Author Topic: Lib Columnist Calls For Ending Military Funeral Honors For Vets, “Most Veterans Did Nothing Heroic”…  (Read 2758 times)

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famousdayandyear

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http://weaselzippers.us/2013/03/27/st-louis-post-dispatch-lib-columnist-calls-for-ending-military-funeral-honors-for-veterans-most-veterans-did-nothing-heroic/


St. Louis Post-Dispatch Lib Columnist Calls For Ending Military Funeral Honors For Vets, “Most Veterans Did Nothing Heroic”…

When it comes to crap like welfare liberals don’t care what the cost is, but when it comes to honoring vets suddenly they’re deficit hawks. It’s absolutely pathetic.

You can email this piece of shit, Bill McClellan, here: bmcclellan@post-dispatch.com


Bill McClellan: One last call to service – end military funeral honors — St.Louis Post-Dispatch

    . . . According to the program’s website, it is funded by the federal government and the Missouri National Guard Trust Fund.

    Both the federal government and the state government are broke. So why are we providing military funeral honors for all veterans? It is a nice gesture we can’t afford.

    Certainly, men and women killed in combat deserve full military honors. It’s a way for the country to say, “We honor the memory of those who died in our service.” These military honors — and the thought behind them — are intended to provide some solace for the families of the fallen.

    But what about the guy who spends a couple of years in the military and then gets on with his life? Bear in mind that most veterans did nothing heroic. They served, and that’s laudable, but it hardly seems necessary to provide them all with military honors after they have died. In fact, it seems generous enough to provide veterans and their spouses with free space and headstones at a national cemetery.

    Why not let the veterans organizations provide military honors at the funerals of their members? If a person gets out of the Marine Corps and wants to stay connected, he can join the Marine Corps League. I’m sure the 101st Airborne has an association. In a more general vein, we have the American Legion and the VFW.

    Providing military honor funerals for their members would be a boon to these organizations. Membership would presumably climb, and veterans who want the military funerals could still get them.

    Everybody knows government needs to cut costs.

    This is exactly how you do it.

Offline Rapunzel

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I suppose he supports the church protesting their funerals, too... what an ass.
�The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.� G Washington July 2, 1776

Offline mountaineer

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The Post-Dispatch has always been a liberal rag and McClellan a reliably left-leaning voice, but this is a new low. As you might expect, the comments at the newspaper's site are not favorable.

Michael Wilding · Top Commenter
Hmm, as far as cutting things Bill, maybe the first family's monthly vacations or the Vice-President's million dollar trip to France would be a good place to start. The commoner who served his/her country deserves a little more respect than a tune played from an iPod.
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Cindy Martin · Top Commenter
I usually enjoy your column....but, I may have to quit reading.
My father served 20+ years in the Marines, including two tours in Vietnam. He died in December and we were just approved a claim that Agent Orange caused his death.
We did not have what is considered a "normal" childhood. We never lived near family, no joining the relatives for holidays, no overnight stays with the cousins. What we DID have was an educational childhood - we've traveled to more places within the US than most people will visit in a lifetime - including a five year tour in Hawaii.

After his 20+ years in the Marines, he "got on with his life." He went to work for McDonnell Douglas and we continued moving following the Harrier. We used to tease our parents that he never had to kick his kids out of the house - he just kept moving and, eventually, the kids quit moving with them.
This is the man you want to refuse military honors for? A man who not only fought for his country but died BECAUSE he fought for his country?
How dare you!
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Cameron Lange · Assistant Superintendant at McCarthy Building Companies
I usually don't comment on articles here, but this article hurt my heart. In all the ways we as a nation can cut spending, why target something that costs $100 an occurrence? With the travel bills by the President, Vice President, and congressmen growing evermore extravagent and our government spending tax money on research studies like why lesbians are overweight, I wonder why this is where you propose we start trimming the excess. My grandfather served in WWII and, while I never had the privilege of meeting him, I guarantee you that he earned and deserved the honor of having a military funeral. This is such a small way to honor those who have served our country. I can't imagine taking that away.
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Brian Hansen · Top Commenter · Tarkio College
Bill...I always read your column...I don't always agree, and this is one of those times. The playing of taps is above all a show of respect for the veteran's service. It is also tradition...and we know the military is steeped in tradition. The playing of taps through an electronic bugle cheapens the tradition and respect. When this "broke" government can shell out 2 million dollars for a program to allow inmates to pet horses or a couple of hundred thousand dollars to study duck penises, I say we can afford to have a live playing of taps at military funerals. We just need to cut the crazy stuff we spend money on.
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Matt Conley · Top Commenter
We just gave the PLO Palestinian State ( A group who still supports terrorists who kill Americans.) $500 MILLION of borrowed money from China with another $200 MILLION soon to follow. That's after $250 MILLION Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt who support beating and raping women to death and Bill is worried about a couple of $ for showing respect to those that served?
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Terri Kotula · Top Commenter
Oh, didn't you hear, Matt? Obama's "THEY WILL LOVE ME, IF I PAY THEM TO" Tour isn't going as planned...
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Donald Ickes · Alton, Illinois
As someone who has served on the honor guard while on active duty in the Marine Corps, my first response was to tell Mr. McClellan to go take a flying leap. My second response was to stop, tell myself he is just looking for fat to cut, and anything that gets cut effects someone.Then reconsider.

