The Briefing Room

General Category => Economy/Business => Topic started by: Applewood on October 15, 2018, 10:13:04 am

Title: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Applewood on October 15, 2018, 10:13:04 am
Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers

Quote
The company filed for Chapter 11 protection from creditors with the U.S. Bankruptcy Court in White Plains, New York, early Monday and said Eddie Lampert is stepping down immediately as chief executive officer. At the same time, Lampert’s ESL Investments Inc. is negotiating a financing deal while also discussing buying “a large portion of the company’s store base,” Sears said in a statemen

Excerpt.  More at:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-10-15/sears-said-to-be-filing-for-bankruptcy-protection-monday-morning?srnd=premium (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-10-15/sears-said-to-be-filing-for-bankruptcy-protection-monday-morning?srnd=premium)

Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Applewood on October 15, 2018, 10:16:00 am
Even Stevie Wonder could see this coming.  Tragic, but the company brought it on itself.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: DCPatriot on October 15, 2018, 12:48:43 pm
Even Stevie Wonder could see this coming.  Tragic, but the company brought it on itself.

If only somebody could get them to re-ignite Craftsman Home Kits.     :shrug:

(http://hungrybuzz.info/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/prairie-box-house-plans-foursquare-house-architecture-diagram.jpg)


http://www.google.com/search?q=sears+craftsman+house+plans&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi6i7vrvYjeAhUGneAKHY3PDCAQsAR6BAgDEAE&biw=1920&bih=1035 (http://www.google.com/search?q=sears+craftsman+house+plans&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi6i7vrvYjeAhUGneAKHY3PDCAQsAR6BAgDEAE&biw=1920&bih=1035)
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: 240B on October 15, 2018, 12:58:17 pm
The saddest part of this story is that Sears was the first online store in the world. The Sears Order Catalog was the 1800s equivalent to what Amazon is to us today. It is simply amazing that anyone could screw that up. But, somehow they did?
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Frank Cannon on October 15, 2018, 01:07:44 pm
This worthless dinosaur should have been dead years ago. Who cares.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: DCPatriot on October 15, 2018, 01:08:06 pm
The saddest part of this story is that Sears was the first online store in the world. The Sears Order Catalog was the 1800s equivalent to what Amazon is to us today. It is simply amazing that anyone could screw that up. But, somehow they did?

 :pondering:  You're absolutely right! 
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: DCPatriot on October 15, 2018, 01:10:49 pm
This worthless dinosaur should have been dead years ago. Who cares.

That's the type of remark my grandson, born in 2001, might say about McDonald's some day.

Baby Boomers and our parents and grandparents grew up with Sears.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Frank Cannon on October 15, 2018, 01:20:31 pm
That's the type of remark my grandson, born in 2001, might say about McDonald's some day.

Baby Boomers and our parents and grandparents grew up with Sears.

And McDonalds should die a quick death too. Instead of focusing on their core business which is making delicious burgers and fries in a timely fashion, they want to be something to everyone. That means they ruin their fries because health nuts were angry. It means making shitty salads because Commies were angry. It means making Halal dishes because rag heads are angry. Burger King and Wendy's focused on making the products that made them national with great success.

Sears is the same story. They were a company that sold shit to people until a guy who had no retail experience. Eddie Lampert, took over and turned it into a data mining operation. Ever wonder why you were asked 58 questions to buy gum at Sears or K-Mart? It's because a major part of their income was selling that information instead of selling the shit in their stores. They should have died years ago with that bullshit. I don't particularly pine for American Motors vehicles, I don't particularly pine for Author Treacher's fish sandwiches and I don't particularly pine for a Kenmore trash compactor. 
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mountaineer on October 15, 2018, 01:20:43 pm
It was a go-to place for household appliances, lawn equipment, tires and things like that for those of us who don't live in large metropolitan areas. We just had the Sears repair guy out last week to fix our Craftsman lawn tractor.  :crying:
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Frank Cannon on October 15, 2018, 01:28:15 pm
We just had the Sears repair guy out last week to fix our Craftsman lawn tractor.  :crying:

Wow. A Crapsman lawn tractor failing. That's unheard of.  *****rollingeyes*****
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mountaineer on October 15, 2018, 01:38:00 pm
Wow. A Crapsman lawn tractor failing. That's unheard of.  *****rollingeyes*****
It's 10 years old. Not surprising the belt would break. Otherwise, it's been a workhorse.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: DCPatriot on October 15, 2018, 01:40:08 pm
And McDonalds should die a quick death too. Instead of focusing on their core business which is making delicious burgers and fries in a timely fashion, they want to be something to everyone. That means they ruin their fries because health nuts were angry. It means making shitty salads because Commies were angry. It means making Halal dishes because rag heads are angry. Burger King and Wendy's focused on making the products that made them national with great success.

