Ford “Drastically” Cutting EV Lightning Workforce Hours

[DB]

No I  said every US industry is subsidized and gave some examples and reasons why they do  it. Because again...huh other countries are heavily subsidizing their industries and if we do not  our US companies will be at huge disadvantage just as Boeng lost a 300 aircraft deal to airbus because the european countries heavily subsidized airbus.
Where did I say I believed in wind and solar?

No, every US industry is not subsidized. That should be plainly obvious.

And where did I mention wind? Renewables and solar were your words. And there you go twisting things again...

[banddag]

And unlike Chinese battery makers, Amazon did it all without US taxpayer subsidies.

Really?  Over the past decade, Amazon received at least $4.7 billion in  state and federal government subsidies around the world to support its build out of data centers, warehouses, offices, call centers, and film production projects.Feb 10, 2022

As of 2024 it is up to 6.7 billion.

[banddag]

No, every US industry is not subsidized. That should be plainly obvious.

And where did I mention wind? Renewables and solar were your words. And there you go twisting things again...

You are the twister I just gave an example just as airbus/boeing. Show me where I say I want solar and wind. Show me.

[banddag]

No, every US industry is not subsidized. That should be plainly obvious.

Name one major industry that is not subsidized by the federal gov't .

 Every major industry is:   Transportation=air land and sea, , ag, healthcare, communications, oil and gas/coal, finance, banking, insurance, forestry and wood indusrty, tv and movie production, manufacturing of just about every type for examples.

Top 100 companies getting US subsidies. Go ahead read the list

https://subsidytracker.goodjobsfirst.org/parent-totals

[banddag]

You said flat screen TVs. Flatscreen TVs are and have been made overseas without any US subsidies for a long time.


The computer industry (non military) has only recently been subsidized to move high end chip fabrication out of Taiwan due to the threat of invasion by China as a national security issue.

Flat screen R&d is in the US and heavily subsidized

IBM and Dell etc have been getting federal subsidies for years. Dell is up to 700 million. The computer industry has been heavily subsidized since day 1

https://subsidytracker.goodjobsfirst.org/parent-totals

[banddag]

No, every US industry is not subsidized. That should be plainly obvious.

RANK
PARENT
SUBSIDY VALUEsort icon
NUMBER OF AWARDS
1   Boeing   $15,502,641,455   957
2   Intel   $8,360,460,516   128
3   Ford Motor   $7,742,056,086   703
4   General Motors   $7,550,136,090   786
5   Micron Technology   $6,856,681,915   19
6   Amazon.com   $5,802,700,434   455
7   Alcoa   $5,727,691,764   134
8   Cheniere Energy   $5,617,152,523   43
9   Foxconn Technology Group (Hon Hai Precision Industry Company)   $4,820,110,112   74
10   Texas Instruments   $4,286,328,869   69
11   Volkswagen   $3,977,630,513   216
12   Sempra Energy   $3,878,692,264   51
13   NRG Energy   $3,405,383,876   264
14   Venture Global LNG   $3,285,883,566   6
15   NextEra Energy   $3,008,691,129   116
16   Sasol   $2,836,049,845   72
17   Tesla Inc.   $2,829,855,494   114
18   Stellantis   $2,795,436,436   213
19   Nucor   $2,538,761,123   176
20   Walt Disney   $2,483,328,762   255
21   Iberdrola   $2,380,558,984   110
22   Hyundai Motor   $2,349,743,470   18
23   Oracle   $2,272,418,288   96
24   Shell PLC   $2,211,676,001   132
25   Samsung   $2,178,196,443   83
26   Mubadala Investment Company   $2,124,035,097   62
27   Toyota   $2,111,010,689   239
28   Nike   $2,104,917,829   153
29   Meta Platforms Inc.   $2,098,261,272   82
30   Alphabet Inc.   $2,054,325,527   125
31   Comcast   $2,032,609,740   398
32   Paramount Global   $1,973,256,854   336
33   Brookfield Corporation   $1,969,735,585   287
34   Exxon Mobil   $1,906,554,975   227
35   Apple Inc.   $1,900,308,359   63
36   Nissan   $1,892,314,165   98
37   Berkshire Hathaway   $1,838,569,373   1,194
38   Summit Power   $1,783,593,414   6
39   General Electric   $1,779,446,759   998
40   JPMorgan Chase   $1,762,150,650   1,151
41   Cleveland-Cliffs   $1,705,497,604   129
42   Southern Company   $1,694,958,172   45
43   Energy Transfer   $1,680,794,666   156
44   Vornado Realty Trust   $1,623,857,336   33
45   Duke Energy   $1,580,421,869   86
46   Wolfspeed Inc.   $1,564,430,563   64
47   Rivian Automotive Inc.   $1,536,054,012   5
48   IBM Corp.   $1,519,901,697   368
49   General Atomics   $1,505,785,957   111
50   OGE Energy   $1,427,570,182   15
51   SCS Energy   $1,419,011,796   5
52   Panasonic   $1,384,147,584   61
53   Microsoft   $1,366,243,159   113
54   Lockheed Martin   $1,337,674,082   323
55   Sagamore Development   $1,320,000,000   2
56   Northrop Grumman   $1,275,514,883   284
57   Corning Inc.   $1,269,303,359   400
58   Vingroup   $1,254,000,000   1
59   Continental AG   $1,244,875,478   111
60   RTX Corporation   $1,166,657,132   781
61   SK Holdings   $1,081,550,283   9
62   Valero Energy   $1,053,812,692   207
63   Dow Inc.   $1,049,354,213   640
64   AES Corp.   $1,039,510,135   136
65   Air Products & Chemicals   $1,025,557,482   88
66   Exelon   $986,892,877   98
67   CF Industries   $982,271,715   129
68   Pyramid Companies   $973,565,278   93
69   SkyWest   $922,686,541   339
70   Centene   $916,607,054   59
71   Mazda Toyota Manufacturing, U.S.A., Inc.   $900,000,000   1
72   Apollo Global Management   $891,705,089   592
73   LG   $883,168,466   88
74   Delta Air Lines   $871,485,833   13
75   Jefferies Financial Group   $871,137,335   16
76   Bayer   $852,475,226   217
77   Honda   $849,832,301   92
78   Shin-Etsu Chemical   $828,683,936   106
79   Enterprise Products Partners   $826,988,371   89
80   SunEdison   $817,425,725   115
81   Goldman Sachs   $800,873,386   253
82   Bank of America   $796,947,128   953
83   E.ON   $786,865,473   40
84   Warner Bros. Discovery Inc.   $772,994,690   218
85   EDF-Electricite de France   $766,205,550   36
86   Triple Five Worldwide   $748,000,000   4
87   EDP-Energias de Portugal   $733,674,868   14
88   Related Companies   $714,675,504   8
89   Koch Industries   $676,761,373   498
90   Caithness Energy   $672,688,888   30
91   Dell Technologies   $658,417,951   185
92   Wells Fargo   $657,333,216   542
93   FedEx   $647,035,546   632
94   Entergy   $638,533,387   235
95   OCI N.V.   $627,879,406   5
96   Chevron Phillips Chemical   $619,839,444   20
97   Bedrock Detroit   $618,000,000   1
98   Dominion Energy   $615,436,089   79
99   Eli Lilly   $601,741,368   77

[Hoodat]

Pepsi is using Tesla semis  500 mile range  and can pull 82,000 lbs.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_Semi

You should really consider reading the links you post.  It would save you some embarrassment.

PepsiCo Vice President Mike O'Connell stated that the Semis can haul Frito-Lay food products for around 425 miles (684 km), but for heavier loads of sodas, the trucks will make shorter trips of around 100 miles (160 km).

Not quite the 500 miles you suggest.  Nor are they hauling 82,000 pounds (which would be illegal).  The weight of the Tesla Semi is estimated to be 27,000 lbs, and the trailer adds another 10,000.  So your max load weight comes in around 43k.  Tesla did a test hauling eleven concrete barriers (44,000 lbs total weight) and claims to have driven 500 miles.  But that could have been at 35 mph.  Certainly not 70 mph which all long-haul truckers typically drive.  Also, the average long haul trucker maxes out at around 4,000 miles per week, which exceeds even the best claim that Tesla makes.