So I reconsidered. I still disagree.

The effect the honor guard has on the deceased family is a extreme emotional, and it gives them a sense of honor. There loved one was so important that the Government sent people out to their funeral.

Okay, so there is that. It has an effect on people. As I mentioned before, everything has an effect on someone. Take in consideration who these people are. For the most part, the service men who are dieing are those who served during the Korean War, the Vietnam War, and a few left over from WWII. The size of our military has been shrinking ever since then, with a few bumps with the two Iraqi Wars and the one in Afghanistan. Even with both the Iraqi War and the Afghanistan War happening at the same time, or military numbers were much smaller when compared to the previous wars. (Disclaimer: That is unverified, working from memory and I didn't check it. I would be surprised if it wasn't true though.) In short, they were promised it, and participation in the program will go fall off.

Offline Rapunzel

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I think American's are starting to pay closer attention... that is a good thing that they start taking on the slime like this author.  I am seeing it in the comments in my local paper to articles as well.
�The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.� G Washington July 2, 1776

Offline Relic

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I didn't do anything heroic... I was never shot at, I had the good fortune to serve during peace time. So all I did was:

Give 4 years of my life to the Navy. Going where they told me, doing what they told me. And, for another 2 years I was an "inactive reserve". Sort of a free agent option.

I served on combatant vessels keeping them ready so that if something bad happened, I'd be there, ready, to protect the likes of Mr. McClellan. On those ships, we routinely did night time refueling, and loading of supplies. Often this was during heavy seas, and the chances of someone being washed over the side were very real. (And did happen once). Another time, a ship ahead of us had a line snap while tying up, tearing the legs from an officer.

And, we were privileged to spend some quality time off the coast of Yemen during a civil war there. Oh, did I mention we lost power and were drifting towards the shore? That we had multiple snipes get heat exhaustion during their 5 minute shifts trying to restore power.

This man has no clue. What has he ever done for his country?
Just thinking about this disgusts me.

Offline mountaineer

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Bill McClellan doesn't like being criticized.
Post-Dispatch, March 29, 2013

McClellan: Doubling down on the argument for ending military funeral honors


 Jeez. A national campaign to get rid of me. More emails than I can read. Threats of an advertising boycott. An answering machine jammed with hate-filled calls. It’s pig heaven for an attention-craving columnist. What did I do to deserve this?

I suggested that we stop asking taxpayers to foot the bill for military funeral honors for all veterans. The people in charge of these things have already decided we can’t afford live buglers. One of the buglers contacted me, and that got me thinking. Why are we doing this in the first place?

So I wrote that men and women killed in combat deserve full military honors. “But what about the guy who spends a couple of years in the military and then gets on with his life? Bear in mind that most veterans did nothing heroic. They served, and that’s laudable, but it hardly seems necessary to provide them all with military honors after they have died.”

That set people off. “Despicable! Everybody who puts on a uniform is a hero. When they sign their name on the dotted line, they are giving the government a blank check, and blah, blah, blah. You owe our veterans an apology.”

Nonsense. I stand by every word I wrote.

I am my own best example. I flunked out of college and was drafted into the Marine Corps. I went to Vietnam. I did nothing heroic. Nor did any of my close friends. But I knew people who did, and it devalues the real heroes to say that everybody was one. If everybody is a hero, nobody is.

