The Briefing Room
General Category => World News => Topic started by: mystery-ak on May 09, 2014, 01:23:30 pm
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http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/pope-francis-redistribution-wealth/2014/05/09/id/570414/ (http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/pope-francis-redistribution-wealth/2014/05/09/id/570414/)
Pope Demands 'Legitimate Redistribution' of Wealth
Friday, 09 May 2014 08:29 AM
Pope Francis called Friday for governments to redistribute wealth to the poor in a new spirit of generosity to help curb the "economy of exclusion" that is taking hold today.
Francis made the appeal during a speech to U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon and the heads of major U.N. agencies who are meeting in Rome this week.
Latin America's first pope has frequently lashed out at the injustices of capitalism and the global economic system that excludes so much of humanity.
On Friday, Francis called for the United Nations to promote a "worldwide ethical mobilization" of solidarity with the poor in a new spirit of generosity.
He said a more equal form of economic progress can be had through "the legitimate redistribution of economic benefits by the state, as well as indispensable cooperation between the private sector and civil society."
Francis had a similar message to the World Economic Forum in January and in his apostolic exhortation "The Joy of the Gospel." That document, which denounced trickle-down economic theories as unproven and naive, provoked criticism in the U.S. that he was Marxist.
Francis has denied he's Marxist, and spent years in Argentina battling Marxist excesses of liberation theology. But he has said from the outset that he wants a church that "is poor and for the poor" and ministers to the most marginal of society.
On Friday, he urged the U.N. to promote development goals that attack the root causes of poverty and hunger, protect the environment and ensure "dignified" labor for all.
"Specifically, this involves challenging all forms of injustices and resisting the economy of exclusion, the throwaway culture and the culture of death which nowadays sadly risk becoming passively accepted," he said.
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Father forgive him for he knows not what he does.
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I'll have to part ways with the Pope here. What he is saying is antithetical to the thread that runs through the entire New Testament and Jesus' ministry, which - as I read it - is that it is a personal obligation between God and each individual, for that individual to do good works, to give charity to the poor, that it is not something that can be fobbed off on Caesar (i.e., secular government) and that Caesar does not do God's will, Caesar pursues its own ends.
What, by the way, is "legitimate redistribution"?? I wasn't aware that certain species of theft were legitimate; who gets to decide which?
Things like unemployment compensation, e.g., aren't primarily redistributive - their goal and end is not to redistribute wealth per se - but on providing a degree of security to those who need it most and have earned it by working.
To give the Pope the benefit of the doubt, I'll assume for now that he was really considering things like unemployment comp and other social security matters, and not the naked taking from one to give to another.
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Did he really say this or did the media take his quote and change it? I read elsewhere that on the popes website it says a different statement. doesn't use the word government.
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"Beware false prophets, who come in sheep's clothing, but inward are ravenous wolves." —Matthew 7:15
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Father-Jonathan Morris
5 mins ·
Bad reporting by many: Pope Francis did not ask nations to "redistribute wealth". He asked them to create opportunity for all, avoiding "economic policies of exclusion". This, he says, requires "legitimate redistribution of economic benefits", meaning, specifically avoiding all "injustices" (corruption, for example, "policies of exclusion", and a "throwaway culture" which amounts to a "culture of death". This doesn't sound Marxist to me.
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Father-Jonathan Morris
5 mins ·
Bad reporting by many: Pope Francis did not ask nations to "redistribute wealth". He asked them to create opportunity for all, avoiding "economic policies of exclusion". This, he says, requires "legitimate redistribution of economic benefits", meaning, specifically avoiding all "injustices" (corruption, for example, "policies of exclusion", and a "throwaway culture" which amounts to a "culture of death". This doesn't sound Marxist to me.
If there is one thing these forums have taught me, it's to avoid making judgements based on headlines.
(I still slip up on occasion).
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Father-Jonathan Morris
5 mins ·
Bad reporting by many: Pope Francis did not ask nations to "redistribute wealth". He asked them to create opportunity for all, avoiding "economic policies of exclusion". This, he says, requires "legitimate redistribution of economic benefits", meaning, specifically avoiding all "injustices" (corruption, for example, "policies of exclusion", and a "throwaway culture" which amounts to a "culture of death". This doesn't sound Marxist to me.
There isn't much mistaking "the legitimate redistribution of economic benefits by the state." That phrase is inherently socialist in nature.
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SHUT UP AND PRAY!
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"Beware false prophets, who come in sheep's clothing, but inward are ravenous wolves." —Matthew 7:15
..and wear funny looking hats.
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Father-Jonathan Morris
5 mins ·
Bad reporting by many: Pope Francis did not ask nations to "redistribute wealth". He asked them to create opportunity for all, avoiding "economic policies of exclusion". This, he says, requires "legitimate redistribution of economic benefits", meaning, specifically avoiding all "injustices" (corruption, for example, "policies of exclusion", and a "throwaway culture" which amounts to a "culture of death". This doesn't sound Marxist to me.
glad you posted this
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So Catholic and Democrat are pretty much one and the same.
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Father-Jonathan Morris
5 mins ·
Bad reporting by many: Pope Francis did not ask nations to "redistribute wealth". He asked them to create opportunity for all, avoiding "economic policies of exclusion". This, he says, requires "legitimate redistribution of economic benefits", meaning, specifically avoiding all "injustices" (corruption, for example, "policies of exclusion", and a "throwaway culture" which amounts to a "culture of death". This doesn't sound Marxist to me.
Thank you so much for posting that - and shame on me for being too lazy to go look for it myself - because what he said is quite different than what it was reported he said.
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The LDS an organization like this. We have something called the Relief Society which has been around since 1842.The Relief Society is the oldest women's organization in the world. It is for all women 18 years of age and older. The motto of Relief Society is "Charity Never Faileth". One of their goals is to serve others in need
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Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's, and unto God what is God's"…
The Pope's job is to deal with the latter half of that statement -- NOT with the first half.
Get thee into the Sistine Chapel and shut up….
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Caring for the sick and elderly and assisting the poor is Gods. You are supposed to do it voluntarily though, not have it done forcibly on your behalf.
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Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's, and unto God what is God's"…
The Pope's job is to deal with the latter half of that statement -- NOT with the first half.
Get thee into the Sistine Chapel and shut up….
Not only do you misunderstand Jesus' quote, but you,like Obama, want moral opinion relegated to the four walls of a church building.
If Jesus' message can't be proclaimed in the streets and in the media, then His message is worthless.
Read Matthew 25 if you want to know how important Jesus considered the way we treat our brothers and sisters.
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Thank you, sink! Got a trick mind for a lot of things but I can never remember the relevant passage numbers!
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Caring for the sick and elderly and assisting the poor is Gods. You are supposed to do it voluntarily though, not have it done forcibly on your behalf.
The Relief Society does this. We go to the stations at 4:30 AM and serve the poor all day from our pantries.I have been too many missions to feed the poor
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The Relief Society does this. We go to the stations at 4:30 AM and serve the poor all day from our pantries.I have been too many missions to feed the poor
I have heard they do fine work! :beer: In fact, the hot food line we use in MsF was first dreamed up by a pair of LDS doctors. Best damned idea, ever. Never met them, but it's part of the history.
Though some of the convent and hospital orders want words about them being the oldest women's relief organization. :laugh:
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I have heard they do fine work! :beer: In fact, the hot food line we use in MsF was first dreamed up by a pair of LDS doctors. Best damned idea, ever. Never met them, but it's part of the history.
Though some of the convent and hospital orders want words about them being the oldest women's relief organization. :laugh:
Relief Society was established in 1842 for women 18 years of age and older. Its purpose is to build faith and personal righteousness, strengthen families and homes, and help those in need.Men are allowed at Relief Society fuctions
https://www.lds.org/handbook/handbook-2-administering-the-church/relief-society?lang=eng#96
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Sigh...
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Sigh...
I guess we will not put your name for tickets to the Mormon Tabernacle.
:silly: :silly:
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The Relief Society does this. We go to the stations at 4:30 AM and serve the poor all day from our pantries.I have been too many missions to feed the poor
My father was raised Mormon, but left when he married my mother. That was the deal.
He told us of the good works of the church. A sort of joke I've heard goes this way.
The best place for a down and out Catholic to find himself, is in Salt Lake City.
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My father was raised Mormon, but left when he married my mother. That was the deal.
He told us of the good works of the church. A sort of joke I've heard goes this way.
The best place for a down and out Catholic to find himself, is in Salt Lake City.
Yep. Sure - they are bound to have their contingent of holier than thou assholes (or just plain assholes), but I liked the Mormons I met. Polite, friendly, helpful to a fault. Believe in hard work, self improvement, self reliance - Gee wizz, it's almost like they are conservatives or something ....
Don't get their theology at all though.
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I liked the Mormons I met. Polite, friendly, helpful to a fault. Believe in hard work, self improvement, self reliance - Gee wizz, it's almost like they are conservatives or something ....
Don't get their theology at all though.
Im all that.You will get the theology once you are immersed into the Church. That is why they have the Elders and the Sisters are for. They will work with you. Then they will do bi-weekly follow-ups after the baptism to make sure that you will not fall behind. There is also home study programs that are set up by the Church. But attendance on Sunday is a must and tithing is a must also. Reading the material like the "Book of Mormon","Doctrine and Covenants and "The Pearl of Great Price" also need to be read.
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Im all that.You will get the theology once you are immersed into the Church. That is why they have the Elders and the Sisters are for. They will work with you. Then they will do bi-weekly follow-ups after the baptism to make sure that you will not fall behind. There is also home study programs that are set up by the Church. But attendance on Sunday is a must and tithing is a must also. Reading the material like the "Book of Mormon","Doctrine and Covenants and "The Pearl of Great Price" also need to be read.
Sounds like Evangelical Christians who were smart enough to keep the rite of Confession.
Not likely to change my faith. I like being Catholic, it gives me immense comfort. Just endlessly curious about people and both how and why they see the world as they do.
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Sounds like Evangelical Christians who were smart enough to keep the rite of Confession.
Not likely to change my faith. I like being Catholic, it gives me immense comfort. Just endlessly curious about people and both how and why they see the world as they do.
The LDS church is not for everyone. I am happy where I am at. If you are looking for a religion with strong patriarchal and family values this is where its at.
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Caring for the sick and elderly and assisting the poor is Gods. You are supposed to do it voluntarily though, not have it done forcibly on your behalf.
Exactly.
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Yep. Sure - they are bound to have their contingent of holier than thou assholes (or just plain assholes), but I liked the Mormons I met. Polite, friendly, helpful to a fault. Believe in hard work, self improvement, self reliance - Gee wizz, it's almost like they are conservatives or something ....
Don't get their theology at all though.
The theology is whacko. The people are fine (I'm related to a bunch of them).
I've got cousins that are devout Mormons, Jack Mormons, and Ex-Mormons.
Me, I've never been a Mormon. Just kinda had to deal with them, get along, etc.
My wife has been to some Mormon events, and she likes the food and family aspect. She's Italian, and says they remind her of her family.
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The theology is whacko. The people are fine (I'm related to a bunch of them).
I've got cousins that are devout Mormons, Jack Mormons, and Ex-Mormons.
Me, I've never been a Mormon. Just kinda had to deal with them, get along, etc.
My wife has been to some Mormon events, and she likes the food and family aspect. She's Italian, and says they remind her of her family.
I am glad to be a devout Mormon, I will raise my family to be devout Mormons according to church doctrine and I will die a die a devout Mormon. President Gordon Hinckley said."Our lives are the only meaningful expression of what we believe and in Whom we believe. And the only real wealth, for any of us, lies in our faith.”
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I am glad to be a devout Mormon, I will raise my family to be devout Mormons according to church doctrine and I will die a die a devout Mormon. President Gordon Hinckley said."Our lives are the only meaningful expression of what we believe and in Whom we believe. And the only real wealth, for any of us, lies in our faith.”
I apologize to you for having to read such posts, SPQR! There's no reason for it.
I am a "fallen away" Catholic...was an altar boy and was taught by the Franciscans and Jesuits. Just read an essay recently that actually ridiculed the Catholic doctrine...but with velvet gloves, if you know what I mean.
Please apologize, truth_seeker. I'm sure you didn't mean to do that to a fellow member.
One more thing. Please don't turn this place into a Mormon war like over at TOS. Thanks! :police:
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I apologize to you for having to read such posts, SPQR! There's no reason for it.
I am a "fallen away" Catholic...was an altar boy and was taught by the Franciscans and Jesuits. Just read an essay recently that actually ridiculed the Catholic doctrine...but with velvet gloves, if you know what I mean.
Please apologize, truth_seeker. I'm sure you didn't mean to do that to a fellow member.
One more thing. Please don't turn this place into a Mormon war like over at TOS. Thanks! :police:
It all right. All the negative things about the LDS makes my faith even stronger.
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It all right. All the negative things about the LDS makes my faith even stronger.
