The Briefing Room
General Category => Science, Technology and Knowledge => Computers => Topic started by: ShadowAce on April 13, 2017, 02:21:28 pm
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From ComputerWorld (http://computerworld.com/article/3189408/linux/windows-as-a-service-now-there-s-an-argument-for-linux.html?nsdr=true) :
Expert Windows writer Ed Bott recently pointed out that the “Windows as a Service” tagline for Windows 10 isn’t just a marketing line. He’s right.
Now, Microsoft is not ready to offer a true Windows-as-a-service offering where you’d be running your desktop from the cloud. Not yet, anyway. But if Microsoft were to buy Citrix, that would be another story.
Yes, you’ve heard that Citrix rumor forever and a day, but it looks as if Microsoft may finally do it. The combination always made sense, but with former Microsoft executive Kirill Tatarinov now in charge of Citrix as president and CEO, Microsoft has its man on the inside.
Additionally, Citrix has just started offering Xen Desktop Essentials. This latest Xen program enables you to manage Windows 10 remote desktops from Azure for $12 per user per month. Earlier, in 2016, Microsoft enabled some of its partners to offer enterprise editions of Windows 10 — Windows 10 Enterprise E3 and E5 — from the cloud.
I should also mention there’s a new version of Windows 10, dubbed “Cloud,” coming. Don’t be misled by the name. This appears to be a re-baked version of the failed Windows RT. It looks like it has the same goal: grabbing back market share from Chromebooks. Good luck with that, Microsoft.
In the meantime, even as true cloud-based Windows 10 desktops start rolling out, Bott pointed out that users already have far less control over “their” Windows 10 desktops. For example, if you’re running Windows 7 SP1, you haven’t had any major changes in six years. Now, that’s stability. Windows 10? The upgrade cycle is now about 18 months. More annoying still, while you can defer the upgrades, you can’t refuse them.
As for patches, you can’t refuse them either. It’s all or nothing. God help you if you have mission-critical applications or hardware that’s broken by a new patch collection. You can’t roll back the one bad patch to fix compatibility problems anymore.
If you’re a sysadmin, you’re already seeing this happening. It’s only going to get worse as Microsoft takes charge of “your” desktops.
What can you do? Well, you can keep your Windows 7 machines staggering on, but Microsoft has changed 7‘s patching to a roll-up model as well if you use Windows Server Update Services (WSUS).
Or you could switch to Macs. <Crickets> OK, so much for that idea. Besides, the notion of moving from Microsoft to Apple if in search of more control of your system is a bad joke.
So, if you really, really want to control your desktop moving forward, there’s only one choice: Linux.
I know, I know. I can hear your screaming from here. But think about it. Do you have another choice?
I’ve been happily using Linux desktops for decades. They work. In fact, they work well.
In particular, I recommend Linux Mint. It’s stable, it works like a fine-tuned watch, and it’s free. If you use the Cinnamon desktop, your users will think they’ve traveled back in time to the Windows XP desktop.
Applications are easy to set up. These days, you just download and install them from an app store.
Linux programs are also simple to use. Personally, I find that LibreOffice works just fine for office work. It’s latest version, 5.3.2, works better than ever with Microsoft Office’s OpenXML formats. And there’s always Google Docs.
What’s that? You can’t live without Microsoft Office? Then don’t. You can run Office 365 on Linux. For that matter, when a user pointed out that OneDrive ran like a dog on Linux, Microsoft fixed it. Yes, you read that right. Microsoft fixed a serious bug with how a Microsoft app ran on Linux.
Much as I like the Linux desktop, there are real problems with deploying it in business. For example, Mint, my personal favorite, doesn’t offer corporate support. You can get business support from other Linux distributors, such as Canonial (Ubuntu), SUSE and Red Hat, for their distributions.
It’s also not as easy to get Linux pre-installed on desktops. There are specialty Linux PC vendors, such as System76 and ZaReason. But of the major PC vendors, Dell is the only one that makes a point of selling ready-to-run Linux PCs. You can get Linux desktops and laptops from other top vendors, including HP and Lenovo, but they don’t make it easy.
All that said, if you really want your IT department to be in charge of your PCs and not Microsoft (or Apple, or Google with Chromebooks), it’s time to start seriously considering the Linux option. There really are no other viable alternatives.