I sometimes write about heroes. Maybe you remember Jerry Abbenhaus. He was a Chaminade graduate. He joined the Marines and was a machine gunner. One day his unit was ambushed and Abbenhaus was able to safely reach cover. But when another Marine was hit by a North Vietnamese machine gun, Jerry rose to return the fire and let a corpsman get to his wounded companion. Five rounds tore into Jerry. He never walked again. He died in 1986.

On the other side of the equation, I had a friend who was about to get drafted. He did not want to end up in the rice paddies, so he joined the Air Force. That meant a four-year commitment instead of two years, but he figured it was worth it. Joining the Air Force was honorable, but not heroic.

He ended up in Vietnam. He was a little cog in the big wheel. He sorted mail. Honorable, but not heroic. He had an apartment in Saigon. The bar girls were attractive and friendly; the dope was plentiful and cheap. It was the best year of his life.

If he were to get full military honors at his funeral, I don’t know what the bugler should play. Maybe something from Jimi Hendrix.

I am not demeaning my friend’s service. I come from a long line of non-heroes. My dad was at Guadalcanal. He ran the largest still on the island. When he died, I did not choose to have a military funeral. I bought a bottle of very good whiskey.

After I got out of the service, I went to college on the GI bill. As far as I’m concerned, Uncle Sam and I are square. I do not feel like the country owes me anything. Truth is, I got more from the military than the military got from me. I do not expect the taxpayers to pony up for a military funeral.

Two days before my column was published, the newspaper ran a story about the money we spend on former presidents. In addition to pensions, we pay for their travel, their office staff and their office space. Not counting Secret Service protection, we paid $3.7 million for our ex-presidents last year. Biggest spender? George W. Bush. Next was Bill Clinton.

Bear in mind that none of these men is poor, and they can make tens of thousands of dollars for giving a speech. It would be nice if those men would say, “Hey, the government is broke. We don’t need this.”

But that is not their nature. They feel entitled.

Admittedly, military funerals are not so costly. Missouri averages 729 of them per month. At Jefferson Barracks National Cemetery, the cost is about $400. At private cemeteries, the cost is a little higher.

As I said in Wednesday’s column, the way you cut a budget is by cutting small programs and trimming big ones. I suggested letting veterans service organizations provide military funerals for their members. That did not seem despicable or outrageous to me. It still doesn’t.

Nor did it seem political. I thought reasonable people on both sides of the aisle understood we have to control our spending.

Sadly, if the response I’ve gotten is any indication, there’s not much hope for any kind of a deal. Nobody wants to give up anything. I was hoping veterans could lead the way. It would be a heroic thing to do.

Offline happyg

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Nobody wants to give up anything. I was hoping veterans could lead the way. It would be a heroic thing to do.

Heroes or not, they were all willing to give up their lives for America. The least we can do is thank them by way of a military funeral. How about asking those welfare couch potatoes to give up something? Most of them are better off than the taxpayers who are supporting them.

Offline Rapunzel

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I didn't do anything heroic... I was never shot at, I had the good fortune to serve during peace time. So all I did was:

Give 4 years of my life to the Navy. Going where they told me, doing what they told me. And, for another 2 years I was an "inactive reserve". Sort of a free agent option.

I served on combatant vessels keeping them ready so that if something bad happened, I'd be there, ready, to protect the likes of Mr. McClellan. On those ships, we routinely did night time refueling, and loading of supplies. Often this was during heavy seas, and the chances of someone being washed over the side were very real. (And did happen once). Another time, a ship ahead of us had a line snap while tying up, tearing the legs from an officer.

And, we were privileged to spend some quality time off the coast of Yemen during a civil war there. Oh, did I mention we lost power and were drifting towards the shore? That we had multiple snipes get heat exhaustion during their 5 minute shifts trying to restore power.

This man has no clue. What has he ever done for his country?
Just thinking about this disgusts me.

He claims he served and because he went to college on the GI bill that is all the payment he or anyone else deserves.  I disagree. Not only are our veterans willing, able and ready to go to war to protect people like this man, many put good careers on hold to do so and their families back home are affected in many, many ways.  We all owe them a great deal.
�The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.� G Washington July 2, 1776

Offline mountaineer

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I guess we're supposed to appreciate the fact that Bill McClellan submitted to the draft and didn't flee to Canada. Apparently, that's all he did for this country. Nevertheless, if he died tonight and his family said they wanted him to receive whatever honors were available for a veteran, I wouldn't object.

