The Briefing Room
General Category => Sports/Entertainment/MSM/Social Media => Topic started by: ABX on October 25, 2016, 10:03:33 pm
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Seriously to all you Ned Flanders types out there, do you not know what this show is about? And to think, some of these people let their little kids watch it then complained about the content? Even my wife wouldn't watch this episode.
Now, with the most recent episode of #TheWalkingDead pushing even devoted fans of the series to their limits with its brutal depiction of bloody, bloody murder, it's perhaps not all that surprising that those who've never been fond of the show were downright appalled. That, at least, was the response of The Parents Television Council, a conservative watchdog that — in a move that should surprise literally no-one — just denounced The Walking Dead's Season 7 premiere for that aforementioned violence....
http://moviepilot.com/p/the-walking-dead-premiere-didnt-go-down-well-with-conservative-groups/4132969?utm_source=fb-stream-post&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=the-walking-dead-premiere-didnt-go-down-well-with-conservative-groups
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I can't even handle the commercials.
NOT my kind of show. Definitely not a show I would have let my kids watch.
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I can't even handle the commercials.
NOT my kind of show. Definitely not a show I would have let my kids watch.
It is not a children's show in the least. Sunday's was even a bit rough for me. I have one friend (I think she is a member here) who said she was shaking and crying after that episode.
But there were no surprises, we knew what was coming.
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Typical nannies...don't like it? Don't watch...
Uhm, when the governor was busy hacking Herschel's head off with Michonne's katana a couple of seasons back, wasn't that a FREAKIN' CLUE!?!?
What about the trough at Terminus? Baseball bat to the back of the head and then slit the throats of their next meal...and there were others, too many to recall right now.
The method of dispatching the dead has become quite creative and consistent with the types of dead they've encountered. Maggie in the sewer going all the way up the chest cavity of the one walker until saved by her partner...
I'll admit, Abraham's murder/execution was bad enough, showing Glenn after the first hit and severely injured, facial features distorted, practically dead, was a bit over the top...but there are disclaimers warning viewers about the violence. My wife binge watches the DVD's upon release, hates waiting for the weekly episodes. I've already told her that she either skips this one or prepares herself for some serious gore.
I don't watch the show for the violence. But one has to figure that in a SHTF scenario similar to this, I do believe there will be elements that will match or exceed the level of cruelty and violence on display in WD.
I watch it for the psychological, mental and physical components of trying to survive in a post apocalyptic world and the abundance of really stupid mistakes/actions...storyline ain't too bad either.
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It is not a children's show in the least. Sunday's was even a bit rough for me. I have one friend (I think she is a member here) who said she was shaking and crying after that episode.
But there were no surprises, we knew what was coming.
I have no problem with people watching the show. I just wish (even though my kids are adults and all gone) that for the sake of other kids, they'd not show graphic faces, etc. on the commercials when anyone could be watching.
If people want to see it (and lots do), more power to them.
I suppose the ads are pretty tame compared to the show, but I'd like a little self-censorship coming from Hollywood.
Like in the "good old days." :dx1:
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I don't watch the show for the violence. But one has to figure that in a SHTF scenario similar to this, I do believe there will be elements that will match or exceed the level of cruelty and violence on display in WD.
I watch it for the psychological, mental and physical components of trying to survive in a post apocalyptic world and the abundance of really stupid mistakes/actions...storyline ain't too bad either.
I agree. As a horror show,it's a cartoon. How serious can you take monsters that can't even walk fast and have the IQ of a Dimocrat?
I see it like you,as a show about how to survive after the SHTF. The monsters are just there for the same purpose as the supermodels that are in action flicks.
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Seriously to all you Ned Flanders types out there, do you not know what this show is about? And to think, some of these people let their little kids watch it then complained about the content? Even my wife wouldn't watch this episode.
The Bible thumpers are worse than the Trumpkins IMO...
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I have no problem with people watching the show. I just wish (even though my kids are adults and all gone) that for the sake of other kids, they'd not show graphic faces, etc. on the commercials when anyone could be watching.
If people want to see it (and lots do), more power to them.<<
@musiclady
Since this is basically a show about the survival of the human species after "life as we know it has ended",the graphic things need to be shown because survival is going to be pretty damn graphic. Tinker Belles ain't going to make it.
>>I suppose the ads are pretty tame compared to the show, but I'd like a little self-censorship coming from Hollywood.<<
"Self-Censorship" by Hollywood IS censorship to suit a certain political segment of society.
Like in the "good old days." :dx1:
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Typical nannies...don't like it? Don't watch...
I watch it for the psychological, mental and physical components of trying to survive in a post apocalyptic world...
That is why I watch it.
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The aggrieved losers in the The Parents Television Council can stuff it. This nanny state BS is why Conservatives have the bad street cred they do.
BTW, I tried to watch this stupid show when it came out and gave up on it because it was a bunch of unlikable characters looking for Govt' in DC to save them. It wasn't because of the violence. When I dial in once and a while all I see is hilariously fake blood and guts of the Hershel Gordon Lewis variety.
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The aggrieved losers in the The Parents Television Council can stuff it. This nanny state BS is why Conservatives have the bad street cred they do.
BTW, I tried to watch this stupid show when it came out and gave up on it because it was a bunch of unlikable characters looking for Govt' in DC to save them. It wasn't because of the violence. When I dial in once and a while all I see is hilariously fake blood and guts of the Hershel Gordon Lewis variety.
The first couple of seasons were about seeking gov't help, it's what many in society have come to believe in, that gov't is the big nanny and is gonna save you...the characters in the show have since arrived at the conclusion that isn't happening, at least not yet...I don't know the comics so can't tell.
Now they're in full on survival mode and trying to establish some sense of normalcy, to bring civilization "back".
Hence Negan's poking fun at them about "sitting around a picnic table" in the Sunday's episode...and yes, the gore gets tiresome at times...but ya just gotta look past that and enjoy the special "special effects" these folks are putting out. Some are pretty damned good.
But I get it, it's not for everyone.
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Mindless Tipper Gore and Terry Ricolla types. Save the world from TV shows. Get a life.
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@sneakypete
I'm not sure what Louis B. Mayer's politics were, but the Hayes Act gave us decades of good, healthy entertainment for which I'm grateful.
And Hollywood did controlled itself. No censorship required.
My love of clean musicals thanks them.
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@sneakypete
I'm not sure what Louis B. Mayer's politics were, but the Hayes Act gave us decades of good, healthy entertainment for which I'm grateful.
And Hollywood did controlled itself. No censorship required.
My love of clean musicals thanks them.
Mayer was a Republican and ran the CA state GOP back in the day.
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Mayer was a Republican and ran the CA state GOP back in the day.
Oh, thanks for that, Frank. I didn't know what his politics were. I knew he was a task master and a strong man, but didn't know he was a Republican.
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Some parents don't care what their kids watch. My guy went to see The hills have eyes 2 when it was in theaters. He said he was stunned at the family in front of him, had 6 kids, and 3 were under age 10. He said one looked to be about 5 or 6
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I watched one episode and that was too much, it was just ridiculous.
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The Bible thumpers are worse than the Trumpkins IMO...
Wow. Interesting sentiment. Did you actually intend to insult Bible-believing Christians on this board, or was that a slip of the keyboard?
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@sneakypete
I'm not sure what Louis B. Mayer's politics were, but the Hayes Act gave us decades of good, healthy entertainment for which I'm grateful.
And Hollywood did controlled itself. No censorship required.
My love of clean musicals thanks them.
@musiclady
You have to be kidding. There was a censor on every movie lot and on every tv episode,monitoring what was being done and said.
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The Bible thumpers are worse than the Trumpkins IMO...
It isn't a question of Bible thumping, so much as what you probably don't want your four year old to watch. Theology question of the day: Do zombies have a soul?
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@sneakypete It's the smell that will get them, not the scenery so much.
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It isn't a question of Bible thumping, so much as what you probably don't want your four year old to watch. Theology question of the day: Do zombies have a soul?
@Smokin Joe
Who is telling you that you have to make your 4 year old granddaughter watch it?
You have every right to determine what you and your family CAN watch.
You have NO right to tell others what THEIR families will not be ALLOWED to watch.
If it were otherwise,your local government could legally tell you that you and your family MUST convert to Islam and make mandatory prayers daily and attend services at a local Mosque.
You can't have it both ways. Any government that has the authority to force people to obey YOUR religious viewpoints and customs also has the right to tell YOU to obey the religious viewpoints of Islam.
Be careful what you ask for lest you get it.
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I'm hopelessly out of it, I guess. Never had any interest in seeing this series. Since "Person of Interest" ended, there's no TV series anywhere that Mr. M and I watch, except for NYPD Blue reruns and Barnwood Builders. :laugh:
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@musiclady
You have to be kidding. There was a censor on every movie lot and on every tv episode,monitoring what was being done and said.
I'm not kidding. Hayes Act. Cleaned up Hollywood. Self imposed.
And it resulted in good, quality movies that everyone can watch.
Some day you'll understand that we're not all the same as you are, @sneakypete, and being different doesn't make us stupid. I don't anticipate being alive for that day, but I hope it will happen sometime soon....... for YOUR sake.
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I'm not kidding. Hayes Act. Cleaned up Hollywood. Self imposed.
And it resulted in good, quality movies that everyone can watch.
I gotta jump in here. First off it was the "Hays" act, not Hayes, named after William Hays. He was head of the Motion Pictures Association. Secondly it only lasted 4 years after talking pictures were introduced. It was such a disaster because no one adhered to it and a lot of early 30's films were full of sex, drugs and other things you are bashing now. In 1934 the Association enacted the Production Codes that lasted until the late 60's.
Mayer had nothing to do with the code system at any point along the line. The code when enacted was dumb as hell. It was in the code that every bad guy in the movie needed to be punished. It was in the code that married people needed to be in separate beds. The whole thing was absurd and made movies so boring that Hollywood was a shambles by the 60's and most movie production was done in Europe. Remember the Spaghetti style movies?
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The Bible thumpers are worse than the Trumpkins IMO...
Bible Thumpers? Sounds like something a liberal would say.
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I gotta jump in here. First off it was the "Hays" act, not Hayes, named after William Hays. He was head of the Motion Pictures Association. Secondly it only lasted 4 years after talking pictures were introduced. It was such a disaster because no one adhered to it and a lot of early 30's films were full of sex, drugs and other things you are bashing now. In 1934 the Association enacted the Production Codes that lasted until the late 60's.
Mayer had nothing to do with the code system at any point along the line. The code when enacted was dumb as hell. It was in the code that every bad guy in the movie needed to be punished. It was in the code that married people needed to be in separate beds. The whole thing was absurd and made movies so boring that Hollywood was a shambles by the 60's and most movie production was done in Europe. Remember the Spaghetti style movies?
Thanks for the correction. My information was obviously only partial and partly incorrect.
Nonetheless, the movies in the (later) 30's were cleaned up and are still great entertainment. As I said earlier, as a fan of great musicals, the 30's were the best of the best, with Fred and Ginger, Nelson and Jeanette.
There are a whole lot of people who are grateful for the 'censorship' that allow us to thoroughly enjoy movies without offense.
btw, the so-called "sophisticated" early 30's musicals (with Maurice Chevalier particularly) were dopey and Jr High silly in trying to be dirty.
They got MUCH better when they clamped down on the childish innuendo.
JMHO......
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@Smokin Joe
Who is telling you that you have to make your 4 year old granddaughter watch it?
You have every right to determine what you and your family CAN watch.
You have NO right to tell others what THEIR families will not be ALLOWED to watch.
If it were otherwise,your local government could legally tell you that you and your family MUST convert to Islam and make mandatory prayers daily and attend services at a local Mosque.
You can't have it both ways. Any government that has the authority to force people to obey YOUR religious viewpoints and customs also has the right to tell YOU to obey the religious viewpoints of Islam.
Be careful what you ask for lest you get it.
I fail to see where I called to ban it. Oh, I didn't.
I don't want the government involved. I would like for the ads for the show to be run when the little urchins are in bed, not three thirty in the afternoon. And that goes for some of the other age inappropriate trailers on the tube, too. That's something that can be done while the government is off picking it's collective nose as far as I am concerned. Why does doing something that should be common sense have to have a frigging law?
BTW, I have told local government to go piss up a rope before, I reckon it'll happen again.
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I hate to tell these conservative groups, but what's going on now in TWD is minor compared to what it will be like if SHTF. I understand there needs to be some kind of level of decency, but what they portray is well within context.
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I hate to tell these conservative groups, but what's going on now in TWD is minor compared to what it will be like if SHTF. I understand there needs to be some kind of level of decency, but what they portray is well within context.
I think it is just prep for the meltdown anyway. But no amount of teevee will ever prep someone for the smell of either gore or decaying flesh.
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Thanks for the correction. My information was obviously only partial and partly incorrect.
Nonetheless, the movies in the (later) 30's were cleaned up and are still great entertainment. As I said earlier, as a fan of great musicals, the 30's were the best of the best, with Fred and Ginger, Nelson and Jeanette.
There are a whole lot of people who are grateful for the 'censorship' that allow us to thoroughly enjoy movies without offense.
btw, the so-called "sophisticated" early 30's musicals (with Maurice Chevalier particularly) were dopey and Jr High silly in trying to be dirty.
They got MUCH better when they clamped down on the childish innuendo.
JMHO......
You may like those movies, but the public tired of them after 20 years of saccharine fluff. I don't have a problem with a ratings system to know what you are about to see, but censorship is a loser whenever it is enacted.
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The Bible thumpers are worse than the Trumpkins IMO...
I'm just a "clinger"...
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I'm not kidding. Hayes Act. Cleaned up Hollywood. Self imposed.
And it resulted in good, quality movies that everyone can watch. <<
@musiclady
Yeah,and killed every bit of creativity while pleasing the "Church Ladies of the world" and no one else.
Not to mention what it did to comedy.
>>Some day you'll understand that we're not all the same... <<
YOU are telling ME this??????
>> and being different doesn't make us stupid.<<
Nor does it make us evil.
>>I don't anticipate being alive for that day, but I hope it will happen sometime soon....... for YOUR sake.<<
PLEASE give that phony piety a rest. You care nothing about anyone but yourself and what YOU want,or you wouldn't be trying to force censorship off on the rest of us.
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Bible Thumpers? Sounds like something a liberal would say.
The younger generation has no use for the Jesus people, believe me. They're tired of wedge issues.
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I'm hopelessly out of it, I guess. Never had any interest in seeing this series. Since "Person of Interest" ended, there's no TV series anywhere that Mr. M and I watch, except for NYPD Blue reruns and Barnwood Builders. :laugh:
@mountaineer
It had already been airing for several years before I ever tuned in to see if I could understand why so many people liked it. I do NOT go for horror movies,and being afraid of monsters that can only shamble along as 1 MPH,can't climb,have no brains,no defense,and growl to warn you they are coming made no sense at all.
Then I watched the first episode and figured out the zombies were just a "tool" to sell a show about survival after "The World As We Know It Comes To An End",and it clicked. It's a first rate series about survival,the sacrifices that will have to be made,the changes in thinking that have to be made to survive,and about how people from different backgrounds and cultures will have to come together to form a new society if any of them want to survive.
They could have used a giant Asteroid crashing into the Earth as a plot anchor if they had wanted,but that type of thing had been done several times before,so I guess they settled on Zombies to pull in the young crowd and to be different.
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Bible Thumpers? Sounds like something a liberal would say.
@driftdiver
How old are you,12? That has to be one of the most juvenile attacks I have seen.
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I fail to see where I called to ban it. Oh, I didn't.
I don't want the government involved. I would like for the ads for the show to be run when the little urchins are in bed, not three thirty in the afternoon. And that goes for some of the other age inappropriate trailers on the tube, too. <<
I see and understand your point,or would if you had written 7 PM. Nothing is on in the afternoons buy those dreary wimmins programs like soap operas and "you go,gurl!" shows. I would rather have teeth pulled than watch any of them,and can't imagine a child watching any of them unless forced to watch.
Or a 4 year old understanding what they were seeing and hearing if they were forced to watch. I don't even see how adults can stand to watch that crap.
>>That's something that can be done while the government is off picking it's collective nose as far as I am concerned. Why does doing something that should be common sense have to have a frigging law? <<
Best argument against official censorship I have ever seen. If YOU don't want to watch something,don't watch it. If YOU don't want YOUR children watching something,don't let them watch it. See how simple that is,and it doesn't involves the government or the Mrs Grundy's of the world at all.
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Seriously to all you Ned Flanders types out there, do you not know what this show is about? And to think, some of these people let their little kids watch it then complained about the content? Even my wife wouldn't watch this episode.
Totally agree. It's clear what the content is. The outrage reminds me of Tipper Gore and the PMRC back in the day.