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(http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z347/ShadowAce1800/Tech_Ping_1.png)
@BikkFire @geronl @Smokin Joe @roamer_1 @Blizzardnh @markomalley @VarmintAl @Doug Loss @Rikki Tikki Tavi @guitar4jesus
@kevindavis
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The only thing stopping me now is file compatibility with my customers. I write a lot of reports, if I send them to a customer and they don't convert to windows version of office then I'm screwed.
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Microsoft would be smart to offer their software free on their devices, including Office.
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Microsoft would be smart to offer their software free on their devices, including Office.
Isn't that where they make any profit?
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Isn't that where they make any profit?
OTOH as a PC owner who ran MS programs and systems (DOS, Windows 2.X through 7) on my computers (1984- 2015), the last straw was losing a 2 month old PC to malware and viruses, no matter how safe I browsed, or how much I spent on Virus/Malware protection.
2 years now with a Mac.....No problems.
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From ComputerWorld (http://computerworld.com/article/3189408/linux/windows-as-a-service-now-there-s-an-argument-for-linux.html?nsdr=true) :
So, if you really, really want to control your desktop moving forward, there’s only one choice: Linux.
I’ve been happily using Linux desktops for decades. They work. In fact, they work well.
In particular, I recommend Linux Mint. It’s stable, it works like a fine-tuned watch, and it’s free. If you use the Cinnamon desktop, your users will think they’ve traveled back in time to the Windows XP desktop.
Applications are easy to set up. These days, you just download and install them from an app store.
Linux programs are also simple to use.
Interesting points. Have been very tempted to switch to Linux, but perception has always been it's a pain. I already spend too much time helping my computer illiterate spouse on the PC.
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Isn't that where they make any profit?
You can structure your business any way you want. IMHO, this is how they should structure it.
Get a two-fer on hardware and software to businesses.
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OTOH as a PC owner who ran MS programs and systems (DOS, Windows 2.X through 7) on my computers (1984- 2015), the last straw was losing a 2 month old PC to malware and viruses, no matter how safe I browsed, or how much I spent on Virus/Malware protection.
2 years now with a Mac.....No problems.
Sure Mac makes a great user friendly product. They have issues in business due to compatibility and inability to meet compliance requirements.
There are a myriad of insecurities on Mac products though. Go read their security bulletins. They have vulnerabilities they don't plan to fix.
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Sure Mac makes a great user friendly product. They have issues in business due to compatibility and inability to meet compliance requirements.
There are a myriad of insecurities on Mac products though. Go read their security bulletins. They have vulnerabilities they don't plan to fix.
I haven't been "in the know" as much as I used to, but I have a hard time believing iOS has more security issues than MS operating systems. Just from my own experiences the past 5 years.
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Interesting points. Have been very tempted to switch to Linux, but perception has always been it's a pain. I already spend too much time helping my computer illiterate spouse on the PC.
I've run nothing but Linux for a couple of decades. Running Mint now; my wife has no trouble with it, and she's not a computer person at all. My advice: get/make a Linux live CD or bootable USB stick, then boot off that and try it out. It'll be a bit slower than a hard drive installation, but it'll let you kick the tires without making any changes to the system.
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I've run nothing but Linux for a couple of decades. Running Mint now; my wife has no trouble with it, and she's not a computer person at all. My advice: get/make a Linux live CD or bootable USB stick, then boot off that and try it out. It'll be a bit slower than a hard drive installation, but it'll let you kick the tires without making any changes to the system.
Just don't click "Install" by accident while checking it out
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Just don't click "Install" by accident while checking it out
@Doug Loss
Will it resurrect a dead dust collector sitting here in the corner? (i.e boot off USB?)
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I've run nothing but Linux for a couple of decades. Running Mint now; my wife has no trouble with it, and she's not a computer person at all. My advice: get/make a Linux live CD or bootable USB stick, then boot off that and try it out. It'll be a bit slower than a hard drive installation, but it'll let you kick the tires without making any changes to the system.
Good information. I didn't want to use Linux, but will if MS actually goes there.
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@Doug Loss
Will it resurrect a dead dust collector sitting here in the corner? (i.e boot off USB?)
If the problem is a dead hard drive, possibly. First, the BIOS would have to support booting off a USB device. If you can do that, make sure there are no other obvious problems, then try installing Linux from the USB stick (there should be an icon for the installer on the desktop). Maybe it can get around the problem with the hard drive. If that's not the actual problem, then we'd need more information to make a useful guess.
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If the problem is a dead hard drive, possibly. First, the BIOS would have to support booting off a USB device. If you can do that, make sure there are no other obvious problems, then try installing Linux from the USB stick (there should be an icon for the installer on the desktop). Maybe it can get around the problem with the hard drive. If that's not the actual problem, then we'd need more information to make a useful guess.
Thanks I will give it a try later.
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Good information. I didn't want to use Linux, but will if MS actually goes there.
Maybe not, but a CD-DVD live disc might work and you can use the USB for storage (?)
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Will it resurrect a dead dust collector sitting here in the corner? (i.e boot off USB?)
If it is an XP box, you will likely not be very happy. It will likely run, but the hardware from that era will be too slow.
If it is a later Vista box or newer, especially if it is capable of 64bit - Yes, by all means... Fix the box and shovel Mint into it (full installation). It's the best way to learn it, IMHO. I refit retired machines precisely for that purpose all the time.
So yeah, try a live cd or live thumb in it... If it all works, don't be afraid to install it.
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I think my next Linux box will get Steam OS.
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The only thing stopping me now is file compatibility with my customers. I write a lot of reports, if I send them to a customer and they don't convert to windows version of office then I'm screwed.
Ever thought of sending your reports in PDF or ODF?
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Interesting points. Have been very tempted to switch to Linux, but perception has always been it's a pain. I already spend too much time helping my computer illiterate spouse on the PC.
My spouse just switched her laptop to Linux Mint. I installed VMware Player so she could run TurboTax. Took a little tweaking to get it to run at a decent performance but once done, has not been an issue. Mother-in-law also converted to Mint
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It seems MS is bent on pushing its long time customers into a corner and I will not comply. I started with DOS 2.00 and a PC-1 (the very first model of the IBM PC). I'm an engineer that uses it as a tool demanding heavy graphic and numerical calculations and must be very stable. I'm using Windows 7 and refuse to go to 8, 8.1 or 10.
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Ever thought of sending your reports in PDF or ODF?
Seriously thinking about it
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So much ridiculousness (and uninformed) stupidity about Windows 10 in that article. First off, there are ways around both telemetry and updates, for example, a few entries into the hosts files will stop all communication between your PC and Microsoft if you want it.
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So much ridiculousness (and uninformed) stupidity about Windows 10 in that article. First off, there are ways around both telemetry and updates, for example, a few entries into the hosts files will stop all communication between your PC and Microsoft if you want it.
You're right, of course... Signing into a local account (rather than the online account MS clearly desires @ install), and uninstalling all the bouncy-jangly 'apps', and locking down security and privacy via standard settings, will give you something approximating Win7's traffic on the net.
The only real bitch I have is the opaque and uncontrolled update process. I bought an Alienware box that I am currently reinstalling... Something in the drivers is breaking it... After four installs crapping out, I am getting close to an answer, but the reason I can see it at all is because it is Win7... I would hate to have a similar problem on win10.
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Just don't click "Install" by accident while checking it out
Every bootable Linux I've tried mounts Ntfs file systems as read only.
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You're right, of course... Signing into a local account (rather than the online account MS clearly desires @ install), and uninstalling all the bouncy-jangly 'apps', and locking down security and privacy via standard settings, will give you something approximating Win7's traffic on the net.
The only real bitch I have is the opaque and uncontrolled update process. I bought an Alienware box that I am currently reinstalling... Something in the drivers is breaking it... After four installs crapping out, I am getting close to an answer, but the reason I can see it at all is because it is Win7... I would hate to have a similar problem on win10.
@roamer_1
Win7 has a real stupid problem regarding initial updates after being newly installed. The Win7 Windows Update task crashes when there are too many updates available from Microsoft. You have to manually download and install these service packs after you install Win7 but before you let it go out and do automatic updates. It caused me a bunch of pain...
KB3050265 & KB3135445 (install them in that order)
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catfish wrote:
"2 years now with a Mac.....No problems..."
You're on the right track.
30 years now with Macs... and no problems, either!
(I don't do Windows. Although I did some "windows" today, outside, with Glass Plus!)
Aside:
Regarding malware, I suggest "MalwareBytes Anti-Malware for Mac". Strange name, but it's free, and works well.
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@roamer_1
Win7 has a real stupid problem regarding initial updates after being newly installed. The Win7 Windows Update task crashes when there are too many updates available from Microsoft. You have to manually download and install these service packs after you install Win7 but before you let it go out and do automatic updates. It caused me a bunch of pain...
KB3050265 & KB3135445 (install them in that order)
Thanks @DB , But I already knew... There is something in Intel's Storage matrix driver... and the bluetooth driver... I have gone 7 ways to sunday, but it seems I have to install Win7 gold. install the chipset and the vid, and the bluetooth... THEN let the dang thing update until those drivers hit the 'optional drivers' ... Let their updates install... Then 265 and 445, THEN I can do SP1
I don't know if that is perfectly true, but I am close.
Serves me right, buying an Alienware box... but an i7, standalone Radeon vid, and 32g RAM lured me in... Hard to find all that in a laptop for 150 bucks...
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Ah for crying out loud. Not another infomercial for Linux. You guys are worse than the damn Moonies.
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Thanks @DB , But I already knew... There is something in Intel's Storage matrix driver... and the bluetooth driver... I have gone 7 ways to sunday, but it seems I have to install Win7 gold. install the chipset and the vid, and the bluetooth... THEN let the dang thing update until those drivers hit the 'optional drivers' ... Let their updates install... Then 265 and 445, THEN I can do SP1
I don't know if that is perfectly true, but I am close.
Serves me right, buying an Alienware box... but an i7, standalone Radeon vid, and 32g RAM lured me in... Hard to find all that in a laptop for 150 bucks...
Doesn't Dell have the drivers for it?
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Doesn't Dell have the drivers for it?
@DB
Sort of... The drivers I have (with the exception of vid) are from Dell. Problem is that they are original drivers.
I have tried Intel drivers direct, but the stuff won't run w/o sp1, and sp1 won't let the updates, not because of KBs, but because Intel's storage matrix breaks it. I can't find a newer driver for the bluetooth, although it is available through Win updates...
I take it there's revisions in between that allow it to take sp1... revisions I can't seem to find easily...
So the method I detailed seems to be what I have to do.
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They sell these Chrome book type Win 10 computers now, with very little memory and stuff. The OS and its related crap takes up around half the memory (sometimes a HDD, SSD or some sort of memory card inside the unit). Seeing the customer reviews was enough to keep me away, lol. I don't understand what market segment is looking to buy computers with little memory and little RAM.
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Serves me right, buying an Alienware box... but an i7, standalone Radeon vid, and 32g RAM lured me in... Hard to find all that in a laptop for 150 bucks...
Where was that??
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Where was that??
A private sale... It's used and old. The problem with bleeding-edge machinery... It's bleeding edge. A lot of times the hardware goes through quick revisions, and the drivers can be a nightmare. I shouldn't ought to have done it. I know better. :shrug:
But, I can sell the ram and the hdd for what I have in it... So I am not hurting... other than from banging my head on the KB.
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Ah for crying out loud. Not another infomercial for Linux. You guys are worse than the damn Moonies.
Don't like it, don't read it.
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Seriously thinking about it
We do here as it's more professional. Word documents are a little more "editable".
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We do here as it's more professional. Word documents are a little more "editable".
Depends on the end use of the report if it's more professional.
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Thanks @DB , But I already knew... There is something in Intel's Storage matrix driver... and the bluetooth driver... I have gone 7 ways to sunday, but it seems I have to install Win7 gold. install the chipset and the vid, and the bluetooth... THEN let the dang thing update until those drivers hit the 'optional drivers' ... Let their updates install... Then 265 and 445, THEN I can do SP1
I don't know if that is perfectly true, but I am close.
Serves me right, buying an Alienware box... but an i7, standalone Radeon vid, and 32g RAM lured me in... Hard to find all that in a laptop for 150 bucks...
What gen i7?
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What gen i7?
720QM 2.8Ghz
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The NSA files that were leaked are a huge issue for windows. Numerous zero days which have no fix currently. I wouldn't doubt that the us govt was paying Microsoft to leave some of these holes open.