Sears is the same story. They were a company that sold shit to people until a guy who had no retail experience. Eddie Lampert, took over and turned it into a data mining operation. Ever wonder why you were asked 58 questions to buy gum at Sears or K-Mart? It's because a major part of their income was selling that information instead of selling the shit in their stores. They should have died years ago with that bullshit. I don't particularly pine for American Motors vehicles, I don't particularly pine for Author Treacher's fish sandwiches and I don't particularly pine for a Kenmore trash compactor.

 :beer:

One 30 second walk from the parking lot thru the store to the mall boulevard 'hallway' tells you everything that's wrong with Sears.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mountaineer on October 15, 2018, 01:44:50 pm
It's hard to find a shopping mall, many of which formerly were anchored by Sears, that isn't also dying.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Frank Cannon on October 15, 2018, 01:51:47 pm
It's hard to find a shopping mall, many of which formerly were anchored by Sears, that isn't also dying.

That isn't true. There are many malls flourishing despite what Zero Hedge and others pimp. The one common denominator with a failing mall is a dying town. It's not Sears dying or other anchor stores that is killing malls. It's the area dying that is killing malls. 
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mountaineer on October 15, 2018, 01:59:03 pm
IowaHawk has a thread going on Twitter where he shows the products Sears used to sell, from cars to motorscooters to musical instruments. Really interesting. (https://twitter.com/iowahawkblog/status/1051833797396848640)
Quote
RIP Sears, Roebuck & Co... a little thread to salute some of the stuff they sold in their catalogs. First, the Allstate car (basically a rebadged Kaiser Henry J)  ...
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Frank Cannon on October 15, 2018, 02:01:43 pm
IowaHawk has a thread going on Twitter where he shows the products Sears used to sell, from cars to motorscooters to musical instruments. Really interesting. (https://twitter.com/iowahawkblog/status/1051833797396848640)

Problem is those Allstate products were garbage.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Texas Yellow Rose on October 15, 2018, 02:11:59 pm
Somebody woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning.   wink777
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: dfwgator on October 15, 2018, 02:30:46 pm
Oldest rule in business:

"Adapt, or die!"
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mountaineer on October 15, 2018, 02:56:44 pm
Oldest rule in business:

"Adapt, or die!"
There's a factory in my town that started out over 120 years ago making pickle jars. Now it's one of the world's leading manufacturers of safety cans, safety cabinets and poly drums. They adapted from glass to metal and plastic - and currently are looking to hire more workers.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: RoosGirl on October 15, 2018, 03:10:28 pm
That isn't true. There are many malls flourishing despite what Zero Hedge and others pimp. The one common denominator with a failing mall is a dying town. It's not Sears dying or other anchor stores that is killing malls. It's the area dying that is killing malls.

In my area the malls failing are the ones that have not bothered to remodel in the last 30 years or allow groups of unsavory characters to hang out.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mountaineer on October 15, 2018, 03:14:54 pm
In my area the malls failing are the ones that have not bothered to remodel in the last 30 years or allow groups of unsavory characters to hang out.
That's a big part of it. Older shoppers won't go someplace they don't feel safe.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: DCPatriot on October 15, 2018, 03:47:27 pm
Problem is that we're at a stage in our electronic culture where specialty boutiques and 4 different athletic shoe stores can't pay the rents.

That's why the 'New Mall' is the "Major Brand Outlets".

...which are mostly bullshit made-up sales on merchandise specially purchased to offer 'off price'.

Went into a Zegna store last month...saw a lightweight v-neck sweater in light mauve.   Their discounted price was $795.

Screw that.   Can't afford to do that anymore.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: INVAR on October 15, 2018, 03:57:02 pm
They were a company that sold shit to people until a guy who had no retail experience. Eddie Lampert, took over and turned it into a data mining operation.

True, but more than that- he became head of Sears in a hostile takeover, and essentially made himself richer by running the company into the ground as his other 'investment firms' constantly loaned Sears money  - and of course the selling off of assets as lambert chopped up the company and left what remained to literally rot made him even more money.  He did the same to Kmart which his new company 'Sears Holdings' bought and proceeded to run into the ground as well. 

Lambert from my reading, is a Class A Jerk and is essentially what Richard Gere was in Pretty Woman; an investor that took over vulnerable companies and cut up their assets and sold them off to make even more money.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: INVAR on October 15, 2018, 04:21:05 pm
We just had the Sears repair guy out last week to fix our Craftsman lawn tractor.

Three years ago the John Deere tractor mower we owned for 12 years to mow 2.3 acres, failed.  Limited on what I would spend for another mower, I ended up getting a Crafstman at the Sears store near me (before it was closed a year and a half ago) for cash. 

It was a monster lemon of a machine that literally broke down in the middle of my first mowing.  The transmission drive cable came loose and rendered the hand controls useless.  Turns out the mower was a repainted cheap-end Husqvarna.  'Craftsman' simply private label repackaged it in their name.  Had a 'Sears repair service' come from 3 hours away to service it - and he became a regular feature for the ensuing two mowing seasons.  The mower was more powerful than the metal in the chassis could properly handle and the vibration literally 'shook' loose every nut, bolt, belt and fastener as it mowed.  Notwithstanding it did not mow or cut the grass as nicely as the Deere did that we once had.

The resonant frequency of the engine vibration literally cracked the pylons and the rings holding the mower deck to the bottom of the chassis and the deck fell off by the beginning of season 3.  Well, the Sears Service guy no longer worked for Sears and the closest repair service guy to me was a 5 hour drive away and required me to bring the mower to him.  I have no trailer, so that option was a non-starter.

So... I did what I should've done three years ago - I ponied up the dough and bought a John Deere.   It's like going from a Dodge Gremlin to a Lexus.  This season's mowing has been a joy and the grounds never looked better.

What was interesting to learn in this ordeal was that Craftsman was simply stamping their name on other name brand products that were cheaper or Chinese junk in the era of Lampert.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Applewood on October 15, 2018, 04:43:37 pm
@INVAR

My late father  bought all of his lawnmowers from Sears, except for the last one.  His last mower from Sears was called "Eager One."  The nower had a pull cord to start it, but Dad could pull on it for 20 minutes and the mower wouldn't start.  He joked that the mower was an eager one all right -- eager to stay in the shed and not do any mowing. 

I don't know the brand of Dad's last mower, but he bought it at Home Depot.  I do know that mower ran well for years and after Dad passed, my brother used it for sometime thereafter.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: debrawiest on October 15, 2018, 05:04:43 pm

So... I did what I should've done three years ago - I ponied up the dough and bought a John Deere.   It's like going from a Dodge Gremlin to a Lexus.  This season's mowing has been a joy and the grounds never looked better.


I love my JD mower! It’s my third one. Last year I traded up to the more commercial version with a roll bar and padded seat, necessary because I mow 10+ acres of not-so-nice turf. Does a great job with the grass and anything else I happen to mow over. 😊 I’ll never purchase another one.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Frank Cannon on October 15, 2018, 05:13:24 pm
Everyone bent out of shape that Sears died will be really depressed when Walmart meets the same fate in a couple years. They are all over the place with strategy, opened up too many stores to attempt to boost growth estimates and are run by morons. They are set up for the same failure the way they are going.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mirraflake on October 15, 2018, 05:27:26 pm
I was in Sears yesterday.  Instead of 5 foot walkways  as in the past now they are 10 feet wide and clothes and merchandise racks are spaced further part to make it appear the store is full.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Applewood on October 15, 2018, 05:27:37 pm
What I notice is that many of these retailers are started by people, often with little or no formal education, maybe immigrants who came to the US with little money and couldn't speak English.  But they were smart enough to sell quality products and treat their customers well, and that's how they became successful.  But then the younger, supposedly better educated generation comes along with MBAs from Wharton or wherever, but they cut corners, sell inferior merchandise, hire employees based on skin color or whatever instead of competence, outsource to foreign countries and so on -- all in an effort to make millions and billions.  But then they forget about the customers, the one who keep them in business. 

Sell inferior merchandise, treat your customers poorly and they are going elsewhere.  Contrary to what many anti-capitalists in the media will say -- Amazon and other successful, customer-oriented companies are not the ones to blame for Sears' demise.  Sears is failing because of Sears.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: thackney on October 15, 2018, 05:30:32 pm
Everyone bent out of shape that Sears died will be really depressed when Walmart meets the same fate in a couple years. They are all over the place with strategy, opened up too many stores to attempt to boost growth estimates and are run by morons. They are set up for the same failure the way they are going.

How Worried Should Amazon Be by Target and Walmart's Surging Online Growth?
https://www.thestreet.com/technology/amazon-target-walmart-online-sales-14691038 (https://www.thestreet.com/technology/amazon-target-walmart-online-sales-14691038)
Aug 22, 2018


...Meanwhile, last week, Walmart also beat revenue expectations and reported an increase of 4.5% in same-store sales, an outcome that also soundly beat analyst projections of 2.3%. Moreover, it reported that its U.S. e-commerce sales grew by 41% in the quarter, although it didn't release specific sales figures....

- - - - - - -

Walmart Gets Newfound Love From Wall Street - Here's Why
https://www.thestreet.com/investing/walmart-gets-love-from-wall-street-here-s-why-14738894 (https://www.thestreet.com/investing/walmart-gets-love-from-wall-street-here-s-why-14738894)

...Walmart is expecting a 30% online grocery sales increase in fiscal 2019...
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mirraflake on October 15, 2018, 05:34:31 pm
Wow. A Crapsman lawn tractor failing. That's unheard of.  *****rollingeyes*****

I own a office building and apartment complex next to each other and got tired of paying $130  every 5-6 days for someone cut the  grass. I bought a Craftsman tractor  in 2005 and it sits outside all year in the back of the office-rain and snow. I have changed the oil maybe once very 2 years It has 400+ hours on it.
Never a single problem except the  mower deck rusted out which a friend welded up for me.

Last year the trtans finally went out and I bought  a new one.

@Frank Cannon
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Frank Cannon on October 15, 2018, 05:40:42 pm
I own a office building and apartment complex next to each other and got tired of paying $130  every 5-6 days for someone cut the  grass. I bought a Craftsman tractor  in 2005 and it sits outside all year in the back of the office-rain and snow. I have changed the oil maybe once very 2 years It has 400+ hours on it.
Never a single problem except the  mower deck rusted out which a friend welded up for me.

Last year the trtans finally went out and I bought  a new one.

@Frank Cannon

You're one of the few. Maybe you got one when they were putting Kohler motors in them. Mostly they are a throw aways.

Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Frank Cannon on October 15, 2018, 05:42:14 pm
How Worried Should Amazon Be by Target and Walmart's Surging Online Growth?
https://www.thestreet.com/technology/amazon-target-walmart-online-sales-14691038 (https://www.thestreet.com/technology/amazon-target-walmart-online-sales-14691038)
Aug 22, 2018


...Meanwhile, last week, Walmart also beat revenue expectations and reported an increase of 4.5% in same-store sales, an outcome that also soundly beat analyst projections of 2.3%. Moreover, it reported that its U.S. e-commerce sales grew by 41% in the quarter, although it didn't release specific sales figures....

- - - - - - -

Walmart Gets Newfound Love From Wall Street - Here's Why
https://www.thestreet.com/investing/walmart-gets-love-from-wall-street-here-s-why-14738894 (https://www.thestreet.com/investing/walmart-gets-love-from-wall-street-here-s-why-14738894)

...Walmart is expecting a 30% online grocery sales increase in fiscal 2019...

Wall Street used to be excited about Sears too not that long ago. They turned a profit in 2010. Doesn't take long for the house of cards to collapse.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: truth_seeker on October 15, 2018, 05:53:02 pm
Sears is an example of a successful 20th centuryfirm in the 21st century.


In my mid-sized town old shopping centers are being replaced by modern housing and/or by modern updated shopping centers.

Old "anchor" stores like Sears, are not in the replacement centers.


There are 3 Home Dept stores within 5 miles but there are also 2 Sears stores that will close.




Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mountaineer on October 15, 2018, 06:52:09 pm
Our Craftsman tractor has held up pretty well and I have no complaints about it, but when it finally goes kaput, we'll likely get a Deere.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: catfish1957 on October 15, 2018, 06:58:34 pm
That's the type of remark my grandson, born in 2001, might say about McDonald's some day.

Baby Boomers and our parents and grandparents grew up with Sears.

Back in my youth... (way back) Sears was synonymous with quality and lasting products.

I know times change, but it is sad.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: catfish1957 on October 15, 2018, 07:03:16 pm
Wall Street used to be excited about Sears too not that long ago. They turned a profit in 2010. Doesn't take long for the house of cards to collapse.

Some of our younger Briefers will even see Amazon go belly up in the next 70 years.   

Business cycle of life.   Inevitable.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Frank Cannon on October 15, 2018, 07:21:36 pm
Our Craftsman tractor has held up pretty well and I have no complaints about it, but when it finally goes kaput, we'll likely get a Deere.

If you are going to do that don't buy the Home Despot scrap. Go to the dealer. There is a huge difference in quality. The head of Deere said his biggest regret was getting into bed with Home Despot and making a tractor to meet their price point. It totally ruined their reputation for quality. You could also get an old 318. Those things are effing tanks and Deere still supports them.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mountaineer on October 15, 2018, 07:25:06 pm
Good to know, Frank. Thanks.
BTW, is that also true of Lowe's?
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: RoosGirl on October 15, 2018, 08:38:47 pm
If you are going to do that don't buy the Home Despot scrap. Go to the dealer. There is a huge difference in quality. The head of Deere said his biggest regret was getting into bed with Home Despot and making a tractor to meet their price point. It totally ruined their reputation for quality. You could also get an old 318. Those things are effing tanks and Deere still supports them.

All of the manufacturers, previously known for high quality products, did that for Home Depot and Lowes.  Well, maybe not *all*, but as you say Deere and I know that is the case for Kohler and Moen.  I have to believe it's pretty much true across the board.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: truth_seeker on October 15, 2018, 09:16:38 pm
Our local plumber sent us to a wholesale supplier to "the trade," advising we not purchase from Home Depot/Lowes

Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: GtHawk on October 15, 2018, 09:40:44 pm
And McDonalds should die a quick death too. Instead of focusing on their core business which is making delicious burgers and fries in a timely fashion, they want to be something to everyone. That means they ruin their fries because health nuts were angry. It means making shitty salads because Commies were angry. It means making Halal dishes because rag heads are angry. Burger King and Wendy's focused on making the products that made them national with great success.

Sears is the same story. They were a company that sold shit to people until a guy who had no retail experience. Eddie Lampert, took over and turned it into a data mining operation. Ever wonder why you were asked 58 questions to buy gum at Sears or K-Mart? It's because a major part of their income was selling that information instead of selling the shit in their stores. They should have died years ago with that bullshit. I don't particularly pine for American Motors vehicles, I don't particularly pine for Author Treacher's fish sandwiches and I don't particularly pine for a Kenmore trash compactor.
That means they ruin their fries because health nuts were angry

Actually they changed the shortening because they folded like a cheap suit(sorry Trump you got it wrong) when cow worshipers threatened to sue, who gives a damn I men they don't eat beef so what, back then they weren't gonna buy Filets Fries and shakes? Big loss! As far as them screwing up by running away from the core principles that Ray built it upon your absolutely right, I was there for the start of the fall. The way they pre cook and assemble to order has completely ruined the flavor and as far as standards? the very few times I go(with my grandson) I feel like I have entered the Twilight Zone! I would have fired anyone that ran one of my stores the way they are run today, hell, I would have been fired!

As far as your examples of those that stuck to their cores? SoSo, They were right there with the rest of us when the burger wars started with the buck menus and burger a month and specialty meals when the minimum wage started going up and competition went into overdrive.

If you really want an example of a brand that stayed true, I would say that at least for the west coast, that would be In-N-Out. They stuck to their  standards and didn't play menu item of the month, just hamburgers, cheeseburgers, doubles, shakes and sodas.........period! I'm sure there are others but that's the only I know for a fact stayed completely true to their core.

As for Sears, I think they were dead long before Lampert, they stopped carrying what people wanted and kept their prices too high, why buy Craftsman tools when I could buy the same exact tool at Home Depot with the same warranty, the only difference being it said Husky on it? And what has Lampert done but sell off all the brands that were worth any money at Sears. He has run it into the ground, actually into it's grave and now looks to pick up any of the real estate property that has value for a pittance. For myself, I stopped shopping at Sears close to twenty years ago when they started to stock clothes and goods that were of more appeal to those from south of the border.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Gefn on October 15, 2018, 10:10:55 pm
I’ll miss you Sears.

I’ll miss Kenmore.

I miss the Sears catalog
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: RoosGirl on October 15, 2018, 10:22:51 pm
Our local plumber sent us to a wholesale supplier to "the trade," advising we not purchase from Home Depot/Lowes

Yep, because the supplier stuff is much better made and if it does break can be fixed.  The HD/Lowes crap cannot be.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Free Vulcan on October 15, 2018, 10:27:56 pm
I’ll miss you Sears.

I’ll miss Kenmore.

I miss the Sears catalog

I know. It's sad. Had Sears had it's head out of it's butt and been looking ahead, it could have adapted to fill a pretty nice niche, but it decided to do the same-old same-old and waste away.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: roamer_1 on October 15, 2018, 10:28:46 pm
What was interesting to learn in this ordeal was that Craftsman was simply stamping their name on other name brand products that were cheaper or Chinese junk in the era of Lampert.

Actually an improvement from days past, when they were big enough to bend industry to it's will.
They have always rebranded, that is nothing new. What they used to do was to change the specs of generic parts in order to capture their parts market, to the point that even motor specs were different.

Standard Briggs or Tecumseh on that machine? Not on your life. Everything down to the valve guides and crankshaft bearings were altered, just a little bit, so that standard stock would not fit, and you were enslaved into the Sears parts system, which was a nightmare.

I quite literally would not buy used Craftsman small engine equipment, because their only use was as scrap for other Craftsmans - Recycling the parts otherwise was impossible. And there was no sense in trying to restore old Craftsman machines, as the parts system was so very bad, and incredibly (3x price) expensive.

What little I have had to do with their machinery lately, that is not the case anymore. Their rebranded Husqvarna equipment is the very same as Husqvarna makes for everything. Maybe they just don't have the buying power anymore.

That all said, I have a great respect for Craftsman hand tools and such - my road box is full of them. But I will not buy anything from them more complicated than that, even yet, for fear of that part system entrapment and planned obsolescence.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Applewood on October 15, 2018, 10:45:23 pm
I’ll miss you Sears.

I’ll miss Kenmore.

I miss the Sears catalog

I miss the catalog.  Felt like I would get a hernia just picking it up.  But I can't tell you how much Mom and I ordered from the big book and the sales booklets that would come out from time to time.  Never ordered from the Wish Book - always thought the holiday stuff was overpriced. Doing away with the catalog might not have been so bad had Sears developed a good online presence.  But its website is bleah! 

As for Kenmore --at one time, those appliances were excellent.  Mom had a Kenmore washer/dryer which lasted 26 years.  My first laundry pair, also Kenmore, lasted 18 years.  My last Kenmore major appliance was my current refrigerator.  A huge disappointment.  Among other things, the crisper drawers won't open and close properly.  Junk.  May sound strange, but I'm actually looking forward to the day when this fridge croaks.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Applewood on October 15, 2018, 10:55:49 pm
FWIW -- this article has a list of the 142 stores that will be closing:

https://time.com/money/5424687/sears-stores-closing-2018-bankruptcy-liquidation-sales/

I'm amazed that the usually empty Kmart near me is still staying open.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Sighlass on October 15, 2018, 11:43:12 pm
Sears used to make good lifetime warranty tools. Then they started making crap tools that I could get from any Harbor Freight Tools store. Their lawnmowers and washing machines got to where they were not worth it and I stopped going.

Now I run a Cub Cadet lawnmower, they are pretty good deck wise (no rusting out). Like every other mower, it is the electronic crap they add that eventually fails on you.

I see our local Sears is not going out of business, thanks Apple for the link to the list.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: GtHawk on October 16, 2018, 12:01:26 am
I’ll miss you Sears.

I’ll miss Kenmore.

I miss the Sears catalog
You can't miss Kenmore, Sears didn't manufacture anything, just look for the product of mainstream manufacturers that most closely resembles the Kenmore product you liked. I.E. Refrigerators -Whirpool, vacuum cleaners - Hoover, panasonic , etc.

I missed the Sears Catalog too, only I missed it before I got into my teens, when Sears dropped so many of the items they used to carry, like guns, scooters(gas), motorcycles....

I have fond memories of the Old Sears, and Montgomery Wards, hell even J.C.Penney used to be a real honest to God Department Store! There are so many retailers gone that I used to enjoy going to and just, I guess the best comparison would be 'window shop', in my youth and see merchandise that can only be found in specialty shops now. And Dammit! I'm not that old!
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Frank Cannon on October 16, 2018, 12:02:26 am
Our local plumber sent us to a wholesale supplier to "the trade," advising we not purchase from Home Depot/Lowes

I buy shit for my rentals at the box stores. I buy shit for my house at the supply houses. Even the valves and elbows are a better quality.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: catfish1957 on October 16, 2018, 12:05:33 am

I miss the Sears catalog

For us old folks at age 5-10......

Maybe the most read item between October and December. (The Sears Christmas Wish Book Catalog)
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: roamer_1 on October 16, 2018, 12:08:38 am
For us old folks at age 5-10......

Maybe the most read item between October and December. (The Sears Christmas Wish Book Catalog)

Yeah... not up in here... The outhouse was too cold for sticking around very long...
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: GtHawk on October 16, 2018, 12:14:30 am
FWIW -- this article has a list of the 142 stores that will be closing:

https://time.com/money/5424687/sears-stores-closing-2018-bankruptcy-liquidation-sales/

I'm amazed that the usually empty Kmart near me is still staying open.
One of those closing is in the South Coast Plaza Mall, in Costa Mesa, CA. That is an upscale mall and it's not surprising there wasn't enough demand for it's crap, plus the mall will I'm sure, be happy to lose the low class element that drifted out of the Sears into the the more upscale retailers. I did notice that there is a Kmart that is being left open not to far away in Cost Mesa so the Hispanics will be happy.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Fishrrman on October 16, 2018, 12:38:46 am
Freya wrote:
"I’ll miss Kenmore."

We have a Kenmore gas stove here that was bought back in the early 1980's and it still works*

We also have a Kenmore electric drier that's now about 24 years old. I've replaced the belt on it once, and a couple of years ago the original motor gave out, so I bought a replacement for $150 and installed it myself.

And... a Kenmore washer that is 11 years old, still doing ok. I believe both the washer and drier were made for Sears by Whirlpool.

* Several weeks ago the spark igniter for the gas burners stopped working. I ordered a replacement part online, but before it arrived, the igniters started working again by themselves. Might have been a period of high humidity we had here (CT). I'll keep the igniter module around just in case.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Absalom on October 16, 2018, 04:35:53 am
Sears Roebuck was founded in 1892 and endured for126
years, an astonishing record of achievement and survival.
According to Barron's, by 1935, corporate longevity dropped
below 90 years.Then by 2000 it had fallen to 18 years.
Everything, EVERYTHING, in our material world withers and
dies, despite our best laid efforts and plans.
Yet many are shocked, chagrined, angry.........Why???
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mountaineer on October 16, 2018, 02:25:01 pm
Maybe all those laid off Sears and KMart employees can take heart:
Quote
CNBC (https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/16/job-openings-hit-record-7point136-million-in-august.html?__source=sharebar|twitter&par=sharebar)

Job openings hit a fresh record in August, indicating companies could face more inflationary pressures ahead with a tight labor market.

The vacancies level hit 7.14 million for the month, according to the Job Openings and Labor Turnover Survey, a report Federal Reserve officials watch closely for clues about where employment stands.

The total number of hires also reached a new record of 5.78 million.

Openings dwarfed the total level of workers looking for jobs  ...
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Applewood on October 16, 2018, 04:52:42 pm
Sears Roebuck was founded in 1892 and endured for126
years, an astonishing record of achievement and survival.
According to Barron's, by 1935, corporate longevity dropped
below 90 years.Then by 2000 it had fallen to 18 years.
Everything, EVERYTHING, in our material world withers and
dies, despite our best laid efforts and plans.
Yet many are shocked, chagrined, angry.........Why???

Don't know about anyone else, but I'm not shocked, angry or chagrined.  Unless you live under a rock, you have known for years that bankruptcy was where Sears was headed.  It was no surprise.    Perhaps some people are surprised Sears lasted this long.    But the inevitable destruction of Sears was a long time coming. 

If nothing else, Sears is a good example of what happens to a once excellent retailer when management forgets about the customer and focuses instead exclusively on the almighty dollar.  A successful retailer keeps its customers happy and makes money.  Can't make money if you give the customer shoddy merchandise and poor service. 

Other struggling retailers like Penneys and Macy's would do well to learn from the whole Sears mess, but I doubt they will. 

Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: truth_seeker on October 16, 2018, 05:37:03 pm
On Sears' balance sheet is a ton of valuable real estate; valuable until they mismanaged their retail business, on down, and on down until this point.


I learned from a top manager:

"What are we doing,, why are we doing it,, when are we going to stop?"

Although he was in the corporate level of engineering & construction, his saying is broadly applicaable.


Sears had literally decades to change, but failed miserably.




Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: mountaineer on October 16, 2018, 05:42:08 pm
Don't know about anyone else, but I'm not shocked, angry or chagrined.  Unless you live under a rock, you have known for years that bankruptcy was where Sears was headed.  It was no surprise.   
Exactly. The only surprise is that they didn't declare bankruptcy earlier.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: DCPatriot on October 16, 2018, 05:56:10 pm
Exactly. The only surprise is that they didn't declare bankruptcy earlier.

This is still a Chapter 11 reorganization.   It is not a liquidation...yet.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Applewood on October 16, 2018, 06:30:35 pm
This is still a Chapter 11 reorganization.   It is not a liquidation...yet.

But I think liquidation is going to happen sooner or later.  They are already talking about selling off remaining stores.  They aren't really trying to stay in business. 
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: truth_seeker on October 16, 2018, 06:50:09 pm
This is still a Chapter 11 reorganization.   It is not a liquidation...yet.
Besides real estate and debt, what do they have?
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Absalom on October 16, 2018, 08:02:31 pm
Don't know about anyone else, but I'm not shocked, angry or chagrined.  Unless you live under a rock, you have known for years that bankruptcy was where Sears was headed.  It was no surprise.    Perhaps some people are surprised Sears lasted this long.    But the inevitable destruction of Sears was a long time coming. 

If nothing else, Sears is a good example of what happens to a once excellent retailer when management forgets about the customer and focuses instead exclusively on the almighty dollar.  A successful retailer keeps its customers happy and makes money.  Can't make money if you give the customer shoddy merchandise and poor service. 

Other struggling retailers like Penneys and Macy's would do well to learn from the whole Sears mess, but I doubt they will.
--------------------------------
Respectfully, my query Why? wasn't directed at any post and
your rules for business success are right on the mark. What of it?
In our world, regardless of attitude, behavior, impulse or sentiment,
be it for better or worse; nothing endures forever! Reality.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: roamer_1 on October 16, 2018, 08:46:31 pm
Sears Roebuck was founded in 1892 and endured for126
years, an astonishing record of achievement and survival.
According to Barron's, by 1935, corporate longevity dropped
below 90 years.Then by 2000 it had fallen to 18 years.
Everything, EVERYTHING, in our material world withers and
dies, despite our best laid efforts and plans.

Yet many are shocked, chagrined, angry.........Why???

While that is right, still there is a correlation in there someplace, related to the hostility that corporations must survive.

Corporations, business in general, is supposed to be somewhat ruthless, and I get that. But *none* are managed perfectly... So I think the mismanagement accusation is way overplayed. Likewise your statement that everything withers - That assumes a thing does not, or is incapable of change. Any corporation is capable of becoming 'new' again.

Yes, there are problems with old encrusted corporations being too top-heavy, and unable to be nimble in the face of change...

But more than any other thing, hostility toward capitalism by government, ridiculous regulation and labor demands, and an out-of-control civil suit environment have made any misstep in business a potential and literal disaster. And once that disaster happens, there is nothing but a thin line to walk to recover, which is nearly impossible.

That is why corporations don't last as long as they used to.
Title: Re: Sears Goes Bankrupt, Mired in Debt and Deserted by Shoppers
Post by: Skeptic on December 04, 2018, 03:45:04 am
I went to Sears to purchase a winter coat but couldn't find what I wanted although they had a large selection. I might go there for shoes or slacks. Average department store, hit and miss. A lot like Khol's.