Oh, and then there's the cost.  Tesla claims that their vehicle costs 20¢ less than diesel to operate.  But that claim was based on a guaranteed recharge cost of 7¢/kWh.  Texas and Florida utilites charge double that.  New York triple that.  Massachusetts charges four times that.  And California?  Just under 30¢/kWh.

Oh, and don't even think about running the AC while you drive.  Not unless you want to stop for a charge every four hours.

[Hoodat]

You are the twister I just gave an example just as airbus/boeing. Show me where I say I want solar and wind. Show me.

This is your post, no?

https://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,528404.msg3007855.html#msg3007855

[Hoodat]

Flat screen R&d is in the US and heavily subsidized

IBM and Dell etc have been getting federal subsidies for years. Dell is up to 700 million. The computer industry has been heavily subsidized since day 1

https://subsidytracker.goodjobsfirst.org/parent-totals

From your link:  Dell

SUBSIDY SUMMARY
State/Local   $658,417,951
Federal (grants and allocated tax credits)   $0
TOTAL   $658,417,951

LOAN / BAILOUT
State/Local loans, bond financing and venture capital   $0   
Federal loans, loan guarantees and bailout assistance (not including repayments)   $0
TOTAL   $0

Again, you really should read your links before you post them.  I know how tempting it is when you're asking someone else at DU for a link so that you can show those Conservatives up, and they hand you one.  Only to be humiliated later on because your link exposes you as a complete fool, and a dishonest one at that.  You would do yourself better if you did your own research and learned to think critically instead of being trapped as a prisoner of your own emotion.

Bottom line, subsidies are wrong.  They have failed every single time they have been utilized without exception.

[DB]

Flat screen R&d is in the US and heavily subsidized

IBM and Dell etc have been getting federal subsidies for years. Dell is up to 700 million. The computer industry has been heavily subsidized since day 1

https://subsidytracker.goodjobsfirst.org/parent-totals

Do you even read the crap you post?

Take Dell for example. From your own link Dell got "0 Federal (grants and allocated tax credits)". All the "federal subsides" you claimed, that "700 million", were state and city governments enticing Dell to build offices/manufacturing in their states.

Amazing...

[banddag]

With batteries for power?  What exactly is this expectation based on?  It sure as heck isn't based on reality.

I said one day pickups will be ev's that can pull heavily loaded trailers and you mentioned it is  not based upon reality so I posted the Tesla semi and you nitpick me on exact specs because I proved you wrong You are a hoot.
You also said Amazon never received subsidies but they are up to 6.7 billion as of 2024

[Hoodat]

Again from your link:  Amazon


SUBSIDY SUMMARY
State/Local   $5,802,700,434
Federal (grants and allocated tax credits)   $0
TOTAL   $5,802,700,434   364
LOAN / BAILOUT SUMMARY   
State/Local loans, bond financing and venture capital   $2,225,000
Federal loans, loan guarantees and bailout assistance (not including repayments)   $0
TOTAL   $2,225,000

What part of $0 do you not get?

[banddag]

This is your post, no?

https://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,528404.msg3007855.html#msg3007855

Yes it sure is. I posted examples of US companies moving towards renewables/ solar and how the public is moving that way also in terms of what they buy.

US companies like B&D , Home Depot are going solar because it makes economic sense. B&D said they are 100% off the grid and actually sell excess energy back   to the tune of 400k per year

[DB]

Yes it sure is. I posted examples of US companies moving towards renewables/ solar and how the public is moving that way also in terms of what they buy.

US companies like B&D , Home Depot are going solar because it makes economic sense. B&D said they are 100% off the grid and actually sell excess energy back   to the tune of 400k per year

They got massive government subsidies to do it. No economic sense otherwise.

Funny how you haven't answered about the misinformation or was it lies you posted not long ago about subsidies and the companies you listed...

[Hoodat]

I told you why 3 times at least. the car co;s do not think hydrogen cars are the future. Toyota came out with one and dropped it.

