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Conservative Review Contributor, Steve Deace
Dear Christian Leaders, You’re Playing a Very Dangerous Game - See more at: https://www.conservativereview.com/commentary/2016/05/dear-christian-leaders-youre-playing-a-very-dangerous-game#sthash.Zt2Dp2Zg.dpuf
DISCLAIMER: I am grateful for the opportunity I have here at Conservative Review to reach those on the broad spectrum of conservatism on several issues, some of which conservatives don’t always agree on. But in this case I’m writing to you, Christian leaders, as s very specific target audience. Since it’s arguable no one faces more of a dilemma with this election than you do, for you represent the sacredness of the Gospel even more than conservatism.
Dear Christian Leaders,
I hope this letter finds you well, and I thank you for the time, talent, and treasure you have given to the cause of Christ and its resulting American exceptionalism. Thank you for putting these words from the Scriptures into practice: “Now the Lord is that spirit, and where the spirit of the Lord is there is liberty.”
I’m writing this as a 42-year old believer who has been blessed by the works of so many of you. Some of you I am proud to call friends, or know as acquaintances. Some of you I hope to meet someday to share how God used you to take this son of a 15-year old girl raised in a home of abuse, and give him the strength and courage to break generational cycles of dysfunction. If not for your testimonies and willingness to stand for Christ against the prevailing winds of the culture, odds are I would’ve succumbed to them.
I say these things because I want you to know this letter is coming from a place of concern more so than criticism. I struggle with a critical spirit, which is why I’ve waited several weeks before penning this letter that I have started and stopped several times. I needed to make sure I was in a place I could remove as much of myself as possible, and address these concerns in the spirit rather than with my own, haughty one.
With that long disclaimer out of the way, allow me to cut right to the chase.
If you are supporting Donald Trump, or flirting with doing so, you are playing a very dangerous game. There is simply no moral, biblical, or even strategic case for doing so, near as I can tell. And if I’m wrong, then let us come now and reason together.
First of all, holiness and character is of more value in the kingdom than ideological correctness. That is not to say ideological correctness isn’t important, because it is, and it’s where I make my living for the most part. But God has often worked through strange ideological bedfellows to accomplish His will. For example, three of the greatest minds in church history were Augustine, Calvin, and Wesley. Yet they vehemently disagreed with one another, even on vitally important doctrines. However, the fruit of their callings remains impactful to this very day.
Some of you will say, “But wasn’t David a man of poor character and morality and God used him in a mighty way?” Yes, that is true, but others paid dearly for David’s sins. His own nation was plunged into civil war. His daughter was raped by her brother. He had a man killed so he could have his wife.
The point of David’s life is not that he’s the hero, but God is. That God so wants to be known He is willing to even use the worst of us to reach us.
So what made David a man after God’s own heart? That despite all his documented shortcomings, David in the end sought God’s forgiveness and repentance when confronted with “Thou art the man.” Trump, by his own admission, does not have a repentant heart. He has not sought God’s forgiveness, because he doesn’t think he needs it. Thus, the King David-Trump comparisons are flawed exegesis and should cease here.
Furthermore, the Scriptures make clear the qualifications for public office:
Moreover, look for able men from all the people, men who fear God, who are trustworthy and hate a bribe, and place such men over the people as chiefs of thousands, of hundreds, of fifties, and of tens.
There is simply no way to avoid the conclusion that Trump violates every syllable of these requirements.
Now that we’ve addressed the biblical case, what about the moral one?
Trump is a scam artist.
Trump is a gossip.
Trump is a slanderer.
Trump is a misogynist.
Trump is an adulterer.
Trump is a deceiver.
Trump is a liar.
Other than that, Trump seems like a righteous dude.
Of course, Paul writes all of us were these things, because all of us were sinners, too. However, we live differently now – or at least should – because we are new creations in Christ. Unfortunately, this campaign has revealed this is who Trump remains to this day.
Finally, let’s look at the strategic argument. Generally, there are three archetypes of politicians in the Scriptures:
Josiah – The true statesman. The man who does the hard thing, no matter how hard it may be, because it is the right thing. A man sold out to the cause of righteousness. Sadly, there are very few of these.