My late father served in WWII. He was  on the periphery of naval combat in the South Pacific, but as a result did suffer a rather serious injury that caused him pain for the remaining decades of his life. It didn't earn him a Purple Heart because it wasn't deemed combat-related (not like the grain of rice that hit John Kerry in the butt, for example), but we still wanted to have the flag on his casket and the local VFW (or whoever it was) play taps at the gravesite. He loved his country and he served it honorably. I'm sorry that offends Bill McClellan.

Offline happyg

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My late father served in WWII. He was  on the periphery of naval combat in the South Pacific, but as a result did suffer a rather serious injury that caused him pain for the remaining decades of his life. It didn't earn him a Purple Heart because it wasn't deemed combat-related (not like the grain of rice that hit John Kerry in the butt, for example), but we still wanted to have the flag on his casket and the local VFW (or whoever it was) play taps at the gravesite. He loved his country and he served it honorably. I'm sorry that offends Bill McClellan.

The same with my dad and husband. I paid anything that needed to be paid for my husband. My son and two grandsons are in the military, and their friends performed the duties, while they presented me the flag. The VFW did the 21 gun salute and taps.

As for our young men and women, anyone who served in those hell holes deserves a badge of honor. Even sitting behind a desk over there is dangerous.

Offline PzLdr

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Spent about four years. Volunteeredfor Viet Nam twice-once at Armor School, and the second time while on stateside assignment. Got shot at twice [DMZ, Korea]. In Viet Nam, was a MACV advisor [S-3] to an ARVN Tank Bn., learning M48A3Cs. Got a skin disease I still have. Got some other health problems, too.

So by the columnist's lights, I don't deserve a sendoff. But I willingly gave up four years of my life while a bunch of draft dodging bastards got on with theirs,got the jump on the rest of us, and got to write the narrative that made us out to be a bunch of drug taking psychotic losers. A bugle call isn't much to ask. And when we buried my Pop, Combat Engineer, 4th ID, Utah Beach, battle of France, Huertgen Forest, they played TAPS on a boom box. Cheesey.  :patriot:

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Offline happyg

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Spent about four years. Volunteeredfor Viet Nam twice-once at Armor School, and the second time while on stateside assignment. Got shot at twice [DMZ, Korea]. In Viet Nam, was a MACV advisor [S-3] to an ARVN Tank Bn., learning M48A3Cs. Got a skin disease I still have. Got some other health problems, too.

So by the columnist's lights, I don't deserve a sendoff. But I willingly gave up four years of my life while a bunch of draft dodging bastards got on with theirs,got the jump on the rest of us, and got to write the narrative that made us out to be a bunch of drug taking psychotic losers. A bugle call isn't much to ask. And when we buried my Pop, Combat Engineer, 4th ID, Utah Beach, battle of France, Huertgen Forest, they played TAPS on a boom box. Cheesey.  :patriot:

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You are a genuine hero member, PzLdr! I was an Acitivity Director in a local nursing home. One year, I did a salute to the veterans, and a local old-timers band came in and did all patriotic songs. We then read stories about our resident veterans, who cried when they recognized their stories. They thought they were forgotten. At every event, I requested the performers to end their show with a patriotic tribute, and ALL the residents would put their hands over their hearts, some stood, and the men took their hats off. I went to all the aids, and even nurses and asked them to do the same. As far as I know, the nursing home still does that.

Offline Rapunzel

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My husband could have easily gotten out of serving given he suffered Asthma his entire life and in a fall as a child damaged the ligaments in his legs that led to being in a hip to toe cast for over a year, but he not only took a leave from his work to serve in Naval Air, when he was given orders for Long Beach he volunteered to switch with another man who had orders for a two-year stint in Japan and a pregnant wife stateside... the military agreed to the switch and because he was eligible for a top security clearance he was assigned to ordinance on the base..... this was during the run up to Vietnam and they were bringing the plane that were shot up back to Japan in boxes for repair... he never had any use for the draft dodgers that were so prevalent during this period of time.  He loved Japan BTW and learned to speak fluent Japanese while there....
�The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.� G Washington July 2, 1776

Offline happyg

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Interesting story, Rap. My husband loved Japan, too. He was one of the Marines flying to Cuba to give aid to the rebels. On the way there, his plane turned back on orders from Kennedy. He said that was the day he became a republican.

Offline mountaineer

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After hospitalization for his non-combat-related WWII injuries, my father's assignment was repatriating Japanese POWs. He transported them back to their homeland. I've seen some photos of him in Japan, and he brought back an Arisaka rifle. Heroic? Who knows, but I'm proud of him.