Thanks...so glad to hear that.
As long as a recognized religion doesn't physically harm the weaker sex and embraces a "live and let live" mentality, it's all good.
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I guess we will not put your name for tickets to the Mormon Tabernacle.
:silly: :silly:
I was reacting to the article, not to the comments.
Has the Choir added any Led Zep to the repertoire yet?
Maybe I'll take the tickets.
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Thanks...so glad to hear that.
As long as a recognized religion doesn't physically harm the weaker sex and embraces a "live and let live" mentality, it's all good.
:thumbsup:
I really appreciate that DC
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I was reacting to the article, not to the comments.
Has the Choir added any Led Zep to the repertoire yet?
Maybe I'll take the tickets.
I do not think that Mack Wilberg or President or Prophet Monson would allow that
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It all right. All the negative things about the LDS makes my faith even stronger.
I meant you or any other Mormons no disrespect. No offense intended. So as requested, I apologize if any offense was taken.
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I am glad to be a devout Mormon, I will raise my family to be devout Mormons according to church doctrine and I will die a die a devout Mormon. President Gordon Hinckley said."Our lives are the only meaningful expression of what we believe and in Whom we believe. And the only real wealth, for any of us, lies in our faith.”
Just so you know, you are not alone here!
I was the director of education in a large Methodist congregation for many years before my conversion in 1993. Finally found what I had been looking for all those years up to then.
And if what happened at FR prior to the last presidential election happens here I'll be VERY sad indeed!
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I meant you or any other Mormons no disrespect. No offense intended. So as requested, I apologize if any offense was taken.
:beer:
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And if what happened at FR prior to the last presidential election happens here I'll be VERY sad indeed!
It won't. Myst and Repub won't stand for it. Nor would any of the rest of us.
Glad you found your path though, brother.
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It won't. Myst and Repub won't stand for it. Nor would any of the rest of us.
Glad you found your path though, brother.
:beer:
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Yep. Sure - they are bound to have their contingent of holier than thou assholes (or just plain assholes), but I liked the Mormons I met. Polite, friendly, helpful to a fault. Believe in hard work, self improvement, self reliance - Gee wizz, it's almost like they are conservatives or something ....
Don't get their theology at all though.
In my lifetime I have seen assholes from all Religions... However, I'm seeing a growing contingent from the Secularist and from Islamist.. Having said that is what I like about the Mormons... I have relatives who are Mormons...
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It won't. Myst and Repub won't stand for it. Nor would any of the rest of us.
Glad you found your path though, brother.
Thank you! So am I! It was a LONG journey!
:beer:
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Just so you know, you are not alone here!
I was the director of education in a large Methodist congregation for many years before my conversion in 1993. Finally found what I had been looking for all those years up to then.
And if what happened at FR prior to the last presidential election happens here I'll be VERY sad indeed!
That is one the main reasons why I left FR.......
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That is one the main reasons why I left FR.......
It's the reason I were zotted from FR. Got sick of Elsie's BS and called him unchristian. :shrug:
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That is one the main reasons why I left FR.......
In my case it destroyed a long standing personal friendship with Jim Rob and drove me off the forum. Not banned! Just left!
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It won't. Myst and Repub won't stand for it. Nor would any of the rest of us.
You better believe it!
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You better believe it!
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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In my case it destroyed a long standing personal friendship with Jim Rob and drove me off the forum. Not banned! Just left!
Sorry to see what happen to your friendship..
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That is one the main reasons why I left FR.......
D I T T O...
it was the last straw! J Rob went particularly insane.
I never understood it. The Romney's are a model family.
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It won't. Myst and Repub won't stand for it. Nor would any of the rest of us.
You better believe it!
It's what I like about this site..it's management.
There are probably 4 or 5 posters that I can think of that I have different views with at least 50 to 75% of the time.
But, it's never been acrimonious. A bit snarky now and then but enjoyable.
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It won't. Myst and Repub won't stand for it. Nor would any of the rest of us.
It's what I like about this site..it's management.
There are probably 4 or 5 posters that I can think of that I have different views with at least 50 to 75% of the time.
But, it's never been acrimonious. A bit snarky now and then but enjoyable.
:amen: I feel exactly the same!
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Judging by posts at FR, they are xenophobic when it comes towards LDS members. And its amazing because Fresno has the largest Temple. Bring up the topic God forbid.
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You better believe it!
:thumbsup: