The Briefing Room
General Category => World News => Topic started by: mystery-ak on September 12, 2023, 07:23:18 pm
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Poll: Nearly 80% of Ukrainians Hold Zelensky Responsible for Corruption
Frances Martel 12 Sep 2023
The vast majority of Ukrainians – 78 percent – say President Volodymyr Zelensky is directly responsible for corruption in the government and military, a poll published on Monday found.
The survey, conducted in July by the Ilko Kucheriv Democratic Initiatives Foundation and the Kyiv International Institute of Sociology, also found that Ukrainians ranked corruption within their own government as a bigger threat to “Ukrainian entrepreneurship” than the ongoing Russian invasion, according to the Kyiv Independent.
The poll was taken after months of investigations, which followed months of firings at the highest levels of governments. Zelensky announced measures to fight bribery and other corrupt activity in his administration in January, firing five governors and four deputy ministers. Those firings came after the ouster of top infrastructure official Vasyl Lozinskyi on suspicions of embezzlement.
Since the Ilko Kucheriv Democratic Initiatives Foundation poll was taken in July, Zelensky has fired every regional recruitment center head for taking bribes from men attempting to avoid the war and has replaced the nation’s defense minister, Oleksii Reznikov. Reznikov does not face any criminal charges or accusations of direct involvement in corruption at press time, but rumors of corruption preceded his “resignation.”
The string of corruption probes and mounting international concern about where war funding is going has apparently affected the public’s sentiments towards Zelensky, elected in 2019 largely due to his promises to eradicate corruption and his status as a political outsider. Zelensky defeated vocally pro-Western President Petro Poroshenko in the 2019 election despite having no experience in public office; he rose to fame starring as the president of Ukraine in a sitcom.
more
https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2023/09/12/poll-nearly-80-ukrainians-hold-zelensky-responsible-corruption/
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What crap is this?
Petro Poroshenko was Putin's puppet and the center of corruption with Hunter Biden and others.
And this article claims Ukrainians are more concerned about Zelensky's supposed corruption than their hundreds of thousands dead and bombed out cities perpetrated by the Russians over the last year??? Seriously???
Shame on Breitbart for publishing this crap.
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What crap is this?
Petro Poroshenko was Putin's puppet and the center of corruption with Hunter Biden and others.
And this article claims Ukrainians are more concerned about Zelensky's supposed corruption than their hundreds of thousands dead and bombed out cities perpetrated by the Russians over the last year??? Seriously???
Shame on Breitbart for publishing this crap.
Exactly.
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What crap is this?
Petro Poroshenko was Putin's puppet and the center of corruption with Hunter Biden and others.
And this article claims Ukrainians are more concerned about Zelensky's supposed corruption than their hundreds of thousands dead and bombed out cities perpetrated by the Russians over the last year??? Seriously???
Shame on Breitbart for publishing this crap.
:amen: :amen:
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The poll was taken after months of investigations, which followed months of firings at the highest levels of governments. Zelensky announced measures to fight bribery and other corrupt activity in his administration in January, firing five governors and four deputy ministers. Those firings came after the ouster of top infrastructure official Vasyl Lozinskyi on suspicions of embezzlement.
Since the Ilko Kucheriv Democratic Initiatives Foundation poll was taken in July, Zelensky has fired every regional recruitment center head for taking bribes from men attempting to avoid the war and has replaced the nation’s defense minister, Oleksii Reznikov. Reznikov does not face any criminal charges or accusations of direct involvement in corruption at press time, but rumors of corruption preceded his “resignation.”
If he is combating corruption, then yes, it is a concern, but that doesn't mean something isn't being done about it.
Seems an awful lot depends on what questions are being asked. Any time there is money around, thieves and corruption become a concern.
In the meantime, there's a war on.
Every war has 'feather merchants'.
Maybe those Ukrainians ranked corruption within their own government as a bigger threat to “Ukrainian entrepreneurship”
just haven't figured out a racket of their own. :shrug:
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I've felt that Zelenskyy has been corrupt all along; in partnership with Brandon, Soros and Obammy.
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How do we know that this poll is not corrupt?
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A new "poll" suggests 83% of husbands want to do more housework.
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I've felt that Zelenskyy has been corrupt all along; in partnership with Brandon, Soros and Obammy.
Yes, we know - yet you provide zero actual evidence of it. Repeatedly...
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Yes, we know - yet you provide zero actual evidence of it. Repeatedly...
Actually I have - quite awhile ago and with quite a few links. Before this thread I provided links of videos from Glen Beck and what has research team discovered - perhaps a year or two ago.
I'm not one to just give opinions, usually my opinions are backed up by several links validating my opinion. Whether or not they are read and given any credence; obviously not.
Though she no longer posts, @Right_in_Virginia posted all kinds of evidence and history of Ukraine and Russia and I absolutely agreed with her.
Repeatedly???? Nope. I haven't posted a rebuttal to anyone's post in awhile.
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How do we know that this poll is not corrupt?