Posted twice already on this thread:

As leftist idiot keep pushing battery subsidies in the US, Toyota is selling these cars starting at $50K.

They use hydrogen as a battery.

https://www.toyota.com/mirai/

Here's the 2024 model which you have twice now claimed that Toyota has dropped, even after being provided evidence to the contrary.




So, since we have now ascertained that you are just making up shit with zero basis in fact and are completely ignorant of what others post on this thread, would you like a do-over?  Clearly, Toyota is selling an all electric powertrain fuel cell car in 2024.  Surely, you could save yourself some embarrassment if you did your own research instead of relying on what your DU buddies tell you to say.  So I ask yet again.  Why subsidize the battery industry when hydrogen tanks cost less, are lighter, have longer range, and are better for the environment?

[Hoodat]

Yes it sure is. I posted examples of US companies moving towards renewables/ solar and how the public is moving that way also in terms of what they buy.

US companies like B&D , Home Depot are going solar because it makes economic sense. B&D said they are 100% off the grid and actually sell excess energy back   to the tune of 400k per year

Yeah, I remember.  You even suggested that B&D had special solar panels that generated power at night to keep their factory running.  Of course you didn't bother to read one word of all the contrary evidence you were provided.  Just charging along on emotion with zero regard for truth.

[Hoodat]

@Hoodat, I assume this wasn't intended for me.

Oh, damn.  My bad.  I thought that was posted by our in house DU member.  My mistake.  I grievously and profusely apologize, my brother @DB

[banddag]

They got massive government subsidies to do it. No economic sense otherwise.

Funny how you haven't answered about the misinformation or was it lies you posted not long ago about subsidies and the companies you listed...

B&D said the solar project was privately funded.

Ok I screwed up on Dell and Amazon. The fact is nearly every US the industry is getting subsidies from the US govt but you pick on ev's

I am getting attacked at all sides here so sometimes I make mistakes.
I will not make that mistake again and will slow down

[DB]

Oh, damn.  My bad.  I thought that was posted by our in house DU member.  My mistake.  I grievously and profusely apologize, my brother @DB

We're good. It was obvious it wasn't intended for me. Let's just delete them.

[DB]

B&D said the solar project was privately funded.

Ok I screwed up on Dell and Amazon. The fact is nearly every US the industry is getting subsidies from the US govt but you pick on ev's

I am getting attacked at all sides here so sometimes I make mistakes.
I will not make that mistake again and will slow down

So now its "nearly all" you say...

You said Home Depot in the post I was responding too. And it is highly likely that B&D got subsidies too even if they used private funding for part of their project.

You have no idea what you're talking about.

Oh, I will give you some credit for owning up to your misinformation.

[DB]

And "B&D said they are 100% off the grid and actually sell excess energy back".

Well, you can't be off grid while at the same time connected to the grid to sell it back.

Just damn...

[banddag]

And "B&D said they are 100% off the grid and actually sell excess energy back".

Well, you can't be off grid while at the same time connected to the grid to sell it back.

Just damn...

Oh it's late. They are getting 100% of their power needs from their solar farm. You are nitpicking. You knew exactly what I meant

[DB]

Oh it's late. They are getting 100% of their power needs from their solar farm. You are nitpicking. You knew exactly what I meant

"Off grid" has a meaning...

It is also highly likely they get power off the grid when the sun isn't shining. Kind of dumb to build an expensive battery farm while connected to the grid unless you expect the grid to go down.

[banddag]

"Off grid" has a meaning...

It is also highly likely they get power off the grid when the sun isn't shining. Kind of dumb to build an expensive battery farm while connected to the grid unless you expect the grid to go down.

Solar panels still generate power on overcast days. I expect BD has battery backup to a degree.

They are still connected to the grid because BD says they are selling excess power back to the local electric company

New solar panels are being developed that generate electricity at night via ambient temperature.  I do not know the exact details

[roamer_1]

Solar panels still generate power on overcast days.

No, they really don't. Rule of thumb up in here is that you need twice the panels you need in the summer to make in the winter, and you will still be on the Jenny at least once a week to catch up. Cloudy days severely hamper solar generation.