Offline happyg

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After hospitalization for his non-combat-related WWII injuries, my father's assignment was repatriating Japanese POWs. He transported them back to their homeland. I've seen some photos of him in Japan, and he brought back an Arisaka rifle. Heroic? Who knows, but I'm proud of him.

My dad did that, too! He was in the Army Air Corps, and spent most of his time in the Philippines.

Offline Rapunzel

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Interesting story, Rap. My husband loved Japan, too. He was one of the Marines flying to Cuba to give aid to the rebels. On the way there, his plane turned back on orders from Kennedy. He said that was the day he became a republican.

That, too is an interesting story, happy.  Interesting what makes people decide where they fall on the political spectrum. 

George was tall with blond hair and blue eyes, he stood out in Japan ~LOL~ but he said what always impressed him most was they really liked Americans (at the time - mid-60's)....... the first time he went skiing in Japan he still had limited Japanese, someone wrote a note for him so he could use it to get to where he was going.  When he went to  breakfast he ordered a Japanese breakfast and said he noticed other Japanese at this table giggling about his order.. when their food arrived he knew why.. he has sea weed, rice and some sort of runny egg, the Japanese had ordered bacon and eggs......   he got a good laugh out of that. 
�The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.� G Washington July 2, 1776

Offline happyg

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That, too is an interesting story, happy.  Interesting what makes people decide where they fall on the political spectrum. 

George was tall with blond hair and blue eyes, he stood out in Japan ~LOL~ but he said what always impressed him most was they really liked Americans (at the time - mid-60's)....... the first time he went skiing in Japan he still had limited Japanese, someone wrote a note for him so he could use it to get to where he was going.  When he went to  breakfast he ordered a Japanese breakfast and said he noticed other Japanese at this table giggling about his order.. when their food arrived he knew why.. he has sea weed, rice and some sort of runny egg, the Japanese had ordered bacon and eggs......   he got a good laugh out of that.

I always loved to try new foods. My husband, Pat was totally basic. When we went to the Domincan Republic, he refused to eat their food, which was delicious. One morning, he saw they had corn flakes, so was on his third bowl, when someone told him he was drinking goat's milk. He left the table. Another time, we went to a snack bar, and he ordered a burger and fries. I told his friend if he mentioned the type of grease that was used, I'd never speak to him again!

It was the same in Mexico, but he had peanut butter, a loaf of bread, and a jar of grape jelly in his suitcase! All that good food, and he missed out on it.

Offline Cincinnatus

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...he had peanut butter, a loaf of bread, and a jar of grape jelly in his suitcase!

Not looking for a fight, Happyg, but a peanut butter and jelly sandwich is the bestest food ever invented. In fact I have a theory that the famed "ambrosia of the gods" was actuallY a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. Homer just neglected to call it that.
We shall never be abandoned by Heaven while we act worthy of its aid ~~ Samuel Adams

Offline happyg

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...he had peanut butter, a loaf of bread, and a jar of grape jelly in his suitcase!

Not looking for a fight, Happyg, but a peanut butter and jelly sandwich is the bestest food ever invented. In fact I have a theory that the famed "ambrosia of the gods" was actuallY a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. Homer just neglected to call it that.

No fight from me! That's is nearly all my youngest grandson eats. The doctor said it's fine as long as he drinks liquids. My middle son eats it every night before going to bed. So do I, except without jelly,  along with a glass of milk. For some reason, it helps me sleep.

famousdayandyear

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After General James Mattis USMC retired, who was the last of the field officer generals, we hardly have a fighting force left.  When Sec of the Navy Mabus lowers standards so that women serve in combat roles, we are toast anyway.  But I am for a military funeral for anyone who served before all that insanity happens.
 ***evilkitty

Offline PzLdr

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...he had peanut butter, a loaf of bread, and a jar of grape jelly in his suitcase!

Not looking for a fight, Happyg, but a peanut butter and jelly sandwich is the bestest food ever invented. In fact I have a theory that the famed "ambrosia of the gods" was actuallY a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. Homer just neglected to call it that.

Best food ever invented was my Mom's homemade three cheese ravioli [with her homemade gravy]! Post - Homer.  :laugh: :patriot:
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famousdayandyear

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To all:  Happy Easter.  By the Way, this is a thread for military news.   :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: