The Briefing Room
Briefing Room Polls (Guests Welcome!) => The Briefingroom Polls => Topic started by: corbe on February 20, 2023, 09:52:33 pm
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MTG calls for 'national divorce' between red and blue states'
by Barnini Chakraborty, Senior Investigations Reporter
February 20, 2023 01:36 PM
It's Presidents Day, and Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene's (R-GA) got a plan.
Instead of celebrating the birthdays of America's Founding Fathers, George Washington and Abraham Lincoln, the Georgia GOP firebrand is calling for a "national divorce," tweeting that red and blue states need to separate and go their own ways. She is also advocating shrinking the federal government.
"We need a national divorce," Greene tweeted. "From the sick and disgusting woke culture issues shoved down our throats to the Democrats' traitorous America Last politics, we are done."
<..snip..>
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/georgia-mtg-biden-divorce-ukraine (https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/georgia-mtg-biden-divorce-ukraine)
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I have no idea how to answer this.....
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I would hate for this country to split apart. But it comes down to "them or us" it needs to be us.
Side note: If it were to come to that...what state would like to buy Austin and move it? Going once, going twice for this pretty piece of property. The winner just needs to bring a u-haul within ten days of the auction. :laugh:
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It's obvious to me that MTG is the front runner in the Trump VP contest.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ChozqfrVAAAbB-e.jpg)
I just don't what happened to her that happened to Carly Fiorina.
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I have no idea how to answer this.....
Either I'm too stoned to be making polls or that three syllable word 'Plausible' tripped up you Deep Thinker Briefers.
I'd bet on the former in this scenario.
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Either I'm too stoned to be making polls or that three syllable word 'Plausible' tripped up you Deep Thinker Briefers.
I'd bet on the former in this scenario.
I guess I just don't want to even think about it...
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I question the viability of letting the leftists take some of the prime locations for trade, industry, and resources that they have turned into totalitarian hellholes and continue to tie them up.
Is there some place we can just ship them back to?
Failing that, give them one state of their choice, and put up the wall.
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The country can't be divided up by state without upending entire populations based on their ideologies. "Blue" states like Pennsylvania and New York have large numbers of rural Conservatives but are dominated by the liberal cities, while "Red" states like Texas and Florida have large liberal enclaves, all of which would be stuck behind "enemy lines" under such a division.
MTG needs to shut up about such talk.
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The country can't be divided up by state without upending entire populations based on their ideologies. "Blue" states like Pennsylvania and New York have large numbers of rural Conservatives but are dominated by the liberal cities, while "Red" states like Texas and Florida have large liberal enclaves, all of which would be stuck behind "enemy lines" under such a division.
MTG needs to shut up about such talk.
No harm in provoking thought.
You are right. The boundaries are drawn along lines of population density, for the most part (excepting those "elites" who can afford more room).
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No harm in provoking thought.
You are right. The boundaries are drawn along lines of population density, for the most part (excepting those "elites" who can afford more room).
In reality, here is what such a divorce would look like...
(https://www.sightline.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/2020_United_States_presidential_election_results_map_by_county.png)
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We already tried that twice ... The Articles of Confederation and the US Civil War ... GOP just loves repeating history's failures.
Loosing is a bad habit that feeds upon itself. GOP needs to go to rehab for loosing.
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In reality, here is what such a divorce would look like...
(https://www.sightline.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/2020_United_States_presidential_election_results_map_by_county.png)
Ugh. I'm definitely going to have to move closer to @txradioguy if that's the way it works out.
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Data to consider:
States Most Dependent on the Federal Government – 2022 Edition
https://smartasset.com/data-studies/states-most-dependent-on-the-federal-government-2022 (https://smartasset.com/data-studies/states-most-dependent-on-the-federal-government-2022)
Return on Statehood: How Much Value Every State Gets from the Federal Government
https://www.moneygeek.com/living/states-most-reliant-federal-government/ (https://www.moneygeek.com/living/states-most-reliant-federal-government/)
Most & Least Federally Dependent States
https://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700 (https://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700)
Most Federally Dependent States – A Complete Rundown
https://balancingeverything.com/most-federally-dependent-states/ (https://balancingeverything.com/most-federally-dependent-states/)
Which States Pay The Most Federal Taxes?
