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CNN)An EgyptAir flight heading from Paris to Cairo has disappeared from radar, the airline tweeted.
http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/18/middleeast/egyptair-flight-disappears/index.html
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58 Passengers 10 Crew 2 hours late...
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EgyptAir flight 804 from Paris to Cairo disappears from radar (http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/may/18/egyptair-flight-804-paris-cairo-disappears-radar/)
By Victor Morton - The Washington Times
Updated: 11:04 p.m. on Wednesday, May 18, 2016
An Egypt Air flight from Paris to Cairo has disappeared from radar, according to multiple news accounts citing the airline.
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They probably just pulled over for directions. Nothing to see here folks.
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The plane most likely crashed into the sea, Ihab Raslan, a spokesman for the Egyptian civil aviation authority, told SkyNews Arabia.
According to flightradar24.com, the plane's last known position was above the Mediterranean Sea.
Egypt's civil aviation ministry said search and rescue teams were looking for the missing jet. A ministry source also said technical information about the condition of the plane was being gathered.
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Reminder:
October 31, 1999
EgyptAir MS990
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37,000 feet no distress call, and just disappeared.
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Ship captain reported seeing a flash in the sky. Looks like possibility of an explosion.
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There are some reports indicating that EgyptAir said the plane faded from radar instead of disappeared. How that's significant, IDK, unless it means a gradual loss of signal versus a sudden loss.
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Latest report now says pilot made a distress call to the Egyptian military.
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Egyptian navy picks up electronic signal from crash.
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Latest report now says pilot made a distress call to the Egyptian military.
Reports are that it was an automated distress signal and not a distress call from the pilot.
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Reports are that it was an automated distress signal and not a distress call from the pilot.
Yes, but seems to be confusion about when the signal was first heard and from where it originated. It does appear to be catastrophic failure or explosion.
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EgyptAir flight from Paris to Cairo crashes in Mediterranean: Officials
An EgyptAir flight bound from Paris to Egypt has crashed in the Mediterranean, Egyptian officials said on Thursday.
The flight with 56 passengers, seven crew members and three security men aboard went missing overnight according to the airline. Contact was lost at 2:45 am Cairo time (0045 GMT) when the plane was just inside Egyptian airspace and at an altitude of 37,000 feet (11,000 metres).
30 Egyptians and 15 French were on board along with nationals from Iraq, Britain, Belgium, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Chad, Portugal, Algeria and Canada.
- See more at: http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/airegypt-flight-paris-egypt-crashes-mediterranean-377822798#sthash.pLS39xDO.dpuf
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Joint Rescue Team Deployed To Search For Missing Flight - Egyptian Military
http://www.bernama.com/bernama/v8/wn/newsworld.php?id=1247218
CAIRO, May 19 (Bernama) -- A joint rescue team has been deployed to search for the EgyptAir flight which disappeared from radar screens early Thursday, the Egyptian military spokesman said in a statement.
"As the Armed Forces are following the developments of the Egyptian missing plane of EgyptAir, the search is currently underway by searching jets.
"Egyptian military rescue boats have also been sent, in cooperation with Greece, to search in the place of disappearance," China's Xinhua news agency reported the statement as saying.
The ill-fated EgyptAir MS840, an Airbus 320, was carrying 56 passengers - 30 Egyptians, 15 French and 11 from other nationalities, plus three security staffers and seven crew numbers.
The plane, which was on its way from Paris to Cairo, lost contact with radar at 2:45 a.m. Cairo time (0045 GMT) Thursday at an altitude of 37,000 feet (11,280 meters) and 10 miles (16 km) inside Egyptian airspace, MENA reported, quoting an official source in the Egyptian airlines.
The airlines said the aircraft commander has accumulated 6,275 flying hours, including 2,101 hours on the same plane model, and the co-pilot has 2,766 flying hours.
The plane, which was made in 2003, left Paris at 11:09 p.m. local time (2109 GMT) on Wednesday night for a scheduled three-hour-45-minute journey.
EgyptAir said it's following the situation through an integrated operation centre.
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Mirror (http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/egyptair-flight-ms804-missing-live-8003059):
Egyptair flight MS804 missing: live updates as plane vanishes with 66 on board 'almost certainly caused by attack'
Updated 12:48, 19th May 2016
By Natalie Evans , Jon Dean
The former chief of France’s air accident investigation unit said the airbus A320's disappearance suggested a 'brutal event'
What we know so far:
•Egyptair flight MS804 with 66 people on board including one Brit crashed according Egyptian aviation officials
•But Egyptair say reason for disappearance hasn’t been yet confirmed
•Jean-Paul Troadec, the former chief of France’s air accident investigation unit, the BEA, said the disappearance suggested a "brutal event" and was “almost certainly” caused by “an attack
•The plane took off from Paris Charles de Gaulle Airport at 11.09pm and went missing at 2.45am on route to Cairo International
•The Greek Merchant Navy has reported seeing a "flame in the sky" in the south Mediterranean ...
Jean-Paul Troadec, the former chief of the BEA national investigation unit, said there was a “strong possibility” the plane disappeared due to a suicide bomber.
Speaking to Europe 1 radio station in Paris, he said: “There’s a strong possibility of an explosion on board from a bomb or a suicide bomber.
“The idea of a technical accident when weather conditions were good, seems almost possible but not that likely. We could also consider a missile, which is what happened to the Malaysia Airlines aircraft in July 2014.” ...
More at link.
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And, of course, the fear-mongering opportunist is up at 4 am cynically exploiting a tragedy for his own ends:
Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
Looks like yet another terrorist attack. Airplane departed from Paris. When will we get tough, smart and vigilant? Great hate and sickness!
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We could also consider a missile, which is what happened to the Malaysia Airlines aircraft in July 2014.
When did we find out that a missile took down MH370?
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When did we find out that a missile took down MH370?
I think even Senator Cruz or perhaps Rubio have said as much. I'll believe them and not a kleptocracy.
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An EgyptAir flight from Paris to Cairo made two sharp turns before plunging into the Mediterranean Sea, Greece's defence minister says.
Mr Kammenos said: "The picture we have at the moment on the accident as it emerges from the Greek air force operations centre is that the aircraft was approximately 10-15 miles inside the Egyptian FIR [flight information region] and at an altitude of 37,000 feet.
"It turned 90 degrees left and then a 360-degree turn toward the right, dropping from 37,000 to 15,000 feet and then it was lost at about 10,000 feet."
Egyptian Aviation Minister Sherif Fathi said: "Let's not try to jump to the side that is trying to identify this as a technical failure - on the contrary.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-36333992
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When did we find out that a missile took down MH370?
A Russian missile took down MH 17 over the Ukraine in July 2014.They are still finding pieces of what is believed to be MH 370 in the Indian Ocean but I don't think they have found enough of it to say for sure whether it was a missile or pilot sabotage or mechanical failure...
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I think even Senator Cruz or perhaps Rubio have said as much. I'll believe them and not a kleptocracy.
There is no evidence whatsoever that a missle took down that Malaysian flight.
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Debris Found
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/ci0svcywuaawdd9.jpg)
Two bodies and pieces of debris have been found in the search of missing EgyptAir Flight MS804 - just hours after the plane plunged 22,000 feet into the sea, it is reported.
The corpses, which have not yet been identified, were discovered in the south Mediterranean by a Greek frigate this afternoon, according to Al Arabiya news channel.
They were uncovered in the same spot as two large plastic floating objects, which were seen close to an area where a transponder signal was emitted earlier.
The objects, which appeared to be pieces of plastic in white and red, are believed to be debris from the missing plane, Greek defence sources said.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/egyptair-flight-ms804-missing-radar-8003055
The crew of the missing flight were threatened days before the incident, claims Sharif Mehera, a former EgyptAir pilot, who describes himself as a close friend of the captain of the Airbus A320 that disappeared.
He told (LINK) LifeNews that someone wrote a menacing message on the hull of one of the planes.
The message was in Arabic, and read: “the next murder will be the flight number SU-GCC,” Mehera said, adding that it was exactly the flight number of the missing plane and that all security services were aware of this incident."
End of quote.
https://www.rt.com/news/343512-egyptair-missing-flight-search/
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/debris.jpg)
http://metro.co.uk/2016/05/19/debris-found-in-sea-in-search-for-crashed-egyptair-flight-5892705/
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"It turned 90 degrees left and then a 360-degree turn toward the right, dropping from 37,000 to 15,000 feet and then it was lost at about 10,000 feet."
If it was a controlled descent I could see this being a loss of pressurization, followed by a breakup at ~10,000 feet. A bomb could certainly do that.
The turning behavior is odd. Could be some sort of control failure, or it could be evasive action of some sort.
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The detail that jumped out at me immediately was the presence of 10 crew members. That's a large number, even considering three were security personnel.
I wonder if EgyptAir's security protocols are different for their crew members than the general public?
This might be ghoulish speculation - but I would not be surprised if one or more of the crew members were complicit.
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The detail that jumped out at me immediately was the presence of 10 crew members. That's a large number, even considering three were security personnel.
I wonder if EgyptAir's security protocols are different for their crew members than the general public?
This might be ghoulish speculation - but I would not be surprised if one or more of the crew members were complicit.
Your speculation makes sense to me. Why did the plane go down ten miles off the coast of Egypt? Could it be a crew member waiting until the plane was in Egyptian space, knowing how lax Egyptian investigations of air disasters are?
Sabotage by crew seems more likely to me.
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Your speculation makes sense to me. Why did the plane go down ten miles off the coast of Egypt? Could it be a crew member waiting until the plane was in Egyptian space, knowing how lax Egyptian investigations of air disasters are?
Sabotage by crew seems more likely to me.
48 paying passengers is about 1/3 full for an A320 so it would be easy for some EgyptAir employee to show up last minute for a "deadhead" lift to Cairo. From a usual staffing point of view, that plane would have two previously scheduled pilots and three FAs. That would imply the three Air Marshalls and two deadheaders were along for the ride.
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Sabotage by crew seems more likely to me.
Since no "mayday", until more info is known, I would speculate a bomb timed to go off over Med. I originally speculated a bomb triggered to go off upon descent, however Flightaware does not show descent (i.e. 370 at event).
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/MSR804/history/20160518/2045Z/LFPG/HECA/tracklog
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The plane disappeared at 0245 -- wouldn't it have been dark then?
I had been wondering about that. I will delete.
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(http://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13254216_10207072274387810_8196858851524237803_n.jpg?oh=7b8c11b7087c1fba800dacab31407170&oe=57D1D8FE)
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Trump tweets: Looks like yet another terrorist attack. Airplane departed from Paris. When will we get tough, smart and vigilant? Great hate and sickness!
So I'm wondering if the Trumpsters here have any idea exactly what the American President should do to protect Planes flying for Egyptian Air leaving Paris and heading for Egypt?
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Shoot first, find out the truth later.
Yeah, that's exactly what we want in a CIC.
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Destroy ISIS, take their oil and break them financially.
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Shoot first, find out the truth later.
Yeah, that's exactly what we want in a CIC.
13859
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Destroy ISIS, take their oil and break them financially.
And will that protect flights from Paris to Egypt?
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13859
Maybe we can use taxpayer dollars to install American TSA workers in every major airport in the world???
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Maybe we can use taxpayer dollars to install American TSA workers in every major airport in the world???
Yeah, that's working. :whistle:
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Trump tweets: Looks like yet another terrorist attack. Airplane departed from Paris. When will we get tough, smart and vigilant? Great hate and sickness!
So I'm wondering if the Trumpsters here have any idea exactly what the American President should do to protect Planes flying for Egyptian Air leaving Paris and heading for Egypt?
WE=civilized people of the world. French and Egyptians weren't the only victims.
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EgyptAir crash has markings of Muslim Brotherhood operation
'Look at who stands to benefit'
Published: 8 hours ago
The fate of EgyptAir Flight MS-804 has once again thrown the media spotlight on Paris, France, where the plane took off for Cairo before going down over the Mediterranean Sea.
All 66 people aboard perished.
U.S. intelligence agencies said the crash exhibited “indications of an explosion.”
The airliner, only 13 years old, was cruising at high altitude in good weather conditions when it suddenly went down. There was no call of distress.
While much of the media has focused on Paris as the location where a terrorist could have loaded a bomb onto the plane, an expert of Egyptian politics and the Muslim Brotherhood says look again at Cairo.
The plane left Cairo for Paris and then was on a return flight to Cairo when it went down.
It only sat on the ground in Paris for an hour, said Dr. Mark Christian, founder and president of the Global Faith Institute, an Omaha-Nebraska-based think tank that focuses on Islamic terrorism.
image: http://www.wnd.com/files/2014/09/Dr.-Mark-Christian-289x300.jpg
Dr. Mark Christian grew up in a prominent Muslim family in Egypt and converted to Christianity as an adult. He has been disowned by his family.
Dr. Mark Christian grew up in a prominent Muslim family in Egypt and converted to Christianity as an adult. He has been disowned by his family.
Christian, who grew up in Egypt the son of a Muslim Brotherhood member and became a child imam by the age of 14, says the Brotherhood has the most to gain from a terror attack on EgyptAir and has been active in a string of terror attacks recently in the country.
Eight national police officers were killed in an ambush as they got off a government minivan in central Cairo May 8. Five former police officers suspected of carrying out the attack remain on the run.
A string of fires have been set at Egyptian tourist sites within the last two weeks.
The economy is in shambles with inflation approaching 40 percent.
The government of President Abdel Fattah el-Sisi is seen as vulnerable, and the Muslim Brotherhood would like nothing better than to topple him.
“Nobody can dispute that the Muslim Brotherhood is doing whatever they can to turn the tide and remove the military from power and take over Egypt again and oust the current administration of Sisi that is backed up by the Russians and has been estranged from America and the West,” Christian said. “To take out Sisi, you have to do three things: destroy the economy, stability and security of the country.”
The fires set at tourist sites strike at the heart of Egypt’s economy. The attacks on the police by insiders strikes at the national security apparatus.
“This is all meant to weaken Sisi and show he’s not capable of running the country,” Christian said.
The fact that the plane was only on the ground in Paris for an hour makes it unlikely someone was able to sneak a bomb onto the flight. The French are known to have one of the tightest airport security systems in the world and would have been on high alert give the recent terror attacks there.
“If you look at the circumstances of this attack, it is not a coincidence that the last several incidents took place in Egypt, the first being the Russian plane downed over the Sinai killing all 224 passengers and now this, all in a matter of six months. So you look at this and see there is a pattern, and who is benefiting from this? ISIS is not. The Muslim Brotherhood is.”
Christian says the obvious gap in security was in Egypt, “where you already have police officers turning into terrorists and you have people warring against each other. So it seems like something was put on the plane while sitting in Egypt. And so if it was a timed bomb, it exploded six hours after leaving Egypt.”
Recent attacks on tourist sites, security forces
What does the militant wing of the Muslim Brotherhood stand to benefit from this?
When Sisi took over Egypt and led a coup against the former Brotherhood-backed regime of Muhammad Morsi, he promised Egyptians he would lead them into prosperity and would keep them safe. He has not delivered on those promises, and now the Brotherhood smells its chance to return to power.
“Destroy the Egyptian tourist industry and expose the gaps in security, making Sisi look weak and leaving Egypt with more instability and economic distress,” Christian said. “All of this is an embarrassment for Sisi not only nationally but internationally as a man who cannot keep his country safe and as a man who is destroying the Egyptian economy.”
The Obama administration has done nothing to help bolster Sisi, as it has sided in the past with Morsi and the Brotherhood.
“The only organization that would benefit from this crime is not ISIS but the Muslim Brotherhood, and the Muslim Brotherhood and ISIS are one in the same anyway,” Christian said.
Christian said the Brotherhood has a secret militant wing that is involved in much of the dirty work of planning and fomenting terrorism in the Middle East.
“They work in concert with the non-militant political wing,” he said. “This is the key to the Brotherhood’s success from day one back to the 1940s.”
Phil Haney, a former Customs and Border Patrol officer who served two terms with Homeland Security’s National Targeting Center, said he agrees with Christian, especially in light of the activities of groups such as Hamas, and/or ISIS, which are operating in Egypt today, as well as other armed Muslim Brotherhood-affiliated groups operating in Jordan, Libya, Syria and Tunisia.
“The revelation came as security experts, ministers and former air accident investigators said all the evidence pointed to the plane being targeted in a terrorist attack,” said Haney, author of “See Something Say Nothing: A Homeland Security Officer Exposes the Government’s Submission to Jihad.”
“If confirmed, the disaster would deal another hammer blow to Egypt’s crippled tourism industry just months after a Russian Metrojet plane was brought down in the Sinai peninsula by a bomb planted at Sharm el-Sheikh airport,” Haney said.
ISIS has been waging a deadly insurgency against Egyptian security forces and last October claimed the bombing of the Russian airliner that killed all 224 people on board.
The EgyptAir plane that crashed into the Mediterranean had flown to terror hotspots in Tunisia, Eritrea and Belgium in the days before the disaster.
If a bomb was not loaded aboard the plane in Cairo, it could have occurred in one of these other hotspots, Haney said.
More than 20 people were killed in the Tunisian capital, Tunis, in March last year when two Islamist militants stormed the Bardo Museum.
Meanwhile, Ethiopian authorities said last week they had thwarted a terror attack by jihadists who trained and armed in Eritrea’s capital of Asmara.
“If it turns out that the apparent bomb was place on board in Paris, then it becomes obvious that a sophisticated network of terrorist operatives has been established in France, and that they are operating with near impunity,” Haney said.
A ‘game changer’ for airport security?
“If the apparent bomb was placed on board before Flight MS804 arrived in Paris, this would engender a whole new set of questions and concerns, not only about the level of security at each one of the three other airports, but also about the affiliations and sophistication of the individuals involved in planning and coordinating such an attack.”
Haney said Western intelligence will be mistaken if they believe only ISIS would carry out an attack like this.
“These kind of attacks benefit an entire coalition of affiliated Salafi jihadist groups, which are all part of the global Islamic movement,” Haney said, and that global movement is headed by the Muslim Brotherhood.
Christian said the destruction of Egypt Air Flight 803 is a “game changer,” especially if it turns out that airport security personnel in Cairo were involved in planting the bomb on board the plane.
“This plane going down is a complete game changer, because since 9/11 aviation security has been focused on the passengers and their luggage, but now you have planes coming from jihadist areas, and you have no idea how they have been screened. And they may come to the West and to America as a ticking bomb,” he said.
“If they can time one to go off in six hours, then they can push it to 11 hours, and that means a plane can explode after leaving New York City having come from Cairo. So here they are screening people and luggage, but now you have a plane that is exploding as it takes off with a timed bomb. For American aviation, that is a huge big deal. And if you are going to miss that perspective, then we can miss a ticking bomb that is targeting America.”
Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2016/05/egyptair-crash-has-markings-of-muslim-brotherhood-operation/#6gv7ZcQRS8wvvO8C.99
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Live updates: EgyptAir 804 wreckage, body parts found, authorities say
Egypt said it has located parts of the missing EgyptAir plane in the Mediterranean Sea Friday. Yahoo News is live-blogging the latest developments. (Egyptian Defense Ministry)
Airplane seats, a body part, and luggage items have been spotted by crews searching for the wreckage of EgyptAir flight 804, authorities said. The plane bound from Paris to Cairo, carrying 66 passengers and crew members, crashed in the Mediterranean Sea after disappearing from the radar early Thursday. What brought down the flight has not been determined. Yahoo News is following the latest developments in the live blog below. ...
More at link, Yahoo News (https://www.yahoo.com/news/egyptair-flight-804-crash-missing-000000139.html)
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Debris, body part and luggage found from EgyptAir flight: Egyptian military
#EgyptAir
Egyptian military say debris and body part from missing EgyptAir plane have been found, as families mourn deaths of 66 people onboard
A relative of a passenger who was aboard the EgyptAir flight cries at Cairo airport on Thursday (AFP)
MEE and agencies's picture
MEE and agencies
Friday 20 May 2016 06:56 UTC
Last update:
Friday 20 May 2016 11:42 UTC
Debris found in the Mediterranean on Friday is believed to be from missing EgyptAir flight MS804, the Egyptian military has said.
The Egyptian military's official spokesman said on Facebook that the debris, which included passengers belongings and parts of the aircraft, was found in an area of the Mediterranean 290km north of Alexandria. Reuters has reported that the Egyptian Navy are searching for the plane's black box.
The Greek defence minister Panos Kammenos later said Egyptian vessels had spotted a body part, two seats and suitcases in search for the EgyptAir plane. He added that data clearly shows that the aircraft took sharp turns and plunged, but said the analysis is for experts to determine, according to Reuters.
Flight MS804 was en route from Paris to Cairo with 66 passengers and crew onboard when it vanished early on Thursday morning.
Egyptian President Abdel Fattah al-Sisi has expressed his condolences to the families of the victims. In a statement released by his office, he said: “The presidency with utmost sadness and regret mourns the victims on board the EgyptAir flight who were killed after the plane crashed in the Mediterranean on its way back to Cairo from Paris.”
Egypt's aviation minister said on Thursday that while it was too soon to say why the Airbus A320 flying from Paris to Cairo had vanished from radar screens, a "terrorist" attack was a far more likely scenario than a technical failure, an analysis widely backed up by aviation experts.
However, on Friday, France's foreign minister said there was still "absolutely no indication" about what had caused the crash in which all 66 passengers and crew are feared to have been killed.
"We're looking at all possibilities, but none is being favoured over the others because we have absolutely no indication on the causes [of the crash]," Jean-Marc Ayrault told French television.
The French government will meet families of the victims on Saturday in order to "provide all the information we can," Ayrault added.
No group has as yet claimed the bombing, although suspicion has fallen on the Islamic State (IS) group, which has attacked both France and Egypt in the past year. The group took responsibility for the bombing of a Russian passenger jet over the Sinai last year that killed all 224 people on board within 10 hours of the attack.
EgyptAir says that there were 56 passengers on the Cairo-bound flight, including three children, as well as 10 crew members including three security personnel, a setup the airline described as standard practice.
Greek Defence Minister Panos Kammenos said the aircraft swerved sharply twice in Egyptian airspace before plunging 22,000 feet (6,700 metres) and disappearing from radar screens about an hour before it was due to land in Cairo. Mixed reports have emerged about whether the plane sent out a distress signal or not.
A Greek aviation source said the flight had disappeared from Greek radar at around 0029 GMT on Thursday, around 130 miles off the island of Karpathos.
Greek civil aviation chief Constantinos Litzerakos said the pilot had mentioned no problem in the last communication before the plane disappeared, and it had not deviated from its course.
"The flight controllers contacted the pilot at a height of 37,000 feet [near Athens]... he did not mention a problem," Litzerakos told Greece's Antenna TV. EgyptAir's Adel also said there had been "no distress call" before the plane vanished.
Neither the Greek coastguard nor the navy could confirm reports that a passing ship had seen "a ball of fire in the sky".
The civil aviation chief said if there had been an explosion, any debris would have been scattered across a wide area.
The head of Greece’s air traffic control board, Serafeim Petrou, told the Guardian that it was certain the plane had crashed, but that it was likely “at the bottom of the sea” which would make recovery operations extremely difficult.
“Nothing can be excluded. An explosion could be a possibility, but then so could damage to the fuselage,” he said.
- See more at: http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/confusion-over-egyptair-crash-mounts-search-operations-intensify-825521160#sthash.Xt3GlxU6.dpuf
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Latest Update
Egypt finds belongings, debris from plane crash at sea
Reuters - By Ahmed Aboulenein - May 20, 2016
The Egyptian navy said on Friday it had found the personal belongings of passengers and other debris floating in the Mediterranean, confirmation that an EgyptAir jet had plunged into the sea with 66 people on board.
The military said it had found the debris about 290 km (180 miles) north of the port city of Alexandria and was searching for the plane’s black box flight recorders...
Friday’s announcement that debris had been found followed earlier confusion about whether wreckage had been located. Greek searchers found some material on Thursday, but the airline later said this was not from its plane.
A European satellite spotted a 2 km-long oil slick in the Mediterranean, about 40 km southeast of the aircraft’s last position, the European Space Agency said...
Khaled al-Gameel, head of crew at EgyptAir, said the pilot, Mahamed Saeed Ali Shouqair, had 15 years’ experience and was in charge of training and mentoring younger pilots.
“He comes from a pilot family; his uncle was a high ranking pilot at EgyptAir and his cousin is also a pilot,” Gameel said. “He was very popular and was known for taking it upon himself to settle disputes any two colleagues were having.”...
http://www.oann.com/egyptair-says-flight-from-paris-to-cairo-missing/
The aircraft involved, registered under SU-GCC was MSN (Manufacturer Serial Number) 2088 delivered to Egyptair from the production line in November 2003. The aircraft had accumulated approximately 48,000 flight hours. It was powered by IAE engines.
https://www.facebook.com/airbus/?fref=nf
"If an aircraft breaks up at flight/cruise altitude (in this case FL370), for whatever cause, and assuming this is what may have happened, inherent inertial forces and of course drag opposing the inertial direction and gravity acting in the vertical direction and external forces (i.e. winds aloft) act on an (unpowered) aircraft (or aircraft debris).
It appears that MSR804 was following a flight path including overflying RAPOS WP and KUMBI WP (reported to be the approximate last radar position of MSR804 at around 0030Z). Therefore looking at the flight path direction and coordinates being reported for the last radar contact position at approximately KUMBI WP and the reported coordinates for the found/located ocean debris, it appears logical that the aircraft (or aircraft debris if truly an inflight breakup) continued on a forward inertial path while being displaced E by winds aloft (at the last position time, being roughly 280 Deg. True at 75 Knots at FL370 at both HECA and LGKP) while descending.
At a reported approximately 530 NM/Hr ground speed at FL370 at the time of lost radar contact the aircraft (or debris) would have been moving over the ground (ocean) at around 9 NM/ minute and then (unpowered) decelerating while descending, and along with the reported winds aloft acting almost directly from the West displacing the debris to the East. IMO the ocean debris location found around 60 NM Left of the course at the reported last radar position seems logical relative to a potential inflight breakup (from whatever cause) at FL370."
3000 or more meters in that area...
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/med.png)
How can we explain the registration SUGBZ and not SUGCC on this list?
Was the plane swapped at the last moment? Perhaps with one from the hangar, with maintenance issues? SU-GBZ is a 320, so this rules out my initial fear that a 737 crew was piloting a 320... (earlier in the thread, it was mentioned that the flight was usually operated with a 737).
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/89743740_aircraft_movements_inf624-01.png)
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/6699699#246
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ACARS (Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System) Messages (SU-GCC):
00:26Z 3044 ANTI ICE R WINDOW
00:26Z 561200 R SLIDING WINDOW SENSOR
00:26Z 2600 SMOKE LAVATORY SMOKE
00:27Z 2600 AVIONICS SMOKE
00:28Z 561100 R FIXED WINDOW SENSOR
00:29Z 2200 AUTO FLT FCU 2 FAULT
00:29Z 2700 F/CTL SEC 3 FAULT
no further ACARS messages were received
ACARS Indications are:
1- problem with first officer window heating system
2- problem with first officer sliding window sensor
3- smoke detected in the lavatory and probably will the one just behind the cockpit
4- avionics smoke detected which is beneath the cockpit
5- fault with the sensor of the first officer front fixed window
6- flight control unit FCU 2 fault, the unit to used all flight trajectory short term manual orders
7- SEC 3 the Spoiler Elevator Computer number 3 fault, as its name implies controls part of the spoilers and is aback up for elevator control.
MS804 Synopsis
==============
Background
1. 66 people were on board. None of the people on the manifest were on a terrorism watchlist.
2. Leaked passenger list: According to a leaked passenger list, only very few of the passengers have a non-Arabic name. A leaked passenger list can be found on a anti-Muslim website http://www.shoebat.com
2.1 Strangely, the plane mentioned on the leaked crew list is SU-GBZ, but at least two confirmed victims (among them, French photographer Pascal Hess) do appear on the passenger list.
2. Earlier that day, SU-GCC flew to Eritrea and Tunis, returning to CAI each time.
3. According to BBC, no terrorist organization has credibly claimed responsibility.
Flight History
--------------
1. Flight entered Athens FIR at 2:24 AM. Last successful communication was at 2:48, the flight was cleared to the exit of Athens FIR. "The pilot was jocund and thanked in Greek."
1.1 Several ACARS messages beginning at 3:26 AM:
00:26Z 3044 ANTI ICE R WINDOW
00:26Z 561200 R SLIDING WINDOW SENSOR
00:26Z 2600 SMOKE LAVATORY SMOKE
2. At 3:27, Athens ACC tried to communicate with the flight, to hand it over to the Cairo FIR. Repetitive calls, also on the emergency frequency, went without any response. At the same time, 0:27Z, there was the "2600 AVIONICS SMOKE ACARS" message.
2.1 ACARS message:
00:28Z 561100 R FIXED WINDOW SENSOR
3. The flight passed the FIR boundary at 3:29 AM. At the same time, these ACARS messages were sent:
00:29Z 2200 AUTO FLT FCU 2 FAULT
00:29Z 2700 F/CTL SEC 3 FAULT
After those, no more ACARS messages were received.
At 3:29:40 AM, the flight was lost from ATC radar, almost 7 nm southeast of KUMBI (KUMBI lies on the FIR boundary). The Greek Air Force was called, they were unable to track the plane with their radars (as it had already crashed at this time).
4. The aircraft stayed at FL370, at least when the transponder was still working.
5. Supposedly, the Greek Air Force's primary radars did record the plane's flight. "It turned 90 degrees left and then a 360-degree turn toward the right, dropping from 38,000 to 15,000 feet and then it was lost at about 10,000 feet." (Paul Kammenos, Greek minister of defense)
Search
------
1. First debris spotted at around noon of May 20th.
2. Possible oil slick photographed by the European Space Agency's Sentinel satellite.
--------------
Thanks to Flying Turtle for his work on the chronology of events.
I have three remarks to make:
1/- It's still very early news and, as usual, information arrives in bits and pieces, very often very contradictory. There isn't a reliable source of news except specialised media and officials... and even then...
2/- Theories and assumptions are fine... provided they have some logical basis :
- " I think this happened (....x....) because of this info..." The usual wild guesses about fuel starvation and stall / spin, for the time being have absolutely no basis whatsoever.
3/- Accident investigations are a fine balance between causes and effects , appearances and realities, technical and human failures, all those in a very dynamic environment : weather, air traffic...
Here, for instance we have two sets of apparent facts :
A/- A turn, followed by a rapid descent, another turn ion the opposite direction, a steeper descent until a target signal loss around 15 000 feet.
B/- A set of ACARS messages which need to be qualified:
1/- ANTI ICE RIGHT WINDOW / RIGHT SLIDING WINDOW SENSOR / RIGHT FIXED WINDOW SENSOR : Of these, only the first one is displayed to the crew, indicating a fault in the RHS window heating : the panes are no longer heated.
2/- SMOKE LAVATORY SMOKE / AVIONICS SMOKE . Onlyt the Lav smoke would trigger an alarm, the avionionics smoke is just a level 2 caution. On this aspect one should be really basic about the info / warning / advisory : *smoke* means the detectors and the system are seeing smoke in the affected compartment : It doesn't mean a fire had started there. On this fire and smoke protection system, one has to say that there is no sensor (that I know of ) and no indication / warning of a COCKPIT SMOKE, for obvious reasons : there are two - or more - pairs of eyes and nostrils in that flight deck.
3/- AUTO FLIGHT : FCU 2 FAULT / FLIGHT CONTROLS : SEC 3 FAULT . Only the second triggers a caution. FCU 2 Fault means that , had the FO been the PF, A/P #2 would have disconnected, causing even more disorder on the flight deck. Otherwise, it has no real impact on the flight conduct.
Now, with all the above in mind, what can we seriously say ?
- The absence of a MAYDAY call seems to point toward a very sudden event that became rapidly unmanageable : IMHO the only event that could have happened was a fire. A violent fire which started either in the avionics bay or in the cockpit.
The fire quickly destroyed most of the electronics, which is the reason there is no more ACARS messages - that we know of - just three minutes after the events initiation at 00:26 Z.
What caused the fire ? culprits abound : shorts / laptop batteries / cigarette.... or plain sabotage or bomb...
Wherever the fire started, the cockpit was one of the most affected volumes on that aircraft ; it must have been a very uncomfortable place to be in...
Pihero
At the moment, it looks like a Sub-Bus of the DC-Bus 2 system that's affected. I think this is more of a fire in avionics bay, although I wouldn't rule out an actual cockpit fire...
mandalla499
Source: airliners.net (http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/6700324/2/1460764637#157)
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOnMKPX31MQ
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/13240638_833996213398029_3156357189212636919_n.jpg)
Egypt officials claim to locate EgyptAir black boxes
CBS/AP May 21, 2016, 6:16 AM
Search crews located the data recorders for EgyptAir Flight 804 close to an area where human remains and debris from the crashed flight have been found, Egyptian government sources confirmed to CBS News on Saturday.
Also Saturday, the French air accident investigation agency said smoke was detected in multiple places on the flight moments before it plummeted into the Mediterranean, but the cause of the crash that killed all 66 on board remains unclear.
On Friday, sources told CBS News that information was transmitted from the flight indicating that smoke was detected on the plane before it crashed.
According to the sources, the information indicates smoke was coming from one of the engines. The data was transmitted through the Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System, which sends snapshots of engine performance throughout the flight...
The spokesman's Facebook page later posted a brief video that showed more debris, including what appeared to be a piece of blue carpet, seat belts, a shoe and what looked like a woman's white handbag. The short clip opened with aerial footage of an unidentified navy ship followed by a speed boat with five service members aboard heading toward floating debris.
gyptian authorities said they believe terrorism is a more likely explanation than equipment failure, and some aviation experts have said the erratic flight suggests a bomb blast or a struggle in the cockpit. But so far no hard evidence has emerged.
No militant group has claimed to have brought down the aircraft. That is a contrast to the downing of a Russian jet in October over Egypt's Sinai Peninsula that killed all 224 on board. In that case, the Sinai branch of the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria, or ISIS, issued a claim of responsibility within hours. On Friday, ISIS issued a statement on clashes with the Egyptian military in Sinai, but said nothing about the plane crash.
Three European security officials said on Friday that the passenger manifest for Flight 804 contained no names on terrorism watch lists. The officials spoke to the AP on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss the investigation. The manifest was leaked online and has not been verified by the airline.
Further checks are being conducted on relatives of the passengers.
French aviation investigators have begun to check and question all baggage handlers, maintenance workers, gate agents and other ground crew members at Charles de Gaulle Airport who had a direct or indirect link to the plane before it took off, according to a French judicial official. The official was not authorized to discuss the investigation and spoke to the AP on condition of anonymity.
Whatever caused the aircraft to crash, the tragedy will most likely deepen Egypt's difficult predicament as it struggles to revive a battered economy and contain an increasingly resilient insurgency by Islamic militants...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRZlfCIb8qE
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/ht_egypt-debris-1_12x5_1600-e1463838061274.jpg)
Quoting mandala499 (http://www.airliners.net/profile/mandala499):
it looks like a Sub-Bus of the DC-Bus 2 system that's affected. I think this is more of a fire in avionics bay,
As usual, Buddy, you have a knack for complexities... And here, we have one which could go very far.
1/- Electrical fire in the Avionics Bay:
What is galling is that the right window(s) anti-icing is ruled by the WHC - window heating computer - which is in turn powered by DC BUS 2. That bus seems to be rather involved : SEC 3 and FCU 2 are amongst the systems it furnishes power to.
There now comes the big problem : DC BUS 2 powers a lot more systems and as a matter of fact, one is left with FAC 1 ELAC 1 and SEC 1... The F/O has lost his static sensor ---> needs to switch to ADR 3... One's lost three spoilers per side... and those haven't been ACARS transmitted.
The only explanation that makes sense is a fire, are we to consider that its progression was very fast and it destroyed basically most of the communications capability of the flight in less than four minutes.
On that subject, we have to consider that the detected smoke should have triggered a QRH procedure, here the AVIONICS SMOKE... and guess what ? the procedure could lead to an ELEC EMER CONFIG situation and com-wise, one is left with only VHF1... no bloody ACARS possible.
2/- Fire in the cockpit:
I'm afraid we have to consider the possibility of an event similar to the B-777 Nefertiti on ground at Cairo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3Z8_u6ll18).
What is of note is that the wires to the sliding window sensors / heaters run very close to the pilots' O2 masks stowage, and we have basically a continuous table running parallel to the fuselage skin from the instrument panel to the circuit breakers boards behind the pilots, on which to store a book, a laptop...etc... the O2 mask hose would add a lot to a fire in this area.
Then, the already polluted cockpit air would go to the avionics bay, for cooling, then be evacuated through the extract duct / fan where it would be scanned for particles. Then, and only then we would have a "Smoke" warning.
Pihero (http://www.airliners.net/profile/pihero)
Additional Reference Material:
Smartcockpit Docs (http://www.smartcockpit.com/plane/airbus/a320.html)
Airbus Training Notes (http://www.airbusdriver.net/airbusnotes.pdf)
Flightcrew Training Manual (http://air.felisnox.com/view.php?name=a318.pdf)
AF Flight 447 – ACARS Messages Decoded (https://luckybogey.wordpress.com/2009/06/29/af-flight-447-acars-messages-decoded/) (For comparison purposes only)
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According to the sources, the information indicates smoke was coming from one of the engines. The data was transmitted through the Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System, which sends snapshots of engine performance throughout the flight...
Not sure how CBS/AP came to this conclusion since the ACARS messages did not include any engine trouble? If true, then EgyptAir probably subscribed to real time engine monitoring.
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http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/EgyptAir-black-boxes-located/2016/05/21/id/730021/
(http://www.newsmax.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?guid=c47cdb6d-23ee-4d43-9b63-6096a71f0521&SiteName=Newsmax&maxsidesize=600)
Newsmax
Report: EgyptAir Black Boxes Located in Mediterranean Sea
Saturday, May 21, 2016 06:11 PM
By: Todd Beamon
The flight-data recorders for EgyptAir Flight 804 have been found near where human remains and other debris from the crashed flight have been located, an Egyptian government source said Saturday.
The "black boxes" — painted bright orange — were approximately located by their pings, and recovery efforts were underway, a U.S. intelligence source told CBS News.
The devices store key flight metrics and sounds from the cockpit that could definitively detail what downed the plane.
Egyptian media, including state-owned media, also reported the same development, CBS reports, though no official confirmation has been released.
In addition, EgyptAir officials would not confirm or deny that the black boxes have been located, according to CBS.
The development comes after French investigators said Saturday that smoke was detected in multiple places on the flight moments before it plummeted into the Mediterranean Sea early Tuesday, but that the cause of the crash that killed all 66 on board remained unclear.
The electronic signals offer a puzzling twist to what may have happened to the flight. Two error messages, the first at 2:26 a.m. local time, suggested there was a fire on board, while later alerts indicated some type of failure in the plane’s electrical equipment.
While similar signals have preceded air accidents in the past, the warnings aren’t associated with a sudden disappearance from radar as occurred with the Airbus A320 jet.
A Malaysian Airlines flight shot down over Ukrainian airspace in July 2014 broke apart so quickly that on-board systems did not have time to send distress messages.
"It’s too long for an explosion and too short for a traditional fire," said John Cox, a former A320 pilot who is president of Safety Operating Systems, a Washington consulting firm. "It says we have more question than we have answers."
Spanning three minutes, the warnings were followed by alerts that fumes were detected by smoke detectors, one in a lavatory and the other in the compartment below the cockpit where the plane’s computers and avionics systems are stored, according to the Aviation Herald.
CNN reported that the time stamps of the alerts match the approximate time the aircraft went missing.
In the case of a mid-flight fire, the pilots would have been expected to radio a distress call and begin attempts to divert, Cox said. No such radio calls came from the EgyptAir plane.
The transmissions, which are automatically sent to ground stations so airlines can monitor whether maintenance is necessary, will probably provide valuable clues once they’re matched up against the plane’s crash-proof flight recorders.
Egypt’s Ministry of Civil Aviation said Saturday that transmissions collected from the plane may have different causes and require further analysis before drawing any conclusions.
"We are looking at all the information that is collected but it is far too early to make a judgment or decision on single source of information," the ministry said in a statement.
Bloomberg News contributed to this report.
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Don't know about the veracity of the report, but a supposed pilot says the ACARS messages could indicate that the right front windows next to the co-pilot were blown out.
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It's becoming clear that there was no explosion. No bomb.
This is very reminiscent of SwissAir Flight 111 in 1998:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swissair_Flight_111
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Don't know about the veracity of the report, but a supposed pilot says the ACARS messages could indicate that the right front windows next to the co-pilot were blown out.
NO the ACARS msg did not mean the window was blown out. As I posted in the original/larger thread, this messages mean: "the panes are no longer heated"
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EgyptAir Was Aware of Threats to Security, Including One Scribbled on Plane
By DECLAN WALSH, NOUR YOUSSEF and KAREEM FAHIM
MAY 21, 2016
CAIRO — In an eerie coincidence, the EgyptAir jetliner that plunged into the Mediterranean on Thursday was once the target of political vandals who wrote in Arabic on its underside, “We will bring this plane down.”
Three EgyptAir security officials said the threatening graffiti, which appeared about two years ago, had been the work of aviation workers at Cairo Airport. Playing on the phonetic similarity between the last two letters in the plane’s registration, SU-GCC, and the surname of Egypt’s president, Abdel Fattah el-Sisi, some workers also wrote “traitor” and “murderer.”
The officials, who were interviewed separately and who spoke on the condition of anonymity to describe the airline’s security procedures because they were not authorized to speak publicly, said the graffiti had been linked to the domestic Egyptian political situation at the time rather than to a militant threat. Similar graffiti against Mr. Sisi, a former general, was scrawled across Cairo after the military ousted the elected president, Mohamed Morsi, in 2013.
Since then, the airline has put into effect a variety of new security measures in response to Egypt’s political turmoil, jihadist violence and other aviation disasters like the crash of a Russian plane that killed 224 people in October. EgyptAir has fired employees for their political leanings, stepped up crew searches and added extra unarmed in-flight security guards. Three such guards died in Thursday’s crash of Flight 804. ...
More at New York Times (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/22/world/middleeast/egyptair-plane-crash-security-threats.html?_r=0)
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(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/cjdn2fnuyaqr3f2.jpg)
Quoting chrisp390:
The pilot then trying to regain control swung the plane left and right before either passing out or being killed by the fire and the plane plunged towards the ocean.
The 90-degree turn is standard procedure to get out of an airlane when an emergency occurs. Pilots are trained to make that maneuver during emergency descent in cases of depressurization, smoke in the cockpit, or some similar situation when the craft remains under control but an onboard emergency occurs, to take the craft from an air traffic lane. Normally, once having descended, the aircraft would then take a 90-degree turn the opposite direction, to return to a heading similar to its original route. Why the 360-degree turn to the right was made is not immediately obvious; it is sometimes initiated to increase drag, and thus cause more rapid descent - but that is pure speculation at this time.
The fact that the turns were precisely 90 degrees left and then and 360-degree right turns indicates the airplane was under control during those time; damaged control surfaces would not initiate such precise turns. For this period of time, at least, it appears these were deliberate actions being taken.
None of this explains what caused the incident, but I hope it does help clarify why the maneuvers indicate the plane was under control, at least for the immediate time following its departure from its planned path. The big question now becomes: what precipitated this?
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/egyptair-flight-804-search-jpg.jpg)
Quoting alfa164:
Russian TV was airing a report that this specific flight number had been targeted for "murder" a few days before the incident herein... a report that grossly misread the situation.
Sure, but at least they didn't solely spewed out that rubbish without providing airtime for those saying it's not terrorism. RT called me many times that day but I could only get 1 slot in... they wanted to do like at least 4 slots throughout... the times just weren't right for me...
Quoting Mir:
They are separated by minute, however. Lav smoke at :26, avionics smoke at :27.
I agree that this is a difficult one to comprehend because of what you said afterwards:
Quoting Mir:
As I said, if the fire was in the cockpit, that's reasonable. But if the fire was in the avionics bay, then it should not trigger the lav smoke detector because of the ventilation pattern of the air.
Anyone got a diagram of the circulation flows?
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/image-6429.jpg)
Quoting zeke:
The ECAM AVIONICS SMOKE means smoke has been detected in the extraction duct of the avionics ventilation system. The Avionics ventilation system is not just the avionics bay, it is also for cooling all of the electrical components on the flight deck including the instrument panel (i.e. the display units and the mode control panel), the overhead panels, and the circuit breakers. The air used to cool the cockpit instruments and circuit breaker panels comes from the cockpit. The air used for the avionics bay comes from the air conditioning duct.
Yeah, found it in the FCOM on AirCond/Press... But failed to find what supplies the air condition ducts, is it bleed air or a combo of bleed air and recirculated cabin air?
Quoting zeke:
Be careful jumping to conclusion that AVIONICS SMOKE means smoke generated in the avionics bay, it can also mean smoke inside the cockpit being drawn in during the normal ventilation process into the extract duct generating the ECAM.
Yes, what's interesting is that the avionics bay air doesn't get circulated back, it gets extracted to the cargo compartment or overboard (or the skin heat exchanger and gets recirculated in the extraction system)... Now, where does the cargo air get sent to? Overboard or some of it get recirculated again?
The reason why I ask this and the air cond ducts, is that in abnormal and smoke modes, aircond ducts supply the extraction system...
Quoting litz:
What if the Lav smoke was actually :26:58 and the avionics was :27:01
Let's not forget that the avionics smoke warning require the smoke detector detect smoke for 5 continuous seconds before activating the warning.
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/egyptair-e1463921168477.jpg)
Quoting Mir:
Air from the air conditioning duct is only used in the event of a failure of one of the fans that draw air through the loop.
Yes, but what supplies the air conditioning duct and also what is the air circulation of the cargo compartment?
Quoting abnormal:
the use of the word perceptible is deliberate as the avionics smoke detectors are take a long time to go off. It's not unreasonable to expect that smoke could have entered the fwd lav before the detectors in the AVIONICS bay were even triggered.
The word "perceptible" has been carefully chosen : here it means, crudely : " if someone smells a *burning* odour", as our sense of smell is capable of discriminating very few molecules with an *odour stamp*... it is a lot more sensitive than a smoke detector.
Quoting YVRLTN:
Do the side windows have heat, or is it just the main windshield?
All cockpit windows are heated ; the windshields have two settings : Normal / Low . The side windows - fixed or sliding - only have one
Quoting flyingturtle:
Last ADS-B data was at 00:29:33.558 with 6 data receptions by ADS-B groundstations over the last 3 seconds of detection. It was tracking at 136 degrees.
The aircraft was consistently tracking at 139 degrees until 00:29:09.000, after which the aircraft had a small track change to 136... which was held from 00:29:18:776 until the end.
Autopilot switched off or changed from managed mode to heading select mode?
Quoting mandala499:
combo of bleed air and recirculated cabin air?
Depends on the cabin fans, if they are in auto its mixed, if it is set to off non recirculated.
Quoting mandala499:
Overboard or some of it get recirculated again?
Overboard normally, you dont want gas from a cargo being circulated into the cabin.
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http://townhall.com/news/politics-elections/2016/05/21/crews-hunt-for-debris-and-black-box-from-doomed-egyptair-jet-n2166618
Smoke, cockpit woes signal chaotic end for EgyptAir plane
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(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/160521-egypt-crash-debris-headrest-4-6a_bd20d470641b9c9e35e9d7f501a8ccf1-nbcnews-ux-2880-1000-e1463936875699.jpg)
EgyptAir flight MS804 pilot spoke with air traffic control 'for several minutes before crash'
Account directly contradicts the official claim that there was no distress call
UK Independent - By John Lichfield Paris Sunday 22 May 2016
The pilot of the doomed EgyptAir flight spoke to air traffic control in Egypt for several minutes just before the plane crashed, a French television station has claimed.
M6 said that the pilot told Cairo control about the smoke which had engulfed parts of the aircraft and decided to make an emergency descent to try to clear the fumes.
This account directly contradicts the official claim that there was no distress call from the plane.
M6’s story, quoting unnamed French aviation officials, was not confirmed by the French air accident investigation agency, the BEA.
No such information had been passed by the Egyptian authorities to three BEA investigators who had flown to Cairo to take part in the official inquiry, the agency said.
M6 said that the pilot of the Egyptair A320 had "a conversation several minutes long" with Cairo air traffic control after the plane ran into difficulties in the early hours of Thursday morning.
As a result of the conversation, the pilot decided to make an “emergency descent”, depressurising the cabin, in an attempt to clear smoke fumes which had invaded the front of the aircraft.
Just after the Paris-Cairo flight vanished on Thursday, there were contradictory claims about distress calls or signals. An airline spokesman initially said that there had been a distress call from the airbus. This statement was denied by the Egyptian military and withdrawn by EgyptAir.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/africa/egyptair-flight-ms804-pilot-spoke-with-air-traffic-control-for-several-minutes-before-crash-a7041936.html
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/egypt_a320_su-gcc_mediterranean_160519_marine.jpg)
Egypt Sends Submarine to Search for Egyptair Flight MS804 Black Boxes
NBC News - by Phil Helsel and Gemma DiCasimirro
Egypt deployed a robot submarine on Sunday to join the search for EgyptAir Flight MS804's black boxes amid the ongoing investigation into what downed the passenger plane.
President Abdel-Fattah al-Sisi announced the deployment of the submarine Sunday in his first public remarks about the crash, warning that an investigation into the incident will take time.
Until now all scenarios are possible. So please, it is very important that we do not talk and say there is a specific scenario," Sisi said, according to Reuters. "This could take a long time."
Sisi said that underwater equipment from Egypt's offshore oil industry was being brought in to help the search.
"They have a submarine that can reach 3,000 meters (nearly 10,000 feet) under water," he said in the televised speech. "It moved today in the direction of the plane crash site because we are working hard to salvage the black boxes."
An oil ministry source said Sisi was referring to a robot submarine used mostly to maintain offshore oil rigs. It was not clear whether the vessel would be able to help locate the black boxes, or would be used in later stages of the operation.
http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/egyptair-crash/egypt-sends-submarine-search-egyptair-flight-ms804-black-boxes-n578236
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/egypt_a320_su-gcc_mediterranean_160519_map.jpg)
PMS Burullus appears to be on location. If anyone is interested this is the ship that is performing the ROV work: http://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/..._:e81d66a2d139a567eb229aba616a7dd6
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/pms_burullus.jpg)
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EgyptAir plane 'did not swerve' before crash
Al Jazeera / Reuters
Egypt air navigation official says plane did not swerve or lose altitude before it disappeared, as claimed by Greece.
The head of Egypt's state-run provider of air navigation services says that EgyptAir flight 804 did not swerve or lose altitude before it disappeared off radar, challenging an earlier account by Greece's defence minister.
Ehab Azmy, head of the National Air Navigation Services Company, told The Associated Press news agency on Monday that in the minutes before the plane disappeared it was flying at its normal altitude of 37,000 feet, according to the radar reading.
He said: "That fact degrades what the Greeks are saying about aircraft suddenly losing altitude before it vanished from radar."
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/05/egyptair-plane-swerve-crash-160523143800474.html
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/map.gif)
Quoting Rivet42:
Q: However, if the Greek military report is still valid, the aircraft continued for 7 minutes at FL370 after ATC lost contact before it began the left turn which doesn't make much sense either unless an avionics fire took out the transponder...
A: Closest Greek radar site would be on Karpathos Island which is around 192 nm miles away. We need to understand that primary radar at that sort of distance is not all that accurate. Second closest radar site would have been the Ziros Area Control Center which is more like 214 nm away, then you have Fodele at 274 nm, and lastly Sklavopoula at 335 nm.
If they are saying radar contact was lost at 15,000 ft, assuming the base antenna is located at 1000m, you would have a maximum radar range of just under 220 nm.
zeke (http://www.airliners.net/profile/zeke)
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EgyptAir 804 remains point to bomb: official
skynews.com.au, May 24, 2016
A senior Egyptian forensics official says human remains retrieved from the crash site of EgyptAir flight 804 suggest there was an explosion on board that may have brought down the aircraft.
The official is part of the Egyptian investigative team and has personally examined the remains at a Cairo morgue.
He spoke on condition of anonymity because he isn't authorised to release the information.
He says all 80 pieces brought to Cairo so far are small and that 'there isn't even a whole body part, like an arm or a head'.
Read more at skynews.com.au
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Forensics chief retracts EgyptAir blast claims
Egypt's head of forensics denied reports that an initial examination of human remains belonging to victims aboard the EgyptAir jet that crashed in the Mediterranean pointed towards an explosion, state news agency MENA said on Tuesday.
"Everything published about this matter is completely false, and mere assumptions that did not come from the Forensics Authority," MENA quoted Hesham Abdelhamid as saying in a statement.
http://worldaffairsjournal.org/content/pentagon-confirms-us-talks-yemen%E2%80%99s-houthis
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/160520170716-egyptair-flight-data-screengrab-smoke-alerts-exlarge-169.jpeg)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVA3Xbfx8CI
Quoting DocLightning
Q: I wonder why their #1 engine is feathered and shut down in the link's video
A: The P-3 can shut down a couple of engines to increase loiter time. apfpilot (http://www.airliners.net/profile/apfpilot)
UPDATE 6
May 23, 2016 at 14:30 UTC
Yesterday, (May 22), U.S. Navy P-3s continued to support the search effort with two missions (6th and 7th) from NAS Sigonella. The first flight of the day (6th overall) discovered another debris field that was a radius of three nautical miles in size. Once reported to the Egyptian on scene commander, the aircraft was sent elsewhere to search for additional debris fields. The Egyptians deployed small vessels to retrieve debris in the field they discovered. From post mission reporting and the plotting of debris fields, two confirmed debris fields have been located by U.S. Navy aircraft supporting the effort.
http://www.c6f.navy.mil/news/us-navy-p-3-orion-assists-search-egyptair-flight-ms804
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/27194271775_02de4c51ec_b-e1464108243666.jpg)
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EgyptAir Crash: Safety Experts Voice Fears Over Flight 804 Evidence
WSJ - By Daniel Michaels in Frankfurt, Tamer El-Ghobashy in Cairo and Robert Wall in London
Updated May 23, 2016 6:05 p.m. ET
Aviation-safety experts are voicing concerns that Egypt may be mishandling debris collected from the downed EgyptAir plane, potentially compromising evidence that could help determine why the Airbus Group SE A320 crashed.
Forensic and chemical analysis of aircraft wreckage can yield vital information for investigators to glean how and why a plane went down. Such findings are particularly crucial when investigators lack access to a plane’s flight recorders, known as black boxes, which typically provide the most comprehensive information about what occurred on board on a flight.
EgyptAir Flight 804 plunged into the Mediterranean Sea on May 19 during a flight from Paris to Cairo with 66 people on board.
Crash investigators are battling not just a lack of data, but also conflicting information about the last seconds of flight. Greek officials Thursday said the plane veered off course before its demise. Ehab Azmi, chairman of the Egyptian air-navigation service, on Monday disputed that sequence, saying contact with the plane was lost abruptly while still at its cruising altitude.
The Egyptian navy has been scooping plane debris and body parts out of the water while the search continues for the main wreckage.
People in close contact with the investigation are concerned that potentially vital evidence is being compromised. Photographs released by Egypt’s military of the salvage operation show personnel handling items without wearing protective clothing, and placing them on unprotected surfaces.
This could threaten the investigation, the people said, because forensic investigators will analyze debris for chemical residue of explosives, fire or smoke. Military personnel who are in contact with weapons or ammunition can be exposed to similar chemical residue and inadvertently transfer it to any debris they handle. Lubricants and other nonmilitary items on ships can contain the same chemicals used to produce explosives and jeopardize chemical analysis of the debris.
Egypt’s military declined to comment on the recovery process, referring questions to the country’s civil aviation ministry. A spokesman for the ministry said concerns over contamination are without merit. He said the military’s recovery teams were accompanied by aviation ministry experts, whom he described as search "veterans” who comply with the standards that govern such operations.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/egyptair-crash-safety-experts-voice-fears-over-flight-804-evidence-1464036919
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/10907522_m1.png)
MASK MAN ON pb:
-- AUTO – a signal is automatically sent to open thepassenger mask doors when the cabin altitude exceeds 14,000 feet.
-- Selected – manually sends a signal to deploy masks.
PASSENGER SYS ON light – illuminates white when either an automatic or manual signal has been sent to deploy the passenger masks.
CREW SUPPLY pb – controls the crew oxygen low pressure supply valve:
-- ON (lights out) – the supply valve is open, and low pressure oxygen is supplied to the masks.
-- OFF (white) – the supply valve is closed.
-- Used in response to the Avionics Equipment Ventilation Computer (AEVC) sensing smoke in the avionics compartment.
-- The BLOWER and EXTRACTpbs are placed to the OVRD (override) position inaccordance with ECAM procedure.
-- This closes the inlet valve, stops the blower fan, and isolates the cargo under floor and aircraft skin heat exchanger.
-- Conditioned air is provided by the air conditioning system through an air conditioning inlet valve.
-- The extract fan draws the conditioned air through the avionics compartment, and expels it through the small internal flap within the closed extract valve.
h/t: PPRUnE (http://www.pprune.org/)
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/1_com.jpg)
Some notes Regarding ACARS messages...
00:26Z 3044 ANTI ICE R WINDOW
00:26Z 561200 R SLIDING WINDOW SENSOR
00:26Z 2600 SMOKE LAVATORY SMOKE
00:27Z 2600 AVIONICS SMOKE
00:28Z 561100 R FIXED WINDOW SENSOR
00:29Z 2200 AUTO FLT FCU 2 FAULT
00:29Z 2700 F/CTL SEC 3 FAULT
Source Document: A319/A320 Technical Notes (http://www.gauci.info/gone2fly/A320%20Notes/Aircraft%20Technical%20Notes%202004.pdf)
An extraction fan draws air from the cabin through the lavatories and galleys and exhausts it near the outflow valve. The extraction fan runs continuously when electrical power is available.
My observation -> If there is smoke in the cabin, it will be drawn into the lavatories to the smoke detector. Smoke source not necessarily in the lavatory.
In Smoke Configuration the main bus bars are shedded. Same as emergency electrical configuration except that the fuel pumps are connected upstream of the GEN 1 line contactor. 75% of equipment is shed, all that is remained is supplied from the CBs on the overhead panel.
• A smoke detector in the air extraction duct detects smoke in the avionics compartment. If smoke is detected for more than 5 min it can be cleared but remains latched. A dual FCU reset on ground can de-latch it.
• One smoke detector is in each lavatory. It sends signals to an SDCU (Smoke Detection Control Unit) which in turn sends signals to the FWC and CIDS.
Flight Controls
• Flight control surfaces are electrically controlled and hydraulically activated.
• The stabilizer and rudder can be mechanically controlled.
• There are seven Flight Control Computers:
o Two ELACs
• Normal elevator and stabilizer control.
• Aileron control.
o Three SECs
• Spoiler control.
• Standby elevator and stabilizer control.
o Two FACs
• Electrical rudder control.
• Also, there are two FCDC (Flight Control Data Concentrators) which acquire data from the ELACs and the SECs and send it to the CFDS and EIS
SEC 3 – Controls Spoiler 2.
If a SEC fails, its spoilers are retracted.
Speedbrake
• The Speedbrake is made up of spoilers 2, 3 and 4.
• Extension is inhibited if:
o SEC 1 and SEC 3 have faults.
Flight Control - Mechanical Backup
• Mechanical backup happens in the case of a complete loss of electrical power.
• Pitch is controlled manually using the THS. (Trimmable Horizontal Stabilizer)
• Lateral control is through the rudders.
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/3_com.jpg)
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Long out of a job, "Baghdad Bob" may return to handle media relations, for Egypt.
Got Taqqiya ?? This is yet another nail in the coffin, of their tourism business.
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Greece to start key data handover on EgyptAir crash Wednesday: source
Reuters - May 24, 2016
Greece will start dispatching key information on the EgyptAir crash to Egyptian authorities on Wednesday, including data from the airliner as it flew through Greek airspace moments before disappearing, a source close to the probe said on Tuesday.
"We will start sending the main data from tomorrow, including the radar tracking and the conversation with controllers," one source who requested anonymity told Reuters.
Sixty-six people are thought to have died when the EgyptAir Airbus plunged into the Mediterranean 290 km north of Alexandria on a Paris to Cairo flight on May 19. The aircraft dropped off radars 10 minutes after leaving Greek airspace and entering Egyptian airspace.
The source close to the probe, and a second defense ministry official, said Greece stuck by its account that the plane had lurched violently in mid-air before it disappeared from radar screens. There has already been an exchange of information with Egypt, the sources said.
Egyptian authorities said they did not see the plane swerve and lose altitude before it vanished from their radars.
Greek Defense Minister Panos Kammenos last week said the aircraft took a sudden 90 degree turn, before flipping 360 degrees in the opposite direction and plunging from a cruising altitude of 37,000 feet to 15,000 feet, then vanishing.
"The picture we have off our radars is what the minister announced... we insist on that," the defense official said.
The plane and its black box recorders, which could explain what brought down the aircraft, have not yet been detected. Egyptian officials have said it is too early to draw any conclusions on what may have caused the crash.
Asked about widespread speculation of an explosion, the source close to the probe said: "To be honest, I'm not an expert on this issue... the aircraft debris is too small in number for us to say why the plane crashed."
https://www.yahoo.com/news/greece-start-key-data-handover-egyptair-crash-wednesday-145904171.html?nhp=1
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/4252-e1464191066656.jpg)
Reference Material
BEA Study: Flight Data Recorder Read-Out Technical and Regulatory Aspects (https://www.bea.aero/uploads/tx_scalaetudessecurite/use.of.fdr_01.pdf)
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/vessel-tracking.png)
Latest Tracking - PMS BURULLUS (33.54733° / 29.13073°)
(2016-05-25 16:52 UTC) Appears to be a sonar search pattern !
The AIS plot shown above is very strongly indicative of the search vessel looking at a credible search datum.
They are clearly using Dynamic Positioning (DP) to manoeuvre the vessel on the search pattern and they are clearly using a deep tow sensor. They are not 'towing' the side-scan towfish or deep-tow pinger locator like a trawler tows a net. It's not astern of them, most of the time.
Sidescan sonar seems quite likely, but you would use a very similar pattern to 'box in' a suspected target with a deep tow hydrophone to locate a pinger signal.
A sensible searcher would concentrate his efforts, at this stage in time, to getting best data from the battery-limited pinger.
The way you do that is not by triangulation but by measuring the signal strength as you pass by the source. You plot that out with signal strength in the Y axis and the distance along track on the X axis. You get a parabolic curve, albeit a lumpy bumpy one which can sometimes be a bitch to interpolate. Maximum strength suggests that that is where your line reached closest point of approach (CPA). That gives you an LoP to/from the target, perpendicularly. By repeating that line perpendicularly you get a cross-cut of that LoP. By covering the other two sides you eliminate the baseline side confusion and further refine the position. Voila. You have a good approximation to the actual co-ords of your Dukane (or whatever) pinger.
I do, however, concur with those who have pointed out that the line-spacing is more consonant with a medium frequency sonar run, eg 125kHz, than what you would choose for a broad-brush pinger locator run in anything other than very shallow water. The reason why I think it's more likely to be a pinger locator on the end of the wire than a side-scan is that the speed over the ground is something like half a knot. That's Okay for a hydrophone but would not be enough water speed to keep a side-scan towfish on any kind of of sensible heading and would make sonar trace interpretation impossible.
I therefore conclude that they've got a pinger within earshot and are boxing it in before putting an ROV onto it.
The water depth at that locus, btw, is approx 3106m. The seabed sediment consistency in that area is like baby-poop. ROVs will have to be negatively ballasted, ie positively buoyant at bottom depths, so that they don't stir up the fluffy sediment and blind themselves during recovery of high value items such as the 'box(es)'.
Source: Cazalett33 @ PPRuNe Forums (http://www.pprune.org)
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Crashed EgyptAir Plane Tagged with Jihadist Graffiti
"We will bring this plane down."
May 25, 2016
Dawn Perlmutter
http://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/262952/crashed-egyptair-plane-tagged-jihadist-graffiti-dawn-perlmutter
EgyptAir Flight 804 that crashed into the Mediterranean Sea on May 19, 2016 had been tagged two years ago with graffiti that read in Arabic “We will bring this plane down.” The words “traitor” and “murderer” were also written in messages directed at Egypt’s President Abdel Fattah el-Sisi. Security officials attributed the graffiti to the work of aviation workers at Cairo Airport who were protesting former General el-Sisi after he ousted the elected president Mohamed Morsi in 2013. Details about the graffiti were given anonymously to the New York Times by Cairo Airport officials who said it had been linked to the domestic Egyptian political situation at the time rather than to a militant threat. The New York Times described the graffiti as an “eerie coincidence” and the target of “political vandals.” The paper did not think it was newsworthy to expand on the concept of “political vandals” or to report that President Morsi was the Muslim Brotherhood candidate. Hence the aviation workers were most likely Muslim Brotherhood supporters clearly increasing the threat.
There is nothing eerie or coincidental about the airplane’s graffiti. Jihadists have tagged numerous planes with graffiti both celebrating and threatening terrorist attacks. Less than two weeks after the Paris terrorist attacks and less than a month after Russia’s Metrojet Flight 9268 was brought down by a bomb in Egypt’s Sinai Peninsula, planes across France were found with Arabic graffiti. EasyJet airliners in different locations across France, including Charles de Gaulle Airport, had Arabic graffiti spray painted on their fuel tanks. Some of the graffiti read “Allahu Akbar”, which translates Allah is Greater, and is often used during Islamist terrorist attacks as a war cry to strike fear in the hearts of non-believers. The phrase is frequently used in graffiti by ISIS supporters. “Allahu Akbar” was sprayed on some of the fuel tanks, the bathroom door of one jet and on an access hatch to the cargo hold on an easyJet plane stationed in Lyon. “Allahu Akbar” sprayed on sections of aircraft that are supposed to be secure and not accessible to the public signifies both a threat and a celebration of the Paris attacks and the Russian airliner bombing. The graffiti was erased prior to any passengers boarding the plane and a spokesman for easyJet said it was not "considered a security problem both by us and by the authorities." A source close to the investigation told La Tribune, that “this has been happening for months on a number of airlines including easyJet.” When it comes to assessing the threat of graffiti on airplanes, the policy seems to be “see no evil”.
The phenomenon of not recognizing the seriousness of jihadist graffiti has been occurring in the U.S. for several years. In February 2015 and February 2014 I wrote articles describing how young Islamists and their sympathizers have been using every genre of graffiti to spread the global jihadist message. The prevalence of Islamic State and other jihadist graffiti has increased significantly in the past year and is often immediately relegated to kids joking around or designated as no credible threat.
On March 30, 2016 in Grand rapids, Michigan “ISIS IS Here” was written on the side of a home. In the same neighborhood “ISIS will Rise” and “ISIS We R Here” was sprayed on a utility box. There were two incidents in Tucson, Arizona this year. On March 23 the word “ISIS” had been spray painted on the side of a woman’s car. On February 8, 2016 at least 3 cars were tagged with ISIS in black paint and five walls in one neighborhood had anti-government, anti-police and ISIS graffiti. Some of the graffiti read: “ISIS is Here 2 Kill”, “Kill Kops”, “Islamic State”, “Your not Safe” and “Kill Everyone”. The phrase “ISIS is here” and “ISIS will Rise” may be a reference to the groups motto “Remaining and Expanding”.
In 2015 ISIS graffiti appeared in several cities. On July 19 in Colorado Springs, CO, “ISIS” was written on a I-25 CDOT highway sponsor sign. On July 26 “ISIS” appeared in multiple places along the Pueblo Riverwalk in Pueblo, Colorado. On June 6 “ISIS” was spray painted on a concrete wall near U.S. Route 1 in Boynton Beach, Florida. On May 11 “Allah Akbar” with an image of a bomb and “LBK, TX” was painted at a Scurry County Texas rest area off Highway 84 North. The graffiti was noticed on May 11, one week after a failed terrorist attack in Garland, TX where two men were killed by police while they attempted to wage jihad on the Prophet Muhammad cartoon-drawing contest. ISIS took credit for the attack.
What's This?
Many incidents of ISIS graffiti have occurred on or near schools. In Youngstown, Ohio on November 23, 2015, ten days after the Paris attacks, a rock located outside the Kilcawley Center at Youngstown State University, was defaced with messages of support for ISIS: “We are coming,” “France Deserves Destruction,” “YSU supports ISIS” and “Jihad over God ISIS”. Imagery included the black ISIS flag and an upside-down Eiffel Tower peace symbol inverting the meaning. Police also discovered Arabic graffiti written on the walls of the men’s bathroom in Cushwa Hall. The rock is an iconic symbol of the school and is located in the very public heart of the university. Although it obviously took some time to paint, there was no surveillance video with a direct view of the rock. University workers immediately painted the rock white without consideration for evidence. The media focused more on how the college community came together to paint over the rock with messages of world peace and the American Flag than on potential threats at the University. Several reports falsely claimed that the Arabic depicted in the image of the Islamic State flag was misspelled and used that to argue that the graffiti was a hoax. Move along, nothing to see here, no Islamic terrorist sympathizers on this college campus.
Another graffiti incident occurred less than two weeks after the Paris attacks in Jacksonville, Florida. On November 24, 2015 a fence that borders Cedar Mills Elementary School was sprayed painted with the word “ISIS” above Arabic writing. It is not known if the local police were aware that the Arabic writing was in the design of the Seal of the Prophet as depicted in the ISIS Flag. The local police probably did not know since in 2011 the administration purged counter-terrorism training materials blinding law enforcement officers to the threat from Islamic terrorism. On May 31, 2015 “ISIL We R here” was spray painted in black on a brick wall beneath a basketball hoop outside Miller Elementary School in Salem, Oregon. The acronym “ISIL” is specific to the U.S. ISIL is an acronym for Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant, representing a geographic area and one translation of the group’s former name. The group has not used that name since June 2014 when it declared the creation of a caliphate and shortened its name to “Islamic State” (IS). The most prevalent Islamic State name depicted in graffiti around the world is ISIS using English language characters. Islamic State graffiti continues to appear in countries around the world attesting to their global presence.
Symbolism is a hallmark of jihadist attacks and graffiti is just one form of jihadist symbolism. Jihadist groups often attempt to strike on anniversaries or commemorative dates that hold symbolic meaning to the organization or in Islamic history. Targets, places and dates such as the anniversary of 9/11 and American holidays such as July 4th are also symbolically significant. The bombing of Russia’s Metrojet on October 31, 2015 is an example of a significant date. Ansar Bayt al-Maqdis, who was responsible for the bombing, formally swore allegiance (Bay’a) to the Islamic State, changing their name to Sinai Province (Wilayat Sinai) on the 17th of Muharram 1436 of the Islamic Calendar [10 November 2014]. The bombing of Russia’s Metrojet occurred on the one year anniversary of their oath of allegiance to the Islamic State on the 17th of Muharram 1437 [31 October 2015].
Last year the media inaccurately reported that the first anniversary of the Islamic State was June 29, 2015. The actual anniversary was on the first day of the month of Ramadan which fell on June 18, 2015. Islam has a moveable calendar and celebrates Islamic holidays on the Islamic calendar and American holidays on the Gregorian calendar. The second anniversary of the Islamic State Caliphate is June 5/6, 2016. The month of Ramadan 2016 begins in the evening of June 5 and ends in the evening of July 5 (dates may vary according to geographic location). Many countries raise their threat level during the holy month of Ramadan because it is seen as a time of victory for Muslim armies and a period when those who are martyred have a greater assurance of a place in paradise. Ramadan which encompasses July 4th in combination with the anniversary of the Islamic State Caliphate signifies a higher threat. Western media and Airport authorities need to stop applying Western rational interpretations to Islamist symbolism and start reading the writing on the wall.
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Searchers Detect Emergency Signal of EgyptAir Plane
The discovery could lead to the location of the fuselage of the Airbus A320
WSJ - By Tamer El-Ghobashy and Dahlia Kholaif in Cairo and Robert Wall in London
May 26, 2016 8:15 a.m. ET
Egyptian search teams have detected an emergency signal from the wreckage of EgyptAir Flight 804 that could help them locate the aircraft’s fuselage on the floor of the Mediterranean Sea, the lead investigator into the disaster said Thursday.
The discovery of the signal is the biggest breakthrough yet for the Egypt-led search, which so far has been limited to recoveries of small pieces of debris and human remains. The Airbus Group SE A320 plane, bound from Paris to Cairo with 66 passengers and crew aboard, crashed last Thursday.
The investigator, Capt. Ayman Al Moqadem, told Egypt’s flagship state newspaper Al Ahram that the detection of the signal by satellite narrowed the search zone for the main body of the plane to a radius of about 3 miles.
Egyptian officials had said their search was on a 40-mile radius of the Mediterranean.
Emergency locator transmitters similar to the one Egyptian searchers are said to have detected are radio beacons that send a signal to satellites, used to locate plane wreckage or ships in distress.
Passenger jets have emergency locator beacons on their fuselage, which differ from the underwater locator beacons attached to the Airbus A320’s so-called black boxes, the cockpit voice and data recorders that typically provide the most comprehensive flight information. Mr. Moqadem said investigators haven’t located the black boxes.
To aid in the search for the black boxes, Egyptian authorities have retained foreign companies who specialize in marine wreckage searches and whose equipment can survey the depths in the crash area, believed to be around 10,000 feet deep.
France has deployed a ship to the area carrying such instruments. Egypt said Sunday that it also had dispatched a remote-controlled submarine belonging to its petroleum ministry to aid in the search...
http://www.wsj.com/articles/searchers-detect-emergency-signal-of-egyptair-plane-1464264946
Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs)
ELTs transmit on 121.5/243/406 MHz. (406 MHz contacts a satellite monitoring system. It uplinks the serial No of the Box which the Satellite authority uses to look up the Regulatory authority, who keep a list of serial no's versus tail nos)
Some ELT's are tied into the Navigation system to uplink last position.
Many rely on the Satellite system to direction find the signal
An ELT (due to the frequencies involved) is not able to contact the satellite from underwater. It is also not a waterproofed box.
The aircraft hull mounted ELTs are typically set up to transmit when a G-load of a particular magnitude is detected (crash)
Sample product sheet (https://www51.honeywell.com/aero/portal/Common/Documents/myaerospacecatalog-documents/BA_brochures-documents/ELT_For_Web.pdf) (Honeywell; Thales and some other vendors also make products in this class).
FAA Spec TSO-C126A (http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgTSO.nsf/0/0ac772bbed9b95a586257523007629b3/$FILE/TSO-C126a.pdf) (not sure if an international spec is also in print) DO-204A, DO-160F are cited on some product sheets.
Source: PPruNer avspook & Lonewolf_50
Clarification per another poster: The ELT sends the (programmable) ICAO 24-bit address belonging to the aircraft (same as used for Mode S, TCAS, etc). That's sufficient to identify the aircraft without the need to maintain a separate database of unit serial numbers.
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No new signal from EgyptAir jet since day of crash as search intensifies
Reuters
No new radio signal has been received from an EgyptAir jet since the day it crashed in the Mediterranean last week, sources close to the investigation said on Friday.
Media reports on Thursday suggested that a new signal had allowed officials to further home in on where the black box recorders might be located.
A radio signal picked up on the day of the crash from the plane's emergency locator transmitter (ELT) allowed officials to determine a broadly defined search zone, but nothing new has since been detected, the sources told Reuters.
"There has been nothing since day one," a source familiar with the investigation said.
Since the Airbus A320 crashed on May 19 with 66 people on board, including 30 Egyptians and 15 from France, no clear picture of its final moments has emerged.
A French vessel carrying specialist probes designed to detect black box pinger signals arrived on Friday at the search zone, sources on the investigation committee said.
The vessel contains equipment from ALSEAMAR, a subsidiary of French industrial group Alcen, that can pick up black-box pinger signals over long distances up to 5 km (3 miles), according to the company's website.
These are separate from the signals transmitted by the ELT, which sends a radio signal upon impact that is not designed to continue emitting once the plane is submerged underwater, said a source familiar with the investigation.
The French vessel will conduct a deepwater search in "four or five" areas within the 5 km search zone believed to contain the two black boxes, with the possibility of expanding the zone should nothing be detected, the source said.
Search teams are working against the clock to recover the two flight recorders that will offer vital clues on the fate of flight 804, because the acoustic signals that help locate them in deep water cease transmitting after about 30 days.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-egyptair-airplane-search-signal-idUSKCN0YI17M
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/laplace-e1464352746701.jpg)
Marine Nationale Hydro. "Laplace" (A793) is sailing to the crash site with two BEA officers, in order to join the search for the CVR/FDR. She also has on board three pinger locators. They are planning to send another vessel equipped with deep sea recovery assets. The Egyptians authorities are still in charge of the search, assisted by the BEA.
Source: BEA (https://www.bea.aero/fr/les-enquetes/les-evenements-notifies/detail/event/accident-survenu-a-un-airbus-a320-immatricule-su-gcc-et-exploite-par-egyptair-au-large-des-cotes-egyptiennes-survenu-le-190516/)
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/bea_laplace.jpg)
h/t takata @ PPRuNe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Q7eoLZkVE4
The Laplace is equipped with three detectors made by the ALSEAMAR company designed to detect and localise signals from the flight recorders, believed to be about 3,000 metres underwater. France may also send an unmanned submarine and deep-sea retrieval equipment. ALSEAMAR’s equipment includes three of its DETECTOR-6000 systems, designed to pick up black-box pinger signals over long distances up to 5km, according to the company’s website.
Source: France 24 (http://www.france24.com/en/20160527-france-sends-underwater-probes-egyptair-search-zone)
Underwater Detection Systems DETECTOR (http://www.alseamar-alcen.com/acoustics-positioning/underwater-detection-systems-detector)
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/acsa-seaexplorer-glider-e1464370110695.jpg)
PMS Burullus appears have gone dark. French Warship "9014" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_ship_Tonnerre_%28L9014%29) appears to be on scene. h/t AT1 @ PPRuNe
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/1200px-tonnerre_l9014-e1464366232253.jpg)
Helicopter Carrier Tonnerre was not dispatched for supporting this operation. So this tag "9104" is more likely given to PHM Jacoubet which is, since May 23, only doing surface sweep and visual researches for debris and they deployed two aircraft, a Falcon 50 and Atlantic 2, in addition to Egyptian and US assets deployed.
See official French Navy media, 28 May situation :
Vol Egyptair : Point de situation au 28 mai | colsbleus.fr : le magazine de la Marine Nationale
http://www.colsbleus.fr/articles/8479
takata @ PPRuNe
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEdqcrV1TdY
Investigation Progress Report (4) by the Egyptian Aircraft Accident Investigation Committee
CAIRO - 28 May 2016
The investigation committee received satellite reports of the electronic emergency signal that came out of the Emergency Locator Transmitter (ELT); which is equipment that sends automatic signals to satellite in the event of a crash or fall into water. Concerned search units were then informed of the updates recorded by the satellite to intensify searching in that area.
Efforts to search for the data recorders of the A320 continues; including the use of the most advanced search equipment of Alseamar company that was brought aboard the French vessel. The Ministry of Civil aviation has also made agreement with DOS (DEEP OCEAN SEARCH) (http://www.deepoceansearch.com/index.htm) company for other equipment with high capacity to receive signals and conduct sonar scan, in order to diversify research methods and to carry them out in the shortest time possible.
On the other hand, the investigation committee has started studying the information received from the Greek air traffic control about the accident; more information of the records of the radar that had followed the path of the plane before the accident, is expected to be also received.
http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/News/news%20pages%20ar/messs_28_5_16.html
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/dos_jlb_side-e1464526173875.jpg)
Egypt brings in specialized deep search ship for Egyptair hunt
Chicago Tribune - By Gregory Viscusi,Alan Levin and Andrea Rothman, May 28, 2016
Egyptian authorities hired a deep ocean survey and recovery company to join the hunt for wreckage of the EgyptAir jet that went down over the eastern Mediterranean last week as new satellite evidence emerged to help narrow down the likely crash site.
Egypt's civil aviation ministry signed the agreement on Friday with Deep Ocean Search Ltd., according to a statement from France's air accidents bureau, BEA, which is part of the investigation. A DOS's vessel will join the Laplace, a French Navy ship set to arrive in the area over the weekend and deploying specialist technology to pick up telltale "pings" from the Airbus Group SE A320's black-box flight recorders...
DOS is based in Mauritius, staffed by veterans of the French Navy and has recovered precious metals from a ship sunk in World War II in the mid-Atlantic at a depth of 5,150 meters (about 17,000 feet), the company said on its website. The area where the EgyptAir flight went down is thought to be more than 3,000 meters deep.
The Laplace, named after celebrated French mathematician and astronomer Pierre-Simon Laplace, will carry three Detector 6000 underwater listening systems supplied by the Alseamar unit of Paris-based search specialist Alcen, a veteran of air-crash searches that also works with defense and oil-industry clients. Two officials from the BEA are traveling on the Laplace.
The probes, shaped like torpedoes and dragged beneath the ship, have an "extremely long detection range," according to Alseamar, being able to detect pings from black boxes 5 kilometers away. Egypt said Thursday the deployment of more specialist gear would "help speed up" the search effort.
Among previous projects, Alseamar worked on the recovery of the black boxes from a Flash Airlines Boeing Co. 737 that crashed into the Red Sea shortly after takeoff from Sharm el-Sheikh in 2004, killing all 148 passengers and crew...
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/sns-wp-blm-egyptair-025bb63e-24f1-11e6-b944-52f7b1793dae-20160528-story.html
(https://luckybogey.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/dos_city_of_cairo_archive-e1464525994142.jpg)
Concerning MS 804, beside using optical detectors (see Airbus statement), I would add that the smoke warning(s) were triggered several hours after take off. At this point, such warnings would be very unlikely resulting from prior ground contamination of smoke detectors, which is what happen in most cases.
Also, ACARS of MS 804 are reporting two warnings at 0:26 and 0:27 (Lavatory and Avionics), which make it even less likely that they were related to nearly simultaneous faults of two detectors reporting spurious alarms. They are related to different compartiments and systems.
Moreover, both warnings were possibly triggered by cockpit adjacent areas (Lavatory A door is only a few centimenters away from the cockpit door while the avionics bay is right below the cockpit's floor) ; on top of it, the avionics vent system is using cockpit air to refresh both instrument panel and the whole bay, where the avionics smoke detector check the exhaust ducts for particles.
Finally, the two system faults reported at 0:26 and 0:28 are telling something related to the cockpit right windows heating sensors (sliding first, then fixed one) ; both window sensors faulted... but not the right windshield which is also heated by the same WHC-2. Hence, one could think that it wasn't related to the state of WHC-2 in the bay which was still working on the right windshield and triggered no fault on its own. In case of such a single fault reported, one would suspect the sensor first, the computer next and the wiring last. Now, if the computer is not at fault, we are still left with two faults with different wirings, sensors, and circuit breakers...
So far, and without any further evidence, I would rather suspect that those smoke warnings reported were actually real ones ; also, it seems to be more likely due to an external system cause, probably in cockpit, like a sudden surge of temp close to the right sliding windows ; the original event would have to last for at least 1-3 minutes (0:26 to 0:28) in order to trigger the second sensor fault on the fixed right window.
Considering that the investigation is in possession of the full ACARS content, they would have more details on each time stamping; they would also be able to tell if any probable delay happened during the string of ACARS between 0:26 and 0:29. But based on what we have, it's still possible to make some sense out of the first faults reported.
Of course, it's not the only scenario as one could also suspect a more complicated sequence, like a wiring combustion or electrical issue contaminating one and second right window heating system. It's only less likely because it would alert the crew of something wrong (like smell) in the cockpit, and probably well before this point.
Now, looking at any previous report of incident at cruise involving cockpit windows overheating in A320 might be more interesting than spurious smoke warning events, in order to understand if this could make more sense than an external surge of temp in cockpit.
takata @ PPRuNe
UPDATE (May 31, 2016): PMS Burullus is back on location per AIS Vessel tracking....
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EgyptAir crash: Signals from deep in Mediterranean Sea 'could be flight MS804's black boxes'
Indepenent - By Lizzie Dearden, June 1, 2016
A ship has picked up signals from believed to emanate from EgyptAir flight 804’s black boxes in the Mediterranean Sea.
The missing flight data recorders hold vital information for officials investigating what caused the plane to crash last month, killing everyone on board.
Egypt’s civil aviation ministry said the Laplace vessel had received signals during searches using sonar equipment.
Officials from the US National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration told The Independent American and European satellites detected distress signals pinpointing the plane’s emergency location transmitter minutes after the Airbus A320 crashed.
The signal was picked up at 2.36am local time on 19 May and transmitted to France’s Mission Control Centre and civil aviation ministry, calculating the location of the crash to be between the Greek island of Crete and Egyptian coast.
Another ship, Deep Ocean Search’s John Lethbridge, will join the search team later this week.
Human remains, plane seats, life jackets and passengers’ luggage are among the items found so far and are being analysed.
The cause of the disaster, which killed all 66 passengers and crew on board the flight from Paris to Cairo, remains unknown.
Officials from the US National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration told The Independent American and European satellites detected distress signals pinpointing the plane’s emergency location transmitter minutes after the Airbus A320 crashed.
The signal was picked up at 2.36am local time on 19 May and transmitted to France’s Mission Control Centre and civil aviation ministry, calculating the location of the crash to be between the Greek island of Crete and Egyptian coast.
Another ship, Deep Ocean Search’s John Lethbridge, will join the search team later this week.
Human remains, plane seats, life jackets and passengers’ luggage are among the items found so far and are being analysed.
The cause of the disaster, which killed all 66 passengers and crew on board the flight from Paris to Cairo, remains unknown.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/egyptair-flight-ms804-crash-latest-black-boxes-found-mediterranean-sea-signals-a7059241.html
There are now 3 surface vessels located in the area of interest - around 33°30'N 29°10'E; they are the PMS Burullus (Egyptian Offshore Support Vessel), Alnadorah (Tug), and the Laplace (French Navy Hydrographic vessel).
The Laplace arrived on scene over 12 hours ago, and appears to have done a Towed Pinger Locator (TPL) test run; the PMS Burullus is maintaining position nearby, while another vessel a small tug Alnadorah is currently alongside the Laplace.
The search for the ULB's (Underwater Locator Beacons) is about to get underway. The DFDR and the CVR each have an ULB attached to them, and these beacons emit a pulsed Ultrasonic sound wave with a frequency of approximately 37.5kHz. Approximately, because the frequency control parameters are set by resistive/capacitive circuitry, which results in no two beacon's frequency performance being exactly the same as another; handy when identifying multiple beacons in a search area.
With regard to the ELT transmissions received by satellite, there is always the possibility the automated fixed ELT was set to "ON" from the "ARMED" position by actions taken in the cockpit following LOC. This may have given the time needed for the vital positional data to be sent. That being the case, the ULB's will most likely be located relatively quickly [if functioning].
mm43 @ PPRuNe
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A Coptic Christian grieves on Sunday during prayers for the departed, remembering the victims of Thursday's crash of EgyptAir Flight 804,
at Al-Boutrossiya Church, the main Coptic Cathedral complex, in Cairo, Egypt.
Investigation Progress Report (5) by the Egyptian Aircraft Accident Investigation Committee
"Cairo, 1st of June 2016
The French vessel “La Place” of the French navy; participating in the search for the two data recorders of the A320 that was downed in the Mediterranean mid of last month; has received through its search equipment signals from the seabed of the wreckage search area; assumed to be from one of the data recorders.
Extensive search efforts are being carried out to locate the two data recorders in preparation for their retrieval by “JOHN LETHBRIDGE” which is a vessel that belongs to DOS "Deep Ocean Search", which will join the search team within a week."
http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/News/news%20pages%20ar/messs_1_6_16.html
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Egyptair: No Alerts 24 Hours Before Crash
Lefigaro.fr Publié le 02/06/2016 à 11:21 (English Translation)
A source close to the investigation into the crash of an EgyptAir Airbus A320 on 19 May in the Mediterranean denied today that a series of alerts was issued by the aircraft in the 24 hours before her disappearance at sea, as reported by the media yesterday in France.
"It is not true, as some have told French media that Acars messages signaling the presence of smoke were sent three successive times during the flights of the plane to Asmara in Eritrea, and Tunis and its from Cairo, "said the investigator. Acars is an embedded communications system that sends regular flight data from the device to the operating company. The radius of the search area flight recorder has been reduced from five to two kilometers after a signal has been detected by a French vessel, the source said.
In Paris, the French Transport Minister Alain Vidal, said this morning that it would take eight days before the black boxes could be retrieved.
http://www.lefigaro.fr/flash-actu/2016/06/02/97001-20160602FILWWW00119-egyptair-pas-d-alertes-avant-le-crash-enquete.php
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This after a French naval supply vessel picked up signal from one of two recorders on June 1.
http://www.turnto23.com/news/second-specialist-vessel-to-join-egyptair-flight-804-search
Deep-sea robot to join search for Egyptair wreck
Paris - A research vessel with an underwater robot is set to begin searching the Mediterranean "as from Friday" for the wreck of the EgyptAir plane that crashed last month, according to the French aviation safety agency BEA.
Egypt has hired the "John Lethbridge", which is owned by the private Deep Ocean Search company, to comb the ocean floor for the Airbus A320 that went down with 66 people aboard en route from Paris to Cairo on May 19.
The ship is en route and "should arrive in the area as from Friday," BEA director Remi Jouty told reporters.
A French navy vessel using deep-water listening devices picked up signals from one of the black boxes over a week ago, but so far it has failed to locate either it or the second recorder.
"For the moment we are hopeful of managing to locate these recorders while they continue to emit [pings]," Jouty said, acknowledging "we have to be quick".
The the flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder have enough battery power to emit signals for four to five weeks.
The area where the plane went down is believed to be about 3 000m deep.
The "John Lethbridge" has a side scan sonar that provides digital images of the seabed, as well as a robot that is capable of diving to 3 000 metres.
Some wreckage was retrieved from the Mediterranean last month, along with belongings of passengers on board flight MS804, but no bodies have been found so far.
The plane crashed between the Greek island of Crete and the Egyptian coast after disappearing suddenly from radar screens.
Investigators have said it is too soon to determine what caused the disaster.
While speculation initially centred on a terror attack, a technical fault has also not been ruled out, with automated messages sent by the plane shortly before its demise indicating smoke in the cabin and a fault in the flight control unit.
The crash took place seven months after the bombing of a Russian airliner over Egypt's restive Sinai Peninsula in October that killed all 224 people on board.
The Islamic State group claimed responsibility for that attack. There has been no such claim over the EgyptAir crash.
http://www.news24.com/Africa/News/deep-sea-robot-to-join-search-for-egyptair-wreck-20160609
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10,000 feet deep in the area along with a really funky bottom profile in a geologically active area of the planet. It will take time to find, but they'll get those recorders.
Hell of a job.
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Investigation Progress Report (7) by the Egyptian Aircraft Accident Investigation Committee
Cairo, 13th of June 2016
Investigation Progress Report (7) by the Egyptian Aircraft Accident Investigation Committee
The Egyptian Armed Forces Investigation Committee received Radar images of the A320 route before its crash; which identified that the aircraft swerved to the left then turned right for a full circle. This comes in accordance with the British and Greek radar images; however investigation cannot count merely on such information.
Manufacturers of the flight data recorders stated that signals will continue to come out of the so-called black boxes till the 24th of June 2016.
The investigation committee has approved the request of the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) to assign one of its approved representatives to join the investigation team as the Unites States of America is the engine manufacturer; in addition to an expert of the flight recorders manufacturing company.
It is worth mentioning that search vessel “La Place” and the search and retrieval vessel “JOHN LETHBRIDGE”; are carrying out their mission at the wreckage designated area.
http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/News/news%20pages%20ar/messs_14_6_16.html
EgyptAir crash: Wreckage found in Mediterranean
Wreckage of the EgyptAir flight that went missing over the Mediterranean last month has been found, Egyptian investigators say.
A statement said "several main locations of the wreckage" had been identified.
A deep sea search vessel had also sent back the first images of the wreckage, the statement added.
There were 66 people on board flight MS804 when it crashed on 19 May while flying from Paris to Cairo.
The Airbus A320 plane vanished from Greek and Egyptian radar screens, apparently without having sent a distress call.
The Egyptian investigation committee said that investigators on board the John Lethbridge search vessel, which has been contracted by the Egyptian government, would now draw up a map of the wreckage distribution.
What happens next, by Richard Westcott, BBC Transport Correspondent @bbcwestcott
Investigators will begin with something they call "the four corners". It means that, before touching anything, they will map exactly where every single piece of the aircraft ended up.
If debris is spread over a large area it tells them the plane broke up in mid-air. If it is more intact, it suggests it hit the water then broke up.
They will also look for what is missing. If, for example, an engine or the tail is two miles away, it clearly broke off earlier in the flight.
The little evidence so far suggests a fire broke out in the front of the aircraft, so they will be keen to film and photograph that area. One experienced investigator who worked on the Lockerbie bombing told me bomb damage looks very different to fire damage.
Ultimately, investigators will probably have to retrieve wreckage to know for sure what brought this plane down. And that could take weeks, even months.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-36543969
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Word is they have recovered the Cockpit Voice Recorder, so there should be some definitive information soon. I would imagine that the FDR discovery is probably imminent...
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Yes, per the news, they found the black box:
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/black-box-of-crashed-plane-found-pulled-out-of-sea/ar-AAh5RPs?ocid=ansmsnnews11
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Official Egyptian update (10)
Cairo,17th of June 2016
After the success in retrieving the CVR of the doomed A320; John Lethbridge, the vessel contracted by the Egyptian Government; has managed to retrieve the second black box which is the FDR. The FDR was also retrieved in several stages but the vessel equipment managed to pick up the memory unit; which is considered as the most important part of the above-mentioned recorder. Immediately the General Prosecution was notified that the second data recorder was also found and accordingly issued its decision to hand over the 2 data recorders to the technical investigation committee to carry out analysis and unload the voice conversations. Transfer process of the 2 data recorders from the vessel to Alexandria is under process; which will be received by members from the General Prosecution and the Investigation Committee. 17/06/2016
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EgyptAir crash: Second flight recorder recovered
The flight data recorder from the EgyptAir plane that crashed in the Mediterranean Sea last month has been retrieved, Egyptian investigators say.
The news comes a day after search teams recovered the cockpit voice recorder from the wreckage of Flight MS804.
Both recorders, known as the "black boxes", are crucial to discovering why the Airbus A320 came down on 19 May, killing all 66 people on board.
The plane was flying from Paris to Cairo when it vanished from radar.
The Egyptian investigation committee said in a statement on Friday that the data recorder had been "retrieved in several pieces" by one of the specialist vessels searching for the wreckage, which was located on Wednesday.
The data recorder is usually located in the plane's tail along with the voice recorder, which had to be salvaged in stages on Thursday because it was extensively damaged.
The cause of the crash remains a mystery.
A terrorist attack has not been ruled out but no group has claimed it downed the plane.
Analysts say human or technical error is also a possibility. Electronic messages sent by the plane revealed that smoke detectors went off in the toilet and the aircraft's electrics, minutes before the plane's signal was lost.
According to Greek investigators, the plane turned 90 degrees left and then 360 degrees to the right, dropping from 11,300m (37,000ft) to 4,600m (15,000ft) and then 3,000m (10,000ft) before it was lost from radar.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-36557134
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Investigation Progress Report (9) by the Egyptian Aircraft Accident Investigation Committee
Cairo, 16th of June 2016
John Lethbridge, the vessel contracted by the Egyptian Govt; to join the search for the wreckage of the A320 that was downed in the Mediterranean last month; had found the CVR. The CVR was retrieved in several stages as it was damaged but the vessel equipment managed to pick up the memory unit; which is considered as the most important part of the above-mentioned recorder. The General Prosecution was then notified and accordingly issued its decision to hand it over to the technical investigation committee to carry out analysis and unload the voice conversations. Transfer process of the CVR from the vessel to Alexandria is under process then it will be received by members from the general prosecution and the investigation committee.
(Note: text unchanged apart from shortening to CVR - what they probably mean is that the CVR was in 3-4 pieces ('tray', 'power', memory module component, 'pinger') and that they have recovered the component containing the memory module. If the damage is not too much then they will read it in Cairo, if too much then the module will be sent to the manufacturer of the CVR.) A0283 @ PPruNe
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French BEA communiqué today: CVR retrieved, BEA inspector dispatched to Cairo
BEA is announcing that one of their inspectors is moving to Cairo on 17 June to bring in BEA's expertise in the reading out of the CVR.
"Accident de l'Airbus A320, immatriculé SU-GCC et exploité par Egyptair, survenu le 19/05/2016 au large des côtes égyptiennes [Enquête menée par AIB / Egypte] - information du 16/06/2016 16H30
Les autorités égyptiennes ont publié le 16/06/16 un point de situation indiquant la découverte et la remontée de l'enregistreur de vol phonique (CVR - Cockpit Voice Recorder). Un enquêteur du BEA se rendra au Caire le 17/06/16 afin d'apporter notre expertise technique à la lecture de l'enregistreur.
Point de situation n° 9 publié par les autorités égyptiennes :
"Cairo, 16th of June 2016
John Lethbridge, the vessel contracted by the Egyptian Government; to join the search for the wreckage of the A320 that was downed in the Mediterranean last month; had found the Cockpit voice recorder.
The Cockpit voice recorder was retrieved in several stages as it was damaged but the vessel equipment managed to pick up the memory unit; which is considered as the most important part of the above-mentioned recorder.
The General prosecution was then notified and accordingly issued its decision to hand it over to the technical investigation committee to carry out analysis and unload the voice conversations.
Transfer process of the Cockpit voice recorder from the vessel to Alexandria is under process then it will be received by members from the general prosecution and the investigation committee.""
https://www.bea.aero/index.php?id=11...communique=278
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Investigation Progress Report (12) by the Egyptian Aircraft Accident Investigation Committee
Cairo, 19th of June 2016
On Saturday the 18th of June; the investigation committee started the process of inspecting parts of both CVR and FDR, the approved representative of France and his consulting experts witnessed this process. Whereas approved Representative and consultants from the US as the engine manufacturer also joined the investigation committee.
Memory units of both recorders were removed at the labs of the Central Department for Aircraft Investigation at the Ministry of Civil Aviation as a preparation to start the drying stage which was conducted at the Technical Research Center of the Armed Forces using modern high-Tech drying ovens. The drying stage took 8 consecutive hours and it was made in attendance of members of the investigation committee, and the adviser to the approved representative of France, who has a wide expertise in dealing with the plane recorders. Electrical tests of memory units of the recorders are in progress which will be followed by the data unloading phase.
It is worth mentioning that John Lethbrige, the vessel contracted by the Egyptian Government to join the search for the plane wreckage, is proceeding its tasks of drawing a map of the wreckage distribution at the bottom of the Mediterranean.
Egyptian Aircraft Accident Investigation Committee (http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/News/news%20pages%20ar/messs_19_6_16.html)
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Investigation Progress Report (13) by the Egyptian Aircraft Accident Investigation Committee
Cairo, 22nd of June 2016
The investigation committee is conducting thorough inspection and tests on the electronic boards of both the Cockpit Voice Recorder (CVR) and the Flight Data Recorder (FDR) of the doomed A320 in order to start the uploading process of the data. Approved representatives and consultants from France and the United States of America, are also witnessing these processes.
Inspection and removal of salt accumulations for more than 200 electrical circuits are undergoing to determine the circuit that does not function properly in order to reach accurate reading of the memory units of the recorders.
It is worth mentioning that John Lethbrige, the vessel contracted by the Egyptian Government to join the search for the plane wreckage, is proceeding its tasks of drawing a map of the wreckage distribution at the bottom of the Mediterranean; which lead up to retrieving them in a later stage.
http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/News/news%20pages%20ar/messs_22_6_16.html