Hezekiah – The typical politician. The man who does the principled thing when it's easy or it suits him. As in when the Scriptures say one of the holiest celebrations of the Passover since Moses came at the time of his ascendancy. However, when it gets hard, or his ego gets in the way, he will serve himself/mammon instead. So that same Hezekiah is relieved that at the end of his reign the judgment to come, which he contributed to with his own arrogance, won't take place until he's dead and buried. Rather than humbly repent and seek God's mercy as a David might have done. Like most politicians, Hezekiah was principled at first, but less so the longer he was in power. Eventually principle gave way to political expediency.
Ahab – A pure megalomaniac whose only motivation is his own ego, elevation, and experiences. A hedonist/narcissist/tyrant whose only ethos is the golden rule: he who has the gold gets to make all the rules. Thankfully, there are very few of these as well, mainly because they’re like the Lords of the Sith in Star Wars. If there are too many of them, they tend go after one other.
Trump is an Ahab. He is not like anything we have ever dealt with before. He is not a RINO, Republicrat, or any other kind of Hezekiah type. He won't even pander to you on the bathroom issue when it would help him. Why? Because you're all nothing but marks to him. He is utterly and undeniably shameless.
Trump is merely a conqueror convinced that if he's calling all the shots the world would be a better place. He is a law unto himself.
He is the sort of figure we read about in history books. Not a raving madman Hitler type, and those making such comparisons are intellectually lazy and should be dismissed. Nor is Trump even the kind of megalomaniac Obama is, with his Soviet-era style ruthless pursuit of Marxism.
Rather, Trump is merely a conqueror convinced that if he's calling all the shots the world would be a better place. He is a law unto himself.
In our day and age, Alpha Males are few and far between. So much so that many believe Trump is an Alpha, but he is not. Like most tyrants he is deeply insecure. How many 70-year old men are still defensive about their penis size? And it is those very insecurities that cause him to lash out so maliciously. Think of the damaged Commodus in the movie “Gladiator.”
It is the alpha male that is required to confront and take down the tyrant. Men willing to storm the beaches of Normandy, proclaim we have "no king but Jesus," or face down Commodus in front of a full crowd at the Coliseum. Where are the alpha males in our day willing to do so? I pray God will raise some up among our ranks.
The tyrant cannot be negotiated with. He cannot be befriended. Nor can he show empathy. For all is weakness to him. Therefore, everything is transactional. You are there for as long as you're useful, and then gone when you are not.
Like what just happened to Ben Carson, and pretty much everyone else that comes into Trump's orbit once he’s used them for what he needed at the time. Like how my friend Bob Vander Plaats was a great guy when Trump thought he needed his endorsement, and then Trump called him a crook when he didn’t get it.
Like his spirit animal, Ahab, who came home to whine to his wife about how he couldn’t buy this one property he wanted, Trump takes to Twitter and friendly media enclaves to do the same. And then his Twitter following, and adorning media throng, acts as his Jezebel when she told Ahab just to go take what he wants because he’s the king.
Tyrants cannot be loved on. They must be broken. You will only know if they have been broken if you see the fruit of the spirit in their lives. Do they practice altruism, as in the right thing expecting nothing in return? Is there a public repentance, or a repentance of convenience? Meaning they tell you what you want to hear now just so they can get from you what they want.
When you dance with the devil, the devil doesn't change. He changes you.
Anything short of that and I can promise you, as God Almighty is my witness, you are being played. And once that is revealed it will not be the tyrant that is exposed for scorn and mockery, but you.
Every. Single. Time.
In short, this is a dangerous game. This is not dining with sinners. This is attempting to evangelize Herod's Court, where even Christ himself kept silent among such godlessness and darkness. You have never been this way before. He is unlike anything you have encountered. He would arguably be the most personally damaged and feckless individual ever to occupy the Oval Office.
He is beyond the milquetoast pabulum the system usually serves up, which is why he was able to crush the system. When you dance with the devil, the devil doesn't change. He changes you.
He will see your willingness to love on him as weakness. He is laughing at you now, even as we speak, for wanting to meet with him. He sees it as the groveling of the already defeated. There's a reason he attracts heretical Paula White types who are only in this for personal gain, too. Because real recognize real.
Such a man can be brought to Christ, because nothing is beyond the power of Christ. However, he must be broken like any wild stallion, or a prodigal son. He must hit rock bottom, such as when Nebuchadnezzar was sent to live as a wild animal. He must be shown there is a power greater than he, otherwise he will believe he is that power.
Just as you wouldn't reward a petulant, rebellious teenager with more power and pleasure, the absolute worst thing that you can do is reward such a man just the same. You will not pierce his heart, but he will break yours.
In conclusion, I urge you to consider these two final questions:
Do you really believe you could look Jesus in the eye at your judgment and justify supporting such a man for the most powerful office in the world?
If you do support him, must we then apologize to the Clintons for the stones we threw at their immorality, as well as to others whose sin we have rightly lobbied against in the past since we’re now excusing it from Trump?
I know what the alternative appears to be, and I do not wish it. If she becomes president, I will oppose her Leftist schemes as I always have (unlike Trump, who lavished praise and financial contributions upon her). But I am not afraid of Hillary Clinton. Let me tell you what I am afraid of.
I am afraid of the message we will be sending this culture by compromising everything we claim to believe in, by supporting a man who embodies everything we supposedly oppose. And I’m afraid the cost for that message could transcend generations, as the culture declares we are the emperor who has no clothes. That when push comes to shove we offer them nothing not already of this world. The same fear-mongering and situational ethics they can get anywhere else. Just minus all that annoyingly sanctimonious moralizing. We will confirm for them they were right to tune us out. That we are who they thought we were. We will write the God-haters’ material for them.
That will have consequences for our fellow countrymen that will last long past the next four years.
I urge you, as a representative of the next generation who will someday take your place, please do not put us any further behind the eight ball with this culture than we already are. They already don’t trust us, nor do they take us seriously, and that’s if they don’t ignore us altogether.
Give us a real chance to reach the next generation, rather than spending years defending the indefensible simply because there is an “R” after its name.
The scriptures say we are not Christians because of our hermeneutically sound systematic theology. Or because we follow creeds. But because we testify to the fact that God supernaturally reached down into history to raise His Son from the dead. The Son who God gave to pay the penalty we deserve because He loved us so. To demonstrate that love, God was willing to lose something of tremendous value to Him, as testimony of His love for us.
His only Son.
We came to Christ because of that testimony. We bowed at the knee to Jesus and chose to follow him because he showed what he was willing to lose for us. Love knows no greater man than Jesus, who laid down his life for his friends.
Perhaps we have lost this culture because we haven’t shown it similar sacrificial love. We haven’t shown them we’re willing to lose anything for what we believe, except the same things of this world they value.
Not to mention maybe, just maybe, God would providentially award such faithfulness in the sort of supernatural ways He has for His people in the past? Perhaps we do not see God move in such ways in our day because we prefer our ways to His?
And where has that gotten us — an election between Hillary and her donor.
This is our rendezvous with destiny. Except this time it isn’t wrestling with existential threats outside of us, but the brokenness inside of us.
We don’t need Barabbas the zealot. We need Jesus. And we have the means to give them Jesus, if only we have the faith and courage of conviction. When we came to Christ did we know for sure how it would turn out, or did we have faith? Let us stop trying to manipulate outcomes as our adversaries do, and instead show real faith that while we do not know what the future holds, we know who holds the future.
Duty is ours, but outcomes belong to God.
Thank you for reading my letter and at least considering these words. I pray you will fight the good fight, keep the faith, and finish the race.
- See more at: https://www.conservativereview.com/commentary/2016/05/dear-christian-leaders-youre-playing-a-very-dangerous-game#sthash.Zt2Dp2Zg.dpuf
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You're wasting your time Deace. I've seen on this very website proclamations that Trump is, like Moses, the chosen of God to lead the wayward Americans out of the wilderness.
Me, I agree with you about Trump's degeneracy. He couldn't spell God if you spotted him the G and the D.
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I think we answer to God for our vote just as we do for all of our thoughts, words and actions. When we use evil means to accomplish our ends, we can be sure of only one thing: God's judgment. As a believer in the truth of Scripture, there are many examples where God not only blessed obedience, but He made clear that it was He who controlled the outcome, not the power of men. So we are to fear God, not men. Trust God, not men. Obey God, not men. Follow God, not men. There are also many examples where human might lost when they trusted in themselves rather than God.
For me, Trump and Hillary are both out of the question. I will put my trust in the Sovereign of the Universe. Vengeance is His. I'm not saying we must have perfect candidates. I am saying that I want a candidate who walks in the fear of God; who knows that our rights are from God; who believes as so many Presidents before him, that God judges in the affairs of men and that good and evil are not equal or reversed; who at a minimum understands the threat of too much power in too few hands is dangerous precisely because men are corruptible. And I want this in someone who was not born to it yesterday as a means to manipulate. Rather I want a history of good character and in support of good policy that can be tracked over many years. Trump can't do it in six months.
:thumbsup2:
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A great explanation as to why principled Christian Conservatives oppose with vehemence, Trump's candidacy.
But the Trump Believers will lecture us that we are not voting for a pastor (even though God lays out in explicit details the qualifications for office that we should consider before anointing someone to act as our servant) and that "holy rollers" like ourselves are fanatics that are dangerous to the process of secular government.
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There are more important things than elections.
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A great explanation as to why principled Christian Conservatives oppose with vehemence, Trump's candidacy.
But the Trump Believers will lecture us that we are not voting for a pastor (even though God lays out in explicit details the qualifications for office that we should consider before anointing someone to act as our servant) and that "holy rollers" like ourselves are fanatics that are dangerous to the process of secular government.
:thumbsup2: :thumbsup2:
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"If you do support him, must we then apologize to the Clintons for the stones we threw at their immorality, as well as to others whose sin we have rightly lobbied against in the past since we’re now excusing it from Trump?"
Thought provoking. For some of us.
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:thumbsup2: :thumbsup2:
So glad that Steve put the pen to the paper! Exactly, exactly my thought. My Spirit is in agreement.
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Proverbs 29:2 When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice: but when the wicked beareth rule, the people mourn. (KJV)
@INVAR @don-o @markomalley
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But the Trump Believers will lecture us that we are not voting for a pastor (even though God lays out in explicit details the qualifications for office that we should consider before anointing someone to act as our servant) and that "holy rollers" like ourselves are fanatics that are dangerous to the process of secular government.
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I don't think there has ever been a candidate for president who was so brazen about sin and indifferent to repentance. Trump's claims that he will defend Christians is strange. He'd never impose its doctrines on himself. He is very much a man of our time, more comfortable, as The Rolling Stone said, reading Penthouse than National Review. Deace is right to uphold the truth. Those who bend their morals to support Trump are either gullible or indifferent to his flaws. We blew it. We had so many candidates who we could have proudly supported to beat Hillary. We ended up with a person that manifest nearly all the same flaws as Bill and Hillary, a man who funded Bill and Hillary, and a man shares their willingness to say anything to get elected.
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righteous dude.
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Very good article. Trumpy is Ahab. Israel demanded a king and recieved Ahab. America wants a king now. All hail King Trumpy. He will be a disaster for our country
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Trump is a false God, and those who are more loyal to him than to the truth will rue the day they gave up their critical-thinking skills, became dupes, and shills for this bombastic boob.
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This pretty well sums up where I have been since August, giving DT all benefit of the doubt and waiting vainly for any sign that he might give me a reason..Most recently it was suggested to me that I throw in with him with an eye to impeaching and removing him.
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If he picks Newt for VP, he can get the grumpy old man vote. Should he win and be impeached, we'll end up with a man almost equal to him in vanity, but somewhat more real as a conservative. Newt never imposed traditional values on himself, and Trump doesn't know what they are.
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Steve Deace can always be counted on for the hard, straight truth.
I know there are some who don't take this kind of thing seriously, but in 2012 I voted for Romney after hearing him say that homosexuals should be able to adopt children. I prayed about it a good deal and I felt strongly that God was leading me to just leave it alone. But then Benghazi happened. I decided to ignore God's counsel---which I had asked for---and I voted out of fear. The very next day began a spiritual crisis for me that lasted for a couple of years.
I was taught a hard lesson, and I don't need to learn it again. IMO Trump is worse than Romney. The man is on video saying he wouldn't ban partial birth abortion, and I just don't believe that a 70 year old lifelong liberal suddenly reversed his views just in time to run for president.
IMO Trump is a sleaze, a liar, and a liberal who contributed to the first gubernatorial run of Terry McAuliffe, who now squats like a toad in my governor's mansion (and is being investigated by the FBI). That alone is enough to ensure I would never vote for him. But it goes deeper than that...there are spiritual elements to this issue, as well.
Today I received an article from a friend who is urging me to vote for Trump to help stop Hillary. The author is Dennis Prager, who says he thinks the moral argument of NeverTrumpers is weak. Well, if he plans to stand in front of Jesus and run interference for me, I might listen, but otherwise, I have to answer for myself.
@Victoria33
@don-o
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Steve Deace can always be counted on for the hard, straight truth.
I know there are some who don't take this kind of thing seriously, but in 2012 I voted for Romney after hearing him say that homosexuals should be able to adopt children. I prayed about it a good deal and I felt strongly that God was leading me to just leave it alone. But then Benghazi happened. I decided to ignore God's counsel---which I had asked for---and I voted out of fear. The very next day began a spiritual crisis for me that lasted for a couple of years.
I was taught a hard lesson, and I don't need to learn it again. IMO Trump is worse than Romney. The man is on video saying he wouldn't ban partial birth abortion, and I just don't believe that a 70 year old lifelong liberal suddenly reversed his views just in time to run for president.
IMO Trump is a sleaze, a liar, and a liberal who contributed to the first gubernatorial run of Terry McAuliffe, who now squats like a toad in my governor's mansion (and is being investigated by the FBI). That alone is enough to ensure I would never vote for him. But it goes deeper than that...there are spiritual elements to this issue, as well.
Today I received an article from a friend who is urging me to vote for Trump to help stop Hillary. The author is Dennis Prager, who says he thinks the moral argument of NeverTrumpers is weak. Well, if he plans to stand in front of Jesus and run interference for me, I might listen, but otherwise, I have to answer for myself.
@Victoria33
@don-o
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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@elhombrelibre
@CatherineofAragon
@Bigun
"But the Trump Believers will lecture us that we are not voting for a pastor..."
I don't know a single person who is voting for Trump and even if I did, their opinion of what I should do, means nothing to me. There are Trump believers on this forum but they don't know me, they don't live with me or my conscience, so they don't affect me.
"I don't think there has ever been a candidate for president who was so brazen about sin and indifferent to repentance. Trump's claims that he will defend Christians is strange."
Okay, I think he is a candidate to be the AntiChrist. He is swaying Christians to vote for him even though he is not a Godly man. He said he has never asked for forgiveness from God so that makes him the opposite of God, and that is Satan. It is as though a delusion has come over Christians and they flock to him. No matter what he does or says, nothing keeps them from praising him and that includes church pastors. Is the "mark" of Satan transferred to voters when they vote for him?
I just read a very long article about why he may be the AntiChrist. I don't remember where I got the link, could have been on this forum. The link is below. I think if you read that, it will make you wonder who Trump really is. If you remember your Bible, the AntiChrist is connected to a trumpet. I would say read that article and get back to me if it makes sense to you. I know one thing that is clear - I won't vote for him and he is dangerous for this country and for every one of us.
http://www.thehypertexts.com/Donald%20Trump%20Antichrist%20666.htm
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"But the Trump Believers will lecture us that we are not voting for a pastor..."
I don't know a single person who is voting for Trump and even if I did, their opinion of what I should do, means nothing to me. There are Trump believers on this forum but they don't know me, they don't live with me or my conscience, so they don't affect me.
"I don't think there has ever been a candidate for president who was so brazen about sin and indifferent to repentance. Trump's claims that he will defend Christians is strange."
Okay, I think he is a candidate to be the AntiChrist. He is swaying Christians to vote for him even though he is not a Godly man. He said he has never asked for forgiveness from God so that makes him the opposite of God, and that is Satan. It is as though a delusion has come over Christians and they flock to him. No matter what he does or says, nothing keeps them from praising him and that includes church pastors. Is the "mark" of Satan transferred to voters when they vote for him?
I just read a very long article about why he may be the AntiChrist. I don't remember where I got the link, could have been on this forum. The link is below. I think if you read that, it will make you wonder who Trump really is. If you remember your Bible, the AntiChrist is connected to a trumpet. I would say read that article and get back to me if it makes sense to you. I know one thing that is clear - I won't vote for him and he is dangerous for this country and for every one of us.
I understand your thought process and concerns - but I am NOT going to declare Trump to be the end-time biblical antiChrist.
Unrepentant and proud, arrogant… YES. But so too are so many who are secular and part of this world's value system. Direct hostility to God and His people has not manifested itself in anything I have read or watched from Trump.
I can go with a reincarnation of sorts with Il Duce perhaps (Satan sticks to what works) - and maybe even perhaps a false christ and false messiah charge (as so many who view him as a national savior), but I'm not ready to go where you want to place Trump.
Unless he declares himself divine, which Obama has already done on myriad occasions.
If he sets himself up as divine and begins to redefine morality as Obama has - then we may have a concern to discuss.
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John warns of many antichrists to come, not just one.
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@elhombrelibre
@CatherineofAragon
@Bigun
"But the Trump Believers will lecture us that we are not voting for a pastor..."
I don't know a single person who is voting for Trump and even if I did, their opinion of what I should do, means nothing to me. There are Trump believers on this forum but they don't know me, they don't live with me or my conscience, so they don't affect me.
"I don't think there has ever been a candidate for president who was so brazen about sin and indifferent to repentance. Trump's claims that he will defend Christians is strange."
Okay, I think he is a candidate to be the AntiChrist. He is swaying Christians to vote for him even though he is not a Godly man. He said he has never asked for forgiveness from God so that makes him the opposite of God, and that is Satan. It is as though a delusion has come over Christians and they flock to him. No matter what he does or says, nothing keeps them from praising him and that includes church pastors. Is the "mark" of Satan transferred to voters when they vote for him?
I just read a very long article about why he may be the AntiChrist. I don't remember where I got the link, could have been on this forum. The link is below. I think if you read that, it will make you wonder who Trump really is. If you remember your Bible, the AntiChrist is connected to a trumpet. I would say read that article and get back to me if it makes sense to you. I know one thing that is clear - I won't vote for him and he is dangerous for this country and for every one of us.
http://www.thehypertexts.com/Donald%20Trump%20Antichrist%20666.htm
Two different kinds of references to antichrist. One with capital A. The Antichrist, and antichrist (s) The bible says there are many. Anti meaning against Christ. Denying Christ. I think your right. I don't know if he is the Antichrist but I think he is antichrist. What he has done without saying I don't believe in Christ. He said it in another very powerful way. He denied who Christ is by denying the power of the Cross and the sacrifice for sin. So I believe you are right. In the very least he is a Christ denier. Making him antichrist of which there are many.
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It just amazes me how many Christians believe in their heart of hearts that Trump was sent by God. From prominant leaders like Pat Robertson, to people like my sister who uses her FB account to spread what she thinks are prophetic messages from God about Trump she finds on some pretty nutty web pages. Have they lost thier minds, or are we witnessing with our own eyes the warnings of Mathew 24:24 about even the elect being deceived.
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It just amazes me how many Christians believe in their heart of hearts that Trump was sent by God. From prominant leaders like Pat Robertson, to people like my sister who uses her FB account to spread what she thinks are prophetic messages from God about Trump she finds on some pretty nutty web pages. Have they lost thier minds, or are we witnessing with our own eyes the warnings of Mathew 24:24 about even the elect being deceived.
Well we have the fact that so far no weapon formed against him has prevailed....
And he is building a wall to protect a nation...
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Two different kinds of references to antichrist. One with capital A. The Antichrist, and antichrist (s) The bible says there are many. Anti meaning against Christ. Denying Christ. I think your right. I don't know if he is the Antichrist but I think he is antichrist. What he has done without saying I don't believe in Christ. He said it in another very powerful way. He denied who Christ is by denying the power of the Cross and the sacrifice for sin. So I believe you are right. In the very least he is a Christ denier. Making him antichrist of which there are many.
I feel the door was opened to the spirit of antichrist the moment the Democrats at their 2012 DNC convention denied Christ 3 times. That door has not been closed.
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Okay, I think he is a candidate to be the AntiChrist. He is swaying Christians to vote for him even though he is not a Godly man. He said he has never asked for forgiveness from God so that makes him the opposite of God, and that is Satan. It is as though a delusion has come over Christians and they flock to him. No matter what he does or says, nothing keeps them from praising him and that includes church pastors. Is the "mark" of Satan transferred to voters when they vote for him?
PEACE, darlin'
There is a HUGE difference between 'christian' and Christian Right. Remember, Romney supposedly got the Christian vote too - But he really didn't. And he lost. SOSDD.
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Well we have the fact that so far no weapon formed against him has prevailed....
And he is building a wall to protect a nation...
God sometimes permits the temporary success of evil persons to reveal the faithfulness (or lack thereof) of those who claim to His followers. In Moses, a false prophet was not to be followed, even if he prophesied correctly, if the prophet led people away from God. Nebuchadnezzar was given an open path to defeat Israel, despite being a self-worshipping pagan. Judas was allowed to betray Christ for money, because in God's plan for our redemption, Jesus had to die.
So you cannot judge by temporary success in worldly matters whether God is for or against someone. Look at the entire body of Old and New Testament literature. A person's relationship with God always comes down to faith, believing what God says is true, and acting accordingly, even when the apparent result is worldly failure. Does God say we are all sinners? Then if we say we are without sin, we make God a liar. Is someone right with God if they are calling him a liar?
As for the wall, consider this:
Psalm 127:1 Except the Lord build the house, they labour in vain that build it: except the Lord keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain.
All the proud boasting of men offers no protection at all from our true enemies, if in our hearts we put out the welcome mat for evil men. We become our own worst enemies, because we deprive ourselves of the blessing of God. There is no wall high enough to protect us from the enemy God sends us in judgment.
Peace,
SR
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Well we have the fact that so far no weapon formed against him has prevailed....
Soooo.. He's the Barren Woman of Is 54?
And he is building a wall to protect a nation...
So now he's Nehemiah the Prophet?
IS that what passes for exegesis in your world?
It seems your skills with the Prophecy need a lot of work...
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It just amazes me how many Christians believe in their heart of hearts that Trump was sent by God. From prominant leaders like Pat Robertson, to people like my sister who uses her FB account to spread what she thinks are prophetic messages from God about Trump she finds on some pretty nutty web pages. Have they lost thier minds, or are we witnessing with our own eyes the warnings of Mathew 24:24 about even the elect being deceived.
I don't know about Robertson. I am sure you have heard things he has said that make you wonder if he has a screw loose.
http://www.alternet.org/belief/10-craziest-things-pat-robertson-has-said
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God sometimes permits the temporary success of evil persons to reveal the faithfulness (or lack thereof) of those who claim to His followers. In Moses, a false prophet was not to be followed, even if he prophesied correctly, if the prophet led people away from God. Nebuchadnezzar was given an open path to defeat Israel, despite being a self-worshipping pagan. Judas was allowed to betray Christ for money, because in God's plan for our redemption, Jesus had to die.
So you cannot judge by temporary success in worldly matters whether God is for or against someone. Look at the entire body of Old and New Testament literature. A person's relationship with God always comes down to faith, believing what God says is true, and acting accordingly, even when the apparent result is worldly failure. Does God say we are all sinners? Then if we say we are without sin, we make God a liar. Is someone right with God if they are calling him a liar?
As for the wall, consider this:
Psalm 127:1 Except the Lord build the house, they labour in vain that build it: except the Lord keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain.
All the proud boasting of men offers no protection at all from our true enemies, if in our hearts we put out the welcome mat for evil men. We become our own worst enemies, because we deprive ourselves of the blessing of God. There is no wall high enough to protect us from the enemy God sends us in judgment.
Peace,
SR
:amen:
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Well we have the fact that so far no weapon formed against him has prevailed....
And he is building a wall to protect a nation...
Trump: "I play to people's fantasies," he writes. "People may not always think big themselves, but they can still get very excited by those who do. That's why a little hyperbole never hurts. People want to believe that something is the biggest and the greatest and the most spectacular."
Trump knows how to dupe people.
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God sometimes permits the temporary success of evil persons to reveal the faithfulness (or lack thereof) of those who claim to His followers. In Moses, a false prophet was not to be followed, even if he prophesied correctly, if the prophet led people away from God. Nebuchadnezzar was given an open path to defeat Israel, despite being a self-worshipping pagan. Judas was allowed to betray Christ for money, because in God's plan for our redemption, Jesus had to die.
So you cannot judge by temporary success in worldly matters whether God is for or against someone. Look at the entire body of Old and New Testament literature. A person's relationship with God always comes down to faith, believing what God says is true, and acting accordingly, even when the apparent result is worldly failure. Does God say we are all sinners? Then if we say we are without sin, we make God a liar. Is someone right with God if they are calling him a liar?
As for the wall, consider this:
Psalm 127:1 Except the Lord build the house, they labour in vain that build it: except the Lord keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain.
All the proud boasting of men offers no protection at all from our true enemies, if in our hearts we put out the welcome mat for evil men. We become our own worst enemies, because we deprive ourselves of the blessing of God. There is no wall high enough to protect us from the enemy God sends us in judgment.
Peace,
SR
As far as the wall goes. It was to prevent destroying the nation, we are heading to destruction. Its not a house builder situation its a Nation Saving situation with a wall as part of it.
I do not see Trump as Evil. I see there are evil forces using lies against him. To me the behavior of known evil being used against a claimed evil tells me the claim is probably false.
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Voting for stump means Republicans owe Bill Clinton an apology.
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Have they lost thier minds, or are we witnessing with our own eyes the warnings of Mathew 24:24 about even the elect being deceived.
That thought has come to my mind every time I read of the Christians who are endorsing Trump. Note well, it seems like every endorsement while acknowledging his flaws, overlook the elephant in the room. That being his never asking God for forgiveness while he claims to be a Christian.
ipso facto by allowing that steaming pile to lay there, they are endorsing "another gospel"; one that requires no repentance.
Mind boggling.
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That thought has come to my mind every time I read of the Christians who are endorsing Trump. Note well, it seems like every endorsement while acknowledging his flaws, overlook the elephant in the room. That being his never asking God for forgiveness while he claims to be a Christian.
ipso facto by allowing that steaming pile to lay there, they are endorsing "another gospel"; one that requires no repentance.
Mind boggling.
What was really stunning was when he claimed that he reads the Bible more than 'anyone'.....and then the Two Corinthians faux paux. Most Christians I know have his number and see him clearly for what he is.
In 2008 we had a choice to vote for a solid conservative in Sarah Palin, despite that idiot McCain. In 2012 we had the choice of voting for an anti-American, race-bating radical or a Mormon RINO.
We will have a choice of voting this year for either pure evil or evil lite. Not much of a choice and as anyone can (or should be able to) see....our "choices" are getting more and more sucky as time goes by. We are losing this war, IOW.
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Why Donald Trump didn't REALLY mess up when he said 'Two Corinthians' instead of 'Second Corinthians'
http://www.getreligion.org/getreligion/2016/1/18/donald-trump-two-corinthians-at-liberty-university
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Why Donald Trump didn't REALLY mess up when he said 'Two Corinthians' instead of 'Second Corinthians'
http://www.getreligion.org/getreligion/2016/1/18/donald-trump-two-corinthians-at-liberty-university
So no, Trump didn't really mess up. Except that he probably did.
In the meantime, The Donald might want to consider remedial Sunday school.
Thanks for the extra perspective that I didn't really need.
Trump would do better to stick with reality tv or maybe even standup comedy. He's such an 'entertainer'....lol.
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Here's what Eric Erickson of Red State thinks of evangelical leaders' efforts:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CjVAFH9WUAAsbFL.jpg)
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Why Donald Trump didn't REALLY mess up when he said 'Two Corinthians' instead of 'Second Corinthians'
http://www.getreligion.org/getreligion/2016/1/18/donald-trump-two-corinthians-at-liberty-university
from link
So no, Trump didn't really mess up. Except that he probably did.
The takeaway from a media reporting standpoint: More context is always helpful. So are fewer assumptions.
In the meantime, The Donald might want to consider remedial Sunday school.
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Here's what Eric Erickson of Red State thinks of evangelical leaders' efforts:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CjVAFH9WUAAsbFL.jpg)
:whocares: what that Presstitute says?
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Thanks for the extra perspective that I didn't really need.
GMTA
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:whocares: what that Presstitute says?
Here's an avatar you might consider. Truth in packaging and all that...
(http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp221/drw509/lala.jpg)
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GMTA
Yes, indeed. :beer:
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This pretty well sums up where I have been since August, giving DT all benefit of the doubt and waiting vainly for any sign that he might give me a reason..Most recently it was suggested to me that I throw in with him with an eye to impeaching and removing him.
Well now, there's a dangerous plan.
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Here's what Eric Erickson of Red State thinks of evangelical leaders' efforts:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CjVAFH9WUAAsbFL.jpg)
The metaphor makes me want to throw up, but it's right on target. And it's pathetically sad.
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:whocares: what that Presstitute says?
Yet you'll believe "sundance" without question. Funny how that works, isn't it?
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Yet you'll believe "sundance" without question. Funny how that works, isn't it?
There is no evidence Sundance took 3 million dollars from a PAC to write Trump Opposition hit pieces. There are FEC filings showing Eric did. So logic says one is better and more reliable then the known crooked one.
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The metaphor makes me want to throw up, but it's right on target. And it's pathetically sad.
"Waxing their nethers". You don't see that very often.
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"Waxing their nethers". You don't see that very often.
LOL, thankfully.