalreview.com/node/430137/print

 Against Trump
By The Editors — January 21, 2016

Donald Trump leads the polls nationally and in most states in the race for the Republican presidential nomination. There are understandable reasons for his eminence, and he has shown impressive gut-level skill as a campaigner. But he is not deserving of conservative support in the caucuses and primaries. Trump is a philosophically unmoored political opportunist who would trash the broad conservative ideological consensus within the GOP in favor of a free-floating populism with strong-man overtones.

Trump’s political opinions have wobbled all over the lot. The real-estate mogul and reality-TV star has supported abortion, gun control, single-payer health care à la Canada, and punitive taxes on the wealthy. (He and Bernie Sanders have shared more than funky outer-borough accents.) Since declaring his candidacy he has taken a more conservative line, yet there are great gaping holes in it.

His signature issue is concern over immigration — from Latin America but also, after Paris and San Bernardino, from the Middle East. He has exploited the yawning gap between elite opinion in both parties and the public on the issue, and feasted on the discontent over a government that can’t be bothered to enforce its own laws no matter how many times it says it will (President Obama has dispensed even with the pretense). But even on immigration, Trump often makes no sense and can’t be relied upon. A few short years ago, he was criticizing Mitt Romney for having the temerity to propose “self-deportation,” or the entirely reasonable policy of reducing the illegal population through attrition while enforcing the nation’s laws. Now, Trump is a hawk’s hawk.

He pledges to build a wall along the southern border and to make Mexico pay for it. We need more fencing at the border, but the promise to make Mexico pay for it is silly bluster. Trump says he will put a big door in his beautiful wall, an implicit endorsement of the dismayingly conventional view that current levels of legal immigration are fine. Trump seems unaware that a major contribution of his own written immigration plan is to question the economic impact of legal immigration and to call for reform of the H-1B–visa program. Indeed, in one Republican debate he clearly had no idea what’s in that plan and advocated increased legal immigration, which is completely at odds with it. These are not the meanderings of someone with well-informed, deeply held views on the topic.

As for illegal immigration, Trump pledges to deport the 11 million illegals here in the United States, a herculean administrative and logistical task beyond the capacity of the federal government. Trump piles on the absurdity by saying he would re-import many of the illegal immigrants once they had been deported, which makes his policy a poorly disguised amnesty (and a version of a similarly idiotic idea that appeared in one of Washington’s periodic “comprehensive” immigration reforms). This plan wouldn’t survive its first contact with reality.



On foreign policy, Trump is a nationalist at sea. Sometimes he wants to let Russia fight ISIS, and at others he wants to “bomb the sh**” out of it. He is fixated on stealing Iraq’s oil and casually suggested a few weeks ago a war crime — killing terrorists’ families — as a tactic in the war on terror. For someone who wants to project strength, he has an astonishing weakness for flattery, falling for Vladimir Putin after a few coquettish bats of the eyelashes from the Russian thug. All in all, Trump knows approximately as much about national security as he does about the nuclear triad — which is to say, almost nothing.

Indeed, Trump’s politics are those of an averagely well-informed businessman: Washington is full of problems; I am a problem-solver; let me at them. But if you have no familiarity with the relevant details and the levers of power, and no clear principles to guide you, you will, like most tenderfeet, get rolled. Especially if you are, at least by all outward indications, the most poll-obsessed politician in all of American history. Trump has shown no interest in limiting government, in reforming entitlements, or in the Constitution. He floats the idea of massive new taxes on imported goods and threatens to retaliate against companies that do too much manufacturing overseas for his taste. His obsession is with “winning,” regardless of the means — a spirit that is anathema to the ordered liberty that conservatives hold dear and that depends for its preservation on limits on government power. The Tea Party represented a revival of an understanding of American greatness in these terms, an understanding to which Trump is tone-deaf at best and implicitly hostile at worst. He appears to believe that the administrative state merely needs a new master, rather than a new dispensation that cuts it down to size and curtails its power.

It is unpopular to say in the year of the “outsider,” but it is not a recommendation that Trump has never held public office. Since 1984, when Jesse Jackson ran for president with no credential other than a great flow of words, both parties have been infested by candidates who have treated the presidency as an entry-level position. They are the excrescences of instant-hit media culture. The burdens and intricacies of leadership are special; experience in other fields is not transferable. That is why all American presidents have been politicians, or generals.

Any candidate can promise the moon. But politicians have records of success, failure, or plain backsliding by which their promises may be judged. Trump can try to make his blankness a virtue by calling it a kind of innocence. But he is like a man with no credit history applying for a mortgage — or, in this case, applying to manage a $3.8 trillion budget and the most fearsome military on earth.



Trump’s record as a businessman is hardly a recommendation for the highest office in the land. For all his success, Trump inherited a real-estate fortune from his father. Few of us will ever have the experience, as Trump did, of having Daddy-O bail out our struggling enterprise with an illegal loan in the form of casino chips. Trump’s primary work long ago became less about building anything than about branding himself and tending to his celebrity through a variety of entertainment ventures, from WWE to his reality-TV show, The Apprentice. His business record reflects the often dubious norms of the milieu: using eminent domain to condemn the property of others; buying the good graces of politicians — including many Democrats — with donations.

Trump has gotten far in the GOP race on a brash manner, buffed over decades in New York tabloid culture. His refusal to back down from any gaffe, no matter how grotesque, suggests a healthy impertinence in the face of postmodern PC (although the insults he hurls at anyone who crosses him also speak to a pettiness and lack of basic civility). His promise to make America great again recalls the populism of Andrew Jackson. But Jackson was an actual warrior; and President Jackson made many mistakes. Without Jackson’s scars, what is Trump’s rhetoric but show and strut?

If Trump were to become the president, the Republican nominee, or even a failed candidate with strong conservative support, what would that say about conservatives? The movement that ground down the Soviet Union and took the shine, at least temporarily, off socialism would have fallen in behind a huckster. The movement concerned with such “permanent things” as constitutional government, marriage, and the right to life would have become a claque for a Twitter feed.

Trump nevertheless offers a valuable warning for the Republican party. If responsible men irresponsibly ignore an issue as important as immigration, it will be taken up by the reckless. If they cannot explain their Beltway maneuvers — worse, if their maneuvering is indefensible — they will be rejected by their own voters. If they cannot advance a compelling working-class agenda, the legitimate anxieties and discontents of blue-collar voters will be exploited by demagogues. We sympathize with many of the complaints of Trump supporters about the GOP, but that doesn’t make the mogul any less flawed a vessel for them.

Some conservatives have made it their business to make excuses for Trump and duly get pats on the head from him. Count us out. Donald Trump is a menace to American conservatism who would take the work of generations and trample it underfoot in behalf of a populism as heedless and crude as the Donald himself.
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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2016, 02:07:59 pm »
http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/266679-trump-rips-gop-manifesto-as-national-review-cut-from-debate

January 22, 2016, 07:21 am
Trump rips GOP manifesto as National Review cut from debate

By Tristan Lejeune

Republican presidential front-runner Donald Trump tore into the National Review on Thursday night for publishing an issue dedicated to attacking him while the Republican National Committee cut the magazine as a primary debate host.

The RNC announced it had disinvited the National Review from a GOP debate the magazine had been set to co-host on Feb. 25 after its latest issue — called “Against Trump” — featured essays slamming the real estate mogul from leading conservatives including Glenn Beck, Erick Erickson and Russell Moore.

Trump, meanwhile, took to Twitter to slam the publication:





“A debate moderator can’t have a predisposition,” RNC spokesman Sean Spicer in a online post.

Trump has faced accusations both of being too extreme, risking moderate voters for a GOP ticket, and of being a fake conservative with a long history of liberal views.

The National Review’s attack issue is perhaps the most visible example of conservatives struggling to take down the billionaire, who holds a prohibitive lead in national polling, as well as in the first primary state of New Hampshire.

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Offline ABX

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2016, 02:33:14 pm »
A few months ago the RNC was whining about Trump, trying anything to get rid of him and even demanding he pledge his allegiance.  Now they slam heavy hitters like Thomas Sowell, Edwin Meese III, and so many more in defense of Trump?

This is all very curious.  It seems almost purposefully out to destroy everyone on the right.  Reminds me of a Monk episode where an incarcerated thug was due to pass through a courthouse so his thug girlfriend killed an old lady juror just to get on a jury (Monk's).  She then aimed to stall the jury, voting against the others for no principle other than delay.  She voted guilty then not guilty, just to hang up the jury.

Almost seems like the RNC just wants scandal.  No principles.  Scandal.  Or maybe control.  Anyone they can control.  At first they didn't think they could control Trump but now they think they can.

Something...because this is too weird.

The business side of the GOP goes with who they can buy. They are in the business of winning, not in the business of values. They see Trump who is someone for sale while Cruz and others as principled people who will go against them.

It is rich irony now so many who claim to be Conservatives are now attacking the likes of Thomas Sowell whose bonifieds have never been in question.

When you are a Conservative and you turn on Thomas Sowell, it is time to reevaluate your position.

Offline GAJohnnie

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2016, 03:24:05 pm »
I guess they are settling for the candidate they can buy.

yeah let ignore the facts and spin a fable that validates our emotion based canidate opinions

 As the RNC said in their statement , you cannot have a moderator at a debate with pre determined editorial postion.

If NRO had come out for Trump, Rubio, Bush etc, the RNC would do the same thing.

Offline GAJohnnie

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2016, 03:29:08 pm »
EXACTLY!

Real Conservative do not idolize personalities. When Dr Sowell publishes a poorly argued easily refuted screed based on his political opinions rather then facts, rational people will point out his failures of logic and reason.


This campaign has been pretty shocking in exposing just how many in the supposed "Conservatives Media" are wholly driven by their emotions based opinions, not their reason.

Offline GAJohnnie

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2016, 03:31:29 pm »
When you are a Conservative and you turn on Thomas Sowell, it is time to reevaluate your position.

When did "Conservatives" start blindly worship media figures rather then be willing to acknowledge the real flaws in logic and reason in the argument they presented?

Offline Scottftlc

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2016, 03:51:28 pm »
If National Review is as effective and insightful as they have been for decades, then this will definitely impact the attitudes of bird owners and fish n' chip eaters everywhere.
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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2016, 03:55:36 pm »
Donald Trump is a Brand New Lamborghini that looks GREAT until you get up close and notice that the tires are bald and there is a yugo engine under the hood!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Offline katzenjammer

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2016, 03:58:16 pm »
When you are a Conservative and you turn on Thomas Sowell, it is time to reevaluate your position.

When did "Conservatives" start blindly worship media figures rather then be willing to acknowledge the real flaws in logic and reason in the argument they presented?

Because Dr. Sowell has come out with an anti-Trump stance, he is omniscient; it is virtually definitional at this point.

Offline Scottftlc

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2016, 04:07:58 pm »
Because Dr. Sowell has come out with an anti-Trump stance, he is omniscient; it is virtually definitional at this point.

Because Thomas Sowell has had such a dramatic impact on turning the American government and society toward "conservative" values?  We see the effects of his powerful impact everywhere?
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Offline katzenjammer

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #11 on: January 22, 2016, 04:22:02 pm »
Because Thomas Sowell has had such a dramatic impact on turning the American government and society toward "conservative" values?  We see the effects of his powerful impact everywhere?

None of that matters... now!  To be fair, Sowell has been a good intellectual voice for conservatism for quite some time.  In my opinion, I have noticed that he seems to be getting a bit afield as he has aged; but who hasn't!  The point is, he is a man with an opinion, like anyone else.

There are often charges about Trump supporters being part of a cult of personality, I see the same, in spades, from many Cruz supporters.

(A wise person long ago warned about any of us putting our total trust in man ("in princes, in human beings"), I think ALL would do well to heed that warning.)

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #12 on: January 22, 2016, 04:24:35 pm »
The RNC is kissing Trump's arse because it's petrified that Trump will break his promise and run as a third party independent if he isn't treated "fairly".   Trump's a mafia don,  strong-arming anyone who gets in his way.   I think there's some truth to the meme that, among at least some "establishment" Republicans,  they'd rather deal with Trump, who can be bought, than Cruz, who's the sort of idealist that will lead the national ticket to a Goldwater-like defeat.   

(As I've stated before, while I don't support Cruz because I fear he's unelectable, I'll be pleased to extend my 40 years of loyalty and support him if he's the nominee.  Goldwater's defeat eventually led conservatives to the promised land.  But if Trump's the nominee, I'm leaving the GOP behind.  I will not be an accessory to his madness.) 
 
Bottom line, IMO,  neither Trump nor Cruz can win in the fall, for different reasons. If conservatives want to win the White House (and I doubt that's the real goal for many), then it's time to unite around one of the other challengers, be it Rubio, Christie, Kasich, Fiorina or Bush.   It's the lack of unified opposition that is causing Trump and Cruz to look so strong.   But if either wins the nomination, Hillary will be measuring the drapes.
 
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Offline GAJohnnie

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #13 on: January 22, 2016, 04:34:10 pm »
It is utterly hypocritical for "conservatives" to applaud the RNC giving NBC the boot for their biases then turn around and demand the same RNC standard on per-disposition NOT be applied to National Review.

If NRO had written these article about Cruz, the RNC would give them the boot. Really sad to see how many supposed "conservatives" have given up on reason due to their emotional opinions about this or that candidate.

Offline GAJohnnie

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #14 on: January 22, 2016, 04:37:33 pm »

(A wise person long ago warned about any of us putting our total trust in man ("in princes, in human beings"), I think ALL would do well to heed that warning.)

VERY good advice. The only thing you can count on in politics is any one you elect will disappoint you at times. Even Reagan let us down a few time on tax hikes and amnesty for illegals.

NO one but God is perfect.

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #15 on: January 22, 2016, 04:38:58 pm »
None of that matters... now!  To be fair, Sowell has been a good intellectual voice for conservatism for quite some time.  In my opinion, I have noticed that he seems to be getting a bit afield as he has aged; but who hasn't!  The point is, he is a man with an opinion, like anyone else.

There are often charges about Trump supporters being part of a cult of personality, I see the same, in spades, from many Cruz supporters.

(A wise person long ago warned about any of us putting our total trust in man ("in princes, in human beings"), I think ALL would do well to heed that warning.)

I see the Cruz cult of personality too.  It's obvious that many people who are against Trump are now seeing the writing on the wall, that he will likely be our nominee.  It's going to become more clear in the next couple of weeks.

 



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Offline GAJohnnie

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #16 on: January 22, 2016, 05:01:05 pm »
Have to laugh that the same NR that went all in for McCain in 2008 and Romney in 2012 during the primaries is NOW being hailed as a bastion of "Conservatism".

« Last Edit: January 22, 2016, 05:01:51 pm by GAJohnnie »

Offline aligncare

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #17 on: January 22, 2016, 05:08:03 pm »
Donald Trump is a Brand New Lamborghini that looks GREAT until you get up close and notice that the tires are bald and there is a yugo engine under the hood!

Very creative, loved the imagery--agree about the tires, wrong about the yugo engine. But, I liked it anyway!

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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #18 on: January 22, 2016, 05:12:33 pm »
A few months ago the RNC was whining about Trump, trying anything to get rid of him and even demanding he pledge his allegiance.  Now they slam heavy hitters like Thomas Sowell, Edwin Meese III, and so many more in defense of Trump?

This is all very curious.  It seems almost purposefully out to destroy everyone on the right.  Reminds me of a Monk episode where an incarcerated thug was due to pass through a courthouse so his thug girlfriend killed an old lady juror just to get on a jury (Monk's).  She then aimed to stall the jury, voting against the others for no principle other than delay.  She voted guilty then not guilty, just to hang up the jury.

Almost seems like the RNC just wants scandal.  No principles.  Scandal.  Or maybe control.  Anyone they can control.  At first they didn't think they could control Trump but now they think they can.

Something...because this is too weird.

My hunch is 'The Donald"; who deems himself as the best negotiator in the world, has already made a deal with the GOPe and the Clintons.
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Re: The GOPe Turn on National Review
« Reply #19 on: January 22, 2016, 08:55:01 pm »
Have to laugh that the same NR that went all in for McCain in 2008 and Romney in 2012 during the primaries is NOW being hailed as a bastion of "Conservatism".

Now?

It has been a bastion of conservatism since it was founded by Buckley.