The Briefing Room
General Category => Editorial/Opinion/Blogs => Topic started by: Hoodat on May 09, 2021, 12:37:45 pm
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Here's How You Know Democrats Rigged and Stole the 2020 Election
Wayne Allyn Root | May 09, 2021 12:01 AM
Let me put this in terms even Democrats can understand.
Let's say a white police officer killed a black man who did nothing wrong. Unlike George Floyd, this man had not committed any crime, did not resist arrest, didn't have fentanyl in his system and had no record of violent crime. Assume this poor guy was a law-abiding, taxpaying, churchgoing American and that the cop killed him for the crime of "driving while black."
How do the police react? They say the shooting was righteous. They refuse to investigate. There is bodycam footage, but they refuse to release it. And get this: They refuse to allow anyone to even talk about it. If any cop talks about it, he loses his job. If anyone in the black community talks about it, social media will suspend them or ban them for life.
What would all of that mean to you? Guilty as charged, right? The police must be covering up a crime. No one who's innocent acts like that, right?
Guess what? That's equivalent to the reaction (or, should I say, overreaction) of liberals, Democrats and assorted socialists and communists when Republicans make accusations of massive voter fraud in the 2020 presidential election. . . .
https://townhall.com/columnists/wayneallynroot/2021/05/09/heres-how-you-know-democrats-rigged-and-stole-the-2020-election-n2589148
If Democrats really believed there was no fraud, then they would welcome with open arms these election audits.
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:thumbsup:
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Yes, let's investigate the results of the last election. And every election for the last two hundred years. Maybe we can get a lot of elections overturned.
I'm for the little green men from Mars theory. I think they fixed it for Biden. Prove me wrong.
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Denying the rats cheated last November says more about those doing the denying.
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Denying the rats cheated last November says more about those doing the denying.
That's right. It's like denying that you're a racist PROVES!!! you're a racist!!!! Yes, great logic there.
Usually making some claim about a stolen election necessitates actually proving it was stolen. But since His Royal Orangeness claims it was stolen, we'll just take his word for it. Because Trump never lies, right? Who needs proof?
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That's right. It's like denying that you're a racist PROVES!!! you're a racist!!!! Yes, great logic there.
Usually making some claim about a stolen election necessitates actually proving it was stolen. But since His Royal Orangeness claims it was stolen, we'll just take his word for it. Because Trump never lies, right? Who needs proof?
So, what would you do if it's proven the Rats cheated heavily in Maricopa County, and that Trump really won AZ? Admit you were wrong? Sign off and leave TBR in shame? What?
Demanding that other states perform audits is certainly not going to be something you would do. You are far too comfortable in your fantasy.
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That's right. It's like denying that you're a racist PROVES!!! you're a racist!!!! Yes, great logic there.
Usually making some claim about a stolen election necessitates actually proving it was stolen. But since His Royal Orangeness claims it was stolen, we'll just take his word for it. Because Trump never lies, right? Who needs proof?
Looks from here like you're the one deficient in logic.
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So, what would you do if it's proven the Rats cheated heavily in Maricopa County, and that Trump really won AZ? Admit you were wrong? Sign off and leave TBR in shame? What?
Demanding that other states perform audits is certainly not going to be something you would do. You are far too comfortable in your fantasy.
Oh my God....the rats cheated? Say it ain't so.
But of course we must accept the word of Dear Leader who claimed, without a shred of proof, that the election was stolen. Only five more states to go.
Yeah, you're right. I'll just take His Orangeness's word that the election was stolen. In fact, the Dems stole every state, right? Because Trump said so.
Let's just accept Trump's word on everything, JUST BECAUSE HE SAID SO!!
I mean, who needs proof? I'm leaving TBR in shame. Oh, the ignominy. 8888crybaby
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I know because I took the time to watch the legislative hearings that took place in several states and saw quite enough actual EVIDENCE to convince me beyond any doubt!
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I know because I took the time to watch the legislative hearings that took place in several states and saw quite enough actual EVIDENCE to convince me beyond any doubt!
You mean you don't find @goatprairie 's fact based presentation convincing enough?
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You mean you don't find @goatprairie 's fact based presentation convincing enough?
I stopped seeing what that poster says here LONG ago @skeeter as I no longer have time for trolls.
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I'll just take His Orangeness's word that the election was stolen. In fact, the Dems stole every state, right? Because Trump said so.
Let's just accept Trump's word on everything, JUST BECAUSE HE SAID SO!!
No one has to take Trump's word on this. The evidence is what we all saw - swing states simultaneously suspending vote counting only to deposit hundreds of thousands of votes for Biden such that he miraculously came from behind to win; observers being sent home *on video* in Georgia followed by continued vote counting; obvious violations of Article II of the US Constitution by the Executive and Judicial branches in Pennsylvania.
If Trump were to shut up and go away completely tomorrow, this evidence would still exist. People can reach their own conclusions about the evidence - some might argue it's unconvincing or insufficient to determine the outcome - but the evidence is what we actually saw and has nothing to do with anything Trump says or doesn't say.
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crypto leftyRose
@leftyinvests
No i think this is what they mean
Video: https://twitter.com/leftyinvests/status/1391274947486515203
Michael Tracey
@mtracey · May 8
I think when most GOP voters say the 2020 election was rigged, they're referring to the general sense that Trump was ill-treated over the course of his presidency (Russiagate, impeachment, media bias, censorship, etc.) more so than to any specific claims of literal election fraud
2:12 AM · May 9, 2021·Twitter for iPhone
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crypto leftyRose
@leftyinvests
No i think this is what they mean
Video: https://twitter.com/leftyinvests/status/1391274947486515203
2:12 AM · May 9, 2021·Twitter for iPhone
@Right_in_Virginia
It's great seeing you posting!
To the point of your post: It's nice to see a lefty admit the press bias, but he can't quite force himself to admit there was actual vote cheating.
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No one has to take Trump's word on this. The evidence is what we all saw - swing states simultaneously suspending vote counting only to deposit hundreds of thousands of votes for Biden such that he miraculously came from behind to win; observers being sent home *on video* in Georgia followed by continued vote counting; obvious violations of Article II of the US Constitution by the Executive and Judicial branches in Pennsylvania.
If Trump were to shut up and go away completely tomorrow, this evidence would still exist. People can reach their own conclusions about the evidence - some might argue it's unconvincing or insufficient to determine the outcome - but the evidence is what we actually saw and has nothing to do with anything Trump says or doesn't say.
I am not against you in this @HoustonSam . But I will object to the term 'evidence'... That which we know not having been vetted, not having been passed through the rigors of any trial or audit.
For instance, the only thing I have seen so far proving the involvement of Dominion seems to be a false narrative involving dark-of-the-night assaults on servers deep in Germany, and a crappy piece of javascript that no coder in his right mind would include in a proper program.
That much has proved out to be nothing more than gossip.
I am ALL FOR auditing the process. I was ALL FOR Tumpy pushing the line and trying to prove and overturn the election.
But the bare fact is that so far, nothing has been validated. Nothing.
Now, I AM watching this Maricopa County audit - And perhaps (just perhaps) it will finally show a smoking gun. And if it does, Hurrah.
But what if it does not?
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I am not against you in this @HoustonSam . But I will object to the term 'evidence'... That which we know not having been vetted, not having been passed through the rigors of any trial or audit.
No worries @roamer_1. When I say "evidence" I'm talking about an observation that would lead us as reasoning people to believe something is likely true or at least worthy of further investigation; I'm not talking about a legal standard of evidence. By definition we have to acknowledge that the evidence has not met a legal standard since so many judges and justices saw fit to slam the courthouse door; but to me that demonstrates not a failure of the evidence but a failure of the legal standard. It's not that evidence doesn't exist, it's that the evidence has not been considered.
With regard specifically to claims about Dominion, personally I don't find those claims believable and consequently I omit them from my examples. That line of assertion only dragged the entire question of election integrity into disrepute and licensed the media to claim that anyone raising questions was a paranoid kook, as the late Rush Limbaugh observed. Let this be an example - we don't effectively advocate for a cause by accepting uncritically any assertion raised on behalf of that cause. In fact we will just as easily harm the cause when we suspend serious thought in favor of tribal cheerleading. This is my fundamental grievance against many of Trump's supporters.
I am not watching the Maricopa County audit very closely. If that audit does not come back with credible *additional* evidence of *specific manipulation of votes* - not statistical improbabilities in outcome or questionable actions by authorities but actual evidence that manipulation did in fact take place and evidence of *how* it took place - then this case must be considered closed. It's not enough continually to assert "they must be hiding something!!" - it's time to find what they are hiding and if we can't find it then it doesn't exist.
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@roamer_1 It's illogical to say "no evidence vetted by a trial" when no court has given standing to plaintiffs to enter the evidence.
I do believe, however, that if the audit in Maricopa County shows that "Tumpy" won you would agree something was horribly amiss last November.
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No worries @roamer_1. When I say "evidence" I'm talking about an observation that would lead us as reasoning people to believe something is likely true or at least worthy of further investigation; I'm not talking about a legal standard of evidence. By definition we have to acknowledge that the evidence has not met a legal standard since so many judges and justices saw fit to slam the courthouse door; but to me that demonstrates not a failure of the evidence but a failure of the legal standard. It's not that evidence doesn't exist, it's that the evidence has not been considered.
With regard specifically to claims about Dominion, personally I don't find those claims believable and consequently I omit them from my examples. That line of assertion only dragged the entire question of election integrity into disrepute and licensed the media to claim that anyone raising questions was a paranoid kook, as the late Rush Limbaugh observed. Let this be an example - we don't effectively advocate for a cause by accepting uncritically any assertion raised on behalf of that cause. In fact we will just as easily harm the cause when we suspend serious thought in favor of tribal cheerleading. This is my fundamental grievance against many of Trump's supporters.
I am not watching the Maricopa County audit very closely. If that audit does not come back with credible *additional* evidence of *specific manipulation of votes* - not statistical improbabilities in outcome or questionable actions by authorities but actual evidence that manipulation did in fact take place and evidence of *how* it took place - then this case must be considered closed. It's not enough continually to assert "they must be hiding something!!" - it's time to find what they are hiding and if we can't find it then it doesn't exist.
I am watching the Maricopa audit closely because it's a "local" story to me. Dominion is refusing to hand over the Administrative passwords to "their" machines, even though they've been ordered to do so by a Judge. So, if it's "unbelievable" they are in on the cheat, then what are they hiding from the auditors?
Related: How can Maricopa County claim to have performed an audit after admitting they never had the passwords?
And why are they (Maricopa County officials) refusing to hand over the modems and routers that may show "their" machines were connected to the internet in violation of Arizona law?
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I am not against you in this @HoustonSam . But I will object to the term 'evidence'... That which we know not having been vetted, not having been passed through the rigors of any trial or audit.
For instance, the only thing I have seen so far proving the involvement of Dominion seems to be a false narrative involving dark-of-the-night assaults on servers deep in Germany, and a crappy piece of javascript that no coder in his right mind would include in a proper program.
That much has proved out to be nothing more than gossip.
I am ALL FOR auditing the process. I was ALL FOR Tumpy pushing the line and trying to prove and overturn the election.
But the bare fact is that so far, nothing has been validated. Nothing.
Now, I AM watching this Maricopa County audit - And perhaps (just perhaps) it will finally show a smoking gun. And if it does, Hurrah.
But what if it does not?
Actually... It is a fact that Democratic urban strongholds didn't check signatures/envelope information as required by law. The mail in ballot rejection rate in Democratic stronghold swing states was less than 1% while outside those areas it was about 5% - the historical average. That little dirty deed means about 4% more ballots in rural conservative areas were not counted than ballots in urban liberal areas within the same state. That's a huge swing in a swing state. A few percentage point shift in virtually all of these swing states made a huge difference who won both the presidency and the senate.
That is also why in AZ the Democrats have pulled all the stops to block checking signatures in the audit going on now.
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I am watching the Maricopa audit closely because it's a "local" story to me. Dominion is refusing to hand over the Administrative passwords to "their" machines, even though they've been ordered to do so by a Judge. So, if it's "unbelievable" they are in on the cheat, then what are they hiding from the auditors?
Related: How can Maricopa County claim to have performed an audit after admitting they never had the passwords?
And why are they (Maricopa County officials) refusing to hand over the modems and routers that may show "their" machines were connected to the internet in violation of Arizona law?
Those routers likely have logs not just indicating if they were connected to the Internet, but to what they were connected to on the Internet and when.
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I am watching the Maricopa audit closely because it's a "local" story to me. Dominion is refusing to hand over the Administrative passwords to "their" machines, even though they've been ordered to do so by a Judge. So, if it's "unbelievable" they are in on the cheat, then what are they hiding from the auditors?
Related: How can Maricopa County claim to have performed an audit after admitting they never had the passwords?
And why are they (Maricopa County officials) refusing to hand over the modems and routers that may show "their" machines were connected to the internet in violation of Arizona law?
Thanks @Cyber Liberty, I realize the Maricopa County audit is local for you and I will certainly trust your observations and analysis. When I discount Dominion claims I'm thinking of the Venezuela/raid in Germany fantasies that, so far, have to be rounded up even to achieve a value of 0.
If an audit is still being stalled in Maricopa then yes, that does convince me something is being hidden. If a court order to surrender a password is being flouted, then it's time for someone to go to jail. So long as an audit is being stalled then I join you in believing that stall in itself is evidence of corruption. My point is that when an audit *does* occur, it will have to reveal clearly something that is not yet known, not just that outcomes were improbable or authorities acted in ways they should not have; the audit needs to find clearly what is being hidden or else we conclude that nothing was being hidden. And I am open to the possibility the audit will demonstrate Dominion collusion with vote manipulation.
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No worries @roamer_1. When I say "evidence" I'm talking about an observation that would lead us as reasoning people to believe something is likely true or at least worthy of further investigation; I'm not talking about a legal standard of evidence. By definition we have to acknowledge that the evidence has not met a legal standard since so many judges and justices saw fit to slam the courthouse door; but to me that demonstrates not a failure of the evidence but a failure of the legal standard. It's not that evidence doesn't exist, it's that the evidence has not been considered.
That is somewhat true @HoustonSam , but neither here nor there where the rubber meets the road. The only way any of it means anything is by being proven - Till then it is nothing but hearsay in the actual measure of the term, and largely inadmissible, being little more than gossip. The Dominion shtick is an excellent example.
I hasten to add that I do not question your powers of reason most particularly, nor anyone else's hereon. What I question is the veracity of what the right leaning press has been spewing, regardless of the source. If the information is suspect, no amount of reason can rectify that.
With regard specifically to claims about Dominion, personally I don't find those claims believable and consequently I omit them from my examples. That line of assertion only dragged the entire question of election integrity into disrepute and licensed the media to claim that anyone raising questions was a paranoid kook, as the late Rush Limbaugh observed. Let this be an example - we don't effectively advocate for a cause by accepting uncritically any assertion raised on behalf of that cause. In fact we will just as easily harm the cause when we suspend serious thought in favor of tribal cheerleading. This is my fundamental grievance against many of Trump's supporters.
Personally, the Dominion thing served as proof to me that what I had suspected was indeed true - That the right was being manipulated by the right facing press just as much as the left leaning press influences the left. The same propaganda, the same stench of partisanship. I am offended by press that bandies the truth about like so many eggs at the market, with all the skill of a first-time juggler.
I am not watching the Maricopa County audit very closely. If that audit does not come back with credible *additional* evidence of *specific manipulation of votes* - not statistical improbabilities in outcome or questionable actions by authorities but actual evidence that manipulation did in fact take place and evidence of *how* it took place - then this case must be considered closed. It's not enough continually to assert "they must be hiding something!!" - it's time to find what they are hiding and if we can't find it then it doesn't exist.
Oh I am watching it closely alright. But I wholly agree that without it being an unquestionable result, not only in veracity, but in magnitude, then it merely will add to the detritus - to the mountain of flotsam and jetsam that only proves that the right leaning press is no better than the left, that journalism is gone in all the press, and that truth lies dead in the streets.
I am already paying it (the 'news') little mind at all anymore, except where it may prove yet to hold some small kernel of what it is supposed to be. Thus the proof in Maricopa has worth, whichever direction it lands.
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Thanks @Cyber Liberty, I realize the Maricopa County audit is local for you and I will certainly trust your observations and analysis. When I discount Dominion claims I'm thinking of the Venezuela/raid in Germany fantasies that, so far, have to be rounded up even to achieve a value of 0.
If an audit is still being stalled in Maricopa then yes, that does convince me something is being hidden. If a court order to surrender a password is being flouted, then it's time for someone to go to jail. So long as an audit is being stalled then I join you in believing that stall in itself is evidence of corruption. My point is that when an audit *does* occur, it will have to reveal clearly something that is not yet known, not just that outcomes were improbable or authorities acted in ways they should not have; the audit needs to find clearly what is being hidden or else we conclude that nothing was being hidden. And I am open to the possibility the audit will demonstrate Dominion collusion with vote manipulation.
What's interesting to me is that I have more access to what's going on in Maricopa County than I did when I lived in Maricopa County for almost 40 years. I am presently living in Mohave County.
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I am not against you in this @HoustonSam . But I will object to the term 'evidence'... That which we know not having been vetted, not having been passed through the rigors of any trial or audit.
For instance, the only thing I have seen so far proving the involvement of Dominion seems to be a false narrative involving dark-of-the-night assaults on servers deep in Germany, and a crappy piece of javascript that no coder in his right mind would include in a proper program.
That much has proved out to be nothing more than gossip.
I am ALL FOR auditing the process. I was ALL FOR Tumpy pushing the line and trying to prove and overturn the election.
But the bare fact is that so far, nothing has been validated. Nothing.
Now, I AM watching this Maricopa County audit - And perhaps (just perhaps) it will finally show a smoking gun. And if it does, Hurrah.
But what if it does not?
You can't vet what you refuse to even look at, and that's where the courts have consistently been on the issue. That evidence has been sufficient to get the audit in AZ, and that is the foot in the door for the whole process of proving, with evidence, that this last election was stolen. Until the evidence is examined, it can't be vetted, and in at least one jurisdiction, that is happening now.
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@roamer_1 It's illogical to say "no evidence vetted by a trial" when no court has given standing to plaintiffs to enter the evidence.
No, it is not. If there s no standing, then the point is moot. It must of a necessity be a high bar, or every election would be challenged endlessly.
I do believe, however, that if the audit in Maricopa County shows that "Tumpy" won you would agree something was horribly amiss last November.
Oh I would HAPPILY agree. I am already on the record stating as much - But it must needs require real and absolute PROOF, or it is gossip, waggin tongues, and so much sour grapes.
Tough sh*t, there it is. :shrug: :whistle:
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Actually... It is a fact that Democratic urban strongholds didn't check signatures/envelope information as required by law. The mail in ballot rejection rate in Democratic stronghold swing states was less than 1% while outside those areas it was about 5% - the historical average. That little dirty deed means about 4% more ballots in rural conservative areas were not counted than ballots in urban liberal areas within the same state. That's a huge swing in a swing state. A few percentage point shift in virtually all of these swing states made a huge difference who won both the presidency and the senate.
That is also why in AZ the Democrats have pulled all the stops to block checking signatures in the audit going on now.
That is so much anecdotal/incidental information. There is incidental jacking of elections every time. You need to prove collusion, and that across states, and that, enough to have overturned the election, or the most you will get from it is various county voting staff heads rolling about.
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If an audit is still being stalled in Maricopa then yes, that does convince me something is being hidden.
Shroedinger's cat. The box must be opened.
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Oh I would HAPPILY agree. I am already on the record stating as much - But it must needs require real and absolute PROOF, or it is gossip, waggin tongues, and so much sour grapes.
Tough sh*t, there it is. :shrug: :whistle:
You're tough but fair. :beer:
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That is so much anecdotal/incidental information. There is incidental jacking of elections every time. You need to prove collusion, and that across states, and that, enough to have overturned the election, or the most you will get from it is various county voting staff heads rolling about.
The mail in ballot rejection rates were published.
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You can't vet what you refuse to even look at, and that's where the courts have consistently been on the issue. That evidence has been sufficient to get the audit in AZ, and that is the foot in the door for the whole process of proving, with evidence, that this last election was stolen. Until the evidence is examined, it can't be vetted, and in at least one jurisdiction, that is happening now.
And more power to it, if it is indeed there - I have more doubt than hope anymore. If I were to predict it, I would suppose it will be a month of nail-biting followed by all the air getting let out of it.
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The mail in ballot rejection rates were published.
Sure. Statistics. They mean nothing without context.
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That is so much anecdotal/incidental information. There is incidental jacking of elections every time. You need to prove collusion, and that across states, and that, enough to have overturned the election, or the most you will get from it is various county voting staff heads rolling about.
That's all we can get from it. No audit, or bunch of audits, is going to eject Biden from office and restore Trump. What we must do now is clarify that there will be very severe consequences for those who actually conduct the elections if those elections return prima facie unbelievable and non-auditable results. If that is made clear enough, non-credible results will become far less likely in the future.
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That's all we can get from it. No audit, or bunch of audits, is going to eject Biden from office and restore Trump. What we must do now is clarify that there will be very severe consequences for those who actually conduct the elections if those elections return prima facie unbelievable and non-auditable results. If that is made clear enough, non-credible results will become far less likely in the future.
I expect that is true at this point - But if it were true that there was collusion across five states, and Dominion in the middle of it all, the consequences would be profound.
Sure and nothing will put Tumpy back in there, but absolute proof that the election was thrown would put the current administration on life support, and Biden and Kamala might even have to step down... With serious repercussions echoing up and down the DNC economy... To include the press.
And if a frog had wings his ass wouldn't bump the ground.
These folks have been rigging sh*t for a coon's age - Catching them out has always been the chore.
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That's all we can get from it. No audit, or bunch of audits, is going to eject Biden from office and restore Trump. What we must do now is clarify that there will be very severe consequences for those who actually conduct the elections if those elections return prima facie unbelievable and non-auditable results. If that is made clear enough, non-credible results will become far less likely in the future.
I highlighted one of the most truthful comments ever posted on the subject. There is no remedy in the Constitution for removing a President for cheating to win an election, short of Impeachment, and even that is not a good remedy because it merely installs a Vice President who was also elected by fraud.
This is my chief argument about the "Oh, you just want to undo the election, you poopy-head!" pejorative. No, I'm interested in protecting the voters, not reversing a crooked election. Right now the Rats are fine with the cheating because their ends justify their means, and they think that can never be turned against them because they have no intention of losing ever again. They are that myopic.
@HoustonSam
ETA: I think the fact that there is no remedy is why the Courts are so shy about hearing the arguments.
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There is no remedy in the Constitution for removing a President for cheating to win an election, short of Impeachment, and even that is not a good remedy because it merely installs a Vice President who was also elected by fraud.
ETA: I think the fact that there is no remedy is why the Courts are so shy about hearing the arguments.
You could be right about the Courts, but IMO they've been plenty willing to make up law from whole cloth in the past and we all can recognize when that has happened. When they now suspend that willingness, and we all recognize it, they just destroy their own credibility, the credibility of elections, and the credibility of law.
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You could be right about the Courts, but IMO they've been plenty willing to make up law from whole cloth in the past and we all can recognize when that has happened. When they now suspend that willingness, and we all recognize it, they just destroy their own credibility, the credibility of elections, and the credibility of law.
No law signed by an illegitimate president should have any weight. What has effectively been removed is the legitimate power of the executive branch, and its legitimacy should this election be proven to have been stolen.
This is truly a Constitutional Crisis, something even the Founders did not foresee.
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That's right. It's like denying that you're a racist PROVES!!! you're a racist!!!! Yes, great logic there.
Usually making some claim about a stolen election necessitates actually proving it was stolen. But since His Royal Orangeness claims it was stolen, we'll just take his word for it. Because Trump never lies, right? Who needs proof?
No one here is citing Trump's claims as evidence that cheating occurred. It is disingenuous to bring it up here while completely ignoring the substance of the op-ed.
Maybe you, @goatprairie , can take a shot at answering some of these questions for us instead of reflexively defaulting to 'Orange Man Bad':
- If Democrats didn't rig and steal the election, why are they so afraid of forensic audits in key battleground states, specifically the current audit in Arizona?
- When Trump was an 8-to-1 landslide favorite with bettors around the world late on election night and clearly headed toward a landslide electoral victory, why did five states suddenly announce they would pause counting for the night? And how come Biden was suddenly ahead by morning?
- How come Michigan apparently had a dump of 149,772 votes at 6:31 a.m. on Nov. 4, 96% of which went to Biden?
- How did Wisconsin count 149,520 votes for Biden from 3:26 to 3:44 a.m. on Nov. 4?
- How come Philadelphia vote counters were so desperate to keep witnesses out of the counting room? Why did they refuse entry to witnesses (to Republicans) until those witnesses had a court order in hand?
- Why were the windows in a vote-counting location in Detroit covered with cardboard so nobody (no Republican) could see inside?
- There are videotapes filmed in Detroit of vans pulling up in the middle of the night with what obviously look like boxes of ballots. In Atlanta, there are videotapes that clearly show ballot containers appearing at a vote-counting location after a fake water main break was used to force all GOP witnesses out of the counting room. Why can't we discuss these videotapes?
- How come Twitter banned me for life over mentioning these videotapes?
- How come the Arizona Senate's liaison for the vote audit says Maricopa County hasn't complied with the subpoena by turning over passwords to Dominion voting machines?
- How come the Biden DOJ suddenly wants to stop the Arizona audit?
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But of course we must accept the word of Dear Leader who claimed, without a shred of proof, that the election was stolen. Only five more states to go.
Yeah, you're right. I'll just take His Orangeness's word that the election was stolen.
Just re-read the article again. Still can't find any statement in it attributed to Trump. Did you even read it? Or is this a simple matter of contempt prior to investigation?
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But the bare fact is that so far, nothing has been validated. Nothing.
It absolutely positively has been validated that signatureless absentee ballots were counted in vote totals, that stacks of ballots were fed through machines multiple times, that changes were made to Dominion software without re-certification, that Dominion did have internet access to voting machines while the election was ongoing, that ballots received after state-mandated deadlines were still counted, that election rules were put in place without legislative approval, that five states simultaneously halted their counting process and in the interim of them not 'counting' happened to tabulate enough votes for one candidate to swing the final result in favor of that candidate, and that these same states bitterly oppose any auditing efforts that would validate their claims of a fair election.
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Just re-read the article again. Still can't find any statement in it attributed to Trump. Did you even read it? Or is this a simple matter of contempt prior to investigation?
It's contempt for the Bad Orange Man, and also contempt for the people insisting on finding out if the election really was fraudulent. A reasonable person would say one cannot reject the argument out of hand, examination of what's known is necessary.
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Sure. Statistics. They mean nothing without context.
The context is history. And there's a lot of it to make the statistics of less than a 1% mail in ballot rejection rate while truthfully following the law nearly impossible. Repeat that over multiple swing states only within the heavily democratic urban areas and you have something that is not possible in the real world.
And the bottom line is if no one is, or can be, held accountable for this type of cheating then it will only expand. And that cheats everyone else who follows the law which in time renders the law meaningless. After that the mob rules and we've gone full banana republic.
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A reasonable person would say one cannot reject the argument out of hand, examination of what's known is necessary.
A reasonable person. Ayn Rand once said that there is no such thing as a contradiction. If you ever encounter one, recheck your premises. You will find that one of them is wrong.
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It's contempt for the Bad Orange Man, and also contempt for the people insisting on finding out if the election really was fraudulent. A reasonable person would say one cannot reject the argument out of hand, examination of what's known is necessary.
Politics via who's ox is gored... No place for truth. The ends justify the means... These things lead to the darkest of times.
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Politics via who's ox is gored... No place for truth. The ends justify the means... These things lead to the darkest of times.
Very true, and that has been the name of the game in Politics since I first started watching over a half-century ago. :shrug:
Lies are the coin of the pols' realm.
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A reasonable person. Ayn Rand once said that there is no such thing as a contradiction. If you ever encounter one, recheck your premises. You will find that one of them is wrong.
Sometimes one cannot tell which (if either) assertion is true, which is where I end up saying, "Damifino." :shrug:
I say that a lot.
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:bkmk:
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:bkmk:
Hi @Victoria33. I believe you have a lot of experience with elections (if I remember correctly). Isn't it unheard of to have a less than 1% mail in ballot rejection rate, especially involving first time voters? And that virtually all the swing state heavy urban areas had extremely low rejection rates while those outside those areas had typical rejection rates of around 5%?
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Politics via who's ox is gored... No place for truth. The ends justify the means... These things lead to the darkest of times.
ain’t that the truth. I tell my kids the same thing.
But they’ll have to see for themselves, ‘cause they certainly didn’t learn it in school.
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Isn't it unheard of to have a less than 1% mail in ballot rejection rate, especially involving first time voters?
Correctamundo.
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Yes, let's investigate the results of the last election. And every election for the last two hundred years. Maybe we can get a lot of elections overturned.
I'm for the little green men from Mars theory. I think they fixed it for Biden. Prove me wrong.
To the Democrats/Liberals/NeverTrumps/Communists no amount of factual logical evidence will ever convince them that the election was a farce.
They are beyond reason and beyond rational thought.
All you have to say to them is, "Orange man bad" and they will shit themselves with delight.
They do not care if the election was stolen or not. To them it does not matter.
These guys would execute Trump and his entire family if they could, that is the depth of their fanaticism.
There is no way to 'reason' with people like this because they are fundamentally irrational to begin with.
They don't want to hear 'facts' or 'reality'. Their minds are made up and nothing, absolutely nothing, will ever change their obsession.
I am right! you are wrong! and that is that! To a Liberal, even to dare question them about anything only proves that you are insane.
They are beyond question. Liberals are divinely intelligent and much better than you.
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Oh my God....the rats cheated? Say it ain't so.
But of course we must accept the word of Dear Leader who claimed, without a shred of proof, that the election was stolen. Only five more states to go.
Yeah, you're right. I'll just take His Orangeness's word that the election was stolen. In fact, the Dems stole every state, right? Because Trump said so.
Let's just accept Trump's word on everything, JUST BECAUSE HE SAID SO!!
I mean, who needs proof? I'm leaving TBR in shame. Oh, the ignominy. 8888crybaby
We all saw it happen. The jump in the middle of the night. Are you going to keep denying what we saw with our very eyes, regardless of whether or not Trump was involved?
Disagreements I can handle. Refusals to accept reality, I cannot.
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The context is history. And there's a lot of it to make the statistics of less than a 1% mail in ballot rejection rate while truthfully following the law nearly impossible. Repeat that over multiple swing states only within the heavily democratic urban areas and you have something that is not possible in the real world.
And the bottom line is if no one is, or can be, held accountable for this type of cheating then it will only expand. And that cheats everyone else who follows the law which in time renders the law meaningless. After that the mob rules and we've gone full banana republic.
History cannot be used, because the data set has never been so large. The difference may be nothing other than that large data set and a better processing ability in the cities...
UNDERSTAND me here: I likely agree with you. The problem with statistical data is that it is largely an interpretive exercise - similar to interpretation of religious texts, in that there is always someone who can be found to support your allegory, and no one - And I DO mean no one - is satisfied to take the interpretation in the simple literal sense. Similar things going on.
So it is not that I discount what you are saying as much as I know it CAN BE legitimately or semi-legitimately discounted, and that discount can and probably will be acceptable to many.
That's what I mean. If you are going to do this, it has to be nailed down hard with no wiggle room, or you may as well not try at all, because anything less will fail.
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It absolutely positively has been validated that signatureless absentee ballots were counted in vote totals, that stacks of ballots were fed through machines multiple times, that changes were made to Dominion software without re-certification, that Dominion did have internet access to voting machines while the election was ongoing, that ballots received after state-mandated deadlines were still counted, that election rules were put in place without legislative approval, that five states simultaneously halted their counting process and in the interim of them not 'counting' happened to tabulate enough votes for one candidate to swing the final result in favor of that candidate, and that these same states bitterly oppose any auditing efforts that would validate their claims of a fair election.
Sure. And nothing to stitch it all together into the conspiracy that is the only thing that matters in the proof. Without it, there is nothing but anecdotal cheating thither and yon, which happens in all elections...
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History cannot be used, because the data set has never been so large. The difference may be nothing other than that large data set and a better processing ability in the cities...
UNDERSTAND me here: I likely agree with you. The problem with statistical data is that it is largely an interpretive exercise - similar to interpretation of religious texts, in that there is always someone who can be found to support your allegory, and no one - And I DO mean no one - is satisfied to take the interpretation in the simple literal sense. Similar things going on.
So it is not that I discount what you are saying as much as I know it CAN BE legitimately or semi-legitimately discounted, and that discount can and probably will be acceptable to many.
That's what I mean. If you are going to do this, it has to be nailed down hard with no wiggle room, or you may as well not try at all, because anything less will fail.
Large sets of numbers for for these type of things tend to provide very consistent results. People make mistakes filling out their ballot envelopes even without fraud at a pretty consistent rate. Going to less than 1% which is ONE FIFTH of typical simply means they didn't check them as required by law. And why they'll fight tooth and nail to avoid those envelopes from actually being audited. At a minimum the same rules have to be applied equally across a state in order to get a truthful result.
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That's right. It's like denying that you're a racist PROVES!!! you're a racist!!!! Yes, great logic there.
Usually making some claim about a stolen election necessitates actually proving it was stolen. But since His Royal Orangeness claims it was stolen, we'll just take his word for it. Because Trump never lies, right? Who needs proof?
@goatprairie
Ahhh,the classic "Ah hates da ebil orange man" RINO Rant.
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The Orange Man is Satan incarnate.
Whatever means used to defeat him are justified.
If I had to shut down all of America and kill half a million people to kill the orange Satan
the means justifies the ends...always.
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The Orange Man is Satan incarnate.
Whatever means used to defeat him are justified.
If I had to shut down all of America and kill half a million people to kill the orange Satan
the means justifies the ends...always.
"Half a million?" Piker.
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Large sets of numbers for for these type of things tend to provide very consistent results. People make mistakes filling out their ballot envelopes even without fraud at a pretty consistent rate. Going to less than 1% which is ONE FIFTH of typical simply means they didn't check them as required by law. And why they'll fight tooth and nail to avoid those envelopes from actually being audited. At a minimum the same rules have to be applied equally across a state in order to get a truthful result.
Right. But that is an interpretation - One for which there is a refutation - That I will guarantee. It is a cause for inquiry to you and me - But there will be weaseling, and the weaseling will win. A cause for inquiry is not proof.
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Right. But that is an interpretation - One for which there is a refutation - That I will guarantee. It is a cause for inquiry to you and me - But there will be weaseling, and the weaseling will win. A cause for inquiry is not proof.
And...that is why AZ is auditing ballots tonight.
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And...that is why AZ is auditing ballots tonight.
And as I have said, over and over again, more power to em.
I hope the audit is bulletproof and complete, regardless of where the chips fall (which I can tell you from vast experience is behind the animal)
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And as I have said, over and over again, more power to em.
I hope the audit is bulletproof and complete, regardless of where the chips fall (which I can tell you from vast experience is behind the animal)
And that's where I am too. I recommend patience. We're weeks or perhaps months away from an answer.
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Most of us, some of us, remember when the Soviet Union collapsed.
That is where we are. That is where America is.
Liberals are fools, of course, and they have no idea what they are bringing down on their own heads.
But they will know. They will know very soon.
Who knew only a few years ago that the destruction of America would be 'cheered' by so many Americans.
Boy! That Orange guy really infected their brains. He made them insane zombies, willing to lose everything
willing to give up all of America for some insane 'cause' that only they understand.
In the next few years, America will be a completely different place than we all know.
We have a bumbling fool as President, and a mulatto chick as VP.
We have fake elections and fake news.
There is no way we make it through this.
The NeverTrumps can celebrate this all they want to.
Wait six months and see if they are still so happy.
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The NeverTrumps can celebrate this all they want to.
Wait six months and see if they are still so happy.
Happy don't have a damn thing to do with it either way.
If you expect me to support big government on the Right, the result will be the same, every_single_time. I will never support that, regardless of the consequence.
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Happy don't have a damn thing to do with it either way.
If you expect me to support big government on the Right, the result will be the same, every_single_time. I will never support that, regardless of the consequence.
Easy for you to say. You aren't a "Never Trumper," strictly speaking.... :laugh:
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Sure. And nothing to stitch it all together into the conspiracy that is the only thing that matters in the proof. Without it, there is nothing but anecdotal cheating thither and yon, which happens in all elections...
Give it time. We're still in the 'discovery' phase. The problem being that in a regular trial, a judge will order evidence be made available to the plaintiff. In this case, courts have willfully blocked discovery.
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Easy for you to say. You aren't a "Never Trumper," strictly speaking.... :laugh:
BWAHHH! Like hell he isn't!
Suggest you wipe off that brown spot you have on the tip of your nose... happy77
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If all that happens after this audit is that mail in ballots and so-called early voting are verboten, then it's cool.
Sure don't expect Biden & FRiends to be frog-marched out of the White House...
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Democommies cheating is like the old axiom DOES A BEAR SH*T IN THE WOODS? Hell yes is the ONLY answer!!!
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BWAHHH! Like hell he isn't!
Suggest you wipe off that brown spot you have on the tip of your nose... happy77
Was it that obvious? 888buttkisser
:laugh:
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I will never support that, regardless of the consequence.
That is what I mean by irrational.
I have been in the military and 'consequence' is everything.
No decision is made like that. That is crazy thinking.
Unless you want to get all your guys killed?
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Was it that obvious? 888buttkisser
:laugh:
:tongue2: :yowsa:
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Happy don't have a damn thing to do with it either way.
If you expect me to support big government on the Right, the result will be the same, every_single_time. I will never support that, regardless of the consequence.
@roamer_1
Ahhh,the "burn down the house to eliminate the termites" approach!
Clever thinking!
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@roamer_1
Ahhh,the "burn down the house to eliminate the termites" approach!
Clever thinking!
@roamer_1
What?
Is this me or you?
By your own standards, burning down your house is a good idea.
You know, since consequences don't matter to you.
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BWAHHH! Like hell he isn't!
Suggest you wipe off that brown spot you have on the tip of your nose... happy77
It is technically correct. I stand for Conservatism, not any prince.
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@roamer_1
What?
Is this me or you?
By your own standards, burning down your house is a good idea.
You know, since consequences don't matter to you.
That was not me you quoted.
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@roamer_1
Ahhh,the "burn down the house to eliminate the termites" approach!
Clever thinking!
@sneakypete
If it is costing more than it's worth, and no longer serves the purpose a house is supposed to serve, hell yes, burn it down and start over. And that is directly in line with the founders, btw.
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I will never support that, regardless of the consequence.
That is what I mean by irrational.
I have been in the military and 'consequence' is everything.
No decision is made like that. That is crazy thinking.
Unless you want to get all your guys killed?
Incorrect.
Big government is the problem, and is never the solution. If the only solution given is more big government, that is no solution at all.
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Give it time. We're still in the 'discovery' phase. The problem being that in a regular trial, a judge will order evidence be made available to the plaintiff. In this case, courts have willfully blocked discovery.
Sure. I have kept my powder dry. The only difference is that I look at BOTH sides with a jaundiced eye.
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@sneakypete
If it is costing more than it's worth, and no longer serves the purpose a house is supposed to serve, hell yes, burn it down and start over. And that is directly in line with the founders, btw.
@roamer_1
What price,liberty?
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@roamer_1
What price,liberty?
@sneakypete
What you are doing is not liberty. It is merely choosing your masters.
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@sneakypete
What you are doing is not liberty. It is merely choosing your masters.
@roamer_1
You can't possibly be THAT much of a fool.
EVERYONE EVERYWHERE has a "master" of one sort or another. It may be a boss,it may be the head of a family,or it may be the pressure of being the head of a family with a wife and children to provide for,but ONLY a fool can seriously think he is a real life "Marloboro Man",who incidentally ended up needing several "masters" to monitor his cancer treatments.
NO man is an "island" that stands alone in the world. Most people understand this by the time they are teenagers.
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@roamer_1
You can't possibly be THAT much of a fool.
EVERYONE EVERYWHERE has a "master" of one sort or another. It may be a boss,it may be the head of a family,or it may be the pressure of being the head of a family with a wife and children to provide for,but ONLY a fool can seriously think he is a real life "Marloboro Man",who incidentally ended up needing several "masters" to monitor his cancer treatments.
NO man is an "island" that stands alone in the world. Most people understand this by the time they are teenagers.
@sneakypete
Then you may as well bow and kiss the hand that feeds you.
Me, I will find my food elsewhere.
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@sneakypete
Then you may as well bow and kiss the hand that feeds you.
Me, I will find my food elsewhere.
@roamer_1
Jesus! You really DO believe all that crap!
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@roamer_1
Jesus! You really DO believe all that crap!
@sneakypete
Conservatism is premised foremost on individuality - Rugged individualism. Standing on your own and making your own way.
I have not had an employer since my early 20s. I have always had my own businesses.
I have always fed myself, more or less, and my family.
If anything I am going back to that. Increasing my ability to stand on my own. Moving myself further - as far as I can - From the system, which I know is going to come crumbling down.
Conservatism 101. Rugged Individualism.
Part of living where I am - more than anywhere, except maybe AK, people here will fight for those libertarian ideals. Because we still can function individually. Because we can see that removing our own ability to fend for ourselves is the penultimate surrender.
The only master I will serve is not on this earth. And I serve him gratefully. To no other will I bend a knee - And that you think I should just shows how far the country has fallen.
Big Government is not your friend, ever. The government big enough to help you is big enough to enslave you - and it most certainly will.
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Geeesh. All I did was get dinner......
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The context is history. And there's a lot of it to make the statistics of less than a 1% mail in ballot rejection rate while truthfully following the law nearly impossible. Repeat that over multiple swing states only within the heavily democratic urban areas and you have something that is not possible in the real world.
And the bottom line is if no one is, or can be, held accountable for this type of cheating then it will only expand. And that cheats everyone else who follows the law which in time renders the law meaningless. After that the mob rules and we've gone full banana republic.
Hey, it ain't no big thing. If you don't bother to vote because it's corrupted, surely someone else will vote for you...
(yeah, that was sarcasm)
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Hey, it ain't no big thing. If you don't bother to vote because it's corrupted, surely someone else will vote for you...
(yeah, that was sarcasm)
What cause in voting for what you don't want?
There ain't no profit in it.
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What cause in voting for what you don't want?
There ain't no profit in it.
Ha! Chances are someone would pay you.
I agree, I don't vote for who I don't want, but usually there is at least one race or initiated measure on the ballot I have an opinion on, and I express it. Write-ins for the rest, if need be.
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Ha! Chances are someone would pay you.
I agree, I don't vote for who I don't want, but usually there is at least one race or initiated measure on the ballot I have an opinion on, and I express it. Write-ins for the rest, if need be.
About the same here. If the man is standing on what I want, and has the record to prove it, he will have my vote. Otherwise, I will pass.
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Sure. I have kept my powder dry. The only difference is that I look at BOTH sides with a jaundiced eye.
I'm not cheering for the GOP side here. I am cheering for truth, righteousness, and integrity. From what I have witnessed from the GOP so far, they seem just as intent to fix elections as are the Dems.
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I'm not cheering for the GOP side here. I am cheering for truth, righteousness, and integrity. From what I have witnessed from the GOP so far, they seem just as intent to fix elections as are the Dems.
That's right. :beer:
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It is technically correct. I stand for Conservatism, not any prince.
Uh-huh... go and preach that brand of "Conservatism" to somebody else. Pragmatism is anathema to you.
Not going to dance with you, buddy.
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That's right. It's like denying that you're a racist PROVES!!! you're a racist!!!! Yes, great logic there.
Usually making some claim about a stolen election necessitates actually proving it was stolen. But since His Royal Orangeness claims it was stolen, we'll just take his word for it. Because Trump never lies, right? Who needs proof?
Here ya go! Want proof?
https://generaldispatch.whatfinger.com/mike-lindell-tv-releases-irrefutable-election-theft-proof-on-new-television-special-that-features-world-renowned-physicist/
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I am not against you in this @HoustonSam . But I will object to the term 'evidence'... That which we know not having been vetted, not having been passed through the rigors of any trial or audit.
For instance, the only thing I have seen so far proving the involvement of Dominion seems to be a false narrative involving dark-of-the-night assaults on servers deep in Germany, and a crappy piece of javascript that no coder in his right mind would include in a proper program.
That much has proved out to be nothing more than gossip.
I am ALL FOR auditing the process. I was ALL FOR Tumpy pushing the line and trying to prove and overturn the election.
But the bare fact is that so far, nothing has been validated. Nothing.
Now, I AM watching this Maricopa County audit - And perhaps (just perhaps) it will finally show a smoking gun. And if it does, Hurrah.
But what if it does not?
It does. I happened to click CNN at the right time. They were doing a live shot on the election. In the background, they had live count numbers. Real time tally. I literally saw 149,000 votes for Trump disappear and the same number placed in Biden's tally. I couldn't cap it because the camera view changed immediately.
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Uh-huh... go and preach that brand of "Conservatism" to somebody else. Pragmatism is anathema to you.
Not going to dance with you, buddy.
Indeed. Pragmatism is anathema to Conservatism, nearly by definition... and nothing to brag upon.
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It does. I happened to click CNN at the right time. They were doing a live shot on the election. In the background, they had live count numbers. Real time tally. I literally saw 149,000 votes for Trump disappear and the same number placed in Biden's tally. I couldn't cap it because the camera view changed immediately.
That literally means nothing.
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That literally means nothing.
It was important to me. No doubt in my mind. I also saw that my Tyrant's mail in ballot disappeared. I capped the whole thing, every step of the way. My signature, my name & address. I even took a cap of me fitting my ballot in the anonymous sleeve. I capped my vote as I placed it in the election box.
It never showed up. There was a site to check if your vote was received. The same thing happened in 2016. According to our state RNC, I haven't voted in years.
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@sneakypete
Conservatism is premised foremost on individuality - Rugged individualism. Standing on your own and making your own way.
I have not had an employer since my early 20s. I have always had my own businesses.
I have always fed myself, more or less, and my family.
If anything I am going back to that. Increasing my ability to stand on my own. Moving myself further - as far as I can - From the system, which I know is going to come crumbling down.
Conservatism 101. Rugged Individualism.
Part of living where I am - more than anywhere, except maybe AK, people here will fight for those libertarian ideals. Because we still can function individually. Because we can see that removing our own ability to fend for ourselves is the penultimate surrender.
The only master I will serve is not on this earth. And I serve him gratefully. To no other will I bend a knee - And that you think I should just shows how far the country has fallen.
Big Government is not your friend, ever. The government big enough to help you is big enough to enslave you - and it most certainly will.
@roamer_1
Because,of course,in YOUR eyes,it's "All about me,me,ME DAMMIT,AND TO HELL WITH AMERICA!"
Good to see you finally came out of the closet and quit pretending to be a patriot.
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@roamer_1
Because,of course,in YOUR eyes,it's "All about me,me,ME DAMMIT,AND TO HELL WITH AMERICA!"
Good to see you finally came out of the closet and quit pretending to be a patriot.
@sneakypete
By no means is it about me. Except in that you would have me bend a knee to your prince rather than standing upon what I know is right - In that YES, I will do that which I know to be true rather than succumbing to fear and justifying the subversion of principle things.
In no way is it patriotic to subject this country to a political system wherein NEITHER side is standing for America. To participate in that from either side is to subvert the American way.
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It was important to me. No doubt in my mind.
No, you don't understand me @dancer ... ANYTHING you were watching was not 'real time'. There is a whole chain of events happening which are subject to updating sequences... to include the interface between state agencies and federal agencies, counties updating, and even the interfaces between government and the press reporting.
That is a perfect example of runaway gossip without any context at all. Just because they say it is 'live reporting' doesn't mean a dang thing.
I also saw that my Tyrant's mail in ballot disappeared. I capped the whole thing, every step of the way. My signature, my name & address. I even took a cap of me fitting my ballot in the anonymous sleeve. I capped my vote as I placed it in the election box.
It never showed up. There was a site to check if your vote was received. The same thing happened in 2016. According to our state RNC, I haven't voted in years.
And my ballot was disqualified unfairly - I didn't get to vote at all. sh*t happens. That doesn't prove conspiracy or fraud.
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Here ya go! Want proof?
https://generaldispatch.whatfinger.com/mike-lindell-tv-releases-irrefutable-election-theft-proof-on-new-television-special-that-features-world-renowned-physicist/
Yes, I'm sure Lindell's video is irrefutable proof of fraud. :silly:
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We really need to move on from this topic IMO. Either bring legal action or move on.
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Yes, I'm sure Lindell's video is irrefutable proof of fraud. :silly:
By definition,, no proof can be irrefutable when some refute it without even looking at it.
Contempt prior to investigation. A classic Democrat trait.
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We really need to move on from this topic IMO. Either bring legal action or move on.
How do you think Arizona got the audit of the election started? They brought legal action.
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How do you think Arizona got the audit of the election started? They brought legal action.
Legal action? All for it. Bleating on about it, not so much.
GOP needs to step up and oppose wokeness, it's a winning issue for us.
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Legal action? All for it. Bleating on about it, not so much.
GOP needs to step up and oppose wokeness, it's a winning issue for us.
It's politics. Nobody knows what you do if you don't bleat. :shrug:
And I agree, it's a winning issue, it frustrates the dickens out of me when they don't engage the Lefities on issues like that.