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You may like those movies, but the public tired of them after 20 years of saccharine fluff. I don't have a problem with a ratings system to know what you are about to see, but censorship is a loser whenever it is enacted.
:amen:
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The younger generation has no use for the Jesus people, believe me. They're tired of wedge issues.
@Weird Tolkienish Figure
Not just the younger generation. There are a BUNCH of geezers like me that are as fed up with that form of Nazism as they are every other form of Nazism.
Remember stupid crap like "Blue Laws" telling us what we could and could not buy on Sundays,and even telling us that what we COULD be ALLOWED to buy could only be bought after Church hours had ended?
I remember one example where you were allowed to buy beer after 2 PM,but not allowed to buy dog food until Monday.
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The younger generation has no use for the Jesus people, believe me. They're tired of wedge issues.
@Weird Tolkienish Figure
Yes, its been the same story for 2000 years.
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@driftdiver
How old are you,12? That has to be one of the most juvenile attacks I have seen.
@sneakypete
Yes of course this is a touchy subject for you. Its far less juvenile then calling religious people "bible thumpers".
Until recently the only people in a political realm who have been insulting and otherwise attacking Christian "bible thumpers" have been the liberals.
So ya see its not a juvenile attack, its factual.
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The younger generation has no use for the Jesus people, believe me. They're tired of wedge issues.
True, but since the 60's the Younger Generation has pretty much been full of crap, sucking up and spewing out the catechism of liberal religious zealotry all over America, so there's a little pot-kettle-black going on with that.
Alot of that hate is pent up frustration from not being able to butcher right wingers like they did in the good old days of Stalin, Mao, and the gang. They get mad because right wingers and Jesus people refuse to comply with their decadent pop culture that they want to shove down our throat.
Which is also why I have guns.
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Alot of that hate is pent up frustration from not being able to butcher right wingers like they did in the good old days of Stalin, Mao, and the gang.
No, they just beat us at the polls, repeatedly, since 1992 or so.
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The younger generation has no use for the Jesus people, believe me. They're tired of wedge issues.
There have been wedge issues as long as there has been politics. To think otherwise is Pollyanna bullshit.
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Best part of that show in the second season was Dale getting eaten.
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The younger generation has no use for the Jesus people, believe me. They're tired of wedge issues.
Please name one Christian (Bible thumper) who would rather center his/her life around pleasing the younger generation than Jesus (their savior). If you do come up with any names, I'd strongly recommend that they get themselves into the Word and into a discipleship class, because such people would obviously have zero maturity in their faith. If they truly are Christians.
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Just like Trumpers are shocked, people are shocked when people actually do or say conservative things.
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@sneakypete
@driftdiver
Yes of course this is a touchy subject for you. Its far less juvenile then calling religious people "bible thumpers".<<
WHY? That's what they/you are. If you don't like it,quit thumping on your bible and demanding we all live according to the dictates in it.
>>Until recently the only people in a political realm who have been insulting and otherwise attacking Christian "bible thumpers" have been the liberals. <<
That tells me that either you haven't been paying much attention,or that the left (They are NOT "liberal" in ANY sense of the word) isn't always wrong.
So ya see its not a juvenile attack, its factual.<<
No,it was juvenile.
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True, but since the 60's the Younger Generation has pretty much been full of crap, sucking up and spewing out the catechism of liberal religious zealotry all over America, so there's a little pot-kettle-black going on with that.
Alot of that hate is pent up frustration from not being able to butcher right wingers like they did in the good old days of Stalin, Mao, and the gang. They get mad because right wingers and Jesus people refuse to comply with their decadent pop culture that they want to shove down our throat.
Which is also why I have guns.
@Free Vulcan
Just how freaking old are you that you can call a generation of people now eligible for Social Security "The Younger Generation"? Younger than what,dirt?
BTW,I have guns also.
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@Free Vulcan
Just how freaking old are you that you can call a generation of people now eligible for Social Security "The Younger Generation"? Younger than what,dirt?
BTW,I have guns also.
I'm saying that the last three generations, from the Boomers to the Millenials - when they were in their teens and twenties - have pretty much been full of crap. Not all, but most.
That includes my generation. I grew up with alot of those type of asshats. It wasn't that they didn't like Jesus people, they didn't like anything to do with religion, faith, morality, or goodness. Mostly because they were drinking, drugging, and whoring around when they should have been getting up off their lazy worthless asses and trying to make a future for themselves instead of dragging everyone down in the gutter.
My point is, too often people that don't like and rebel against 'Jesus people' are that way because they themselves are little fascists that want the world their way. They are more than happy to enforce their morality on the rest of the world just as much as the 'Jesus people'. If there's one thing I've learned in life is that rebellion and fascism are two sides of the same coin.
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I'm saying that the last three generations, from the Boomers to the Millenials - when they were in their teens and twenties - have pretty much been full of crap. Not all, but most.
That includes my generation. I grew up with alot of those type of asshats. It wasn't that they didn't like Jesus people, they didn't like anything to do with religion, faith, morality, or goodness. Mostly because they were drinking, drugging, and whoring around when they should have been getting up off their lazy worthless asses and trying to make a future for themselves instead of dragging everyone down in the gutter.
My point is, too often people that don't like and rebel against 'Jesus people' are that way because they themselves are little fascists that want the world their way. They are more than happy to enforce their morality on the rest of the world just as much as the 'Jesus people'. If there's one thing I've learned in life is that rebellion and fascism are two sides of the same coin.
Not all of us care if two people of the same sex want to get married. And not all of us are obsessed with abortion.
Two issues I just do not care about.
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Not all of us care if two people of the same sex want to get married. And not all of us are obsessed with abortion.
Two issues I just do not care about.
And neither do I until the homos and transgenders tell me I must cater to their marriages, tell my church that they must open their restrooms to them and perform their wedding services, or that they can have sex in public, while that I can't disagree publicly with their morality.
Or push their crap on little elementary kids in school, tell kids they can be different genders or gay, or have 14 y/o minor girls get abortions without parental consent. Or try to excuse pedophelia, or pick your poison.
Then it becomes our business. Then it's over the line and in your face, and that's what liberals do. They aren't libertarians, they are theocrats, and they will never ever ever ever ever ever ever stop until everyone agrees with them, has their beliefs, and lives exactly how they're told.
I learned that lesson long ago in a small little crap blue collar union Democrat town. Sometimes their hate for you and your beliefs is not because of something you did to them, but because of something you won't let them do to you.
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And neither do I until the homos and transgenders tell me I must cater to their marriages, tell my church that they must open their restrooms to them and perform their wedding services, or that they can have sex in public, while that I can't disagree publicly with their morality.
Or push their crap on kids in school, tell kids they can be different genders or gay, or have 14 y/o minor girls get abortions without parental consent. Or try to excuse pedophelia, or pick your poison.
Then it becomes our business. Then it's over the line and in your face, and that's what liberals do. They aren't libertarians, they are theocrats, and they will never ever ever ever ever ever ever stop until everyone agrees with them, has their beliefs, and lives exactly how they're told.
I learned that lesson long ago in a small little crap blue collar Democrat town. Sometimes their hate for you and your beliefs is not because of something you did to them, but because of something you won't let them do to you.
Ok, granted. But the anti-gay stuff on FR was a little over the top as to be ridiculous.
And I'm tired of hearing about abortion.
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Ok, granted. But the anti-gay stuff on FR was a little over the top as to be ridiculous.
And I'm tired of hearing about abortion.
In some respects I see your point. Abortion ain't gonna matter if people don't have jobs and can't eat, which is where we are headed if we don't get things like the debt under control fast.
And that might have worked well if liberals had left abortion as a states rights thing. Or at least compromised, left it to science and cut it off at provable viability. Now they're cool with infanticide and aborting a baby as it's being born, and even after.
They're cool with that because it's just a stepping stone to population control and forced abortion, meaning once again they are up in your face, because they never ever stop.
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Personally I don't understand how anyone who calls themselves conservative would watch the crap.
If it offends, just turn it off.
I don't watch any TV days. Heck I haven't even checked out Pookie Toons in more than a month.
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You may like those movies, but the public tired of them after 20 years of saccharine fluff. I don't have a problem with a ratings system to know what you are about to see, but censorship is a loser whenever it is enacted.
I understand your position, Frank, but if it weren't for "20 years of saccharine fluff" some of us..... many of us........ would have missed out on some absolutely fantastic entertainment. (Fred Astaire wouldn't even kiss an actress in a movie because he was married. Do you think he'd have been a star if dirty dancing were the norm in the 30's?)
I don't agree with all the restrictions, obviously (putting Lucy and Desi in twin beds was silly), but without those self-imposed codes, the lousy stuff would have gotten lousier sooner, and those of us who believe in clean entertainment would have been out to sea.
I oppose outside censorship, but I firmly agree on self control and self censorship of responsible people.
Those of us who don't like the filth aren't that small a number. Good G/PG rated movies do super well with the public because there are a lot of us who just don't go to most movies because of the offensiveness of so many. Even movies that we enjoy have language, sex and violence that we'd rather not have to see.
Again....... if Hollywood hadn't self-censored, the movie industry might have died on the vine because in the 30's the average person lived by a moral code and didn't want to see the kind of garbage that's out there now. There are fewer of us now, but we're not that small a number.
There would have been far fewer people going to movies (and less money for the moguls) if they hadn't put on the brakes on after the late 20's and early 30's, and I, for one, am very glad it happened.
And I don't think I'm alone in that view.
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You have to remember that some "conservatives" don't care about perversions, they don't even care if sodomy is part of the school curriculum as long as "it doesn't affect them"...
Of course it affects you. Everything you watch affects you and your morals. You start seeing degeneracy as "normal" and even start mocking others as "prudes" and "behind the times" for not embracing the latest perversions.
They will even say they don't care about the wholesale slaughter of babies, they probably think its worth the price to keep the perversions going.
But they will claim to be "conservatives"....
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Personally I don't understand how anyone who calls themselves conservative would watch the crap.
If it offends, just turn it off.
I don't watch any TV days. Heck I haven't even checked out Pookie Toons in more than a month.
Wanting limited government has little to do with being entertained by apocalypse sci-fi.
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You have to remember that some "conservatives" don't care about perversions, they don't even care if sodomy is part of the school curriculum as long as "it doesn't affect them"...
Of course it affects you. Everything you watch affects you and your morals. You start seeing degeneracy as "normal" and even start mocking others as "prudes" and "behind the times" for not embracing the latest perversions.
They will even say they don't care about the wholesale slaughter of babies, they probably think its worth the price to keep the perversions going.
But they will claim to be "conservatives"....
Excellent observations. I agree.
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Of course it affects you. Everything you watch affects you and your morals. You start seeing degeneracy as "normal" and even start mocking others as "prudes" and "behind the times" for not embracing the latest perversions.
Been checking out Playboy, Hustler and Penthouse since I was 12 or 13 years old, been to plenty of strip clubs in college and a few years out, I was dragged against my will to a strip club night before my wedding lol -my wife knew about it and gave me a handful of ones....still check out internet porn every so often. I'm honest.
My brothers and close friends about the same.. we got it out of our system while we were younger.
Non of us ever divorced-same for my groomsman, still married to my original wife. Don't cheat. Don't do drugs or drink. My wife knows where to find me, in the garage very night working on my muscle cars.
My point is it's always the ones who say they don't do this stuff who have the hidden lives. cheaters, child molestors, turn gay.
The people I know who were goody two shoes are the ones who always have a mid life crisis and feel they need to go out a sow their wild oats at age 50.
My wife had a convo with one of her friends a few years back.. friend was married to the first guy she dated right out of HS> She told my wife "Oh I should have dated more, had more fun, went to parties, I've only had sex with my husband" ..6 months later she was separated. My wife told that night what was going to happen.
@geronl
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My brothers and close friends about the same.. we got it out of our system while we were younger.
and now you back a man who says his own daughter is a "nice piece of @$$"
check mate
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@mirraflake
My ex-best friend was a totally goody-two-shoes all her life. Then last year, she up and divorces her husband, screws him out of some cash and then uses that money to go to Albania and marry some guy she met online who can't come here because he can't get a passport and he's not allowed into America anyway, apparently "He's on some kind of list or something"
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Wanting limited government has little to do with being entertained by apocalypse sci-fi.
Those who can't or won't govern themselves but want limited government are worrisome
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It's a really entertaining show, the characters are really interesting.
And considering all that went down at Terminus, Carol shooting Lizzie, Carl shooting his mom, "tainted meat", Sophia being in the barn, the Governor's heads and daughter, Andrea's death, Glen under the dumpster, Herschel, Beth, Andrea and Carl's eye, I find all this whining and moaning about this episode insane.
Anyone with a passing familiarity with this show knew this was coming. Negan told them what he was going to do, for the last 5 or so month people have been anticipating who has going to "meet Lucille". When Lucille is a barb-wire wrapped baseball bat, you know it's going to be brutal. Also, the wounds perfectly matched the comic book, so it's not like there was no warning.
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Seriously to all you Ned Flanders types out there, do you not know what this show is about? And to think, some of these people let their little kids watch it then complained about the content? Even my wife wouldn't watch this episode.
Parents that stupid will always howl and squeal and blame others while seeking to censor what they disapprove of. Screw em. The show is not for children. And not even for some adults. Different strokes.
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Seriously to all you Ned Flanders types out there, do you not know what this show is about?
Ned Flanders types. Wow. Don't people have every right to criticize a TV show they find terrible and disgusting? Or should we modify the first amendment to make those horrible Ned Flanders types shut up? How dare they have an opinion! How dare they!
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Parents that stupid will always howl and squeal and blame others while seeking to censor what they disapprove of. Screw em. The show is not for children. And not even for some adults. Different strokes.
Not liking a show is not a crime.
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Not liking a show is not a crime.
To me....not taking responsibility for what your little kids watch on tv borders on child abuse and/or criminal. Some parents use the tv as a free babysitter. So yeah....it can be.
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Ned Flanders types. Wow. Don't people have every right to criticize a TV show they find terrible and disgusting? Or should we modify the first amendment to make those horrible Ned Flanders types shut up? How dare they have an opinion! How dare they!
Who, exactly, is forcing them to watch the show?
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Who, exactly, is forcing them to watch the show?
Nobody is forced to watch, just like child porn. That doesn't make it okay.
Guess what, even people who do not like the show, and don't watch, are still allowed to have an opinion.
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@geronl
Direct quote from the article:
The PTC is, in effect, saying that The Walking Dead has gone too far, and positioning itself as a suitable arbiter for deciding what else is or isn't appropriate.
Not saying you can't express your opinion, this isn't about is this a good show or not, it's more about does/should this self-appointed group have the ability to tell others that since this show violates their sensibilities, it shouldn't be on the air?
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Nobody is forced to watch, just like child porn. That doesn't make it okay.
Guess what, even people who do not like the show, and don't watch, are still allowed to have an opinion.
I have no problem with people that have an opinion. What I have a problem with....as illustrated in my first post in this thread....is parents that allow their small/young children to watch shows like The Walking Dead....and then bitch about it. Parents that take NO responsibility whatsoever is what I have a problem with. How did you miss that?
There's a ton of shows that I don't like, don't approve of and wouldn't let MY young kids watch, if I still had young kids around the house. I just simply say "no" to the remote when it tries to force me to watch that crap....lol.
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@geronl
The PTC is, in effect, saying that The Walking Dead has gone too far, and positioning itself as a suitable arbiter for deciding what else is or isn't appropriate.
Just like those of us who oppose Trump on moral grounds are accused of being 'Ned Flanders types' positioning ourselves as the arbiter for what is and is not appropriate, I guess.
I have every right to say a TV show is perverted and immoral if I think it is. I'm not going to apologize for having standards of decency.
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Just like those of us who oppose Trump on moral grounds are accused of being 'Ned Flanders types' positioning ourselves as the arbiter for what is and is not appropriate, I guess.
I have every right to say a TV show is perverted and immoral if I think it is. I'm not going to apologize for having standards of decency.
I'm confused. Are you trying to equate child porn with a zombie apocalypse show like The Walking Dead? There's a serious disconnect here, if so.
Nobody is forced to watch, just like child porn.
Bottom line....if you have young kids, don't allow them to watch it. Keep your opinion. Nobody is saying otherwise. Just don't try to dictate to others what they can or can't, should or shouldn't, watch. JS....
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Yeah, but I'm not saying Trump shouldn't be allowed to talk, just that he's a slug.
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Just don't try to dictate to others what they can or can't, should or shouldn't, watch. JS....
I have a right to share my opinion and I will. "I watched an episode and didn't like it" was the only thing I was going to post until I saw all the hate and filth sent towards those of us with standards.
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Those who can't or won't govern themselves but want limited government are worrisome
Are you claiming someone who is entertained by apocalypse sci-fi is incapable of governing themselves? Really?
