The Briefing Room
General Category => Science, Technology and Knowledge => Computers => Topic started by: Cyber Liberty on October 20, 2021, 07:58:21 pm
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OK, so the Microslop Update has come to my computer. Should I "upgrade" now or wait for the Weed Option?
Not sure I want to pull that trigger so soon, so should I? Wait until the free upgrades expire? Never?
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Wait until at least the first wave of early adopters has gone through and resolved the various updating problems that will inevitably crop up.
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I don't upgrade anymore.. I have always had glitches.
I wait until they threaten to shut my machine off or an application I want/need requires a newer windows then I just get a new machine with the new windows, usually about every 5 to 7 years.
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You need another choice... Don't upgrade to Windows 11 and wait until you need to buy a new computer and do it then when Windows 10 is no longer available.
Invariably one has to update and/or replace other applications when the OS has a major change with a whole set of new problems. In addition a number of those applications may not have newer versions for the newer OS. So at a minimum you have to wait for all the applications you use to be fully supported by the new OS before moving to it.
And wasn't windows 10 supposed to be the last version of Windows for ever on and it would automatically morph into whatever Microsoft decided to do with it without allowing the user a choice??? That it had become a "service" instead of an OS...
Perhaps that plan didn't go over so well with the corporate world that doesn't want things changing willy-nilly causing random major meltdowns in productivity...
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Of course, unless one categorically needs MS Office, one can always switch to a nice flavor of linux, or, more generally, a *nix. Like Linux Mint: https://linuxmint.com/
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I am going to wait for awhile as 11 currently has issues with the Ryzen CPU and that's what I have.
https://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,451185.0.html (https://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,451185.0.html)
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OK, so the Microslop Update has come to my computer. Should I "upgrade" now or wait for the Weed Option?
Not sure I want to pull that trigger so soon, so should I? Wait until the free upgrades expire? Never?
Depends. If your machine is already set up full UEFI and TPM enabled, your call.
But f not - and most machines are not UEFI, rather either UEFI-Hybrd or legacy BIOS, with TPM present but disabled - If that is the case, know it is a full nuke and pave to enact UEFI and TPM. If you enable it from bios, your current installation will brick, and you will have to reinstall using a UEFI capable boot stick to reinstall.
It may be a thing - just sayin.
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Depends. If your machine is already set up full UEFI and TPM enabled, your call.
But f not - and most machines are not UEFI, rather either UEFI-Hybrd or legacy BIOS, with TPM present but disabled - If that is the case, know it is a full nuke and pave to enact UEFI and TPM. If you enable it from bios, your current installation will brick, and you will have to reinstall using a UEFI capable boot stick to reinstall.
It may be a thing - just sayin.
Those are good points to know! Is there any way to check whether one's system is both UEFI and TPM compliant? Other than blindly trying the update to see what happens?
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Those are good points to know! Is there any way to check whether one's system is both UEFI and TPM compliant? Other than blindly trying the update to see what happens?
You will get a nag/warning board in updates saying your machine is out of compliance for Win11 and it will not install, with a happy link to a win app to tell you what is out of whack - which is always going to start with UEFI and TPM (2.0 I think). It does NOT tell you that enabling UEFI will brick your current installation. But neither does it tell you how to do it.
But I have already had two across my bench from power users that switched their BIOS over and killed their box.
To be fair - Saying it is bricked is maybe a bit much. A reinstall will fix it. But so far, for me, there has been no alternative to copying files off the drive by hand, full nuke and pave... Though I may not understand it all the way, and there may be a repair scenario... But I have not found it yet.
So no Win11 for me until there is a HDD fail or some other reason to nuke a box. I have somewhere around 10 machines at any given time, and that's nuts over an upgrade.
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To clarify: Most machinery made in the last 10 years is UEFI and TPM2 capable. Most machines are set up differently because the strictures of UEFI and TPM are onerous, not allowing boot unless the operating system approves it - Not allowing hardware unless the operating system approves it... The OS becomes king over BIOS, and nothing but an UEFI capable OS will do.
There are also questions about unique ID being implemented through UEFI/TPM enabled OS... So most manufacturers have left the factory setup either legacy (CMOS) or UEFI-Hybrid of some kind.
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Those are good points to know! Is there any way to check whether one's system is both UEFI and TPM compliant? Other than blindly trying the update to see what happens?
Microsoft provides a tool to check out your machines to see if they are Win. 11 ready (I do not have a link handy but it's easy to find) and none of mine are for the reasons @roamer_1 has alluded to. You should also know that not all current processors make the grade.
Just my own personal opinion, but it appears to me that Win. 11 is more of a tool to sell new machines than a big OS upgrade.
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Microsoft provides a tool to check out your machines to see if they are Win. 11 ready (I do not have a link handy but it's easy to find) and none of mine are for the reasons @roamer_1 has alluded to. You should also know that not all current processors make the grade.
Just my own personal opinion, but it appears to me that Win. 11 is more of a tool to sell new machines than a big OS upgrade.
Yes @Bigun , your machinery is very likely UEFI and TPM2 capable... It/they are a setting in BIOS... So yeah you probably can set the machine up to take Win11. What you need to understand to make an informed decision is what will happen in order to make your machine UEFI/TPM compliant, and that is:
You will need to save everything off the machine, Jst like you would for a HDD replacement or other major data-loss surgery. I would suggest simply buying a new HDD and leave your old one alone in case of some SNAFU.
When your data is guaranteed safe, change your BIOS to UEFI and (Likely) within UEFI, enable TPM2
After reboot you will be ready to install windows from a UEFI capable thumb, which must be prepared before the fact. I have not been successful installing Win 10 into UEFI using a standard bootable windows media. I DL the ISO, set up a UEFI bootable using Rufus (https://rufus.ie/en/) creating a UEFI/GPT/NTFS bootable and importing the Win10 ISO into it.
Then boot to the thumb and install normally.
IOW, It is a complicated thing to do and ma really be an onramp to horror highway. It is still largely experimental to me, still messin with it... And maybe I am overly cautious... But so far, it ain't been fun.
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Microsoft releases an improved Windows 11 PC health check app
Engadget by N. Ingraham 8/27/2021
And it's allowing unrestricted Windows 11 ISO installs.
https://www.engadget.com/microsoft-windows-11-supported-processors-update-175544403.html (https://www.engadget.com/microsoft-windows-11-supported-processors-update-175544403.html)
When Microsoft released the Windows 11 Insider preview earlier this summer, it did so with some confusion around minimum system requirements. It quickly reversed course, saying that more people could install the software update than its requirements originally stated so the company could gather more performance on how the OS performed. After a few months of users testing and providing feedback, Microsoft says that, for the most part, its system requirements from June will stand — but there are a few notable changes.
This means that you'll need a compatible 64-bit processor, 4GB of memory and 64GB of storage, as well as "UEFI secure boot, graphics requirements and TPM 2.0." For the most part, Microsoft is still requiring an 8th-generation or newer Intel processor, but the company is adding a few 7th-generation Intel options to the supported list, including Intel Core X-series, Xeon W-series and the Intel Core 7820HQ. For the latter, Microsoft will only support "select devices that shipped with modern drivers based on Declarative, Componentized, Hardware Support Apps (DCH) design principles, including Surface Studio 2."
There is some good news for people running older hardware, though. According to The Verge, Microsoft won't prohibit computers running processors on its "supported" list from installing Windows 11 — they just won't be able to do so through the official Windows update software. You'll instead have to download a Windows 11 ISO file and install it yourself. The Verge says this method will primarily be for businesses to try Windows 11 and it won't be publicizing this method to standard users.
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You need another choice... Don't upgrade to Windows 11 and wait until you need to buy a new computer and do it then when Windows 10 is no longer available.
Invariably one has to update and/or replace other applications when the OS has a major change with a whole set of new problems. In addition a number of those applications may not have newer versions for the newer OS. So at a minimum you have to wait for all the applications you use to be fully supported by the new OS before moving to it.
And wasn't windows 10 supposed to be the last version of Windows for ever on and it would automatically morph into whatever Microsoft decided to do with it without allowing the user a choice??? That it had become a "service" instead of an OS...
Perhaps that plan didn't go over so well with the corporate world that doesn't want things changing willy-nilly causing random major meltdowns in productivity...
I'm a veteran of the Vista start. I know about things breaking after installation, because Vista broke almost every damned thing I had.
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Yes @Bigun , your machinery is very likely UEFI and TPM2 capable... It/they are a setting in BIOS... So yeah you probably can set the machine up to take Win11. What you need to understand to make an informed decision is what will happen in order to make your machine UEFI/TPM compliant, and that is:
You will need to save everything off the machine, Jst like you would for a HDD replacement or other major data-loss surgery. I would suggest simply buying a new HDD and leave your old one alone in case of some SNAFU.
When your data is guaranteed safe, change your BIOS to UEFI and (Likely) within UEFI, enable TPM2
After reboot you will be ready to install windows from a UEFI capable thumb, which must be prepared before the fact. I have not been successful installing Win 10 into UEFI using a standard bootable windows media. I DL the ISO, set up a UEFI bootable using Rufus (https://rufus.ie/en/) creating a UEFI/GPT/NTFS bootable and importing the Win10 ISO into it.
Then boot to the thumb and install normally.
IOW, It is a complicated thing to do and ma really be an onramp to horror highway. It is still largely experimental to me, still messin with it... And maybe I am overly cautious... But so far, it ain't been fun.
IF and when I find I have need for Win. 11 box, I'll probably just find a new (to me) one and drop the dime @roamer_1
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Microsoft releases an improved Windows 11 PC health check app
There is some good news for people running older hardware, though. According to The Verge, Microsoft won't prohibit computers running processors on its "supported" list from installing Windows 11 — they just won't be able to do so through the official Windows update software. You'll instead have to download a Windows 11 ISO file and install it yourself. The Verge says this method will primarily be for businesses to try Windows 11 and it won't be publicizing this method to standard users.
Oh that could be fun... I wonder if you can get around all the requirements that way... That will be my weekend playtime.
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IF and when I find I have need for Win. 11 box, I'll probably just find a new (to me) one and drop the dime @roamer_1
I will have a couple of my machines in Win11 for testing and orientation - I need to do that to stay on the troubleshooting edge.
And if a machine goes dark for some reason, like a hdd replacement, as an instance - I will likely bring it back win11, as it really is not so different in that scenario - I do a clean install anyway in such cases.
But real adoption of Win11 will be a years-long endeavor for me, @Bigun . Probably though attrition, much as you describe. We will see. After it ripens for a year, maybe I will have a different outlook.
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But I am really, seriously considering just turning my house Linux. If it were not for my tech business, I would have gone Linux long ago. It may just be time to throw the switch. Leave my test benches windows... and my route laptop... But my media machines could have gone linux years ago, as could my servers and personal boxen.
I might be there.
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I'm a veteran of the Vista start. I know about things breaking after installation, because Vista broke almost every damned thing I had.
That Fluster cluck should have made believers out of everybody.
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I'm a veteran of the Vista start. I know about things breaking after installation, because Vista broke almost every damned thing I had.
Win2k broke everything I had... Rewrote everything by the time XP came out, and then SP2 broke it all again. Rewritten just in time for Vista to break it all again. rewrote for Seven, and gave up. I will not be rewriting again.
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When MS won't work Linux will.
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By the way y'all... I tolja about losing WENTWORTH, my main laptop.
That was a UEFI conversion... Fixing to set the thing up for Win11. Bricked the BIOS and it has not run since... No joy in reset, no joy at all.
So while that is probably not common, bad things can happen.
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By the way y'all... I tolja about losing WENTWORTH, my main laptop.
That was a UEFI conversion... Fixing to set the thing up for Win11. Bricked the BIOS and it has not run since... No joy in reset, no joy at all.
So while that is probably not common, bad things can happen.
Well, I get lotsa joy tossing them out the window... :shrug:
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Ask all those who invested in Windows 8. Microsoft seems to get it wrong every other version. So I will hold out for whatever comes after Windows 11.
Windows Vista → Windows 7
Windows 8 → Windows 10
Windows 11 → ??????
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I'm a veteran of the Vista start. I know about things breaking after installation, because Vista broke almost every damned thing I had.
Yep... It took years to get a number of Visual Basic programs to run again...
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I'm waiting for XP professional to be reintroduced. Till them Gates can suck my big big hard......drive.
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I have Windows 10...only because I had to get a new computer after we moved... electrical problems.... long story.
I definitely preferred Windows XP. No plans to upgrade to 11.
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The one thing that caught my eye about Window's 11 was the ability to run apps on it. I just want to run my security camera software on my desktop instead of a phone. I hate phones, and the only one I have is a used one my brother gave me that I can't figure out.
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The one thing that caught my eye about Window's 11 was the ability to run apps on it. I just want to run my security camera software on my desktop instead of a phone. I hate phones, and the only one I have is a used one my brother gave me that I can't figure out.
I have an Emulator to run my Android apps, a reason I am cautious about something that might break the emulator. I use it to run my security cams too.
@roamer_1 you mentioned you have boxes running Win11. Is it a lot like 10, or is it a serious rewrite of the GUIs? I get the feeling from the buzz MS sends me, it sounds like it basically the same as Win10. I also expect they are lying.
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@roamer_1 you mentioned you have boxes running Win11. Is it a lot like 10, or is it a serious rewrite of the GUIs? I get the feeling from the buzz MS sends me, it sounds like it basically the same as Win10. I also expect they are lying.
@Cyber Liberty
Actually no, I do not currently have Win11 running on anything... I have loaded it up a couple times - I am inner ring on TechNet, and usually an early adopter - But so far, I am just messing with it.
The biggest crapola is that they have dicked with the start bar again. Can't leave the dang thing alone. Looks more like apple now with centered start that comes up in a centered window. Can't stand that. But the backside looks Win10 alright. Have not dug around much yet,
That's why I was trying to shovel it onto Wentworth - That would have been my first standing installation of my own with an intent toward using it instead of just messin with it. I was due for a new personal laptop anyhow, and I thought I would turn Wentworth Win11 and go get a different one to replace that one as my main laptop.
Now that's shot to hell, and the only other box I might be willing to mess with is the Yoga, and I ain't real keen on that either.
It sure will not be hitting my desks till I know it well.
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I have an Emulator to run my Android apps, a reason I am cautious about something that might break the emulator. I use it to run my security cams too.
Have you messed with MS 'My Phone' app yet? if it will run for you (and that is the question) it brings android messaging and notifications right to your desktop, along with a great emulator for running the phone. Works flawlessly with my Yoga - Less well with my old laptop...
And there is also Samsung Flow which works pretty good too.
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Just got the W11 link to upgrade...I will take the advice here and wait awhile.. :2popcorn:
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Just got the W11 link to upgrade...I will take the advice here and wait awhile.. :2popcorn:
Dittos. I'm not a Guinea Pig for Vaxxes or Operating Systems....
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Has anyone downloaded W11 yet?
If so how is it?
Will I have to re-install Firefox or will it still be in my aps when it is done updating?
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Just for curiosity I ran the tool to see if my machine was W11 compatible and it came back Hell No. I know I can do a back door install, but I'm nowhere near ready to leave W10 yet.
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Has anyone downloaded W11 yet?
If so how is it?
Will I have to re-install Firefox or will it still be in my aps when it is done updating?
The guts of it are still pretty much Win 7-10... They just gotta mess with the start bar. The ONE thing that makes Windows so ubiquitous, and every time they roll out a new one their hate for it is so apparent.
Win11 is Win 10 with a 'wanna be more like Apple' feel. Still ain't got it loaded for use, but I have blown it onto a couple boxes just for giggles. As it turns out, I am shaking loose my main whip on the desktop, and when it comes back it will be Win11 for realz, as I have to get comfortable with it to fix it.
As to your question - Your apps will all work fine.
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I'm waiting for XP professional to be reintroduced. Till them Gates can suck my big big hard......drive.
Ah, XP. Good times.
As I noted elsewhere, I have an old XP that I occasionally dust off and it still works.
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Ah, XP. Good times.
As I noted elsewhere, I have an old XP that I occasionally dust off and it still works.
I have a game machine with XP on it...
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Ask all those who invested in Windows 8. Microsoft seems to get it wrong every other version. So I will hold out for whatever comes after Windows 11.
Windows Vista → Windows 7
Windows 8 → Windows 10
Windows 11 → ??????
I went from 3.11 (bulletproof) to Win 95, to 98SE to XP and held out until WIN 10.
When I have a system that works, especially if I am using it for work, the last thing I want to do is screw with it.
It isn't just Windows, it's the proprietary software I use that has to be updated to run on it. That crap gets expensive.
In a fast paced environment, the last thing I need to do is learn a new OS.
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I'm waiting for XP professional to be reintroduced. Till them Gates can suck my big big hard......drive.
XP was my favorite because it was so darned hard to crash. Not since 3.11 had Windows been so solid. After skipping Win ME, Win 2000, Win 7 and 8, I finally got Win 10. It's okay, but I keep the XP machines because I have an older version of some proprietary software that runs on it.
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Considering that I am running Win10 on a real old machine built for XP I don't think I will even try it. I figure I am lucky to have Win 10 operational as it is so 11 will just have to wait until I have to get a new machine and that oughta be about the time Win 12 is being released.
I do have an older ASUS gaming laptop with Win 8 on it so I will be watching to see how you are all doing before I upgrade it.
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XP was my favorite because it was so darned hard to crash. Not since 3.11 had Windows been so solid. After skipping Win ME, Win 2000, Win 7 and 8, I finally got Win 10. It's okay, but I keep the XP machines because I have an older version of some proprietary software that runs on it.
That is the last version of "Windows" that I used.
Can no longer deal with the ish....
888mouth
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I fear I'll have problems upgrading to W11 on my machine. I had a W10 upgrade that refused to install as it detected that I had Oracle VirtualBox loaded. I tried and tried to remove all traces of Oracle to no avail. I contacted MS and a nice tech in India spent an hour remotely on my machine before he hacked the upgrade enough to load on my machine. Of course I reinstalled VirtualBox as I have several apps that won't run on W10 that I run with it on W7.
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I have upgraded two of my machines to W11, and so far they work fine. This one in my lap is still 10, but I'll upgrade it pretty soon, as the OS works almost the same. Much easier than the change from W7 to W10.
My previous machine came with W8.1, I hated it like everybody else in the world and I got the W10 upgrade with a couple months. This machine would have worked better with 8.1 because it has a touch screen. The mouse gives me trouble sometimes, but a wireless mouse works a lot better.
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Any opinions on Server 2019?
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I am now running Win11 on my laptop, presumably to stay.
For the tech inclined: This is an older, 'unsupported' box.
changed legacy bios to UEFI, no TPM or SecureBoot. Changed HDDs From MBR to GPT under the illusion I would be able to update from the stick... Booted to the stick, the only option:
Nuke and pave, installed perfectly with no warnings. I did not let it go to internet, because I want a local account, and I want the pooter named before it phones home to MS (saves me going out to remedy multiple aliased machines tied to my user account). Once that was done, I gave it internet.
Running great. Updated fine.
So I am here now. And I cannot put the taskbar on the top without a reg hack...
*SIGH*
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Don't ax me, I'm still on Windows 7. :whistle:
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Don't ax me, I'm still on Windows 7. :whistle:
So was I up until a couple of months ago..then my pc crashed and I had to buy a new one...I am afraid to upgrade to 11...whatever can happen will happen to me..lol
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My processor will not support Win 11 (AMD Ryzen 5 2400G). I know that it is possible to add a registry key to allow the upgrade, but since my PC is running well enough, I am not comfortable messing around with it.
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My processor will not support Win 11 (AMD Ryzen 5 2400G). I know that it is possible to add a registry key to allow the upgrade, but since my PC is running well enough, I am not comfortable messing around with it.
MS has changed that a bit... Nuke and Pave (or theoretically setup in win from thumb which MAY upgrade)... either way I guess (though I only KNOW nuke and pave) allows older procs - Mine is an old i7
Went in like budda - no hacks at all.
FOR SURE needs GPT formatting and UEFI... But that is all I did so far....
May turn on tpm and secure boot, but it updated fine and is working beautifully.
I hate it btw...
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So was I up until a couple of months ago..then my pc crashed and I had to buy a new one...I am afraid to upgrade to 11...whatever can happen will happen to me..lol
I was using Windows 10 at work and hated it, so we kept 7 even after buying a new computer which would have come with 10.
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MS has changed that a bit... Nuke and Pave (or theoretically setup in win from thumb which MAY upgrade)... either way I guess (though I only KNOW nuke and pave) allows older procs - Mine is an old i7
Went in like budda - no hacks at all.
FOR SURE needs GPT formatting and UEFI... But that is all I did so far....
May turn on tpm and secure boot, but it updated fine and is working beautifully.
I hate it btw...
If I have to mess with the BIOS to get something to work that may not be all that much better than what I've got... I'll just leave well enough alone.
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If I have to mess with the BIOS to get something to work that may not be all that much better than what I've got... I'll just leave well enough alone.
So far it is quicker, and smooth as black ice... But it ain't better... at least IMHO. Usability is way down. They moved every dang thing around and the start bar sucks.
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So far it is quicker, and smooth as black ice... But it ain't better... at least IMHO. Usability is way down. They moved every dang thing around and the start bar sucks.
I've used True Launch for many years and really like it.
http://www.truelaunchbar.com/
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I've used True Launch for many years and really like it.
http://www.truelaunchbar.com/
Yeah thanks... As a pooter tech, I have to learn to run this crap. :shrug: :whistle: **nononono* *****rollingeyes*****
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W10 is suppose to be supported by MS for at least another 3 years, right?
W11 is not a great learning curve from W10, IMHO, but i'm sticking with 10 for as long as i can. My PC is getting a little long in the tooth, like me.
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My wife just got me a new laptop with windows 11 on it. Right off the bat, it refused a different browser, any browser. Took for ever to find how to cut that off. Appears in max security setting, which is how it comes set up, only microsoft software can be used. Reset that and everything is fine. It does not have a disk clean function at all. also, nearly impossible to find files in the new menu. Also, if you have pictures that just won't load, no matter what, that is also part of that max security setting.
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My wife just got me a new laptop with windows 11 on it. Right off the bat, it refused a different browser, any browser. Took for ever to find how to cut that off. Appears in max security setting, which is how it comes set up, only microsoft software can be used. Reset that and everything is fine. It does not have a disk clean function at all. also, nearly impossible to find files in the new menu. Also, if you have pictures that just won't load, no matter what, that is also part of that max security setting.
Sounds like another new MS product where the primary value-add is the visual bling, but the functionality has been further castrated.
Methinks I will (a) keep my new laptop on the Win10 it came with, and (b) stay with linux going forward for newer OSes. My next computer purchase just may be an ODM machine without any preinstalled OS, so I can put a fresh linux on it without having to pay for a Win OS I'll never use.
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I'd say go for it. I upgraded my gaming laptop to 11 and I've been pretty happy with it so far.
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My wife just got me a new laptop with windows 11 on it. Right off the bat, it refused a different browser, any browser. Took for ever to find how to cut that off. Appears in max security setting, which is how it comes set up, only microsoft software can be used. Reset that and everything is fine. It does not have a disk clean function at all. also, nearly impossible to find files in the new menu. Also, if you have pictures that just won't load, no matter what, that is also part of that max security setting.
I use Firefox..does 11 support it..will it still be there after I install W11?
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I use Firefox..does 11 support it..will it still be there after I install W11?
I installed 11 on a couple of our machines, and FF is still there and working. Same for Chrome.
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I'd say go for it. I upgraded my gaming laptop to 11 and I've been pretty happy with it so far.
It is smooth, and feels quicker... I will give it that.
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also, nearly impossible to find files in the new menu.
YUP...
HATE the new start menu. Hate the 'widgets' menu. My start menu in win10 is 3 panels wide - The first panel is shortcuts I use all the time - ARRANGED AND GROUPED how I want them... The second panel is PIM widgets, large and wide - Email, calendar and todo... And the third panel has large calendar and picture widgets that are basically placeholders, because all around them are baby icons to utility things I access all the time. Editors, file managers, RDP, VNC, partition managers, Cmd box, and etc...
All that wonderful organized structure, immediately accessible by WinKey... and really, as far as I would nearly always need to go.... All arranged and organized in one place = ALL GONE.
I HATE the new menu.
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I've found that if you were getting around in W10 OK, you should be able to figure out W11. Everything is still there but in typical MS fashion with the advent of a new OS they moved everything. I just put a 92yo Woman comfortably on W11 and she was never considered a Power User.
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Sounds like another new MS product where the primary value-add is the visual bling, but the functionality has been further castrated.
Methinks I will (a) keep my new laptop on the Win10 it came with, and (b) stay with linux going forward for newer OSes. My next computer purchase just may be an ODM machine without any preinstalled OS, so I can put a fresh linux on it without having to pay for a Win OS I'll never use.
I keep threatening to turn this house Linux. And my business has been damaged enough that it is basically nonexistent... Maybe I will go where you are going...
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I keep threatening to turn this house Linux. And my business has been damaged enough that it is basically nonexistent... Maybe I will go where you are going...
I set up an older laptop on linux mint 6 months ago, as a dual boot, and it is becoming my go-to machine except when I need to work on an MS Word document for work, in which case I use my new Win10 machine, or when I want to use CorelDRAW. I haven't booted into the Win installation on the dual boot machine since I set it up.
Other than accessing MS Word documents, it's my view that there are linux distributions out now that (a) are ready for prime-time use by people who are not superusers, and (b) are fully supported by the group that put it together, so frequent updating takes place.
To be quite honest, one of the things that just finally turned me off to Windows was sitting there waiting for half an hour while it updated itself and installed the updates. The linux machine, by contrast, which is a slower machine with an hdd instead of an sdd, and an old pentium processor, updates itself in minutes - even when it makes updates to crucial kernel software.
I would definitely recommend people give linux a try, at least on an old machine to see how they like it.
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I set up an older laptop on linux mint 6 months ago, as a dual boot, and it is becoming my go-to machine except when I need to work on an MS Word document for work, in which case I use my new Win10 machine, or when I want to use CorelDRAW. I haven't booted into the Win installation on the dual boot machine since I set it up.
Other than accessing MS Word documents, it's my view that there are linux distributions out now that (a) are ready for prime-time use by people who are not superusers, and (b) are fully supported by the group that put it together, so frequent updating takes place.
To be quite honest, one of the things that just finally turned me off to Windows was sitting there waiting for half an hour while it updated itself and installed the updates. The linux machine, by contrast, which is a slower machine with an hdd instead of an sdd, and an old pentium processor, updates itself in minutes - even when it makes updates to crucial kernel software.
I would definitely recommend people give linux a try, at least on an old machine to see how they like it.
I was a Slacker way back in the day... Been on Susi and RedHat. Wound up in BSD till Ubuntu came along... And from Ubuntu to Mint, which is my current fav.
I currently have no boxen in Linux. I could easily turn my TV machines Linux... But the rest would be tough so long as I stay in business. Not only do I have to operate Win in order to stay current as to the problems my clients will face, but the lion's share of tools are win oriented. A good portion of my business is (was, really) Hell Desk over the phone. The bricks and mortar of it is recovery work and OS repair. All of that is win oriented. I seldom get Linux calls, installs, or recovery, even though I am happy to help Linux along with my clients.
So... So long as I am trying to save my business, I will probably be forced to remain a Win house. :shrug:
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I was a Slacker way back in the day... Been on Susi and RedHat. Wound up in BSD till Ubuntu came along... And from Ubuntu to Mint, which is my current fav.
I currently have no boxen in Linux. I could easily turn my TV machines Linux... But the rest would be tough so long as I stay in business. Not only do I have to operate Win in order to stay current as to the problems my clients will face, but the lion's share of tools are win oriented. A good portion of my business is (was, really) Hell Desk over the phone. The bricks and mortar of it is recovery work and OS repair. All of that is win oriented. I seldom get Linux calls, installs, or recovery, even though I am happy to help Linux along with my clients.
So... So long as I am trying to save my business, I will probably be forced to remain a Win house. :shrug:
Fair enough!!
At least one can always say that Windows puts food on the table!
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Okay I just downloaded W11 on Mike's laptop....tested it on his... :silly:
Worked perfectly...I will do mine later or in the morning...
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Ultimately the work tools I use dictates what OS I use.
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Okay I just downloaded W11 on Mike's laptop....tested it on his... :silly:
Worked perfectly...I will do mine later or in the morning...
@mystery-ak
Well, did you mandate this experimental activity or did you leave it up to Mr. Mike and his computer guru? :silly:
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Ultimately the work tools I use dictates what OS I use.
Very true. I would probably go without Windows at all but for the fact that I still need access to MS Office software for work, and I don't want to have to shell out again for CorelDRAW.
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What about OpenOffice for Linux?
The newer Office file formats are xml, not binary, so they are more portable.
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What about OpenOffice for Linux?
The newer Office file formats are xml, not binary, so they are more portable.
I actually have LibreOffice on my linux machine; unfortunately, it doesn't always play nice with the MS Word generated documents. There are still certain MS Word aspects that are not handled by LibreOffice.
Don't get me wrong, it's generally a good suite of tools, but when I open an MS Word document and try to do editing in it, sometimes the formatting gets messed up. I look forward to the time that it can fully digest and write MS Word documents; then I'll be free of another MS constraint.
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I've used True Launch for many years and really like it.
http://www.truelaunchbar.com/
Apologies... I spoke too soon. This thing may give me back some of the utility that has gone missing in Win11.
Thank you. :beer:
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Okay...I tried installing W11 and it wouldn't connect...I kept getting this
https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/secure-connection-failed-firefox-did-not-connect
This doesn't make sense since I was able to install 11 on Mike's laptop with the same settings
Is this because I have FF as my dedicated browser?
These instructions are all Greek to me... :shrug:
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Okay...I tried installing W11 and it wouldn't connect...I kept getting this
https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/secure-connection-failed-firefox-did-not-connect
This doesn't make sense since I was able to install 11 on Mike's laptop with the same settings
Is this because I have FF as my dedicated browser?
These instructions are all Greek to me... :shrug:
What website were you trying to connect to?
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What website were you trying to connect to?
None...I got this error when it was downloading..
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None...I got this error when it was downloading..
Downloading the W11 via firefox?
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Downloading the W11 via firefox?
Nothing was open...I was on the start menu got the link to download...hit download and all this popped up
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Nothing was open...I was on the start menu got the link to download...hit download and all this popped up
Hmmm, strange. And also at the end of my very meager knowledge! Hopefully one of the computer whizzes will be by shortly to help! Sorry!
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So...Firefox is halting the update, even though it's not running in the foreground. It must be running in the background. Curious. I want to ponder this a bit.
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So...Firefox is halting the update, even though it's not running in the foreground. It must be running in the background. Curious. I want to ponder this a bit.
Well 2nd time was a charm...What I did this time was clean and clear cookies with ccleaner shut down..power up went straight to the start menu and downloaded it... :shrug:
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Well, I got put on a job with a brand new Win 11 'puter.
It is just similar enough to Win 10 to aggravate me. Previous drop down menus that I used in 10 require me to click on "other options" before I can do what took only one mouse click before. Seems like another step backward for efficiency-I don't like it.
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I'm getting the 11 push popups too.
Clicked on it just for no reason a few days ago.
Kept telling me that first I have to download this thing and that thing, before I can get the upgrade.
No way. Exit and reboot. Maybe it was real? Maybe it was a virus site.
Either way I see no need to go 11. Windows updates have a very bad reputation.
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I'm getting the 11 push popups too.
Clicked on it just for no reason a few days ago.
Kept telling me that first I have to download this thing and that thing, before I can get the upgrade.
No way. Exit and reboot. Maybe it was real? Maybe it was a virus site.
Either way I see no need to go 11. Windows updates have a very bad reputation.
CNET agrees with you in their review, Win11 doesn't offer much to folks that run 10.
But, nature will take it's course when they decide to not support W10.
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I humbly admit that I am the least computer literate member on this board.
I accidently installed Win11 when a pop up appeared and said install "install now or later". I naively thought there would be another option that would give me the control to do so. Nope...it installed "later" without my prompting.
I was content with Win 10. Win 11 has messed up the start, my wallpaper and Excell access. 8888crybaby
But I guess I'll learn to be tickled pink over it....eventually. Be cranky now or be cranky later!!! I don't like change. :laugh:
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I humbly admit that I am the least computer literate member on this board.
I accidently installed Win11 when a pop up appeared and said install "install now or later". I naively thought there would be another option that would give me the control to do so. Nope...it installed "later" without my prompting.
I was content with Win 10. Win 11 has messed up the start, my wallpaper and Excell access. 8888crybaby
But I guess I'll learn to be tickled pink over it....eventually. Be cranky now or be cranky later!!! I don't like change. :laugh:
I don't like it either. This machine, my main one, is still W10. I have a couple of both.
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I humbly admit that I am the least computer literate member on this board.
I accidently installed Win11 when a pop up appeared and said install "install now or later". I naively thought there would be another option that would give me the control to do so. Nope...it installed "later" without my prompting.
I was content with Win 10. Win 11 has messed up the start, my wallpaper and Excell access. 8888crybaby
But I guess I'll learn to be tickled pink over it....eventually. Be cranky now or be cranky later!!! I don't like change. :laugh:
Thankfully, ALL of my W10 boxes are just old enough that they will not support W11 without some intervention on my part and that is not going to happen anytime soon.
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I humbly admit that I am the least computer literate member on this board.
I accidently installed Win11 when a pop up appeared and said install "install now or later". I naively thought there would be another option that would give me the control to do so. Nope...it installed "later" without my prompting.
@berdie
You CAN change it back... Settings=>Updates and Security=> Recovery
Should be a thing in there to revert to previous operating system...
I was content with Win 10. Win 11 has messed up the start, my wallpaper and Excell access. 8888crybaby
But I guess I'll learn to be tickled pink over it....eventually. Be cranky now or be cranky later!!! I don't like change. :laugh:
Not me... had it on for about a week, and reloaded back to 10
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@berdie
You CAN change it back... Settings=>Updates and Security=> Recovery
Should be a thing in there to revert to previous operating system...
Not me... had it on for about a week, and reloaded back to 10
Thanks @roamer_1 . I'll save this info should I find that I just can't deal with 11. For now things are ok and I can see me really making a mess of things if I try to reload 10. Remember I said I'm illiterate, lol.
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@berdie
You CAN change it back... Settings=>Updates and Security=> Recovery
Should be a thing in there to revert to previous operating system...
Not me... had it on for about a week, and reloaded back to 10
I see 11 as the new Vista...
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Thanks @roamer_1 . I'll save this info should I find that I just can't deal with 11. For now things are ok and I can see me really making a mess of things if I try to reload 10. Remember I said I'm illiterate, lol.
That option in Win 10 (to revert back to Win 7) was only good for 30 days since initial install. That may be in Win 11 also (30 day trail period). @berdie
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If before you upgrade to 11, you take an image backup of your system using a program such as Macrium, then you can restore back to that image at any time.
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I see 11 as the new Vista...
Yeah... Not impressed with the fit and feel. There are some things under the hood that are pretty nice... It feels smoother, faster... DriverID seems to be even better. And I was surprised when it found unpaired bluetooth automatically and asked me if I wanted to hook it up... A simple yes, and there it was.
But fit and feel, it feels more like a downgrade. HATE the new start bar. Everything seems to take two or three more clicks... meh.
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If before you upgrade to 11, you take an image backup of your system using a program such as Macrium, then you can restore back to that image at any time.
:thumbsup:
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Yeah... Not impressed with the fit and feel. There are some things under the hood that are pretty nice... It feels smoother, faster... DriverID seems to be even better. And I was surprised when it found unpaired bluetooth automatically and asked me if I wanted to hook it up... A simple yes, and there it was.
But fit and feel, it feels more like a downgrade. HATE the new start bar. Everything seems to take two or three more clicks... meh.
The start bar is crap, and I don't like the feel of it, not after the vertical bars of systems past. It has a phone feel to it, and I don't want my computer to feel like a phone, nor do I want my phone to take over what the 'puter does.
But it is the multiple click bit that aggravates me. I frequently rename data files to smooth importing them into other programs, and it takes two click to get to "rename" instead of just one. Every time is wasted time, and when it is crunch time on this job, every second can count. Also to get down to compressing or sending files in the option stack, it is the two click trip. You'd think they were in cahoots with the people who make computer mice, because that will cut the useful life of the mouse in half. (Yes, I have worn those little micro-switches out before, just as I have worn the letters off of keyboards.--E,C,L,A N, seem to go first...)
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The start bar is crap, and I don't like the feel of it, not after the vertical bars of systems past. It has a phone feel to it, and I don't want my computer to feel like a phone, nor do I want my phone to take over what the 'puter does.
Yes, it is a downgrade in usability for me - Though I am a menu hawg. Like I said, I use three panels on the start menu to organize my front end. All of that is completely GONE in 11... Which would not be bad if the thing they replaced it with - The widgets button (that now must take up very expensive real estate on my start bar), which is a feed tool rather than the simple widgets of win10... Designed around feed... I can't even get all of my PiM tools in there. 9999hair out0000
Now that Start is only minimally arrange-able, one is really limited to deep search of the menu, or a Win+R style of find\execute (which is my fallback) - I can do it alright - But I don't like it.
But it is the multiple click bit that aggravates me. I frequently rename data files to smooth importing them into other programs, and it takes two click to get to "rename" instead of just one. Every time is wasted time, and when it is crunch time on this job, every second can count. Also to get down to compressing or sending files in the option stack, it is the two click trip. You'd think they were in cahoots with the people who make computer mice, because that will cut the useful life of the mouse in half. (Yes, I have worn those little micro-switches out before, just as I have worn the letters off of keyboards.--E,C,L,A N, seem to go first...)
I heard that alright! I am an RDP freak (Remote Desktop) which is also in the [...more] list. I also rename a lot. The new context menu is crap... And I wreck Ctrl, Win, C, V, R, and down-arrow. I wreck about a keyboard per year on my main laptop and on my main whip desktop (which is actually KVM'd to three machines)... I HATE extra steps - Especially without need or reason.
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Sounds like I won't be converting my current Win10 system to Win11.
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Sounds like I won't be converting my current Win10 system to Win11.
I wouldn't. I have a Win 10 and a Win 11 here at work, and I'd rather have two Win 10s. The Win 11 machine aggravates me for its inefficiency.
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Sounds like I won't be converting my current Win10 system to Win11.
Eh... if you have an old box, do a nuke and pave and try it for yourself - It will install on about anything (5 years or so, intel i5/i7, UEFI, GPT, secure boot in my direct experience), though it is rumored it won't update on things not approved...
Different strokes and all... but I agree with Smoke.. Not impressed, myself.
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Eh... if you have an old box, do a nuke and pave and try it for yourself - It will install on about anything (5 years or so, intel i5/i7, UEFI, GPT, secure boot in my direct experience), though it is rumored it won't update on things not approved...
Different strokes and all... but I agree with Smoke.. Not impressed, myself.
Unfortunately, I don't have anything that fits the bill.
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Unfortunately, I don't have anything that fits the bill.
:shrug:
I rubbed off my main laptop this last time and loaded 11... kept it about 10 days, rubbed it off again and went back to win10...
Now technically I knew that this new box I am on was coming down the river...so after a fashion, my i7 elitebook could be afforded and could be considered sacrificial... But, the river turned out to be running slower than predicted and this new box got held up for a spell... which is why I put that elitebook back to win10 - And it DOES remain... It has been moved into a reserve capacity.
Still the point remains... Heck, a spare SSD and a little R&R would be enough to play...Leave your real SSD alone and load the spare with win11, and swap em back when you tire of it.
I guess such a thing is easy for me... Or easier anyway... I am currently running eight Win boxen in my lab, and have enough in pieces and parts to throw at least 10 more together at any given time. so swappin stuff around is just part of the furniture here.
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Anyone got experience with Linux? I have to set up a VM with Linux as an O/S. I have VM Ware, but I've never set up my own Virtual Machine. I would think Linux would be easier than Windows.
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Anyone got experience with Linux? I have to set up a VM with Linux as an O/S. I have VM Ware, but I've never set up my own Virtual Machine. I would think Linux would be easier than Windows.
Pinging @roamer_1
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Its been too long since I've run Linux. And I haven't run it on a VM. I always ran it either standalone, or a dual boot Win or Linux. All my VM usage has been with VirtualBox. I currently run Win7 on my Win10 machine to run some apps that no longer run on 10.
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Anyone got experience with Linux? I have to set up a VM with Linux as an O/S. I have VM Ware, but I've never set up my own Virtual Machine. I would think Linux would be easier than Windows.
Yeah... Mint or ubuntu (but really Mint)... which probably means any BSD based nix will go in pretty flawlessly... At least it did for me on mostly standard Intel.
Where you will get into trouble is assigning the VM what it needs... A VM box had better be heavy to cores and ram. Definitely call it a test bed if you are new... RTFM and a little trial and error... you'll figure it out pretty quick,
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Anyone got experience with Linux? I have to set up a VM with Linux as an O/S. I have VM Ware, but I've never set up my own Virtual Machine. I would think Linux would be easier than Windows.
I've been using it in various flavors since Mandrake. Besides Ubuntu, the GUI aspect of it has always been... problematic. Might consider running it on older machines. :shrug:
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I've been using it in various flavors since Mandrake. Besides Ubuntu, the GUI aspect of it has always been... problematic. Might consider running it on older machines. :shrug:
LOL! I cut my teeth on Mandrake too.... Forgot about that. Went Slackware pretty early on then Susi and Redhat for a while. then long BSD... then Ubuntu and then Mint because they install so beautifully.
Pretty much, if it installs well it is going to run well. If you go to prying it in with config files, you will chase it forever. easier to get a different box that it will install on perfectly
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I started out with Yggdrasil some time in the earl 90's. We ran on Unix at work, so it was an easy cross over for me to run Linux. I haven't dabbed in it for quite some time now.
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I'll throw in a vote for Mint. The desktop version installs smoothly, even on older equipment (I have it running on an old pentium system), and it runs pretty much flawlessly.
I originally set this system up as a dual boot with windows, but have decided that I will probably nuke the Windows partition and reclaim it for use by Mint.
And I am by no means a real super user, so if I can do it without any real problems, so can most people.
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OK, I'm stuck. Just downloaded the Mint Cinnamon 64-bit ISO, but they are telling me to verify ISO file with sha256sum.txt and sha256sum.txt.gpg. But I am not seeing those files.
Integrity check
To check the integrity of your local ISO file, generate its SHA256 sum and compare it with the sum present in sha256sum.txt.
sha256sum -b yourfile.iso
Background: I am in the process of creating a VM stored on an SSD. I chose Ubuntu 64-bit as my operating system, but it is now asking me for ISO file.
@Kamaji
@Elderberry
@roamer_1
@Weird Tolkienish Figure
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OK, I'm stuck. Just downloaded the Mint Cinnamon 64-bit ISO, but they are telling me to verify ISO file with sha256sum.txt and sha256sum.txt.gpg. But I am not seeing those files.
Background: I am in the process of creating a VM stored on an SSD. I chose Ubuntu 64-bit as my operating system, but it is now asking me for ISO file.
@Kamaji
@Elderberry
@roamer_1
@Weird Tolkienish Figure
Download the SHA256 sums provided by Linux Mint
All download mirrors provide the ISO images, a sha256sum.txt file and a sha256sum.txt.gpg file. You should be able to find these files in the same place you downloaded the ISO image from.
If you can’t find them, browse the Heanet download mirror and click the version of the Linux Mint release you downloaded.
Download both sha256sum.txt and sha256sum.txt.gpg.
Do not copy their content, use “right-click->Save Link As…” to download the files themselves and do not modify them in any way.
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Download the SHA256 sums provided by Linux Mint
All download mirrors provide the ISO images, a sha256sum.txt file and a sha256sum.txt.gpg file. You should be able to find these files in the same place you downloaded the ISO image from.
If you can’t find them, browse the Heanet download mirror and click the version of the Linux Mint release you downloaded.
Download both sha256sum.txt and sha256sum.txt.gpg.
Do not copy their content, use “right-click->Save Link As…” to download the files themselves and do not modify them in any way.
YES to ALL.
I never sum-check sh*t unless the install fails severally... Ain't no dang different than DLDing a Windows installation media or any other... SELDOM is there a transmission error. More likely is someone altering the ISO and republishing - so always get from official mirrors.
You can quite safely skip sum checking in that case.
@Hoodat
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Download the SHA256 sums provided by Linux Mint
All download mirrors provide the ISO images, a sha256sum.txt file and a sha256sum.txt.gpg file. You should be able to find these files in the same place you downloaded the ISO image from.
If you can’t find them, browse the Heanet download mirror and click the version of the Linux Mint release you downloaded.
Download both sha256sum.txt and sha256sum.txt.gpg.
Do not copy their content, use “right-click->Save Link As…” to download the files themselves and do not modify them in any way.
OK, I got that. I have a HTML document that contains the two files.
Instruction now says:
Import the Linux Mint signing key:
gpg --keyserver hkp://keyserver.ubuntu.com:80 --recv-key "27DE B156 44C6 B3CF 3BD7 D291 300F 846B A25B AE09"
Do I run this command from a DOS window?
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Oh hell. Screw it. I'm doing the @roamer_1 method. I got two ISO files, one from Purdue University and the other from Heatnet Download mirror. The two ISO files are the exact same size. If y'all don't hear back from me, then the Chicoms hacked my pooter.
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Oh hell. Screw it.
Yes... That is my preferred method in most things. :rolling: :beer:
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Looks like it worked. First time I have even looked at Linux. The Calculator opened and did correct math, so I'm counting this as a win.
Next task, loading a C compiler.
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Looks like it worked. First time I have even looked at Linux. The Calculator opened and did correct math, so I'm counting this as a win.
Next task, loading a C compiler.
Which compiler?
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Looks like it worked. First time I have even looked at Linux. The Calculator opened and did correct math, so I'm counting this as a win.
Next task, loading a C compiler.
Get a linux handbook and a bash handbook (or a handbook for whatever shell you're using) so you have all of the various app commands available to you, and then get a good feel for what the file structure is like. The linux file structure is fairly consistent across all versions, and - once you figure out the ideosyncracies - makes a fair amount of sense. Also get comfortable doing things as a regular user, and knowing when to shift to super user (i.e., via the "sudo" command). Finally, remember that most of the processing apps in linux are fundamentally text-based - that is, they accept most of their inputs as text-based datastreams, and not as objects, as you might be accustomed to if you have worked a lot in powershell. Speaking of which, a basic powershell interpreter is available for linux, so you may want to see about downloading that if you're used to using powershell.
It'll grow on you. It has grown on me.
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C-Shell was the standard when I was in the lab during my previous life. But...$BASH has been around FOREVER and even Apple uses that for their Mac wrapper.
(BASH = Bourne Again SHell)
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C-Shell was the standard when I was in the lab during my previous life. But...$BASH has been around FOREVER and even Apple uses that for their Mac wrapper.
(BASH = Bourne Again SHell)
bash is the standard/default shell that comes with a lot of versions of linux. However, there are other shells available too. Also, powershell can be added as an available shell as well.
Powershell is actually quite a powerful app, once one manages to figure out all of the intricacies of its pure object-based setup. Everything in powershell is first and foremost an object, with a whole slew of metadata baggage, even a simple string.
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Which compiler?
mingw
Haven't done it yet. I get this cool box that looks like a DOS window, but has <login name>@<machine name>:~$
Can I run C commands from here? Or do I still need mingw or other compiler?
Sorry for the stupid questions. Just signed up for an Internet Security class and will need to know this stuff in coming weeks. First lab is on stacks. And I ain't talking pancakes here. All I know is ones and zeroes. But I know nothing about where they are stored.
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mingw
Haven't done it yet. I get this cool box that looks like a DOS window, but has <login name>@<machine name>:~$
Can I run C commands from here? Or do I still need mingw or other compiler?
Sorry for the stupid questions. Just signed up for an Internet Security class and will need to know this stuff in coming weeks. First lab is on stacks. And I ain't talking pancakes here. All I know is ones and zeroes. But I know nothing about where they are stored.
The "$" is the BASH prompt.
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mingw
Haven't done it yet. I get this cool box that looks like a DOS window, but has <login name>@<machine name>:~$
Can I run C commands from here? Or do I still need mingw or other compiler?
Sorry for the stupid questions. Just signed up for an Internet Security class and will need to know this stuff in coming weeks. First lab is on stacks. And I ain't talking pancakes here. All I know is ones and zeroes. But I know nothing about where they are stored.
AFAIK you don't run C commands, C is a compiled language, not interpreted. You can create a simple C program in a text file and run something like gcc textfile.c (here textfile.c is the C language text file). It will output to an executable called a.out. In UNIX/Linux you have to alter files permissions to execute them so you can type something like "chmod 777 a.out" to make the file executable. then you can type "./a.out" to run the executable file in UNIX/Linux.
Stacks are one of the most basic data structures, where OS's use them to keep track of what memory address a program has "jumped from". Otherwise we'd have to use goto's, which suck.
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AFAIK you don't run C commands, C is a compiled language, not interpreted. You can create a simple C program in a text file and run something like gcc textfile.c (here textfile.c is the C language text file). It will output to an executable called a.out. In UNIX/Linux you have to alter files permissions to execute them so you can type something like "chmod 777 a.out" to make the file executable. then you can type "./a.out" to run the executable file in UNIX/Linux.
Stacks are one of the most basic data structures, where OS's use them to keep track of what memory address a program has "jumped from". Otherwise we'd have to use goto's, which suck.
From what I am reading so far with Linux, it already has tools to run C. So I'm guessing the 'mingw' install is not going to be necessary? I already have it installed on my Win10 system, but not on the VM.
Without seeing it yet, I am speculating the first lab is about stack overflow where some malware is introduced in the stack and the buffer is exceeded causing it to push back to the malware. Am I making any sense with that? Anyway, with any computing, practice and repetition is the only thing that works. I am hoping that 'C' will bring up memories of BASIC programming back when I was a young teenager.
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From what I am reading so far with Linux, it already has tools to run C. So I'm guessing the 'mingw' install is not going to be necessary? I already have it installed on my Win10 system, but not on the VM.
Without seeing it yet, I am speculating the first lab is about stack overflow where some malware is introduced in the stack and the buffer is exceeded causing it to push back to the malware. Am I making any sense with that? Anyway, with any computing, practice and repetition is the only thing that works. I am hoping that 'C' will bring up memories of BASIC programming back when I was a young teenager.
My understanding is that mingw was really intended to be a port to windows of certain gnu compiler tools, so that they'll run on windows and generate windows executables. For compiling on linux, it shouldn't be necessary, unless you're trying to compile something that will then be run on windows, in which case I understand that there are some cross-platform tools in mingw.
I found some info on this here: https://www.linux.org/threads/mingw.11589/
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mingw
Haven't done it yet. I get this cool box that looks like a DOS window, but has <login name>@<machine name>:~$
Can I run C commands from here? Or do I still need mingw or other compiler?
Sorry for the stupid questions. Just signed up for an Internet Security class and will need to know this stuff in coming weeks. First lab is on stacks. And I ain't talking pancakes here. All I know is ones and zeroes. But I know nothing about where they are stored.
Stacks?
What is Network Security Stack?
https://www.netscout.com/what-is/Network-Security-Stack (https://www.netscout.com/what-is/Network-Security-Stack)
The term ‘Security Stack’ is used to help visualize the many different cyber security tools (many times depicted in layers) that an organization uses to protect themselves from cyber threats. More specifically the ‘Network Security Stack’ are those cyber security tools which are network attached and conducting some sort of network traffic/packet analysis to detect and block threats. These could include a wide range of tools including firewalls (FW/NGFW), network intrusion prevention/detection systems (NIPS/NIDS), security information and event management systems (SIEM), secure web gateways (SWG), threat intelligence feeds/platforms, security analytics solutions and advanced malware analysis platforms. Examples in the market today of companies who provide technologies for this layer are Palo Alto Networks, FireEye, Cisco, among others.
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My understanding is that mingw was really intended to be a port to windows of certain gnu compiler tools, so that they'll run on windows and generate windows executables. For compiling on linux, it shouldn't be necessary, unless you're trying to compile something that will then be run on windows, in which case I understand that there are some cross-platform tools in mingw.
I found some info on this here: https://www.linux.org/threads/mingw.11589/
Thank you, sir.
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Thank you, sir.
No worries. Also, if you've d/l'ed Mint, check out the discussion forums and support forums. I've found that one can often find all the info one needs for linux questions in places like that; it's a little bit like herding cats when compared to the monolithic support services provided by Microsoft, but then again, one has paid a pretty penny for MS products, and nothing more than time for linux products. It was incredibly frustrating for me at first, but I think the trade off is worth it.
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From what I am reading so far with Linux, it already has tools to run C. So I'm guessing the 'mingw' install is not going to be necessary? I already have it installed on my Win10 system, but not on the VM.
Without seeing it yet, I am speculating the first lab is about stack overflow where some malware is introduced in the stack and the buffer is exceeded causing it to push back to the malware. Am I making any sense with that? Anyway, with any computing, practice and repetition is the only thing that works. I am hoping that 'C' will bring up memories of BASIC programming back when I was a young teenager.
You are stirring the cobwebs of my memory with this. Dang, I retired...lol.
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From what I am reading so far with Linux, it already has tools to run C. So I'm guessing the 'mingw' install is not going to be necessary? I already have it installed on my Win10 system, but not on the VM.
Without seeing it yet, I am speculating the first lab is about stack overflow where some malware is introduced in the stack and the buffer is exceeded causing it to push back to the malware. Am I making any sense with that? Anyway, with any computing, practice and repetition is the only thing that works. I am hoping that 'C' will bring up memories of BASIC programming back when I was a young teenager.
From my memory,
Buffer overflow involves overwriting a variable so that you can push arbitrary data onto the stack, which can change the return location of a subroutine, such that you can actually return the program to the calling shell prompt, which can give you access to the shell account of a remote computer. Something like that.
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From my memory,
Buffer overflow involves overwriting a variable so that you can push arbitrary data onto the stack, which can change the return location of a subroutine, such that you can actually return the program to the calling shell prompt, which can give you access to the shell account of a remote computer. Something like that.
Sweet. Anyone here have the IP address of the Bank of the Caymans?
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Sweet. Anyone here have the IP address of the Bank of the Caymans?
There is a really cool debugger called x64 debugger that really illustrates how all this stuff works on a lower level. A bit overwhelming at first.