The Briefing Room
General Category => National/Breaking News => Topic started by: Gefn on April 25, 2018, 11:57:06 pm
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Bye bye Taurus, Fiesta, and Fusion.
http://www.foxnews.com/auto/2018/04/25/ford-is-killing-off-nearly-all-its-cars-in-favor-suvs.html (http://www.foxnews.com/auto/2018/04/25/ford-is-killing-off-nearly-all-its-cars-in-favor-suvs.html)
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They are keeping the Mustang.
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I wonder if the removal of the insane CAFE mpg requirements were part of this decision.
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They and other automakers seem convinced no one wants sedans anymore, just SUVs. :shrug:
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Bye bye Taurus, Fiesta, and Fusion.
Can I be there for the execution?
(https://media.giphy.com/media/OkC1P99rfIqru/giphy.gif)
Oh yeah. Eff Ford.
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They and other automakers seem convinced no one wants sedans anymore, just SUVs. :shrug:
I'm 5 feet tall. I can't drive a SUV. I'm too short, I need a car
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They and other automakers seem convinced no one wants sedans anymore, just SUVs. :shrug:
Convinced? Well yeah. Sales numbers bear that out.
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Don't they make police cars?
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I'm 5 feet tall. I can't drive a SUV. I'm too short, I need a car
Have you been in a Buick Encore crossover? They're built for midgets. They just sit higher.
(https://www.buick.com/content/dam/buick/na/us/en/vdc-collections/2018/suvs/encore/encore/encore-preferred-ii/01-images/2018-encore-1sd-preferred2-trim-transparent.png?imwidth=1200)
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I'm 5 feet tall. I can't drive a SUV. I'm too short, I need a car
Get the Escape. You won’t notice the difference.
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Don't they make police cars?
They make a police version of Taurus, but a lot of PDs are just buying the Explorer instead.
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They make a police version of Taurus, but a lot of PDs are just buying the Explorer instead.
All the cops in my area are swapping out their Crown Vics for Tahoes and Chargers.
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I'm 5 feet tall. I can't drive a SUV. I'm too short, I need a car
Get a Subaru.
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Get a Subaru.
(https://m.popkey.co/be6d1c/bXwrq.gif)
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Get a Subaru.
I have a Subaru Impreza four door sedan. I tried to drive their 5 door one which looks like a little SUV and I couldn't see out the back window. I had to pull off the road and make the salesman drive
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I love my Subaru Forester. It's been a good little workhorse, while averaging 30 mpg.
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I have a Subaru Impreza four door sedan. I tried to drive their 5 door one which looks like a little SUV and I couldn't see out the back window. I had to pull off the road and make the salesman drive
Just when phonebooks have fallen out of favor.
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Just when phonebooks have fallen out of favor.
Just use the My Cushion by Mark Zuckerberg.
(https://s.yimg.com/lo/api/res/1.2/RMKpUWKMrCWPATf15Yy06A--~B/YXBwaWQ9eWlzZWFyY2g7Zmk9Zml0O2dlPTAwNjYwMDtncz0wMEEzMDA7aD01MzQ7dz00MDA-/https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/booster-2.jpg?strip=all&w=649.cf.jpg)
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Love my Taurus silver with black leather..
(https://static.cargurus.com/images/site/2015/11/23/14/30/2016_ford_taurus-pic-3373621557234016240-1600x1200.jpeg)
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I love my Subaru Forester. It's been a good little workhorse, while averaging 30 mpg.
About every hillbilly cabin around here has a 3/4T 4x4 pickup and a Subaru sitting outside... because that's about all that can get up there in the wintertime...
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All the cops in my area are swapping out their Crown Vics for Tahoes and Chargers.
Yep, I am seeing the same thing here, as well.
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Get a Subaru.
Communist!!!
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Love my Taurus silver with black leather..
(https://static.cargurus.com/images/site/2015/11/23/14/30/2016_ford_taurus-pic-3373621557234016240-1600x1200.jpeg)
Fleet company car or did you voluntarily buy one?
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Communist!!!
The Subaru has surpassed the Volvo for all around bad drivers and Communists.
(https://usercontent2.hubstatic.com/7389477_f520.jpg)
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The Subaru has surpassed the Volvo for all around bad drivers and Communists.
