The Briefing Room
General Category => Politics/Government => Topic started by: mystery-ak on March 11, 2018, 01:59:06 pm
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Flake calls for 2020 Trump primary challenger
By Julia Manchester - 03/11/18 09:52 AM EDT
Sen. Jeff Flake (R-Ariz.) called for a Republican to challenge President Trump in the 2020 election on Sunday during an interview with NBC's Chuck Todd on "Meet the Press."
"Do you think he needs to be challenged from somebody who espouses your views?" Todd asked Flake.
"Yes, I do. I do. I mean, it would be a tough go in a Republican primary. The Republican Party is the Trump party right now. But that's not to say it will stay that way," Flake said.
The retiring Arizona has long been one of Trump's chief critics in the Republican Party, often lashing out at the president for his immigration and economic policies, as well as for his bombastic rhetoric. He criticized the Trump administration when announcing he would not run again for Senate.
Flake made similar comments earlier this month, and would not rule out a 2020 challenge to Trump.
“I do think the president will have a challenge from the Republican Party, I think there should be,†Flake said. “I also think that there will be an independent challenge, particularly if the Democrats insist on putting somebody up from the far left of the party.â€
more
http://thehill.com/homenews/sunday-talk-shows/377820-flake-calls-for-2020-trump-primary-challenger (http://thehill.com/homenews/sunday-talk-shows/377820-flake-calls-for-2020-trump-primary-challenger)
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Flake calls for 2020 Trump primary challenger
By Julia Manchester - 03/11/18 09:52 AM EDT
Sen. Jeff Flake (R-Ariz.) called for a Republican to challenge President Trump in the 2020 election on Sunday during an interview with NBC's Chuck Todd on "Meet the Press."
"Do you think he needs to be challenged from somebody who espouses your views?" Todd asked Flake.
"Yes, I do. I do. I mean, it would be a tough go in a Republican primary. The Republican Party is the Trump party right now. But that's not to say it will stay that way," Flake said.
The retiring Arizona has long been one of Trump's chief critics in the Republican Party, often lashing out at the president for his immigration and economic policies, as well as for his bombastic rhetoric. He criticized the Trump administration when announcing he would not run again for Senate.
Flake made similar comments earlier this month, and would not rule out a 2020 challenge to Trump.
“I do think the president will have a challenge from the Republican Party, I think there should be,†Flake said. “I also think that there will be an independent challenge, particularly if the Democrats insist on putting somebody up from the far left of the party.â€
more
http://thehill.com/homenews/sunday-talk-shows/377820-flake-calls-for-2020-trump-primary-challenger (http://thehill.com/homenews/sunday-talk-shows/377820-flake-calls-for-2020-trump-primary-challenger)
Isn't Flake supposed to be stepping down?
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Unless the GOP scraps the winner take all primary system, Trump will be as hard to stop in 2020 as he was in 2016.
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Isn't Flake supposed to be stepping down?
I presume what the article means by "retiring." :pondering:
To Jeffie Boy, I say, "Go ahead and do it yourself." If you think "somebody" needs to do it, then stop whining, step up, man up, and get 'er done. Everybody's counting on you.
I can't wait to see what nickname Trump comes up with for a guy named "Flake."
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Unless the GOP scraps the winner take all primary system, Trump will be as hard to stop in 2020 as he was in 2016.
Until the the Electoral college ceases being "winner take all," it would be dumb to scrap WTA for the Primaries. We run Primaries to find the best candidate to win the General Election, and that means we should match the General Election rules.
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Until the the Electoral college ceases being "winner take all," it would be dumb to scrap WTA for the Primaries. We run Primaries to find the best candidate to win the General Election, and that means we should match the General Election rules.
Electoral college isn't really winner take all though, otherwise Hillary would have won.
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Flake really is a great last name for old Jeffers. The man can truly be himself.
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Electoral college isn't really winner take all though, otherwise Hillary would have won.
Only one or two states are not winner take all. The rest are Winner Take all. Hillary would have won if we had been Popular Vote wins, and that's a much different argument.
As it is, we have quite a few proportional Convention Delegate rules for the primary anyway. It's a non-issue for me. As it is, I'd like the candidates to consider a Presidential Election (Primary and General) as 50 separate elections. That's what the Founders intended, to prevent having a tiny number of population centers picking the President. I don't have to tell you how much that would suck.
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Isn't Flake supposed to be stepping down?
But, apparently, not shutting up.
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Unless the GOP scraps the winner take all primary system, Trump will be as hard to stop in 2020 as he was in 2016.
It's not WTA. Some states are, some states are proportioned, some give a certain percentage to the winner then proportion the rest.
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Only one or two states are not winner take all. The rest are Winner Take all. Hillary would have won if we had been Popular Vote wins, and that's a much different argument.
As it is, we have quite a few proportional Convention Delegate rules for the primary anyway. It's a non-issue for me. As it is, I'd like the candidates to consider a Presidential Election (Primary and General) as 50 separate elections. That's what the Founders intended, to prevent having a tiny number of population centers picking the President. I don't have to tell you how much that would suck.
Side note: if all the states proportioned the EC by congressional district, Romney would have just barely beaten Obama.
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But, apparently, not shutting up.
Flake, McMuffin, Romney and Beck are teaming up. Quattro Deseret Muchachos.
Beck's media empire, Romney's money, Flake and McMuffin for office. Romney for potus 2020.
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Side note: if all the states proportioned the EC by congressional district, Romney would have just barely beaten Obama.
That's the only proportional EC I could like.
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Flake, McMuffin, Romney and Beck are teaming up. Quattro Deseret Muchachos.
Beck's media empire, Romney's money, Flake and McMuffin for office. Romney for potus 2020.
Sounds good on paper, eh? Fortunately, the people still get a say, which is why Beck's "media empire" is a joke.
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Problem is, guys like Flake, Romney, McMullin and Kasich are heirs to the Goldwater and Kemp traditions, and that's not where the GOP is at these days.
The best bet is with an independent run, but as was noted above only if the Dems cooperate and nominate a looney leftist.
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Sounds good on paper, eh? Fortunately, the people still get a say, which is why Beck's "media empire" is a joke.
In my humble way, I too was trying to make a joke. On serious notes:
! No longer available (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3ksFQdseTc#)
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In my humble way, I too was trying to make a joke. On serious notes:
! No longer available (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3ksFQdseTc#)
Agreed, Ted.
They're called public servants for a reason.
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Professor Victor Davis Hanson on #nevertrump
! No longer available (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xg-tAjnYbk#)
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Only one or two states are not winner take all. The rest are Winner Take all. Hillary would have won if we had been Popular Vote wins, and that's a much different argument.
As it is, we have quite a few proportional Convention Delegate rules for the primary anyway. It's a non-issue for me. As it is, I'd like the candidates to consider a Presidential Election (Primary and General) as 50 separate elections. That's what the Founders intended, to prevent having a tiny number of population centers picking the President. I don't have to tell you how much that would suck.
I am not in favor of scrapping the EC. Not not not not not!
This is GOP primary only. Different issue, different implications.
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I am not in favor of scrapping the EC. Not not not not not!
This is GOP primary only. Different issue, different implications.
That reminds me of something I'd bet $$$ both of us can agree on 100%: Republican ONLY Primaries. No more Rats having a voice in who our candidates are!
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But, apparently, not shutting up.
Flake's going to be on an unstoppable free-for-all against the President through January when the new Senate term begins.
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Put your Money where your Mouth is, Jeff.
(http://static5.businessinsider.com/image/5510713869beddd750a1aaa0-2125-1594/ted-cruz.jpg?maxX=600)
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Flake's going to be on an unstoppable free-for-all against the President through January when the new Senate term begins.
I live in AZ. I look forward to that case of diarrhea of the mouth for a long time to come. After January.
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Put your Money where your Mouth is, Jeff.
(http://static5.businessinsider.com/image/5510713869beddd750a1aaa0-2125-1594/ted-cruz.jpg?maxX=600)
Flake needs to man up and stop insisting others do the dirty work.
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https://hotair.com/archives/2018/03/11/sure-sounds-like-jeff-flakes-running-president/
Sure sounds like Jeff Flake’s running for President
He’s said before that he thinks a conservative probably *will* challenge Trump in 2020 but this may be the first time he’s said a conservative *should* challenge him. And it’s not hard to guess who that challenger is likely to be. The universe of conservatives willing to primary POTUS is small, partly because the, ah, universe of conservatives is small. Within that universe, even hardcore anti-Trumpers like Ben Sasse will decline to jump in knowing that doing so would cost them their jobs. Even Mitt Romney, possibly the right’s most prominent Trump critic, is off the board now that he’s decided to focus on the Senate.
Off the top of my head, the number of conservatives with governing experience, a bit of national name recognition, contempt for Trump, and little to lose by mounting a doomed primary challenge includes Flake, Bob Corker, maaaaaybe Tom Coburn, and that’s it. And of those three, Flake clearly seems most enamored with the idea of a “battle for the soul of the Republican Party.â€
more at link
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Somebody has Flake confused with "conservative." Maybe they're using some definition of the word I'm not familiar with.
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https://hotair.com/archives/2018/03/11/sure-sounds-like-jeff-flakes-running-president/
Sure sounds like Jeff Flake’s running for President
He’s said before that he thinks a conservative probably *will* challenge Trump in 2020 but this may be the first time he’s said a conservative *should* challenge him. And it’s not hard to guess who that challenger is likely to be. The universe of conservatives willing to primary POTUS is small, partly because the, ah, universe of conservatives is small. Within that universe, even hardcore anti-Trumpers like Ben Sasse will decline to jump in knowing that doing so would cost them their jobs. Even Mitt Romney, possibly the right’s most prominent Trump critic, is off the board now that he’s decided to focus on the Senate.
Off the top of my head, the number of conservatives with governing experience, a bit of national name recognition, contempt for Trump, and little to lose by mounting a doomed primary challenge includes Flake, Bob Corker, maaaaaybe Tom Coburn, and that’s it. And of those three, Flake clearly seems most enamored with the idea of a “battle for the soul of the Republican Party.â€
more at link
There are plenty of others, such as Bill Kristol. Glen Beck. Media types. Talkers.
And they need a platform. Will it be tax increases, pipeline closings, troop withdrawals, submission to NK, more regulations?
Come on. Big ideas are needed, for "true conservative" big shots.
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Somebody has Flake confused with "conservative." Maybe they're using some definition of the word I'm not familiar with.
I've always seen Flake as both fiscally and socially conservative. Could you expand on ways in which he's not?
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There are plenty of others, such as Bill Kristol. Glen Beck. Media types. Talkers.
And they need a platform. Will it be tax increases, pipeline closings, troop withdrawals, submission to NK, more regulations?
I know we are all delusional about reality. We see the world through the blinders we construct to filter out the stuff that conflicts with what we KNOW to be real. All we really care about is what we like.
But honestly do you really think Kristol, Beck, or Flake would call for "tax increases, pipeline closings, troop withdrawals, submission to NK, more regulations?"
I do not.
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I've always seen Flake as both fiscally and socially conservative. Could you expand on ways in which he's not?
He was pushing for Amnesty for Illegals since before he was inaugurated (Gang of Eight anybody?), and voted for cloture on the last major gun-control bill. Sure-fire losers in AZ politics. He was great in Congress before that, and I was a close watcher of his because I lived in his District. I was a major supporter of his when he ran to replace Jon Kyle.
Everybody has a hot button issue, and those are two of mine because of things that have happened in my life.
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He was pushing for Amnesty for Illegals since before he was inaugurated (Gang of Eight anybody?), and voted for cloture on the last major gun-control bill. Sure-fire losers in AZ politics. He was great in Congress before that, and I was a close watcher of his because I lived in his District. I was a major supporter of his when he ran to replace Jon Kyle.
Everybody has a hot button issue, and those are two of mine because of things that have happened in my life.
@Cyber Liberty
I'm sorry you've been touched by those issues ;(. I do think DACA is a special case, and I can see a conservative supporting that limited group on the grounds of fairness and charity, both of which I think of as values shared by Conservatives. But I can understand disagreement on that point.
It does seem like he has a strong pro-life history and believes in fiscal responsibility, which I've always thought of as Conservative cornerstones.
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Maybe that's a question: what do you all see as the issues that absolutely define American Conservatism?
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Problem is, guys like Flake, Romney, McMullin and Kasich are heirs to the Goldwater and Kemp traditions, and that's not where the GOP is at these days.
The best bet is with an independent run, but as was noted above only if the Dems cooperate and nominate a looney leftist.
What they all have in common, is losing. This is the perfect place to reminisce over them.
Nearly 1 1/2 years after electing Trump, this is a daily gathering of denial, coulda, shoulda, woulda -- pick your loser of the day.
Don't forget Dole, John Anderson, and John McCain.
#nevertrump is "stupidtism" above all
The criteria for membership is being wrong on everything for over 2 years.
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Maybe that's a question: what do you all see as the issues that absolutely define American Conservatism?
I might be willing to talk DACA with someone, provided the word "dreamer" is stricken from the conversation. Good luck getting a definition of "conservatism," that's sort of what this forum is for. :pondering:
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I might be willing to talk DACA with someone, provided the word "dreamer" is stricken from the conversation. Good luck getting a definition of "conservatism," that's sort of what this forum is for. :pondering:
That is the impression I get ;). It's kind of why I'm here, to learn from you all.
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What they all have in common, is losing. This is the perfect place to reminisce over them.
Nearly 1 1/2 years after electing Trump, this is a daily gathering of denial, coulda, shoulda, woulda -- pick your loser of the day.
Don't forget Dole, John Anderson, and John McCain.
#nevertrump is "stupidtism" above all
The criteria for membership is being wrong on everything for over 2 years.
Thank You for the insight into my troubled soul but again @truth_seeker it's all just conjecture on your part and thanks also for sharing.
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Thank You for the insight into my troubled soul but again @truth_seeker it's all just conjecture on your part and thanks also for sharing.
Not that my soul is troubled, but I am heading out for a 4-5 mile walk now that the rain is over (I think).
Aerobic exercise, fresh air, some sat radio for rock, blues, jazz or political news and talk.
About the worst that could come of that, is a troubled sole. @corbe
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Not that my soul is troubled, but I am heading out for a 4-5 mile walk now that the rain is over (I think).
Aerobic exercise, fresh air, some sat radio for rock, blues, jazz or political news and talk.
About the worst that could come of that, is a troubled sole. @corbe
Enjoy your walk @truth_seeker ^-^
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I'll fix another Bloody Mary, open up another pack of Winstons and anxiously await your return @truth_seeker besides my Rockets who had their 17 game winning streak snapped by Toronto Friday night are about to snap the Mavericks 2 game streak in about an hour, so hurry back. :beer:
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Not that my soul is troubled, but I am heading out for a 4-5 mile walk now that the rain is over (I think).
Aerobic exercise, fresh air, some sat radio for rock, blues, jazz or political news and talk.
About the worst that could come of that, is a troubled sole. @corbe
Enjoy the walk! My SIL tells me it's very nice right now.
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I'll fix another Bloody Mary, open up another pack of Winstons and anxiously await your return @truth_seeker besides my Rockets who had their 17 game winning streak snapped by Toronto Friday night are about to snap the Mavericks 2 game streak in about an hour, so hurry back. :beer:
You speak of jungle ball?
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Yes, though I have heard much worse racial denigrations of the NBA. Besides the FMW (Female Mud Wrestling) it's the only sport I watch and some still, dare call me a racist.
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Yes, though I have heard much worse racial denigrations of the NBA. Besides the FMW (Female Mud Wrestling) it's the only sport I watch and some still, dare call me a racist.
When I hear "Jungle Ball," it's football and its dozens of Felons that come to my mind. Is there a channel that covers FMW regularly? I'd like to see that.
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@Cyber Liberty I haven't looked lately. I'm still catching the reruns in the early morning hours, during REM.
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-owOI3jthl_U/TpC_43O5osI/AAAAAAAAKFE/XHQatC6mUCQ/s1600/Girls+Mud+Wrestling+%25282%2529.jpg)
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@Cyber Liberty I haven't looked lately. I'm still catching the reruns in the early morning hours, during REM.
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-owOI3jthl_U/TpC_43O5osI/AAAAAAAAKFE/XHQatC6mUCQ/s1600/Girls+Mud+Wrestling+%25282%2529.jpg)
But where are the midgets????
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But where are the midgets????
I just saw a vid on Bookface of four midgets running a relay race with a camel. The internet has many, many strange attractions so I am sure there is a place to find midget FMW. Rule 34, sweetie, Rule 34.
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I just saw a vid on Bookface of four midgets running a relay race with a camel. The internet has many, many strange attractions so I am sure there is a place to find midget FMW. Rule 34, sweetie, Rule 34.
@Cyber Liberty heheheheh
My husband just learned that his cousin's daughter has adopted the "fursona" of a Dutch Angel Dragon. I shudder to think where that leads, and I weep for my son's future.
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@Cyber Liberty heheheheh
My husband just learned that his cousin's daughter has adopted the "fursona" of a Dutch Angel Dragon. I shudder to think where that leads, and I weep for my son's future.
Boyohboy. I Googled that, and it's exactly what I thought it was. Could be worse. Your son could be a Bronie.
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Maybe that's a question: what do you all see as the issues that absolutely define American Conservatism?
Few folks are wholly conservative or liberal. Most orient one way or another, but as you point out values like empathy and compassion are not ideological.
Conservatives are oriented toward individual liberty and the encouragement of economic initiative in the context of free markets, meaning they favor equality of opportunity, not necessarily of result. Liberals are informed of Rawlesian notions of the role of government, and favor taxation of the community to fund a safety net.
This broad distinction between conservative and liberal is complicated by the presence, on both the right and the left, of idiosyncratic obsessions that clash with the libertarian instincts of conservatives and the Rawlesian instincts of liberals. On the right it is social conservatism, urging a role for intrusive government in the support of Biblical morality, and on the left it is identity politics, which is amoral cynicism that undercuts the credibility of its communitarian impulse.
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Unless the GOP scraps the winner take all primary system, Trump will be as hard to stop in 2020 as he was in 2016.
As long as Trump keeps winning Conservative positions... and handing democrats their asses on a silver plate..... 2020 is a landslide with anyone .
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By 2020 I fully expect that McCain will be long gone and Flake will be a Democrat.
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As long as Trump keeps winning Conservative positions... and handing democrats their asses on a silver plate..... 2020 is a landslide with anyone .
I disagree @Fantom Record busting budgets, Tariffs and DACA are not Conservative principles as I ever knew, as far as the DEMS they are doing their own slice and dice game unto themselves, their current fundraising proves that, as divided as the GOP is, the DEMS are in so much worst shape, right now and that has more to do with hellary not letting go than anything Trump has done to them, he's been to busy disparaging Republicans. 2020 is a long ways away, politically, particularly with this Administration.
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Boyohboy. I Googled that, and it's exactly what I thought it was. Could be worse. Your son could be a Bronie.
@Cyber Liberty I know -- can you imagine?! I couldn't get over the fact that they're no longer "furries" -- "fersonas" is so much more dignified, right? ;)
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Few folks are wholly conservative or liberal. Most orient one way or another, but as you point out values like empathy and compassion are not ideological.
Conservatives are oriented toward individual liberty and the encouragement of economic initiative in the context of free markets, meaning they favor equality of opportunity, not necessarily of result. Liberals are informed of Rawlesian notions of the role of government, and favor taxation of the community to fund a safety net.
This broad distinction between conservative and liberal is complicated by the presence, on both the right and the left, of idiosyncratic obsessions that clash with the libertarian instincts of conservatives and the Rawlesian instincts of liberals. On the right it is social conservatism, urging a role for intrusive government in the support of Biblical morality, and on the left it is identity politics, which is amoral cynicism that undercuts the credibility of its communitarian impulse.
This was helpful to read, @Jazzhead! BTW, I know you're not a Dem plant; I was kidding. And I hope you're feeling ok and hanging in there!
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This was helpful to read, @Jazzhead! BTW, I know you're not a Dem plant; I was kidding. And I hope you're feeling ok and hanging in there!
Thanks, Laura! Surgery is first thing tomorrow morning.
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I disagree @Fantom Record busting budgets, Tariffs and DACA are not Conservative principles as I ever knew, as far as the DEMS they are doing their own slice and dice game unto themselves, their current fundraising proves that, as divided as the GOP is, the DEMS are in so much worst shape, right now and that has more to do with hellary not letting go than anything Trump has done to them, he's been to busy disparaging Republicans. 2020 is a long ways away, politically, particularly with this Administration.
All of this is true, sadly ;(.
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Flake calls for 2020 Trump primary challenger
Very Very interested in seeing if we can get a conservative to primary and beat DJT. Know odds are long right now, but a lot can happen between now and summer 2019.
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I disagree @Fantom Record busting budgets, Tariffs and DACA are not Conservative principles as I ever knew, as far as the DEMS they are doing their own slice and dice game unto themselves, their current fundraising proves that, as divided as the GOP is, the DEMS are in so much worst shape, right now and that has more to do with hellary not letting go than anything Trump has done to them, he's been to busy disparaging Republicans. 2020 is a long ways away, politically, particularly with this Administration.
Hey @corbe , good to hear from you buddy. :dx1:
Last first as is my wont, yes 2020 is a far ways away.... but with clear vision, and a booming Trump economy, it is clear sailing so far.... Red sky at night so's to speak. As for this Administration... doing amazing things in my book friend.
As for attacking R's... seems a lot of that is Kabuki' Threatre to me, some of them are scum..Like Flake/McCain and deserve it... others...meh :shrug: Kabuki.
Yes, the dems are in a real funk..... a good part of that is Trump. They cannot deal with someone who can get away with doing to them what they are accustomed to doing to us. This is a good thing ...No?
As for Conservative principles.... DACA..... has it passed? All I see is illegals shutting down democrat offices.... hmnn. :pondering:
Tariffs, that game is just beginning... likewise such as George Washington espoused tariffs. Without getting into the weeds.... tarrifs are not against my Conservative grain.
Which brings us to budgets. Until the House passes Trumps budgets... they own the one they pass... you know... all those "Conservatives". Personally... I'll take a booming economy with a trillion deficit over a crappy economy with a trillion deficit any year.
Jus' Sayin'. 888high58888
P.S. I like your avatar..... reminds me of a woman I once knew.
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Thanks, Laura! Surgery is first thing tomorrow morning.
God Bless. I hope you had good results.
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Thanks, Laura! Surgery is first thing tomorrow morning.
@Jazzhead
Keep me up to date on your recovery. I never hit a man when he is down! :smokin:
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Thanks, Laura! Surgery is first thing tomorrow morning.
We're all pulling for ya, buddy! Having surgery is a time we put these petty differences aside and send Knee-Mail for ya. :0001:
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Thanks, thackney, WN and CL ("knee-mail" - I like that!). The surgery was performed this morning and I am at home in a leg brace, trying to get through the pain with a minimum reliance on narcotics. My greatest thanks to Mrs. Jazz, the finest woman in the world.
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Thanks, thackney, WN and CL ("knee-mail" - I like that!). The surgery was performed this morning and I am at home in a leg brace, trying to get through the pain with a minimum reliance on narcotics. My greatest thanks to Mrs. Jazz, the finest woman in the world.
A alright. 888high58888 Hey when do you start seeing the Physical Terrorist?
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Thanks, thackney, WN and CL ("knee-mail" - I like that!). The surgery was performed this morning and I am at home in a leg brace, trying to get through the pain with a minimum reliance on narcotics. My greatest thanks to Mrs. Jazz, the finest woman in the world.
Do your therapy! And be well! I will pray for a complete recovery for you!
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...Physical Terrorist?
I like that. But take the Terrorist's threats seriously. Do your PT, whatever the injury. Or stay injured forever...
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I like that. But take the Terrorist's threats seriously. Do your PT, whatever the injury. Or stay injured forever...
:beer:
Well, I don't know how they can call what they do "Therapy" lol :cool:
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Thanks for the update @Jazzhead, wishing you a speedy recovery. Utilize the pain pills, misery will delay your progress, addiction is in the mind and surmountable.
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:beer:
Well, I don't know how they can call what they do "Therapy" lol :cool:
I had a mighty fine guy working for me after surgery #2, and some nice gals after surgery #1. They never terrorized me.
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I like that. But take the Terrorist's threats seriously. Do your PT, whatever the injury. Or stay injured forever...
My father did that. He refused to do the therapy after hip surgery because it hurt.
And never walked again. **nononono*
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Thanks for the update @Jazzhead, wishing you a speedy recovery. Utilize the pain pills, misery will delay your progress, addiction is in the mind and surmountable.
@Jazzhead Listen to what @corbe says there: If your surgeon hasn't told you, the PT will...pain is the enemy of your recovery here in the first few weeks. Don't be a "tough guy" and skimp on the meds, you'll be doing your body no favors. When you have genuine pain after surgery, you won't get addicted to them. Addiction happens when you take them when you don't need them. If you don't treat the pain, it will do you harm, I learned about that through a couple of hip replacements.
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My father did that. He refused to do the therapy after hip surgery because it hurt.
And never walked again. **nononono*
I have a SIL like that, and I don't know if she ever got back on her feet...
PT is as important as the surgery, and if JH's injury is as serious as he said it is (severed quad) it's major surgery with lots of PT to come.
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I have a SIL like that, and I don't know if she ever got back on her feet...
PT is as important as the surgery, and if JH's injury is as serious as he said it is (severed quad) it's major surgery with lots of PT to come.
Ouch!
Yes, @Jazzhead .......obey those doctors. Take the pain meds (pain creates more pain....minimize it), and do your therapy.
My Dad was 80 and ruined the last 6 years of his life, but you're just a kid!
Do whatever you can to get yourself back on your feet!
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Thanks, all! And I understand the importance of PT- I'm only 60 and need to be able to walk again.
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I had a mighty fine guy working for me after surgery #2, and some nice gals after surgery #1. They never terrorized me.
No Pain No Gain you Puzzy! :beer:
@Jazzyhead
Pain Heals. Chicks (Mrs Jazzy) dig scars. Glory lives forever! :beer:
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I disagree @Fantom Record busting budgets, Tariffs and DACA are not Conservative principles as I ever knew, as far as the DEMS they are doing their own slice and dice game unto themselves, their current fundraising proves that, as divided as the GOP is, the DEMS are in so much worst shape, right now and that has more to do with hellary not letting go than anything Trump has done to them, he's been to busy disparaging Republicans. 2020 is a long ways away, politically, particularly with this Administration.
Addressing all 3 of your points...budget busting, Tariffs, and DACA...note the following.
1. President Reagan imposed a 100 percent tariff on selected Japanese electronics in 1987
2. From 1981-1983 Reagan tripled the Gross Federal Debt, from $900 billion to $2.7 trillion.
3. in 1986, Ronald Reagan signed a sweeping immigration reform bill into law. The bill also made any immigrant who'd entered the country before 1982 eligible for amnesty
Unless your argument is that Reagan was..not a conservative...you are simply incorrect. In fact, Trump is the closest thing...policy wise..to Ronald Reagan we've had in the Oval office since...well...Ronald Reagan. I'm proud to be a Reagan conservative along with President Trump...as our the vast majority of conservatives/Republicans. @corbe
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You are correct, My Friend, @mescalone on all 3 points, you have quite simply and eloquently, I might add, utterly destroyed my attempt at logic in my prior post. Kudo's Sir. 888high58888
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You are correct, My Friend, @mescalone on all 3 points, you have quite simply and eloquently, I might add, utterly destroyed my attempt at logic in my prior post. Kudo's Sir. 888high58888
Perhaps you're overstating my "victory". I'm a huge Reagan guy so I tend to see all things conservative in his reflected light!
I believe that Reagan was principled, but always pragmatic...his goal was conservative policy and legislation but he was willing to take what he could get even if it didn't pass the conservative "purity" test. For example, if other nation's are unfairly closing their markets to our industry...while we hold ours open...that's not fair trade. So a tariff, when used with discrimination, can pry open markets to create more genuinely free trade. So the goal is a conservative one, though the method of using tariffs is an imperfect...but perhaps necessary tool.
DACA is similar to Reagan's amnesty. Give some on an amnesty issue to create a long term conservative fix to immigration. In Reagan's case, the Dems failed to uphold the "security" side of the deal...Trump has learned from that and WILL ensure the security side of such a deal IS upheld this time. So, again, the goal is a conservative one though it does necessitate some concessions to achieve.
Pragmatism is not a byword for setting aside principles. It is the necessary application of common sense and practicality that allows us to get the MOST conservative solution possible into legislation. Without pragmatism, we get a bunch of folks running around feeling good about their conservative purity...and absolutely nothing achieved in terms of furthering conservative principles and legislation.
Anyway, I expound to much...partly because I enjoy discussing issues with you. You have a sharp and open mind...and a strong set of principles. So kudos to you, sir.
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Perhaps you're overstating my "victory". I'm a huge Reagan guy so I tend to see all things conservative in his reflected light!
I believe that Reagan was principled, but always pragmatic...his goal was conservative policy and legislation but he was willing to take what he could get even if it didn't pass the conservative "purity" test. For example, if other nation's are unfairly closing their markets to our industry...while we hold ours open...that's not fair trade. So a tariff, when used with discrimination, can pry open markets to create more genuinely free trade. So the goal is a conservative one, though the method of using tariffs is an imperfect...but perhaps necessary tool.
DACA is similar to Reagan's amnesty. Give some on an amnesty issue to create a long term conservative fix to immigration. In Reagan's case, the Dems failed to uphold the "security" side of the deal...Trump has learned from that and WILL ensure the security side of such a deal IS upheld this time. So, again, the goal is a conservative one though it does necessitate some concessions to achieve.
Pragmatism is not a byword for setting aside principles. It is the necessary application of common sense and practicality that allows us to get the MOST conservative solution possible into legislation. Without pragmatism, we get a bunch of folks running around feeling good about their conservative purity...and absolutely nothing achieved in terms of furthering conservative principles and legislation.
Anyway, I expound to much...partly because I enjoy discussing issues with you. You have a sharp and open mind...and a strong set of principles. So kudos to you, sir.
I would agree with you, @Mesaclone , that President Reagan was a conservative though those three items weren't conservative policies. He was being pragmatic to achieve what he sought as conservative goals.
The problem I see now, with regard to immigration in particular, is window-dressing in place of two actual reforms that would curb our illegal immigration problem. Without mandatory nationwide e-Verify and thorough biometric VISA entry and exit exams, we will not make a dent in the incursion. Even ending chain migration will take 20 years. And I don't believe we'll realistically see a total halt on immigration -- at the very least, people with money or skills will still gain entry.
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Honestly, if they have “money and “skills†they are welcome to enter via LEGAL immigration. I entirely agree with you on everify and other measures...any DACA amnesty MUST be accompanied by a host of security and administrative measures or its no deal. The Reagan adventure in 1987 has taught us all that we must not cede the follow through to the Dems...the amnesty must come only AFTER all of the new security measures are put in place.