The Briefing Room
General Category => Politics/Government => Topic started by: mystery-ak on October 15, 2023, 08:49:53 pm
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House speaker vote expected Tuesday as Jordan lobbies GOP holdouts
by Emily Jacobs, Congressional Reporter
October 15, 2023 04:01 PM
A notice sent out by House Majority Whip Tom Emmer's (R-MN) office told House Republicans to expect the first floor votes of the week on Tuesday, Oct. 17.
House Judiciary Committee Chairman Jim Jordan (R-OH) and his allies have been pushing for the Tuesday floor vote to give the GOP speaker nominee time to meet with holdouts on Monday. A separate notice sent out by House Minority Whip Katherine Clark (D-MA) on Sunday afternoon told members to expect a floor vote on the next speaker on Tuesday at 12 p.m.
The House has gone 11 days without an official speaker after Rep. Matt Gaetz (R-FL) introduced a motion to vacate that ousted former Speaker Kevin McCarthy (R-CA). The move marked the first time a speaker was removed from their post in the middle of their tenure.
The House voted in a secret ballot on Friday to make Jordan the GOP's speaker-designee after House Majority Leader Steve Scalise (R-LA) dropped out of consideration for the position.
Jordan won the nomination in a 124-81 vote, a far cry from the 217 needed to secure the speaker’s gavel. Jordan upped his numbers in a second vote, 152-55.
A source familiar with the matter tells the Washington Examiner that Jordan is intent on putting members on the record after spending the weekend working to convince those opposing him to reconsider.
In the meantime, House Democrats are preparing to engage in more formal discussions with their GOP counterparts on a possible bipartisan solution.
“There are informal conversations that have been underway,” House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY) told NBC’s Meet the Press on Sunday. “When we get back to Washington tomorrow, it’s important to begin to formalize those discussions.”
more
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/house-speaker-vote-expected-tuesday-jordan-lobbies-holdouts
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“There are informal conversations that have been underway,” House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries
Yeah what is Jordan giving the Dems for their support...
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Yeah what is Jordan giving the Dems for their support...
If that is the case, he's no better than McCarthy, Ryan, Boehner, etc. Sell-out incorporated.
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I thought being a holdout was some kind of original sin? Why aren't they getting in line and doing what they're told like a bunch of brats?
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Turner: If GOP can’t elect Speaker then ‘deal will have to be done’ with Democrats
by Miranda Nazzaro - 10/15/23 2:27 PM ET
Rep. Mike Turner (R-Ohio) said Sunday if House Republicans cannot elect a Speaker soon then a “deal will have to be done” with Democrats in order to get the chamber running again, as it nears two weeks since Rep. Kevin McCarthy’s (R-Calif.) historic ousting.
Asked on CBS News’s “Face the Nation” if there is a possible alternative scenario in which Republicans will need to work with Democrats to find a “mutually acceptable Speaker,” Turner responded that while he prefers a Republican solution to electing a Speaker and supports Rep. Jim Jordan (R-Ohio), a few hard-line GOP members may force a bipartisan deal.
“I think Jim Jordan will be an excellent Speaker. I think he’ll be able to get to 217. If not, we have other leaders in the House. And certainly, if there is a need if the radical, you know, almost just handful of people in the Republican side, make it unable … to be able to return to general work on the House, then I think obviously, there will be a deal [that] will have to be done,” Turner said.
McCarthy was booted from the top spot in a 216-210 vote nearly two weeks ago, making him the first Speaker to to ever be ousted. Eight Republicans joined all House Democrats in voting to take away the gavel from the California Republican.
In the chaotic set of days that followed, the Republicans vying for the Speakership have been met with internal division and opposition, making it more difficult to garner the 217 needed to take the top spot.
more
https://thehill.com/homenews/house/4257216-turner-if-gop-cant-elect-speaker-then-deal-will-have-to-be-done-with-democrats/
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Rep. Mike Turner (R-Ohio) said Sunday if House Republicans cannot elect a Speaker soon then a “deal will have to be done” with Democrats in order to get the chamber running again
Who said that getting the chamber running again is a good thing?
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Who said that getting the chamber running again is a good thing?
I think a very large majority of House Republicans believe that the House must be able to pass legislation sooner or later.
There probably are some who'd just prefer for the entire government to crash and be able to do literally nothing, but I suspect that's a small minority.
Because at some point, you'd have literally zero federal government employees. No military, no border, no courts, nobody to process Social Security checks or Medicare benefits, no air traffic controllers...literally nothing.
So while some folks who romanticize anarchy believes that would be a good thing, they don't have the votes regardless of whether they are correct or not.
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I think a very large majority of House Republicans believe that the House must be able to pass legislation sooner or later.
There probably are some who'd just prefer for the entire government to crash and be able to do literally nothing, but I suspect that's a small minority.
Because at some point, you'd have literally zero federal government employees. No military, no border, no courts, nobody to process Social Security checks or Medicare benefits, no air traffic controllers...literally nothing.
So while some folks who romanticize anarchy believes that would be a good thing, they don't have the votes regardless of whether they are correct or not.
That's neither fair, nor true. No one here promotes anarchy.
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I think a very large majority of House Republicans believe that the House must be able to pass legislation sooner or later.
Then pass it. You don't need a Speaker to get a bill passed. There was a CR a year or so back that passed with only two members on the floor. Congress does whatever in the hell they want.
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Can you say Speaker Jeffries
https://twitter.com/ProudElephantUS/status/1713705984546255079
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Can you say Speaker Jeffries
https://twitter.com/ProudElephantUS/status/1713705984546255079
...hmmm 3 from FL, that surprises me
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That's neither fair, nor true. No one here promotes anarchy.
Well, what would you call it if the federal government went completely unfunded for an extended period, and literally nobody who received a federal paycheck had a job anymore? No military, nobody to process social security or Medicare, no border security, nobody to enforce any federal laws at all...it literally all just stopped. No air traffic...none of it. For months/years.
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Then pass it. You don't need a Speaker to get a bill passed. There was a CR a year or so back that passed with only two members on the floor. Congress does whatever in the hell they want.
Apparently you do, under the Rules. Committees can keep operating, and what you saw had to have someone in the Chair. The problem is, if there is no Speaker - or nobody to whom he has given the gavel under the rules, then nobody can recognize a matter on the floor.
The real question is whether the Speaker Pro Tempore has that power, and if he does, then you're right. Don't need a Speaker, and McHenry already has those powers. So just screw the whole election of a new Speaker and keep chugging ahead with McHenry.
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Well, what would you call it if the federal government went completely unfunded for an extended period, and literally nobody who received a federal paycheck had a job anymore? No military, nobody to process social security or Medicare, no border security, nobody to enforce any federal laws at all...it literally all just stopped. No air traffic...none of it. For months/years.
You're hyperventilating, @Maj. Bill Martin ... We have plenty of Tumpsters to do that around here... :beer:
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Apparently you do, under the Rules. Committees can keep operating, and what you saw had to have someone in the Chair. The problem is, if there is no Speaker - or nobody to whom he has given the gavel under the rules, then nobody can recognize a matter on the floor.
When have House rules ever stopped the House from doing anything? They can suspend the rules any time they want on voice votes without a rollcall.
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Proud Elephant 🇺🇸🦅
@ProudElephantUS
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Follow
🚨 JUST IN: Here are the 6 Republicans that have said they are considering working with the Democrats to elect a Democrat Speaker if Jim Jordan is the nominee.
1. Mike Rogers (AL)
2. Ann Wagner (MO)
3. Don Bacon (NE)
4. Vern Buchanan (FL)
5. Carlos Gimenez (FL)
6. Mario Diaz
↑ ↑ ↑ ↑
THIS is the Establishment we are fighting against. There is no way in hell I am ever supporting any Republican willing to vote for a Dem as Speaker when Republicans hold the majority. I know Jim Jordan would never do that. To hell with them all.
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↑ ↑ ↑ ↑
THIS is the Establishment we are fighting against. There is no way in hell I am ever supporting any Republican willing to vote for a Dem as Speaker when Republicans hold the majority. I know Jim Jordan would never do that. To hell with them all.
This is my entire point. Everybody's pissy and wants to expel Gaetz from the House for removing McCarthy, but it's ok for these clowns to prevent Jordan from becoming Speaker and elect a Rat.
Hypocrisy so thick you can slice it like bread.
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Can you say Speaker Jeffries
https://twitter.com/ProudElephantUS/status/1713705984546255079
6 that need to lose 100% RNC money and a massive primary challenge.
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Turner: If GOP can’t elect Speaker then ‘deal will have to be done’ with Democrats
by Miranda Nazzaro - 10/15/23 2:27 PM ET
Rep. Mike Turner (R-Ohio) said Sunday if House Republicans cannot elect a Speaker soon then a “deal will have to be done” with Democrats in order to get the chamber running again, as it nears two weeks since Rep. Kevin McCarthy’s (R-Calif.) historic ousting.
Asked on CBS News’s “Face the Nation” if there is a possible alternative scenario in which Republicans will need to work with Democrats to find a “mutually acceptable Speaker,” Turner responded that while he prefers a Republican solution to electing a Speaker and supports Rep. Jim Jordan (R-Ohio), a few hard-line GOP members may force a bipartisan deal.
“I think Jim Jordan will be an excellent Speaker. I think he’ll be able to get to 217. If not, we have other leaders in the House. And certainly, if there is a need if the radical, you know, almost just handful of people in the Republican side, make it unable … to be able to return to general work on the House, then I think obviously, there will be a deal [that] will have to be done,” Turner said.
McCarthy was booted from the top spot in a 216-210 vote nearly two weeks ago, making him the first Speaker to to ever be ousted. Eight Republicans joined all House Democrats in voting to take away the gavel from the California Republican.
In the chaotic set of days that followed, the Republicans vying for the Speakership have been met with internal division and opposition, making it more difficult to garner the 217 needed to take the top spot.
more
https://thehill.com/homenews/house/4257216-turner-if-gop-cant-elect-speaker-then-deal-will-have-to-be-done-with-democrats/
Congratulations, Mr. Gaetz. How big was that check from the DNC?
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DC_Draino
@DC_Draino
Hair jokes aside, Rep. Mike Rogers is openly organizing a coalition of Democrats to join with RINOs to elect a Uniparty Speaker (possibly Hakeem Jeffries)
The reason is simple
Mike is Chair of Armed Services and bought out by defense contractors
Jim Jordan wants to stop Ukraine funding
The Military Industrial Complex has been funding Mike Rogers for years so they have him on a tight leash to be their little Congressional war funding simp
3:03 PM · Oct 15, 2023
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You're hyperventilating, @Maj. Bill Martin ... We have plenty of Tumpsters to do that around here... :beer:
I'm not hyperventilating - I'm taking what some people say at face value. You know, as if they actually mean what they say. Novel concept, I know....
So I assume you at least would agree that shutting down the federal government long-term is not a viable strategy. Right? Because believe it or not, there really are people advocating exactly that.
Now maybe they're just posturing. Maybe. But it really doesn't matter because that rhetoric alone is going to push the moderates into making a deal with someone who isn't telling people they don't have a problem with a long-term shutdown.
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When have House rules ever stopped the House from doing anything? They can suspend the rules any time they want on voice votes without a rollcall.
Of course, every time there has been a vote to suspend the rules, that vote itself has been authorized and put on the floor by...the Speaker.
It's also important to remember that the position of Speaker is itself specifically mandated by the Constitution, which says that the House "shall" chuse its Speaker and other officers. So to the extent Republicans decided that they didn't need a Speaker, they would actually be violating their Constitutional oath.
I'm personally in favor of just ratifying McHenry, and moving forward.
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DC_Draino
@DC_Draino
Hair jokes aside, Rep. Mike Rogers is openly organizing a coalition of Democrats to join with RINOs to elect a Uniparty Speaker (possibly Hakeem Jeffries)
The reason is simple
Mike is Chair of Armed Services and bought out by defense contractors
Jim Jordan wants to stop Ukraine funding
The Military Industrial Complex has been funding Mike Rogers for years so they have him on a tight leash to be their little Congressional war funding simp
3:03 PM · Oct 15, 2023
I don't think that's what Rogers is actually doing...at least not yet. I think he's trying to apply pressure to the conservatives to compromise.
But I do think there are more than enough votes to sink Jordan the same way McCarthy and Scalise were sunk. So the question is whether or not it is possible to elect a compromise candidate. If not...then Rogers and co. may look to the Democrats.
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This is my entire point. Everybody's pissy and wants to expel Gaetz from the House for removing McCarthy, but it's ok for these clowns to prevent Jordan from becoming Speaker and elect a Rat.
Hypocrisy so thick you can slice it like bread.
Great point!
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Rogers has changed his tune and now says he'll vote for Jordan.
Mike Rogers
@RepMikeRogersAL
@Jim_Jordan and I have had two cordial, thoughtful, and productive conversations over the past two days. We agreed on the need for Congress to pass a strong NDAA, appropriations to fund our government's vital functions, and other important legislation like the Farm Bill.
As a result, I have decided to support Jim Jordan for Speaker of the House on the floor.
Since I was first elected to the House, I have always been a team player and supported what the majority of the Republican Conference agrees to. Together, our Republican majority will be stronger to fight Joe Biden’s reckless agenda for America.
9:34 AM · Oct 16, 2023
I've read that Rep. Ann Wagner is the only holdout.
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↑ ↑ ↑ ↑
THIS is the Establishment we are fighting against. There is no way in hell I am ever supporting any Republican willing to vote for a Dem as Speaker when Republicans hold the majority. I know Jim Jordan would never do that. To hell with them all.
They're not counting on your vote anyway. In their districts, they're popular.
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This is my entire point. Everybody's pissy and wants to expel Gaetz from the House for removing McCarthy, but it's ok for these clowns to prevent Jordan from becoming Speaker and elect a Rat.
Hypocrisy so thick you can slice it like bread.
888high58888
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I'm not hyperventilating - I'm taking what some people say at face value. You know, as if they actually mean what they say. Novel concept, I know....
So I assume you at least would agree that shutting down the federal government long-term is not a viable strategy. Right? Because believe it or not, there really are people advocating exactly that.
Now maybe they're just posturing. Maybe. But it really doesn't matter because that rhetoric alone is going to push the moderates into making a deal with someone who isn't telling people they don't have a problem with a long-term shutdown.
I remain convinced of my original statement:
In order to deal efficiently, everything must be on the table... Particularly the downside - The thing that is the whip or chain. And for that reason, shutdown MUST be on the table to avoid the all too common 'too big to fail' mentality. There will never be a balanced budget again without a threatening downside.
For that reason, while I have no particular fondness for Geatz, and while I see the trick as being ham-handed, I cannot be against the premise.
The other obvious aspect - It's been perfectly fine for the Moderates to hold Conservatives hostage with 'gang of eight' strategy, blocking conservative legislation, even in strong conservative conventions... But now the Right, using the very same strategy, sets forth a clamor and a cry.
That also forces me to accept the premise.
And finally, Republican forces that are willing to collude with the Left in order that a Conservative might not ascend is very, very telling... And again, I must align with my fellows.
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I remain convinced of my original statement:
In order to deal efficiently, everything must be on the table... Particularly the downside - The thing that is the whip or chain. And for that reason, shutdown MUST be on the table to avoid the all too common 'too big to fail' mentality. There will never be a balanced budget again without a threatening downside.
For that reason, while I have no particular fondness for Geatz, and while I see the trick as being ham-handed, I cannot be against the premise.
The other obvious aspect - It's been perfectly fine for the Moderates to hold Conservatives hostage with 'gang of eight' strategy, blocking conservative legislation, even in strong conservative conventions... But now the Right, using the very same strategy, sets forth a clamor and a cry.
That also forces me to accept the premise.
And finally, Republican forces that are willing to collude with the Left in order that a Conservative might not ascend is very, very telling... And again, I must align with my fellows.
Playing cards one does not have the wherewithal to back up is a fools' errand. The idiots - yes, they are idiots - playing this game do not have the wherewithal to back up their threats, and as a result, they will inevitably lose, which means that "shutdown" was never a real threat in the first place, simply because, sooner rather than later, the idiots will be shunted aside, their persuasive pull in Congress further stunted, making them even more useless to their constituents as a means of getting things done, and the winners of it all will be the democrats and those less-than-conservative GOPer's y'all claim to hate.
If one is going to grab the tiger's tail, one had damned well better make sure they can hang on for the resulting ride.
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If one is going to grab the tiger's tail, one had damned well better make sure they can hang on for the resulting ride.
Oh, absolutely. But often the bluff succeeds because the risk in the ante-up is not worth the gain.
I already said it was a ham-handed stunt - Something with more finesse would have been better game-play. But the cards are drawn and the bids have begun, and there is no telling what the river may bring...
We'll have to wait and see.
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
One by one, Jim Jordan is defeating the establishment lizards who have been in power for far too long and establishing himself as the next Speaker of the House.
Every hour we are hearing about more and more who are just giving in and going to elect Jim to lead the party.
Slay them one by one, Jim. We need you!
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Greg Price
@greg_price11
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3h
Three massive endorsements for @Jim_Jordan
this morning from GOP members who were holdouts:
- @RepMikeRogersAL
- @RepAnnWagner
- @KenCalvert
Speaker Jordan is inevitable and any Republican who doesn't vote for him tomorrow is actively rooting for Democrats to have power.
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Greg Price
@greg_price11
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3h
Three massive endorsements for @Jim_Jordan
this morning from GOP members who were holdouts:
- @RepMikeRogersAL
- @RepAnnWagner
- @KenCalvert
Speaker Jordan is inevitable and any Republican who doesn't vote for him tomorrow is actively rooting for Democrats to have power.
The exact same thing could just as easily be said of the spoilt children who refused to vote for Scalise, or who voted - with the democrats - to bring down McCarthy.
We shall see how long this stupidity lasts.
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The exact same thing could just as easily be said of the spoilt children who refused to vote for Scalise, or who voted - with the democrats - to bring down McCarthy.
We shall see how long this stupidity lasts.
I was happy to see McCarthy go - If you can't keep your word, then you can't make a deal.
But I am out of sorts now, as I fully expected Scalise. That's where it went off the rails for me... And I can hope to be pleasantly surprised. Speaker Jordan is almost an act of God. So unlikely as to be approaching impossible. If it happens, what a coup!
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If one is going to grab the tiger's tail, one had damned well better make sure they can hang on for the resulting ride.
Well I'm a' losing weight and a' turnin' mighty pale ...
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House Republicans Rally Behind Jordan for House Speaker
Wendell Husebø16 Oct 20237
5:02
House Republicans rallied behind House Judiciary Committee Chair Jim Jordan (R-OH) on Monday for House Speaker, as at least 132 publicly announced support for the Ohio congressman to claim the gavel.
The number of lawmakers supporting Jordan is likely more than the number who publicly voiced support.
Jordan won the conference nomination on Friday with 124 votes, defeating Rep. Austin Scott (R-GA) in a closed-door internal party vote. He then earned 152 votes on the second ballot when members were asked if they would support him on the House floor.
After the vote, lawmakers broke for the weekend, with little direction of what would occur next. Jordan then earned the support on Monday of former opposition ringleader Rep. Mike Rogers (R-AL), chairman of the House Armed Services Committee, creating a path for Jordan to obtain the gavel.
Jordan needs a total of 217 votes on the House floor to become Speaker. The Ohio Congressman intends for the House floor to vote on his nomination Tuesday.
“Grassroots America wants Jim Jordan to be the Speaker of the House,” GOP strategist Cliff Maloney told Breitbart News. “Tuesday’s public vote will be a huge opportunity for every Republican member to show that they truly represent WE THE PEOPLE.”
more
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2023/10/16/house-republicans-rally-behind-jordan-house-speaker/
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I think Jordan would be a good Speaker, but I really don't care who it is if they don't force the Senate to respond to the appropriation bills they've already passed and the rest of them that they will. If that doesn't happen and we end up with never ending CR's, or omnibus bills, nothing will have changed.
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EXCLUSIVE: Conservative Donors Pledge To Withhold Funding From GOP Members Who Vote Against Jim Jordan For Speaker
Henry Rodgers
Chief National Correspondent
October 16, 2023 6:40 PM ET
Conservative donors are pledging to withhold funding from Republican House members who refuse to support House Judiciary Chairman Jim Jordan for Speaker, the Daily Caller has learned.
As the House is set to vote for a Speaker on Tuesday, there are twelve House Republicans who have refused to say they would support Jordan, putting him short of the necessary 217 votes he would need on the floor. GOP donors are telling the Caller they will be withholding their donations to anyone who does not end up supporting Jordan in the vote.
“Our nation needs a fighter who will stand up for the interests of American citizens, whether Democrat, Republican or Independent. Jim Jordan is a proven commodity we can trust,” Michaelon Wright Olson, who served on the Independent Women’s Forum (IWF) board of trustees and is a big donor to the GOP, told the Caller Monday evening.
Here Are The Twelve GOP Members Who Have Not Committed To Voting For Jordan As Of Monday Night:
Nebraska Rep. Don Bacon
Florida Rep. Mario Díaz-Balart
California Rep. Mike Garcia
Florida Rep. Carlos Gimenez
Virginia Rep. Jen Kiggans
New York Rep. Mike Lawler
Oklahoma Rep. Frank Lucas
Florida Rep. John Rutherford
Idaho Rep. Mike Simpson
Indiana Rep. Victoria Spartz
Arkansas Rep. Steve Womack
Colorado Rep. Ken Buck
more
https://dailycaller.com/2023/10/16/exclusive-conservative-donors-pledge-withhold-funding-gop-members-vote-jim-jordan-speaker/
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Jordan reportedly to face a mystery challenger for speaker in Tuesday floor vote
October 16, 2023 | Terresa Monroe-Hamilton
U.S. Rep. Jim Jordan (R-Ohio) is struggling to get the 217 votes he needs to win the Speaker of the House position and now a mystery challenger will oppose him in the floor vote on Tuesday.
Republicans who oppose Jordan are vowing to present an unnamed challenger to his bid during the House floor speakership vote on Tuesday, according to two unnamed House Republicans who spoke to Politico.
“While they have not yet nailed down a specific name, they believe the person they ultimately land on will not only be able [to] block Jordan from the speakership, but also give cover to those who want to vote against him. The challenger will certainly take arrows from the far-right flank of the conference, which is pushing hard for Jordan,” Politico noted.
“There will be an alternative for the rational part of the Republican conference,” one unnamed House Republican asserted according to the news outlet.
This will make selecting a speaker even more tense after Rep. Steve Scalise (R-La.) dropped out of the running because he did not have enough votes. Making things worse is the fact that some Republicans are said to be working with Democrats on shared House governance. All of this comes as the US is watching wars being fought on two fronts in Ukraine and now Israel. A speaker must be selected to move things forward.
more
https://www.bizpacreview.com/2023/10/16/jordan-reportedly-to-face-a-mystery-challenger-for-speaker-in-tuesday-floor-vote-1404754/
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Leading moderate who vowed to oppose Jordan flips in major victory for speaker nominee
House Judiciary Committee Chairman Jim Jordan, R-Ohio, scored a major victory in his quest for the speaker's gavel on Monday.
In a Monday tweet, House Armed Services Committee Chairman Mike Rogers, R-Ala., announced he would be supporting Jordan's speakership bid.
Rogers was a major opponent of Jordan's push for speaker, so his flip is a big win for the Republican speaker nominee.
In fact, Rogers was adamant about not supporting Jordan for speaker, even saying last week that "there was nothing that Jordan could do to get his support as speaker of the House."
That changed Monday when Rogers said he and Jordan spoke twice over the weekend with regard to the vote as well as House GOP priorities...............
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/leading-moderate-who-vowed-oppose-jordan-flips-major-victory-speaker-nominee
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Chad Pergram
@ChadPergram
Jordan on Speaker election: I felt good walking into the conference. I feel even better now. We got a few more people we want to talk to listen to and then we'll have a vote tomorrow.
8:30 PM · Oct 16, 2023
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In fact, Rogers was adamant about not supporting Jordan for speaker, even saying last week that "there was nothing that Jordan could do to get his support as speaker of the House."
That changed Monday when Rogers said he and Jordan spoke twice over the weekend with regard to the vote as well as House GOP priorities...............
That changed Monday once Rogers' constituents got wind that he was going to vote for a Democrat for Speaker.
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Thousands Flood Congressional Phone Lines Demanding Jim Jordan for Speaker: “They are Literally Melting the Phone Lines”
by Jim Hᴏft Oct. 16, 2023 10:00 pm
A resurgence of citizen activism is making waves on Capitol Hill. Conservatives across the United States are rallying behind Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH) as he vies for the position of Speaker of the House.
Breitbart News reported that conservatives are “melting” phone lines with calls to GOP members of Congress, urging them to put an end to internal divisions and unite behind Jordan.
“I haven’t seen anything like this in years,” one top House GOP aide told Breitbart News. “They are literally melting the phone lines. Some offices’ numbers are permanently busy. Thousands and thousands of people are calling their members of Congress demanding Jordan for Speaker.”
more
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/10/thousands-flood-congressional-phone-lines-demanding-jim-jordan/
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Chad Pergram
@ChadPergram
Something to note. The House MEETS at noom et. But it once you factor in the quroum call, nominating speeches and other housekeeping, it is unlikely that the House even begins the Speaker vote until after 1 pm et with a result sometime well after 2 pm et.
7:13 AM · Oct 17, 2023
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Go, Jordan, go Jordan!!! :cheerlead:
Chad Pergram
@ChadPergram
1) Raskin: I would think that Liz Cheney would be the natural compromise candidate...And if they couldn't vote for Liz Cheney, that would be a hell of a statement about the condition of their party.
2) Raskin: It's starting to look like there is a consolidation of the party around Trump and around the MAGA wing. So I think the GOP right now might be the party of Trump
3) Raskin: I'm hoping that cooler heads will prevail, but it would be a very extreme statement for them to choose Jim Jordan is Speaker.
9:42 AM · Oct 17, 2023
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Godspeed, Jim! 🙏🤞
Chad Pergram
@ChadPergram
A) Top Dem on Rules Cmte McGovern: I would like to see Hakeem Jeffries as speaker, but..I'd also like to see the Speaker who is the Speaker of the entire House, who you know, who actually gives a damn,
B) McGovern: And it is not going to be cheering on a government shutdown or trying to abruptly cut aid to Ukraine...we ought to have some discussions about, you know, whether or not there is a Democrat or Republican..who could fit that category where Democrats could be supportive
9:03 AM · Oct 17, 2023
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Bacon's a no vote ---- being slammed by his constituents.
Jesse Kelly
@JesseKellyDC
You were deployed to an Air Force base. You had less chance of encountering violence than you do while walking to your office in D.C. every day. And better Wi-Fi. Sell that somewhere else, Rambo.
Don Bacon 🇺🇸 🥓 ✈️ 🏍️
@DonJBacon
·12h
I’m not budging. I’m a five-time commander and deployed to Middle-East four times. I’ll do what is best for country.
10:13 AM · Oct 17, 2023
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:elephant:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F8p2A2TXwAAefKJ?format=jpg&name=900x900)
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Jim Jordan expected to come up short (https://nypost.com/2023/10/17/house-speaker-election-live-updates-jim-jordan-takes-vote-to-floor/)
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I'm personally hoping there are at least 5 Republicans with a spine to vote for someone other than Jordan. But, they're moderates, so maybe not.
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Whut?
Jordan's Pitch to House GOP: Let's Pass Another CR!
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/jim-jordan-plan-avert-shutdown-becomes-house-speaker-rcna120623?cid=sm_npd_nn_tw_ma&taid=652eac010760ad0001588eaa&utm_campaign=trueanthem&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter
Republican House speaker nominee Jim Jordan has pitched his colleagues on an unorthodox plan to prevent a government shutdown on Nov. 17.
And his conference members have mixed feelings about it.
In recent meetings with House Republicans, Jordan, the right-wing firebrand from Ohio, has called for passing a stopgap bill to keep money flowing under existing law beyond April, according to a half-dozen lawmakers who heard his comments. The reason is that an across-the-board 1% cut, as tucked inside a recent debt-limit law, would then take effect, imposing reductions across agencies.
Jordan indicated to Republicans he believes the automatic cuts will give them leverage over Democrats on full-year funding bills as they work to pass individual appropriations bills. The reason, he believes, is that Democrats will want to switch off the automatic cuts as soon as possible and therefore accept more GOP demands.
“That is leverage,” said Rep. Ralph Norman, R-S.C., a member of the hard-right Freedom Caucus. “And I think he’ll get that. And I’ve been against [continuing resolutions]! But we got 31 days. I mean, time’s running out. We got to look forward.”
But other Republicans say it’s a bad idea to pass another continuing resolution, or CR, which represents the sort of short-term funding on autopilot that conservatives — who want the chance to make more spending cuts — typically loathe.
EXCERPT
It's a worse deal than what they had under McCarthy!
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Jim Jordan expected to come up short (https://nypost.com/2023/10/17/house-speaker-election-live-updates-jim-jordan-takes-vote-to-floor/)
There is zero expectation Jordan wins on the first ballot. There will be several.
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Whut?
Jordan's Pitch to House GOP: Let's Pass Another CR!
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/jim-jordan-plan-avert-shutdown-becomes-house-speaker-rcna120623?cid=sm_npd_nn_tw_ma&taid=652eac010760ad0001588eaa&utm_campaign=trueanthem&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter
EXCERPT
It's a worse deal than what they had under McCarthy!
:mauslaff:
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House Speaker election live updates: Jim Jordan falls short of 217 votes needed; minority leader Hakeem Jeffries of NY gets 212 votes to Jordan’s 200
By Kaydi Pelletier, Samuel Chamberlain, Victor Nava and Josh Christenson
Updated Oct. 17, 2023
Rep. Jim Jordan (R-Oh.) fell short of the 217 votes needed to succeed ousted Kevin McCarthy as the next Speaker of the House, on the first ballot Tuesday.
House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY.) bested Jordan, drawing 212 votes to Jordan’s 200. There were 20 votes for other candidates.
The night before Tuesday’s vote, several Republican lawmakers emerged from a House GOP conference meeting saying that they won’t vote for Jordan, 59.
Jordan, however, came out of the meeting confident that he will be elected speaker of the House on Tuesday — despite at least six GOP lawmakers still opposed to his nomination and others undecided.
Follow the Post’s live updates for the latest news as representatives cast their votes to elect the next Speaker of the House:
* * *
Source: https://nypost.com/2023/10/17/house-speaker-election-live-updates-jim-jordan-takes-vote-to-floor/
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Too close for comfort. Praying that something becomes favorable for our country.
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Too close for comfort. Praying that something becomes favorable for our country.
Too close for comfort? Jeffries got more votes than Jordan did. That's not even close.
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If I wanted to see a clown show, I'd go to the circus.
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Can this thread be moved here so we don't have a dozen cross conversations on this topic?
https://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,515219.0.html
Thanks.
@Cyber Liberty
@mystery-ak
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Too close for comfort? Jeffries got more votes than Jordan did. That's not even close.
22222frying pan I read the headline incorrectly. God help us.
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(https://thehardtimes.net/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/clowncar.jpg)
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Why are there Republcians holding out? I thought this was the unpardonable sin? Spoiled brat punks and all that.
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Showing yet again that Establishment Republicans would rather have a Democrat in charge than a Conservative.
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More than a clown show, this is just a major disaster waiting to happen. :thud:
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Threads merged
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I'm getting to the point that I don't even care anymore...we will lose the house in 2024 anyways.
I have already seen an ad against my Rep Mary Miller about how Repubs don't know how to lead...I am sure they are nation-wide..
Sorry to be a Debbie-downer but this Congress is an embarrassment...
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I'm getting to the point that I don't even care anymore...we will lose the house in 2024 anyways.
I have already seen an ad against my Rep Mary Miller about how Repubs don't know how to lead...I am sure they are nation-wide..
Sorry to be a Debbie-downer but this Congress is an embarrassment...
That will be the inevitable fallout of Gaetz' cutesy little coup against McCarthy.
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:bkmk:
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I'm getting to the point that I don't even care anymore...we will lose the house in 2024 anyways.
I have already seen an ad against my Rep Mary Miller about how Repubs don't know how to lead...I am sure they are nation-wide..
Sorry to be a Debbie-downer but this Congress is an embarrassment...
I don't think Joe Schmoe on the street really knows or cares what's going on with the Speaker of the House drama. Those who follow politics closely enough to know and care aren't going to change their vote from R to D (or vice versa) based on this.
:shrug:
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I don't think Joe Schmoe on the street really knows or cares what's going on with the Speaker of the House drama. Those who follow politics closely enough to know and care aren't going to change their vote from R to D (or vice versa) based on this.
:shrug:
Maybe so, but a lot of people will see the DNC campaign ads showing a dysfunctional GOP that cannot even do something as simple as elect a speaker of the house, which is necessary in order for legislation to go forward, and many of the uncommitted will agree with the DNC that the GOP is simply too dysfunctional to be trusted with the reins of power, and they will vote DNC.
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:bkmk:
Is this the live thread now?
@Cyber Liberty
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Whut?
Jordan's Pitch to House GOP: Let's Pass Another CR!
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/jim-jordan-plan-avert-shutdown-becomes-house-speaker-rcna120623?cid=sm_npd_nn_tw_ma&taid=652eac010760ad0001588eaa&utm_campaign=trueanthem&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter
EXCERPT
It's a worse deal than what they had under McCarthy!
Yup. Who the Speaker is does not change where the leverage ultimately lies. The best deal we had, which is now dead and cannot be revived, is the compromise reached by Roy and the Main Street Caucus people for an 8% cut. But Gaetz and Co. killed it, and what eventually passes will inevitably be worse.
I get angry when our own side does stupid stuff.
I opposed Gaetz's move, and still oppose it, because when you sit down and look objectively at the most likely consequences, they are not good for conservatives. But they are good for Gaetz's further political ambitions - he's now "a fighter", and for Nancy Mace. And they're good for the Democrats.
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That will be the inevitable fallout of Gaetz' cutesy little coup against McCarthy.
Even if you assume Gaetz was well-intentioned, which I don't, the road to hell is paved by stupid people thinking they were doing the right thing.
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... just throwing it out there ... What if pissed off non-Maga Republicans vote for Jeffries?
The GOP Sanity Caucus would have greater power in a Dem-GOP coalition / power-sharing than they would in a Jim Jordan House Speakership.
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... just throwing it out there ... What if pissed off non-Maga Republicans vote for Jeffries?
The GOP Sanity Caucus would have greater power in a Dem-GOP coalition / power-sharing than they would in a Jim Jordan House Speakership.
My guess is that before doing that, the moderates would tell other Republicans "we'll support McCarthy or McHenry. If you refuse, we'll cut a deal with Jeffries."
And then folks will have some decisions to make.
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... just throwing it out there ... What if pissed off non-Maga Republicans vote for Jeffries?
The GOP Sanity Caucus would have greater power in a Dem-GOP coalition / power-sharing than they would in a Jim Jordan House Speakership.
Since they haven't changed the rules yet someone could use the *vacate the chair rule*...maybe Gaetz will do it......./s
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Since they haven't changed the rules yet someone could use the *vacate the chair rule*...maybe Gaetz will do it......./s
They could...but they wouldn't have the votes to vacate.
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So, Gaetz thinks playing Musical Chairs with the House Speakership is a winning strategy for GOP?
They are only proving that the House GOP CooCoo Caucus is incapable of governing.
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They could...but they wouldn't have the votes to vacate.
How many do they need?
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How many do they need?
A majority, which they wouldn't have if a majority had just elected Jeffries.
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So, Gaetz thinks playing Musical Chairs with the House Speakership is a winning strategy for GOP?
No, he just thought it was a winning strategy for him personally.
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It is much easier to tear things down than it is to build them. If you tear something down, you better have a plan in place to replace it with something better. Otherwise you are simply destroying things.
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Next vote is supposedly tonight.
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It is much easier to tear things down than it is to build them. If you tear something down, you better have a plan in place to replace it with something better. Otherwise you are simply destroying things.
If there would have been a majority within the GOP conference who wanted McCarthy out, then a Motion would have been appropriate. That's a clear path to move on to someone else. But 210 Republicans voted to keep McCarthy, and the handful of dissenters only won by drawing unanimous Democrat support. What that would have told anyone who paid attention was that you inevitably were going to have a lot of Republicans really pissed at those few who overrode the overwhelming sentiment of Republicans to keep McCarthy.
The lesson learned from Gaetz' action wasn't "conservatives are tough" but rather "if you can sink our guy, we can sink yours."
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It is much easier to tear things down than it is to build them. If you tear something down, you better have a plan in place to replace it with something better. Otherwise you are simply destroying things.
Though I'm still glad McCarthy was booted as he should have been for playing games, having no plan in place for what to do afterwards to me is what was troubling. Here we sit.
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This nonsense has the electorate voting for the Democommies in November, 2024.
Let's face it, the Republicans are completely incompetent. Even when they have a majority, they do not see the necessity of being unified.
Bottomline, the American people went from not being represented to a government that is completely non functional. The time is now to revise the Constitution to add the following:
TERM LIMITS FOR ALL ELECTED FEDERAL OFFICIALS, end golden parachute. $1 for $1 match into 401k, no pensions or
life benefits.
BALANCED BUDGET WITH THE SOLE EXCEPTION BEING A DECLARED WAR BY CONGRESS (last done 1941)
MORE EXTENSIVE REQUIREMENTS TO BE POTUS AND REMAIN POTUS
-merely reaching the average age of 35 at the time the country was founded is grossly inadequate as a requirement
today. That age should be increased to 45 or 50
-health and mental acuity testing that is far more demanding, and failure to pass means stepping down immediately
for all elected to federal positions. That means Biden, McConnell, Feinstein would all have failed to pass said test
END THE MASS THEFT BY CONGRESS OF THE SOCIAL SECURITY TRUST FUND, Requiring Congress to return all money
stolen since 1984.
ESTABLISH THAT FAILURE TO ACCOMPLISH ABOVE REQUIRES ALL IN CONGRESS TO FACE IMMEDIATE ELECTIONS TO BE
REPLACED WITH PEOPLE THAT CAN LEAD.
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More than a clown show, this is just a major disaster waiting to happen. :thud:
No it's not.
The mistake Jordan is making is going back behind closed doors. He should be pushing for votes on the floor so everyone can see who the "MAGA" Establishment Loyalists are so primary challengers can run against them.
Who cares if our "team" looks bad. It is the end result that is all important. All this goes back to the Establishment Loyalists not wanting appropriation bills passed and instead preferring CR's and Omnibus bills so they won't be accountable.
Interest on the debt this year is around 800 billion.
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Even if you assume Gaetz was well-intentioned, which I don't, the road to hell is paved by stupid people thinking they were doing the right thing.
No, the road to hell is paved by those Establishment Loyalists who don't have the strength to do their jobs and the people supporting their failure.
When the bill comes due for the fiscal irresponsibility of the Establishment Loyalists it won't be because men like Gaetz stood up to try and stop it. It will be because of the Establishment Loyalists and their supporters who thought they could ignore the law of large numbers.
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No it's not.
The mistake Jordan is making is going back behind closed doors. He should be pushing for votes on the floor so everyone can see who the "MAGA" Establishment Loyalists are so primary challengers can run against them.
Who cares if our "team" looks bad. It is the end result that is all important. All this goes back to the Establishment Loyalists not wanting appropriation bills passed and instead preferring CR's and Omnibus bills so they won't be accountable.
Interest on the debt this year is around 800 billion.
Everyone knows who the votes are.
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No, the road to hell is paved by those Establishment Loyalists who don't have the strength to do their jobs and the people supporting their failure.
When the bill comes due for the fiscal irresponsibility of the Establishment Loyalists it won't be because men like Gaetz stood up to try and stop it. It will be because of the Establishment Loyalists and their supporters who thought they could ignore the law of large numbers.
No, the road to Hell is paved by idiots like Gaetz who don't have the wherewithal to replace what they destroy.
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Scalise Trying to Undermine Jordan Speakership Bid Ahead of 2nd Ballot
House Majority Leader Steve Scalise (R-LA) is attempting to undermine Judiciary Committee Chairman Jim Jordan’s (R-OH) bid for the Speakership gavel after voting for him on the first ballot, sources familiar with the matter have confirmed to Breitbart News.
more
https://www.breitbart.com/2024-election/2023/10/17/scalise-trying-to-undermine-jordan-speakership-bid-ahead-of-2nd-ballot/
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Ken Buck Does Not Want Tom Emmer as Speaker, but Voted for Him Anyway
Rep. Ken Buck voted on Tuesday for House Majority Whip Tom Emmer for House Speaker without actually wanting Emmer to become Speaker.
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2023/10/17/ken-buck-does-not-want-tom-emmer-speaker-voted-him-anyway/
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No, the road to Hell is paved by idiots like Gaetz who don't have the wherewithal to replace what they destroy.
It's clear that a great many posters look at our national politics as a team sport. They have their "team" and it is all important that the team wins even if in victory the country suffers. We have had CR's and Omnibus bills for our federal budget rather than appropriation bills for at least 26 years. The end result has been an explosion of debt and all kinds of rules and regulations buried in those bills that would have never been passed if an open system existed.
Blame Gaetz all you want but the motion to vacate would never have been pursued if McCarthy wasn't a liar and had done what he agreed to in order to become Speaker.
Now we are seeing Establishment Loyalists in the Pub party who don't want real change. They like the system just the way it is even though it is clear to everyone that within 5 years the debt will be so large interest payments on it will exceed 1.2 TRILLION dollars per year. When this happens the Imperial City will have to impose huge tax increases on the middle class and begin cutting benefits in Social Security. At least Gaetz fought to stop this.
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Whatta bunch o' losers.
Maybe they'd be better off sticking with that "temporary" guy they have now. Just give him the full powers of the Speaker's gavel.
On the other hand, we should enjoy this "paralysis" of the Congress while it lasts.
The country is BETTER OFF that they can "do nothing".
The government that governs least... governs best.
...or so the saying goes.
Let's find out if it's really true !
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Here's another loser...the whole world is on fire and these idiots are playing games in the people's House...shame on all of them!....as far as Gaetz is concerned..once this is settled he should be expelled from Congress.
GOP Rep. Buck: Hard No — ‘I Will Not Vote for Jim Jordan’
Representative Ken Buck (R-CO) said Tuesday on CNN’s “News Central” that he would never vote for Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH) to become House Speaker.
https://www.breitbart.com/clips/2023/10/17/rep-buck-hard-no-i-will-not-vote-for-jim-jordan-for-speaker/
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It's clear that a great many posters look at our national politics as a team sport. They have their "team" and it is all important that the team wins even if in victory the country suffers. We have had CR's and Omnibus bills for our federal budget rather than appropriation bills for at least 26 years. The end result has been an explosion of debt and all kinds of rules and regulations buried in those bills that would have never been passed if an open system existed.
Blame Gaetz all you want but the motion to vacate would never have been pursued if McCarthy wasn't a liar and had done what he agreed to in order to become Speaker.
Now we are seeing Establishment Loyalists in the Pub party who don't want real change. They like the system just the way it is even though it is clear to everyone that within 5 years the debt will be so large interest payments on it will exceed 1.2 TRILLION dollars per year. When this happens the Imperial City will have to impose huge tax increases on the middle class and begin cutting benefits in Social Security. At least Gaetz fought to stop this.
That is true, however, for Gaetz not have any plans in place afterwards is terribly irresponsible. I wonder what he expected the outcome to be after McCarthy was ousted?
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Another day of Congress not being able to spend money it doesn't have. For those of us recognizing the federal government as the greatest threat facing the future of our nation, life is good.
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Another day of Congress not being able to spend money it doesn't have. For those of us recognizing the federal government as the greatest threat facing the future of our nation, life is good.
Good point.
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Scalise Trying to Undermine Jordan Speakership Bid Ahead of 2nd Ballot
House Majority Leader Steve Scalise (R-LA) is attempting to undermine Judiciary Committee Chairman Jim Jordan’s (R-OH) bid for the Speakership gavel after voting for him on the first ballot, sources familiar with the matter have confirmed to Breitbart News.
more
https://www.breitbart.com/2024-election/2023/10/17/scalise-trying-to-undermine-jordan-speakership-bid-ahead-of-2nd-ballot/
Apparently, the reverse happened when Scalise was running.
This is why you respect majority rule for Speakership. People can vote how they wish on legislation, but the Speakership doesn't work otherwise.
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Another day of Congress not being able to spend money it doesn't have. For those of us recognizing the federal government as the greatest threat facing the future of our nation, life is good.
Nope. The 45 day continuing resolution that passed is still in effect. Money is being spent.
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Gingrich apparently has come out in favor of just empowering McHenry and moving on:
https://x.com/costareports/status/1714428822571913406?s=20
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That is true, however, for Gaetz not have any plans in place afterwards is terribly irresponsible. I wonder what he expected the outcome to be after McCarthy was ousted?
It is unreasonable to expect Gaetz to solve everything. His response when asked after McCarthy was voted out was there are a lot of good people capable of being Speaker. I remember him saying that about Scailse and Jordan among others.
The problem doesn't rest with Gaetz. It rests with the Establishment Loyalists in the Pub party that have been lying to us for years. They like things just the way they are. They get to say and do whatever they want without any consequences.
We are the ones that pay the price. Our money is worth less every day and we are approaching the breaking point. Ask what will happen when the only buyer of our govt bonds is the Federal Reserve.
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The Republicans are highly skilled at total incompetence! They are proving daily they cannot get anything done, not even selecting a leader. How pathetic is that?
:thud: :yowsa:
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Benny Johnson
@bennyjohnson
🚨 HERE ARE THE OFFICE NUMBERS OF THE 20 REPUBLICANS WHO VOTED AGAINST JIM JORDAN ON FIRST BALLOT - KEEP THE PRESSURE ON:
Bacon - (202) 225-4155, (402) 938-0300
Buck - (202) 225-4676, (720) 639-9165
Chavez - (202) 225-5711, (503) 387-8651
D'Esposito -(202) 225-5516, (516) 739-3008
Diaz-Balter - (202) 225-8576, (305) 470-8555
Ellzy - (202) 225-2002, (903) 602-7860
Garbino - (202) 225-7896, (631) 541-4225
Gimenez - (202) 225-2778, (305) 222-0160
Gonzalez - (202) 225-2531, (956) 682-5545
Granger - (202) 225-5071, (817) 338-0909
James - (202) 225-4961, (586) 498-7122
Kelly - (202) 225-5406, (724) 342-7170
Kiggans - (202) 225-4215, (757) 364-7650
LaLota - (202) 225-3826, (631) 289-1097
LaMalfa - (202) 225-3076, (530) 223-5898
Lawler - (202) 225-6506, (845) 743-7130
Rutherford - (202) 225-2501, (904) 831-5205
Simpson - (202) 225-5531, (208) 334-1953
Spartz - (202) 225-2276, (317) 848-0201
Womack - (202) 225-4301, (479) 464-0446
2:18 PM · Oct 17, 2023
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The Republicans are highly skilled at total incompetence! They are proving daily they cannot get anything done, not even selecting a leader. How pathetic is that?
Republicans cannot select a leader because so many Republicans are really just turncoat Democrats, who want Democrats to provide leadership and to run Congress. The problem with a Republican majority is that it causes Republicans to have to actually have to 'do something', which is what most of them spend their entire careers trying to avoid. Now, when they are put under the spotlight and are being forced to choose between Democrat or Republican leadership, their heads spin around and around with confusion. They want so much to vote Democrat but cannot because of political appearances. The RINO Republicans want to vote Democrat, but at the same time they do not want to show their true colors.
So, they hem and haw, avoid and distract, delay and hide, until they absolutely have no choice.
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Next Speaker vote pushed to Wednesday after Jordan falls short: Live updates
Rep. Jim Jordan and his allies took Tuesday afternoon to regroup after a vote in the House earlier in the day had 20 Republicans come out against his bid to become Speaker.
Jordan (R-Ohio) secured 200 of the necessary 217 votes, while Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries (D-N.Y.) got the full backing of Democratic members, with 212 votes.
The House has been in recess since the vote ended, just before 2 p.m., and a second vote is now expected at 11 a.m. Wednesday.
Jordan had gained some major momentum, picking up endorsements from key players who had initially said they would not vote for him. But during Tuesday’s midday vote, 20 Republicans cast votes for other members.
more
https://thehill.com/homenews/house/4259954-house-speaker-jim-jordan-vote-live-coverage/
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Good chance of a motion today to expand McHenry's power to conduct House business.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/effort-empower-interim-speaker-mchenry-gains-steam-jordan-momentum-stalls
Doesn't make him Speaker permanently, but it is definitely a step down that road.
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Benny Johnson
@bennyjohnson
🚨 HERE ARE THE OFFICE NUMBERS OF THE 20 REPUBLICANS WHO VOTED AGAINST JIM JORDAN ON FIRST BALLOT - KEEP THE PRESSURE ON:
Spartz - (202) 225-2276, (317) 848-0201
I am surprised that Spartz voted against.
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Republicans cannot select a leader because so many Republicans are really just turncoat Democrats, who want Democrats to provide leadership and to run Congress. The problem with a Republican majority is that it causes Republicans to have to actually have to 'do something', which is what most of them spend their entire careers trying to avoid. Now, when they are put under the spotlight and are being forced to choose between Democrat or Republican leadership, their heads spin around and around with confusion. They want so much to vote Democrat but cannot because of political appearances. The RINO Republicans want to vote Democrat, but at the same time they do not want to show their true colors.
So, they hem and haw, avoid and distract, delay and hide, until they absolutely have no choice.
TRUTH !
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Benny Johnson
@bennyjohnson
The American people elected a Republican controlled House of Representatives.
Republican Representatives who want to work with Democrats to find a "consensus" candidate are betraying their voters by even entertaining the thought.
This would instantly hand all power of the Republican majority over to Democrats, and it would be a slap in the face to the American people.
We elected Republicans to hold the Biden Admin accountable, not bend a knee to it.
10:38 AM · Oct 18, 2023
·
23.4K
Views
The Briefing Room 🇺🇸🇮🇱
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Republicans cannot select a leader because so many Republicans are really just turncoat Democrats, who want Democrats to provide leadership and to run Congress. The problem with a Republican majority is that it causes Republicans to have to actually have to 'do something', which is what most of them spend their entire careers trying to avoid. Now, when they are put under the spotlight and are being forced to choose between Democrat or Republican leadership, their heads spin around and around with confusion. They want so much to vote Democrat but cannot because of political appearances. The RINO Republicans want to vote Democrat, but at the same time they do not want to show their true colors.
So, they hem and haw, avoid and distract, delay and hide, until they absolutely have no choice.
Bullshit. Changing parties is easy enough to do, so if they really wanted to vote democrat, they'd simply change parties.
What it means is that right now, a large number of republican representatives do not agree with the hardcore right on a lot of issues, and the hardcore right is not giving them any good persuasive reasons to change their minds.
The only time one gets to lead with the stick rather than with honey is when one has a commanding majority already. Conservatives do not have anything even approaching a commanding plurality, let alone a majority, and so it would behoove them to start learning the gentle(r) art of persuasion and stop deluding themselves into thinking they have a big enough stick to beat everyone else into submission.
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Bullshit. Changing parties is easy enough to do, so if they really wanted to vote democrat, they'd simply change parties.
What it means is that right now, a large number of republican representatives do not agree with the hardcore right on a lot of issues, and the hardcore right is not giving them any good persuasive reasons to change their minds.
The only time one gets to lead with the stick rather than with honey is when one has a commanding majority already. Conservatives do not have anything even approaching a commanding plurality, let alone a majority, and so it would behoove them to start learning the gentle(r) art of persuasion and stop deluding themselves into thinking they have a big enough stick to beat everyone else into submission.
:amen:
The hard liners are trying to avoid the unpleasant reality that to change national policy, you have to win more elections. That means persuading more people to vote more conservatively than they have before.
That means recognizing that not everybody is going to be a conservative, much less a hardline conservative. But if you can at least move people overall to the right of where they were, then you can accomplish something.
The risk is that if you try to move people too far to the right too fast, they will resist and actually end up moving in the opposite direction. That's exactly what we see happening with Republican moderates considering working with Jeffries because of Gaetz and Co.
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Bullshit. Changing parties is easy enough to do, so if they really wanted to vote democrat, they'd simply change parties.
What it means is that right now, a large number of republican representatives do not agree with the hardcore right on a lot of issues, and the hardcore right is not giving them any good persuasive reasons to change their minds.
No, this is 100% politics, pure and simple. It is about influence and perks and ego. It has nothing to do with issues.
Those who allied themselves with the GOP leadership got certain perks. And those people are now pissed off that their perks are going away.
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No, this is 100% politics, pure and simple. It is about influence and perks and ego. It has nothing to do with issues.
Those who allied themselves with the GOP leadership got certain perks. And those people are now pissed off that their perks are going away.
Nope. There are fundamental disagreements with how the hardliners want to run things, and they are singularly incapable of making a persuasive argument for why anyone should go along with them.
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Ah yes. "The hardliners". People who have this archaic belief that people should tell the truth and honor what they say they will do. What bastards!
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Klukowski: Joyce Plan to Make McHenry Acting Speaker Empowers Democrats, Strikes All Republicans from Presidential Succession
David Joyce (R-OH) is exploring options to give powers to Patrick McHenry (R-NC) instead of electing Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH) as Speaker of the House, but that would empower Hakeem Jeffries to protect the Biden agenda and remove the only Republican from the line of presidential succession, ensuring complete Democrat control.
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2023/10/18/klukowski-joyce-plan-make-mchenry-acting-speaker-empowers-democrats-strikes-republicans-presidential-succession/
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‘Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it.’
King Pyrrhus of Epirus
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Klukowski: Joyce Plan to Make McHenry Acting Speaker Empowers Democrats, Strikes All Republicans from Presidential Succession
David Joyce (R-OH) is exploring options to give powers to Patrick McHenry (R-NC) instead of electing Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH) as Speaker of the House, but that would empower Hakeem Jeffries to protect the Biden agenda and remove the only Republican from the line of presidential succession, ensuring complete Democrat control.
This doesn't empower Democrats since the probability of both Biden and Harris leaving office at the same time is less than the probability of winning the Powerball. It would have mattered back when Democrats held only 50 seats in the Senate, because removal of either Biden or Harris would have moved the Speaker up a spot to second in line. But Republicans already blew that opportunity.
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Bullshit. Changing parties is easy enough to do, so if they really wanted to vote democrat, they'd simply change parties.
Changing parties is far from easy. All your election infrastructure (donors/volunteers/employees) sometimes built over decades all has to be revamped. How you run a campaign and who you are running against are all different. If you keep getting reelected time after time after time again, the last thing any politician would do is to wipe all that out and start over.
The primary goal of all politicians is to get elected at any cost. Any promises or party affiliations are secondary concerns after gaining office.
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The primary goal of all politicians is to get elected at any cost. Any promises or party affiliations are secondary concerns after gaining office.
Yep. It's about the perks. Health insurance. Retirement account. Living allowance. Free meals. Kennedy Center tickets. And the best insider information for stock purchases. Just look at how many members of Congress suddenly become millionaires AFTER they take office. They treat it as a career and not as representation for their constituents.
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This doesn't empower Democrats since the probability of both Biden and Harris leaving office at the same time is less than the probability of winning the Powerball. It would have mattered back when Democrats held only 50 seats in the Senate, because removal of either Biden or Harris would have moved the Speaker up a spot to second in line. But Republicans already blew that opportunity.
Good analysis.
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‘Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it.’
King Pyrrhus of Epirus
Who also said "one more such victory and I am lost". In other words, you can sometimes win a battle but put yourself in an even worse position.
Too bad Gaetz and those who ousted McCarthy didn't read their Plutarch.
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Plutarch Schmootarch. They read their Neil Young instead.
"It's better to burn out than to fade away."
My my, hey hey.
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The Republicans are highly skilled at total incompetence! They are proving daily they cannot get anything done, not even selecting a leader. How pathetic is that?
:thud: :yowsa:
It sure looks like it, but maybe they are more devious than we recognize. It looks like the Establishment Loyalists are getting ready to set up a coalition govt with the Rats. They will give some power sharing to the Rats, make the current Speaker the permanent Speaker and then they can pass a big Omnbus bill in Dec. The Establishment Loyalists in the Pub party keep spending money we don't have and those that are in swing districts can pretend that they care about their constituents.
They will do all this and more and blame Gaetz for anything bad that happens. DC continues to spend based on Modern Monetary Theory, which disregards deficits, and in the end we will be crushed by the Law of Large Numbers.
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Republicans cannot select a leader because so many Republicans are really just turncoat Democrats, who want Democrats to provide leadership and to run Congress. The problem with a Republican majority is that it causes Republicans to have to actually have to 'do something', which is what most of them spend their entire careers trying to avoid. Now, when they are put under the spotlight and are being forced to choose between Democrat or Republican leadership, their heads spin around and around with confusion. They want so much to vote Democrat but cannot because of political appearances. The RINO Republicans want to vote Democrat, but at the same time they do not want to show their true colors.
So, they hem and haw, avoid and distract, delay and hide, until they absolutely have no choice.
:amen:
The only thing I would add is some of these "conservative" Establishment Loyalists want the system to remain the way it is because they have a big say in how money is spent and because of this the lobbyists and various industries, that benefit from the spending, make sure they are very well funded. The last thing they want are appropriation bills debated in an open forum.
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No, this is 100% politics, pure and simple. It is about influence and perks and ego. It has nothing to do with issues.
Those who allied themselves with the GOP leadership got certain perks. And those people are now pissed off that their perks are going away.
Among those perks is the funding of campaigns from the lobbyists. If we end up debating appropriation bills in an open forum it's going to get a lot tougher to pay businesses for goods and services we don't need.
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Ah yes. "The hardliners". People who have this archaic belief that people should tell the truth and honor what they say they will do. What bastards!
I agree with you so strongly that I am looking into buying billboards in the district I'm moving to in FL. depending on how my Congressman votes. If he bails on Jordan I will pose the question "Why are you voting for this guy who fails us when it counts?"
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Jordan does even worse the second time around:
Jim Jordan Loses on Second Speaker Ballot
Spencer Brown
October 18, 2023
After Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH) came up 17 votes short of the magic number needed to secure the speaker's gavel on Tuesday, the House of Representatives gathered again on Wednesday for its second attempt at electing a speaker since Kevin McCarthy (R-CA) was ousted earlier in October.
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Again, Jordan was nominated by Republicans and Hakeem Jeffries was nominated by Democrats, and again the clerk proceeded through a roll-call vote of all 433 members who were present in the chamber. Again, Jordan came up short.
The final tally in round two was even worse for Jordan than the first round: there were 199 votes for Jordan, 212 for Jeffries, and 22 votes for other individuals after some who voted for Jordan on Tuesday switched their vote to someone else in the second round, such as Reps. Vern Buchanan (R-FL) and Drew Ferguson (R-GA).
https://mobile.twitter.com/HouseDailyPress/status/1714692048270311861
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Source: https://townhall.com/tipsheet/spencerbrown/2023/10/18/speaker-vote-round-2-n2630011
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Ah yes. "The hardliners". People who have this archaic belief that people should tell the truth and honor what they say they will do. What bastards!
There's nothing wrong with having strongly conservatives goals. But you have to think through rationally how best to get there, and that's not what happened here. It was more like frustration just lashing out rather than a coherent strategy.
We need to elect more conservatives in Congress. Until that happens, trying to force a conservative Speaker is counterproductive.
When they actually removed McCarthy, who had overwhelming support in the caucus, it was equivalent to kidnappers shooting the only hostage they had Any leverage they had vanished at that instant. So, we were left with many of those who voted for McCarthy resentful that the choice of the clear majority was disregarded, and it was completely predictable that some wouldn't fall in line behind Jordan, who had been the choice of the minority.
The true power shifted heavily to the moderate members once McCarthy was gone. That's why conservatives are now powerless to force a result they want.
Just not well-thought out at all.
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Continuing dumbassery
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There's nothing wrong with having strongly conservatives goals. But you have to think through rationally how best to get there, and that's not what happened here. It was more like frustration just lashing out rather than a coherent strategy.
We need to elect more conservatives in Congress. Until that happens, trying to force a conservative Speaker is counterproductive.
When they actually removed McCarthy, it was equivalent to the kidnappers shooting the only hostage they had Any leverage they had vanished at that instant, which is why conservatives are now powerless to force a result they want.
Just not well-thought out at all.
Exactly.
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There's nothing wrong with having strongly conservatives goals. But you have to think through rationally how best to get there, and that's not what happened here. It was more like frustration just lashing out rather than a coherent strategy.
When he took the job, McCarthy agreed to a list of demands, one of which was to pass separate appropriation bills in place of a continuing resolution. McCarthy did not get it done. He did not honor the promise made, primarily because he gave everyone the month of August off (just like the GOP leadership always does) and then have everyone come back and pass a CR (again, just like GOP leadership always does).
Gaetz doesn't need a plan. He isn't in leadership. He simply was holding the existing leadership to do what they promised to do. He wasn't seeking a takeover. He was simply holding the leadership accountable for their actions.
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When he took the job, McCarthy agreed to a list of demands, one of which was to pass separate appropriation bills in place of a continuing resolution. McCarthy did not get it done.
He doesn't/didn't have the sole power to do that, and I said back in January that it wouldn't happen. The problem was the actual rank and file GOP representatives who had to vote for those bills couldn't agree on the numbers. That's not on McCarthy. He can't force other representatives to change their votes on appropriations bills.
Gaetz doesn't need a plan. He isn't in leadership. He simply was holding the existing leadership to do what they promised to do. He wasn't seeking a takeover. He was simply holding the leadership accountable for their actions.
That's where we disagree. It was a set-up right from the start when Gaetz and a few holdouts demanded concessions that (I believe) Gaetz knew could not be met. There were a whole bunch of other representatives who resented Gaetz and his small group demanding preferential treatment for his views and allies other that of the majority. And when those other representatives pushed back on complying with those promises, McCarthy was doomed.
I mean, there have been exactly four times in the last 4+ decades when separate appropriations bills were actually passed. Four in more than forty years. The most recent was in the last millenium, and happened when the GOP had a much larger majority in Congress.
Like I said back in January - this deal was doomed from the start, and that was Gaetz's plan all along. He couldn't shake McCarthy's support after 14 ballots, so he set it up to take him down later.
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When he took the job, McCarthy agreed to a list of demands, one of which was to pass separate appropriation bills in place of a continuing resolution. McCarthy did not get it done. He did not honor the promise made, primarily because he gave everyone the month of August off (just like the GOP leadership always does) and then have everyone come back and pass a CR (again, just like GOP leadership always does).
Gaetz doesn't need a plan. He isn't in leadership. He simply was holding the existing leadership to do what they promised to do. He wasn't seeking a takeover. He was simply holding the leadership accountable for their actions.
Gaetz has the good sense to recognize the direction we are headed in is a disaster. The Bond Vigilantes are pushing yields higher and higher and Treasury is still having more difficulty selling the longer term debt. In the end we will end up with the Federal Reserve buying most of the longer term bonds and the world will move even more quickly to end the dollar's reign as the world reserve currency. What this means for those who are retired is your dollar will buy less and less. What this means for those starting out in life buying a home is going to get tougher and tougher.
The bill is coming due. This year alone interest payments on the debt are going to be about what the defense budget is. The interest payments are only going to go up, even if interest rates were to drop because we keep adding TRILLIONS to the debt. Gaetz is fighting to change the course we are on.
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The Bond Vigilantes are pushing yields higher and higher and Treasury is still having more difficulty selling the longer term debt. In the end we will end up with the Federal Reserve buying most of the longer term bonds and the world will move even more quickly to end the dollar's reign as the world reserve currency. What this means for those who are retired is your dollar will buy less and less. What this means for those starting out in life buying a home is going to get tougher and tougher.
The bill is coming due. This year alone interest payments on the debt are going to be about what the defense budget is. The interest payments are only going to go up, even if interest rates were to drop because we keep adding TRILLIONS to the debt.
I agree with all that. But you're not going to be able to stop that overnight with a 4 vote margin in the House, and nothing else. The best you can do realistically is slow it down, and try to win the next election with fiscal conservatives.
Again, the hardliners killed 8% cuts, which meant we got stuck with no cuts at all. How does that help the problems you listed??
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I agree with all that. But you're not going to be able to stop that overnight with a 4 vote margin in the House, and nothing else. The best you can do realistically is slow it down, and try to win the next election with fiscal conservatives.
Again, the hardliners killed 8% cuts, which meant we got stuck with no cuts at all. How does that help the problems you listed??
No one expected it to be turned around over night. The first step is to return to a process that is already required by law, passing appropriation bills that go through a committee process and then get voted on in an open process on the House floor. The House hasn't done this in 26 years and the debt has exploded.
The Establishment Loyalists con us with the "we are cutting X%" in 2 ways. The cuts are either cuts in the rate of growth, or are in the out years of the deal. It never happens.
Also, the wait till we have a bigger majority never works either. The Establishment Loyalists told us the same thing with Obamacare. We gave them the House, then the Senate and finally the Presidency. Obamacare is still here, just waiting for the Rats to expand it.
There is never going to be a great time to fight this battle over spending and now we are going to find out which "MAGA" Establishment Loyalists, like Ken Buck, need to go.
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@CryptidPolitics
Matt Gaetz is desperately hoping his Speaker stunt works out, otherwise he is going to be DOA in his 2026 gubernatorial campaign.
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No one expected it to be turned around over night. The first step is to return to a process that is already required by law, passing appropriation bills that go through a committee process and then get voted on in an open process on the House floor. The House hasn't done this in 26 years and the debt has exploded.
The Establishment Loyalists con us with the "we are cutting X%" in 2 ways. The cuts are either cuts in the rate of growth, or are in the out years of the deal. It never happens.
Also, the wait till we have a bigger majority never works either. The Establishment Loyalists told us the same thing with Obamacare. We gave them the House, then the Senate and finally the Presidency. Obamacare is still here, just waiting for the Rats to expand it.
There is never going to be a great time to fight this battle over spending and now we are going to find out which "MAGA" Establishment Loyalists, like Ken Buck, need to go.
:yawn2: :yawn2:
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No one expected it to be turned around over night. The first step is to return to a process that is already required by law, passing appropriation bills that go through a committee process and then get voted on in an open process on the House floor. The House hasn't done this in 26 years and the debt has exploded.
The Establishment Loyalists con us with the "we are cutting X%" in 2 ways. The cuts are either cuts in the rate of growth, or are in the out years of the deal. It never happens.
Also, the wait till we have a bigger majority never works either. The Establishment Loyalists told us the same thing with Obamacare. We gave them the House, then the Senate and finally the Presidency. Obamacare is still here, just waiting for the Rats to expand it.
There is never going to be a great time to fight this battle over spending and now we are going to find out which "MAGA" Establishment Loyalists, like Ken Buck, need to go.
Yeah, no. There are better and worse times to pick a fight, and one of the worst times to do so is when you have no hope of winning. Gaetz screwed the pooch, and quite possibly the country, because of his own personal pique and his need to virtue-signal. That is not leadership, that is not picking a necessary fight, that is being a spoilt child.
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No, this is 100% politics, pure and simple. It is about influence and perks and ego. It has nothing to do with issues.
Those who allied themselves with the GOP leadership got certain perks. And those people are now pissed off that their perks are going away.
If there are five of them, I can definitely see them cutting a deal with Jeffries in exchange for their own pet interests.
Sadly I think that's going to be the end result of this. Five Republicans are going to defect just to end the drama.
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If there are five of them, I can definitely see them cutting a deal with Jeffries in exchange for their own pet interests.
Sadly I think that's going to be the end result of this. Five Republicans are going to defect just to end the drama.
Well, it sure won't be the first time a deal has been cut with the Dems is it? Although it won't surprise me I hope that doesn't turn out to be the case. But that is what happens when there is no plan in place.
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https://twitter.com/NoahCRothman/status/1714762403630510490
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Deal or not, what all this drama will spell is LOST ELECTIONS FOR REPUBLICANS IN NOVEMBER. The incompetence is overwhelming!!!
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So the moderates are doing what they said made Gaetz a traitor and a scumbag, but apparently now it's ok because it's them.
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Noah Rothman
@NoahCRothman
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Follow
First Ukraine aid now SALT. Almost like seeking leadership means failing the kinds purity tests Jordan eagerly imposed on his predecessors.
Not sure what purity test he's talking about here since Jordan voted for McCarthy on all 15 votes last January and again when McCarthy was deposed.
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Deal or not, what all this drama will spell is LOST ELECTIONS FOR REPUBLICANS IN NOVEMBER. The incompetence is overwhelming!!!
This won't be on anyone's radar next November. That's an eternity away. If anything, Republican voters will still be thinking about McCarthy's Paul Ryan imitation.
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Not sure what purity test he's talking about here since Jordan voted for McCarthy on all 15 votes last January and again when McCarthy was deposed.
Jordan is now running as the guy who supposedly can unify the party.
Yet oddly, he was unable to get all his followers to support either McCarthy or Scalise. If he can't even unify the people who are aligned most closely with him, how does he expect to unify the rest?
So either Jordan couldn't really lead all his supporters...or he just wasn't trying very hard. Seems like it might have been the latter. I saw one member who voted against Jordan on the floor say that after Scalise won the conference vote, five of Jordan's supporters stood up and said they'd never vote for Scalise under any circumstances. And Jordan, who had promised to support Scalise if he won that vote, just sat there and said nothing. Didn't even try to persuade his supporters otherwise.
So this member said that when he saw Jordan say nothing in response, and not make any effort to follow through on his promise to support Scalise if he won, it "made an impression on him.". Said that then and there he decided not to vote for Jordan.
When he was asked if there was anyway to get him to vote for Jordan as Speaker he said "well, if he takes all the committee assignments away from the 8 who ousted McCarthy, that would do it."
Though that was a good answer.
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So the moderates are doing what they said made Gaetz a traitor and a scumbag, but apparently now it's ok because it's them.
Gaetz is a scumbag regardless.
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Gaetz is a scumbag regardless.
Apparently now the moderates are going to share that crown.
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Gaetz is a scumbag regardless.
I'd say that Gaetz is a sneaky little shit, but that would be an insult to Niedermeyer.
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So the moderates are doing what they said made Gaetz a traitor and a scumbag, but apparently now it's ok because it's them.
So...what is the consistent rule or principle here to which you believe members should be bound?
If the rule is that every member should rally around whichever candidate for Speaker has majority support in the caucus, then McCarthy should have been elected on the first ballot in January and should still be Speaker.
But if that's not the rule, then nobody is obliged to vote for Jordan.
What you guys want is two different rules - one for if a moderate has majority support, and one for if a conservative has the most support. So conservatives were not obligated to vote for McCarthy, but moderates are required to vote for Jordan.
Some moderates - and even some conservatives - are calling that out as a double standard and are refusing to play by two different sets of rules.
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So...what is the consistent rule or principle here to which you believe members should be bound?
If the rule is that every member should rally around whichever candidate for Speaker has majority support in the caucus, then McCarthy should have been elected on the first ballot in January and should still be Speaker.
But if that's not the rule, then nobody is obliged to vote for Jordan.
What you guys want is two different rules - one for if a moderate has majority support, and one for if a conservative has the most support. So conservatives were not obligated to vote for McCarthy, but moderates are required to vote for Jordan.
Some moderates - and even some conservatives - are calling that out as a double standard and are refusing to play by two different sets of rules.
Whatever credibility the Establishment thought they had, they just blew with their little temper tantrum. Jordan has 200 votes - by far the majority. It's a bunch of spoiled diaper brats that won't vote for him and are even willing to elect a Rat. That was never an option when the Speaker vote for McCarthy taken.
The Establishment for decades demanded the conservatives play ball despite all the crap sandwich legislation that has gotten us to where we are, and expect conservatives to just keep following along. It's obviously just a one way street.
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This won't be on anyone's radar next November. That's an eternity away. If anything, Republican voters will still be thinking about McCarthy's Paul Ryan imitation.
Oh, Republican incompetence will be playing in every DNC campaign ad next year, and it will matter to precisely the people the republicans need to win - moderates and independents. This stupid little shitshow, run twice (at least) in close succession, will be one of the DNC's best talking points next year.
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Whatever credibility the Establishment thought they had, they just blew with their little temper tantrum. Jordan has 200 votes - by far the majority.
You didn't answer the question as to what the rule should be, and it's relevant because McCarthy had an even larger margin in January when Gaetz and Co. refused to vote for him, and again recently when they voted him out.
Either you're obligated to vote for the guy with majority support, or you're not. So which is it?
It's a bunch of spoiled diaper brats that won't vote for him and are even willing to elect a Rat. That was never an option when the Speaker vote for McCarthy taken.
Right - because the other "choice" presented by Gaetz and Co. was just not to elect a Speaker at all.
The Establishment for decades demanded the conservatives play ball despite all the crap sandwich legislation that has gotten us to where we are, and expect conservatives to just keep following along. It's obviously just a one way street.
We already established that there has never been a time when a conservative speaker candidate had majority support within the caucus, and the moderates refused to elect him.
In terms of legislation rather than Speaker elections, representatives have always been free to cast their votes however they wish regardless of whether they are members of the Freedom Caucus or not. There has never been, for either side, the same rule of always supporting the majority view.
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:facepalm2:
Rep. Mariannette Miller-Meeks gets death threats after voting against Jordan for House speaker
By Allie Griffin
Published Oct. 19, 2023
An Iowa Republican who voted against Rep. Jim Jordan for the House speakership said she has received “credible death threats” since withdrawing her support for him in the second round of voting.
Rep. Mariannette Miller-Meeks said she has gotten “a barrage of threatening calls” and multiple threats to her life after she voted for Rep. Kay Granger, chair of the House Appropriations Committee, on Wednesday afternoon.
Miller-Meeks initially voted for Jordan, a staunch Ohio conservative, in the first vote for speaker on Tuesday before she changed her pick the following day.
Jordan was nominated by the majority of his party last week but failed twice to garner enough votes to be elected the new House speaker after Rep. Kevin McCarthy was ousted from the post.
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Source: https://nypost.com/2023/10/19/rep-mariannette-miller-meeks-gets-death-threats-after-voting-against-jordan-for-house-speaker/
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GOP Rep. Bacon: Jordan Is Done, He Needs to ‘Withdraw’ from Speaker Race —
Representative Don Bacon (R-NE) said Wednesday on CNN’s “The Lead” that Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH) should withdraw from the speaker race because he will not get the votes.
https://www.breitbart.com/clips/2023/10/18/gop-rep-bacon-jordan-is-done-he-needs-to-withdraw-from-speaker-race/
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Jim Jordan weighs alternative to withdrawing from House speaker race
by Ashley Oliver, Justice Department Reporter
October 19, 2023 08:10 AM
Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH) is weighing an exit strategy in the House speaker race after two failed bids for the gavel and the prospect of a third round of voting appearing to be a guaranteed loss.
The Ohio Republican met with a small group on Wednesday night that included Speaker Pro Tempore Patrick McHenry (R-NC), former House Speaker Kevin McCarthy (R-CA), and a few aides to discuss his next moves, according to a source familiar with the meeting.
They discussed Jordan supporting a resolution that has become increasingly popular among Jordan's detractors that would broaden McHenry's powers through January in exchange for McHenry continuing to support Jordan as speaker-designate.
House leaders would use Jordan's position as speaker-designate over the next few months to bring Jordan, at least informally, into the leadership fold as they test his abilities to perform the role through events, fundraisers, and more.
The plan would set Jordan up for a third speaker vote in January if he were to remain speaker-designate until then. It would also give Jordan the ability to avoid conceding a loss and withdrawing as the Republicans' internal nominee while the House GOP remains in an elevated state of turmoil with no leader for more than two weeks.
Many of Jordan's most fervent supporters, such as those in the House Freedom Caucus, have already signaled they do not support expanding McHenry's powers, so winning them over would be a clear challenge. The McHenry plan would require Democratic Party support if more than four Republicans were to oppose it, given the GOP's slim majority.
more
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/house-speaker-race-jim-jordan-weighs-alternative-withdrawing
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GOP Rep. Bacon: Jordan Is Done, He Needs to ‘Withdraw’ from Speaker Race —
Representative Don Bacon (R-NE) said Wednesday on CNN’s “The Lead” that Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH) should withdraw from the speaker race because he will not get the votes.
https://www.breitbart.com/clips/2023/10/18/gop-rep-bacon-jordan-is-done-he-needs-to-withdraw-from-speaker-race/
I think that is verbatim from a statement Matt Gaetz made about McCarthy back in January after a couple rounds of voting.
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You didn't answer the question as to what the rule should be, and it's relevant because McCarthy had an even larger margin in January when Gaetz and Co. refused to vote for him, and again recently when they voted him out.
I guess we should ask you that, because the goal posts keep changing. You said majority. Jordan has the majority, but now he needs a bigger majority than McCarthy? Sounds like you require a different set of rules for the conservative side. They apparently get to even elect Rats if they don't get their way. That was never on the table when Gaetz opposed McCarthy.
Either you're obligated to vote for the guy with majority support, or you're not. So which is it?
Dunno, you tell me. Is the Establishment required to follow their own rules or not?
Right - because the other "choice" presented by Gaetz and Co. was just not to elect a Speaker at all.
We already established that there has never been a time when a conservative speaker candidate had majority support within the caucus, and the moderates refused to elect him.
In terms of legislation rather than Speaker elections, representatives have always been free to cast their votes however they wish regardless of whether they are members of the Freedom Caucus or not. There has never been, for either side, the same rule of always supporting the majority view.
Actually there is one - Jim Jordan.
Conservatives were 'free' to cast their votes as they wish, of course if they wanted committee assignments and money to their districts they voted as they were told.
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GOP Rep. Bacon: Jordan Is Done, He Needs to ‘Withdraw’ from Speaker Race —
Representative Don Bacon (R-NE) said Wednesday on CNN’s “The Lead” that Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH) should withdraw from the speaker race because he will not get the votes.
https://www.breitbart.com/clips/2023/10/18/gop-rep-bacon-jordan-is-done-he-needs-to-withdraw-from-speaker-race/
Jordan is done, but McCarthy had 14 votes to get the speakership and that was ok?
Bacon needs to get in line. And what self-respecting Republican goes on CNN to air the dirty laundry?
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https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/10/breaking-rinos-win-jim-jordan-withdraws-speakers-race/
So all the Establishment Loyalists should be happy. McCarthy 2.0 is going to be the Speaker on a "3 mo. interim basis".
The guy who gave us that awesome debt limit deal. I'm sure he will avoid another CR, or omnibus bill. /s
Again, the middle 60% of the economic scale get sold out.
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https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/10/breaking-rinos-win-jim-jordan-withdraws-speakers-race/ (https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/10/breaking-rinos-win-jim-jordan-withdraws-speakers-race/)
So all the Establishment Loyalists should be happy. McCarthy 2.0 is going to be the Speaker on a "3 mo. interim basis".
The guy who gave us that awesome debt limit deal. I'm sure he will avoid another CR, or omnibus bill. /s
Again, the middle 60% of the economic scale get sold out.
Your war against the Establishment is going to end in failure. There are a lot who people who like so-called Establishment candidates.
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Jim Jordan Will Not Seek a Third Speaker Vote
Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH) confirmed Thursday he will not seek a third vote to become Speaker of the House and will back a plan to grant Speaker Pro Tempore Patrick McHenry (R-NC) more powers.
Jordan had lost two votes for Speaker after facing swift opposition from New York Republican moderates and many members of the House Appropriations Committee.
Breitbart News has documented how 22 House Republicans have denied Jordan the ability to serve as Speaker of the House despite overwhelming grassroots support for the Ohio Republican:
Rep. Don Bacon (R-NE) voted for former Speaker Kevin McCarthy (R-CA)
Rep. Vern Buchanan (R-FL) voted for Rep. Byron Donalds (R-FL)
Rep. Lori Chavez-DeRemer (R-OR) voted for McCarthy
Rep. Anthony D’Esposito (R-NY) voted for former Rep. Lee Zeldin (R-NY)
Rep. Mario Díaz-Balart (R-FL) voted for House Majority Leader Steve Scalise (R-LA)
Rep. Jake Ellzey (R-TX) voted for Rep. Mike Garcia (R-CA)
Rep. Drew Ferguson (R-GA) voted for Scalise
Rep. Andrew Garbarino (R-NY) voted for Zeldin
Rep. Carlos Giminez (R-FL) voted for McCarthy
Rep. Tony Gonzales (R-TX) voted for Scalise
Rep. John James (R-MI) voted for former Rep. Candice Miller (R-MI)
Rep. Mike Kelly (R-PA) voted for former Speaker John Boehner (R-OH)
Rep. Mariannette Miller-Meeks (R-IA) voted for Rep. Kay Granger (R-TX)
Rep. Granger voted for Scalise
Rep. John Rutherford (R-FL) voted for Scalise
Rep. Mike Simpson (R-ID) voted for Scalise
Rep. Pete Stauber (R-MN) voed for Bruce Westerman (R-AR)
Rep. Ken Buck (R-CO) voted for House Majority Whip Tom Emmer (R-MN)
Rep. Jen Kiggans (R-VA) voted for McCarthy
Rep. Nick LaLota (R-NY) voted for Zeldin
Rep. Steve Womack (R-AR) voted for Scalise
Rep. Mike Lawler (R-NY) voted for McCarthy
Breitbart News senior legal contributor, Ken Klukowski, has explained how elevating McHenry could also empower House Democrat Caucus Chair Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY):
If something happens to both the president and vice president, then federal law at 3 U.S.C. § 19 says that the Speaker of the House becomes Acting President “until the expiration of the then current Presidential term.” After the Speaker, it goes to the president pro tempore of the Senate, then Cabinet secretaries in the order that Congress created their departments, starting with the secretary of state and ending with the secretary of homeland security.
But it can only be a person with the true title of Speaker, not Speaker Pro Tempore or Acting Speaker. So if McHenry – or anyone else – is sitting in the Speaker’s chair as anything other than the true Speaker elected by a roll call vote of the House, then after Biden and Harris the powers of the presidency would bypass the House altogether, going to Sen. Patty Murray (D-WA) as president pro tempore of the Senate, then to Secretary of State Anthony Blinken, then Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen, and all the way through Biden’s Cabinet, to Homeland Security Alejandro Mayorkas. Everyone in that lineup is a Democrat, aside from a Speaker duly elected by the Republican-majority House.
“This would be a total sellout of the conservative agenda that won us the House majority,” says former U.S. Ambassador Ken Blackwell, chairman of the Conservative Action Project. “Republican members need to see through this plot by the uni-party establishment to block an America First agenda that would save our constitutional republic by stopping the Biden agenda and paving the way to elect a new president in 2024.”
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2023/10/19/jim-jordan-will-not-seek-a-third-speaker-vote/
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https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/10/breaking-rinos-win-jim-jordan-withdraws-speakers-race/
So all the Establishment Loyalists should be happy. McCarthy 2.0 is going to be the Speaker on a "3 mo. interim basis".
The guy who gave us that awesome debt limit deal. I'm sure he will avoid another CR, or omnibus bill. /s
Again, the middle 60% of the economic scale get sold out.
Considering that Jordan was already promising another CR, that complaint is nothing more than spoilt child's sour grapes.
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https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/10/breaking-rinos-win-jim-jordan-withdraws-speakers-race/ (https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/10/breaking-rinos-win-jim-jordan-withdraws-speakers-race/)
So all the Establishment Loyalists should be happy. McCarthy 2.0 is going to be the Speaker on a "3 mo. interim basis".
The guy who gave us that awesome debt limit deal. I'm sure he will avoid another CR, or omnibus bill. /s
Again, the middle 60% of the economic scale get sold out.
Well maybe Gaetz shouldn't have pulled this stunt!
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Considering that Jordan was already promising another CR, that complaint is nothing more than spoilt child's sour grapes.
I'm not surprised that after failing to see the real issue involved in this you would post that.
Now the big issue will be whether Rat votes will be required and if so what will the Establishment Loyalists give them.
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Gaetz,
If you're going to kill the king ...
1.) Don't take the shot until you have a replacement to take the throne.
2.) Don't miss.
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Well maybe Gaetz shouldn't have pulled this stunt!
Yeah I get it, the Establishment Loyalists never want to hold leadership responsible for failing to do what they said they would do.
Eventually the Patriots will have to either take over the party, or like the original Pubs split from the whigs.
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So all the Establishment Loyalists should be happy. McCarthy 2.0 is going to be the Speaker on a "3 mo. interim basis".
According to the ACU, McHenry was rated in the low 70s in recent years, while McCarthy was closer to 80%. So it was unwise of Gaetz to roll the dice, when he knew a freedom caucuser would not be elected speaker by the 118th congress.
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The Coo-Coo Caucus are a bunch of impulsive juvenile amateurs playing by high school rules.
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Yeah I get it, the Establishment Loyalists never want to hold leadership responsible for failing to do what they said they would do.
Eventually the Patriots will have to either take over the party, or like the original Pubs split from the whigs.
:shrug:
A swing and a miss is better than no swing at all I guess. I still think it was a ham-handed attempt. But at least, an attempt. That's a something.
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:shrug:
A swing and a miss is better than no swing at all I guess. I still think it was a ham-handed attempt. But at least, an attempt. That's a something.
Agree. It was bungled, but the can is not able to be kicked down the road anymore. No more business as usual, no more being smooth and projecting an image.
This country is nothing but a drunk old ox just plodding toward the edge of a cliff.
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Agree. It was bungled, but the can is not able to be kicked down the road anymore. No more business as usual, no more being smooth and projecting an image.
This country is nothing but a drunk old ox just plodding toward the edge of a cliff.
:mauslaff:
I'm sure Speaker Jeffries will remember you in his victory speech.
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A swing and a miss is better than no swing at all I guess.
Only in certain situations. Gaetz was hot dogging it, when he just needed to move the runners over, and he screwed his team.
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Agree. It was bungled, but the can is not able to be kicked down the road anymore. No more business as usual, no more being smooth and projecting an image.
This country is nothing but a drunk old ox just plodding toward the edge of a cliff.
Led by a bunch of Establishment Loyalists who don't care because they think they will not be affected by the looming economic nightmare, to some extent they are right. The real burden will be felt by the 60% that are in the middle economic brackets.
We are adding Trillions every year to a debt we will soon be hard pressed to pay the interest on. What did our Establishment Loyalists do to stop this, NOTHING. Of course our Establishment Loyalist Pub posters are okay with this as long as the team wins.
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Dunno, you tell me. Is the Establishment required to follow their own rules or not?
Ouch.
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We are adding Trillions every year to a debt we will soon be hard pressed to pay the interest on. What did our Establishment Loyalists do to stop this, NOTHING. Of course our Establishment Loyalist Pub posters are okay with this as long as the team wins.
We are at around $1T interest cost with tax receipts a bit north of $4T, in a mediocre but fairly stable economy, and as of now has hockey sticked straight north. In '08 revenues crashed about 25%, so another recession will squeeze that even harder.
Do we think the world is going to fund our debt when most of it goes to pay interest?
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I guess we should ask you that, because the goal posts keep changing.
The only one who changed where the goalposts have always been is Gaetz.
I support the entire caucus agreeing to back for Speaker whomever gets the majority vote within the caucus. That's the deal. But there's no deal if some members of the Freedom Caucus refuse to be bound by that deal. Because all they then have to do is refuse to support everyone except the guy they want - In this case Jordan - and then pressure everybody else into backing their candidate.
That's what Gaetz did. "We're not obligated to vote for McCarthy, but you're obligated to vote for Jordan.". He did that in January, and then again in October. On both occasions, McCarthy had a larger majority than does Jordan right now. He had at least 210 votes both times, more than Jordan has ever gotten. But, despite that majority, Gaetz & Co. refused to vote for him.
The Freedom Caucus actually broke that deal again with respect to Scalise. They agreed to support whoever won the vote between Jordan and Scalise. But when Scalise won it, five members of the Freedom Caucus announced that they would never vote for Scalise under any conditions. So much for the vote.
The deal to support whoever wins the majority within the Republican conference was broken multiple times by members of the freedom Caucus, and no longer exists. For the Freedom Caucus to now insist that everybody else is obligated to vote for Jordan, after they refused to vote for others who won the majority before Jordan, is laughable.
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Yeah I get it, the Establishment Loyalists never want to hold leadership responsible for failing to do what they said they would do.
Eventually the Patriots will have to either take over the party, or like the original Pubs split from the whigs.
:yawn2: :yawn2: :yawn2: 11513 11513 11513 11513 11513 11513 11513 11513 11513
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We are at around $1T interest cost with tax receipts a bit north of $4T, in a mediocre but fairly stable economy, and as of now has hockey sticked straight north. In '08 revenues crashed about 25%, so another recession will squeeze that even harder.
Do we think the world is going to fund our debt when most of it goes to pay interest?
You've got it exactly right!
It's why the BRICS movement has gained steam.
On top of this, even if interest rates dropped back to 3% the interest payments will continue to rise because old debt financed at much lower rates has to be refinanced and we are adding TRILLIONS of debt every year.
It's not widely reported, but even the Wall Street Journal has reported that the Treasury is having more trouble selling it's longer term Bonds, even at higher rates. The Bond Vigilantes are telling us that the USA may not back it's obligations long term. I hope some of the posters who think fighting for appropriation bills being how the govt is funded is not a fight worth fighting let that sink in.
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You've got it exactly right!
It's why the BRICS movement has gained steam.
On top of this, even if interest rates dropped back to 3% the interest payments will continue to rise because old debt financed at much lower rates has to be refinanced and we are adding TRILLIONS of debt every year.
It's not widely reported, but even the Wall Street Journal has reported that the Treasury is having more trouble selling it's longer term Bonds, even at higher rates. The Bond Vigilantes are telling us that the USA may not back it's obligations long term. I hope some of the posters who think fighting for appropriation bills being how the govt is funded is not a fight worth fighting let that sink in.
888high58888
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Conference Chairwoman Elise Stefanik (R-NY) rejects McHenry motion, calls for 3rd floor vote
By Josh Christenson
GOP Conference Chairwoman Elise Stefanik (R-NY) rejected an approach to empower the McHenry motion, which she said was "Democrat-backed" — and called instead for another vote on the House floor.
"The people across #NY21 and America can rest assured that I strongly oppose any attempt to create a Democrat backed coalition government," she tweeted mid-afternoon Thursday.
"I will vote to support Jim Jordan for Speaker on the House Floor.
"We must work to unify Republicans as the last line of defense to save America."
https://twitter.com/EliseStefanik/status/1715078877372977190
NYPost
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We are at around $1T interest cost with tax receipts a bit north of $4T, in a mediocre but fairly stable economy, and as of now has hockey sticked straight north. In '08 revenues crashed about 25%, so another recession will squeeze that even harder.
Do we think the world is going to fund our debt when most of it goes to pay interest?
More than that... The hidden tax of inflation... Silver c. 1960s vs silver now... A 60's $1k is what now... about 30k?
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an hour ago
Rep. Massie: Expect 3rd house vote tonight; Jordan to ask McCarthy to deliver speech nominating him
By Josh Christenson
Rep. Thomas Massie of Kentucky has told The Post that he expects there to be a third speaker ballot at some point this evening, and that Jordan will ask McCarthy to deliver a nominating speech for him on the floor.
In the meantime, Massie said, Jordan will call the 20-odd GOP holdouts in a bid to win them over.
"Jim concluded the meeting by saying that he will talk to his wife and to the 20 people who were objecting to him, and then likely seek a third vote later today," according to Massie.
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4 minutes ago
Holdouts to meet with Jordan ahead of potential third ballot: source
By Josh Christenson
Jim Jordan will hold a 4 p.m. meeting with 22 holdouts who opposed him on the second ballot Wednesday, a source tells The Post.
It's unclear whether there will be a third ballot, with some members calling for a floor vote tonight and others calling for new candidates to emerge in the speakership fight.
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According to the ACU, McHenry was rated in the low 70s in recent years, while McCarthy was closer to 80%. So it was unwise of Gaetz to roll the dice, when he knew a freedom caucuser would not be elected speaker by the 118th congress.
It doesn't look like anyone has the support to be elected speaker at this rate.
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We are at around $1T interest cost with tax receipts a bit north of $4T, in a mediocre but fairly stable economy, and as of now has hockey sticked straight north. In '08 revenues crashed about 25%, so another recession will squeeze that even harder.
Do we think the world is going to fund our debt when most of it goes to pay interest?
Which is exactly why we can't keep passing spending bills. That means going over the fiscal cliff and telling the usury lenders that have screwed us over and the dependent masses who have grown literally fat on borrowed largess a simple word: NO.
The budget has to be balanced. No more questions. And that means telling people NO once in a while when they want money we haven't had in years.
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Yeah I get it, the Establishment Loyalists never want to hold leadership responsible for failing to do what they said they would do.
Eventually the Patriots will have to either take over the party, or like the original Pubs split from the whigs.
That is correct. Either we the people vote in enough conservatives to become the majority or this exercise is futile. Time to move on to your option "B"...start another new party.
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That is correct. Either we the people vote in enough conservatives to become the majority or this exercise is futile. Time to move on to your option "B"...start another new party.
For sure this time?
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That is correct. Either we the people vote in enough conservatives to become the majority or this exercise is futile. Time to move on to your option "B"...start another new party.
I don't seem how starting a new party helps.
To get control of the GOP, you need to elect just over half of the members. But if you can't even get enough votes to elect half of the GOP's members, then how are you going to have enough votes to outvote the GOP as a whole?
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Until conservatives stop voting for the lesser evil there won't be any actual change.
As long as they aren't as bad as the Democrats they know they own your vote. The net result is you get what you voted for...
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I don't seem how starting a new party helps.
To get control of the GOP, you need to elect just over half of the members. But if you can't even get enough votes to elect half of the GOP's members, then how are you going to have enough votes to outvote the GOP as a whole?
Certain members such as McConnell like to make sure that his cronies remain and certainly he doesn't want conservatives rocking his boat so he backs RINO's. A new party full of true conservatives would be wonderful. It's finding enough conservatives to run that is a problem as well as very much needed, competent and courageous leader (Ted Cruz).
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I don't seem how starting a new party helps.
To get control of the GOP, you need to elect just over half of the members. But if you can't even get enough votes to elect half of the GOP's members, then how are you going to have enough votes to outvote the GOP as a whole?
I don't think starting a new party is the answer either. My post was somewhat ineloquent and I left of the sarcasm tag after option "B".
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Certain members such as McConnell like to make sure that his cronies remain and certainly he doesn't want conservatives rocking his boat so he backs RINO's. A new party full of true conservatives would be wonderful. It's finding enough conservatives to run that is a problem as well as very much needed, competent and courageous leader (Ted Cruz).
Continuing to participate in a rigged game is futile. That's why conservatives do not play it...
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A new party full of true conservatives would be wonderful. It's finding enough conservatives to run that is a problem as well as very much needed, competent and courageous leader (Ted Cruz).
I think it's more a question of finding enough voters to elect them. I mean, if there aren't even enough of us to win primaries within the GOP, how are the fraction of conservatives within the GOP splitting off and running separately going to win general elections against the Democrats?
So let's say Ted Cruz left the GOP and ran in some new conservative party. He'd lose everyone to the left of him who stayed in the GOP, then would have to win election against a Democrat despite losing all those other Republicans.
I just don't see it.
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To many people, the Federal Debt is such an abstract, intangible thing, it might as well be the Great Pumpkin. It doesn't seem relevant and relateable.
(https://media.kjzz.org/s3fs-public/styles/special_story_images_aspect_switcher/public/its-the-great-pumpkin-charlie-brown-peanuts-halloween-3-20201028.jpg?itok=4ppUHNVZ)
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I think it's more a question of finding enough voters to elect them. I mean, if there aren't even enough of us to win primaries within the GOP, how are the fraction of conservatives within the GOP splitting off and running separately going to win general elections against the Democrats?
So let's say Ted Cruz left the GOP and ran in some new conservative party. He'd lose everyone to the left of him who stayed in the GOP, then would have to win election against a Democrat despite losing all those other Republicans.
I just don't see it.
That's not right. On the whole, EVERYBODY on the Right is a conservative at election time.
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https://twitter.com/nicksortor/status/1715141431101157514
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Matt Gaetz
@mattgaetz
Ever seen a SWAMP actually drained?
This Florida Man has.
It’s not orderly.
Turns out, the alligators & snakes get unruly when the comfort of their habitat is disrupted.
Chaos doesn’t scare me.
American decline does.
Our fight continues.
Thank you for having my back!
5:13 PM · Oct 19, 2023
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JR Majewski
@JRMajewski
It’s not easy being the enemy of the Swamp.
@mattgaetz needs backup.
I’m coming in 2024. We’re not just going to drain this swamp, we are going to fill it with concrete.
3:48 PM · Oct 19, 2023
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Until conservatives stop voting for the lesser evil there won't be any actual change.
As long as they aren't as bad as the Democrats they know they own your vote. The net result is you get what you voted for...
:thumbsup:
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Thomas Massie
@RepThomasMassie
This is a speech you won’t want to miss from the next Speaker of the House! Floor vote to follow at 10:00 a.m.
9:49 PM · Oct 19, 2023
https://twitter.com/JudiciaryGOP/status/1715179354798403616
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That's not right. On the whole, EVERYBODY on the Right is a conservative at election time.
Not sure what you mean, but maybe I stated my point poorly.
Ted Cruz is a conservative, and he's already getting the vote of every conservative - even those who don't consider themselves Republicans. Quitting the GOP and running in a new conservative party isn't going to gain him any votes on the right.
But what it does do is lose him votes by those Republicans who don't leave the GOP, but who would have voted for him because he's the GOP nominee. Instead, they're more likely to vote for whomever the GOP nominates. In essence, he's losing the votes of everyone in the GOP who aren't as conservative as he is, but also would never vote Democrat.
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Establishing a Quorum now. Jim Jordan VOTE 3.
https://youtu.be/4rdRZVzhGSs (https://youtu.be/4rdRZVzhGSs)
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Not sure what you mean, but maybe I stated my point poorly.
Ted Cruz is a conservative, and he's already getting the vote of every conservative - even those who don't consider themselves Republicans. Quitting the GOP and running in a new conservative party isn't going to gain him any votes on the right.
But what it does do is lose him votes by those Republicans who don't leave the GOP, but who would have voted for him because he's the GOP nominee. Instead, they're more likely to vote for whomever the GOP nominates. In essence, he's losing the votes of everyone in the GOP who aren't as conservative as he is, but also would never vote Democrat.
My position was stated poorly. I was merely using Ted Cruz as an example of a person whom I think has the knowledge and ground game to create a third party -- not necessarily him being the 3rd party candidate. Perhaps gathering a group of notable conservatives to join an existing party like the Constitution Party, I see that they may succeed. IMHO the Constitution Party has a conservative platform but they've never had the $$, enough name recognition, nor ground game to succeed.
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It looks like many in the GOP wing of the Uniparty openly agree with him .....
Hakeem Jeffries: “Jim Jordan is a clear and present danger to our democracy.”
. (Video)
https://twitter.com/TPostMillennial/status/1715379515466121388
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My position was stated poorly. I was merely using Ted Cruz as an example of a person whom I think has the knowledge and ground game to create a third party -- not necessarily him being the 3rd party candidate. Perhaps gathering a group of notable conservatives to join an existing party like the Constitution Party, I see that they may succeed. IMHO the Constitution Party has a conservative platform but they've never had the $$, enough name recognition, nor ground game to succeed.
I like the way you THINK @libertybele
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Chad Pergram
@ChadPergram
McCarthy to nominate Jordan for Speaker in third round
10:46 AM · Oct 20, 2023
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Jordan doesn't have the votes, already 9 have voted against him.
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I don't understand the problem here. McCarthy has endorsed and nominated Jordan, so what's the excuse for the spoiled bratty Establishment diaper babies not voting for him? What little ledge of hypocrisy are they trying to stand on now?
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I don't understand the problem here. McCarthy has endorsed and nominated Jordan, so what's the excuse for the spoiled bratty Establishment diaper babies not voting for him? What little ledge of hypocrisy are they trying to stand on now?
:facepalm2:
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https://twitter.com/DC_Draino/status/1715145541460357253
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Note that none of these defectors will cast a vote for Jeffries. It goes to show how inept he is at teaching across the aisle and taking advantage of the discord.
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Not sure what you mean, but maybe I stated my point poorly.
Ted Cruz is a conservative, and he's already getting the vote of every conservative - even those who don't consider themselves Republicans. Quitting the GOP and running in a new conservative party isn't going to gain him any votes on the right.
But what it does do is lose him votes by those Republicans who don't leave the GOP, but who would have voted for him because he's the GOP nominee. Instead, they're more likely to vote for whomever the GOP nominates. In essence, he's losing the votes of everyone in the GOP who aren't as conservative as he is, but also would never vote Democrat.
FOREMOST:
The reason we are few in the Republican party is foremost because of the deliberate material sabotage of conservative candidates in the primaries by the Moderates in control of the party. So conservatives will always be few as long as Moderates control the party - And leaving those conservatives in perpetual servitude, rubber-stamping the Moderate agenda because of the very need for party unity being hawked in this thread. And meanwhile, the controlled agenda makes sure that conservative ideas opposed to that agenda never even make it to the table. So cry me a river for poor McCarthy.
But it ain't right to blame the voters beyond their inattention and ignorance. Everyone sells Conservatism at election time. They're ALL conservatives on the stump. Once elected, the moderates, who got in because they received Republican rain, go on to reinforce Moderate control of numbers, and support the Moderate agenda.
It's a no-win scenario without some means of distinction between those who ARE conservative, and those who pose on the stump... And look no further than right here for evidence... A very few of us have worked long and hard to draw a conservative distinction AGAINST Tumpy all the way along... prevailing finally against those who wished to wrap Tumpy in the Conservative mantle, even though he stands for *nothing* conservative at all - or at most, damn little.
The very SAME argument went on with Romney - a liberal like Tumpy - and moderates McCain and both Bushes (and Dole).
At some point there is no profit in it, and a hard line has to be drawn. I have already drawn that line - No longer Republican, I can stand against the phony unity and demand a Conservative agenda.
I have supported the Constitution Party by and large since I left, and I do support getting CP candidates in place precisely to spoil Republicans when they stray, because of a hard line of distinction. Those lines are more than blurred among useless Republicans.
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:facepalm2:
That is an appeal to emotion, not an argument.
Again, he has McCarthy's endorsement, what now is the excuse?
It's obvious the holdouts are being exposed for the Establishment hacks they are.
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That is an appeal to emotion, not an argument.
Again, he has McCarthy's endorsement, what now is the excuse?
It's obvious the holdouts are being exposed for the Establishment hacks they are.
So they should just vote lock-step because McCarthy tells them to? Why? Jordan is part of the tiny little spoilt child minority that is trying to strong-arm its way into a position of authority that it does not have the numbers to merit, and these people are simply resisting the illegitimate strong-arm tactics of spoilt children and their tantrums.
One does not give in to spoilt little children; it only encourages them to continue their illegitimate behavior.
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That is an appeal to emotion, not an argument.
Again, he has McCarthy's endorsement, what now is the excuse?
It's obvious the holdouts are being exposed for the Establishment hacks they are.
Jordan was accused of aiding Trump with overturning the election. He is viewed as "ultra" conservative. The RINO's in Congress don't like him and they would need to swing a little more to the right.
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Jim Jordan Is Trying To Buy the Speakership With Tax Breaks for Wealthy Residents of Blue States
It's a maneuver that makes little fiscal, philosophical, or political sense, but thankfully it also seems unlikely to work.
ERIC BOEHM
10.20.2023
After failing in two attempts to become Speaker of the House of Representatives, Rep. Jim Jordan (R–Ohio) has reportedly offered an unexpected bargaining chip: a big tax break for wealthy Americans living predominantly in high-tax, Democratic-controlled states.
We'll soon find out whether that makes any difference: Jordan is expected to make a third attempt at securing the speakership on Friday.
Jordan is "on board" with increasing the $10,000 cap on state and local tax deductions if it will secure support for his speakership bid from some hold-out Republicans who also favor lifting or abolishing that cap, Roll Call reports. If it works out, Jordan's proposal would see the so-called "SALT cap"—shorthand for "state and local tax"—doubled to $20,000 for single tax filers and $40,000 for married couples who file taxes jointly. It is, as The Wall Street Journal notes, an obvious attempt to curry favor with Republican lawmakers from blue states like New York.
"It would be a notable endorsement from Jordan, who has led some of the House's most conservative factions that tend to oppose allowing more deductions for state and local taxes," is how Roll Call's Laura Weiss frames the surprising maneuver.
That's putting it mildly. By even putting that deal on the table, Jordan has signaled that he's willing to sell out major Republican fiscal and tax policy accomplishments to advance his career. That's not a good sign (though it would be very much in keeping with Jordan's status as the avatar for a Republican Party that increasingly has little interest in policy making or traditionally conservative principles).
It might be tempting for some libertarians to support a higher SALT cap, simply because it means larger deductions—and therefore lower taxes—for some Americans. Hey, isn't letting people keep more of their own money always a good thing?
Yes, but that's the wrong way to think about the SALT cap. If Congress felt that individuals making $100,000 (or pick any other number you'd like) ought to be paying less in taxes, it should make that the law of the land. The federal tax code should treat all federal taxpayers equally, and that means being agnostic about how much taxpayers might owe in state and local taxes. Doing otherwise is fundamentally unfair: Why should a person earning $80,000 (or, again, pick any number you'd like) in Connecticut get a tax break that isn't available to someone making the same amount of money in Florida?
* * *
Source: https://reason.com/2023/10/20/jim-jordan-is-trying-to-buy-the-speakership-with-tax-breaks-for-wealthy-residents-of-blue-states/
Yeah, he's such a fiscally responsible conservative.
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So they should just vote lock-step because McCarthy tells them to? Why? Jordan is part of the tiny little spoilt child minority that is trying to strong-arm its way into a position of authority that it does not have the numbers to merit, and these people are simply resisting the illegitimate strong-arm tactics of spoilt children and their tantrums.
One does not give in to spoilt little children; it only encourages them to continue their illegitimate behavior.
I fail to see the difference between that and what Gaetz did.
So Gaetz was required to vote for McCarthy because he was in the minority, but now the Establishment hack holdouts don't have to follow McCarthy even though he endorsed Jordan?
Seems like a serious double standard here. Not to mention these holdouts were willing to make deals with Rats, and go on CNN to air the dirty laundry.
Don't recall Gaetz doing that. He kept it strictly in-house and was willing to negotiate with McCarthy for a deal. These jerks now just want their way or they take their ball and go home, or elect Jeffries.
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https://twitter.com/RepMattGaetz/status/1715406863464808845
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https://twitter.com/greg_price11/status/1715397331791601745
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
·
39m
.@MattGaetz
just said that he and the eight who voted for the Motion To Vacate have offered to be censured and removed from committees to get Jim Jordan in as Speaker.
Selfless.
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Dan Bongino
@dbongino
·
4h
PICK A SPEAKER ALREADY YOU CHILDISH NITWITS!
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I don't understand the problem here. McCarthy has endorsed and nominated Jordan, so what's the excuse for the spoiled bratty Establishment diaper babies not voting for him? What little ledge of hypocrisy are they trying to stand on now?
It's the Uniparty fighting for its life @Free Vulcan
https://twitter.com/DC_Draino/status/1715145541460357253
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Oh Brother
Congressman Troy E. Nehls
@RepTroyNehls
·
42m
Sadly, once again, the Conference rejected Jim Jordan.
It’s now time to bring in the leader of our party to unite our Conference so we can get back to work for the American people.
My next vote will be for Donald J. Trump.
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Dan Bongino
@dbongino
·
4h
PICK A SPEAKER ALREADY YOU CHILDISH NITWITS!
Calm down, Dan. Picking the RIGHT speaker is more important than picking "a" speaker.
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https://twitter.com/RepNancyMace/status/1715411095203029144
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Reminder:
Catturd ™
@catturd2
Everything happening in the House right now is because Kevin McCarthy lied to the holdouts to become Speaker.
If he wasn’t a liar, he’d still be Speaker.
9:46 AM · Oct 20, 2023
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Another day of Congress not being able to spend money it doesn't have. For those of us recognizing the federal government as the greatest threat facing the future of our nation, life is good.
Yep! Amazing how few note this.
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
·39m
.@MattGaetz just said that he and the eight who voted for the Motion To Vacate have offered to be censured and removed from committees to get Jim Jordan in as Speaker.
Selfless.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F85ZCBOXkAAhfMv?format=jpg&name=medium)
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F85ZCBOXkAAhfMv?format=jpg&name=medium)
Rep. Nancy Mace
@RepNancyMace
Throw stones at me, it's fine. This is about keeping promises, leadership, and doing the right thing for the people we represent.
All 8 Republicans who removed McCarthy as Speaker offer “censure, suspension or removal from the conference” to elect Jim Jordan as Speaker.
12:54 PM · Oct 20, 2023
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Reminder:
The only reason the holdouts existed in the first place was because they refused to follow conference protocol of supporting the person nominated by a majority of the Republican conference.
The unrealistic promises extracted by the holdouts shouldn't have had to be made in the first place.
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Yep! Amazing how few note this.
The money is still being spent because the continuing resolution was passed.
What is happening is that we have lost all of the time that otherwise might have been used to pass separate appropriations bills that supposedly were one of the key demands of the conservatives. Because of this stunt, the chances of more individual appropriations bills being passed has diminished.
Whenever this does eventually end, whatever money they would have passed to send to Israel and or Ukraine will be spent anyway.
Not a penny will have been saved.
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Olivia Beavers
@Olivia_Beavers
·
1m
NEWS: Jordan loses by secret ballot, source tells me
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
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4m
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The House Republican Conference just voted to REMOVE Jim Jordan from Speaker consideration via a secret ballot.
Jim Jordan is NO LONGER the Speaker Designate.
The will of the American people has been ignored.
The GOP will pay dearly for this.
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The only reason the holdouts existed in the first place was because they refused to follow conference protocol of supporting the person nominated by a majority of the Republican conference.
The unrealistic promises extracted by the holdouts shouldn't have had to be made in the first place.
And now the other side is doing the exact same thing, except they aren't even trying to reach a deal, except maybe with the Rats.
McCarthy has endorsed, so majority premise is now moot. The vacators have offered their heads on a plate, so what is the holdouts' excuse now?
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Olivia Beavers
@Olivia_Beavers
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1m
NEWS: Jordan loses by secret ballot, source tells me
Curious as to how that works. I thought this was strictly floor nomination.
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The only reason the holdouts existed in the first place was because they refused to follow conference protocol of supporting the person nominated by a majority of the Republican conference.
The unrealistic promises extracted by the holdouts shouldn't have had to be made in the first place.
I get it @Maj. Bill Martin ----- you're a Uniparty devotee. You've no reason to keep trying to convince me, so relax.
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Olivia Beavers
@Olivia_Beavers
·
1m
NEWS: Jordan loses by secret ballot, source tells me
Secret ballot ---- f#*king cowards can run, but they won't stay hidden for long.
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https://twitter.com/nicksortor/status/1715431622311378963
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
The GOP is essentially becoming The Whig Party right now.
The will of the people is no longer part of the equation in this Speaker's battle.
We now have absolutely no idea who is going to materialize as a candidate.
McCarthy is out. Scalise is out. Jordan is out.
Where do we go from here?
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https://twitter.com/repkevinhern/status/1715432076483104838
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
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4m
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The House Republican Conference just voted to REMOVE Jim Jordan from Speaker consideration via a secret ballot.
Jim Jordan is NO LONGER the Speaker Designate.
The will of the American people has been ignored.
The GOP will pay dearly for this.
The GOP as configured will never hold the majority again. They have awakened their constituents.
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I fail to see the difference between that and what Gaetz did.
So Gaetz was required to vote for McCarthy because he was in the minority, but now the Establishment hack holdouts don't have to follow McCarthy even though he endorsed Jordan?
Seems like a serious double standard here. Not to mention these holdouts were willing to make deals with Rats, and go on CNN to air the dirty laundry.
Don't recall Gaetz doing that. He kept it strictly in-house and was willing to negotiate with McCarthy for a deal. These jerks now just want their way or they take their ball and go home, or elect Jeffries.
The double standard is all on the part of Gaetz and company, in particular the ones who rejected Scalise, who was after all, the preferred nominee of the party.
There is no two ways about it. The spoilt children here are Gaetz, Jordan, and the other self-proclaimed "conservatives", and they have no cause to complain when their own stupid childish tricks are used against them.
Maybe, just for once, they should learn how to persuade, instead of going on crusades where they're the only true believers and think they have the right to bludgeon everyone else into doing what they want. That only works when one has an outright majority, and that is a long, long way away from the current state of affairs.
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And now the other side is doing the exact same thing, except they aren't even trying to reach a deal, except maybe with the Rats.
McCarthy has endorsed, so majority premise is now moot. The vacators have offered their heads on a plate, so what is the holdouts' excuse now?
The majority premise is not moot. The majority of the caucus clearly prefers that McCarthy be Speaker, but the eight dissenters made that impossible. McCarthy himself would prefer to be Speaker, but is trying to be a team player by endorsing Jordan. That does not obligate McCarthy's supporters to surrender the majority principle and support Jordan.
And it's worth noting that despite Jordan himself endorsing McCarthy both in January and recently, the dissenters refused to follow Jordan, and chose to sink McCarthy anyway.
McCarthy's supporters are doing to Jordan exactly what Gaetz and Co. did to McCarthy. And they should keep doing it unless and until the Freedom Caucus agrees to support a compromise candidate rather than their dream candidate in Jordan.
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
The GOP is essentially becoming The Whig Party right now.
The will of the people is no longer part of the equation in this Speaker's battle.
We now have absolutely no idea who is going to materialize as a candidate.
McCarthy is out. Scalise is out. Jordan is out.
Where do we go from here?
What is the "will of the people" then? That is such a glib, easy term to use, but too often it is not unpacked and the speaker's unstated premises examined.
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Electing Jim Jordan Speaker was not my will.
MAGAS need to learn math. 30%-40% is NOT a majority, no matter how obnoxious, loud, and threatening they are.
Could Sean Hannity be dinged for being an unregistered lobbyist, and FoxNews dinged for being an unregistered lobbying organization? Calling Congressmen to ask them to change their votes is not journalism - it's lobbying.
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What is the "will of the people" then? That is such a glib, easy term to use
We, the people are done with the GOP wing of the Uniparty. Need a hint? As of today, Trump's closest GOP reivals are in the single digits at 8 percent, 51 points behind him.
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I fail to see the difference between that and what Gaetz did.
If you fail to see the difference, then why are you complaining? You cheered on Gaetz when he did it, so you have no principled basis on which to condemn those who are doing it now.
I personally do see a difference, though. When there was an open vote in conference for everybody to vote for who they wanted as Speaker back in December, McCarthy got 188 votes to just 31 for Andy Biggs. McCarthy was the clear, freely chosen majority choice. And then, after McCarthy was removed, Scalise won the head-to-head vote against Jordan.
Jordan, in contrast, only won a majority after the same dissenters refused to vote for either McCarthy or Scalise, making their election by the full House of Representatives impossible. It was only by knocking the top two candidates off the ballot that Jordan managed to get a majority.
So the difference I see is that Gaetz & Co. opposed the first place guy, and the current dissenters are opposing the third place guy.
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Stephen Miller
@StephenM
·1h
Conservative voters have know(n) for a while that the Senate is predominately composed of Washington Establishment Republicans (unrestricted foreign trade, foreign migration, foreign war, cultural surrender at home). Many are only now learning the House is composed much the same.
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@JakeSherman
Kevin Hern. Jack Bergman. Two of the candidates for speaker.
1:14 PM · Oct 20, 2023
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93K Views
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We, the people are done with the GOP wing of the Uniparty.
You are no more "the People" then is anyone else.
You are one person, and speak only for yourself unless someone on here specifically adopts your opinion. Otherwise, nobody chose you to represent them or their views.
You are not "the People." You are a person, and should quit pretending that you represent the rest of us. Nobody elected you to anything.
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The double standard is all on the part of Gaetz and company, in particular the ones who rejected Scalise, who was after all, the preferred nominee of the party.
There is no two ways about it. The spoilt children here are Gaetz, Jordan, and the other self-proclaimed "conservatives", and they have no cause to complain when their own stupid childish tricks are used against them.
Maybe, just for once, they should learn how to persuade, instead of going on crusades where they're the only true believers and think they have the right to bludgeon everyone else into doing what they want. That only works when one has an outright majority, and that is a long, long way away from the current state of affairs.
Except that the Establishment hacks have been ruling by minority for decades with the 'Gang of X' tactics, and now are pissy it was used against them, but are trying to justify doing it back because 'Gaetz did it first'.
Scalise was 'preferred' candidate in the caucus 113-99, hardly a landslide. Certainly not a mandate. Which doesn't matter anyway because it's a floor nomination, and as was said members are free to vote for who they choose, including Scalise, and they didn't.
Gaetz didn't bludgeon or strong arm, he made a deal, and McCarthy broke it. Meanwhile the Establishment hacks were willing to savage Gaetz for it yet now refuse to make any deal, except with the Rats. Bottom line is they aren't going to play ball till they get their way. Who's the problem here?
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If you fail to see the difference, then why are you complaining? You cheered on Gaetz when he did it, so you have no principled basis on which to condemn those who are doing it now.
I personally do see a difference, though. When there was an open vote in conference for everybody to vote for who they wanted as Speaker back in December, McCarthy got 188 votes to just 31 for Andy Biggs. McCarthy was the clear, freely chosen majority choice. And then, after McCarthy was removed, Scalise won the head-to-head vote against Jordan.
Jordan, in contrast, only won a majority after the same dissenters refused to vote for either McCarthy or Scalise, making their election by the full House of Representatives impossible. It was only by knocking the top two candidates off the ballot that Jordan managed to get a majority.
So the difference I see is that Gaetz & Co. opposed the first place guy, and the current dissenters are opposing the third place guy.
And Jim Jordan got 200 votes, so by your definiton he was in the clear.
Conference votes mean nothing, the only vote that matters is on the floor.
Fact is Gaetz made deals, the current Establishment hack holdouts refuse to deal with anyone but the Rats.
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You are no more "the People" then is anyone else.
You are one person, and speak only for yourself unless someone on here specifically adopts your opinion. Otherwise, nobody chose you to represent them or their views.
You are not "the People." You are a person, and should quit pretending that you represent the rest of us. Nobody elected you to anything.
I know that this wasn't directed towards me, but I view "We the People" collectively as those in this country who are citizens of the United States of America with certain rights under the Constitution.
AS you well know, the preamble of the Constitution states "We the People" of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Prosperity, do ordain and establish this Constitution of the United States of America."
We are supposed to be a Government of the people, by the people, for the people. The government/politicians work for us, not the other way around. The seem to forget that they are in an elected position; not an authoritarian position and should be held responsible and accountable.
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Except that the Establishment hacks have been ruling by minority for decades with the 'Gang of X' tactics, and now are pissy it was used against them, but are trying to justify doing it back because 'Gaetz did it first'.
Didn't you already admit that there has never been a conservative who had a majority within the caucus, but was blocked by the moderates? So then what was the incident prior to Gaetz?
Scalise was 'preferred' candidate in the caucus 113-99, hardly a landslide. Certainly not a mandate. Which doesn't matter anyway because it's a floor nomination, and as was said members are free to vote for who they choose, including Scalise, and they didn't.
Which of course applies equally to those who just voted against and sank Jordan's nomination.
Gaetz didn't bludgeon or strong arm, he made a deal, and McCarthy broke it.
Refusing to vote for the overwhelming caucus favorite, causing 14 failed floor votes for Speaker, and threatening not to sit a Speaker at all, certainly falls within my definition of bludgeoning or strong arming. Your mileage may vary.
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Gaetz didn't bludgeon or strong arm, he made a deal, and McCarthy broke it. Meanwhile the Establishment hacks were willing to savage Gaetz for it yet now refuse to make any deal, except with the Rats. Bottom line is they aren't going to play ball till they get their way. Who's the problem here?
Correctamundo.
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Jordan is never going to get the votes needed. No one else seems to be stepping up to the plate...so...what about making the temporary Speaker the permanent Speaker??
Otherwise the government shutdown will lay heavily in the laps of the GOP.
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I know that this wasn't directed towards me, but I view "We the People" collectively as those in this country who are citizens of the United States of America with certain rights under the Constitution.
AS you well know, the preamble of the Constitution states "We the People" of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Prosperity, do ordain and establish this Constitution of the United States of America."
We are supposed to be a Government of the people, by the people, for the people. The government/politicians work for us, not the other way around. The seem to forget that they are in an elected position; not an authoritarian position and should be held responsible and accountable.
My point was that no particular political position or view has any more right to claim the mandate of being representative of "We the people" than any other.
When the individual representatives we as citizens collectively send to Washington vote in ways that some of us don't like, that does not mean they are ignoring the wishes of "We the People.". It more than likely means that they are representing the views of other citizens with whom we happen to disagree.
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https://twitter.com/JoeyMannarinoUS/status/1715445189106364911
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My point was that no particular political position or view has any more right to claim the mandate of being representative of "We the people" than any other.
When the individual representatives we as citizens collectively send to Washington vote in ways that some of us don't like, that does not mean they are ignoring the wishes of "We the People.". It more than likely means that they are representing the views of other citizens with whom we happen to disagree.
Regardless of appeasing constituents the Constitution needs to be adhered to -- "We the People" should demand that. Sidestepping the Constitution is why we have the problems in DC that we are facing.
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https://twitter.com/JoeyMannarinoUS/status/1715445189106364911
Yay!!! Go Byron. So far he has proven to be a conservative. I hope he gets the votes. I would love to see him as Speaker.
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Jordan is never going to get the votes needed. No one else seems to be stepping up to the plate...so...what about making the temporary Speaker the permanent Speaker??
Otherwise the government shutdown will lay heavily in the laps of the GOP.
I'm fine with McHenry or any compromise candidate. Now that McCarthy, Scalise, and Jordan are all off the table, that may pull some of the emotion out of the equation so they'll all be able to rally around someone and get on with business.
I do think the importance of the speaker has been massively overestimated, because in the end, the speaker is going to be restricted by the general consensus that exists in the GOP conference. Changing speakers was never going to make the moderates vote more conservatively on legislation, and it wasn't going to make the conservatives vote more moderately. That's why even Jordan was talking about continuing resolutions if he made Speaker.
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Regardless of appeasing constituents the Constitution needs to be adhered to -- "We the People" should demand that. Sidestepping the Constitution is why we have the problems in DC that we are facing.
Just to be clear, there is nothing in the Constitution that demands 12 separate appropriations bills. That particular aspiration didn't even exist until the 1970s.
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I do find it amazing that some of the strongest supporters of this Speaker fight on the grounds of returning to fiscal restraint also happen to be strong supporters of Donald Trump, who affirmatively mocked those who advocated fiscal restraint.
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Just can't work the weekend
https://twitter.com/ChadPergram/status/1715421236556181574
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Chad Pergram
@ChadPergram
·
1h
2) In fact, some members have hinted they could leave for the weekend as a protest if they either stick with Jordan or force additional votes without a clear path to win.
Chad Pergram
@ChadPergram
·
1h
3) In addition, some members have expressed concern about accidentally electing House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY) as Speaker if there are the right number of absences and the GOP fails to provide a certain number of votes to block him.
Chad Pergram
@ChadPergram
·
1h
4) That could happen if there’s an attendance issue
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The double standard is all on the part of Gaetz and company, in particular the ones who rejected Scalise, who was after all, the preferred nominee of the party.
Well that's sorta bullcrap. Scalise and Jordan are both favored sons, both uniters, both considered even-handed.
Granted, Scalise, as a moderate, would probably be considered as having an upper hand, but not by much. And I am on the record here as expecting Scalise, and satisfied with that, though no doubt I would prefer Jordan.
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Gaetz didn't bludgeon or strong arm, he made a deal, and McCarthy broke it. Meanwhile the Establishment hacks were willing to savage Gaetz for it yet now refuse to make any deal, except with the Rats. Bottom line is they aren't going to play ball till they get their way. Who's the problem here?
That's the way I see it too.
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*bouche*
Marjorie Taylor Greene Press Release (Parody)
@MTGrepp
·
1h
Breaking 🚨🚨
Jim Jordan is stepping out of the Speaker race
It might be time to abandon the Republican Party and officially start the MAGA party
Are you with me ?
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The GOP as configured will never hold the majority again. They have awakened their constituents.
I agree...they cannot lead.
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The only reason the holdouts existed in the first place was because they refused to follow conference protocol of supporting the person nominated by a majority of the Republican conference.
The unrealistic promises extracted by the holdouts shouldn't have had to be made in the first place.
No, McCarthy is responsible because he broke almost every promise he made, several of which were within his power to honor.
I am sick of people lying as he did, just to get the votes for Speaker.
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Benny Johnson
@bennyjohnson
🚨BREAKING: Byron Donalds to announce candidacy for House Speaker
Benny Johnson
@bennyjohnson
Other names in the mix:
-Tom Emmer
-Kevin Hern
-Austin Scott
-Jack Bergman
-Mike Johnson
-Mark Green
-Roger Williams
3:51 PM · Oct 20, 2023
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It's a parody account. Says so right in the name. There's no Maga party.
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No, McCarthy is responsible because he broke almost every promise he made, several of which were within his power to honor.
I am sick of people lying as he did, just to get the votes for Speaker.
210 Republicans did not believe the alleged lies warranted his removal from the Speakership.
I trust their collective judgment a lot more than I do some of the self-serving nut bags among the eight who opposed him.
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210 Republicans did not believe the alleged lies warranted his removal from the Speakership.
I trust their collective judgment a lot more than I do some of the self-serving nut bags among the eight who opposed him.
My statement was partially rhetorical, I already know what side you are on.
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I don't mind them taking the weekend off. The truth is they'll be need to be a lot of behind the scenes conversations, meetings, and phone calls to put together candidates and support. I personally prefer to see the various factions within the party coalesce around three or four candidates at most rather than have a dozen or more so all running.
It also would be a nice time to get a commitment from every member that they'll all agree to support any candidate who actually gets a majority within the caucus. If they want to specifically exclude McCarthy, Scalise, and Jordan from that, that's fine.
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We, the people are done with the GOP wing of the Uniparty. Need a hint? As of today, Trump's closest GOP reivals are in the single digits at 8 percent, 51 points behind him.
What do you mean, WE?
This all started under your guy's watch.
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Well that's sorta bullcrap. Scalise and Jordan are both favored sons, both uniters, both considered even-handed.
Granted, Scalise, as a moderate, would probably be considered as having an upper hand, but not by much. And I am on the record here as expecting Scalise, and satisfied with that, though no doubt I would prefer Jordan.
Nope. It's not bullcrap at all. It's the truth. Scalise was the preferred nominee of the GOP as a whole; Jordan was not. It was only after Scalise' departure from the nomination was extorted by the same sort of childish threats Gaetz and Co. made that Jordan became the next one up to the plate, and by that time, the rest of the GOP conference had had more than enough of the spoilt child tactics of Gaetz & Co., and opted to not support Jordan. Too bad, so sad; play with fire and you can't complain when you get burned.
Gaetz f*cked this thing six ways to Sunday, without a viable exit plan, and so has almost single-handedly most likely handed the House to the democrats in 2024. Congratulations; Mr. "Conservative" has ended up simply enabling the progressives and their control of the House. I hope his check from the DNC is big enough to make it worth the while for having f*cked the country.
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https://twitter.com/JoeyMannarinoUS/status/1715445189106364911
First Black Speaker of the House and a conservative. Win! Win!
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First Black Speaker of the House and a conservative. Win! Win!
Agreed.
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I really like Jim Jordan and am sorry he is a part if this. Be it willingly or unwillingly.
The question that enters my mind is why would anybody want to be speaker? Small majority, warring factions, d@mned if you do d@amned if you don't.
Somebody refresh my memory, but wasn't there a similar situation prior to Ryan. Wasn't he more or less forced into the position?
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Kevin McCarthy endorses Tom Emmer for House Speaker
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First Black Speaker of the House and a conservative. Win! Win!
IMHO, He's too close to Trump.
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
Byron Donalds is officially running for Speaker.
Let's make history, America.
It will be history all right. Republicans haven't elected a Conservative Speaker in over 100 years.
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2nd vote for Jordan a congresscritter wanted John Boehner back :shrug:
Admit the House been in Disarray since Sen Cruz got into that pizzing contest with the aforementioned fellow. This is a battle that has to be done, there is no other Time.
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It will be history all right. Republicans haven't elected a Conservative Speaker in over 100 years.
Newt?
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IMHO, He's too close to Trump.
I'm not familiar with his ties to Trump. I do know him to vote conservatively. Here is his voting record:
https://justfacts.votesmart.org/candidate/key-votes/137655/byron-donalds
Byron Donalds "On the Issues" -- he is categorized as a "hard core" conservative.
https://www.ontheissues.org/FL/Byron_Donalds.htm
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IMHO, He's too close to Trump.
He's also inexperienced, and as a member of the Freedom Caucus likely will get some of the overflow resentment toward Gaetz. I do think the experience point is relevant because the job of the Speaker is largely procedural, and Donalds hasn't even chaired a committee.
I think someone like Hern, who is a conservative but not a member of the Freedom Caucus, is probably the best shot.
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Kevin McCarthy endorses Tom Emmer for House Speaker
In comparison on the same issues as Byron Donalds, Emmer is a "moderate conservative". Does that surprise anyone since McCarthy endorsed him??
https://www.ontheissues.org/house/tom_emmer.htm
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He's also inexperienced, and as a member of the Freedom Caucus likely will get some of the overflow resentment toward Gaetz. I do think the experience point is relevant because The job of the speaker is largely procedural, and Donald's hasn't even chaired a committee.
I think someone like Hern, who is a conservative but not a member of the Freedom Caucus, is probably the best shot.
I thought about him being a new kid on the block, but he's done very well for FL. I've been listening to him in comparison to how he votes and so far -- he doesn't waiver or walk back. He's pretty darn steadfast in his beliefs.
Perhaps we need someone who doesn't have years of experience and tainted by the DC RINO's. :shrug:
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Don't forget about The Hammer.
(https://npr.brightspotcdn.com/dims4/default/fba94c9/2147483647/strip/true/crop/443x352+0+0/resize/880x699!/quality/90/?url=http:%2F%2Fnpr-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2Flegacy%2Fsites%2Fkut%2Ffiles%2F201011%2Fdelay%20mug%20shot_0.jpg)
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In comparison on the same issues as Byron Donalds, Emmer is a "moderate conservative". Does that surprise anyone since McCarthy endorsed him??
https://www.ontheissues.org/house/tom_emmer.htm
No. Emmert is closer to the middle of the caucus, which honestly should be where the Speaker comes from.
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Kevin McCarthy endorses Tom Emmer for House Speaker
Of course he does.
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No, McCarthy is responsible because he broke almost every promise he made, several of which were within his power to honor.
I am sick of people lying as he did, just to get the votes for Speaker.
THAT'S RIGHT. End of story wrt McCarthy.
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No. Emmert is closer to the middle of the caucus, which honestly should be where the Speaker comes from.
Frankly, the more conservative, the better.
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Frankly, the more conservative, the better.
Playing to the "Moderates" is playing to lose, and is exactly how we got here as a nation.
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Frankly, the more conservative, the better.
In my opinion, the goal should be passing the most conservative legislation possible. I think the risk with a Speaker that is significantly further to the right than the majority of the caucus is that you are going to risk losing moderate Republicans to the Democrats on key votes. So while the Speaker personally may stake out a more conservative position, what ends up being passed maybe significantly less conservative than what it might otherwise have been.
Realistically, we are not going to get significantly more conservative results until we elect significantly more conservatives. In the meantime, we've got to fight the best rear guard action possible.
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Benny Johnson
@bennyjohnson
🚨BREAKING: Byron Donalds to announce candidacy for House Speaker
Benny Johnson
@bennyjohnson
Other names in the mix:
-Tom Emmer
-Kevin Hern
-Austin Scott
-Jack Bergman
-Mike Johnson
-Mark Green
-Roger Williams
3:51 PM · Oct 20, 2023
Heritage rates Hern at 98% https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/H001082 (https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/H001082)
Heritage also rates Donalds at 98% https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/d000032 (https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/d000032)
Jack Bergman at 84% https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/b001301 (https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/b001301)
Mike Johnson at 84% https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/J000299/118 (https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/J000299/118)
Mark Green at 84% https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/G000590/118 (https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/G000590/118)
Tom Emmer comes in at 82% https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/E000294/ (https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/E000294/)
Roger Williams at 78% https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/w000816?session=115 (https://heritageaction.com/scorecard/members/w000816?session=115)
Those are Heritage Foundation ratings, and only for this session. Specifics are at the links.
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In my opinion, the goal should be passing the most conservative legislation possible. I think the risk with a Speaker that is significantly further to the right than the majority of the caucus is that you are going to risk losing moderate Republicans to the Democrats on key votes. So while the Speaker personally may stake out a more conservative position, what ends up being passed maybe significantly less conservative than what it might otherwise have been.
Realistically, we are not going to get significantly more conservative results until we elect significantly more conservatives. In the meantime, we've got to fight the best rear guard action possible.
I hear what you are saying but in the same light; those that side with DEMS or vote along with them aren't worth their seat and should be voted out. Not doing so is why we're at the crossroads we have.
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THAT'S RIGHT. End of story wrt McCarthy.
Yep. Hern and Donalds are rated most conservative out of the list (by The Heritage Foundation, for the current session) and maybe need a better look. I'd like to see those ratings compared to other scorecards.
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Yep. Hern and Donalds are rated most conservative out of the list (by The Heritage Foundation, for the current session) and maybe need a better look. I'd like to see those ratings compared to other scorecards.
Wishful thinking. If Jordan could not get it done, no other Conservative is going to have the credz.
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Wishful thinking. If Jordan could not get it done, no other Conservative is going to have the credz.
We'll see. It's an election year, and the GOP is not beyond pandering to demographics and checking boxes, in spite of a candidate being Conservative.
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Wishful thinking. If Jordan could not get it done, no other Conservative is going to have the credz.
From where I'm sitting, this entire thing was an attempt by members of the Freedom Caucus to force the GOP majority to select Jordan as Speaker. They figured that as long as they held firm, everyone else would capitulate and they'd get the guy they wanted all along. They miscalculated.
For that same reason, I think Donald's candidacy is DOA.
Hern is pretty close to Trump and so might not be acceptable anyway, but I do think he has a better shot than Jordan did.
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We'll see. It's an election year, and the GOP is not beyond pandering to demographics and checking boxes, in spite of a candidate being Conservative.
That's the only reason Jordan would have stood a chance... though they ARE burning down the phone lines... maybe so...
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From where I'm sitting, this entire thing was an attempt by members of the Freedom Caucus to force the GOP majority to select Jordan as Speaker. They figured that as long as they held firm, everyone else would capitulate and they'd get the guy they wanted all along. They miscalculated.
For that same reason, I think Donald's candidacy is DOA. Hern is conservative, but he is not a member of The Freedom Caucus, but rather the chair of the Republican Study Group.
He is pretty close to Trump and so might not be acceptable anyway, but I do think he has a better shot than Jordan did.
Like I said upthread... ham-handed... But I DO believe it was about McCarthy not keeping his word. What happened next is obviously unplanned to me.
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Like I said upthread... ham-handed... But I DO believe it was about McCarthy not keeping his word. What happened next is obviously unplanned to me.
Hern is the head of the Republican Study Group, which is the largest caucus within the GOP and has 156 members. Obviously, if they support him, he's in.
I personally think he's the best damage control candidate out there. He's not tied as closely to McCarthy as someone like Emmert, So I think the more hardline members would be willing to support him.
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Hern is the head of the Republican Study Group, which is the largest caucus within the GOP and has 156 members. Obviously, if they support him, he's in.
Dunno if he's a glad-hander, like Scalise or Jordan... not on the social radar... maybe so.
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I hear what you are saying but in the same light; those that side with DEMS or vote along with them aren't worth their seat and should be voted out. Not doing so is why we're at the crossroads we have.
Ever heard that saying “half a loaf is better than no bread?” You are not going to elect right wingers in most districts. There are just tons of people in the northeast, on the west coast, and cities in between. Either we welcome squishes into the coalition, or the dems will happily lord over us for all eternity.
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Wishful thinking. If Jordan could not get it done, no other Conservative is going to have the credz.
The Establishment members have revealed what really matters to them. It isn't Gaetz' head. We just witnessed Gaetz, Good, Rosendale, et al. offer to step down if the Establishment holdouts would drop their opposition to Jordan. But they found that unacceptable. Keeping Establishment control of the leadership positions was more important to them than getting rid of Gaetz.
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unusual_whales
@unusual_whales
BREAKING: Kevin Hern has announced he is going to run for speaker of the House after Jim Jordan's attempt failed.
Kevin Hern currently is the Congressman who benefits most from the current wars in Ukraine and Israel, per his stock holdings.
Here are more of his unusual trades:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F853zvrXUAAmNHQ?format=jpg&name=small)
2:56 PM · Oct 20, 2023
unusual_whales
@unusual_whales
Kevin Hern has a tendency of buying military companies before news. For example, Rep. Kevin Hern bought Lockheed Martin stocks back in August 2021. He bought another $100k in $LMT just 2 weeks before Lockheed Martin won the $10.9 billion Air Force contract.
2:56 PM · Oct 20, 2023
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The Establishment members have revealed what really matters to them. It isn't Gaetz' head. We just witnessed Gaetz, Good, Rosendale, et al. offer to step down if the Establishment holdouts would drop their opposition to Jordan. But they found that unacceptable. Keeping Establishment control of the leadership positions was more important to them than getting rid of Gaetz.
They didn't offer to resign their seats in Congress - they'd have kept those. They'd have just been out of the GOP conference, which wouldn't really have mattered anyway after the leadership elections.
The problem with that scenario is that it was setting up Gaetz & Co. as martyrs to the cause who were ultimately victorious. Sure they lose committee seats for whatever time remains in this congressional term, but they'd have been absolute heroes to many for getting Jordan in as Speaker. So ultimately, that offer really didn't sweeten the pot.
The nice thing about Hern is that he hasn't been in Congress as long as McCarthy, Scalise, etc, so he is less a part of that establishment.
If you add up the minimum 79+ (half of the total membership of the Republican study group, meaning the minimum number that voted him as chair), plus the Freedom Caucus, that gives him a clear majority of the entire GOP caucus.
If you want someone who was more conservative than McCarthy, and less tied to the establishment, he's your most electable guy.
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unusual_whales
@unusual_whales
BREAKING: Kevin Hern has announced he is going to run for speaker of the House after Jim Jordan's attempt failed.
Kevin Hern currently is the Congressman who benefits most from the current wars in Ukraine and Israel, per his stock holdings.
Here are more of his unusual trades:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F853zvrXUAAmNHQ?format=jpg&name=small)
2:56 PM · Oct 20, 2023
unusual_whales
@unusual_whales
Kevin Hern has a tendency of buying military companies before news. For example, Rep. Kevin Hern bought Lockheed Martin stocks back in August 2021. He bought another $100k in $LMT just 2 weeks before Lockheed Martin won the $10.9 billion Air Force contract.
2:56 PM · Oct 20, 2023
I follow Unusual Whales.
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Ever heard that saying “half a loaf is better than no bread?” You are not going to elect right wingers in most districts. There are just tons of people in the northeast, on the west coast, and cities in between. Either we welcome squishes into the coalition, or the dems will happily lord over us for all eternity.
Well, perhaps that ship has sailed long ago for the GOP. The GOP is no longer a party with conservative principles. As for the DEMS reigning for all eternity - why do you think they're allowing so many ILLEGALS in? Eventually they'll give them voting rights.
The GOP has all but died -- IMHO because they've become centrists rather than remain right wing conservatives. You can't continue to appease your opposition and expect to win.
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unusual_whales
@unusual_whales
BREAKING: Kevin Hern has announced he is going to run for speaker of the House after Jim Jordan's attempt failed.
Kevin Hern currently is the Congressman who benefits most from the current wars in Ukraine and Israel, per his stock holdings.
Here are more of his unusual trades:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F853zvrXUAAmNHQ?format=jpg&name=small)
2:56 PM · Oct 20, 2023
unusual_whales
@unusual_whales
Kevin Hern has a tendency of buying military companies before news. For example, Rep. Kevin Hern bought Lockheed Martin stocks back in August 2021. He bought another $100k in $LMT just 2 weeks before Lockheed Martin won the $10.9 billion Air Force contract.
2:56 PM · Oct 20, 2023
But of course .... he'll be the next Speaker. Follow the $$. Line the pockets.
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I follow Unusual Whales.
An adventure story from Walmart?
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But of course .... he'll be the next Speaker. Follow the $$. Line the pockets.
Okay, then elect Emmert.
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Okay, then elect Emmert.
Nah ... how about they elect Donalds?
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Nah ... how about they elect Donalds?
Don't think there's a shot at electing a member of the Freedom Caucus. Just being black and inexperienced isn't enough to overcome that.
For what it is worth, Hern is a completely self-made, wealthy businessman worth tens of millions before he even got to Congress. So to the extent he made more money on investments, he had a lot more to invest.
Also, he has consistently voted against aid to Ukraine, so the implication of saying that he "profits from war" is misleading as hell.
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
·
4h
Kevin McCarthy just endorsed Tom Emmer as Speaker.
Let me make this really clear, Emmer might be the worst GOP member of the House.
Under no circumstance can we allow Emmer to ascend to Speaker.
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Don't think there's a shot at electing a member of the Freedom Caucus. Just being black and inexperienced isn't enough to overcome that.
For what it is worth, Hern is a completely self-made, wealthy businessman worth tens of millions before he even got to Congress. So to the extent he made more money on investments, he had a lot more to invest.
Also, he has consistently voted against aid to Ukraine, so the implication of saying that he "profits from war" is misleading as hell.
Ok -- thanks for the info on Hern.
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
·
4h
Kevin McCarthy just endorsed Tom Emmer as Speaker.
Let me make this really clear, Emmer might be the worst GOP member of the House.
Under no circumstance can we allow Emmer to ascend to Speaker.
Unfortunately with McCarthy's endorsement, I have a feeling that he will be our next Speaker.
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Unfortunately with McCarthy's endorsement, I have a feeling that he will be our next Speaker.
My guess is the only reason whomever "Joey Mannarino" is (never heard of the guy before this...) doesn't like Emmer is because Trump doesn't like Emmer, and has come out against him. For some context....
"In conversations Friday, Trump made clear he was concerned by the prospect of Emmer in the speaker’s chair, telling people he believed the Minnesota Republican was not a fan, according to two people familiar with those private talks. Trump has complained, they say, that Emmer has not forcefully defended him against the indictments he is facing. He has also pointed to Emmer’s criticism of him following the Trump-inspired Jan. 6 Capitol riot, and reports — which Emmer strenuously denied — that as then-chair of the House GOP campaign arm, he advised Republican candidates to avoid mentioning Trump."
Of course the criticisms are not policy based - they're all just Trump's hurt feelings. But my guess is that there are enough hardcore MAGA people in the House to essentially "veto" Emmert as well.
Personally, those are all excellent reasons that I'd support Emmer, but realistically, the House MAGA's likely would follow Trump's marching orders and "veto" Emmert just like they vetoed McCarthy and Scalise.
Of course, when the MAGA's veto a third Speaker supported by a majority, the rest of the GOP caucus is going to be even more sick of the Freedom Caucus than they already are. Another reason why I think a FC Speaker is DOA.
I'll take literally anyone who isn't FC or the pure RINO "Problem Solvers Caucus". That still leaves 160 or so who'd be fine.
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Ever heard that saying “half a loaf is better than no bread?” You are not going to elect right wingers in most districts. There are just tons of people in the northeast, on the west coast, and cities in between. Either we welcome squishes into the coalition, or the dems will happily lord over us for all eternity.
Truth.
The other truth is that a lot of those RINOs will actually support some conservative legislation if they believe it can pass, and that it will have the support of enough of their voters. That's why the RINO's jumped on board with the Contract with America. So it is possible.
But those conditions do not exist when you have this narrow a majority in only one house of Congress, and the Democrats control everything else. The RINO's are not going to be willing to endure a long shutdown where Republicans look like a minority trying to impose their view on a majority.
The way to turn the country in a more conservative direction is to win more House seats to increase the margin, and then win either the Senate or Presidency, preferably both. And even that only works if the Republican President you elects believes in fiscal restraint.
Unfortunately, the odds of that happening in 2024 look vanishingly small. And changing Speakers won't make a damn bit of difference in the face of those underlying dynamics.
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unusual_whales
@unusual_whales
Kevin Hern has a tendency of buying military companies before news. For example, Rep. Kevin Hern bought Lockheed Martin stocks back in August 2021. He bought another $100k in $LMT just 2 weeks before Lockheed Martin won the $10.9 billion Air Force contract.
2:56 PM · Oct 20, 2023
No thanks. I don't want another Pelosi or Feinstein. Unfettered corruption is got us where we are now. If one of us was doing what Hern does (insider trading), we would be in prison.
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Also, he has consistently voted against aid to Ukraine, so the implication of saying that he "profits from war" is misleading as hell.
Money for Ukraine isn't going to defense contractors.
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Problem we have is that there is not a clear cut, acceptable, honorable leader of the Republican Party right now. It is a torn sailed, rudderless hot mess.
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Ever heard that saying “half a loaf is better than no bread?”
Ever heard that saying "keep putting the same Establishment bastards in power, keep getting the same results"?
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Problem we have is that there is not a clear cut, acceptable, honorable leader of the Republican Party right now. It is a torn sailed, rudderless hot mess.
Sure we do. It's just that there are so few Republicans in Congress who want that honorable leader. Like you said, torn and rudderless. And most of all, corrupt.
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Truth.
The other truth is that a lot of those RINOs will actually support some conservative legislation if they believe it can pass, and that it will have the support of enough of their voters. That's why the RINO's jumped on board with the Contract with America. So it is possible.
But those conditions do not exist when you have this narrow a majority in only one house of Congress, and the Democrats control everything else. The RINO's are not going to be willing to endure a long shutdown where Republicans look like a minority trying to impose their view on a majority.
The way to turn the country in a more conservative direction is to win more House seats to increase the margin, and then win either the Senate or Presidency, preferably both. And even that only works if the Republican President you elects believes in fiscal restraint.
Unfortunately, the odds of that happening in 2024 look vanishingly small. And changing Speakers won't make a damn bit of difference in the face of those underlying dynamics.
That is the hard truth that a lot of people here and also on talk radio along with people on Social media refused to acknowledge!
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Sure we do. It's just that there are so few Republicans in Congress who want that honorable leader. Like you said, torn and rudderless. And most of all, corrupt.
That's pretty much it. They are trying to smokescreen this by blaming Gaetz and trying to get him back when they stand on zero principles other than keeping the train rolling.
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That's pretty much it. They are trying to smokescreen this by blaming Gaetz and trying to get him back when they stand on zero principles other than keeping the train rolling.
:bingo:
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The other truth is that a lot of those RINOs will actually support some conservative legislation if they believe it can pass, and that it will have the support of enough of their voters. That's why the RINO's jumped on board with the Contract with America. So it is possible.
Republicans jumped on board with the Contract With America because it was the first time they had tasted power in almost 40 years. But once they realized it required hard work, they began longing for their minority status again where they got to collect the perks without actually having to do anything. The bottom line is that Republicans don't want to lead. It is simply not in their nature. Which is why we continue getting a CR year after year after year. And why we are now over $30 trillion in debt.
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In the race to be Speaker, Jim Jordan learns Trump tactics only work for Trump
BY KEITH NAUGHTON, OPINION CONTRIBUTOR - 10/20/23 4:00 PM ET
Intimidation, backstabbing and flaunting the will of the majority are all tactics that Donald Trump has used expertly to dominate the Republican Party. Wannabe House Speaker Jim Jordan has tried the same gameplan, only to find out that he’s no Trump. It took three failed ballots for that reality to sink in for Jordan and his fuming, fumbling allies.
It was not so long ago the GOP House caucus voted to elect Steve Scalise to be Speaker, defeating Jordan by a clear, but not overwhelming, margin of 113 to 99. At that point, regardless of the outcome on the House floor, Jordan should have been disqualified for the job. He lost, end of story. If Scalise could not get a majority before the full chamber, then Republicans should have ruled out Scalise and Jordan.
But Jordan and his henchmen (and women) had another plan. A sliver of caucus members announced they would not vote for Scalise, tanking his candidacy. While Jordan did publicly support Scalise, it did not sway the gaggle of holdouts.
After over 30 years working in, observing and analyzing politics, you learn a thing or two about the public pronouncements of ambitious politicians — namely, don’t trust them, ever. I have no doubt that Jim Jordan’s public endorsement was a complete sham. In my opinion, he plotted with his allies to block a Scalise win, planning to then bulldoze any opposition on his way to the Speaker’s chair.
It’s the Trump playbook: do whatever it takes to undermine your opponent and then play a game of chicken, forcing the other guy to duck. But Jordan is not Trump. Jordan does not have the charisma and feel for the room Trump has. Worse, Jordan does not have Trump’s power — which means his game of chicken simply won’t work.
<..snip..>
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/4267204-in-the-race-to-be-speaker-jim-jordan-learns-trump-tactics-only-work-for-trump/ (https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/4267204-in-the-race-to-be-speaker-jim-jordan-learns-trump-tactics-only-work-for-trump/)
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Not agreeing with that, @corbe
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Not agreeing with that, @corbe
I didn't either @Hoodat but I thought it interesting enough to share, even though it is The Swill.
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I didn't either @Hoodat but I thought it interesting enough to share, even though it is The Swill.
Jordan as some Machiavellian type trying to seize power by any means necessary while voting for McCarthy/Scalise on every single vote? Yeah, right.
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https://twitter.com/JoeyMannarinoUS/status/1715548205495054457
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https://twitter.com/RepThomasMassie/status/1715760152979087748
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https://twitter.com/JoeyMannarinoUS/status/1715548205495054457
A "Cum Dumpster"?
Maybe the most apt and accurate description of her yet.
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https://twitter.com/Chis4truBot/status/1715754515213729792
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Ever heard that saying "keep putting the same Establishment bastards in power, keep getting the same results"?
:amen:
I think a lot of these Establishment Loyalists will have a harder time getting re-elected if they aren't primaried. Why come out and vote for them?
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That's pretty much it. They are trying to smokescreen this by blaming Gaetz and trying to get him back when they stand on zero principles other than keeping the train rolling.
To illustrate your point, the recent closed door secret ballot had more Establishment Loyalists voting against Jordan than for Jordan, but on the House floor in Public it was only 22 that voted against Jordan. They want the base to support them, but don't want to represent the base.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F8-Vo5DXgAANAAg?format=jpg&name=900x900)
Yep. Thankfully, we were able to get rid of Tom Price (GA) when he went to work for Trump. He would have been next in line behind Scalise.
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To illustrate your point, the recent closed door secret ballot had more Establishment Loyalists voting against Jordan than for Jordan, but on the House floor in Public it was only 22 that voted against Jordan. They want the base to support them, but don't want to represent the base.
There are FAR too many people in the Party who crave Business as Usual.
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(https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/fredgraph.png?width=880&height=440&g=jdlx)
This is why we can't do business as usual anymore. At the current rate we'll be approaching half our federal receipts being eaten up by interest in roughly another 3 or 4 years. That's if the economy doesn't take a crap and the interest payments trend doesn't accelerate.
Does anyone really think the world is going to fund us when deficits are 2 or 3 times our income? There are no more half loafs or putting up with smooth, slick suit, glad handing, back slapping and helmet hair for another 40 or 50 years in some delusion belief that conservatives just need to wait in line for their time.
Make some bold moves now or it is over.
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Republicans jumped on board with the Contract With America because it was the first time they had tasted power in almost 40 years. But once they realized it required hard work, they began longing for their minority status again where they got to collect the perks without actually having to do anything. The bottom line is that Republicans don't want to lead. It is simply not in their nature. Which is why we continue getting a CR year after year after year. And why we are now over $30 trillion in debt.
I disagree with pretty much all that. I've never believed they wanted to be in the minority. They want to be in the majority. Unfortunately, so do the Democrats, so it's not that easy.
I will say that there was at least one hardline Freedom Caucus member who admitted praying for as small a GOP margin in the House as possible:
Republican congressman admits he 'was praying' for 'small' GOP House majority before 2022 midterm elections
×
A Republican congressman and member of the conservative House Freedom Caucus admitted last week he "was praying" the GOP would win just a "small" majority in the House of Representatives ahead of the 2022 midterm elections in order to shift the party further to the right, according to video obtained Monday by Fox News Digital.
"When a lot of people, unfortunately, were voting, to have a 270, 280 Republican House, I was praying each evening for a small majority, because I recognize that that small majority was the only way that we were going to advance a conservative agenda," Rep. Matt Rosendale, R-Mont., said during a closed briefing, which The Messenger first reported was "a virtual briefing for around 50 top conservative donors."
"If it was the right majority, that if we had six or seven very strong individuals, we would drag the conference over to the right," he added.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/republican-congressman-admits-praying-small-gop-house-majority-2022-midterm-elections
But that's not RINO's refusing to lead - that's a conservative attaching more importance to controlling the caucus than to passing actual legislation.
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This is why we can't do business as usual anymore. At the current rate we'll be approaching half our federal receipts being eaten up by interest in roughly another 3 or 4 years. That's if the economy doesn't take a crap and the interest payments trend doesn't accelerate.
. . .
Make some bold moves now or it is over.
I would like to see any of these schmucks explain how the things they spent borrowed money on ten years ago were so crucial back then to justify the hundreds of billions of dollars in interest payments we are paying on that money now.
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But that's not RINO's refusing to lead - that's a conservative attaching more importance to controlling the caucus than to passing actual legislation.
Totally reject your conclusions. The whole point of dragging things to the right was to hold the moderates feet to the fire on legislation, like the budget, which they tried to do but were basically flouted.
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I disagree with pretty much all that. I've never believed they wanted to be in the minority. They want to be in the majority.
They may say that. But they don't act like it. Again and again, they have forfeited power through sheer cowardice and inaction. Looking back on it, Paul Ryan and John Boehner were the two best Speakers the Democrats ever had. This all started in 2006 when the GOP controlled the White House, House, and Senate. And they couldn't get a damn thing done. If they had reformed Social Security, Republicans would have won every election for the next 20 years. But no, couldn't rock the boat. Had to do what leadership said. Didn't want to offend anyone.
But that's not RINO's refusing to lead - that's a conservative attaching more importance to controlling the caucus than to passing actual legislation.
Uh, no. Conservatives want Conservative legislation. Period. They could care less who is doing it. McCarthy could have been that guy. But he knew up front he was lying to all the Conservatives. He basically sabotaged them all with his August recess.
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But no, couldn't rock the boat. Had to do what leadership said. Didn't want to offend anyone.
Republican Reps want Democrats to be in charge. Always have. Always do.
Then they can slink back to the shadows, do nothing, and collect their grift out of sight.
Nobody was more disappointed with a Republican majority than Republicans.
So now they are fixing that mistake of circumstance.
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Totally reject your conclusions. The whole point of dragging things to the right was to hold the moderates feet to the fire on legislation, like the budget, which they tried to do but were basically flouted.
:yowsa: pointing-up
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Totally reject your conclusions. The whole point of dragging things to the right was to hold the moderates feet to the fire on legislation, like the budget, which they tried to do but were basically flouted.
I think you just proved my point.
They forced 15 votes for the Speaker in January, and then sank the Speaker in October. That's the "controlling the caucus" part I mentioned. Yay - good for them. Except we still don't have a Speaker and the FC candidate was rejected, so....
Then as you noted, they failed to have any positive impact on legislation. Their biggest "achievement" was forcing the rejection of the CR with 8% cuts and giving us a CR with no cuts instead. So a step backwards there.
I could not care less about their intentions, motives, how much they "care" -- that's all crap. I care about the results of their actions. The rest is just excuses.
They are paid to understand the political dynamics within the GOP caucus, and within Congress as a whole. It is their job to know how others are likely to react to what they do. So saying "we did the right thing and it was what others did in reaction that screwed it up" is a crap excuse. They are responsible for the logical and predictable consequences of what they do, and there is nothing that has happened that was not predictable.
They deserve to be judged by their results, and their results suck.
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I think you just proved my point.
They forced 15 votes for the Speaker in January, and then sank the Speaker in October.
On the 15th vote, they voted for Kevin McCarthy who promised to restore the 12-bill process for appropriations as well as agreed to subject himself to removal if he broke his promise.
In September, Kevin McCarthy broke several of the promises he had made in January before becoming Speaker. The following month, he was removed per the rules he had put in place.
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On the 15th vote, they voted for Kevin McCarthy who promised to restore the 12-bill process for appropriations as well as agreed to subject himself to removal if he broke his promise.
In September, Kevin McCarthy broke several of the promises he had made in January before becoming Speaker. The following month, he was removed per the rules he had put in place.
I disagree, but rather than debate that...what is the positive result of all they have done? What legislation can you point to showing how we are now better off than we would be if Gaetz, Resendale, etc., had not done what we did?
Because I think we're worse off because of them.
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I disagree,
Disagree all you want, but what I said is 100% accurate.
but rather than debate that...what is the positive result of all they have done?
Got rid of a business-as-usual Establishment pr*ck as Speaker.
What legislation can you point to showing how we are now better off than we would be if Gaetz, Resendale, etc., had not done what we did?
So far, no legislation at all is better than what we were getting. Would have been nice to have gotten rid of McCarthy at the end of July instead. Maybe then we could have gotten the 12 appropriations bills passed. But your Establishment hero made sure that didn't happen. So at this point, it is completely disingenuous to shift blame on Conservatives for not getting any legislation passed since you know damn well they aren't in charge. McCarthy knew the stakes. He agreed to those stakes. He made his choice. And this is the consequence of McCarthy's choice. Maybe you should be blaming him instead of being fearful of another CR not getting passed.
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Well, here it is.
Trumpland influencer Joey Mannarino has now endorsed Hakeem Jeffries.
https://twitter.com/JoeyMannarinoUS/status/1715819274697056721
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Well, here it is.
Trumpland influencer Joey Mannarino has now endorsed Hakeem Jeffries.
https://twitter.com/JoeyMannarinoUS/status/1715819274697056721
The House is riddled with RINO's and those that back Trump. I don't think in essence Trump is supporting Jeffries via Joey.
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
I’d rather have Hakeem Jeffries than Tom Emmer as Speaker.
I wholeheartedly mean that.
At least with Jeffries, we know he hates me and wants to ruin me.
He won’t pretend otherwise.
Republicans won’t pretend that he’s on their side.
Emmer is as bad as Jeffries but has that R next to his name, so it gives the establishment cover to run a train on our country’s sovereignty but do it with a “conservative” twist.
If you’re going to piss in my face, whip it out and piss on me like you’re R. Kelly. That’s what Hakeem would do.
Emmer would wait until I’m sleeping, piss on me and then tell me it was raining.
No way in hell.
Thank God we have another choice in Byron Donalds. He’s the way forward here.
Well, he's right.
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Sean Moran22 Oct 202312
Texas conservative John O’Shea said on Breitbart News Saturday that House Appropriations Committee Chair Kay Granger (R-TX) was the “matriarch” of the Republican opposition to Rep. Jim Jordan’s (R-OH) bid for Speaker of the House.
O’Shea spoke to Breitbart News Saturday host Matthew Boyle as 25 House “Republicans” blocked House Judiciary Committee Chairman Jordan’s Speakership bid.
Granger was one of the more prominent members to oppose Jordan, the Republican Speaker nominee, as she serves as the chairwoman of the House Appropriations Committee.
O’Shea — a businessman who hopes to primary Granger — said that Granger represents “what is wrong with the country.”
He explained, “We have a ruling class of political professional politicians and this oligarchy does not care about their constituents.”
O’Shea added, “What does Kay do? Does she listen to her constituents, no. She goes her own path as the chairwoman of appropriations, never meeting a spending bill that she does not love. She decided to be the matriarch of the opposition.”
Granger’s Appropriations Committee represents a strong core of opposition to Jordan’s Speakership bid, as seven of the 25 House Republicans against the Ohio Republican are members of the committee.
This includes:
Granger
Rep. Steve Womack (R-AR)
Rep. Mario Díaz-Balart (R-FL)
Rep. Jake Ellzey (R-TX)
Rep. Tony Gonzales (R-TX)
Rep. John Rutherford (R-FL)
Rep. Mike Simpson (R-ID)
Granger’s opposition to Jordan incensed Rep. Jim Banks (R-IN) so much that he called to remove Granger as the committee chair.
“Kay Granger doesn’t deserve to be chairwoman of the Appropriations Committee. She’s blocking the most fiscally conservative choice we’ve ever had to be the Speaker of the House. And she should lose her gavel for that,” Banks told Breitbart News’s Bradley Jaye.
https://www.breitbart.com/radio/2023/10/22/exclusive-texas-republican-john-oshea-kay-granger-matriarch-opposition-jim-jordan-speakership-bid/
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Sean Moran22 Oct 202312
Texas conservative John O’Shea said on Breitbart News Saturday that House Appropriations Committee Chair Kay Granger (R-TX) was the “matriarch” of the Republican opposition to Rep. Jim Jordan’s (R-OH) bid for Speaker of the House.
O’Shea spoke to Breitbart News Saturday host Matthew Boyle as 25 House “Republicans” blocked House Judiciary Committee Chairman Jordan’s Speakership bid.
Granger was one of the more prominent members to oppose Jordan, the Republican Speaker nominee, as she serves as the chairwoman of the House Appropriations Committee.
O’Shea — a businessman who hopes to primary Granger — said that Granger represents “what is wrong with the country.”
He explained, “We have a ruling class of political professional politicians and this oligarchy does not care about their constituents.”
O’Shea added, “What does Kay do? Does she listen to her constituents, no. She goes her own path as the chairwoman of appropriations, never meeting a spending bill that she does not love. She decided to be the matriarch of the opposition.”
Granger’s Appropriations Committee represents a strong core of opposition to Jordan’s Speakership bid, as seven of the 25 House Republicans against the Ohio Republican are members of the committee.
This includes:
Granger
Rep. Steve Womack (R-AR)
Rep. Mario Díaz-Balart (R-FL)
Rep. Jake Ellzey (R-TX)
Rep. Tony Gonzales (R-TX)
Rep. John Rutherford (R-FL)
Rep. Mike Simpson (R-ID)
Granger’s opposition to Jordan incensed Rep. Jim Banks (R-IN) so much that he called to remove Granger as the committee chair.
“Kay Granger doesn’t deserve to be chairwoman of the Appropriations Committee. She’s blocking the most fiscally conservative choice we’ve ever had to be the Speaker of the House. And she should lose her gavel for that,” Banks told Breitbart News’s Bradley Jaye.
https://www.breitbart.com/radio/2023/10/22/exclusive-texas-republican-john-oshea-kay-granger-matriarch-opposition-jim-jordan-speakership-bid/
This shows the issue isn't about any social legislation. The problem rests with the Establishment Loyalists who like things just as they are. They don't want anyone bringing the budget process out into the open where there would be debate and plenty of questions raised. They love the backroom deals with lobbyists, to hell with the country.
FWI, the budget deficit this year is in excess of 1.7 TRILLION dollars. Interest on the debt this year will exceed the defense budget as the short term bonds at near 0% start to roll over. I can see these people on the appropriations committee have been doing such a good job they should all be retained and given raises! /s
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
I’d rather have Hakeem Jeffries than Tom Emmer as Speaker.
I wholeheartedly mean that.
At least with Jeffries, we know he hates me and wants to ruin me.
Who is Joey Mannarino, and why should any of us care if Hakeem Jeffries wants to ruin him?
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Who is Joey Mannarino, and why should any of us care if Hakeem Jeffries wants to ruin him?
Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
I help conservative candidates win elections and raise money | Social Media Strategist | Podcast Host: “The Joey Mannarino Show” | Italian-American
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This shows the issue isn't about any social legislation. The problem rests with the Establishment Loyalists who like things just as they are. They don't want anyone bringing the budget process out into the open where there would be debate and plenty of questions raised. They love the backroom deals with lobbyists, to hell with the country.
FWI, the budget deficit this year is in excess of 1.7 TRILLION dollars. Interest on the debt this year will exceed the defense budget as the short term bonds at near 0% start to roll over. I can see these people on the appropriations committee have been doing such a good job they should all be retained and given raises! /s
Correct on all counts.
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Joey Mannarino
@JoeyMannarinoUS
I help conservative candidates win elections and raise money | Social Media Strategist | Podcast Host: “The Joey Mannarino Show” | Italian-American
So he's just...some guy? Sorry, but the fact that Hakeem Jeffries doesn't like him doesn't register on my "Give a Sh*t" meter.
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This shows the issue isn't about any social legislation. The problem rests with the Establishment Loyalists who like things just as they are. They don't want anyone bringing the budget process out into the open where there would be debate and plenty of questions raised. They love the backroom deals with lobbyists, to hell with the country.
4 of the appropriations bill have been passed by the House, so those were certainly "in the open". The agriculture bill went to a floor vote but some RINO's didn't like the cuts so they voted against it with the Dems. But they're all at least on the record. So that's 5.
https://crsreports.congress.gov/AppropriationsStatusTable/
For the rest, I don't think it's that they're afraid of debate and having things in the open. They simply don't agree on the numbers.
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This shows the issue isn't about any social legislation. The problem rests with the Establishment Loyalists who like things just as they are. They don't want anyone bringing the budget process out into the open where there would be debate and plenty of questions raised. They love the backroom deals with lobbyists, to hell with the country.
FWI, the budget deficit this year is in excess of 1.7 TRILLION dollars. Interest on the debt this year will exceed the defense budget as the short term bonds at near 0% start to roll over. I can see these people on the appropriations committee have been doing such a good job they should all be retained and given raises! /s
I think folks just skim by numbers like that... too big to comprehend... That $1.7T in interest alone is approaching a third of every dollar this country - The WHOLE COUNTRY now - makes in a year.
Let that sink in.
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I think folks just skim by numbers like that... too big to comprehend... That $1.7T in interest alone is approaching a third of every dollar this country - The WHOLE COUNTRY now - makes in a year.
Let that sink in.
And as it rises it will be a cash flow crunch as buyers refuse to show up and bond auctions, or they will require a steep risk premium, which will spike interest costs even faster in a vicious cycle till the music stops and we are Venezuela.
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I think folks just skim by numbers like that... too big to comprehend... That $1.7T in interest alone is approaching a third of every dollar this country - The WHOLE COUNTRY now - makes in a year.
Let that sink in.
The US GDP for 2022 was 25.462 trillion dollars. So that $1.7T is about 6.7% of what the country produces each year. Still bad, but definitely not a third of our annual GDP.
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And as it rises it will be a cash flow crunch as buyers refuse to show up and bond auctions, or they will require a steep risk premium, which will spike interest costs even faster in a vicious cycle till the music stops and we are Venezuela.
The worst thing about all this is that who controls the House won't make a damn bit of difference if we elect a big-spending Republican as President.
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The worst thing about all this is that who controls the House won't make a damn bit of difference if we elect a big-spending Republican as President.
This is inside out and upside down. A Uniparty controlled legislature renders a president nearly moot on spending --- including his veto power.
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Got rid of a business-as-usual Establishment pr*ck as Speaker.
In other words...nothing. I mean, changing Speakers in itself doesn't change legislation one bit. After all, Jordan also was going to support CR's, which was one of the reasons cited for getting rid of McCarthy. So what's the bottom line difference in terms of actual legislation, or other concrete achievements?
Obviously, we can't even begin to answer that question yet because we don't yet know who the new Speaker will be. But here's my guess - the RINO's are going to be much more willing to side with Democrats and not care what conservatives say than they were before all this went down.
So far, no legislation at all is better than what we were getting.
How so? The continuing resolution passed earlier is still in effect until mid-November, so nothing has been shut down. We also have done absolutely nothing to advance individual appropriations bills since this all started. That makes it much more likely we'll be passing another CR when this one runs out.
So how are we better off?
McCarthy knew the stakes. He agreed to those stakes. He made his choice. And this is the consequence of McCarthy's choice.
The alternative was not electing a Speaker at all. McCarthy was absolutely correct to make those promises even if he wasn't sure he could deliver because those promises should never have been required to buy votes in the first place. Gaetz and Co should have voted for McCarthy on the floor because he was the choice of the overwhelming majority of Republican delegates. For them to withhold their votes unless their views and allies got preferential treatment is what broke the House in he first place.
Also, there isn't agreement that McCarthy broke promises. From what I've read, he didn't promise that 12 appropriations bills would actually pass. That was beyond his power and everyone knew it. He promised that he'd get them to the floor, and at least one of them - the agricultural bill - made it to the floor but was voted down. How is it fair to hold him responsible for that?
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This is inside out and upside down. A Uniparty controlled legislature renders a president nearly moot on spending --- including his veto power.
Trump himself has come out against any entitlement reform, which takes most of the budget off the table at the jump. There is zero chance any entitlement reform could be passed over the veto of a GOP President. Zero.
You have openly mocked calls for cutting back spending significantly as fiscal conservatives being "stuck in the 80's."
It's disingenuous for you to push for a fiscal conservatism among Congress while rejecting it when it comes to your support of Trump.
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It's disingenuous for you to push for a fiscal conservatism among Congress while rejecting it when it comes to your support of Trump.
I'm simply trying to educate you on how our system of government works and who controls the purse strings ---- it's Congress.
As long as your beloved Uniparty controls the legislature, nothing will change. You calling for fiscal conservatism while protecting and rallying for the Uniparty's power is, IMO, the very definition of "disingenuous".
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That's pretty much it. They are trying to smokescreen this by blaming Gaetz and trying to get him back when they stand on zero principles other than keeping the train rolling.
888high58888
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DC_Draino
@DC_Draino
People forget that Kevin McCarthy put tens of millions of dollars into GOP primaries attacking MAGA candidates
When they survived his onslaught, he left them high and dry during the general and many lost close races
We could’v easily had a 20-30 seat cushion if popular MAGA candidates were supported
Some blame Trump for our tiny House majority
But it was Kevin using GOP funds to damage MAGA and boost unlikable establishment candidates
Raheem.
@RaheemKassam
·19h
Kevin McCarthy and Tom Emmer’s refusal to back MAGA congressional candidates is the reason they have a shitty majority. Yet somehow these two clowns feel entitled to lead their party? The GOP will not be considered serious until they dispose of these goons.
1:19 PM · Oct 22, 2023
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Scott Adams
@ScottAdamsSays
Don't blame @mattgaetz for breaking something that was already broken.
8:57 AM · Oct 22, 2023
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Scott Adams
@ScottAdamsSays
I'd like to thank @mattgaetz for doing the only useful thing that happened in Congress lately. Since removing the Speaker, Congress has not given away any of my money to people I don't want to have it.
It's progress. Let's keep it going.
9:21 AM · Oct 23, 2023
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1:19 PM · Oct 22, 2023
Meanwhile, the Murder Turtle was doing the exact same thing in the Senate.
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I'm simply trying to educate you on how our system of government works and who controls the purse strings ---- it's Congress.
No, that's not what you're doing. You're trying to deflect from your history of openly ridiculing efforts to reform entitlements, and from your support of Trump attacking anyone who raises it.
Entitlement reform cannot pass without support from the President. That is a political reality that you are trying to ignore so you can support the contradictory positions of supporting Trump's attacks on those who want entitlement reform, while claiming that you support entitlement reform. It's absurd. I suppose it is equally absurd for pro-Trump members of Congress to endorse him while also demanding entitlement reform. Pure cognitive dissonance.
As long as your beloved Uniparty controls the legislature, nothing will change. You calling for fiscal conservatism while protecting and rallying for the Uniparty's power is, IMO, the very definition of "disingenuous".
First, I'm not defending the Uniparty. I'm defending the process of supporting whomever wins the most votes in caucus, because the alternative is untenable. If Jordan had won in January, I'd have been thrilled, and pissed at any RINO's who tried to extract concessions from him. As would everyone here.
I'd point out once again that it was McCarthy who pushed a bill that cut 8% from everything except veterans and defense, and added border security, and alleged conservatives who killed it.
It is not the Speaker who determines which legislation passes, but rather the individual members casting their votes. Rather than focusing on the Speaker, the focus should be on "how do we get the RINOs to support the most conservative bill possible." Pissing them off by removing with 8 votes a Speaker who got 210 GOP votes is not the way to do that. All Gaetz & Co. did was piss off the one voting bloc conservatives absolutely must have to pass better legislation.
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DC_Draino
@DC_Draino
People forget that Kevin McCarthy put tens of millions of dollars into GOP primaries attacking MAGA candidates
When they survived his onslaught, he left them high and dry during the general and many lost close races
We could’v easily had a 20-30 seat cushion if popular MAGA candidates were supported
Some blame Trump for our tiny House majority
But it was Kevin using GOP funds to damage MAGA and boost unlikable establishment candidates
Raheem.
@RaheemKassam
·19h
Kevin McCarthy and Tom Emmer’s refusal to back MAGA congressional candidates is the reason they have a shitty majority. Yet somehow these two clowns feel entitled to lead their party? The GOP will not be considered serious until they dispose of these goons.
Both are EXACTLY right and when you add in what Mitch the bitch has done to conservative senate candidates the REAL picture emerges!
Those clowns are exactly why I only donate to candidates I personally choose now.
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Both are EXACTLY right and when you add in what Mitch the bitch has done to conservative senate candidates the REAL picture emerges!
Those clowns are exactly why I only donate to candidates I personally choose now.
Ha! Freaking Mega-MAGA Representative Matt Rosendale (Moron, Montana) is on record saying that he wanted as small a GOP majority as possible to give maximum leverage to a small group of conservatives. If it's anyone who didn't want a bigger majority, it was them.
I also think it is absurd to claim that we lost races in swing districts because our candidates weren't MAGA enough.
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Ha! Freaking Mega-MAGA Representative Matt Rosendale (Moron, Montana) is on record saying that he wanted as small a GOP majority as possible to give maximum leverage to a small group of conservatives. If it's anyone who didn't want a bigger majority, it was them.
I also think it is absurd to claim that we lost races in swing districts because our candidates weren't MAGA enough.
But that isn't what I said is it? What I DID say is that we've lost MANY winnable races because the clowns I referred to CUT OFF THEIR CAMPAIGN $$$ because THEY don't want conservatives in either body!
The people I mentioned would much prefer a left-wing democrat fill a seat over a conservative. They insist on is business as usual and will accept nothing else.
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First, I'm not defending the Uniparty. I'm defending the process of supporting whomever wins the most votes in caucus, because the alternative is untenable.
In this battle, it's a difference without a distinction. You're simply throwing colorful sprinkles on your fight for the Uniparty.
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As long as your beloved Uniparty controls the legislature, nothing will change. You calling for fiscal conservatism while protecting and rallying for the Uniparty's power is, IMO, the very definition of "disingenuous".
In other words, electing Trump won't make any difference. So why vote for him?
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Trump will make a difference ... more votes for Dems.
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But that isn't what I said is it? What I DID say is that we've lost MANY winnable races because the clowns I referred to CUT OFF THEIR CAMPAIGN $$$ because THEY don't want conservatives in either body!
Where's the evidence of that? Because from what I've read, McCarthy maxed out on supporting a lot of the people who have been lining up against him. Here's some data:
McCarthy’s political operation spent millions on lawmakers now opposing his speaker dreams
The GOP leader’s PAC donated directly to many, and the super PAC aligned with McCarthy spent heavily backing several rebels in past battleground races.
In the 2022 election cycle alone, political groups affiliated with Rep. Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) spent over $1 million supporting Republican representatives who have now voted against him for speaker, according to a review of federal campaign finance records.
Of the 20 Republicans who voted for someone other than McCarthy — leaving the House in deadlock — 14 received a total of $120,000 in contributions from McCarthy’s leadership PAC, the Majority Committee, the filings show. That includes Reps. Dan Bishop (N.C.), Michael Cloud (Texas), Andrew Clyde (Ga.), Byron Donalds (Fla.), Bob Good (Va.), Andy Harris (Md.), Ralph Norman (S.C.), Scott Perry (Pa.) and Matt Rosendale (Mont.), along with incoming freshmen Anna Paulina Luna (Fla.), Josh Brecheen (Okla.), Andy Ogles (Tenn.), Eli Crane (Ariz.) and Keith Self (Texas).
The donations were among hundreds McCarthy spread around to the Republican conference and GOP challengers as he sought to help Republicans win the House majority in 2021 and 2022. Most candidates received the maximum $10,000 — $5,000 each for the primary and the general election — although a few only got support for the general election.
Reps. Andy Biggs (Ariz.), Lauren Boebert (Colo.), Matt Gaetz (Fla.), Paul Gosar (Ariz.), Mary Miller (Ill.) and Chip Roy (Texas) did not receive any contributions from McCarthy’s PAC in the last election cycle, although some have benefited from the political operation in the past. Most of the incumbents — with the exception of Boebert, whose contest went to an automatic recount due to its surprisingly close margin — faced easy paths to reelection in the midterms.
“This is not personal,” Roy said on the House floor on Tuesday.
In addition to McCarthy’s leadership PAC, the McCarthy-aligned House GOP super PAC, Congressional Leadership Fund, also threw its support behind some of the lawmakers who are now spoiling his speaker bid. Crane received $10,000 in contributions from CLF during both the primary and general election. Harris and Self each received $5,000 during their primary and general elections, respectively.
CLF didn’t just donate to Crane, however. The super PAC also spent over $900,000 on ads in support of him as he challenged incumbent Democratic Rep. Tom O’Halleran in Arizona’s 2nd District. Crane, a political newcomer backed by former President Donald Trump, went on to beat O’Halleran, who was one of the most vulnerable House Democrats in 2022 due to redistricting, by about 8 points.
One TV spot touted that Crane would “stand up to [President Joe] Biden and stop the spending.”
First, though, Crane is standing up to McCarthy.
As the main House Republican super PAC, CLF has spent heavily in previous elections bolstering other Republicans who are now playing the role of anti-McCarthy rebels. In 2020, the super PAC poured over $1.5 million into Perry’s race in Pennsylvania, targeting Democratic opponent Eugene DePasquale. It also spent $1.8 million opposing Democrat Cameron Webb, who was Good’s opponent in central Virginia. Perry won his election by 12 points, but it was a closer race for Good, who won by 5 points....
https://www.politico.com/news/2023/01/04/mccarthy-political-action-committee-opposition-00076377
Obviously, you can't spend max money in every race because funds are limited, but the idea that he didn't support conservatives appears false.
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In other words, electing Trump won't make any difference. So why vote for him?
We're talking about the importance of a MAGA Congress here. President Trump is the lynchpin.
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We're talking about the importance of a MAGA Congress here. President Trump is the lynchpin.
A MAGA Congress that believes in the same things in Trump is just doubling down on fiscal stupidity.
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My only comment on this fiasco at this point is...
These yahoos need to stay there until there is a resolution. No recesses. Period. End of story.
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A MAGA Congress that believes in the same things in Trump is just doubling down on fiscal stupidity.
:thumbsup:
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A MAGA Congress that believes in the same things in Trump is just doubling down on fiscal stupidity.
:facepalm2:
Who the hell do you think Gaetz ---- fighting for fiscal sanity in the House ---- aligns with? Maybe it's time you consider buying a vowel ----- actually, give some consideration to buying all five.
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:facepalm2:
Who the hell do you think Gaetz ---- fighting for fiscal sanity in the House ---- aligns with? Maybe it's time you consider buying a vowel ----- actually, give some consideration to buying all five.
Which only goes to show there isn't a single soul in that swamp that actually wants to drain it. It's all sport. Whose team are you on, who are you against. The few that do seem to care seem to care about the wrong things and want to make things worse.
And the voters who put them there are to blame.
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:facepalm2:
Who the hell do you think Gaetz ---- fighting for fiscal sanity in the House ---- aligns with? Maybe it's time you consider buying a vowel ----- actually, give some consideration to buying all five.
:mauslaff:
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Who the hell do you think Gaetz ---- fighting for fiscal sanity in the House ---- aligns with?
1) I don't believe Gaetz is actually fighting for fiscal sanity
2) I believe that he aligns only with himself and his own interests. Everything he says or does is aligned to advance his own political future, and that's it.
It's amusing to watch you ignoring the contradiction between your Trumpian declarations on the absurdity of entitlement reform, and you arguing for fiscal restraint by Congress.
So which is it? Should Republicans be pushing entitlement reform, or not?
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We're talking about the importance of a MAGA Congress here. President Trump is the lynchpin.
Trump is the reason why a GOP takeover in the Senate failed and why their hold over the House is so tenuous. Trump killed the red wave.
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:facepalm2:
Who the hell do you think Gaetz ---- fighting for fiscal sanity in the House ---- aligns with? Maybe it's time you consider buying a vowel ----- actually, give some consideration to buying all five.
Didn't Gaetz just depose Trump's pick for Speaker?
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The US GDP for 2022 was 25.462 trillion dollars. So that $1.7T is about 6.7% of what the country produces each year. Still bad, but definitely not a third of our annual GDP.
My some-timers kicking in... Somehow I get stuck in the early 2ks... Do the same with prices.
I stand corrected. Thank you.
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1) I don't believe Gaetz is actually fighting for fiscal sanity
2) I believe that he aligns only with himself and his own interests. Everything he says or does is aligned to advance his own political future, and that's it.
It's amusing to watch you ignoring the contradiction between your Trumpian declarations on the absurdity of entitlement reform, and you arguing for fiscal restraint by Congress.
So which is it? Should Republicans be pushing entitlement reform, or not?
If you truly believe that, you haven't been paying attention.
The only other possibility is you are so infected with TDS that you immediately reject anything a MAGA-America First Pub says and does.
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Which only goes to show there isn't a single soul in that swamp that actually wants to drain it. It's all sport. Whose team are you on, who are you against. The few that do seem to care seem to care about the wrong things and want to make things worse.
And the voters who put them there are to blame.
Actually, I think there are a lot of them who want to do what we consider is the "right thing". The problem is that there also are a lot of folks on the other side whose "right thing" is the exact opposite of ours. So it's hard to get a majority. Then, when you factor in those who really don't want to do the right thing, and the disagreement in tactics among those who do...it's tough.
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If you truly believe that, you haven't been paying attention.
Politicians say all sorts of crap to get elected, appeal to a target constituency, etc.. So I prefer to focus on the results of what they do, rather than the words or basic actions. I don't see anything Gaetz has done as likely to lead to more conservative results. More likely the opposite because he's fractured the only opposition to an even more rapid slide into leftism.
It's not that I think he's a leftist. I just think he's a...Gaetzist. Kind of like Trump is a Trumpist. So self-absorbed that they think whatever is good for them personally is necessary good for the country.
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unusual_whales
@unusual_whales
Tom Emmer has been selected as a House Speaker Nominee.
Emmer received money from FTX and has not returned the funds. Over $2 million from one FTX Republican PAC, and $2.75 from FTX's main one. He receives PAC money from Citadel's Ken Griffin.
He also receives "dark" money.
1:42 PM · Oct 24, 2023
:shrug:
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Pete Sessions is the only one of that bunch who will champion Conservatism.
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Pete Sessions is the only one of that bunch who will champion Conservatism.
:bigsilly:
That there is PHUNNY! I don't care who you are! @Hoodat
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Like the last Presidential election? The demonized worst candidate was the best, and the projected and sworn to be best candidate was and is the worst. How many times do people need to be fooled into being the worst fools? Never moving past clueless and fool being projected as being wisdom of the Gods?
How long oh Lord?
:dumpster: :media: :dumpster:
:smokin: :smokin: :smokin:
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Like the last Presidential election? The demonized worst candidate was the best, and the projected and sworn to be best candidate was and is the worst. How many times do people need to be fooled into being the worst fools? Never moving past clueless and fool being projected as being wisdom of the Gods?
How long oh Lord?
:dumpster: :media: :dumpster:
:smokin: :smokin: :smokin:
Rapture?