The Briefing Room
General Category => Politics/Government => Topic started by: mystery-ak on September 25, 2013, 12:50:06 pm
-
http://thehill.com/blogs/on-the-money/budget/324413-within-senate-gop-frustration-with-cruz (http://thehill.com/blogs/on-the-money/budget/324413-within-senate-gop-frustration-with-cruz)
Within Senate GOP, frustration with Cruz
By Erik Wasson and Peter Schroeder - 09/25/13 05:30 AM ET
A number of Sen. Ted Cruz's colleagues on Tuesday expressed frustration at the Texas Republican's tactics in the fight over ObamaCare and government funding.
As Cruz prepared to speak for hours on the Senate floor to try to delay work on the government-funding measure, many fellow GOP senators exited a conference meeting said they thought his strategy would backfire on their party.
“We have an obligation to govern and it does not make sense to link defunding ObamaCare, as much as I’d like to see that come about, with a measure that is essential to keep government funding,” said Sen. Susan Collins (R-Maine.). “That includes vital money for the Department of Defense that pays our troops in harms way.
“I don’t think its good policy and good policy and good politics usually go together,” she said.
Sen. Mike Johanns (R-Neb.), who has previously criticized the strategy, said threatening a government shutdown was never a good tactic.
“To me it never seemed like an idea that was going to go far. It never seemed to me like it had a lot of possibilities. That doesn’t mean that it won’t get a lot of attention,” Johanns said. “The majority is the majority. That is the reality…there is a difference in being in the majority and being in the minority.”
Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) convened a special all-conference meeting on Tuesday to try to unify his conference.
But during and after the meeting, Cruz and Sen. Mike Lee (R-Utah) indicated they intended to continue their effort to link ObamaCare's defunding to a government funding bill.
The two also indicated they would seek to delay Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid's (D-Nev.) effort to strip the ObamaCare language from the bill and send a clean government-funding bill to the House.
McConnell had said it would be better to send the clean bill to the House soon, to give House Republicans more time to make a counter offer to the Senate.
Sen. Saxby Chambliss (R-Ga.) said many members wanted to get on with the debate but Lee and Cruz were not listening.
“Digging in? No more than they have already,” he said.
Asked by a reporter if Republicans were unifying, Sen. Mike Crapo (R-Idaho) responded, "Um … that's a hard call."
Other senior members were plain in their discomfort with the shutdown brinksmanship.
"I went through that in '95. We had both houses of Congress, we balance the budget, I think three years in a row, and we just turned the country over to Democrats," said Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah). "That's what happened. They blamed the Republicans for doing that, and I suspect it would be a repeat of the same thing.
"We have to find a way of standing up for principles without immolating ourselves in front of everybody," he added.
Sen. Jim Inhofe (R-Okla.) said members were worried that voting to block the House CR that defunds ObamaCare would be too difficult to explain to members of the public “who don’t understand or care to understand” Senate procedure.
“We are getting wrapped up in a whole lot of procedural things,” he said. “We’ll have procedural votes that will be very hard to explain.”
-
Ted Cruz is the establishments worst nightmare and OUR champion!
-
Is Hatch so out if touch he doesn't remember the GOP handed back the house and Senate because they started spending money like Democrats???
-
There is a revolution brewing within the GOP. The left wing of the GOP is scarred to death and trying to subdue it as fast as possible. One thing is for sure, the lines are sharply divided and no Congressman or woman can be on the sidelines.
-
There is a revolution brewing within the GOP. The left wing of the GOP is scarred to death and trying to subdue it as fast as possible. One thing is for sure, the lines are sharply divided and no Congressman or woman can be on the sidelines.
There is no revolution brewing. Even among Republicans, there is no stomach for shutting down the government.
Cruz and Lee are leading a very vocal minority within the GOP. There will come a time when they need other Republican Senators to support some issue of theirs, and they won't get it.
Being called a Nazi enabler does tend to stick in one's craw for a while.
-
Cruz and Lee are leading a very vocal minority within the GOP. There will come a time when they need other Republican Senators to support some issue of theirs, and they won't get it.
That's typical of the RINOS! It's not about getting even, but doing what is right. Are you saying the republicans will do the wrong thing to get even with Cruz? I imagine they will because they consider him a young upstart who is rocking the boat. That's not good for their social club.
-
I listened to Cruz on the opening segment of Rush today.
He is inspirational.
It is rare that I can have someone say EXACTLY the things that I feel and believe.
Ted Cruz is such a man.
-
That's typical of the RINOS! It's not about getting even, but doing what is right. Are you saying the republicans will do the wrong thing to get even with Cruz? I imagine they will because they consider him a young upstart who is rocking the boat. That's not good for their social club.
No. He will want something for Texas that nobody else cares about and they won't support him.
You think it was OK for Cruz to liken Republicans to Nazi enablers?
-
No. He will want something for Texas that nobody else cares about and they won't support him.
You think it was OK for Cruz to liken Republicans to Nazi enablers?
YEP! I loved every word he said! He inspired me! :patriot:
-
YEP! I loved every word he said! He inspired me! :patriot:
Same here.
-
YEP! I loved every word he said! He inspired me! :patriot:
So calling those on your side who disagree with you over tactics Nazi enablers is OK. Got it.
-
No. He will want something for Texas that nobody else cares about and they won't support him.
You think it was OK for Cruz to liken Republicans to Nazi enablers?
Ted Cruz is a leader the likes of which we have not seen in a LONG time and YOU had better come to grips with that fact!
-
So calling those on your side who disagree with you over tactics Nazi enablers is OK. Got it.
I guess wacky birds would be better?
Of course those on the right cowering in the corner afraid of the big bad democrats/Nazis would be considered Nazi enablers to me too!!!
-
Ted Cruz is a leader the likes of which we have not seen in a LONG time and YOU had better come to grips with that fact!
:amen: The RINOS will be long gone, and Cruz and other conservatives will take their places. It's way past time to vote those suckers out.
-
No. He will want something for Texas that nobody else cares about and they won't support him.
You think it was OK for Cruz to liken Republicans to Nazi enablers?
Here is what Cruz ACTUALLY said:
"“If you go to the 1940s, Nazi Germany... look, we saw in Britain, Neville Chamberlain, who told the British people, ‘Accept the Nazis. Yes, they’ll dominate the continent of Europe but that’s not our problem. Let’s appease them. Why? Because it can’t be done. We can’t possibly stand against them.’”
His point was not about Nazis. It was about the dangers of appeasement. He did not liken ANYONE to a "Nazi Enabler", so please knock it off, m'kay?
Besides, I've been called a "Nazi" so many times, I frankly don't give a shit if some Progressive GOP Ruling Class weenie's feelings were hurt. Boo-friggin'-hoo. 8888crybaby
-
Ted Cruz is a leader the likes of which we have not seen in a LONG time and YOU had better come to grips with that fact!
If Ted Cruz expects to lead a disparate Republican party (as Ronald Reagan did), he'd better stop with the vitriol and trashing members of his own party.
The Democrats are the opposition. Training fire on Republicans is counterproductive.
-
His point was not about Nazis. It was about the dangers of appeasement. He did not liken ANYONE to a "Nazi Enabler", so please knock it off, m'kay?
The dangers of appeasement within the context of enabling the Nazis. It's clear who Cruz thinks the enablers are.
Nice try.
-
If Ted Cruz expects to lead a disparate Republican party (as Ronald Reagan did), he'd better stop with the vitriol and trashing members of his own party.
The Democrats are the opposition. Training fire on Republicans is counterproductive.
Cruz doesn't trash anyone. He is the one being the target. And, you misread his Nazi remark.
-
His point was not about Nazis. It was about the dangers of appeasement. He did not liken ANYONE to a "Nazi Enabler", so please knock it off, m'kay?
The dangers of appeasement within the context of enabling the Nazis. It's clear who Cruz thinks the enablers are.
Nice try.
The "enablers" were not Nazis, they were Britons. Our allies and friends.
Nice try. But thanks for playing.
-
The "enablers" were not Nazis, they were Britons. Our allies and friends.
Nice try. But thanks for playing.
Yes. The Britons enabled the Nazis in WWII by appeasing them. You don't know your history.
-
Yes. The Britons enabled the Nazis in WWII by appeasing them. You don't know your history.
No one has EVER won anything by appeasing the enemy! THAT is the point of Cruz's statement and YOU damned well know it. Enough!
-
Cruz was comparing those who argued against his style, particularly the MSM, to defund Obamacare to those who were more than willing to appease the Nazis during World War II. And, he is right. The MSM appears more than willing to destroy this nation by following Obama's lead.
-
No. He will want something for Texas that nobody else cares about and they won't support him.
You think it was OK for Cruz to liken Republicans to Nazi enablers?
Yup. They're worse than Nazi enablers.
-
If Ted Cruz expects to lead a disparate Republican party (as Ronald Reagan did), he'd better stop with the vitriol and trashing members of his own party.
The Democrats are the opposition. Training fire on Republicans is counterproductive.
NOPE. Totally wrong.
Those enablers have ripped the heart and soul out of the Republican party to where it is no longer recognizable from a wing of the dimocrat party.
Time to take a stand.
The time is now.
-
Yes. The Britons enabled the Nazis in WWII by appeasing them. You don't know your history.
I'd say that you don't know yours:
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/09/09/article-1053798-0283213600000578-277_468x374.jpg)
-
I have a feeling people like McConnell are hearing from key constituents today, and I seriously doubt what they are hearing is anti-Cruz. Quite the opposite. If he is making life difficult for the GOP leadership in the senate, so be it. The leadership desperately needed shaking up.
-
I have a feeling people like McConnell are hearing from key constituents today, and I seriously doubt what they are hearing is anti-Cruz. Quite the opposite. If he is making life difficult for the GOP leadership in the senate, so be it. The leadership desperately needed shaking up.
:amen: :amen: and :amen:
-
I'd say that you don't know yours:
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/09/09/article-1053798-0283213600000578-277_468x374.jpg)
In the context of Cruz's speech, he pointed out that there were enablers such as Chamberlain, not that the enablers were Nazis.
Although ALL Nazis were enablers, not all enablers were Nazis.
The comparison to today's republican enablers, that is republicans that are enablers, is perfect.
-
If Ted Cruz expects to lead a disparate Republican party (as Ronald Reagan did), he'd better stop with the vitriol and trashing members of his own party.
The Democrats are the opposition. Training fire on Republicans is counterproductive.
It is not Ted Cruz who is doing the trashing. It would be really helpful had you actually watched his filibuster yesterday - as many of us here did. In fact he was very kind and praised McCain on the floor... he did not stoop to the nasty antics McCain has been using. The only trashing going on is coming from the progressives in our party. In fact after a long back and forth with Kaine of VA (a Democrat) he was very complimentary of Kaine - saying they didn't agree on much, but there was some areas they agree and want to work together........
Frankly I think these go-along, get-along Republicans need calling out.
-
No one has EVER won anything by appeasing the enemy! THAT is the point of Cruz's statement and YOU damned well know it. Enough!
The enemy?
Thanks for proving my point, Bigun.
-
I'd say that you don't know yours:
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/09/09/article-1053798-0283213600000578-277_468x374.jpg)
So? A picture of Neville Chamberlain proves MY point, not yours.
-
In the context of Cruz's speech, he pointed out that there were enablers such as Chamberlain, not that the enablers were Nazis.
Although ALL Nazis were enablers, not all enablers were Nazis.
The comparison to today's republican enablers, that is republicans that are enablers, is perfect.
You Cruzites better get on the same page. Or is there even a rift in Cruzism?
-
The enemy?
Thanks for proving my point, Bigun.
That's right my friend! The ENEMY! And I could care less what letter follows their name! If they are anti liberty progressives they are my sworn enemy and I will not retreat or surrender until they are completely and totally defeated!
Do I make myself clear?
“It is necessary for every American, with becoming energy to endeavor to stop the dissemination of principles evidently destructive of the cause for which they have bled. It must be the combined virtue of the rulers and of the people to do this, and to rescue and save their civil and religious rights from the outstretched arm of tyranny, which may appear under any mode or form of government.”
Mercy Warren, History of the Rise, Progress, and Termination of the American Revolution, 1805
-
Ted Cruz is the establishments worst nightmare and OUR champion!
:amen:
-
You think it was OK for Cruz to liken Republicans to Nazi enablers?
I knew this was another one of his lies as soon as I saw it.
-
So? A picture of Neville Chamberlain proves MY point, not yours.
Chamberlain is precisely who Ted Cruz was referring to. He enabled Hitler's plans. If that "proves your point", then you owe Mr. Cruz's supporters an apology.
-
Chamberlain is precisely who Ted Cruz was referring to. He enabled Hitler's plans. If that "proves your point", then you owe Mr. Cruz's supporters an apology.
Don't count on it.
That said, Chamberlain was a spineless stooge who was so easily bamboozled by Hitler that he would have given away the entire continent if Hitler had asked for it. You do not defeat a thug by backing down or appeasing him. You defeat the thug by standing up to him. Had the western powers stood up to Hitler, his little Nazi experiment might have just imploded in on itself since the entire thing was a house of cards and could only exist with conquest.
-
Chamberlain is precisely who Ted Cruz was referring to. He enabled Hitler's plans. If that "proves your point", then you owe Mr. Cruz's supporters an apology.
It proves my point that Cruz was equating Republicans who disagree with his tactics to Nazi enablers. What Cruz said is beside the point. Other than to advance his own career, Cruz's tactic did nothing.
-
What Cruz said is beside the point. :mauslaff:
Absolutely. How could it possibly matter?
-
Chamberlain has become a mythical figure in history.
At the time he "enabled" the Germans, neither Britain or the US wanted another world war. Hitler had yet to invade Poland, France or Russia.
Roosevelt kept the US out for as long as possible, because the "conservatives" of the day resisted strongly, and because the American people resisted.
So if Chamberlain "enabled" the Nazi, so too did Roosevelt, the US Congress, and American voters.
Read real history, not mythical rewritings of history.
-
I always like when someone tells me to read history or that I don't know it. :whistle:
-
I always like when someone tells me to read history or that I don't know it. :whistle:
Yep.. isn't your masters in History?
-
Yep.. isn't your masters in History?
Bachelor of Arts, History, Texas A&M University 2003
Master of Arts, American Military History, Sam Houston State University 2008
-
Don't count on it.
That said, Chamberlain was a spineless stooge who was so easily bamboozled by Hitler that he would have given away the entire continent if Hitler had asked for it. You do not defeat a thug by backing down or appeasing him. You defeat the thug by standing up to him. Had the western powers stood up to Hitler, his little Nazi experiment might have just imploded in on itself since the entire thing was a house of cards and could only exist with conquest.
Very much like many in the republican party today unfortunately!
-
Very much like many in the republican party today unfortunately!
My dad called them gutless wonders.
-
My dad called them gutless wonders.
I think I'll see if I can't start a trend by calling them Neville Chamberlain republicans!
Or maybe just republican surrender monkeys.
-
Chamberlain has become a mythical figure in history.
At the time he "enabled" the Germans, neither Britain or the US wanted another world war. Hitler had yet to invade Poland, France or Russia.
Roosevelt kept the US out for as long as possible, because the "conservatives" of the day resisted strongly, and because the American people resisted.
So if Chamberlain "enabled" the Nazi, so too did Roosevelt, the US Congress, and American voters.
Read real history, not mythical rewritings of history.
I have read "real" history, as well as taught it. So please allow me:
At the time he "enabled" the Germans, neither Britain or the US wanted another world war. Hitler had yet to invade Poland, France or Russia.
Really. As though anyone wanted another war. By late 1938, Hitler had created the largest and best-armed fighting force in the world; the size, composition, and activities of which (in addition to Nazi broadcast propaganda) made it plain to anyone willing and able to pay attention that Germany had intentions beyond reclaiming the the Saar Valley or the Sudentenland. The Blitzkrieg was not a surprise to those with access to news and information, except to the perpetually deluded.
Roosevelt kept the US out for as long as possible, because the "conservatives" of the day resisted strongly, and because the American people resisted.
Oh, you mean "conservatives" like the America First organization (a great number of whose members were supporters of perennial Socialist Presidential candidate Norman Thomas), or Charles Lindbergh and Joseph P. Kennedy (both noted anti-Semites)? FDR for his part never really trusted Hitler's intentions, nor did he shy away from supporting Britain in 1941 through the "Lend-Lease" program by which the US provided war materiel to them in defense of their homeland.
So if Chamberlain "enabled" the Nazi, so too did Roosevelt, the US Congress, and American voters.
I do not recall FDR or Congress concluding a non-aggression pact with Germany and then proudly declaring that they had achieved "peace in our time". As for the voters, they were weary of the Depression and understandably wary of foreign intrigue, given the recent experience of WWI, in which they and not the politicians in Washington had been suffered to fight in pursuit of objectives that were no longer at all evident by 1938.
Appeasement, as such, is not always due to poor character or evil intentions. Sometimes, people accept what they ought to fight simply because they are beaten down, or beaten up.
That, I believe is the case with Republicans who refuse to fight ObamaCare's implementation.
-
If Ted Cruz expects to lead a disparate Republican party (as Ronald Reagan did), he'd better stop with the vitriol and trashing members of his own party.
The Democrats are the opposition. Training fire on Republicans is counterproductive.
What are you talking about? You "train fire" on Republicans all the time. Its all about who's ox is being gored, right sinky?
-
What are you talking about? You "train fire" on Republicans all the time. Its all about who's ox is being gored, right sinky?
I'm not running for President as Cruz is. I don't have to work with Republicans. He does. Or, at least, he should.
-
I'm not running for President as Cruz is. I don't have to work with Republicans. He does. Or, at least, he should.
Peter King just called Cruz a government terrorist, among the names he was called by McCain. The GOP is doing the name calling, and won't accept a patriot who is guided by principle, rather than the go-along to get-along social club.
-
[quote[Appeasement, as such, is not always due to poor character or evil intentions. Sometimes, people accept what they ought to fight simply because they are beaten down, or beaten up.
That, I believe is the case with Republicans who refuse to fight ObamaCare's implementation.[/quote]
Or, they believe there's another way to do it, a better way that doesn't involve shutting down the government and breathing new life into Obama's approval numbers.
We're not beaten down, beaten up, or appeasers. We just disagree with Cruz's scorched earth approach.
-
Peter King just called Cruz a government terrorist, among the names he was called by McCain. The GOP is doing the name calling, and won't accept a patriot who is guided by principle, rather than the go-along to get-along social club.
Well, I'm no fan of Peter King, the former enabler of the Irish Republican Army. Perhaps both sides should stop the name-calling.
You make the same mistake Cruz does. You assert that those who disagree with Cruz have no principle. Now you don't actually believe that, but it makes you feel good.
-
You make the same mistake Cruz does. You assert that those who disagree with Cruz have no principle. Now you don't actually believe that, but it makes you feel good.
Don't tell me what makes me feel good. I don't feel good at all about what is happening to this country as a result of democrat/republican compromises. It makes me sick to my stomach. And, I wasn't merely talking about those who 'disagree' with Cruz, but those that call him names. He was duly elected, and is doing the job he promised to do. We can't ask for more than that, but we can ask the others to do more.
-
This quote was used on a previous thread.
I think it is quite apropos.
"Obviously you still don't get it, or choose not to, but I am unwilling to pursue the matter given that you are either obtuse, perhaps willfully so, or simply enjoy being a contrarian."
-
Well, I'm no fan of Peter King, the former enabler of the Irish Republican Army. Perhaps both sides should stop the name-calling.
You make the same mistake Cruz does. You assert that those who disagree with Cruz have no principle. Now you don't actually believe that, but it makes you feel good.
Now you've got insight into other's internal, subjective beliefs? Wow. Why are you wasting your time here when you could be making millions in Vegas?
-
(https://scontent-b-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/1375856_365328593600325_1078325783_n.jpg)
-
Don't tell me what makes me feel good. I don't feel good at all about what is happening to this country as a result of democrat/republican compromises. It makes me sick to my stomach. And, I wasn't merely talking about those who 'disagree' with Cruz, but those that call him names. He was duly elected, and is doing the job he promised to do. We can't ask for more than that, but we can ask the others to do more.
Sick to your stomach? Really? You need to take a break from politics.
-
Sick to your stomach? Really? You need to take a break from politics.
So do you.
-
So do you.
My stomach's fine.
You and I both know happyg was being hyperbolic.
-
My stomach's fine.
You and I both know happyg was being hyperbolic.
Stomachs aren't the only tell-tales.
-
Karl Rove, no Ted Cruz cheerleader told Greta Cruz was very impressive, smart, funny, engaging and a lot of other adjectives I cannot remember..... he was impressed was the gist of the interview tonight.
-
Karl Rove, no Ted Cruz cheerleader told Greta Cruz was very impressive, smart, funny, engaging and a lot of other adjectives I cannot remember..... he was impressed was the gist of the interview tonight.
hmmmm...compliments from Rove.
B E W A R E