(https://usercontent2.hubstatic.com/7389477_f520.jpg)
The cars in NY come with the stickers on them stock off the lot, don't they?
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The cars in NY come with the stickers on them stock off the lot, don't they?
No. They are added as structural integrity as the vehicles rust out.
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Let's all have a moment of silence for all the great passenger cars Ford blessed America with...
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/5e/3f/53/5e3f530f5dd3f1640941d8c6364ec653.png)
(https://farm6.static.flickr.com/5251/5469678747_d99e378b2e_b.jpg)
(https://1dcem613f5v8509f13ajfcqx-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/ford-fairmont-car-vintage-ad-late-1977-1-620x831.jpg)
(https://i1.wp.com/www.curbsideclassic.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/1984tempo.jpg)
(https://media.ed.edmunds-media.com/ford/escort/1998/oem/1998_ford_escort_sedan_se_fq_oem_1_500.jpg)
(https://media.ed.edmunds-media.com/ford/taurus/1998/oem/1998_ford_taurus_sedan_lx_fq_oem_1_500.jpg)
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Done with Ford. Dumped our 2006 Explorer after needing it's 3rd radiator. And my 2013 Focus had Transmision issues from day one with horrible grinding noise that Ford said was normal. The transmission failed completely when when the car was less than 3 years old and had to be towed 30 miles. And twice its been in for crimped wireing under the dash causing failure of interior lighting and trunk release, both costing me out of pocket cash.
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I'm 5 feet tall. I can't drive a SUV. I'm too short, I need a car
@Freya
My wife's Ford Expedition EL has adjustment for seat height, steering wheel height and distance from dash, and the pedals can be adjusted closer.
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@Freya
My wife's Ford Expedition EL has adjustment for seat height, steering wheel height and distance from dash, and the pedals can be adjusted closer.
@thackney it sounds nice. I bought a 2017 car, so I'm good. I miss keys in ignitions though. You have to push a button to start it. Between that and the back up camera, I feel like George Jetson!
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@thackney it sounds nice. I bought a 2017 car, so I'm good. I miss keys in ignitions though. You have to push a button to start it. Between that and the back up camera, I feel like George Jetson!
I'm hoping you out live your car. These features are becoming more common. Don't rule out an SUV for your next one, if you want to consider it. My daughter is almost 5' and has a relatively long torso with relatively shorter legs. I understand the struggles of size with vehicles.
My wife, kids and I have gotten used to being able to see ahead farther in traffic from the higher seating position of an SUV. It gives them more time to react to a problem ahead.
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Done with Ford. Dumped our 2006 Explorer after needing it's 3rd radiator. And my 2013 Focus had Transmision issues from day one with horrible grinding noise that Ford said was normal. The transmission failed completely when when the car was less than 3 years old and had to be towed 30 miles.
Mr. M had a 2007 Ford Five Hundred for 11 years. Everyone warned it would have transmission problems but it never did. He liked that car better than any other he had owned, including Mercedes and Volvo, but finally got rid of it because it had a design problem that ensured that the rear fenders would rust through. He'd already had them patched a couple of times, and the body shop guy said there wasn't any more he could do.
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Communist!!!
Hey hey hey!
If the Germans hadn't bombed pearl harbor we'd all be driving Jap cars!
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@thackney it sounds nice. I bought a 2017 car, so I'm good. I miss keys in ignitions though. You have to push a button to start it. Between that and the back up camera, I feel like George Jetson!
LOL - I bought a Nissan Altima last year, went through the same issues. It was a very proud day for me six months ago, when I set the Bluetooth thingy for my cell phone. Allows me to access the music on my IPhone, too.
Yes, I do love that back up camera, too.
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They killed off sedans when they converted them into sports tanks. An old sedan had a comfy ride, quiet tires, and good visibility. Now you may as well get a truck, or one of those SUVs for people with bad knees.
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Don't they make police cars?
Crown Victorias? Who did make those?
I have driven an SUV for over 20 years. I needed room for the very large dogs. Then I just could not smallify.
:silly:
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Let's all take our hats off in somber silence for one of the worst pieces of shit a car company ever polluted America's highways with.....
! No longer available (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7dLoMSxR-Y&list=PLoc2v-9HraDy_Na4G5vhV_Jy6WSzgb-pX&index=7#)
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LOL - I bought a Nissan Altima last year, went through the same issues. It was a very proud day for me six months ago, when I set the Bluetooth thingy for my cell phone. Allows me to access the music on my IPhone, too.
Yes, I do love that back up camera, too.
I really want to get a huge truck so I can just make room in front of me and in back of me. "Oh, was that your car? Oopsy doopsy." Not really. But sometimes the smaller cars take up one-and-a-half spaces. With the huge truck, you can gently push them out of the way. Off the cliff. Down the arroyo. Off the mountain.
:finger:
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Don't they make police cars?
Ford makes both a sedan and an SUV Police Interceptor.
https://www.ford.com/police-vehicles/ (https://www.ford.com/police-vehicles/)
The sedan is standard with All Wheel Drive. They no longer make a police sedan available in Rear Wheel Drive.
http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/chicago-assembly-plant-to-stop-production-of-taurus-replace-with/article_23dff552-371e-5683-91ba-e4ba30bb0a2c.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/chicago-assembly-plant-to-stop-production-of-taurus-replace-with/article_23dff552-371e-5683-91ba-e4ba30bb0a2c.html)
...Since it's no longer making the Taurus, the Chicago Assembly Plant also will stop producing the Police Interceptor Sedan, which is a souped-up version of the Taurus that's specially equipped for police use....
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Let's all take our hats off in somber silence for one of the worst pieces of shit a car company ever polluted America's highways with.....
! No longer available (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7dLoMSxR-Y&list=PLoc2v-9HraDy_Na4G5vhV_Jy6WSzgb-pX&index=7#)
No one really purchased those, did they? Fiesta?
**nononono*
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Let's all take our hats off in somber silence for one of the worst pieces of shit a car company ever polluted America's highways with.....
! No longer available (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7dLoMSxR-Y&list=PLoc2v-9HraDy_Na4G5vhV_Jy6WSzgb-pX&index=7#)
That is where the Yugo went to die.
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No one really purchased those, did they? Fiesta?
**nononono*
My buddies dad bought one right out of the showroom and he regretted it. Every time we went over to his house 2 or three of us would pick up the ass end and put it sideways in his driveway. He hated that. LOL.
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My mom had the Mercury version of this piece of shit and I can say for a fact that the car handled like a soggy diaper and didn't have enough power to get out of it's own way. Jackie Stewart is an evil lying bastard....
! No longer available (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4Ws_Bp7WYA&list=PLoc2v-9HraDy_Na4G5vhV_Jy6WSzgb-pX&index=5#)
Oh yeah. Ford sucks.
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My mom had the Mercury version of this piece of shit and I can say for a fact that the car handled like a soggy diaper and didn't have enough power to get out of it's own way. Jackie Stewart is an evil lying bastard....
! No longer available (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4Ws_Bp7WYA&list=PLoc2v-9HraDy_Na4G5vhV_Jy6WSzgb-pX&index=5#)
Oh yeah. Ford sucks.
Yeah, I don't believe his Heineken commercial, either.
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Yeah, I don't believe his Heineken commercial, either.
Didn't he do a Miller Lite one?
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Yeah, I don't believe his Heineken commercial, either.
Alright then. Looks like we have found a new undeniable truth.......Never Trust A Scotsman.
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Alright then. Looks like we have found a new undeniable truth.......Never Trust A Scotsman.
Longshanks was right. Then it is settled.
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Get a VW. If you don’t need a lot of cargo space or passenger space, the Jetta will do fine.
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Crown Victorias? Who did make those?
I have driven an SUV for over 20 years. I needed room for the very large dogs. Then I just could not smallify.
:silly:
Ford made the Crown Vic. The Mercury version was the Grand Marquis.
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Get a VW. If you don’t need a lot of cargo space or passenger space, the Jetta will do fine.
Also if you don't mind being lied to about the performance of your vehicle, VW will do fine.
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Also if you don't mind being lied to about the performance of your vehicle, VW will do fine.
Actually, the “problem†was they performed better than they were supposed to, and just throttled it down for smog-testing. I’m all for cheating the EPA nanny tests, so VW’s fine by me.
The 1.8 turbo will kick a lot of butt, even in the Passat.
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Actually, the “problem†was they performed better than they were supposed to, and just throttled it down for smog-testing. I’m all for cheating the EPA nanny tests, so VW’s fine by me.
Oy Vey.
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The 1.8 turbo will kick a lot of butt, even in the Passat.
Yeah. If I was a teenage girl I would think that was really cool. Unfortunately, since I am an adult I'll just have to suffer with my luxuriously fast S-Class Mercedes.
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Yeah, I don't believe his Heineken commercial, either.
I have had two Ford Explorers. Great SUVs! Never had a problem with either one of them.
I have also had two Volvos -- do not close your window when shutting the door. Good car all around.
Mercedes Benz, 240D -- forget about diesel stick shifts. O to 60 mph in about an hour. But it would make it to 85 mph going downhill. Very pretty car.
And a bunch of sundry other vehicles. I prefer Ford. But I have not tried the Range Rover yet. Next vehicle.
I really want a Humvy. That would probably be too difficult to drive.
I guess I could do a Red Green to get the Humvy by putting two vehicles together. Great episode of Red Green!
:facepalm2:
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I really want a Humvy. That would probably be too difficult to drive.
H2's were built on basically a Suburban frame. They are not any bigger than those.
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H2's were built on basically a Suburban frame. They are not any bigger than those.
I have driven a Suburban. No biggie. I did not know that.
TU!
888high58888
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I have driven a Suburban. No biggie. I did not know that.
TU!
888high58888
Whatever you do stay the hell away from Land Rover. They are only fun until the warranty is out. Then they become a misery.
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Whatever you do stay the hell away from Land Rover. They are only fun until the warranty is out. Then they become a misery.
The couple I have known to own them would say the misery begins long before that. Although that may depend on the loaner the shop provides while repairs are constantly being made.
I knew one owner of a pipeline construction company. When they were doing really well he bought a Range Rover to replace his Bronco. He got stranded so many times in that piece of junk, he was afraid to go to the grocery store unless his wife was nearby to come get him.
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The couple I have known to own them would say the misery begins long before that. Although that may depend on the loaner the shop provides while repairs are constantly being made.
I knew one owner of a pipeline construction company. When they were doing really well he bought a Range Rover to replace his Bronco. He got stranded so many times in that piece of junk, he was afraid to go to the grocery store unless his wife was nearby to come get him.
I've dabbled with a couple Disco II's and an LR2 over the years. At least the LR2 had a Volvo motor. The Discos have easily the worst Bosch engines ever conceived. At least with a Yugo you know you are buying low priced junk. Land Rover gouges the hell out of you for the same experience. Just garbage cars.
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Hey hey hey!
If the Germans hadn't bombed pearl harbor we'd all be driving Jap cars!
I must confess....
I have to admit, I have a 12 year old Toyota Tacoma, still driving it, that I bought new.
The funny thing is, I traded in a Ford Ranger that I bought new.
I didn't make it 4 years, 80k on it, and I had already spent $2,000.00 on repairs, and it never got right.
The last guy I took it to said, if I like small trucks, I should be a Toyota, so I did.
No issues with it.
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Actually, the “problem†was they performed better than they were supposed to, and just throttled it down for smog-testing. I’m all for cheating the EPA nanny tests, so VW’s fine by me.
The 1.8 turbo will kick a lot of butt, even in the Passat.
If you want a motorcycle engine, then buy a motorcycle!
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If you want a motorcycle engine, then buy a motorcycle!
And that right there is why I love you Roos.
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They killed off sedans when they converted them into sports tanks. An old sedan had a comfy ride, quiet tires, and good visibility. Now you may as well get a truck, or one of those SUVs for people with bad knees.
That's right... I'd have a car if I could get at something like a 60-80's Bonneville or Caprice... nothing today is made like it... so pickups. :shrug:
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If you want a motorcycle engine, then buy a motorcycle!
I want an engine that performs. The VW 1.8T does that quite nicely.
An engine is an engine is an engine.
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An engine is an engine is an engine.
Sure it is.
(http://www.clubhotrod.com/photopost/data/500/medium/Buick_455_-_A32_-_Side_View_of_Completed_Engine_-_7x10_-_6533.jpg)
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/NMcAAOSw9fRZw1IE/s-l225.jpg)
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And that right there is why I love you Roos.
She's a natural-born world-shaker.
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Well, I still drive a 2002 Chrysler minivan with more than 220,000 miles on it, but I'm happy to say that we're completely out of debt. ^-^
(It still runs like a top).
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Whatever you do stay the hell away from Land Rover. They are only fun until the warranty is out. Then they become a misery.
Supposedly, they got better when Ford bought them, and then received another boost when the Indians took over. I still would not drive one past the warranty. Parts alone are ridiculous.
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I forgot another car we all have to have a moment of silence for. Passed one today on the highway and marveled that it was still around.....
(https://i1.wp.com/hooniverse.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/ad-1980-2P-thunderbird.jpg?resize=720%2C486)
What an ugly royal piece of shit this car was. If you think you hate it now, just wait till you drive it.
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DETROIT — The passenger car isn't dead yet.
Ford Motor's announcement that it is killing almost all of its traditional car models is dramatic proof that sedans have lost their luster for U.S. automakers and drivers.
But is the passenger car really headed to the auto graveyard? And is Detroit's fascination with larger vehicles a sign of danger ahead should economic winds shift?
Not exactly, according to industry experts.
Ford's rival, General Motors, isn't ready to call for last rites. ...
That doesn't signal an end to cars in Ford's lineup, said Jim Farley, Ford's president of global markets. It's just that what now are called SUVs will be considered cars, he explained in an interview.
"We're going to have a fantastic passenger car lineup. They just won't be traditional sedans," he said. He said consumers will look at vehicles such as the next generation of the Escape, one of Ford's most popular SUVs, and won't "classify them as a truck at all." They'll have space, comfort and good fuel economy.
He called it a "new era of classification." ... More from Detroit Free Press via USA Today (https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2018/04/26/cars-arent-dead-yet-despite-ford-killing-fusion-taurus/555322002/)
Notice you don't hear anything from Honda, BMW, et al., about discontinuing sedans.
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Notice you don't hear anything from Honda, BMW, et al., about discontinuing sedans.
The big 2 and a 1/3 are ceding that busn to the Import Co's
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This appears to be short-sighted, as gas prices are bound to rise (they just pierced the $3.00 mark here in Pennsy for the first time in four years).
Still, they are keeping the Stang and the Focus, which are the two best cars they still make here in the USA (although I believe the Focus will be moved to Mexico). The Taurus sells poorly, and Ford will likely pitch Lincolns to the oldsters (like me) who still like large sedans.
I was sitting at the lunch counter last week with a guy who owns a Ford dealership, and he says Ford will soon be importing cars from China. I told him, respectfully, that that could be the move that turns me away from Ford for good. I've always preferred to "wave the flag" for an American brand, but hell, at this point Toyota builds more small and midsize cars here than Ford and Chrysler do (Chrysler I don't think builds any cars here at all (the 300 and Charger come from Canada)). I've learned to accept Fiestas and Fusions from Mexico, but China? No way, Jose!
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Communist!!!
@GrouchoTex
Nothing but Hondas for me.
Stalinist? :seeya:
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Forgot another stellar passenger car offering from the Blue Oval......
(https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--ZndpRAiB--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/1301882100259895441.jpg)
And who could forget this monumental piece of shit.....the Ford Elite....
(https://www.productioncars.com/send_file.php/ford_elite_gold_1976.jpg)
I wish I could forget it.
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(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61h4QXLsUKL._SX463_.jpg)
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@GrouchoTex
Nothing but Hondas for me.
Stalinist? :seeya:
Perhaps...
Naw, I was just kidding' around.
I 'fessed up that I have been driving the same Toyota Tacoma for 12 years now.
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That's too bad. I thought Ford had some winners with their turbo-charged "Hot Hatches" such as the Focus ST and Fiesta ST. Unfortunately, the reliability issues and failure to adequately differentiate these cars from the regular versions cost them sales, I am guessing.
There are plenty of great sedans and hatchbacks out there: the Golf GTI, the Mazda3, the Honda Civic and Subaru Impreza models. All of these outshine the Ford by far IMHO.
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(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61h4QXLsUKL._SX463_.jpg)
Even Farrah couldn't make that turd cool.
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/ac/58/bf/ac58bf4a5a3127315d60a080a13fe001.jpg)
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Even Farrah couldn't make that turd cool.
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/ac/58/bf/ac58bf4a5a3127315d60a080a13fe001.jpg)
That was the day I came to the realization that Carroll Shelby was a whore.
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That was the day I came to the realization that Carroll Shelby was a whore.
Yup.....
(https://d39a3h63xew422.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/22092438/the-omni-glh-is-awesome-and-has-a-curse-word-in-its-name-1477100221277-515x320.jpg)
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Yup.....
(https://d39a3h63xew422.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/22092438/the-omni-glh-is-awesome-and-has-a-curse-word-in-its-name-1477100221277-515x320.jpg)
What was that POS with the 2+2 on the hood? I'm having a senior moment and an acid flash back. :chairbang:
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What was that POS with the 2+2 on the hood? I'm having a senior moment and an acid flash back. :chairbang:
You knew you were about to overtake one about a mile ahead on the highway because you could smell the burning oil. At about a quarter mile you could see the smoke.
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Yep, I am seeing the same thing here, as well.
Here in Las Vegas they went from Crown Victoria police interceptors to Explorer SUVs.
Personally, I miss the Crown Vic. I owned one some years back and loved it until the day it died . . .
(https://static.cargurus.com/images/site/2015/12/22/22/09/pic-5188402576659664323-1600x1200.jpeg)
Being a working musician in a part-time way for now, I need a car like that. (I'm also 6'4" and the little cars don't do it for me anymore.) But since
Ford doesn't make the Crown Vic anymore, Lincoln doesn't make the Town Car, and after driving two Intrepids I'm sour on Dodge/Chrysler,
I have this and I love it to death . . .
(http://azr.cdnmedia.autotrader.ca/image_resize.php?width=620&quality=80&image=/galleries/2007/images/toyota/2007_toyota_rav4/07rav4_cc_5-2895.jpg)
With my gear this car is perfect for me. Also drives beautifully when I go to visit my son in southern California.
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California often foretells national vehicle trends years ahead.
--Domestic to foreign
--Larger to smaller
--Better mileage
--Sedans to SUVs (and wagons, hatchbacks)
The last trend has been underway here for many years. I note that Toyota, Mazda, Subaru, Honda/Acura, Mercedes, BMW, Audi and VW all have multiple sizes and configurations of SUVs, wagons and hatchbacks.
Most major car builders have design studios in California, btw. Toyota since the 1970s. BMW for a long while, too.
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California often foretells national vehicle trends years ahead.
--Domestic to foreign
--Larger to smaller
--Better mileage
--Sedans to SUVs (and wagons, hatchbacks)
The last trend has been underway here for many years. I note that Toyota, Mazda, Subaru, Honda/Acura, Mercedes, BMW, Audi and VW all have multiple sizes and configurations of SUVs, wagons and hatchbacks.
Most major car builders have design studios in California, btw. Toyota since the 1970s. BMW for a long while, too.
That's funny. Sales figures don't bear that out. Trucks an SUV's are top sellers.
BTW most of the Major car builders DON'T have design studios in Cali. Ford's is still in Dearborn, Chrysler's is in Auburn Hills MI and GM's is in the old Harley Earl learning center in MI. The only Cali designing that I am aware of was done at the Pacifica facility for Dodges and that was shut down years ago.
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The cars in NY come with the stickers on them stock off the lot, don't they?
Goes by zipcode. Get a few miles outside Ithaca, and about the only ones you'll see are Trump ones...though the radius is expanding.
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Perhaps...
Naw, I was just kidding' around.
I 'fessed up that I have been driving the same Toyota Tacoma for 12 years now.
@GrouchoTex
Yes, Toyotas are right up there, too.
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That's too bad. I thought Ford had some winners with their turbo-charged "Hot Hatches" such as the Focus ST and Fiesta ST.
The twin turbo 3.5L they put in the trucks and SUVs is a workhorse. I have been really impressed with it. More torque in my wife's Expedition for pulling the horse trailer than my 6.2L in my F250.