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Those who can't or won't govern themselves but want limited government are worrisome
What?
I would rather have those than baby momma gov't dependent types with 8 kids who want big gov't entitlements to help them in every aspect of their lives.
If someone wants to be a bum and live on the street let em...why should multiple gov't agencies be created to help them? (other than truly mentally ill or physically disabled-those should be helped).
My philosophy is if you screwed up your life(can't govern yourself) and won't make changes to improve your ;lot in life .. heck with ya.
@geronl
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You sure are full of yourself, aren't you, @sneakypete ?
Just for the record, though, your calling me a "church lady" makes me fall to the floor in gales of laughter. It's funny for me to imagine you at your keyboard thinking you're leveling a great insult, and knowing it's really just dopey.
I will always be thankful that Hollywood produced absolutely great pictures in the 30's, with great stars, great acting, and completely watchable from beginning to end.
The self-censorship Hollywood did hasn't hurt you a bit. There's been all kinds of garbage made since they dropped the code that I'm sure titillates you, so you have your entertainment.
But for those of us who prefer plot to porn, I'm glad there was a time when good movies were actually produced without gratuitous nonsense to please the less mature among us.
Here's to romance! Here's to orchestras out in the forest and Mounties bursting into song! Here's to Hollywood's GOLDEN AGE!! ^-^
It's been downhill ever since.
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And neither do I until the homos and transgenders tell me I must cater to their marriages, tell my church that they must open their restrooms to them and perform their wedding services, or that they can have sex in public, while that I can't disagree publicly with their morality. <<
@Free Vulcan
I'm with ya on that stuff,and I suspect almost everybody else is,also.
>>Or push their crap on little elementary kids in school, tell kids they can be different genders or gay,<<
Some kids ARE homosexual at birth. They have no choice but to deal with it,and neither do you. They have just as many rights and freedoms as the rest of us. Deal with it.
>>or have 14 y/o minor girls get abortions without parental consent. Or try to excuse pedophelia,<<
A 14 year old is a child,and NOBODY has a right to do non-emergency surgery on a 14 year old without parental permission. Period.
>>Then it becomes our business. Then it's over the line and in your face, and that's what liberals do. <<
First off,they aren't liberal in any sense of the word. Secondly,as for the "in your/my face" aspect,they also have a right to do that just like you have a right to tell them Jesus will hate them because they are homos. You have a right to hate/resent it,and so do I,but what neither of us has is a RIGHT to interfere with their rights as American citizens. Freedom of speech is a two-way street.
>>They aren't libertarians, they are theocrats, and they will never ever ever ever ever ever ever stop until everyone agrees with them, has their beliefs, and lives exactly how they're told.<<
This is getting confusing,here. Who are you talking about now,the fascist left or the fascist religious types?
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@mirraflake
My ex-best friend was a totally goody-two-shoes all her life. Then last year, she up and divorces her husband, screws him out of some cash and then uses that money to go to Albania and marry some guy she met online who can't come here because he can't get a passport and he's not allowed into America anyway, apparently "He's on some kind of list or something"
I've seen it a million times..absolutely shocking stories.. men and women I would never suspect.
@chae
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And that might have worked well if liberals had left abortion as a states rights thing. <<
Huh? When did that legally change?
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and now you back a man who says his own daughter is a "nice piece of @$$"
check mate
@geronl l
Out of all the nonsense that both Bubbette! and Donald Little Hands have regurgitated over the last several months,you are fixated on THAT?
HOW does that relate to protecting and preserving the US Constitution,protecting our borders,rebuilding our economy,eliminating bullshit laws that do nothing but empower government,etc,etc,etc?
I personally don't give a damn if he pimps her out so long as he does his job as president to do the things above.
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You sure are full of yourself, aren't you, @sneakypete ?
Just for the record, though, your calling me a "church lady" makes me fall to the floor in gales of laughter. It's funny for me to imagine you at your keyboard thinking you're leveling a great insult, and knowing it's really just dopey.
I will always be thankful that Hollywood produced absolutely great pictures in the 30's, with great stars, great acting, and completely watchable from beginning to end.
The self-censorship Hollywood did hasn't hurt you a bit. There's been all kinds of garbage made since they dropped the code that I'm sure titillates you, so you have your entertainment.
But for those of us who prefer plot to porn, I'm glad there was a time when good movies were actually produced without gratuitous nonsense to please the less mature among us.
Here's to romance! Here's to orchestras out in the forest and Mounties bursting into song! Here's to Hollywood's GOLDEN AGE!! ^-^
It's been downhill ever since.
I watched "Summer Stock" on TCM several months back..mainly to see the tractor Judy Garland bought ( I have one). I will be man enough to say I thought the movie was good and will watch it again...though I am a big fan of TCM anyway but also like my hedonistic movies lol.
My favorite list
Mr Blandings Builds His Dream House
Best Years of our Lives
Anything campy 50's sci fi
@musiclady
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Just like those of us who oppose Trump on moral grounds are accused of being 'Ned Flanders types' positioning ourselves as the arbiter for what is and is not appropriate, I guess.
I have every right to say a TV show is perverted and immoral if I think it is. I'm not going to apologize for having standards of decency.
@geronl
Probably not,but you SHOULD apologize for setting yourself up as the arbitrator of what other adults "should be allowed to watch and enjoy".
The Ned Flanders tag is on the SPOT appropriate for the Bible Thumpers who think they are more moral than everyone else,and that THEY should be the ones to tell us what can should and what we should not enjoy. Don't even THINK about trying to claim you wouldn't make it illegal for anyone to do if you had the power because nobody is going to believe you. You have already spent too much time bitching about it.
If the cross fits,bear it.
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I'm confused. Are you trying to equate child porn with a zombie apocalypse show like The Walking Dead? There's a serious disconnect here, if so.
Bottom line....if you have young kids, don't allow them to watch it. Keep your opinion. Nobody is saying otherwise. Just don't try to dictate to others what they can or can't, should or shouldn't, watch. JS....
@XenaLee
BUT....,BUT...,BUT....,DEYS A-SINNIN'! A-SINNIN',AH TELLS YA!
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I have a right to share my opinion and I will. "I watched an episode and didn't like it" was the only thing I was going to post until I saw all the hate and filth sent towards those of us with standards.
@geronl
No,you started getting back what you were putting out and then claiming your "standards" are higher than ours because we watch a tv show you don't approve of.
You ARE Ned Flanders. If you were a female,you would be Mrs.Grundy of Robert Heinlein fame. You probably don't approve of Heinlein,either. Your loss,not ours.
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@geronl
No,you started getting back what you were putting out and then claiming your "standards" are higher than ours because we watch a tv show you don't approve of.
Different standards or maybe some lack them completely. I don't care what shows you watch.
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The thing that cracks me up is that in one episode who had a guy get his leg cut off and these bad guys roasted and ate it while telling him that they were going to do the same to his girlfriend, but that's ok. Heck the whole Terminus thing where they made people kneel in front of a trough and then they bashed their heads in and butchered them like hogs, that's cool, but now this is too far? Really?
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You sure are full of yourself, aren't you, @sneakypete ?<<
No,I'm just rational and I live in this century. I can see why that would confuse you.
>>Just for the record, though, your calling me a "church lady" makes me fall to the floor in gales of laughter. It's funny for me to imagine you at your keyboard thinking you're leveling a great insult, and knowing it's really just dopey.<<
It was intended as an accurate description,not an insult. If being identified as a Church Lady offends you,I apologize.
Then again,if YOU consider it to be an insult,maybe you should loosen up a little?
>>I will always be thankful that Hollywood produced absolutely great pictures in the 30's, with great stars, great acting, and completely watchable from beginning to end.<<
And I will always be grateful nobody can force me to watch those snoozers. I did like the Marx Brothers movies,though. They were also out in the 30's,but I doubt you would admit to enjoying them.
>>The self-censorship Hollywood did hasn't hurt you a bit. There's been all kinds of garbage made since they dropped the code that I'm sure titillates you, so you have your entertainment.<<
Ahhh,the passive-aggressive attack! Insult by implication so you can pretend you didn't do it. VERY smooth!
>>But for those of us who prefer plot to porn, I'm glad there was a time when good movies were actually produced without gratuitous nonsense to please the less mature among us.<<
There is somebody out there that is nekkid and doing "it" RIGHT NOW,and they might even live on the same block as you!
>>Here's to romance! Here's to orchestras out in the forest and Mounties bursting into song! Here's to Hollywood's GOLDEN AGE!! ^-^<<
If it makes you happy to watch it,I am happy for you. Where you cross the line is wishing the rest of us were sentenced to watch it also.
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I watched "Summer Stock" on TCM several months back..mainly to see the tractor Judy Garland bought ( I have one). I will be man enough to say I thought the movie was good and will watch it again...though I am a big fan of TCM anyway but also like my hedonistic movies lol.
My favorite list
Mr Blandings Builds His Dream House
Best Years of our Lives
Anything campy 50's sci fi
@musiclady
Do you like the movie "THEM!" about the mutant ants, starring James Arness?? I LOVE that one!
And I also love Vincent Price in "House of Wax."
They don't make 'em like that any more! ^-^
I'm also a Frank Capra fan. They made fun of his corny movies even back when he made them, but "Mr Smith Goes to Washington" is still a classic that accurately describes what was going on in DC then, and still is today.
(Where's Jimmy Stewart when you need him, anyway?? :laugh: )
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I've seen it a million times..absolutely shocking stories.. men and women I would never suspect.
@chae
“He has all the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire." -Winston Churchill.
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I hate the way you put your responses inside other posts, pete. Could you do it like everyone else some time??
First, I am NOT "offended" by your stupid use of Church Lady. I am amused that you actually think it has meaning. I mean you're bright. Why post meaningless things that make your 'victims' laugh at you?
As for "sentencing" you.......that's another meaningless, stupid comment. I never said you didn't have the right to watch garbage. Go ahead. Fill your brain with whatever nastiness makes you feel good.
I'm just stating clearly, that if Hollywood hadn't self-censored, some of the greatest movies and greatest acting in history wouldn't exist, so I'm glad they had the SENSE to stop making dopey "sophisticated" movies in the early 30's and started making REAL films.
Enjoy whatever you want. Just don't reduce yourself to calling people names whose tastes are more developed that your own.
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I hate the way you put your responses inside other posts, pete. Could you do it like everyone else some time??
@sneakypete
@musiclady
I agree with music lady re the formatting of your posts. This place is hard enough to navigate without someone throwing a wrench in it.
(For as awful as TOS has become, I will always give them massive kudos for navigability. How I miss being able to follow a conversation between people and omit all the other posts on the thread.)
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@sneakypete
@musiclady
I agree with music lady re the formatting of your posts. This place is hard enough to navigate without someone throwing a wrench in it.
(For as awful as TOS has become, I will always give them massive kudos for navigability. How I miss being able to follow a conversation between people and omit all the other posts on the thread.)
I think pete likes to throw wrenches in things, just for the heck of it. ^-^
As for the navigation stuff, I agree. But it's SO much better here where there is free thought, free speech, and an absence of that stupid Trump echo chamber there, that it's worth a little more effort to find things.
The "mentions" that was added not long ago, helps, but most folks don't do it. And I only do if my response is long enough after the original post.
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@sneakypete
@musiclady
I agree with music lady re the formatting of your posts. This place is hard enough to navigate without someone throwing a wrench in it.
(For as awful as TOS has become, I will always give them massive kudos for navigability. How I miss being able to follow a conversation between people and omit all the other posts on the thread.)
@musiclady @AllThatJazzZ
I really don't get it. I snip off the part I am quoting and reply directly below that in bold so there is a clear difference between what I am quoting and what I am writing. I honestly don't see how this causes any confusion. In fact,I do it to make it less confusing. If it's daylight hours I am usually out in my shop working on one of my cars and trucks,and come in the house to take a break and think about what I am doing and try to figure out a better way to do it. While doing this I am usually posting here and having what I am replying to directly above what I am writing makes it simpler for me to keep focused.
If it's after dark,I am usually watching tv at the same time and posting during commercials or when something is on I don't care much about.
When I am making one reply to a post I do it the traditional way,but to ME it makes sense to segment the original post and reply to each segment when trying to make different points.
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@musiclady @AllThatJazzZ
I really don't get it. I snip off the part I am quoting and reply directly below that in bold so there is a clear difference between what I am quoting and what I am writing. I honestly don't see how this causes any confusion. In fact,I do it to make it less confusing. If it's daylight hours I am usually out in my shop working on one of my cars and trucks,and come in the house to take a break and think about what I am doing and try to figure out a better way to do it. While doing this I am usually posting here and having what I am replying to directly above what I am writing makes it simpler for me to keep focused.
If it's after dark,I am usually watching tv at the same time and posting during commercials or when something is on I don't care much about.
When I am making one reply to a post I do it the traditional way,but to ME it makes sense to segment the original post and reply to each segment when trying to make different points.
The problem is when we quote you, there's nothing there....... it's blank. It makes it harder to respond to, not harder to read. I have to go back and find your original post to make sure I'm not misquoting you, rather than seeing it in the quote.
It's not that big a deal, but it causes confusion for people responding to you and wanting to be accurate.
That was my only point.
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I have a right to share my opinion and I will. "I watched an episode and didn't like it" was the only thing I was going to post until I saw all the hate and filth sent towards those of us with standards.
The problem many of us have isn't towards people who don't like the show or things like it, but what I called "Ned Flanders" types I referred to earlier. Those are the ones who try to get the government to force their will. It is in reference to a Simpson's character who in several episodes, was a big government activist watching every single TV show and complaining to the government about every bad word or anything he objected to in order to get them taken off the air. In another episode, he was put in charge of the city's CCTV system and watched and tried to correct every single person's bad behavior. Basically a SJW.
Using the government in that way is what we find offensive, not someone who has personal standards what they watch.
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Just like those of us who oppose Trump on moral grounds are accused of being 'Ned Flanders types' ...
Darn, I thought we'd get through an entire thread without an unnecessary mention of Trump.
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Just like those of us who oppose Trump on moral grounds are accused of being 'Ned Flanders types' ...
No, as I stated above re my reference to Ned Flanders, that isn't about having morals, it is about using the hammer of government to force every single minutia of your personal standards on everyone else.
Something I know you oppose. You aren't a Ned Flanders type.
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The problem is when we quote you, there's nothing there....... it's blank. It makes it harder to respond to, not harder to read. I have to go back and find your original post to make sure I'm not misquoting you, rather than seeing it in the quote.
It's not that big a deal, but it causes confusion for people responding to you and wanting to be accurate.
That was my only point.
Ok,sorry. I didn't realize that was happening. I try to remember to not do it again.
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I have no idea who Ned Flanders may be. Perhaps I should spend more time glued to the TV screen.
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I have no idea who Ned Flanders may be. Perhaps I should spend more time glued to the TV screen.
I had to look him up. He's a cartoon, but he's apparently designed to make Christians look bad. :shrug:
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I had to look him up. He's a cartoon, but he's apparently designed to make Christians look bad. :shrug:
A lot of people find it funny, but the Simpsons have not been the greatest influence on society....
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A lot of people find it funny, but the Simpsons have not been the greatest influence on society....
I think that's the goal. Entertainment doesn't reflect society. It drives it.
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A lot of people find it funny, but the Simpsons have not been the greatest influence on society....
They aren't an influence, they are a reflection of what society is. Just like much of Shakespeare, when really read, is a crude parody of the times (not that I'm comparing the Simpsons to Shakespeare in the sense of importance or quality). Much of Mark Twain's writing, along with Ben Franklin under his many pseudonyms served the same purpose. All three of those examples, for their times, were considered by many crude or offensive.
Some current shows like The Simpsons and South Park, as two examples, often reflect what is happening in society, whether we like it or not, and they can be more than entertainment but should get us to think about what we are becoming.
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I have no idea who Ned Flanders may be. Perhaps I should spend more time glued to the TV screen.
http://www.simpsonsworld.com/video/250523203904
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They aren't an influence, they are a reflection of what society is. Just like much of Shakespeare, when really read, is a crude parody of the times (not that I'm comparing the Simpsons to Shakespeare in the sense of importance or quality). Much of Mark Twain's writing, along with Ben Franklin under his many pseudonyms served the same purpose. All three of those examples, for their times, were considered by many crude or offensive.
Some current shows like The Simpsons and South Park, as two examples, often reflect what is happening in society, whether we like it or not, and they can be more than entertainment but should get us to think about what we are becoming.
I completely disagree. Children who watch TV a lot (which is most kids) grow up thinking that deviancy is normal and that Christians are stupid.
TV and movies have contributed to the degradation of morals in this culture, and are not just a reflection of what already exists.
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I have a right to share my opinion and I will. "I watched an episode and didn't like it" was the only thing I was going to post until I saw all the hate and filth sent towards those of us with standards.
Well....and there it is.
I happen to like the show, despite the blood and gore, which I look past and try my best to ignore. I love the cast and the writing and the survival theme.
That said....I don't consider the show to be ok for children to view. The original reason I posted is because I'm FTFU with parents that don't bother to monitor (or care) what their precious spawn is doing or watching....and then only AFTER they find out do they screech for censorship. Who the hell are 'they' to decide what I can or can not watch???
Bottom line, I'm against censorship. These same types that would eliminate The Walking Dead from television viewing would no doubt then go on to censor other shows they didn't 'like'. What's next? Book burning? It's all the same brand of idiotic fascism. And I don't take kindly or well these days.... to aholes trying to dictate to me....
about ANY thing.
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I had to look him up. He's a cartoon, but he's apparently designed to make Christians look bad. :shrug:
@musiclady
Then you were looking in the wrong places. Ned's goal was to be an actual Christian neighbor to play off on Homer and Bart. The whole good/devout versus the bad (not really evil,just stupid and lazy) slacker. He provides contrast between two wildly different characters
Ned is a cartoon Pat Boone. Squeaky clean and devout,but he is not a fire and damnation Christian. He tries to convince people to "see the light" instead of beating on them with a flaming sword and Bible.
More of an earnest dweeb than a bad guy.
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They aren't an influence, they are a reflection of what society is. Just like much of Shakespeare, when really read, is a crude parody of the times (not that I'm comparing the Simpsons to Shakespeare in the sense of importance or quality). Much of Mark Twain's writing, along with Ben Franklin under his many pseudonyms served the same purpose. All three of those examples, for their times, were considered by many crude or offensive.
Some current shows like The Simpsons and South Park, as two examples, often reflect what is happening in society, whether we like it or not, and they can be more than entertainment but should get us to think about what we are becoming.
BINGO! All in the Family was an early example. Normal Lear wrote it to highlight what idiots Americans with traditional values are and the danger to society. Archie was supposed to have been a villain,but ended up being one of the most popular characters in TV history. Lear was lucky enough to have struck a gold mine while mining for tin. He was also smart enough and greedy enough (how ironic was THAT?) to take the ball and run with it,and even wrote a couple of spin-offs after the original show ended. It's a damn shame he ever pocketed a dollar from it. If he had any self-respect,he would have given the money to charity. Nobody is quite so pompous as a multi-millionaire producer who beats up on all his employees when it comes to wages to maximize his profits,while preaching that money is evil.
Same thing with Caroll O'Connor,a rabid kneejerk leftie in his private life.
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I completely disagree. Children who watch TV a lot (which is most kids) grow up thinking that deviancy is normal and that Christians are stupid.
@musiclady
Only because they are children and don't understand the word "delusional" yet.
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@XenaLee
Bottom line, I'm against censorship. These same types that would eliminate The Walking Dead from television viewing would no doubt then go on to censor other shows they didn't 'like'. What's next? Book burning? It's all the same brand of idiotic fascism.
Yes,and it hasn't been that long ago actual books and musical records were being burned in public,and the Thumpers were screaming for the government to pass laws to outlaw books they didn't like,and to ban rock and roll music because it was "de music ob de debbil!"
I remember seeing this on the tv news and reading it in the papers as it was actually happening.
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I had to look him up. He's a cartoon, but he's apparently designed to make Christians look bad. :shrug:
Actually, when you get down to it, he doesn't make Christians look bad. Yes, he is Mr. Censorship (he was worse earlier in the show's life) but when you get down to his character, he is the one trustworthy, honest, and decent guy there. He is Homer's best friend. The show basically shows several extremes, not middle of the road, so it will show the extreme of someone who is churchy (for lack of a better term) but it also shows him without any real vice to honestly tries to do right.
It is like the Jesus character in South Park. Many were very offended they had Jesus on the show, but they never insulted him. He was a very likable character and kind of sad because they made a point he didn't have friends (many at least), but he is always the one who saved the day when he was in an episode.
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Yes,and it hasn't been that long ago actual books and musical records were being burned in public,and the Thumpers were screaming for the government to pass laws to outlaw books they didn't like,and to ban rock and roll music because it was "de music ob de debbil!"
I remember seeing this on the tv news and reading it in the papers as it was actually happening.
The Moral Majority along with Tipper Gore and her cabal of anti-rock harpies...didn't say anything about NWA or "Sexual healing" by Marvin Gaye...nope.
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Yes,and it hasn't been that long ago actual books and musical records were being burned in public,and the Thumpers were screaming for the government to pass laws to outlaw books they didn't like,and to ban rock and roll music because it was "de music ob de debbil!"
I remember seeing this on the tv news and reading it in the papers as it was actually happening.
One of my favorite classic SciFi flicks is Fahrenheit 451. It's scary just how much more possible that scenario seems now than it did back then.
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The Moral Majority along with Tipper Gore and her cabal of anti-rock harpies...didn't say anything about NWA or "Sexual healing" by Marvin Gaye...nope.
@SZonian
I had forgotten about that whore Tipsy and her alleged "Moral Crusade".
What I remember seeing and hearing as a kid were the book and record burnings by fundie preachers,and their demands that Elvis,Jerry Lee Lewis,and the others be banned from the air waves because they were playing "devil music". They were doing all this in "The name of GAWD!",just like if there really was a God he would have to have idiots like that do it for him because he wasn't able to do it himself.
Truth to tell,it was all in the name of "donations" to the preachers Cadillac Fund.
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One of my favorite classic SciFi flicks is Fahrenheit 451. It's scary just how much more possible that scenario seems now than it did back then.
@XenaLee
True. People are basically sheep,looking for a sheepherder to lead the way for them and tell them what to do. All it takes is someone with a ton of charisma and no morals at all. Bubba Bill would have been the most successful preacher in the US if he hadn't gone into politics.
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Gratuitous
Beloved characters die on the show all the time but there seemed to be particular joy taken by writers in making these 2 deaths as gruesome as possible.
The execution of Lizzy was some pretty extreme television but there was an understandable reason behind it and they didn't actually show it.
I guess for me, sometimes leaving more to imagination is far better viewing.
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Gratuitous
Beloved characters die on the show all the time but there seemed to be particular joy taken by writers in making these 2 deaths as gruesome as possible.
The execution of Lizzy was some pretty extreme television but there was an understandable reason behind it and they didn't actually show it.
I guess for me, sometimes leaving more to imagination is far better viewing.
I had a coworker describing one while I was eating lunch. I told him I had heard enough. He kept on and I had to insist. Seriously, I've heard enough. (I don't watch the show.)
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Actually, when you get down to it, he doesn't make Christians look bad. Yes, he is Mr. Censorship (he was worse earlier in the show's life) but when you get down to his character, he is the one trustworthy, honest, and decent guy there. He is Homer's best friend. The show basically shows several extremes, not middle of the road, so it will show the extreme of someone who is churchy (for lack of a better term) but it also shows him without any real vice to honestly tries to do right.
It is like the Jesus character in South Park. Many were very offended they had Jesus on the show, but they never insulted him. He was a very likable character and kind of sad because they made a point he didn't have friends (many at least), but he is always the one who saved the day when he was in an episode.
Well, I'll take your word for it @AbaraXas, since I don't watch the show, and I just based what I said on what was in wiki.......... and they're not entirely reliable.
Actually, the last cartoon I watched regularly was Animaniacs with my teenaged kids back in the late 90's. Spielberg........ VERY funny.
FWIW, I was raising kids during the 80's and 90's when TV and movies lost control of themselves. The difference between the language and behavior of small children between the mid 80's and mid 90's was remarkable.
When our oldest was in pre-school, not a kid used foul language. By the time our youngest started pre-school, 4 and 5 year olds used the "f" word and the "s" word with regularity.
They weren't the influencers. They were the influenced. Entertainment debased culture. Without a doubt. I watched it happen. With horror.
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That is IT! (what he said) I have enough horror in my own life to go looking for more. I understand the need for people to be desensitized, for the corruption of their being. It isn't for me.
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Well....and there it is.
I happen to like the show, despite the blood and gore, which I look past and try my best to ignore. I love the cast and the writing and the survival theme.
That said....I don't consider the show to be ok for children to view. The original reason I posted is because I'm FTFU with parents that don't bother to monitor (or care) what their precious spawn is doing or watching....and then only AFTER they find out do they screech for censorship. Who the hell are 'they' to decide what I can or can not watch???
Bottom line, I'm against censorship. These same types that would eliminate The Walking Dead from television viewing would no doubt then go on to censor other shows they didn't 'like'. What's next? Book burning? It's all the same brand of idiotic fascism. And I don't take kindly or well these days.... to aholes trying to dictate to me....
about ANY thing.
I've got to object to this statement strongly.
You assume that parents are with their children every minute of every day. Not so.
Kids can be at a neighbor's house, have a baby sitter, or be changing the channel when you're in another room.
Attacking parents who don't want horror on the screen because they're not being good parents is a faulty. Unless you expect parents to be with their children 24/7 and never leave the house, you can't make the blanket condemnation you're making.
And, IMO, attacking parents who want disgusting material off the air by calling it censorship is also not fair. I think it's important for people who care about culture rot to continue to speak up.
Unless you want to censor us???
I agree with you on most things @XenaLee , but I take strong exception on this one.
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The shows? No problem, they're scheduled, set the parentals, no sweat.
It's the commercials that ooze out into the kiddee hours and could be toned down. The adults know what the shows are about, graphic demonstrations need not be splattered in with the ads for breakfast cereals.
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In some respects I see your point. Abortion ain't gonna matter if people don't have jobs and can't eat, which is where we are headed if we don't get things like the debt under control fast.
And that might have worked well if liberals had left abortion as a states rights thing. Or at least compromised, left it to science and cut it off at provable viability. Now they're cool with infanticide and aborting a baby as it's being born, and even after.
They're cool with that because it's just a stepping stone to population control and forced abortion, meaning once again they are up in your face, because they never ever stop.
It isn't just population control, not just killing, it's who they kill.
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It isn't just population control, not just killing, it's who they kill.
True dat Joe.
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To me....not taking responsibility for what your little kids watch on tv borders on child abuse and/or criminal. Some parents use the tv as a free babysitter. So yeah....it can be.
I fully agree. For us adults, watching the show is a matter of choice. We know when the show comes on, we can herd the kiddies off to bed. No problem.
What I would like is for the commercials to be toned down, because we can't predict when those will be on, and they are often as graphic as the show.
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The problem many of us have isn't towards people who don't like the show or things like it, but what I called "Ned Flanders" types I referred to earlier. Those are the ones who try to get the government to force their will. It is in reference to a Simpson's character who in several episodes, was a big government activist watching every single TV show and complaining to the government about every bad word or anything he objected to in order to get them taken off the air. In another episode, he was put in charge of the city's CCTV system and watched and tried to correct every single person's bad behavior. Basically a SJW.
Using the government in that way is what we find offensive, not someone who has personal standards what they watch.
Thank you.
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I've got to object to this statement strongly.
You assume that parents are with their children every minute of every day. Not so.
Kids can be at a neighbor's house, have a baby sitter, or be changing the channel when you're in another room.
If you would read my original comment....
it was addressing this post below...which talks about parents that allow their young children to watch the show and then bitch about the content of the show.
Seriously to all you Ned Flanders types out there, do you not know what this show is about? And to think, some of these people let their little kids watch it then complained about the content? Even my wife wouldn't watch this episode.
And I hate to break this to you....but....
if your kid is unsupervised at a neighbor's house, the last thing you should probably be worrying about is them watching a show like The Walking Dead. They're much more likely to be pulling up hard-core porn on the pc or watching the Playboy Channel and/or an HBO semi-porn show....all while getting into the liquor cabinet or possibly even worse (drugs stash/medicine cabinet). That's unsupervised kids for ya.
Also, the show comes on at 8 pm in the evening. If you don't have control of your kids at that time of night, how is that my problem? Why should I be penalized via less viewing options because 'some' parents can't or won't control what their kids watch?
Attacking parents who don't want horror on the screen because they're not being good parents is a faulty. Unless you expect parents to be with their children 24/7 and never leave the house, you can't make the blanket condemnation you're making.
Again, go back to my original comment and what it was addressing.
And, IMO, attacking parents who want disgusting material off the air by calling it censorship is also not fair. I think it's important for people who care about culture rot to continue to speak up.
Oh, it's not only fair, it's accurate. It's spot on. That's why they invented a little thing called 'parental controls' on TVs now.
Unless you want to censor us???
Seriously??? What part of my next paragraph did you apparently miss? Starts with this sentence....
Bottom line, I'm against censorship.....
Bottom line.....fascism is fascism. I'm getting the idea from your comments that you would be ok with this group dictating what shows can or can not be shown on tv. So fascism is ok with you ...as long as it's "your" brand of fascism. Have I got that right? And where would your brand of fascism end? We know where and how it begins. But do you have any idea or clue where it ends? (Hint: it doesn't end....it just goes on and on and on until everything is deemed "offensive" and is summarily banned.)
I agree with you on most things @XenaLee , but I take strong exception on this one.
That's ok. We don't have to agree on everything. I certainly don't mind that you take exception.
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if your kid is unsupervised at a neighbor's house, the last thing you should probably be worrying about is them watching a show like The Walking Dead. They're much more likely to be pulling up hard-core porn on the pc or watching the Playboy Channel and/or an HBO semi-porn show....all while getting into the liquor cabinet or possibly even worse (drugs stash/medicine cabinet). That's unsupervised kids for ya.
LOL. Geez. You must live in a rough neighborhood if the kids are doing what I do on an average Friday night.
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I've got to object to this statement strongly.
You assume that parents are with their children every minute of every day. Not so.
Kids can be at a neighbor's house, have a baby sitter, or be changing the channel when you're in another room.
Attacking parents who don't want horror on the screen because they're not being good parents is a faulty. Unless you expect parents to be with their children 24/7 and never leave the house, you can't make the blanket condemnation you're making.
And, IMO, attacking parents who want disgusting material off the air by calling it censorship is also not fair. I think it's important for people who care about culture rot to continue to speak up.
Unless you want to censor us???
I agree with you on most things @XenaLee , but I take strong exception on this one.
Although protecting children from violence and smut isn't a problem I have, I do have family and friends who are desperately trying to do everything possible to do just that. It's really just impossible unless you can be with every kid at every moment of every day. (I'm sure their friends will be thrilled that the kid's parent comes along with the kid on an overnight stay!) Staying vigilant in an attempt to shield your kids leaves you with no life of your own.
I'm geared toward wholesome programming, so I don't see any of this stuff, but I have had friends and co-workers who have said on several occasions that they wished they hadn't seen this movie or that TV show and desperately wished they could unsee it. Just the few things I accidentally overhear are enough to provide an explanation of how society became so degraded in such a short period of time.
I really don't know how one could protect their children in this era. Even refusing to have a TV in the house would only partially protect them since TVs are ubiquitous. And of course we live in the age of computers where the creepiest of material is a click away. Don't tell me that stuff doesn't have an effect on one's soul.
I am so grateful to have grown up in the era of Dick Van Dyke, Danny Thomas, Bonanza, Sky King, Wyatt Earp, Ed Sullivan, Wagon Train, American Bandstand, etc.
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LOL. Geez. You must live in a rough neighborhood if the kids are doing what I do on an average Friday night.
You must not know how kids, even supposedly "good" kids, behave when their parents or adults are not around. Usually, their idea of having fun is doing whatever they know their parents would not approve of...lol.
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@sneakypete
I don't thump a bible nor is it as common as haters like you want us to believe.
No it wasn't juvenile. You sound no different then the anti-Christian bigots on the left. You keep poor company.
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You must not know how kids, even supposedly "good" kids, behave when their parents or adults are not around. Usually, their idea of having fun is doing whatever they know their parents would not approve of...lol.
@XenaLee
Really? Heck I musta screwed up as a kid. I was going fishing, hiking, shooting, playing video games.
My kids messed it up too. They hang around church, go to concerts, play sports, heck they even sometimes do volunteer work.
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If you would read my original comment....
it was addressing this post below...which talks about parents that allow their young children to watch the show and then bitch about the content of the show.
And I hate to break this to you....but....
if your kid is unsupervised at a neighbor's house, the last thing you should probably be worrying about is them watching a show like The Walking Dead. They're much more likely to be pulling up hard-core porn on the pc or watching the Playboy Channel and/or an HBO semi-porn show....all while getting into the liquor cabinet or possibly even worse (drugs stash/medicine cabinet). That's unsupervised kids for ya.
Also, the show comes on at 8 pm in the evening. If you don't have control of your kids at that time of night, how is that my problem? Why should I be penalized via less viewing options because 'some' parents can't or won't control what their kids watch?
Again, go back to my original comment and what it was addressing.
Oh, it's not only fair, it's accurate. It's spot on. That's why they invented a little thing called 'parental controls' on TVs now.
Seriously??? What part of my next paragraph did you apparently miss? Starts with this sentence....
Bottom line.....fascism is fascism. I'm getting the idea from your comments that you would be ok with this group dictating what shows can or can not be shown on tv. So fascism is ok with you ...as long as it's "your" brand of fascism. Have I got that right? And where would your brand of fascism end? We know where and how it begins. But do you have any idea or clue where it ends? (Hint: it doesn't end....it just goes on and on and on until everything is deemed "offensive" and is summarily banned.)
That's ok. We don't have to agree on everything. I certainly don't mind that you take exception.
I guess you didn't read the article, and reacted emotionally and defensively rather than thoughtfully, so I'll let you know what it says.....
"Last night’s season premiere of 'The Walking Dead' was one of the most graphically violent shows we’ve ever seen on television, comparable to the most violent of programs found on premium cable networks... It’s not enough to 'change the channel,' as some people like to advocate, because cable subscribers — regardless of whether they want AMC or watch its programming — are still forced to subsidize violent content. This brutally explicit show is a powerful demonstration of why families should have greater control over the TV networks they purchase from their cable and satellite providers."
The suggestion is not that the shows be "censored," but that families have to option NOT to get that particular channel from their cable package so they have more control at home, or not be forced to subsidize violence because there is no choice as to what channels and programming come into your home.
Nowhere is there mention, here or elsewhere, of parents who let their children watch the show and then "bitch about it." I imagine that most parents who don't care about what their kids watch and are irresponsible enough to think it's OK for their kids to watch this kind of horror aren't the ones complaining. So unless you have evidence that this parents group consists of very confused parents, your point is moot and your argument has no basis in fact.
All I have talked about is self-censorship. That production companies should know what is a "bridge too far" for television that comes into homes where children may be watching. The article is referring to controls over which channels are in your cable package and which aren't. I'm talking about responsible producers.
My husband and I have talked about it for years. Why are we forced to pay for hundreds of channels we never watch, and in essence, support things financially that we don't participate in, or what we strongly disapprove of?
It's a legitimate question.
And your accusing me of agreeing with fascism is just dumb.
Sorry.
@XenaLee
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You must not know how kids, even supposedly "good" kids, behave when their parents or adults are not around. Usually, their idea of having fun is doing whatever they know their parents would not approve of...lol.
Hmmm........... then why did our then 6 year old son call home and ask us to come and get him when he was at a friend's house and they were watching a Freddy Kruger movie? (He's 35 now)
What's wrong with your argument is that you are assuming that every kid is bad and every parent trying to teach their kids right from wrong is a hypocrite.
There are many, many, many parents out there who are trying to protect their children from evil, and many children who don't want to see filthy, violent or frightening things when they're away from home.
Again, an attempt to paint all of us with one black brush and not recognize that there really are people out there trying to do the right thing.......... even kids.
btw, the argument you're using has been used by many who are trying to excuse Donald Trump's abuse of women. That's just the way men are. Doesn't cut it either way.
@XenaLee
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@sneakypete
I don't thump a bible nor is it as common as haters like you want us to believe.
No it wasn't juvenile. You sound no different then the anti-Christian bigots on the left. You keep poor company.
@driftdiver
Blah,blah,blah. Organized religion is the original form of communism,so you might want to back off on those "leftist" smears,comrade.
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I guess you didn't read the article, and reacted emotionally and defensively rather than thoughtfully, so I'll let you know what it says.....
The suggestion is not that the shows be "censored," but that families have to option NOT to get that particular channel from their cable package so they have more control at home, or not be forced to subsidize violence because there is no choice as to what channels and programming come into your home.
@musiclady
The flip side of that is those of us who aren't superstitious are forced to subsidize religious programming despite our desire to be free of communism. Deal with it and quit demanding you have a right to control what the rest of us view and hear.
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Hmmm........... then why did our then 6 year old son call home and ask us to come and get him when he was at a friend's house and they were watching a Freddy Kruger movie? (He's 35 now)
What's wrong with your argument is that you are assuming that every kid is bad and every parent trying to teach their kids right from wrong is a hypocrite.
There are many, many, many parents out there who are trying to protect their children from evil, and many children who don't want to see filthy, violent or frightening things when they're away from home.
Again, an attempt to paint all of us with one black brush and not recognize that there really are people out there trying to do the right thing.......... even kids.
btw, the argument you're using has been used by many who are trying to excuse Donald Trump's abuse of women. That's just the way men are. Doesn't cut it either way.
@XenaLee
@musiclady @XenaLee
I presume you did NOT allow them to view the Holy Bible if you were serious about keeping them away from " filthy, violent or frightening things"? I don't recall any of the leaders on The Walking Dead telling their followers to grab babies by their ankles and bash their brains out against the stone walls,and according to your "Owners Manual" your God told his soldiers to do just that in order to wipe out an "un-Godly" people. This is called "genocide" today even thought it was called "Doing God's will" back in the "good old days" when God ran everything.
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@driftdiver
Blah,blah,blah. Organized religion is the original form of communism,so you might want to back off on those "leftist" smears,comrade.
In my evangelical upbringing, I remember alot of community, but not communism. We were all hard core conservative capitalist entrepreneur types. Lots of farmers and small businessmen in our church.
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You must not know how kids, even supposedly "good" kids, behave when their parents or adults are not around. Usually, their idea of having fun is doing whatever they know their parents would not approve of...lol.
Spot on @XenaLee
I grew up in a 18 state -allowed to drink in bars at age 18.
All my siblings including myself went to Catholic school. My sister who is now 59 said she and her female friends would ride their bicyles to the local hot spot bar and drink there while in HS. They did not drive because the parents would check out the parking lot for their cars.
I drank at the same spot while in HS when I was 17 because I had my brothers college ID and we looked alike.
I did way worse than above btw..I was a hedonistic little thing.
MY dad was street smart..he knew what was going on but my mom was totally naive.
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In my evangelical upbringing, I remember alot of community, but not communism. We were all hard core conservative capitalist entrepreneur types. Lots of farmers and small businessmen in our church.
Farmers will never admit it,but there isn't a single group in America more tightly connected to the government tit than farmers. They get more welfare than the big city professional welfare class. They are guaranteed a profit (fixed price) on their crops before they plant them,and they are even paid to NOT plant crops or trees. They also get other perks,like not having to have license plates on the trucks they drive locally,and lower property taxes than Joe Sixpack that works a 40 hour week. Hell,every one of them I know has a side business going to have something to do and pull in more money during the months they aren't farming.
Try telling one he is on government welfare or is a communist though,and watch his head explode.
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In my evangelical upbringing, I remember alot of community, but not communism. We were all hard core conservative capitalist entrepreneur types. Lots of farmers and small businessmen in our church.
Some folks just aren't bright enough to recognize that a load willingly shared is not communism, its community and cooperation.
Communism is done through force.
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I find it funny that if folks question the wisdom of airing certain shows during prime time they get accused of wanting censorship.
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Farmers will never admit it,but there isn't a single group in America more tightly connected to the government tit than farmers. They get more welfare than the big city professional welfare class. They are guaranteed a profit (fixed price) on their crops before they plant them,and they are even paid to NOT plant crops or trees. They also get other perks,like not having to have license plates on the trucks they drive locally,and lower property taxes than Joe Sixpack that works a 40 hour week. Hell,every one of them I know has a side business going to have something to do and pull in more money during the months they aren't farming.
Try telling one he is on government welfare or is a communist though,and watch his head explode.
What subsidies? There's crop insurance and conservation programs. The subsidy is long gone. And I have no problem them paying lower property taxes on unimproved land. All trucks in my state have to have plates regardless of use.
If they were making big money at farming, they wouldn't need jobs and side businesses. They pull in other income because unless you are very large, farming today doesn't make that much.
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Some folks just aren't bright enough to recognize that a load willingly shared is not communism, its community and cooperation.
Communism is done through force.
Correct and thank you CC.
Good to see ya back.
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Farmers will never admit it,but there isn't a single group in America more tightly connected to the government tit than farmers. They get more welfare than the big city professional welfare class. They are guaranteed a profit (fixed price) on their crops before they plant them,and they are even paid to NOT plant crops or trees. They also get other perks,like not having to have license plates on the trucks they drive locally,and lower property taxes than Joe Sixpack that works a 40 hour week. Hell,every one of them I know has a side business going to have something to do and pull in more money during the months they aren't farming.
Try telling one he is on government welfare or is a communist though,and watch his head explode.
Crop subsidies are very needed. If you did not have these subsidies you would see huge swings in food prices. Paying farmers to plant or not keeps food prices stable.
That being said I agree with you.. farmers get lot's of perks. When they received their gas royalty's in my area the first $300K was income tax free if they bought farm equipment or barns etc with the money.
@sneakypete
@Free Vulcan crop subsidies are still very much in use. Our local paper prints by law every year what each farmer receives in our area.
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Some folks just aren't bright enough to recognize that a load willingly shared is not communism, its community and cooperation.
Communism is done through force.
There is no one more lacking in intelligent responses than a knee-jerk atheist.
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I find it funny that if folks question the wisdom of airing certain shows during prime time they get accused of wanting censorship.
I'm not sure, but I think it may be a defense mechanism.
The ones here screaming "censorship!" haven't thought things through. They're reacting emotionally.
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Spot on @XenaLee
I grew up in a 18 state -allowed to drink in bars at age 18.
All my siblings including myself went to Catholic school. My sister who is now 59 said she and her female friends would ride their bicyles to the local hot spot bar and drink there while in HS. They did not drive because the parents would check out the parking lot for their cars.
I drank at the same spot while in HS when I was 17 because I had my brothers college ID and we looked alike.
I did way worse than above btw..I was a hedonistic little thing.
MY dad was street smart..he knew what was going on but my mom was totally naive.
It was probably the only way she could have gotten thru your teenage years with her sanity intact. And same here. I was a total brat as a teenager. Hey.....it was my job and sworn duty, after all.....lolol. And even my mom said that compared to what the teens of today pull, I was an angel. My mom at least didn't have to worry about the drug craze.
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I guess you didn't read the article, and reacted emotionally and defensively rather than thoughtfully, so I'll let you know what it says.....
And I guess you didn't comprehend what the article concluded. That what this group wants is indeed censorship.....not "self-censorship".
In that sense, this really does become a question of censorship: The PTC is, in effect, saying that The Walking Dead has gone too far, and positioning itself as a suitable arbiter for deciding what else is or isn't appropriate. For better or for worse, that road leads to censorship, and to certain shows being deemed "unsuitable," "immoral," and, if history has taught us anything about how these things tend to go, "un-American."
The suggestion is not that the shows be "censored," but that families have to option NOT to get that particular channel from their cable package so they have more control at home, or not be forced to subsidize violence because there is no choice as to what channels and programming come into your home.
Ah....but how would that help when their little darlings are at the neighbor's house, as you previously suggested? Even IF parents could cherry-pick and choose which channels to pay for....they'd still have to worry about that. And natch, their little darlings would have more reason to want to go to the neighbors if parents could self-censor.
Nowhere is there mention, here or elsewhere, of parents who let their children watch the show and then "bitch about it." I imagine that most parents who don't care about what their kids watch and are irresponsible enough to think it's OK for their kids to watch this kind of horror aren't the ones complaining. So unless you have evidence that this parents group consists of very confused parents, your point is moot and your argument has no basis in fact.
No, I was going by and responding to what AbaraXas posted. That's still allowed here, isn't it?
It's real simple. If your kids are that 'good'....just instruct them never to watch the shows you find offensive. That'll work. Right?
All I have talked about is self-censorship. That production companies should know what is a "bridge too far" for television that comes into homes where children may be watching. The article is referring to controls over which channels are in your cable package and which aren't. I'm talking about responsible producers.
Ehhh.....with all due respect, that is not how what you posted came off. How 'else' could one interpret your comment about "wanting disgusting material off the air"? Wanting the show off the air IS, in fact, seeking censorship. It is NOT self-censorship.
And, IMO, attacking parents who want disgusting material off the air by calling it censorship is also not fair. I think it's important for people who care about culture rot to continue to speak up.
My husband and I have talked about it for years. Why are we forced to pay for hundreds of channels we never watch, and in essence, support things financially that we don't participate in, or what we strongly disapprove of?
It's a legitimate question.
Like I said previously, I disapprove of MANY shows on cable TV these days. Shows that I'm also paying for. If you don't like paying for certain shows, take it up with your cable tv provider. It's not my fault. But wanting to have a certain show that you disapprove of 'removed' from viewing is censorship, in all of its ugly glory. And yes, when you deign to make decisions for everyone else, that smacks of fascism to me.
And your accusing me of agreeing with fascism is just dumb.
Sorry.
And since you brought up and mentioned Trump, it (parents' attempted censorship and/or removal of "certain shows" from tv viewing) also smacks of something the Trump camp would do (See: zotting and censoring of any speech they deem "offensive").
btw, the argument you're using has been used by many who are trying to excuse Donald Trump's abuse of women. That's just the way men are. Doesn't cut it either way.
Again, I have a problem with anyone trying to dictate to ME what I should or shouldn't, can or can't do these days. Just sayin.....
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Some folks just aren't bright enough to recognize that a load willingly shared is not communism, its community and cooperation.
Communism is done through force.
@Cripplecreek
Uh,huh. Only bright people believe in myths like life after death and a "Big Ranger in the Sky that hears all,sees all,and takes notes".
As for Christianity not being done though force,you HAVE heard of the Catholic Church,haven't you?
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I find it funny that if folks question the wisdom of airing certain shows during prime time they get accused of wanting censorship.
@Idaho_Cowboy
What do YOU call it,"ALLOWING other people the freedom to view what they want to view"?
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@Cripplecreek
Uh,huh. Only bright people believe in myths like life after death and a "Big Ranger in the Sky that hears all,sees all,and takes notes".
As for Christianity not being done though force,you HAVE heard of the Catholic Church,haven't you?
Yes, which is sort of why the Reformation happened.
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Ah....but how would that help when their little darlings are at the neighbor's house, as you previously suggested? Even IF parents could cherry-pick and choose which channels to pay for....they'd still have to worry about that. And natch, their little darlings would have more reason to want to go to the neighbors if parents could self-censor.
No, I was going by and responding to what AbaraXas posted. That's still allowed here, isn't it?
It's real simple. If your kids are that 'good'....just instruct them never to watch the shows you find offensive. That'll work. Right?
Ehhh.....with all due respect, that is not how what you posted came off. How 'else' could one interpret your comment about "wanting disgusting material off the air"? Wanting the show off the air IS, in fact, seeking censorship. It is NOT self-censorship.
Like I said previously, I disapprove of MANY shows on cable TV these days. Shows that I'm also paying for. If you don't like paying for certain shows, take it up with your cable tv provider. It's not my fault. But wanting to have a certain show that you disapprove of 'removed' from viewing is censorship, in all of its ugly glory. And yes, when you deign to make decisions for everyone else, that smacks of fascism to me.
And since you brought up and mentioned Trump, it (parents' attempted censorship and/or removal of "certain shows" from tv viewing) also smacks of something the Trump camp would do (See: zotting and censoring of any speech they deem "offensive").
Again, I have a problem with anyone trying to dictate to ME what I should or shouldn't, can or can't do these days. Just sayin.....
And yet, you are quite comfortable with making false assumptions and putting words in my mouth that I don't think, or didn't say, as well as dictating to ME what I should say or think. If you gripe about my freedom to express myself, perhaps you shouldn't take for granted your right to express yourself. That's what this forum is all about.
I see your intense distaste for having someone say that networks should monitor themselves and not put certain shows on the air. But don't jump off the cliff and call it censorship or fascism. It makes you look like you're out of control, and not being rational.
Actually, when I read your words of excess I think maybe you're still suffering from TOS PTSD. Your responses are to people THERE who actually do want censorship, not to the people HERE who are making reasonable arguments for self-censorship and personal responsibility. The emotion and anger in your posts is not a rational response to the arguments being made here.
And you apparently don't believe there actually are good parents and good kids out there, and for that I feel sorry for you.
btw, my husband and I have taken the subject up with the cable company multiple times. I still have the right to state an opinion about it here, your protestations notwithstanding.
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What subsidies? There's crop insurance and conservation programs. The subsidy is long gone. And I have no problem them paying lower property taxes on unimproved land. All trucks in my state have to have plates regardless of use.
If they were making big money at farming, they wouldn't need jobs and side businesses. They pull in other income because unless you are very large, farming today doesn't make that much.
@Free Vulcan
Are you trying to claim the farm programs where farmers are paid to NOT grow crops has been ended?
I would almost bet you are wrong about the license plate thing,too. All they have to do is put a plate that says "Farm Use" on their trucks and they are legal as long as they are only driving it within a certain distance from their farm. I know some that don't even bother to do that. They just paint "Farm Use" on their tailgates. Most put regular plates on their daily driver new pu's,but don't bother to tag their flatbeds.
And you second statement defies reality. Unless of course you believe that a successful farmer doesn't want or need "more money". I guess the rumors about people like Soros and Buffett investing more money for more profits are wrong,because they already have enough money,right?
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@Idaho_Cowboy
What do YOU call it,"ALLOWING other people the freedom to view what they want to view"?
It's the difference between a lamentation and a call for a new law.
Look at it this way. If I say "that's a stupid thing to do" that's not the same as saying "that ought to be illegal." Or if I say it would be nice If I could watch prime time TV with my kiddos isn't the same as saying that the government needs to do something about it. Just because people have the right doesn't mean it's a good idea.
I wish modern country music sounded more like country music. That doesn't mean I want the gubmint to mandate every country band have twin fiddles and a steel guitar. What it means is I wish there were more like minded consumers to myself to increase the demand for said product. Be it good ole twangy country or wholesome Andy Griffith kind of TV programming.
As another example. I don't take your hostility for my faith to mean that you the government to stop my from practicing it; same thought applies here.
Just my dos centavos.
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There is no one more lacking in intelligent responses than a knee-jerk atheist.
@musiclady
Unless it would be someone that believes in fairy tales like life after death,a magical fairy that lives in the sky that sees all,knows all,and punishes the rats in his maze that don't follow orders.
Not to mention people don't understand that "community" is the root word communism comes from,and that ALL communists are happy workers who are willing to share with others. If you don't believe it,just ask the dictators that control the country they live in.
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I'm not sure, but I think it may be a defense mechanism.
The ones here screaming "censorship!" haven't thought things through. They're reacting emotionally.
@musiclady
You really do live in an alternate universe,don't you?
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@Free Vulcan crop subsidies are still very much in use. Our local paper prints by law every year what each farmer receives in our area.
You are correct, I have not kept up with legislation. ARC and PLC are counter-cyclical payments. While not direct subsidies, they are close enough. Still, they only trigger in bad times and not a guaranteed thing.
I know farmers get alot of perks in some areas. Here in Iowa they get tax free fuel and that's about it. Most are pretty efficient.
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@musiclady
Unless it would be someone that believes in fairy tales like life after death,a magical fairy that lives in the sky that sees all,knows all,and punishes the rats in his maze that don't follow orders.
Not to mention people don't understand that "community" is the root word communism comes from,and that ALL communists are happy workers who are willing to share with others. If you don't believe it,just ask the dictators that control the country they live in.
I also find it amusing you never actually want to name the God you like to slander. Your beef isn't really with the little people or the brownies it's with Jehovah you might as well say so.
Besides, if you read your Bible as much as you claim you used to; you'd know it's chock full of people asking "how long o Lord?" If God used laser guided karma to keep things in line it'd be a different story.
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@Free Vulcan
Are you trying to claim the farm programs where farmers are paid to NOT grow crops has been ended?
I would almost bet you are wrong about the license plate thing,too. All they have to do is put a plate that says "Farm Use" on their trucks and they are legal as long as they are only driving it within a certain distance from their farm. I know some that don't even bother to do that. They just paint "Farm Use" on their tailgates. Most put regular plates on their daily driver new pu's,but don't bother to tag their flatbeds.
And you second statement defies reality. Unless of course you believe that a successful farmer doesn't want or need "more money". I guess the rumors about people like Soros and Buffett investing more money for more profits are wrong,because they already have enough money,right?
Not in Iowa. All vehicles must be licensed. And farm conservation programs are not subsidies, they are primarily for erosion control and soil management.
And most businessmen will not shy from more profit, but most farmers would just like to farm and be done with it, not work a full-time job or do side businesses out of necessity.
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Yes, which is sort of why the Reformation happened.
@Free Vulcan
And various religious sects have been seeking to gain the power the Catholic Church had before the Reformation started ever since it ended. The Catholic Church itself never gave up it's quest for world domination. It wasn't that long ago that the loons in Ireland were murdering each other and their families to try to "keep Ireland Catholic". Before that they were allies with the Nazi's during WW-2. Today they are hiding behind the term "Liberation Theology" and Rome is trying to pretend they have never heard of it.
AND,every other religious sect,Christian or otherwise,is also in the mix,trying to grab all the power they can grab for themselves so they can shut down the competition.
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@Free Vulcan
And various religious sects have been seeking to gain the power the Catholic Church had before the Reformation started ever since it ended. The Catholic Church itself never gave up it's quest for world domination. It wasn't that long ago that the loons in Ireland were murdering each other and their families to try to "keep Ireland Catholic". Before that they were allies with the Nazi's during WW-2. Today they are hiding behind the term "Liberation Theology" and Rome is trying to pretend they have never heard of it.
AND,every other religious sect,Christian or otherwise,is also in the mix,trying to grab all the power they can grab for themselves so they can shut down the competition.
I hardly think that's fair. Many denominations including a growing number of non denominational churches don't have any central organization what so ever to seek any political power with.
You are free to kick against the pricks @sneakypete , we're not the ones out to get you.
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It's the difference between a lamentation and a call for a new law.
Look at it this way. If I say "that's a stupid thing to do" that's not the same as saying "that ought to be illegal." Or if I say it would be nice If I could watch prime time TV with my kiddos isn't the same as saying that the government needs to do something about it. Just because people have the right doesn't mean it's a good idea.
I wish modern country music sounded more like country music. That doesn't mean I want the gubmint to mandate every country band have twin fiddles and a steel guitar. What it means is I wish there were more like minded consumers to myself to increase the demand for said product. Be it good ole twangy country or wholesome Andy Griffith kind of TV programming.
As another example. I don't take your hostility for my faith to mean that you the government to stop my from practicing it; same thought applies here.
Just my dos centavos.
@Idaho_Cowboy
Ok,I can go along with all that as long as you can accept that those are your desires,not a mandate the government should enforce. The problems happen when religious leaders,or any other form of charlatan,decide to grab these issues in order to grab the publicity spotlight,and organizes a "crusade against violence/porn/anti-family values/etc,etc,etc,and the members of his flock pick up the ball and run with it.
When it does happen,the result is crap like Sunday Blue Laws,bans on dancing,and censorship of the media.
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@Free Vulcan
And various religious sects have been seeking to gain the power the Catholic Church had before the Reformation started ever since it ended. The Catholic Church itself never gave up it's quest for world domination. It wasn't that long ago that the loons in Ireland were murdering each other and their families to try to "keep Ireland Catholic". Before that they were allies with the Nazi's during WW-2. Today they are hiding behind the term "Liberation Theology" and Rome is trying to pretend they have never heard of it.
AND,every other religious sect,Christian or otherwise,is also in the mix,trying to grab all the power they can grab for themselves so they can shut down the competition.
Don't care, I'm not Catholic. Or Mormon. Or any other type of organized religion. My church nor any of the local ones were ever trying to grab power. We mostly were trying to survive the constant onslaught of insults and intimidation by those in our beloved blue collar Union Dem community that hated the existence of Christians, because they thought everyone should be drinking, drugging, whoring, hedonist, cheating, thieving, unbelieving atheists, agnostics and anarchists just like them.
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Not in Iowa. All vehicles must be licensed. And farm conservation programs are not subsidies, they are primarily for erosion control and soil management.
And most businessmen will not shy from more profit, but most farmers would just like to farm and be done with it, not work a full-time job or do side businesses out of necessity.
But what about "the months they aren't farming"?
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And yet, you are quite comfortable with making false assumptions and putting words in my mouth that I don't think, or didn't say, as well as dictating to ME what I should say or think. If you gripe about my freedom to express myself, perhaps you shouldn't take for granted your right to express yourself. That's what this forum is all about.
First of all....you're the one that ""took exception"" to what I posted and engaged me in this thread....and essentially proclaimed that my argument or point was "moot".
Secondly, many times when I use the word "you" I actually mean "them" or "they"...my bad....referring to the parents who seek to censor certain shows. It's nothing personal, even if you chose to take it that way. And with all due respect, you're the one that seems to be reacting rather emotionally to this entire discussion. Maybe you should take a step back and breathe...lol.
I see your intense distaste for having someone say that networks should monitor themselves and not put certain shows on the air. But don't jump off the cliff and call it censorship or fascism. It makes you look like you're out of control, and not being rational.
There you go again....another passive aggressive/reacharound insult....tsk tsk. Even the article concluded that it was CENSORSHIP. Perhaps you should go back and read it again...?
Actually, when I read your words of excess I think maybe you're still suffering from TOS PTSD. Your responses are to people THERE who actually do want censorship, not to the people HERE who are making reasonable arguments for self-censorship and personal responsibility. The emotion and anger in your posts is not a rational response to the arguments being made here.
Oh for fux sake. Really???
And again....it's not "self-censorship" if parents (like you?) want a show "off the air".
You're the one that comes off as angry here, musiclady. Angry and irrational....since I keep having to point out to you the conclusion made in the article posted....and the only conclusion people could make from your own words. Wanting "disgusting material" off the air is censorship....no matter how vehemently you try to claim otherwise.
And, IMO, attacking parents who want disgusting material off the air by calling it censorship is also not fair. I think it's important for people who care about culture rot to continue to speak up.
And you apparently don't believe there actually are good parents and good kids out there, and for that I feel sorry for you.
Where, exactly, have I ever said that??? My ire is directed at parents that are NOT good parents and yet then blame others for their sucky parenting skills. And again, there are good kids out there that parents do not have to worry about. I never claimed otherwise. And here you go again...with yet another passive-aggressive insult. Good grief. Do you just like to fight with everybody?
btw, my husband and I have taken the subject up with the cable company multiple times. I still have the right to state an opinion about it here, your protestations notwithstanding.
Lolol! Simply ah-mazing.
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I also find it amusing you never actually want to name the God you like to slander. Your beef isn't really with the little people or the brownies it's with Jehovah you might as well say so.
Besides, if you read your Bible as much as you claim you used to; you'd know it's chock full of people asking "how long o Lord?" If God used laser guided karma to keep things in line it'd be a different story.
@Idaho_Cowboy
You mean there are more than one?
I was speaking out against the one known as Rufus in my last reply to you,but what I said goes for them all,regardless of their alias.
And I prefer my fiction reading to be more entertaining and less violent than the Bible.
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But what about "the months they aren't farming"?
Yeah, I don't know many farmers that have months where they 'aren't farming'. Especially if they have livestock. There is always something to do on the farm. Always.
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Not in Iowa. All vehicles must be licensed. And farm conservation programs are not subsidies, they are primarily for erosion control and soil management.
And most businessmen will not shy from more profit, but most farmers would just like to farm and be done with it, not work a full-time job or do side businesses out of necessity.
@Free Vulcan
"And farm conservation programs are not subsidies"
Uh,huh. Pull my finger.
"And most businessmen will not shy from more profit, but most farmers would just like to farm and be done with it, not work a full-time job or do side businesses out of necessity."
ROFLMAO! Do you know any actual farmers that farm more than a "hobby plot"? I know a couple that are multi-millionaires farming land that has been in their families for over 100 years that do their farming AND hold down 1 full-time job and finances a couple of other enterprises as partners.
Do you REALLY think the big (as opposed to the corporate family farm) corporate farmers limit their profits to the money they pull out of farming,or do you think they invest it in other businesses?
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Yeah, I don't know many farmers that have months where they 'aren't farming'. Especially if they have livestock. There is always something to do on the farm. Always.
It's kind of like months when I'm not gardening...
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Not in Iowa. All vehicles must be licensed. And farm conservation programs are not subsidies, they are primarily for erosion control and soil management.
And most businessmen will not shy from more profit, but most farmers would just like to farm and be done with it, not work a full-time job or do side businesses out of necessity.
Exemption saves some vehicle-registration fees
http://www.iowafarmertoday.com/news/regional/exemption-saves-some-vehicle-registration-fees/article_bc8c2682-0639-11e1-8b69-001cc4c002e0.html
Buy a $20,000 vehicle to get to work and back, buy groceries and get the kids to practice, and Iowa takes $1,000 in new-vehicle registration fees.
Buy that same $20,000 pickup to run feed from market to farm, and you can keep that $1,000.
The animal-husbandry exemption on new-vehicle registration fees is one of dozens of rebates and waivers the state gives to motorists using Iowa roads.
They range from fuel-tax rebates for farm implements to breaks on registration fees for trucks used for businesses, and registration waivers for trailers used specifically for displays on patriotic holidays.
The exemptions, refunds and waivers are peppered throughout state code, and there’s no telling how much the state would gain in tax revenue each year if it eliminated them....
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I hardly think that's fair. Many denominations including a growing number of non denominational churches don't have any central organization what so ever to seek any political power with.
You are free to kick against the pricks @sneakypete , we're not the ones out to get you.
@Idaho_Cowboy
I'll admit you are right on the non-denominational churches,but they are the exception,not the rule. As far as I know,for the most part they do their thing and bother no one.
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@musiclady
Unless it would be someone that believes in fairy tales like life after death,a magical fairy that lives in the sky that sees all,knows all,and punishes the rats in his maze that don't follow orders.
Not to mention people don't understand that "community" is the root word communism comes from,and that ALL communists are happy workers who are willing to share with others. If you don't believe it,just ask the dictators that control the country they live in.
You don't think at all rationally, nor logically on this subject.
Caring for each other in a community (root of the word notwithstanding) as it happened in the New Testament, and in small towns and villages, as well as churches all across the country, is a group of people caring about each other, help those in need, the poor, the widows, the orphans, members of ones own family, etc.
It is the precise opposite of Communism, imposed by a government. The OPPOSITE.
If there were more community, we wouldn't have people begging the government to take care of them.
You will argue in circles if you say it's the same thing, because what you are arguing is absolutely false.
Christians who care for each other want LESS government, not more.
You couldn't be more wrong if you tried.
And sometimes I think you DO try to be as wrong as you can be. I haven't figured out yet if you're as angry and irrational as you come across online, or if you're just a provocateur with a morbid sense of humor.
Doesn't really matter.
You're dead wrong.
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@Free Vulcan
"And farm conservation programs are not subsidies"
Uh,huh. Pull my finger.
"And most businessmen will not shy from more profit, but most farmers would just like to farm and be done with it, not work a full-time job or do side businesses out of necessity."
ROFLMAO! Do you know any actual farmers that farm more than a "hobby plot"? I know a couple that are multi-millionaires farming land that has been in their families for over 100 years that do their farming AND hold down 1 full-time job and finances a couple of other enterprises as partners.
Do you REALLY think the big (as opposed to the corporate family farm) corporate farmers limit their profits to the money they pull out of farming,or do you think they invest it in other businesses?
I live in rural Iowa. You know, the farm state. I'm about as immersed in it as you're going to get. I don't know any hobby farmers, just real ones. And here, most farmers would simply like to do that full time, if they could.
Yes, some invest in businesses and coops to vertically integrate, but they're still in the business. Not sure what you're point there.
And you can call the conservation programs whatever you like. It's your opinion, and like buttholes everyone's got one, and they all stink.
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You don't think at all rationally, nor logically on this subject.
Caring for each other in a community (root of the word notwithstanding) as it happened in the New Testament, and in small towns and villages, as well as churches all across the country, is a group of people caring about each other, help those in need, the poor, the widows, the orphans, members of ones own family, etc.
It is the precise opposite of Communism, imposed by a government. The OPPOSITE.
If there were more community, we wouldn't have people begging the government to take care of them.
You will argue in circles if you say it's the same thing, because what you are arguing is absolutely false.
Christians who care for each other want LESS government, not more.
You couldn't be more wrong if you tried.
And sometimes I think you DO try to be as wrong as you can be. I haven't figured out yet if you're as angry and irrational as you come across online, or if you're just a provocateur with a morbid sense of humor.
Doesn't really matter.
You're dead wrong.
@musiclady
"Caring for each other in a community (root of the word notwithstanding) as it happened in the New Testament"
Uhhhh,what happened to the Original Testament,the original Word of God? Was it broken and have to be fixed?
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@musiclady
"Caring for each other in a community (root of the word notwithstanding) as it happened in the New Testament"
Uhhhh,what happened to the Original Testament,the original Word of God? Was it broken and have to be fixed?
And I bet you think you're clever..... Yikes. **nononono*
(I hope some day you realize how absolutely STUPID your posts can be to anyone with a functioning brain).
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Exemption saves some vehicle-registration fees
http://www.iowafarmertoday.com/news/regional/exemption-saves-some-vehicle-registration-fees/article_bc8c2682-0639-11e1-8b69-001cc4c002e0.html
Buy a $20,000 vehicle to get to work and back, buy groceries and get the kids to practice, and Iowa takes $1,000 in new-vehicle registration fees.
Buy that same $20,000 pickup to run feed from market to farm, and you can keep that $1,000.
The animal-husbandry exemption on new-vehicle registration fees is one of dozens of rebates and waivers the state gives to motorists using Iowa roads.
They range from fuel-tax rebates for farm implements to breaks on registration fees for trucks used for businesses, and registration waivers for trailers used specifically for displays on patriotic holidays.
The exemptions, refunds and waivers are peppered throughout state code, and there’s no telling how much the state would gain in tax revenue each year if it eliminated them....
True. I don't deny the funding aspect. I've never liked the Iowa tax code, we do the high-tax-then-give-credits routine to those of special interest. We've needed to flatten alot of things for a long time.
In sum though, Iowa is pretty low in the perks it give farms. Fuel tax and license registration rebates are about the sum of it.
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@musiclady
"Caring for each other in a community (root of the word notwithstanding) as it happened in the New Testament"
Uhhhh,what happened to the Original Testament,the original Word of God? Was it broken and have to be fixed?
II Thessalonians 3:10 "For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat." That whole going around in one accord didn't last very long. In fact the Bible teaches in both testaments to help those in need voluntarily; you can't force people to give with true charity.
Other Historians have talked about it, and Bradford's journal used to be required reading in school way back when, but the Pilgrims thought that they could put everything in a common store and it didn't work so well. Fascinating story if you have the time to read or listen:
http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/11/26/rush-limbaugh-tells-the-true-story-of-thanksgiving/
The old Testament was fulfilled. With the exception of the laws God gave Israel as a theocracy it's still very valid (not that the theocratic laws aren't, but not as directly) and applicable to today. A surprising amount of the New Testament is quotes from the Old Testament.
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Is this a thread about a TV show?
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Is this a thread about a TV show?
Hahaha. I'm almost pining for the FR days of long meandering offtopic threads.
Yes it is about a TV show. And censorship. And apparently farming and religion too. :laugh:
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Is this a thread about a TV show?
We get easily distracted.
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Although protecting children from violence and smut isn't a problem I have, I do have family and friends who are desperately trying to do everything possible to do just that. It's really just impossible unless you can be with every kid at every moment of every day. (I'm sure their friends will be thrilled that the kid's parent comes along with the kid on an overnight stay!) Staying vigilant in an attempt to shield your kids leaves you with no life of your own.
I'm geared toward wholesome programming, so I don't see any of this stuff, but I have had friends and co-workers who have said on several occasions that they wished they hadn't seen this movie or that TV show and desperately wished they could unsee it. Just the few things I accidentally overhear are enough to provide an explanation of how society became so degraded in such a short period of time.
I really don't know how one could protect their children in this era. Even refusing to have a TV in the house would only partially protect them since TVs are ubiquitous. And of course we live in the age of computers where the creepiest of material is a click away. Don't tell me that stuff doesn't have an effect on one's soul.
I am so grateful to have grown up in the era of Dick Van Dyke, Danny Thomas, Bonanza, Sky King, Wyatt Earp, Ed Sullivan, Wagon Train, American Bandstand, etc.
So am I! And even my children who are in their thirties had a choice of good programming and absolutely no slasher garbage on TV. We didn't have parental controls because we didn't really need them.
You are so right, though, about how quickly our culture has degraded.
I just can't see why anyone is up in arms about asking for responsible programming from executives on TV, and why they are screeching "CENSORSHIP!" when the article itself is about choices in cable programming, and the discussion has been about responsibility.
The knee jerk reactions are instructive. Some folks apparently don't even want the discussion to take place.
And to me, that's a heck of a lot closer to censorship than an open discussion with all sides being represented, and simply asking for responsibility from the cable companies and the executive producers.
You can't take horrible images out of your mind once they've been put there. There's going to be some long term damage for people who watch this kind of butchery. Especially the young ones.
@AllThatJazzZ
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I guess you didn't read the article, and reacted emotionally and defensively rather than thoughtfully, so I'll let you know what it says.....
The suggestion is not that the shows be "censored," but that families have to option NOT to get that particular channel from their cable package so they have more control at home, or not be forced to subsidize violence because there is no choice as to what channels and programming come into your home.
Nowhere is there mention, here or elsewhere, of parents who let their children watch the show and then "bitch about it." I imagine that most parents who don't care about what their kids watch and are irresponsible enough to think it's OK for their kids to watch this kind of horror aren't the ones complaining. So unless you have evidence that this parents group consists of very confused parents, your point is moot and your argument has no basis in fact.
All I have talked about is self-censorship. That production companies should know what is a "bridge too far" for television that comes into homes where children may be watching. The article is referring to controls over which channels are in your cable package and which aren't. I'm talking about responsible producers.
My husband and I have talked about it for years. Why are we forced to pay for hundreds of channels we never watch, and in essence, support things financially that we don't participate in, or what we strongly disapprove of?
It's a legitimate question.
And your accusing me of agreeing with fascism is just dumb.
Sorry.
@XenaLee
I'm all for a more a la carte approach to cable. I'd much rather get RFD than Viceland, for instance. I don't care about ellen degenerates' gaycation. No thanks. So why do I have to pay for that channel? I'd rather watch shows about classic tractors, as odd as that may seem to some.
Besides, I'm usually up at 4 AM and most of what is on cable are infomercials. While that hasn't irritated me quite enough to tell the cable company to shut it down and go to a dish, I'm close, but even that isn't necessarily a cure.
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Besides, I'm usually up at 4 AM and most of what is on cable are infomercials. While that hasn't irritated me quite enough to tell the cable company to shut it down and go to a dish, I'm close, but even that isn't necessarily a cure.
I'm on a dish, since the wires don't seem to stretch out this far. I see NO improvement on a dish over the choices I had when we were "in town".
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We get easily distracted.
Great cartoon!
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And I bet you think you're clever..... Yikes. **nononono*
(I hope some day you realize how absolutely STUPID your posts can be to anyone with a functioning brain).
@musiclady
Yes,I do. I don't believe in fairy tales,either.
BTW,are you going to tell us what was wrong with "The Original Word of God/The (now)Old Testament",and why it had to be replaced with a New Testament/Word of God?
Something broken so a "New and Improved God's Word" had to replace it?
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True. I don't deny the funding aspect. I've never liked the Iowa tax code, we do the high-tax-then-give-credits routine to those of special interest. We've needed to flatten alot of things for a long time.
In sum though, Iowa is pretty low in the perks it give farms. Fuel tax and license registration rebates are about the sum of it.
The fuel exemption isn't strictly a farm thing. It's there for vehicles that don't operate on the public roads. It pretty much has to be there because the various state governments use a "road use tax to maintain and build new roads",so they would have a hard time justifying taxing boat fuel,tractor fuel,etc,etc,etc.
BTW,does the tax exemption at vehicle sale include or require the purchase of farm use tags?
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The fuel exemption isn't strictly a farm thing. It's there for vehicles that don't operate on the public roads. It pretty much has to be there because the various state governments use a "road use tax to maintain and build new roads",so they would have a hard time justifying taxing boat fuel,tractor fuel,etc,etc,etc.
BTW,does the tax exemption at vehicle sale include or require the purchase of farm use tags?
No. Basically if it is a car or truck that has red gas or diesel in it, you better not be caught on the road with it. They do check frequently and they have nabbed farmers who cheat. No special tags or anything though.
Since most tractors are road worthy, they could techincally tax them, the ones that are driven to the fields for plant and harvest. They don't though. Boats of course should obviously not pay the road tax, though they might pay some sort of conservation tax here, I don't know.
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I just can't see why anyone is up in arms about asking for responsible programming from executives on TV, and why they are screeching "CENSORSHIP!" when the article itself is about choices in cable programming, and the discussion has been about responsibility.
The knee jerk reactions are instructive. Some folks apparently don't even want the discussion to take place.
And to me, that's a heck of a lot closer to censorship than an open discussion with all sides being represented, and simply asking for responsibility from the cable companies and the executive producers.
You can't take horrible images out of your mind once they've been put there. There's going to be some long term damage for people who watch this kind of butchery. Especially the young ones.
@AllThatJazzZ
@musiclady
You do more spinning/talking in circles than any 3 people I know.
I have some cousins that used to claim tv was a "tool ob de debbil!" and refused to have one in their house,or to allow their children to visit anyone that did.
Then their preacher got his own Sunday morning teebee show,and suddenly a new color console teebee showed up in their houses,and teebee instantly became "an instrument ob de LORD!" When the "700 Club" started airing,they even bought VCR's to record "The Word of GAWD!",although I am guessing that God never showed up to speak,and they were actually recording that con artist,Pat Robertson.
Funny how that works,ain't it?
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No. Basically if it is a car or truck that has red gas or diesel in it, you better not be caught on the road with it. They do check frequently and they have nabbed farmers who cheat.
They do the same thing around here. I've been stopped and checked when driving my diesel GMC pickup. Woe be onto whoever tries to cheat the state highway department out of "THEIR" tax money!
I sometimes buy the red diesel to run in my loader,but sometimes go ahead and but the road-taxed diesel to avoid making another stop. It's a real pain in the butt to get to where the red diesel and gas are pumped and the savings on fuel just isn't worth the effort for me. If I were buying 100 gallons of it every few days you can bet I will make the effort,but I just don't burn enough of it to worry about. I'd like to burn the leaded gas in my stock 51 Ford,but it's just too much trouble. I put lead substitute in the gas tank instead.
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@musiclady
Yes,I do. I don't believe in fairy tales,either.
BTW,are you going to tell us what was wrong with "The Original Word of God/The (now)Old Testament",and why it had to be replaced with a New Testament/Word of God?
Something broken so a "New and Improved God's Word" had to replace it?
Someone else has been gracious enough to explain it to you, and you have rejected it.
I have more important things to do than cast pearls before swine. Besides which, I'm pretty sure you actually know the answer and are just trying to be a jerk.
Peace, @sneakypete .
I don't know anyone else who needs it more than you do.
And FYI, this thread is about a TV show, not your faithlessness and cynicism, so enough of the hijack, OK??
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@musiclady
You do more spinning/talking in circles than any 3 people I know.
I have some cousins that used to claim tv was a "tool ob de debbil!" and refused to have one in their house,or to allow their children to visit anyone that did.
Then their preacher got his own Sunday morning teebee show,and suddenly a new color console teebee showed up in their houses,and teebee instantly became "an instrument ob de LORD!" When the "700 Club" started airing,they even bought VCR's to record "The Word of GAWD!",although I am guessing that God never showed up to speak,and they were actually recording that con artist,Pat Robertson.
Funny how that works,ain't it?
You know more hypocrites than anyone I've ever met. It's apparent that you haven't had contact with genuine Christians, nor more importantly, with the person of Jesus Christ.
I've said it before, and you've rejected it with snark, of course, but you need to get into the Word of God and meet the Savior, and quit looking at sinful people to make your decisions about a Holy, Almighty, Just and Loving God.
My last post participating in your thread hijack.
:seeya:
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You know more hypocrites than anyone I've ever met. It's apparent that you haven't had contact with genuine Christians, nor more importantly, with the person of Jesus Christ.
I've said it before, and you've rejected it with snark, of course, but you need to get into the Word of God and meet the Savior, and quit looking at sinful people to make your decisions about a Holy, Almighty, Just and Loving God.
My last post participating in your thread hijack.
:seeya:
Steve Brown was right on when he called the Church porcupines huddled against the storm. At least Christians are the one group where you have to admit you are messed up to be a member. A lot of them forget, but that's another matter. Why is the world so shocked to find sinners in the Church?
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They do the same thing around here. I've been stopped and checked when driving my diesel GMC pickup. Woe be onto whoever tries to cheat the state highway department out of "THEIR" tax money!
I sometimes buy the red diesel to run in my loader,but sometimes go ahead and but the road-taxed diesel to avoid making another stop. It's a real pain in the butt to get to where the red diesel and gas are pumped and the savings on fuel just isn't worth the effort for me. If I were buying 100 gallons of it every few days you can bet I will make the effort,but I just don't burn enough of it to worry about. I'd like to burn the leaded gas in my stock 51 Ford,but it's just too much trouble. I put lead substitute in the gas tank instead.
I can generally handle the road tax and enforcement if it's done right. We do pretty good here in Iowa though I don't like the road formula much. It's way too oriented to the cities, and the IDOT-contractor relationship is a little too incestuous for me sometimes.
What I personally wish they'd do here is flatten the corporate tax, which is about 5% of state revenue, get rid of all credits, then give it to cities and counties for road repairs and construction. Let the gas tax fill in after that, and cut the budget to make up for the 5%.
It would give jurisdictions incentive to improve their business climate, which would in turn benefit with better roads, drawing more business, and so on.
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Steve Brown was right on when he called the Church porcupines huddled against the storm. At least Christians are the one group where you have to admit you are messed up to be a member. A lot of them forget, but that's another matter. Why is the world so shocked to find sinners in the Church?
Great points and some that should be repeated:
Church members are sinners like everyone else.
Churches are filled with people who have admitted they are sinners.
Some Christians forget that they are sinners. And that.......... is a sin.
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@driftdiver
Blah,blah,blah. Organized religion is the original form of communism,so you might want to back off on those "leftist" smears,comrade.
Communism? "a political theory derived from Karl Marx, advocating class war and leading to a society in which all property is publicly owned and each person works and is paid according to their abilities and needs."
perhaps your education is lacking? Religion has nothing to do with communism.
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Someone else has been gracious enough to explain it to you, and you have rejected it.
I have more important things to do than cast pearls before swine. Besides which, I'm pretty sure you actually know the answer and are just trying to be a jerk.
Peace, @sneakypete .
I don't know anyone else who needs it more than you do.
And FYI, this thread is about a TV show, not your faithlessness and cynicism, so enough of the hijack, OK??
@musiclady
Wouldn't it have been easier to just admit you don't know what was wrong with the Old Testament instead of doing all that tapdancing and making all the personal attacks?
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@musiclady
Wouldn't it have been easier to just admit you don't know what was wrong with the Old Testament instead of doing all that tapdancing and making all the personal attacks?
Your the one that said anything was wrong with in the first place. :nono:
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You know more hypocrites than anyone I've ever met. It's apparent that you haven't had contact with genuine Christians, nor more importantly, with the person of Jesus Christ.
LOL! Good one. Now go off and hide.
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Steve Brown was right on when he called the Church porcupines huddled against the storm. At least Christians are the one group where you have to admit you are messed up to be a member. A lot of them forget, but that's another matter. Why is the world so shocked to find sinners in the Church?
@musiclady @Idaho_Cowboy
EXCELLENT question!
Seems to me most of the most outspoken Christians I have met spend most of their time proclaiming how righteous and beloved of God they are.
Some churches and churchmembers are so righteous they won't even allow sinners to attend services. Or at least sinners not related to anyone in the church hierarchy.
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I can generally handle the road tax and enforcement if it's done right. We do pretty good here in Iowa though I don't like the road formula much. It's way too oriented to the cities, and the IDOT-contractor relationship is a little too incestuous for me sometimes.
What I personally wish they'd do here is flatten the corporate tax, which is about 5% of state revenue, get rid of all credits, then give it to cities and counties for road repairs and construction. Let the gas tax fill in after that, and cut the budget to make up for the 5%.
It would give jurisdictions incentive to improve their business climate, which would in turn benefit with better roads, drawing more business, and so on.
You are probably right,but the most I know of Iowa was driving through it once in the 60's,and having a room mate in college from Iowa. Which doesn't give me much grounding to talk intelligently about local laws.
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Communism? "a political theory derived from Karl Marx, advocating class war and leading to a society in which all property is publicly owned and each person works and is paid according to their abilities and needs."
perhaps your education is lacking? Religion has nothing to do with communism.
@driftdiver
No doubt it is,and would be no matter how much I learn.
The same can be said for you,but you are clearly too ignorant to understand the basic tenets of Christianity are virtual clones of the stated goals of communism.
The fact that neither work as intended is another thing they share.
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@musiclady @Idaho_Cowboy
EXCELLENT question!
Seems to me most of the most outspoken Christians I have met spend most of their time proclaiming how righteous and beloved of God they are.
Some churches and churchmembers are so righteous they won't even allow sinners to attend services. Or at least sinners not related to anyone in the church hierarchy.
If you really have encountered, and they are out there, the kind of "Christians?" that think they don't sin anymore you have my pity. But they are a pretty small minority. Jesus encountered folks like that and he had no kind words for them.
The rest will tell you what John wrote "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us." I John 1:8-10
Paul confessed it on an even more personal level in Romans 7 "For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do."
Just cause they don't believe they have sinners in their church doesn't change what the book says, in fact it just proves it.
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@driftdiver
No doubt it is,and would be no matter how much I learn.
The same can be said for you,but you are clearly too ignorant to understand the basic tenets of Christianity are virtual clones of the stated goals of communism.
The fact that neither work as intended is another thing they share.
Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Strangely enough, I can't find that in Marx...
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@musiclady
Wouldn't it have been easier to just admit you don't know what was wrong with the Old Testament instead of doing all that tapdancing and making all the personal attacks?
You're nothing if not amusing, pete.
Why would I answer a question (that I could give an accurate explanation of) to a person who doesn't give a rip about the answer.
Casting pearls....... don't do it.
If you ever have a legitimate question and ask it as though you want to know the answer, I'll be glad to oblige.
Now, haven't you tired yet of hijacking a thread with your bigotry?
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LOL! Good one. Now go off and hide.
You're a sad man, pete. If this is what you do to feel important and clever, you are just pathetic.
I think most rational people on this forum feel sorry for you. You don't make us angry, regardless of how desperately and ignorantly you try. You just make us feel pity for you.
You know the answers. You know the truth. You know how to find the Way.
Just do it.
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If you really have encountered, and they are out there, the kind of "Christians?" that think they don't sin anymore you have my pity. But they are a pretty small minority. Jesus encountered folks like and he had no kind words for them.
The rest will tell you what John wrote "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us." I John 1:8-10
Paul confessed it on an even more personal level in Romans 8 "For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do."
Just cause they don't believe they have sinners in their church doesn't change what the book says, in fact it just proves it.
goopo
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You're a sad man, pete. If this is what you do to feel important and clever, you are just pathetic.
I think most rational people on this forum feel sorry for you. You don't make us angry, regardless of how desperately and ignorantly you try. You just make us feel pity for you.
You know the answers. You know the truth. You know how to find the Way.
Just do it.
Preach it.
I joke with my wife that half the sermons in church could be replaced with the Pastor walking up setting a Nike on the pedestal and walking off. The hearing is sure easier than the doing.
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Preach it.
I joke with my wife that half the sermons in church could be replaced with the Pastor walking up setting a Nike on the pedestal and walking off. The hearing is sure easier than the doing.
That's for sure! Especially when you're anonymous on an internet forum. ^-^
Thanks so much for reflecting the love of Christ and speaking the truth here.
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The Only Begotten Son of God isn't a person.
Organized religion is a lie.
People should be able to choose to watch whatever they want. Always.
Graphic violence is worse than hardcore porn.
Watching either one is embracing corruption.
We have a bumper crop of leaves this year and I ain't getting no subsidies to harvest them. Feel free to come help rake leaves as a community effort.
seeyaluvyabye
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Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Strangely enough, I can't find that in Marx...
@Idaho_Cowboy
You can't understand the State as God? Seriously?
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You're nothing if not amusing, pete.
Why would I answer a question (that I could give an accurate explanation of) to a person who doesn't give a rip about the answer.
@musiclady
I believe you.
Honest!
Why,I'd almost be willing to bet you are going through a huge inner struggle to explain how the New and Improved Word of God came to be about,but don't want to give up your secrets to a pagan.
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No. Basically if it is a car or truck that has red gas or diesel in it, you better not be caught on the road with it. They do check frequently and they have nabbed farmers who cheat. No special tags or anything though.
Since most tractors are road worthy, they could techincally tax them, the ones that are driven to the fields for plant and harvest. They don't though. Boats of course should obviously not pay the road tax, though they might pay some sort of conservation tax here, I don't know.
Off road use exemptions here (for dyed fuel) include everything from farm and construction equipment to oil rigs and generators. If, however you are caught driving with dyed fuel in the tanks on the highway, penalties are severe and fines are huge. The exemption includes Federal Road use taxes as well, so it can amount to 30 cents per gallon or more depending on what state you are in. Considering oil drilling rigs get their diesel by the truckload, it adds up quick.
Other non-highway uses for diesel include as a base fluid for drilling mud, and the average rig will have well over 1000 barrels of that in the mud tanks and downhole (each stock tank barrel is 42 gallons).
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@musiclady
I believe you.
Honest!
Why,I'd almost be willing to bet you are going through a huge inner struggle to explain how the New and Improved Word of God came to be about,but don't want to give up your secrets to a pagan.
No struggle, none at all. God laid out a deal for the Jewish people. It wasn't working so well, as the rules were pretty tough. That deal and some history were laid out in the OT, along with some prophesy. God gave those who would opt in a new deal, and that was laid out in the New Testament.
Just because the Constitution has been amended doesn't make it wrong.
If a legislature repeals a law does that make both enactments wrong?
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No struggle, none at all. God laid out a deal for the Jewish people. It wasn't working so well, as the rules were pretty tough. That deal and some history were laid out in the OT, along with some prophesy. God gave those who would opt in a new deal, and that was laid out in the New Testament.
Just because the Constitution has been amended doesn't make it wrong.
If a legislature repeals a law does that make both enactments wrong?
@Smokin Joe
Are you saying God had different rules for Jews?
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@Smokin Joe
Are you saying God had different rules for Jews?
Well, they aren't supposed to eat bacon. 22222frying pan So, in a word, yes, there were more of them.
If Jews wished to opt in and go by the new covenant they had that option. It was just that, a new covenant. Prior to that, God had rules for Jews, and others who wanted to follow them.
The decalogue remained the same. Dietary and other rules the Jewish people lived under were not imposed on Christians unless they wanted to follow them.
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@sneakypete @musiclady @XenaLee @Smokin Joe
Mankind's barbarity is pretty well established. The use of that barbarity for entertainment goes back. The Roman Circus was a popular venue or it wouldn't have existed. The key, and 'civilization' rests on overcoming that popularism.
For me, viewing graphic violence isn't some form of entertainment. And I can liken it to voting for Trump. It is an embrasure to barbarity.
I believe in an afterlife. It isn't much of a stretch for me to think, that since "I" exist in four-dimensional time/space, that I can continue that existence in an even more multidimensional energy state.
That being said I have to look at the really big picture. My parents were never big fans of graphic violence. And my dad would never vote for Trump. So my dad is sitting up there watching this election and I know what he is thinking. Eternity is a long time people. No way in hell am I voting for Trump. My dad would never let me live it down. I don't want to have to endure "Dammit, Boy" for the rest of eternity.
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@driftdiver
No doubt it is,and would be no matter how much I learn.
The same can be said for you,but you are clearly too ignorant to understand the basic tenets of Christianity are virtual clones of the stated goals of communism.
The fact that neither work as intended is another thing they share.
@sneakypete
Oh I'm ignorant of many things. Things like how this country put itself in a position to have two such crappy candidates for President.
Also, how people can bear so much unreasoning hatred for the Lord and his flock. Then there's the fanciful comparison of Christianity to communism. Has religion been used for evil? Sure it has. Its also been the cause of much of the good that has occurred. Its people that do wrong and not God.
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@sneakypete
Oh I'm ignorant of many things. Things like how this country put itself in a position to have two such crappy candidates for President.
Also, how people can bear so much unreasoning hatred for the Lord and his flock. Then there's the fanciful comparison of Christianity to communism. Has religion been used for evil? Sure it has. Its also been the cause of much of the good that has occurred. Its people that do wrong and not God.
For me it's not "unreasoning hatred for the Lord and his flock". It's annoyance at forcing your views onto everyone and insisting that politics and religion be wedded at all times.
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@sneakypete @musiclady @XenaLee @Smokin Joe
Mankind's barbarity is pretty well established. The use of that barbarity for entertainment goes back. The Roman Circus was a popular venue or it wouldn't have existed. The key, and 'civilization' rests on overcoming that popularism.
For me, viewing graphic violence isn't some form of entertainment. And I can liken it to voting for Trump. It is an embrasure to barbarity.
I believe in an afterlife. It isn't much of a stretch for me to think, that since "I" exist in four-dimensional time/space, that I can continue that existence in an even more multidimensional energy state.
That being said I have to look at the really big picture. My parents were never big fans of graphic violence. And my dad would never vote for Trump. So my dad is sitting up there watching this election and I know what he is thinking. Eternity is a long time people. No way in hell am I voting for Trump. My dad would never let me live it down. I don't want to have to endure "Dammit, Boy" for the rest of eternity.
You are right to keep an eternal perspective on this election, @bigheadfred . This goes far beyond politics, and for some of us, voting for an amoral man is a bridge we don't believe the Lord wants us to cross.
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@musiclady
I believe you.
Honest!
Why,I'd almost be willing to bet you are going through a huge inner struggle to explain how the New and Improved Word of God came to be about,but don't want to give up your secrets to a pagan.
No, I have made a rational decision not to respond theologically to a man whose only purpose is to mock God.
Others are trying, as I once did, but I've had enough of your atheist snark to realize that you're not a serious poster when it comes to things of faith.
I also wonder if you come up with your canned responses on your own, or if you have a puppet master in the atheist snark world who pulls your strings.... Either way, I know you're not seriously trying to discuss anything, and so it's a complete waste of time. Only God can open your heart. I'll let others give you Truth, and you can snark back at them with your unintelligent replies.
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@Idaho_Cowboy
You can't understand the State as God? Seriously?
I'm not arguing that Marxism doesn't have it's religious elements, rather that Christianity does not lead to Marxism. It seems man is With relatively few exceptions the ideas have not correlated throughout history.
The Bible itself teaches that we give the state due honor, but that we are responsible to follow the higher authority (in the US that would be the Constitution btw) meaning ultimately if the state gives orders that are un-biblical the Christian is not bound to follow them.
The early church was told by the state they could not preach. Needless to say no state worship took place.
Acts 5:28 {The high priest, also a civil authority} "Saying, Did not we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name? and, behold, ye have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this man's blood upon us. Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men."
This is the basis for separation of Church and state. In fact many of the rights we hold dear are written in the scripture.
We hold these truths to be self evident that all men are created equal.
Acts 10:34 "Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:" Also Romans 2:11 and Ephesians 6:9.
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@musiclady
I believe you.
Honest!
Why,I'd almost be willing to bet you are going through a huge inner struggle to explain how the New and Improved Word of God came to be about,but don't want to give up your secrets to a pagan.
If you really want the full Sunday school explanation I'd be happy to post it. But I'm not sure why you think this is a gotcha. Couple of points to consider.
First of all, perfect doesn't always mean complete. The Bible refers to the Church age as a mystery (ie. something not fully revelaed).
Secondly, the old Testaments started with Creation and God coming to earth and breathing life into man. The new testament starts with God coming to earth to redeem man once and for all. The sacrifices, the feasts, the law, and the stories of the old testament all pointed to the cross; they are not inconsistent.
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@sneakypete @musiclady @XenaLee @Smokin Joe
Mankind's barbarity is pretty well established. The use of that barbarity for entertainment goes back. The Roman Circus was a popular venue or it wouldn't have existed. The key, and 'civilization' rests on overcoming that popularism.
Yes. However.....that's not the point or the topic of this thread. We could write volumes on how violent and barbaric mankind has been and still is (See: ISIS).
For me, viewing graphic violence isn't some form of entertainment. And I can liken it to voting for Trump. It is an embrasure to barbarity.
Same here. But the show in question only has a few highly graphic instances of such violence, if you don't count the damage done to the walkers on a daily basis...lol. Most of the fans, including myself, look past such violence because we like the cast, the writing and the apocalyptic survival theme....which is very pertinent in the current environment and times we're in. Not that we'd see zombies roaming after a disaster like....say....a nuclear holocaust. But there would be hoards of roving 'almost' dead people willing to do anything necessary in order to ""stay alive"". Anyone that denies that isn't dealing in reality. Hence, the show's appeal (IMO).
I believe in an afterlife. It isn't much of a stretch for me to think, that since "I" exist in four-dimensional time/space, that I can continue that existence in an even more multidimensional energy state.
That's a topic for a whole nuther thread right there....but so do I. Energy never dies....it just transfers to some other place. And I believe that the human soul is another form of energy. A small part of God, Himself, perhaps. This world and reality is a testing ground. When we die we return to God....to be weighed, measured and judged (wheat from the chaff). But I digress...
That being said I have to look at the really big picture. My parents were never big fans of graphic violence. And my dad would never vote for Trump. So my dad is sitting up there watching this election and I know what he is thinking. Eternity is a long time people. No way in hell am I voting for Trump. My dad would never let me live it down. I don't want to have to endure "Dammit, Boy" for the rest of eternity.
My parents liked Leave It to Beaver and Father Knows Best. The closest they got to watching violence was Gunsmoke...lol. They were lifelong Christians and Republicans, as well. As for them watching this election, the only thing we can do is adhere to our conscience (like Ted Cruz advised....if only he had followed his own excellent advice)....and refuse to support EITHER candidate of evil. So that's my plan. That way ....I just may be lucky enough to receive approval from my parents one last time before I die. Hope springs.
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@Idaho_Cowboy
You can't understand the State as God? Seriously?
Um....pardon me for interjecting here...but.....
since when has "the State"...ie big government (leftists) ever given people a choice....free or otherwise? God gave man free will. The State/leftist government never will. The State seeks to dictate every tiny aspect of our lives, right down to the type of toilets we use and the type of bags we utilize.
Just sayin.....
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Um....pardon me for interjecting here...but.....
since when has "the State"...ie big government (leftists) ever given people a choice....free or otherwise? God gave man free will. The State/leftist government never will. The State seeks to dictate every tiny aspect of our lives, right down to the type of toilets we use and the type of bags we utilize.
Just sayin.....
Good point.
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Um....pardon me for interjecting here...but.....
since when has "the State"...ie big government (leftists) ever given people a choice....free or otherwise? God gave man free will. The State/leftist government never will. The State seeks to dictate every tiny aspect of our lives, right down to the type of toilets we use and the type of bags we utilize.
Just sayin.....
@XenaLee
The USSR and their Nazi brothers gave people a choice. You could either obey them or go to the Gulag/labor camps/firing squads.
Just like God gives people a choice. You can obey his rules or go to Hell and suffer torture for all of eternity.
Compared to God,Stalin and Hitler looks like great humanitarians. Nobody can top that "torture for all of eternity" thing.
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@XenaLee
The USSR and their Nazi brothers gave people a choice. You could either obey them or go to the Gulag/labor camps/firing squads.
Just like God gives people a choice. You can obey his rules or go to Hell and suffer torture for all of eternity.
Compared to God,Stalin and Hitler looks like great humanitarians. Nobody can top that "torture for all of eternity" thing.
I'm afraid that you have it all twisted there. Stalin and the other POS dictators of the world gave nobody a choice between 'being good or being evil'. The only choice you had was to submit....same as with Satan.
With God.... you have the choice of doing good and of not being an evil schmuck. If you choose to be an evil schmuck....quite frankly.....I agree with God. You then deserve to burn in Hell for all eternity...lol.
So you better be good, dude. It's getting close. Closer than you probably think.
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@XenaLee
The USSR and their Nazi brothers gave people a choice. You could either obey them or go to the Gulag/labor camps/firing squads.
Just like God gives people a choice. You can obey his rules or go to Hell and suffer torture for all of eternity.
Compared to God,Stalin and Hitler looks like great humanitarians. Nobody can top that "torture for all of eternity" thing.
heh heh heh God becomes man so man can become God. There is no torture in hell for eternity. You just have to hang out on Saturn and be sneakypete for a while. But you are smart enough to do what I am doing: Living multiple lives simultaneously so "I" get it right the "first" time.
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I'm afraid that you have it all twisted there. Stalin and the other POS dictators of the world gave nobody a choice between 'being good or being evil'. The only choice you had was to submit....same as with Satan.<<
@XenaLee
Absolutely 100 percent wrong. There are countless graves in Europe filled with people who made the choice to not go along with Stalin or Hitler's plans. We ALWAYS have a choice between "Yes",and "No".
And like I wrote before,at least with Stalin and Hitler the suffering was over quickly. With your God,it lasts forever. WADDA GUY!
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For me it's not "unreasoning hatred for the Lord and his flock". It's annoyance at forcing your views onto everyone and insisting that politics and religion be wedded at all times.
What basis would you use to make law, then, as a basic guide for what is to be considered criminal?
Where do your Rights come from?
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What basis would you use to make law, then, as a basic guide for what is to be considered criminal?
Where do your Rights come from?
Aesop's Fables.
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@XenaLee
Absolutely 100 percent wrong. There are countless graves in Europe filled with people who made the choice to not go along with Stalin or Hitler's plans. We ALWAYS have a choice between "Yes",and "No".
And like I wrote before,at least with Stalin and Hitler the suffering was over quickly. With your God,it lasts forever. WADDA GUY!
You may not know it ....but He is your last and only hope in this world. I'll take my chances with God's judgment, thank you very much. Human judgment is irreparably flawed and too easily influenced by EO.
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Aesop's Fables.
You have a Right to Sour Grapes...
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You have a Right to Sour Grapes...
Which imbibed turn into The Grapes of Wrath.