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A new "poll" suggests 83% of husbands want to do more housework.
No poll, especially these days are accurate; but this does perhaps raise awareness that not everyone thinks that Z should continue to get BILLIONS -- those billions that he's been supposedly using to help win the war just haven't helped. So -- send more? B.S.
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Actually I have - quite awhile ago and with quite a few links. Before this thread I provided links of videos from Glen Beck and what has research team discovered - perhaps a year or two ago.
I'm not one to just give opinions, usually my opinions are backed up by several links validating my opinion. Whether or not they are read and given any credence; obviously not.
Though she no longer posts, @Right_in_Virginia posted all kinds of evidence and history of Ukraine and Russia and I absolutely agreed with her.
Repeatedly???? Nope. I haven't posted a rebuttal to anyone's post in awhile.
RiV posted nothing of the sort.
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RiV posted nothing of the sort.
Interesting -- I must have her confused with someone else. *****rollingeyes*****
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Interesting -- I must have her confused with someone else. *****rollingeyes*****
You must have. She mostly posted lies and innuendo, and was singularly incapable of responding to any questions raised by @Hoodat .
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Ok, you are absolutely right @Kamaji. Far be it from me to continue to argue about this. No worries -- I won't post in this thread anymore. It's a simple as that.
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Ok, you are absolutely right @Kamaji. Far be it from me to continue to argue about this. No worries -- I won't post in this thread anymore. It's a simple as that.
Now that's just being passive aggressive; nobody - least of all I - asked you to stop posting on this thread. And no, simply refusing to go along with your assertions about Zelenskyy does not constitute trying to force you off the thread.
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Zelensky could be as crooked as a dog's hind leg for all I know. I do know that he didn't invite the malady of Russian invasion. I do know that when offered a "ticket" out he responded "I don't need a ticket I need bullets". He stuck with his countrymen...who are fighting pretty darn valiantly. I can't say I know, but I have read that he has fired officials as he found them to be corrupt.
In my world, the jury is still out and I need more evidence that he is corrupt.
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World Population Review's "Most Corrupt Countries 2023" map and "Top 11 Most Corrupt Countries in the World" list, https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/most-corrupt-countries . If I understand the "CPI Rank" numbering system, Ukraine isn't even one of the worst 60 in the world. That isn't paradise, but claims that Ukraine is the most corrupt country in the world are absurd. OTOH, there is a rather large neighbor of Ukraine's that is worse.
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Conservatives behaving like liberal cowards with this guy, very shameful.
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Actually I have - quite awhile ago and with quite a few links. Before this thread I provided links of videos from Glen Beck and what has research team discovered - perhaps a year or two ago.
Can you summarize just one of them for us? Give me something to go on. Some instance where Zelenskiy did something corrupt. Anything.
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No poll, especially these days are accurate; but this does perhaps raise awareness that not everyone thinks that Z should continue to get BILLIONS -- those billions that he's been supposedly using to help win the war just haven't helped. So -- send more? B.S.
The corruption here can be found on this side of the Atlantic. Those of us here backing Ukraine have been pointing this out to you for over a year now. Like when Biden announces $40 billion for Ukraine, and then hands the money out to the State Department and USAID. Did Ukraine ask for any of that? Hell no! They asked for weapons. Weapons to defend their country. Weapons to defeat Russia. And the Biden regime has been persistent in delaying to them the military that could end this war earlier. You're looking for corruption? Look at Joe Biden. He's the one siphoning off all the money while Ukraine continues to wait around for old MiGs that were promised fifteen months ago.
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Conservatives behaving like liberal cowards with this guy, very shameful.
How so?
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World Population Review's "Most Corrupt Countries 2023" map and "Top 11 Most Corrupt Countries in the World" list, https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/most-corrupt-countries . If I understand the "CPI Rank" numbering system, Ukraine isn't even one of the worst 60 in the world. That isn't paradise, but claims that Ukraine is the most corrupt country in the world are absurd. OTOH, there is a rather large neighbor of Ukraine's that is worse.
@PeteS in CA
So the "brave conservatives" are being correct by cowering in their bunkers and refusing to do ANYTHING when there is a genuine possibility of Ukraine defeating Russia and Russia having a serious leadership change?
Good to know,but I would like to know how much more afraid you would be if there were actual American soldiers who are NOT you,doing any of the fighting?
BTW,WHAT is your opinion of Communism,good,or evil?
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@PeteS in CA
So the "brave conservatives" are being correct by cowering in their bunkers and refusing to do ANYTHING when there is a genuine possibility of Ukraine defeating Russia and Russia having a serious leadership change?
Good to know,but I would like to know how much more afraid you would be if there were actual American soldiers who are NOT you,doing any of the fighting?
BTW,WHAT is your opinion of Communism,good,or evil?
I do not think you understood the point of my post or my posts on the Ukraine 4 thread. And if my years of posting here don't answer your "question" to your satisfaction, that's a whole lot more you have not understood. Beyond that, I'm not playing the Conservativier-Than-Thou Orthodoxy-Test game.
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@PeteS in CA
So the "brave conservatives" are being correct by cowering in their bunkers and refusing to do ANYTHING when there is a genuine possibility of Ukraine defeating Russia and Russia having a serious leadership change?
Good to know,but I would like to know how much more afraid you would be if there were actual American soldiers who are NOT you,doing any of the fighting?
BTW,WHAT is your opinion of Communism,good,or evil?
We had more reason and justification to be tangled up in Iraq and Afghanistan than we do sending money and munitions we need here at home into the black hole that is Ukraine.
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We had more reason and justification to be tangled up in Iraq and Afghanistan than we do sending money and munitions we need here at home into the black hole that is Ukraine.
Sending money to Ukraine so they can kill Russians is not a black hole.
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We had more reason and justification to be tangled up in Iraq and Afghanistan than we do sending money and munitions we need here at home into the black hole that is Ukraine.
Nope.
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Nope.
As someone who was there in both instances...yes we did.
There is ZERO reason we should be getting entangled in the Ukraine.
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As someone who was there in both instances...yes we did.
There is ZERO reason we should be getting entangled in the Ukraine.
There is as much reason for stopping the Russian Orc in Ukraine as there was for stopping the Nazis in Poland. We played the isolationist game then, and it ended up costing us a whole hell of a lot more than it would have cost us if we'd stopped the Nazis then, and we will get exactly the same result - with potential nuclear escalation thrown in - if we don't stop the Russian Orc in Ukraine.
As someone who claims to have been there, I am rather disappointed that you singularly fail to see that.
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There is as much reason for stopping the Russian Orc in Ukraine as there was for stopping the Nazis in Poland. We played the isolationist game then, and it ended up costing us a whole hell of a lot more than it would have cost us if we'd stopped the Nazis then, and we will get exactly the same result - with potential nuclear escalation thrown in - if we don't stop the Russian Orc in Ukraine.
As someone who claims to have been there, I am rather disappointed that you singularly fail to see that.
@Kamaji
YES,YES,A THOUSAND TIMES YES!
For ALL of my life I prepared to fight against the Evil Soviet Empire,BECAUSE THEY WERE A THREAT to not only the United States,but to freedom all over the globe.
Communism ONLY "works" if the whole world is controlled by a Global Communist Government. Even then,it only "works" for our Communist masters and their families.
Don't get me wrong,Communism is a WONDERFUL system if you want to be a serf to your Communist Masters and let them make ALL your decisions for you. After all,YOU can never be wrong if YOU never made a decision.
It is NOT for me or anyone else that understands the Communist system. And we are now talking about defeating the Russian Communist system,which is probably the most benign of all of them. The Chinese,for example,make the Soviets look like compassionate Saints by comparison.
None the less,and defeat leading to the collapse of Soviet Communism will weaken ALL Communist systems all over the world. Even the Chinese,if we can get out big Corporate CEO's from shipping work and dollars to them in order to increase their profits while weakening America. And make no mistake about it,THESE "capitalists" are nothing less than Communist pigs looking to control the world themselves,and should be our first "target" to slap into line by charging surcharges to ANYTHING and EVERYTHING they import into America to maximize their profits while bankrupting everyone but themselves.
It really boggles the imagination that some of you people are so freaking self-centered that you don't care about what happens to everyone else in America,as long as it doesn't hurt YOU.
Hell,you make the surrender monkeys look honorable by comparison. At least they have the excuse that it might save lives to just surrender. YOUR only excuse is "Me,me,ME,DAMMIT!"
And make no mistake about it,if we in the west don't help Ukraine defeat the USSR now while it is the Ukrainians doing all the fighting,it WILL eventually be US troops doing the fighting in places like Europe to try to stop the Communist invasion and takover.
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There is as much reason for stopping the Russian Orc in Ukraine as there was for stopping the Nazis in Poland. We played the isolationist game then, and it ended up costing us a whole hell of a lot more than it would have cost us if we'd stopped the Nazis then, and we will get exactly the same result - with potential nuclear escalation thrown in - if we don't stop the Russian Orc in Ukraine.
Apples and Oranges. You want to stop Rusia in their tracks...you can do two things....stop sending money to Ukraine...start oil production and exploration in the U.S. again. Undo all of the EO's towards the energy industry that Biden signed on day one.
Biden allowed Putin to fund his war effort with petro dollars by stopping all the exploration in the U.S.
But Biden won't even listen to that idea because he's compromised.
As someone who claims to have been there, I am rather disappointed that you singularly fail to see that.
As someone who has been there I see the false equivalence of the two scenarios. I'm "rather disappointed that you singularly fail to see that."
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Apples and Oranges. You want to stop Rusia in their tracks...you can do two things....stop sending money to Ukraine...start oil production and exploration in the U.S. again. Undo all of the EO's towards the energy industry that Biden signed on day one.
Biden allowed Putin to fund his war effort with petro dollars by stopping all the exploration in the U.S.
But Biden won't even listen to that idea because he's compromised.
As someone who has been there I see the false equivalence of the two scenarios. I'm "rather disappointed that you singularly fail to see that."
Nonsense. Apples to apples. Stop sending arms to Ukraine, and Russia will consume the entire country and start working on its next target. Putin's stated goal has always been the recreation of the old Russian empire, and that does not stop with Ukraine.
And yes, I am disappointed that you make the same mistakes that were made in the early 1900s, and in the 1930s, and cannot see the essential equivalence.
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Apples and Oranges. You want to stop Rusia in their tracks...you can do two things....stop sending money to Ukraine...start oil production and exploration in the U.S. again. Undo all of the EO's towards the energy industry that Biden signed on day one.
Biden allowed Putin to fund his war effort with petro dollars by stopping all the exploration in the U.S.
But Biden won't even listen to that idea because he's compromised.
As someone who has been there I see the false equivalence of the two scenarios. I'm "rather disappointed that you singularly fail to see that."
@txradioguy
Roflmao!
Yeah,THE best way to win a war against a violent aggressor is to refuse to fight! Good thinking!
Good drugs?
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Apples and Oranges. You want to stop Rusia in their tracks...you can do two things....stop sending money to Ukraine...start oil production and exploration in the U.S. again. Undo all of the EO's towards the energy industry that Biden signed on day one.
Biden allowed Putin to fund his war effort with petro dollars by stopping all the exploration in the U.S.
But Biden won't even listen to that idea because he's compromised.
As someone who has been there I see the false equivalence of the two scenarios. I'm "rather disappointed that you singularly fail to see that."
***agree
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Just for the record, Russia's GDP is about 5% of the west's... Russia could put its entire economic output into the war they started and still fall far short of what the west can produce with not very much economic pain. And that would devastate Russia quickly. It is way past time for Russia to stop being a menace to its neighbors and the rest of Europe. The purpose of NATO is to contain Russia to its borders. Without an aggressive Russia, NATO wouldn't be needed. That would be a huge savings along with other major benefits to everyone in the west.
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Just for the record, Russia's GDP is about 5% of the west's... Russia could put its entire economic output into the war they started and still fall far short of what the west can produce with not very much economic pain. And that would devastate Russia quickly. It is way past time for Russia to stop being a menace to its neighbors and the rest of Europe. The purpose of NATO is to contain Russia to its borders. Without an aggressive Russia, NATO wouldn't be needed. That would be a huge savings along with other major benefits to everyone in the west.
@DB
Seems so obvious that anyone should be able to understand it,doesn't it?
Of course,that STILL leaves an aggressive AND emerging China that has a LOT of money to spend,thanks to the contracts,equipment,and parts given to them by GM and other western alleged Capitalists.
HTH can people claim to be Capitalists when they spend money and time to insure that China has industrial contracts that NOBODY in the west can match because in west we can't don't use slave labor.
Not yet,anyhow,but that IS "where the alleged Capitalist movers and shakers are heading."
They seem to think they can "do" Communism better than the Communists.
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The arguments on this board sound like a major circle jerk to me. Have any of you been to Russia? Or Ukraine? Doesn't sound like it.
I have been there a number of times, and there are some basics that all should understand. Russia is a completely corrupt nation, top to bottom. Yes, there are good people in Russia, but the ones that run everything would steal the shirt off their mother's back if they could. Ukraine, having been a sister nation, populated with many people of Russian heritage is NO DIFFERENT. They are every bit as corrupt, top to bottom. Zelensky to get to the level he is at, believe me, he is corrupt.
Another thing that is reflective in their culture is the lack of religious freedom and belief. Excluding the Russian Orthodox church, which has a relationship with the Russian government, there is little to no religious freedom in Russia, and now the same can be said for Ukraine. These two nations are virtual mirrors of one another culturally.
Plus the age old argument of every dead Russian is one less we the USA has to kill. It is assumed we will jump in to save the day. But the huge problem with past established mindsets is that the QUADPARTITE of Russia, China, North Korea and Iran,
THEY ARE ALL NUCLEAR NATIONS OR SOON TO BE, AND THAT REDEFINES EVERYTHING.
How long will the Russian/Ukraine War remain conventional? How long before the USA jumps in with our military on the ground? Oh wait, we already have forces there. I have seen numbers in the tens and numbers in the hundreds. You can bet the real number is in the thousands. Unfolding just like Vietnam...yeah, Vietnam. And a number of you lived through that sh*t sandwich.
This war is a sh*t sandwich that could end the world as we know it.
Russia is teaching their children in their schools that it was the USA that started this war. Are you aware of that? Also, the people in Russia are largely given the mushroom treatment, kept in the dark and fed bullsh*t all day long. Not much has really changed from the days of the USSR in Russia. It is a totalitarian nation with large swaths of the country still very much controlled by the communist party.
But be reassured, the USA has one of its greatest champions as POTUS to lead the way. You should sleep with ease, oh yeah.
I think todays world makes the early 1960s look like the good ole days. There are more evil nations today with weapons of mass destruction than ever before, and it will not get better. At some point, this game hits tilt. When it does, it will not be 120 million dying as in WWII, but it will be billions dying. That day is coming. Not if, the question is when, and is it accelerated with evil doers like Putin at the helm and a total incompetent like Biden at the wheel? Ah yeah. Ugly days ahead. Enjoy the peace now.
The age old expression of live every day like it is your last is more pertinent today than ever before. The last day for billions is coming, and many powerful and super rich folks around the world are planning that moment in time because they blame too many people for all the planets woes. Best get rid of all these people running around throwing straws in the oceans.
There will be no winning in this war. You need to dis-spell that notion because there is only one way this all ends, unless key players like Putin die and are replaced with people that do not have an insane desire to conquer the planet.
Last but not least, the time has come to undo the moronic decision made by Richard Nixon of incorporating China into the global community. We must begin closing relations with China, and we need to begin doing this today. A 10% reduction in trade each year to a level not to exceed 20% of what it presently is. Our hallmark slogan should be fair trade, not free trade. Free trade exists on the shores of the USA only, while the rest of the world is protecting their economies.
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Interesting take @jafo2010 Thanks.
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80% of Americans think Zelensky is Polish.
Polls are propaganda tools of misinformation to gaslight people to ignore reality.
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The arguments on this board sound like a major circle jerk to me. Have any of you been to Russia? Or Ukraine? Doesn't sound like it.
I have been there a number of times, and there are some basics that all should understand. Russia is a completely corrupt nation, top to bottom. Yes, there are good people in Russia, but the ones that run everything would steal the shirt off their mother's back if they could. Ukraine, having been a sister nation, populated with many people of Russian heritage is NO DIFFERENT. They are every bit as corrupt, top to bottom. Zelensky to get to the level he is at, believe me, he is corrupt.
Another thing that is reflective in their culture is the lack of religious freedom and belief. Excluding the Russian Orthodox church, which has a relationship with the Russian government, there is little to no religious freedom in Russia, and now the same can be said for Ukraine. These two nations are virtual mirrors of one another culturally.
Plus the age old argument of every dead Russian is one less we the USA has to kill. It is assumed we will jump in to save the day. But the huge problem with past established mindsets is that the QUADPARTITE of Russia, China, North Korea and Iran,
THEY ARE ALL NUCLEAR NATIONS OR SOON TO BE, AND THAT REDEFINES EVERYTHING.
How long will the Russian/Ukraine War remain conventional? How long before the USA jumps in with our military on the ground? Oh wait, we already have forces there. I have seen numbers in the tens and numbers in the hundreds. You can bet the real number is in the thousands. Unfolding just like Vietnam...yeah, Vietnam. And a number of you lived through that sh*t sandwich.
This war is a sh*t sandwich that could end the world as we know it.
Russia is teaching their children in their schools that it was the USA that started this war. Are you aware of that? Also, the people in Russia are largely given the mushroom treatment, kept in the dark and fed bullsh*t all day long. Not much has really changed from the days of the USSR in Russia. It is a totalitarian nation with large swaths of the country still very much controlled by the communist party.
But be reassured, the USA has one of its greatest champions as POTUS to lead the way. You should sleep with ease, oh yeah.
I think todays world makes the early 1960s look like the good ole days. There are more evil nations today with weapons of mass destruction than ever before, and it will not get better. At some point, this game hits tilt. When it does, it will not be 120 million dying as in WWII, but it will be billions dying. That day is coming. Not if, the question is when, and is it accelerated with evil doers like Putin at the helm and a total incompetent like Biden at the wheel? Ah yeah. Ugly days ahead. Enjoy the peace now.
The age old expression of live every day like it is your last is more pertinent today than ever before. The last day for billions is coming, and many powerful and super rich folks around the world are planning that moment in time because they blame too many people for all the planets woes. Best get rid of all these people running around throwing straws in the oceans.
There will be no winning in this war. You need to dis-spell that notion because there is only one way this all ends, unless key players like Putin die and are replaced with people that do not have an insane desire to conquer the planet.
Last but not least, the time has come to undo the moronic decision made by Richard Nixon of incorporating China into the global community. We must begin closing relations with China, and we need to begin doing this today. A 10% reduction in trade each year to a level not to exceed 20% of what it presently is. Our hallmark slogan should be fair trade, not free trade. Free trade exists on the shores of the USA only, while the rest of the world is protecting their economies.
Absolutely, hands down, the best post in this thread! Thank you for this wonderful and informative post @jafo2010 Hopefully it has opened a lot of eyes.
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The arguments on this board sound like a major circle jerk to me. Have any of you been to Russia? Or Ukraine? Doesn't sound like it.
I have been there a number of times, and there are some basics that all should understand. Russia is a completely corrupt nation, top to bottom. Yes, there are good people in Russia, but the ones that run everything would steal the shirt off their mother's back if they could. Ukraine, having been a sister nation, populated with many people of Russian heritage is NO DIFFERENT. They are every bit as corrupt, top to bottom. Zelensky to get to the level he is at, believe me, he is corrupt.
Another thing that is reflective in their culture is the lack of religious freedom and belief. Excluding the Russian Orthodox church, which has a relationship with the Russian government, there is little to no religious freedom in Russia, and now the same can be said for Ukraine. These two nations are virtual mirrors of one another culturally.
Plus the age old argument of every dead Russian is one less we the USA has to kill. It is assumed we will jump in to save the day. But the huge problem with past established mindsets is that the QUADPARTITE of Russia, China, North Korea and Iran,
THEY ARE ALL NUCLEAR NATIONS OR SOON TO BE, AND THAT REDEFINES EVERYTHING.
How long will the Russian/Ukraine War remain conventional? How long before the USA jumps in with our military on the ground? Oh wait, we already have forces there. I have seen numbers in the tens and numbers in the hundreds. You can bet the real number is in the thousands. Unfolding just like Vietnam...yeah, Vietnam. And a number of you lived through that sh*t sandwich.
This war is a sh*t sandwich that could end the world as we know it.
Russia is teaching their children in their schools that it was the USA that started this war. Are you aware of that? Also, the people in Russia are largely given the mushroom treatment, kept in the dark and fed bullsh*t all day long. Not much has really changed from the days of the USSR in Russia. It is a totalitarian nation with large swaths of the country still very much controlled by the communist party.
But be reassured, the USA has one of its greatest champions as POTUS to lead the way. You should sleep with ease, oh yeah.
I think todays world makes the early 1960s look like the good ole days. There are more evil nations today with weapons of mass destruction than ever before, and it will not get better. At some point, this game hits tilt. When it does, it will not be 120 million dying as in WWII, but it will be billions dying. That day is coming. Not if, the question is when, and is it accelerated with evil doers like Putin at the helm and a total incompetent like Biden at the wheel? Ah yeah. Ugly days ahead. Enjoy the peace now.
The age old expression of live every day like it is your last is more pertinent today than ever before. The last day for billions is coming, and many powerful and super rich folks around the world are planning that moment in time because they blame too many people for all the planets woes. Best get rid of all these people running around throwing straws in the oceans.
There will be no winning in this war. You need to dis-spell that notion because there is only one way this all ends, unless key players like Putin die and are replaced with people that do not have an insane desire to conquer the planet.
Last but not least, the time has come to undo the moronic decision made by Richard Nixon of incorporating China into the global community. We must begin closing relations with China, and we need to begin doing this today. A 10% reduction in trade each year to a level not to exceed 20% of what it presently is. Our hallmark slogan should be fair trade, not free trade. Free trade exists on the shores of the USA only, while the rest of the world is protecting their economies.
:facepalm2:
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The arguments on this board sound like a major circle jerk to me. Have any of you been to Russia?
I have. Twice,for two weeks each time. Moscow the first time,and Yoshkar-Ola that second time.
I have been there a number of times, and there are some basics that all should understand. Russia is a completely corrupt nation, top to bottom.
Kinda like the America of today,right?
Yes, there are good people in Russia, but the ones that run everything would steal the shirt off their mother's back if they could. Ukraine, having been a sister nation, populated with many people of Russian heritage is NO DIFFERENT. They are every bit as corrupt, top to bottom. Zelensky to get to the level he is at, believe me, he is corrupt.
Once again,kinda like the America of today,right?
Another thing that is reflective in their culture is the lack of religious freedom and belief. Excluding the Russian Orthodox church, which has a relationship with the Russian government, there is little to no religious freedom in Russia, and now the same can be said for Ukraine. These two nations are virtual mirrors of one another culturally.
NOT true. I know of a local fundie dingbat that has been to Russia several times on a religious crusade,handing out Bibles and trying to convert Russians to whatever she is.
BTW,when I say "Dingbat", I am talking in her 60's and living in a van.
Plus the age old argument of every dead Russian is one less we the USA has to kill.
Not MY argument! I am all about NOT interfering with the Russians when they want to take out their own rats.
THEY ARE ALL NUCLEAR NATIONS OR SOON TO BE, AND THAT REDEFINES EVERYTHING.
Not really. Damn near EVERYBODY is a nuclear nation these days. "You nuke me,and I will nuke you!" is a pretty effective deterrent.
How long will the Russian/Ukraine War remain conventional?
Forever? Was this a trick question? You DO know that if Russia were to nuke another European country that it would amount to the same thing as nuking them all,due to the fallout,right?
How long before the USA jumps in with our military on the ground?
As peacekeepers once the Russians retreat back to Russia,or on the 52nd day of Never. Whichever comes first.
Oh wait, we already have forces there. I have seen numbers in the tens and numbers in the hundreds. You can bet the real number is in the thousands. Unfolding just like Vietnam...yeah, Vietnam. And a number of you lived through that sh*t sandwich.
zzzzzz. Wake me when you come up with something real. I am not even certain the Miss Miley Military of today would even fight to protect America. Homo Rights maybe,but not the flag or the nation.
This war is a sh*t sandwich that could end the world as we know it.
EEK! EEEK! EEEK! Sumbodie grab de wimmins and de chil-runs,and run fer da hills! EEEK! EEEK! EEEK!
Russia is teaching their children in their schools that it was the USA that started this war. Are you aware of that? Also, the people in Russia are largely given the mushroom treatment, kept in the dark and fed bullsh*t all day long. Not much has really changed from the days of the USSR in Russia. It is a totalitarian nation with large swaths of the country still very much controlled by the communist party.
You DARE to claim that on the same post where you claim to have visited Russia several times????????
The Russian people are slaves/serfs,not stupid.
Are you aware of that? Also, the people in Russia are largely given the mushroom treatment, kept in the dark and fed bullsh*t all day long. Not much has really changed from the days of the USSR in Russia.
That part is still true. One of the most popular jokes going around when I first went there right after the collapse of the Berlin Wall was "We pretend to work,and they pretend to pay us."
It is a totalitarian nation with large swaths of the country still very much controlled by the communist party.
That is because it is a slave nation. That does NOT mean the typical Russian of today does not know what is going on,though.
But be reassured, the USA has one of its greatest champions as POTUS to lead the way. You should sleep with ease, oh yeah.
I think todays world makes the early 1960s look like the good ole days. There are more evil nations today with weapons of mass destruction than ever before, and it will not get better. At some point, this game hits tilt. When it does, it will not be 120 million dying as in WWII, but it will be billions dying. That day is coming. Not if, the question is when, and is it accelerated with evil doers like Putin at the helm and a total incompetent like Biden at the wheel? Ah yeah. Ugly days ahead. Enjoy the peace now.
EEEK! EEEK! EEEK!
There will be no winning in this war. You need to dis-spell that notion because there is only one way this all ends, unless key players like Putin die and are replaced with people that do not have an insane desire to conquer the planet.
Last but not least, the time has come to undo the moronic decision made by Richard Nixon of incorporating China into the global community. We must begin closing relations with China, and we need to begin doing this today. A 10% reduction in trade each year to a level not to exceed 20% of what it presently is. Our hallmark slogan should be fair trade, not free trade. Free trade exists on the shores of the USA only, while the rest of the world is protecting their economies.
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Spoken like a true Surrender Monkey.
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Spoken like a true Surrender Monkey.
@sneakypete is that all you have??? Calling people 'surrender monkeys' that don't agree with your playbook?
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There will be no winning in this war. You need to dis-spell that notion because there is only one way this all ends, unless key players like Putin die and are replaced with people that do not have an insane desire to conquer the planet.
Ukraine is screwed regardless. The destruction they have incurred at the hands of Russia will set them back for decades. Their only realistic objective is to drive Russian forces completely out of their country by destroying as much of them as possible so that Russia is not able to pull this crap again.
It is in the US interest to end this war as quickly as possible with a decisive Russian defeat and the permanent loss of Sevastopol as a Russian naval base. Unfortunately, the idiot who resides in our White House doesn't see it that way. Biden's objective is to drag this war out as long as possible, always holding back Ukraine from achieving victory.
Zelenskiy is desperately trying to save his country. And he is having to put up with a lot of crap from this regime in order to get the help he is getting (which is a pittance of what is being spent). Sure, he knows how money is being siphoned off, mostly before it even reaches Ukraine. But he also knows that some weapons are getting through. And those are his lifeline to Ukraine's survival.
If Russia wins this war, there will no longer be a Ukraine. And that is not in anyone's best interest.
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BTW,stop,and consider for a moment,the silliness of actually believing that some respected polling organization actually ran a poll in Ukraine while there was a shooting war going on,and that the results of such a poll would be accurate,and NOT what the polling organization/the people who paid for the poll,wanted them to be?
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Though she no longer posts, @Right_in_Virginia posted all kinds of evidence and history of Ukraine and Russia and I absolutely agreed with her.
Thanks @libertybele .... I did post this information. It's nice to know someone remembers it. happy77
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Ukraine is screwed regardless. The destruction they have incurred at the hands of Russia will set them back for decades. Their only realistic objective is to drive Russian forces completely out of their country by destroying as much of them as possible so that Russia is not able to pull this crap again.
It is in the US interest to end this war as quickly as possible with a decisive Russian defeat and the permanent loss of Sevastopol as a Russian naval base. Unfortunately, the idiot who resides in our White House doesn't see it that way. Biden's objective is to drag this war out as long as possible, always holding back Ukraine from achieving victory.
Zelenskiy is desperately trying to save his country. And he is having to put up with a lot of crap from this regime in order to get the help he is getting (which is a pittance of what is being spent). Sure, he knows how money is being siphoned off, mostly before it even reaches Ukraine. But he also knows that some weapons are getting through. And those are his lifeline to Ukraine's survival.
If Russia wins this war, there will no longer be a Ukraine. And that is not in anyone's best interest.
:thumbsup:
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:thumbsup:
@Kamaji 888high58888 888high58888 888high58888
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Another piece of Ukraine-Russia history that hasn't been brought up yet is the 2004 Ukrainian Presidential election between Russian puppet Viktor Yanukovych and Viktor Yushchenko. The Russians were so desperate to get Yanukovych in there that they tried to assassinate Yushchenko with dioxin.
In 2010, Yanukovych finally became President. Once in office, he had his Presidential opponent Yulia Tymoshenko thrown in prison, began censoring the press, and began using his government position as his own personal crime syndicate, embezzling $70 billion in government funds to himself, his family, and his cronies. He gave Putin a sweetheart deal on a 25-year lease extension of Sevastopol port facilities for Russia's Black Sea fleet. And he sabotaged the process for Ukraine's entry into the EU which was to be finalized in Nov 2013.
This last act sparked a huge uprising. Protesters filled the streets demanding his resignation over the EU betrayal and a reinstatement of the 2004 Constitution. Yanukovych ordered the police to open fire on the protesters. Over 100 civilians were killed. The next day, the protest evolved into a full scale revolution, and Yanukovych fled Kyiv. The following day, the Ukrainian Parliament voted unanimously to remove Yanukovych from office and to reinstate the Constitution. They also ordered Tymoshenko's release from prison.
Five days later, Yanukovych turns up in Russia where he continues to live to this day. Go figure. Three days after his arrival in Rostov, Yanukovych asked Putin to send troops into Ukraine.
THIS is the real history of how we got to where we are now. Putin has actively been trying to take over Ukraine since his election meddling in 2004. By 2022, he simply lost patience and opted for a full scale invasion. Putin is the bad guy here. Ukraine simply wanted to be left alone.
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@sneakypete is that all you have??? Calling people 'surrender monkeys' that don't agree with your playbook?
@libertybele
How about people who support Russia should be called Putin Sympathizers? You know the former KGB agent who is 90 times more corrupt than Zelensky. I miss the days when Conservatives viewed Russia as the enemy (like Reagan did).
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@sneakypete is that all you have??? Calling people 'surrender monkeys' that don't agree with your playbook?
@libertybele
I didn't create you,I just identified you.
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@libertybele
How about people who support Russia should be called Putin Sympathizers? You know the former KGB agent who is 90 times more corrupt than Zelensky. I miss the days when Conservatives viewed Russia as the enemy (like Reagan did).
I feel that we should stop sending $$ to Ukraine AND I also see Russia as an enemy.
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I feel that we should stop sending $$ to Ukraine AND I also see Russia as an enemy.
Sorry Russia was helping the Taliban when we were in Afghanistan. I figure the money we send to Ukraine so they can kill the orcs is a nice revenge move and a nice long-term investment.
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Apples and Oranges. You want to stop Rusia in their tracks...you can do two things....stop sending money to Ukraine...start oil production and exploration in the U.S. again. Undo all of the EO's towards the energy industry that Biden signed on day one.
Biden allowed Putin to fund his war effort with petro dollars by stopping all the exploration in the U.S.
But Biden won't even listen to that idea because he's compromised.
Russia couldn't finance this war of oil was $30/barrel cheaper. It would stop them in their tracks. First indication that Sniffy doesn't want win this war that badly.
And he is compromised, and I think that is the real reason we are in Ukraine at all. My gut is Zelensky has the goods and can blackmail at will.
Think there is alot more at play here, and none of it is very pretty.
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Russia couldn't finance this war of oil was $30/barrel cheaper. It would stop them in their tracks. First indication that Sniffy doesn't want win this war that badly.
And he is compromised, and I think that is the real reason we are in Ukraine at all. My gut is Zelensky has the goods and can blackmail at will.
Think there is alot more at play here, and none of it is very pretty.
Do you have proof?
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Do you have proof?
Why isn't Biden trying to lower the price of oil and cut Russia off at the knees?
Trump did.
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Why isn't Biden trying to lower the price of oil and cut Russia off at the knees?
Trump did.
I prefer to send money and arms to kill the Russians besides it didn't work on what Trump did.
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I prefer to send money and arms to kill the Russians besides it didn't work on what Trump did.
Where is your proof?
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Where is your proof?
Show me your proof Putin lover..
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Show me your proof Putin lover..
That's what I thought.
Next.
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Ian Miles Cheong
@stillgray
Ukraine now has a president for life.
Zelenskyy has announced that he will only hold elections if the USA or EU pays for those elections. Yet the USA and Europe continue to fully fund Ukraine. The point Rand Paul is making is that even in the worst parts of our history, we have still managed to hold elections.
80% of the territory of Ukraine is not interrupted at all. There is no reason for Ukraine to stall elections.
https://twitter.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1708006980512567633