https://www.moneyrates.com/research-center/federal-income-taxes-by-state.htm (https://www.moneyrates.com/research-center/federal-income-taxes-by-state.htm)
States Most Dependent on the Federal Government – 2022 Edition
https://www.yahoo.com/now/states-most-dependent-federal-government-110024610.html (https://www.yahoo.com/now/states-most-dependent-federal-government-110024610.html)
Where States Get Their Money - FY 2020
https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/data-visualizations/2022/where-states-get-their-money-fy-2020
(https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/data-visualizations/2022/where-states-get-their-money-fy-2020)
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Data to consider:
States Most Dependent on the Federal Government – 2022 Edition
https://smartasset.com/data-studies/states-most-dependent-on-the-federal-government-2022 (https://smartasset.com/data-studies/states-most-dependent-on-the-federal-government-2022)
Return on Statehood: How Much Value Every State Gets from the Federal Government
https://www.moneygeek.com/living/states-most-reliant-federal-government/ (https://www.moneygeek.com/living/states-most-reliant-federal-government/)
Most & Least Federally Dependent States
https://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700 (https://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700)
Most Federally Dependent States – A Complete Rundown
https://balancingeverything.com/most-federally-dependent-states/ (https://balancingeverything.com/most-federally-dependent-states/)
Which States Pay The Most Federal Taxes?
https://www.moneyrates.com/research-center/federal-income-taxes-by-state.htm (https://www.moneyrates.com/research-center/federal-income-taxes-by-state.htm)
States Most Dependent on the Federal Government – 2022 Edition
https://www.yahoo.com/now/states-most-dependent-federal-government-110024610.html (https://www.yahoo.com/now/states-most-dependent-federal-government-110024610.html)
Where States Get Their Money - FY 2020
https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/data-visualizations/2022/where-states-get-their-money-fy-2020
(https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/data-visualizations/2022/where-states-get-their-money-fy-2020)
Very interesting data. It goes to show that we are all corrupted by the leviathan to such an extent that it cannot be cast off. It is what the leviathan counts on.
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We Don’t Need A ‘National Divorce,’ We Need More Federalism
BY: DAVID HARSANYI
FEBRUARY 21, 2023
(https://thefederalist.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/Southern_Chivalry-1200x675.jpg)
Caning of Charles Sumner
IMAGE CREDIT
WIKIPEDIA/JOHN L. MAGEE
Get real.
Marjorie Taylor Greene says the country needs a national divorce. “We need to separate by red states and blue states and shrink the federal government,” she tweeted. “Everyone I talk to says this. From the sick and disgusting woke culture issues shoved down our throats to the Democrat’s traitorous America Last policies, we are done.”
Generally speaking, I’m sympathetic to the idea that the political left is congenitally unable to accept a truly diverse nation. Virtually every legislative policy proposal from modern Democrats — and every policy issued by edict — strengthens federal power and economic control over states. Modern Democrats are champions of direct democracy, in an effort to undercut the choices of local communities and individuals. When they don’t get their way, the permanent D.C. bureaucracy steps in to circumvent the will of states. And when courts stop them, Democrats delegitimize and work to weaken the judiciary. This week, Sen. Ron Wyden, D-Ore., argued states should simply disregard the Supreme Court when they don’t agree with a decision. Ignoring the division of power is far more likely to cause a national schism than any Greene tweet.
None of that means a “national divorce” — really succession, since other states are unlikely to concede to a split — isn’t a reckless thing for someone who took a vow to defend the Constitution to advocate. Even if we took a moment to seriously contemplate the idea, how would it be achieved? We aren’t separated ideologically into large geographic regions or even states, but rather urban, suburban, and rural areas. Conservatives like to share that map showing virtually the entire country painted in electoral red — and it matters more than Democrats like to admit. But we can’t discount that density also matters. A “national divorce” would create even smaller minorities and divisions, but little difference in the way of policy. (How are the Greenes going to shrink the government when they won’t even reform entitlements?)
<..snip..>
https://thefederalist.com/2023/02/21/we-dont-need-a-national-divorce-we-need-more-federalism/ (https://thefederalist.com/2023/02/21/we-dont-need-a-national-divorce-we-need-more-federalism/)
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A national divorce would not be a plausible remedy for the simple fact that each state has the same divisions within it - mostly its an urban versus non-urban issue in most states - so a divorce along state lines wouldn't assuage the pain of the group that ended up being in the minority in each state unless there was a mass migration of affected individuals from one side of the divorce line to the other. Such dislocation would be disastrous.
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A National Divorce Isn’t Happening
It's like asking a mugger to stop beating you and split the contents of your wallet
February 21, 2023 by Daniel Greenfield
The idea of a national divorce is gaining currency among some on the right. The appeal is as obvious as it is completely unrealistic. Getting a national divorce from the Left is like asking a mugger to stop beating you and just agree to split the contents of your wallet. It’s appeasement from a position of weakness and that never works.
The Left isn’t into compromise. It wants total victory and it holds most of the good cards. It didn’t get into this to settle for New York and California, or for that matter America. Making any kind of deal with it is a delusion and entirely unfeasible. The national division isn’t between red and blue states, but between urban and some suburban areas, and everything else. A national divorce between urban and rural areas would only be workable as some sort of libertarian fever dream in which both sides form federations and sign complex treaties.
<..snip..>
https://www.frontpagemag.com/a-national-divorce-isnt-happening/ (https://www.frontpagemag.com/a-national-divorce-isnt-happening/)
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We already tried that twice ... The Articles of Confederation and the US Civil War ... GOP just loves repeating history's failures.
Loosing is a bad habit that feeds upon itself. GOP needs to go to rehab for loosing.
The Republicans WON the war between the states.
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I think the Divorce is the remedy. But other Briefers are spot on that the Logistics are pretty much never going to let that happen.
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Ugh. I'm definitely going to have to move closer to @txradioguy if that's the way it works out.
Come on down! I've got someone that can sell you a house here and sell yours up there.
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In 1862, the GOP was advocating preserving the Union. In 2023, the GOP is advocating dissolution of the Union.
The GOP is no longer the party of Abraham Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt, Barry Goldwater, and Ronald Reagan.
The GOP is being torn apart among a few rich, loud, overly-influential Globalist, Social Conservative, Seditionist, Successionist, and pro-Putin interests.
The GOP is continuing the dissolution of the Reagan coalition that started with Bush 41, greatly accelerated by Bush 43, and expertly exloited by Trump 45.
It will become increasingly difficult for the GOP to win state-wide elections. They'll win House Rep and State legislative elections, but not as many US Senate and US Presidential elections.
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All it takes is ONE.
Florida leaves, Texas will soon follow. Then there will be a flood of nations following them.
All it takes is one.
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In reality, here is what such a divorce would look like...
(https://www.sightline.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/2020_United_States_presidential_election_results_map_by_county.png)
Keep in mind that most of the blue spots in the Dakotas, and a few in Montana are Indian Reservations. Since they run on separate governments from the rest of the State (under federal jurisdiction) that might not be much different from what it is now.
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Very interesting data. It goes to show that we are all corrupted by the leviathan to such an extent that it cannot be cast off. It is what the leviathan counts on.
But it doesn't break down what the Federal money is for. Is it for maintaining 150 missiles, silos and facilities along with two air bases, university grants for Federal research, or even highway funding (for the roads we pay taxes to drive on when we fill up) ?
I'd like to see more of a breakdown on all that Federal Money.
As for who pays the highest income taxes, well, that means they make more money. How many of those jobs are Government jobs? (a cut going from one pocket to the other)...
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It's obvious to me that MTG is the front runner in the Trump VP contest.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ChozqfrVAAAbB-e.jpg)
I just don't what happened to her that happened to Carly Fiorina.
You may be on to something there @corbe ... The way she pushed the speaker vote (as Trump wanted) had me wondering how an otherwise firebrand conservative would be pushing so hard for a Rino... She was adamant and it ticked me off.
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MTG is NOT the front runner for anything but her own district.
I do not believe Trump will win the primary. He will not best DeSantis.
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MTG calls for 'national divorce' between red and blue states'
by Barnini Chakraborty, Senior Investigations Reporter
February 20, 2023 01:36 PM
It's Presidents Day, and Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene's (R-GA) got a plan.
Instead of celebrating the birthdays of America's Founding Fathers, George Washington and Abraham Lincoln, the Georgia GOP firebrand is calling for a "national divorce," tweeting that red and blue states need to separate and go their own ways. She is also advocating shrinking the federal government.
"We need a national divorce," Greene tweeted. "From the sick and disgusting woke culture issues shoved down our throats to the Democrats' traitorous America Last politics, we are done."
<..snip..>
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/georgia-mtg-biden-divorce-ukraine (https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/georgia-mtg-biden-divorce-ukraine)
Not even close to being plausible. The correct answer is a lot more federalism.
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A national divorce would not be a plausible remedy for the simple fact that each state has the same divisions within it - mostly its an urban versus non-urban issue in most states - so a divorce along state lines wouldn't assuage the pain of the group that ended up being in the minority in each state unless there was a mass migration of affected individuals from one side of the divorce line to the other. Such dislocation would be disastrous.
:thumbsup:
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Want a shock? Here are some recent poll results from Rasmussen on this matter....
47%-42% of those in GOP support this, 34% of all respondants.
And only 26% of dims... Why would the slugs want to lose their source of entitlements?
This is not "out there", and will not the last time this will be debated.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11812977/amp/A-Americans-agree-Marjorie-Taylor-Greenes-national-divorce-call.html (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11812977/amp/A-Americans-agree-Marjorie-Taylor-Greenes-national-divorce-call.html)
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Since we are "sharing" a country with demons who wish our demise, what exactly would be the alternative to a national divorce?
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:thumbsup:
Not along state lines... along regions would be the more workable solution.
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Since we are "sharing" a country with demons who wish our demise, what exactly would be the alternative to a national divorce?
Exactly. If the FedGov runs the nation into the ground and becomes financially impotent, the power vacuum will automatically devolve into the defacto redrawing of lines whether DC likes it or not, because it won't be able to do anything about it.
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There no longer remains a republic. We as a society are too obtuse to realize it is gone. What remains is something equivalent to Jeff Goldblum after he went through the transport machine one time too many in The Fly. Is it the character Jeff is playing? Sure. But it is also something more, and something not normal by any means. Biden is doing the same to this nation as Jeff did to himself, morph this nation into something unrecognizable to anyone.
And the answer sure as hell is NOT Trump. He had his 30 seconds of fame with promises NOT kept. Yeah, NOT kept! Two most important promises were build the wall and end H1-b Visas. He did NOT keep either promise. He actually increased the H1-b Visa numbers at the request of the tech billionaire oligarchs, the same f*****s that stabbed him in the back repeatedly with the 2020 election!
Divorce the nation, what a preposterous notion. How would one divide the country? Pure idiocy!
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MTG calls for 'national divorce' between red and blue states'
by Barnini Chakraborty, Senior Investigations Reporter
February 20, 2023 01:36 PM
It's Presidents Day, and Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene's (R-GA) got a plan.
Instead of celebrating the birthdays of America's Founding Fathers, George Washington and Abraham Lincoln, the Georgia GOP firebrand is calling for a "national divorce," tweeting that red and blue states need to separate and go their own ways. She is also advocating shrinking the federal government.
"We need a national divorce," Greene tweeted. "From the sick and disgusting woke culture issues shoved down our throats to the Democrats' traitorous America Last politics, we are done."
<..snip..>
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/georgia-mtg-biden-divorce-ukraine (https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/georgia-mtg-biden-divorce-ukraine)
How does Margie Gorilla Green expect this to happen? Who gets the military bases?
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How does Margie Gorilla Green expect this to happen? Who gets the military bases?
Siri: "What are Armory's and State owned military training areas?" *****rollingeyes*****
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How does Margie Gorilla Green expect this to happen? Who gets the military bases?
I guess they can always rent U-Hauls and move 'em. happy77
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I guess they can always rent U-Hauls and move 'em. happy77
I had so much hope for her. But she was just a creation. The district she represents is pretty neat country. Adjacent to my part of Georgia, but she has become a robotic party shill. Such a shame.