Ayn Rand and/or Atlas Shrugged Quotes to ponder

[Idaho_Cowboy]

The spread of evil is the symptom of a vacuum. Whenever evil wins, it is only by default: by the moral failure of those who evade the fact that there can be no compromise on basic principles. - Ayn Rand

Words to live by.

[mountaineer]

I'm currently reading "Atlas Shrugged" and figured I may as well revive this thread.

I loved this description of the press: The reporters ... had been trained to think that their job consisted of concealing from the world the nature of its events. It was their daily duty to serve as audience for some public figure who made utterances about the public good, in phrases carefully chosen to convey no meaning. It was their daily job to sling words together in any combination they pleased, so long as the words did not fall into a sequence saying something specific.

 

[Ghost Bear]

I'm currently reading "Atlas Shrugged" and figured I may as well revive this thread.

I loved this description of the press: The reporters ... had been trained to think that their job consisted of concealing from the world the nature of its events. It was their daily duty to serve as audience for some public figure who made utterances about the public good, in phrases carefully chosen to convey no meaning. It was their daily job to sling words together in any combination they pleased, so long as the words did not fall into a sequence saying something specific.

 

I've been thinking of re-reading some of it too. Lately it's been feeling to me like we're living at some point in the book (Part II? Start of Part III maybe?) as more and more systems and services that everyone takes for granted break down, and no one can quite explain why it's happening.

[mountaineer]

I'm still reading (over half way through) and, yes, the parallels to the present day are many - and disturbing.

[oldno7]

"From each according to his ability,
To each according to his need"



Twentieth Century Motors becomes these somewhat United States.
Sorry if this quote was already written, I confess not reading every page.

[oldno7]

"Now I know they didn't do it by any kind of mistake. Mistakes of this size are never made innocently.
If men fall for some vicious piece of insanity, when they have no way to make it work and no possible reason to explain their choice---It's because they
have a reason that they do not wish to tell. And we weren't so innocent either, when we voted for the plan at the first meeting.
We didn't do it just because we believed that the drippy old guff they spewed was good. We had another reason but the guff helped us to hide it from our neighbors and from ourselves.
The guff gave us a chance to pass off as virtue something that we'd be ashamed to admit otherwise.
There wasn't a man voting for it who didn't think that under a setup of this kind he'd muscle in on the profits of the men abler than himself.
There wasn't a man rich and smart enough but that he didn't think that somebody was richer and smarter, and this plan would give him a share of his betters wealth and brain. But while he was thinking he would get unearned benefits from the men above, he forgot about the men below who'd get unearned benefits too.
he forgot about all his inferiors who'd rush to drain him just as he hoped to drain his superiors."

[Bigun]

"... There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any
government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one MAKES them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.
......just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced nor objectively interpreted -- and you create a nation of law-breakers -- and then you cash in on guilt. Now that's the system, Mr. Reardon, that's the game, and once you understand it, you'll be much easier to deal with."

- p.411,
Ayn Rand, ATLAS SHRUGGED, Signet Books, NY, 1957

[mrclose]

Today, when a concerted effort is made to obliterate this point, it cannot be repeated too often that the Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals- that it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government- that it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen’s protection against the government.
(Ayn Rand)

[Bigun]

Today, when a concerted effort is made to obliterate this point, it cannot be repeated too often that the Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals- that it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government- that it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen’s protection against the government.
(Ayn Rand)

Which is EXACTLY why liberals (read Commies) hate it so!

[catfish1957]

I'm still reading (over half way through) and, yes, the parallels to the present day are many - and disturbing.

Read it first in high school after my civics teacher found out I was a fan of WFB. To me then it seemed to be a dystopian far fetched  what if, if everything some how went south.  It did scare me though.

Read it again in the early '90's, and the critic in me naively thought we had enough governmental checks and balances to prevent bringing Randian vision to fruiton.

Now, I really don't want to read it at , because we are living the preclude to it unfolding. We are freakin' living the book right now.  I challenge any new reader to not going into prep mode after finishing. Once the entitlement slugs suck the life out of the host, there will be hell to pay.

[mountaineer]

I've finished Atlas Shrugged now (or, for now, as I'll probably have to read it again). As I read, a nagging thought in the back of my mind was, "Can Rand's philosophy be reconciled with my own evangelical Christianity? Or are they at odds?"

A little online search revealed this Facebook group, Ayn Rand and Christianity, and an associated website, Christian Intellectual. I joined the group and look forward to reviewing the videos and other discussions.

[oldno7]

" This Country was built on the supremacy of reason--and for one magnificent century, it redeemed the world.

It will have to do so again."

Francisco d' Anconia

[Lando Lincoln]

" This Country was built on the supremacy of reason--and for one magnificent century, it redeemed the world.

It will have to do so again."

Francisco d' Anconia

Just awesome quote. Is that from Francisco’s money speech?

[oldno7]

 No, this came much later in Galt's Gulch, talking to Dagny in Galt's home.

In my book, page 771(maybe not a good reference due to different editions but it should get close)

[Bigun]

Just awesome quote. Is that from Francisco’s money speech?

Francisco d'Anconia’s Speech on Money from Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand (1957)

[oldno7]

"The trouble with our modern world, Dr. Robert Stadler said over the radio, at the ceremonies launching the construction of the cyclo-tron, is that too many people think too much.
It is the cause of all our current fears and doubts.
An enlightened citizenry should abandon the superstitious worship of logic and the outmoded reliance on reason.
Just as laymen leave medicine to doctors and electronics to engineers, so people who are not qualified to think should leave all thinking to the experts and have faith in the experts' higher authority.
Only experts are able to understand the discoveries of modern science, which have proved that thought is an illusion and that the mind is a myth.
This age of misery is God's punishment to man for the sin of relying on his mind!"

[oldno7]

 "Your fear of death is not a love for life and will not give you the knowledge to keep it."


"Happiness is the successful state of life, pain is an agent of death"


"The purpose of morality is to teach you, not to suffer and die, but to enjoy yourself and live."

[oldno7]

Here's a very complex quote--

"A is A"

[Ghost Bear]

"You have reached the blind alley of the treason you committed when you agreed that you had no right to exist. Once, you believed it was "only a compromise": you conceded it was evil to live for yourself, but moral to live for the sake of your children. Then you conceded that it was selfish to live for your children, but moral to live for your community. Then you conceded that it was selfish to live for your community, but moral to live for your country. Now, you are letting this greatest of countries be devoured by any scum from any corner of the earth, while you concede that it is selfish to live for your country and that your moral duty is to live for the globe. A man who has no right to life, has no right to values and will not keep them."
-- Atlas Shrugged, Part 3, Chapter VII, "This is John Galt Speaking"

[Bigun]

Here's a very complex quote--

"A is A"

It was, not so sure these days.

[Lando Lincoln]

I'm happy this thread has had a return, of sorts.  I just spent some time reading the many quotes and comments.  We are, I fear, in the dystopia Rand imagined. 

[DCPatriot]

"Your fear of death is not a love for life and will not give you the knowledge to keep it."


"Happiness is the successful state of life, pain is an agent of death"


"The purpose of morality is to teach you, not to suffer and die, but to enjoy yourself and live."

Mortality....   

[oldno7]

Mortality....   

pg. 1014 in my book--Yes, morality.

[oldno7]

 Gotta say--as much as I appreciated the Francisco d'Anconia speech, I loathed the tiresome repetition of the John Galt speech.

[mountaineer]

We are, I fear, in the dystopia Rand imagined. 

I can't imagine anyone reading that book today and not feeling that way.

[Ghost Bear]

Gotta say--as much as I appreciated the Francisco d'Anconia speech, I loathed the tiresome repetition of the John Galt speech.

Yes... the previous two times that I read the book, I skipped over most of John Galt's speech. This time, I have promised myself to read through the entire speech. But it isn't easy... I'm on my fourth day of reading just the speech (I don't have a lot of time each day to read, unfortunately, but still, it's taking a long time...)

[oldno7]

 From John Galt, being held against his will(pg. 1102)

 "That's not true, said Mr. Thompson brightly.
If you had a broken leg, you'd pay a doctor to set it."
"Not if he was the one who broke it." replied Galt

[mountaineer]

Anyone on Facebook might be interested in joining https://www.facebook.com/AtlasSociety

They posted this today: Fear of Independence Drives the Blind Stampede to Worship at the Altar of "The Current Thing" -- Whatever it Is! with a link to the article A Self-Help Guide to Living in a Free Society.

 I've also joined this FB group: Ayn Rand and Christianity.

[Lando Lincoln]

@mountaineer Thanks for the links.

[mountaineer]

Interesting thoughts from the fellow at the Ayn Rand and Christianity Facebook page. I hadn't come across the anti-Rand sentiment he describes.

Cody Libolt Media
35m  ·
Jesus Christ AND Ayn Rand?
By Jacob Brunton

The media is abuzz about a “schism” in the Republican Party, a “crisis of values” among Conservatives. But, the media — and unfortunately those responding to it — are all too superficial to see that this is more than a political schism; much more.

The political aspect is just a faint echo — a tremor, which serves as a precursor to the massive coming earthquake.
It is not a political crisis, but a philosophical one.

It is not a crisis of conflicting opinions among groups. It is a crisis of conflicting worldviews within individuals.
It is a crisis in the deepest part of one’s soul; a crisis of cognitive dissonance run rampant in the minds of men, a war between ideals — and the opposing ideals are not what the headlines would lead you to believe:

  “Take a Stand Against Rand” says Christian author, Marvin Olasky in World Magazine.
  “Ayn Rand or Jesus Christ? Conservatives can’t have it both ways” says Mike Lux of the Huffington Post.
  “You Can’t Reconcile Ayn Rand and Jesus” says CNN Contributor and Professor of Religion at Boston University, Stephan Plethero in a USA Today Forum.
  “Christians Must Choose: Ayn Rand or Jesus” reads a headline for the American Values Network.

There is a choice to be made, but it isn’t between Jesus Christ and Ayn Rand. It’s between reason and irrationality; between reality and fantasy; between the objective and the subjective; between truth and fairytales.

And it is a choice that primarily needs to be made by Christians.

The political and religious commentators above are quick to blindly pit Christianity against the philosophy of Ayn Rand and then proceed to wholly denounce one in favor of the other as if the two are some random opposing sports teams behind which the masses are to gather according their personal and subjective preferences.

They drop, or entirely ignore, the context and the nature of what is being discussed. These are not sports teams — they are worldviews; ideas about reality. And the context is not a popularity contest — it is reality.

We are in reality and we are speaking of different views of that reality. Any given aspect of a view of reality will either be accurate or not: true or false. And this, the accuracy of a worldview (or aspects of it) is what matters in the context of reality.

The question to be asked first is not: Are the worldviews of Christianity and Objectivism (Ayn Rand’s philosophy) compatible?
Rather it is: What is true?

Or, more specific to the context of this discussion: Is there any truth in Christianity or in Objectivism? And here is where the Christian must make the crucial choice mentioned above: will he be an advocate of reason, rationality, and objective truth by objectively assessing the truthfulness of his conceptions of Christianity (and willingly rejecting that which is found to be untrue), or will he be an advocate of irrationality, fantasy, and subjective fairytales by insisting that Christianity is true without any objective reason for believing so — that it’s true merely because he wants it to be.

This — devotion to truth, regardless of the implications — is the foundational and indispensible first step that any man who wishes to be worthy of the title of “Man” must take.

Apart from this first step, every thought and crafty sentence, every argument and concept of “proof”, every illusion of truth in one’s head is just that: an illusion — a fleeting and floating cloud of subjective, emotionally charged nothingness.

And, therefore, apart from this step, every critique of other worldviews and every bit of “intellectual” commentary is massively pointless and absurd — akin to a child babbling about his dreams to a board of directors in a business meeting.

Such is the majority of content of the articles above.

However, once one has taken that first step and decided to live for and love the truth no matter where it may lead, then — and only then — is he fit (assuming he is armed with a proper epistemology) to evaluate the truthfulness, not only of various conceptions of Christianity, but of all ideas, period.

Then, he is fit to discover all of the truth — no matter where it came from and no matter where it leads.

Then, he will be capable of rising above the stupid and trite ‘sports game’ demonstrated in the above articles and throughout the media, in order to see what is and is not true in the philosophy of Ayn Rand, and to properly integrate it with all other truth which he has discovered, particularly truth about Christianity.

Then, rather than emulate the intellectual cowardice of the Seminary professor who told Dr. John Piper that “[Ayn Rand’s writing] is incredibly dangerous”, he will be able to emulate Paul’s description of an intellectual hero — a ‘spiritual man who appraises all things’ (1 Cor 2:15) because he will have an objective standard against which to appraise all things.

Then, he will be equipped to say with Paul “we destroy speculations and every lofty opinion raised against the knowledge of God, and we take every thought captive to obey Christ “(2 Cor. 10:5) because he will no longer be running from speculations and lofty opinions or retreating to his own personal fantasy-land which he calls “truth”.

This is what is desperately needed on the part of Christians today (and on the part of every man in general).  This is not the only step which needs to be taken, but it is the first. This is what I have done, and am eager to continually do.

And this first step — together with the path to which it leads — is why I can very comfortably and confidently say that I love Jesus Christ and I love Ayn Rand — and, I love myself.

This is the foundational reason that, in spite of massively popular contrary opinions, I can very seriously — and with full conviction — call myself a Christian egoist.

https://www.facebook.com/cody.libolt/

[mountaineer]

This looks interesting - a new book Critical Essays on Ayn Rand's the Fountainhead, by Emre Gurgen.
 Info at Amazon

[mountaineer]

Posted at The Atlas Society Facebook page:

[Hoodat]

Interesting thoughts from the fellow at the Ayn Rand and Christianity Facebook page. I hadn't come across the anti-Rand sentiment he describes.

.  .  .  “You Can’t Reconcile Ayn Rand and Jesus” says CNN Contributor and Professor of Religion at Boston University, Stephan Plethero in a USA Today Forum.  .  .

So what?  You can't reconcile Stephan Plethero and Jesus either.

btw, if you need to find a Boston University professor willing to prove the existence of G-d, you will have to search the Physics Dept.

Rand was a true atheist which is extremely rare among those purporting to be atheists but are really just denying G-d's existence because they are angry He didn't do things the way they would have done them.  Rand views the world without G-d in it.  But that does not detract from the points she is making about those who live to force control over other people's lives.

[Lando Lincoln]

"When the law no longer protects you from the corrupt, but protects the corrupt from you - you know your nation is doomed."
- Ayn Rand

Worth repeating.

[Bigun]

Worth repeating.

  Thanks for the reminder @Lando Lincoln

[Maj. Bill Martin]

The only true point of conflict I see between Rand and Jesus is in her personal rejection of what she labels as "altruism", which includes individuals voluntarily choosing to do good deeds just to help others.  I think she got a little wonky on that sometimes in terms of discussing charity.

But when people say "Jesus was a socialist", that's nuts.  Jesus never advocated that Pilate, or Herod, or Tiberius raise taxes on people in order to redistribute their wealth by force of law.  There's no "tax the rich" speech anywhere in the New Testament.  And that's how socialists do it.  In fact, if you have government doing that, then a bunch of Jesus' teachings become irrelevant.

Jesus advocated private charity -- voluntary giving -- which is perfectly compatible with capitalism/libertarianism.  What isn't compatible with His teaching is the government taking everyone's money and then redistributing it as those in power see fit.

[Kamaji]

The only true point of conflict I see between Rand and Jesus is in her personal rejection of what she labels as "altruism", which includes individuals voluntarily choosing to do good deeds just to help others.  I think she got a little wonky on that sometimes in terms of discussing charity.

But when people say "Jesus was a socialist", that's nuts.  Jesus never advocated that Pilate, or Herod, or Tiberius raise taxes on people in order to redistribute their wealth by force of law.  There's no "tax the rich" speech anywhere in the New Testament.  And that's how socialists do it.  In fact, if you have government doing that, then a bunch of Jesus' teachings become irrelevant.

Jesus advocated private charity -- voluntary giving -- which is perfectly compatible with capitalism/libertarianism.  What isn't compatible with His teaching is the government taking everyone's money and then redistributing it as those in power see fit.

[Gefn]

Ayn Rand was all the rage when I was in college.

I have to bookmark this thread.

[mountaineer]

I didn't know about Ayn Rand when I was in my 20s, but an event like this would have appealed to me:

Join The Atlas Society for our inaugural student conference in Music City this summer!

The Galt’s Gulch Summit will deepen young people’s understanding of Ayn Rand's ideas, and equip them with the philosophical tools necessary to think critically, act independently, set meaningful personal goals, find win-win relationships, and defend their rational self-interest. The summit will be held at the Nashville Marriott on Vanderbilt Campus – and kicks off the afternoon of Thursday, July 27th, and ends the afternoon of Saturday, July 29th.  ...

If you’re looking for a weekend getaway with other people your age who are interested in ideas – then Galt’s Gulch Summit is for you! Spots are limited to 50 young adult attendees (ages 18 – 27 ) – so don’t wait, you can secure your spot for a nominal fee: young adult discounted tickets are just $50!   ...

https://www.atlassociety.org/galtsgulchsummit2023?fbclid=IwAR3agyVr6W5faHG22MiFo0UrfuSpZgDoe_XMAiBhko0PR7AcC4Gz45WH_8Y

[Cyber Liberty]

[mountaineer]

Ayn Rand’s Thoughts on the Middle East and Israel
Edward Hudgins
October 9, 2023

... We can turn to Ayn Rand for insights about why such an economically successful state as Israel with an open society is so hated by its neighbors.

1. EAST-WEST CONFLICT AND ISRAEL

In 1974, Ayn Rand was asked about American Middle East policy in the aftermath of the Arab-Israeli War of the previous year. That was the fourth war since the modern state of Israel was established in 1948. It was the fourth time that the little country had had to fight for its existence. There have been many attacks in the half-century since then, culminated in the current Hamas attack.

While Rand did not advocate sending American troops into the conflict, she did argue that America should “Give all the help possible to Israel.” She stated specifically that “the help Israel needs is technology and military weapons—and they need them desperately. Why should we help Israel?” She explained that at that time, Israel was “fighting not just the Arabs but Soviet Russia, who is sending the Arabs armaments.” ...

2.     PREMODERN VS. MODERN ARAB-ISRAELI CULTURE CLASH

“The Arabs are one of the least developed cultures,” Rand argued. “They are typically nomads. Their culture is primitive, and they resent Israel because it's the sole beachhead of modern science and civilization on their continent.” ...

https://www.atlassociety.org/post/ayn-rands-thoughts-on-the-middle-east-and-israel

[mountaineer]

Atlas Society has put out a trailer for the book.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUn6JJsJroA

[Lando Lincoln]

Atlas Society has put out a trailer for the book.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUn6JJsJroA

Interesting. I like the animation. It seems like a perfect way to dramatize the entire book, maybe as a series.

Thanks for posting.

[mountaineer]

We are, I fear, in the dystopia Rand imagined.

Jeremy Kauffman 🦔
@jeremykauffman
I would like to apologize for saying Ayn Rand's villains were excessive as a young man.
8:10 AM · Oct 6, 2024

[Lando Lincoln]

Jeremy Kauffman 🦔
@jeremykauffman
I would like to apologize for saying Ayn Rand's villains were excessive as a young man.
8:10 AM · Oct 6, 2024

It is shocking how quickly it is happening.